 Sunday, May 29, 2005
O'Neill signs-off by reverting to his favoured 3-5-2
When the Martin O’Neill era is written for future Celtic history books the name Alan Thompson will feature more prominently than most. Goals against such European luminaries as Bayern Munich, Barcelona and Liverpool, and so many goals against Rangers long convinced me of his value.
Scoring a Scottish Cup winning goal is a suitable honour for a man who has played a number of roles for the club during this difficult season.
Just to endear himself further, as he limped round the pitch on his way to the bench today he made sure referees assistant Andy Davis knew what was on his mind.
Not for the first time this season Dundee United played above their league status against Celtic. They kept their composure throughout, even after the loss of an early, preventable, goal.
They created several clear cut chances and, if Archibald had struck his 25yeard shot a few inches lower, the game would have gone into extra time – which would have taxed Celtic in their current fragile condition.
Martin O’Neill has referred to his players as being tired in recent weeks and there was plenty of evidence of fatigue on show today.
When I played football I thought that football was a game played in the mind. If I was confident and relaxed I would play much better than if I did not have my head sorted. Today, as in recent weeks, you got the feeling that previously sharp minds were all over the place.
The players still put the effort in, but the effervescence had gone. In truth, I do not think they have been enjoying their football for some time. They need a summer, and more than a few need fresh challenges.
One of the main fragilities in recent months has been an inability to kill teams off after taking a lead and today was no exception. Apart from a 15minute spell at the start of the second-half Celtic never looked like adding to their score. I watched, thinking how much the game reminded me of the Motherwell game six days earlier and waited to see if the sucker punch would arrive again.
Instead, the Hampden rigging kept United at bay, and the cup was coming home.
Remarkably the game finished with Martin reverting to his old 3-5-2 formation after Valgaeren replaced Hartson. Maybe he was reacting to the late loss last week; maybe he wanted to go out playing the way he always thought best.
We can expect around half this team to move on in the summer. I had been waiting for two years on Martin being able to spend big now and feel as though he has been robbed of an opportunity he thoroughly deserved.
Though it was Paisley who brought the big prizes to Liverpool, it is Shankley who is credited with turning the club around.
Gordon Strachan has a great platform to build from.
181 Comments:
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Paul how can GS have a great platform to build upon when in your previous atricle you say so many of the team are leaving. I believe it is imperative to keep this backbone - Balde, Agathe, Petrov, Thommo, Sutton - build around that is my advice. Players i would like to see - Phillips (500k), Prutton(2M), Naysmith(free). But i am confident GS knows all this, he has had a lot of time to watch Celtic and will know every possible departure well in advance. Despite what it looks like Celtic have a wee bit of organization! GS will have watched every single game this season knowing it was very probable that he would be in charge next season.
It also my belief that the Niemi deal has been done and dusted, just the formality of timimg left.
Anyone else think radio Clyde was out of order playing the huns title Celebrations 15 minutes before kick off. Another boycott. Just one more thing to get off my chest - anyone try and go to the toilet at Hampden yesterday? Disgrace, how it was deemed fit for another big final is beyond me!
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Paul,
Did you here Thommo's comments after the game, when asked if he would be here next year he replied "Yes I've two years left and im going nowhere" Here's hoping the players will feel happier this week, and Strachan will convince the right players to stay and already have the best type of players lined up for next season.
My wife says "red and green should not be seen" I hope GS and re-write the rule
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What a great send off for Martin and the management team.
I had a good greet at the end. I was in a really busy bar but I seemed to be in my own wee bubble thinking about the last 5 years. Ahh the memories.
I think Martin, the team and the whole stadium let the "officials" know what they thought. I think it is disgraceful that the SFA "rewarded" these 3 clowns for their misdemeanours.
I look forward to an exciting summer.
Great video Celtic Dave. I take it you stayed a bit more "local" yesterday? The behaviour was much better, we had our respective partners to keep us in tow. A few Hymns were belted out mind.
Hail Hail
Martybhoy
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hi paul, fellow celts.....
nice to finally post this week on a high note.
it feels so good that the football has finally finished for this season, the last few weeks have seen my fingernails look like they've been through the shredder.
as usual, of course, i'll be wondering what to do with myself now that i don't have to run around looking for a venue to watch a (possible) live celtic match!!
saturday was surreal over here in sunny thailand....
i met a few fellow celts here on koh phangan (one of whom was among a group of us who watched celtic's uefa cup match v barcelona at 3am in a little restaurant) and we all sat around impatiently waiting for the cup final to start. only to discover it wasn't being broadcast here........!!!!
i then had to sit in an internet shop, logged on to bbc sport for 2 minute text updates from the game. you really understand the meaning of torture when that is your only way of getting the game!!
i wasn't even so bothered at missing the game, more the scenes at the final whistle really. it's strange, but missing these moments makes me feel as though i'm missing out on a bit of history. all the talk this week about the other finals (since the "mcavennie" final that is) have been cherished trips down memory lane, but since i'm over here in thailand now it's more difficult to truly feel part of it.
God knows how i'd feel if i had given up my season ticket before i left. my mum's milk man pete is still flying the flag in my absence from block 403 in the north stand. hail, hail to you pete "the milk" if your logging on to the best celtic fix on the web (remember it's still got my name on it!!).
well i'm going to enjoy a few days respite and then, i just know, i'll be surfing the net for news on the celts rebuilding over the summer. i'm already getting over my feelings of disappointment at WGS being named successor. now i can't wait to hear his first interviews and news of signings (even if most of it is crap!!).
i just can't help but feel positive about next season now. don't know why, can't explain it. that's just the way it is.
one final point paul. are you taking a summer holiday this year? because if you are, i hope you have a lap-top as i can't see any way this quicknews community of ours will be expected to cope in your absence.........
hail, hail for next season. it's coming back to paradise.
alan, still diving in thailand
ps. are there any other celts out here in thailand that are "logging on"?
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Can't argue with any of that Paul.
The showing yesterday was sterotypical of Celtic's domestic performances this season - we dominated yet lacked the guile or energy to convert possesion into goals.
At the end of it all though it was the result alone that mattered yesterday.
We all know this is the end of an era and that this team has had its day. We have to invest to ensure some extensive rebuilding work is need. No doubt some of the neccesary finaces will come from some familiar faces heading out of Parkhead.
There will be a lot of changes over the next couple of months and after finally coming to terms with recent disappointments I can honestly say I am now genuinely excited at the prospect of a busy summer in Paradise. In fact its been a good few years since I have looked forward to close season with such a high degree of anticipation.
Any debate whether GS is up to the massive task ahead should now be an irrelevence. We can only judge this matter at the end of next season. In the meantime our 100 support should be his.
It's time for us all to look forward.
Hail! Hail!
PS - FAO anyone - How about a campaign for the Celtic support to start reclaiming The Fields Of Athenry as our own.
It bad enough having to endure the Liverpool support's dreadful and cringe-worthy cover version of a song which is so special to Celtic. But last Wednesday I heard the ITV commentator proclaim 'The Fields' as "...that famous Liverpool anthem".
Now the English footballing media are rather killed in rewritting history - a couple of seasons ago they even reffered to "the famous Liverpool huddle" - so lets reclaim The Fields.
If any of you guys are involved in the singing section then please, please lets have the Fields echoing around Paradise once more.
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Er, in my above post for "killed" please read "skilled" and for "100 support" please read "100 per cent support".
...and just ignore any other errors!
Cheers!!
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Your right Martybhoy
Stayed in Guildford because i couldnt afford to sink the same amount of drink i did last week!
Got a lot of work on at the moment as well.
Lyric was packed to the rafters again no doubt. Least noone had my big head in the way of the tv screen this time.
Looking forward to a summer of change, and interesting to note what anonymous said on last thread about the video at CP.
It was indeed the players that may be off holding the trophy aloft.
Regarding the Liverpool song. It is a joke. Im sure they have changed the words and sing about 'Anfield Road' or something?
Al the best Strachan
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Paul, I agree with the 352 formation being the preferred way to play, but as you said, apart from 15 mins in the second half the didn’t look like a football team.
Sorry, so sympathy with being tired, if you are earning 20K - 30K a week, you should be crawling off the park.
The managers job is to take all the pressure off the team so they can relax and play football, this did not happen enough this season.
For the first time in decades, players want to stay at Celtic,
Look how many have resigned, it’s the feel good factor and long may it continue.
hail hail
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Spot on again Paul!
Not a great game but good to grab a piece of silverware in MONS last season...
Thanks to the guy at the turnstile who let me in without a ticket....and hope he has a drink (or five) on me...
Just watched the video of the "return of the heroes" on the offisial website....apart from it being pretty embarrassing production...it looks like Bobo was filming his final memories of Celtic...Thanks for the efforts Bobo!!
The biggest miss will be Bellamy-(if hes going) hes been a joy to watch and was again yesterday....how about we get Robbie Keane in and put Sutton in the hole in a 3-5-2?
Thanks for putting the link up btw Paul...
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The leavers this season will it seems be; Lambert, Bellamy, Balde, Valgaaren, Sylla, Hedman, Douglas, Fernandez, Henchoz. These players I estimate earn about £150,000 a week conservatively. We may also lose McNamara, Lennon and Laursen. This will who earn the best part of another £50,000 a week. thus £10 million of the wagebill, but a lot of players to recruit. This combined with the money Paul as identified as free'd from the company accounts from previous transfers and money from Mr Desmond should enable Strachan to have a fairly free hand... My only worry is this, rememeber the free hand John Barnes had... £5m on Scheidt, £5.5m on Berkovic plus a further £6-8m spent on contract wages to both players... Lets hope Strachan spends big money wisely a la Sutton, Thompson and Lennon, awesome signings over the 5 years, if only MON had been given similar funds last season when the cracks were opening things would now be very different.
We need to sign 1 cracking and experienced central defender,
keeper if we can get Hedman away, and holding midfielder. My view is that we are a shop window for Niemi, he's played for the dark side players know that turncoating is not well received, can't visualise him at Parkhead.
On top if the above necessities I'd also like us to get bids in for McFadden, Riordan and Diamond.
We've managed to lose the initiative, typical Celtic, but hey it was good while it lasted... Hail Hail and thanks Martin for 5 great years!!!
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Wee Jinky,
Is it just me, but I hate the song Fields of Athenrye?
It has nothing to do with football and hearing tone deaf football fans singing it is torture.
Chris Collins
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They have indeed changed the lyrics Celtic Dave.
The Liverpool version is this: -
Outside the Shankly Gates
I heard a Kopite calling :
Shankly they have taken you away
But you left a great eleven
Before you went to heaven
Now it's glory round the Fields of Anfield Road.
All round the Fields of Anfield Road
Where once we watched the King Kenny play (and he could play)
We had Heighway on the wing
We had dreams and songs to sing
Of the glory round the Fields of Anfield Road
Outside the Paisley Gates
I heard a Kopite calling
Paisley they have taken you away..
You led the great 11
Back in Rome in 77
And the redmen they are still playing the same way
All round the Fields of Anfield Road
Where once we watched the King Kenny play (and he could play)
We had Heighway on the wing
We had dreams and songs to sing
Of the glory round the Fields of Anfield Road.
I no some will think this is tivial but we really have to reclaim this unique Celtic anthem before another piece of heitage is stolen and repackaged by an English club.
On a different note I've just read Kevin Gallagher's comments on yesterdays game. What a bitter wee so, and so he comes across as.
Hail! Hail!
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just felt i had to add my tuppence worth regarding the future of the team. I sometimes wonder if I am going insane, am I watching different matches to everyone else? For example, I would be far from upset if we did not hold onto Craig Bellamy as long as the proposed 6 million is spent elsewhere. the players are out there, the problem is we haven't had a decent scout since (and i know i risk ridicule here) Davie Hay.
Another point I feel that most don't agree with is Bobo: i feel the guy MUST stay. He has had one bad season in 4, mostly because of injury and illness and what happens? He gets criticised left right and centre. The change in his game, I feel, came partnering him with the immobile Varga, who is the real culprit in our defence. while i think varga has some qualities (good passer, good in the air, reads well from the edge of the box) the fact that his game is about 'reading' means he often comes out to meet the deep striker/attacking midfielder. consequently, he is often in front of bobo. what we really need is someone to partner Bobo who is an organiser and is happier sitting deep, a quality sweeper would be great but they cost big money these days, better getting a good organiser who can pick up the last man and TELL BOBO EXACTLY WHAT TO DO! as a ball winner bobo is one of the best in europe, his strength wins the ball often when he is far from favourite in the challenge, lets not overlook that.
my last point (2 points kinda) is BBJ/lenny. i love lenny, he is a celtic legend but i feel these 2 players are not gonna take us forward in europe. lenny was never fast but he now he is sooooo slow its unreal. i love the guy and i know 'ugly' players that break up play are necessary, and i think the guy is great in the 50/50, hes great with playing simple square passes and hes great intercepting misplaced passes by the opposition in the middle of the park, he generally difficult to get by. but surely i cant be the only one that has noticed when players DO get buy him, he has no chance of getting back to retrieve? how many times has a simple 1-2 cut through our middle because the guy facing lenny has played it and lenny simply cant catch him once he's by him. its kinda embarrassing to see the guy blowing out his arsehole trying to chase back. that said, i appreciate lenny's role (perhaps we could experiment with him at the back in the role i described above, Bobo will go for the headers and onrushing players, all lenny would have to do is drop 5 yards behind play when the ball drops to make sure he is the last man?), but BBJ is becoming a joke. he is without doubt the laziest, slowest player i have ever seen at the club. how many times in the cup final did bellamy break down the left, only to hit the by line and look up to see only sutton trying to keep up? BBJ made no effort, on 2 or 3 such occasions he didnt even make it to the box. very simply, another player willing to run may have had 3 chances that otherwise came to nothing. he does suttons job but not as well. he is good as an outlet for the defence IF they can find him, but he doesnt make himself as available as sutton for this type of pass (ive seen our fullbacks look up for this ball down the line several times only to see BBJ somewhere staying up on the center halves instead of coming wide to be the 'target'). BBJ is also the only player i would consider punting thatmay actually get some cash as unbelievably hes still only 28 or 29.
this post is getting well out of hand, im gonna stop there, but id really like others' views on this. Should we keep Bellamy at the expense of 2-3 other players (apart from anything else i dont think his finishing is that of a 6million pound striker)?Do most think we should keep Bobo? get the right man in beside him (JK to come back before xmas, zander diamond?). Do you think we need a more mobile style of play to take us forward? Am i a tool for talking rubbish?
brummiebhoy
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I dont know the situation with Bobo, will be a crying shame if we dont get money for him. I would love to keep him, imagine this: old firm game, first five minutes, long ball up from rangers, Bobo comes crushing through takes ball and man (bufftel). On countless occasions we have seen the sheer presence of the nig man make top players hide for the rest of the game. He has his faults but his strengths more than make up for it.
Guys like McGeady, Kennedy, Wallace, Beattie, Marshall should all be kept as squad players and if they prove themselves then they can become regulars.
There will be a lot of spare cash but i think the clever route would be to bring in 3/4 players to come straight in. Then wait till January to asses the progress then take corrective measures.
THe second half of the season is all important. I would like to see Celtic and GS use the Jan transfer window a lot better.
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Chris,
Thanks for your reply which I have to admit has left me a little perplexed.
Firstly, you're obviously quite correct that "The Fields.." has nothing to do with football.
But to every Celtic supporter I know Celtic is more than just a football club.
We have a unique history among British football clubs and "The Fields" to me is a song which sums up simply but beautifuly the plight of those who brought this club into existance.
Sure the Scotish media and sections of
the establishment have tried to portray the song as political and even, unbelievably, sectarian.
It is of course neither. It is a poignant account of a human tragedy which foced millions to flee their native Ireland.
If you can't see why this song means so much to Celtic fans than I suggest just start to get to know your history.
I get the feeling that you may be one of the reasons that Celtic Park can often resemble a morgue on match day.
Hail! Hail!
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I see some people writing about Starchan having time to lok at other players etc. but didn't he only get approached 2 weeks ago?
Not much time to start recruiting.
Hopefully the background work on identifying players will already ave been done by MoN & co, along with details of who is leaving etc.
If it has not been done already then once again the planning leaves a lot to be desired.
The only problems should be if GS has any reservations about the players on the most wanted list!!
Regards,
Seggy
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Seggy - GS was approached last season to be a stop gap for a year or something along those lines. He might not have known for definate until two weeks ago but he would have been pretty certain he would be a cp next season. He has been scouring about europe, learning different coaching methods, picking up new styles of play, looking at players, the plannig has for once, been very good.
We should not be looking at Riordan, o'Connor if anyone should be the man. A far better all round player who is more likely to succeed at Celtic
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True tim
O'Connor??? surely not....he is at best a poor mans John Hartson...no thanks...
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I wouldnt like to see any of them at CP. Many people are calling for Riordan and all i'm saying is that out of the 2 O'Connor is the better player. I would like to see GS continue to sign player that are experienced and can handle pressure. That's how we beat Rangers, they had those sort of players all through the 90's and we looked liked boys most of the times. Ok we had players who could nick a goal and put in a good performance but you need to have a core of about 7/8/9 players who have bottle, guts, courage and fight to overcome our oldest rivals. But again i am confident GS knows all this. Funnily enough if you add all those things to McGeady he could be as good as Strachan!!!!
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I personally would like to see Stephen Pearson play a more prominent role in the squad next season.
He didn't do too much wrong in his cameo apparances this term and I think we missed his directness and energy in the run in.
The decision to ostracise him for the training ground bust was IMO ultimately very costly.
Then there's Shaun Maloney. It's make or break time for the wee man. Beattie has overtaken him as the understudy for the main strikers.
Unless he can force himself into the reckoning before Christmas then he may well be joining Rab and Momo down in the English Championship.
One youngster I would snap up is Zander Diamond. From what I've seen this guy could really be top class in the future.
Hail! Hail!
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Brummiebhoy
I for one certainly don’t think you’re talking rubbish. I’ve come round to the view that Bellamy as a striker flatters to deceive.His real worth to us has been as an outball with his superb pace bringing relief to our poor defence. Unfortunately he is not a clinical finisher. Had he been - a la Henrik - we would have been league winners. So for £6m – no thank you.
Having said that it hardly helped to have the liability of BBJ as a partner. It amazes me that he has his supporters whose argument seems to run along the lines of praising him for getting 30 goals. What of the multitude he missed and the others he was to slow too get to. What of the chances that would have been there created by the likes of Bellamy for a striker with pace? I had every sympathy for the wee fella trying to play his way in with the likes of BBJ too slow to respond and as a consequence our play totally predictable. Can’t see Strachan accepting his lack of fitness.
Can’t agree about Bobo though as I don’t think his failing were only this season though you have made me think a bit more about the worth of Varga. Don’t consider Diamond good enough – as yet.
Whatever we do we must have more pace about the way we play and that I must admit is what I find exciting about Strachan. It will definitely be different but please no Darren Huckerby – please!!!
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brummiebhoy
i agree with most of what you say and i'm pleased to see someone offering an opinion that sees through the emotional bandwaggon that everyone jumps on.
The emotional bandwaggon is saying anything different from the popular opinion as this would see you as a celtic critic and no-one wants that.
Balde is not the problem. Varga is. If you looked at the two as individuals this year you could argue (althoug I wouldn't) that Varga has played better as an individual. But football isn't won by the best individuals but the best group of players.
Balde as you say is one of the best commanding defenders going about and he has pace. He has improved dramatically since we first signed him and he can improve further but obviously we have to weigh that up against the wages he is on and/or the fee we could receive.
I agree 100% with your assesment of Hartson and again the emotional will say what about his goals. I believe that no one player cost us the title but if you had to pick one then I'm afraid it would have to be BBJ.
You have to defend from the front and he doesn't do that and you have to attack with options and he doesn't offer any.
Disagree with your point on Bellamy though as previously stated with Balde/Varga he would be seen as a better player if he played alongside someone better.
Lets imagine Larsson played instead of BBJ this season.
We might have beaten Rangers at Parkhead on his debut because Larsson would have tried to tackle Vignal when he shot unlike BBJ who walked away from him. Then if we win everyone forgets about the Bellamy miss.
Same at Motherwell. If we beat them 5-0 as Larsson puts away the chances Bellamy creates then everyone forgets about the save Marshall makes from Bellamy.
Football is about what players give to the team and although I agree that Bellamy is not and will never be a prolific scorer he brings more value to the team than any player in the last few years. He is an out ball when we are defending. He is a creator of goals and a creator of space for his team-mates and he is also a scorer of great goals which is not as good as a prolific scorer but is very handy at times as we have seen this year. £6m for Bellamy is a steal. Robbie Keane is quoted as being the same. A scorer of great goals rather than a prolific scorer but I think Keane would be a prolific scorer at Parkhead. Although Sutton with any one of them would be good also.
Talking about teams. I believe overall we were too slow and you can accomodate some if they contribute overall and I think Lennon and Sutton were major contributors but too slow therefore we could not acoomodate any further slow players if we had them in the team. (And I think we should have had them in the team). That meant Varga and BBJ should have been definately oot.
Therefore since I have commented on your points I may as well go the full hog and give my opinions about the rest.
Before I start though I would say that it would not be a bad thing to keep the majority of players we have at the minute as they are winners and good players who have been de-railed over the last 12months. Why, maybe because Martin couldn't change tactics or couldn't the fresh players needed or maybe his eye was off the ball for personal reasons. Who knows and it is not meant to be a criticism of the departing manager. (God bless Martin). But is a realisation that yes we should change it a little but I firmly believe that if we played the current players next year with a new system from Gordon then we have enough already at our disposal to beat the crap from across the city.
However if we have got the chance to freshen it up then why not and let's make sure of the title.
Keeper.
We need a keeper. Simple. No second raters. Top drawer needed with Marshall and possibly Hedman (on lesser terms) as back up. Only because Strachan may get the best back out of Magnus.
Right back.
Agathe will do for me. You only realise how good he is when he is not there. Not a natural defender when defending in the box therefore we need balance and the other three defenders should be natural defenders. McNamara good cover for right back and some other positions in emergencies but he plays better when he has a point to prove rather than when he is an automatic pick. I think he has been pathetic at left back this year as his passing from there has been rubbish but you can't blame him too much given that the position is not natural to him.
Centre defence
Balde I would keep as discussed above. Partner would be a top quality organiser as brummiebhoy says. Someone who can not only organise Bobo but organise the whole defence, keeper and holding midfielder. Varga could do as cover for Bobo.
Left back
New one needed and has been for a few years. Laursen is adequate back up.
Midfield
Stan. Should be made captain and the team built around him. His faults are he is sometimes out of games so lets change that and make the game go through him so that when he isn't in the mood he is made to be by receiving the ball all the time.
Lennon. After listening to him yesterday I think he will stay but I would only keep him on the condition that it will be horses for courses and if we need fresh blood at christmas then he may be dropped. Similarly away in Europe or chasing a game then Lennon should be dropped / substituted. Otherwise he may be beneficial for another to help the changover and to install the winning mentality into the newcomers.
McGeady
The wee man we come to the fore with better players around him. He has vision despite what some think it's just that his vision is wasted if no-one is making any runs.
Thompson. Could still do a job for us for another year although it would be dependant on what other players are in the team and what balance is needed.
Pearson. Second chance saloon.
Strikers
Hartson. Is a must sell as he'll be unhappy and unfit on the bench and we could get some money for him and free up his big wages.
Sutton. Tremendous player who has been wasted since we signed BBJ. Top quality player who we are lucky to have in Scottish football and it's a disgrace we have wasted him. To his credit he has played well in midfield and defence although I would add to that "until recently" as I think he has been poor in midfield this year. He shoudn't be played there again.
Bellamy and Keane as described above although I do accept we cannot have both of them, unless Sutty leaves, as we couldn't keep all three happy.
Fernandez. Sell and take off the wage bill as he has skill and strength but has no movement or desire.
Therefore all we need to do is sign;
1) a keeper on a bosman giving him the wages Rab and Magnus earned. No extra cost.
2) A left back part funded by Momo's wages. (And Jackie's if he leaves)
3) A centre half giving him Joos's and Stephane's wages. No extra cost.
4) A central midfielder on a bosman giving him Lambo's and Fernandez's wages.
5) Bellamy or Keane. (Wages already being paid to Bellamy and transfer fee could be part funded by BBJ)
Add in the good youngsters to that and not much cost at all to improve the side and win the league however if we do have £15m to spend then no excuses, Gordon title is a must.
Tonybhoy
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Brummiebhoy
How about Lennon behind Balde ?
He can think for both of them, and will definately organise the defense, reads the game brilliantly, and is not shy to speak his mind.
Can't see this happening butr it might be interesting.
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TrueTim, with the money Strachan will have, together with being in Pot 2 we should have a greater advantage next season than in past seasons.
NE Bhoy, I hope Thompson stays, Lets see.
Alan in Thailand, nothing worse than waiting for a web site to update to get the score.
Big Joe, agree the club is an attractive place to do business these days.
Chris Collins, totally disagree on the Fields of Athenrye.
Brummiebhoy, against Rangers Bobo is at his best, as he sticks to his task and gets rid of the ball.
Your comments on Bellamy are telling. Roll back a month and Celtic fans were organising a petition to the board to keep him. These kind of actions work against the club. The player gets an inflated idea of his own self worth and, oten his performance suffers.
Think of him when he is trying to control a ball, or when we are playing a tight Champions League game and do not have the option of playing the ball back, where it can be held.
He has been good for us in the past, but I am looking to raise the bar next season.
Seggy, I would hope that Strachan has been sounded out many months ago.
TonyBhoy, excellent analysis. I’ll give it more consideration later.
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Was it my imagination or was the Pope at todays Celtic Ireland game? I was sitting in the lower tier of the north stand and I looked over at what is normally the away fans section to see the pope blessing the crowd. How I laughed.
And while we're talking about rebuilding - Bring back Simon Donnelly !
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Paul, are you going to keep us waiting till tomorrow for your big news?
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i'm glad that my comments above have not received the ridicule i feared they may!derbyshirebhoy, glad you agree about BBJ, maybe its something in the midlands water, eh? tonybhoy, yer bang on about the virtues of this board, you can (constructively) criticise the team and it will be taken objectively, unlike other boards where i have seen disagreements reduced to 'you must be a hun, then' comments (comeonthehoops being a prime example). oregonbhoy, yeah thats what i meant, it would be interesting to see if lenny could handle it, man u tried a similar ploy at the start of the season with roy keane and contrary to media opinion it was pretty successful. my only worry would be that heading the ball in midfield is different to the attacking of the ball you need at centre half, but thats what friendlies are for, definently worth a try. that one of the good things in getting in a new gaffer, he will have his own ideas and try things out that perhaps saint martin had been too close to the action to see. on a semi related note i always fancied seeing maloney on the right, strange how (to my knowledge) MON never tried it, he has a great right foot, good pace, is tricky and deceptively strong and tenacious. its been tried with other youth team graduate strikers (jamie smith and craig beattie) perhaps wee shaun might get a chance there? im not of the opinion that he cant cut it, i think he is a talented bhoy that is almost worth having in the team for free kicks alone. incidentally, thats another thing that i feel we need to address, of all the signings we make, we need to ensure we have a guy who can hit consitently good free kicks. thompsons delivery from wide areas is phenomenal, but, sorry to say it about your idol paul, he doesnt test the keeper enough from the more orthodox shooting positions. mcgeady looks like he could, but i dont think he will ever be a regualar until we're ready to accomodate him in a more central position perhaps 2 years down the line before he becomes a first choice pick.
tonybhoy, you're as bad as me for sitting down to write a sentence and coming away with a thesis! but cant disagree with you mate, you're spot on about agathe. maybe a better way to think of things is not whos leaving, but rather who is staying and playing 1st choice.
-agathe is as good a right back as ive seen in europe over the past 2 years, certainly as good as anyone in the EPL, and the criticism he has received in the past was ridiculous (guys still expecting him to take men on at the halfway line like he did when he played right mid despite the fact that he had cover behind him then, and he has no one to cover behind him now) but thankfully most fans seem to appreciate him more now. and his crossing, while still not perfect, has improved dramatically.
-bobo, ive already stated my views on - has to stay (also worth considering his age, hes still the right side of 30).
-mcnamara - every team needs a utility man, not many are as competent as the wee man. like agathe and bobo, steps up a gear for europe as well.
-petrov - 'nuff said.most valuable player in the team now, in terms of money and influence.
-thompson-disappointing this season, but not been helped by playing different positions and also having to adjust to larsson absence (who made soooo many average passes/crosses look good). has enough in his locker to come back next year.
sutton-with petrov, the most inluential player in the team. wasted in midfield, and defence. basically can do what hartson does, but better, and a lot more beside.give him the keys to the kingdom.
other than that, id keep all players under 24. guys at that age can ALWAYS learn/improve, so you never know how good there gonna be-mcgeady may have peaked, but equally he could improve immeasurably.no matter how we see them (as pro footballers earning more per week than we do per year) theyre still 19-20 year old boys that are probably terrified any time sutty looks at them funny (intimidating guy). hence marshall will learn to scream at those in front of him etc. i would give laursen the benefit of the doubt as contrary to popular belief hes never let us down.if we do get a top class left back in, laursen is as good a squad player as we can hope to have, and he seems happy as long as hes relatively involved.hartson may raise 2 mil. hedman, sylla and fernandez, thanks but no thanks.douglas i think has been harshly treated (nobody mentions the phenomenal performances he turned in en route to seville) i think he can never get the confidence of the fans back, and i think it plays on his mind too.
basically we need a left back, centre half, GK, at least one midfielder and striker. financial constraints dictate that WGS may have to prioritise, if so, i think we need a LB first and foremost, and if this season has shown one thing its that you can never underestimate the value of a good solid keeper, chelsea have possibly the worst forwards in the top half of the EPL, but a great keeper spreads confidence throughout the team. its the diffference between the top 3 in the EPL.
anyway, i cant believe how much rubbush ive written, lets face it if i knew what i was talking about i wouldn't be typing in the confines of my room whilst im supposed to be writing a dissertation. back to work!
brummiebhoy
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I am not a big fan of the pieces from guys who give their lists of players "the'd keep" and "those they'd get shot off"...(I think some of them sit near me in the North Stand.) However I think Tonybhoy's piece is a cut above the norm.
I feel we were priveleged to have Martin O Neill and his team in charge and the last five years have been terrific. But I think BBJ has been a mistake, but perhaps an understandable one, given the wider context in which Martin was operating. Much of the problems with our performance and pace and style stem from the decision to persist with BBJ and to try and accommodate others such as Sutton out of position. If a newcomer to the EPL comes in with an offer we should snap at it.
...eh! I 've become one of those guys I've just slagged off for saying who we should keep and who we should sell!!!!
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TonyBhoy - Can't disagree with anything you've said.
The amount of occassions that Bellamy has ripped a defence to bits in wide areas and looked up to find no colleague within 20 yards must have been frustrating.
As far as Keane is concerned, I also believe he would become a prolific scorer. Bellamy and Keane supplying each other, now thats a partnership (am I getting greedy now?).
My point a few days ago was that Henrik was older than Keane when he joined us and really couldn't be regarded as a top striker at the time.
I think we all accept that Bellamy wont be here next season but in all honesty, if he gave any indication that he did want to stay, pay the £6 million he is worth it. With quicker and more adaptable players around him he would create an incredible amount of goals. Players like Beattie would also develop more quickly.
WGS has got his work cut out and I'm sure he has already begun. I genuinely believe that he will gain the confidence of the current players immediately which will give him more options, rather than players deciding to walk away.
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Tonybhoy - I agree with you on the varga balde situ bobo may not have finesse as a player but ask him to run through a brick wall, get ready to pick up the bricks.
I would like to see celtic buy a keeper with marshall on the bench. I agree with MON he is our keeper for the future but pretty good back up nonetheless.
I would like to see us keep Didier at right back his attacking options unease teams.
Yes a left back is a priority.
an attacking midfielder too.
I think if we can keep the nucleus of this team and add 4-5 qaulity players we should be in good shape. Those moved on fer me would be
Douglas
Hedman
varga - possible back up for bobo.
joos
laursen - unsure always injured.
lambert
sylla
fernandez
hartson.
I do believe however to accomodate more signings one of the other big three might have to move on aswell
lennon
thompson
sutton. A hard decision to make but for me it would be thommo.
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Had to work today, can someone give a match report of the game?
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First time poster...thanks doesn't even begin to express my appreciation for Paul67 and the rest of you for playing such a integral role in lifting me/everyone else from the sheer depths that this week has brought. Never, ever has it become more apparent to me that we are a 'family' and the arms to which we rush when we find ourselves in times of sadness.
However, the difficulties of last seven days must be nothing compared to that the O'Neill family have been enduring. Did anyone see the extended interview with the Great Man that SKY conducted post match yesterday? I saw it at 0940 this morning and (not for the first time this week), cried. These though, were different. They were borne of admiration and respect for the courage of a simply remarkable, remarkable, special person. We may never see his like again.
So many emotions this week...we can only pray that the O'Neill family have comforting times ahead.
Martybhoy and ProphetofDoomBhoy: In your presence, i'll never walk alone.
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Sir Paul67,
I shall evacuate you and the other members of this elite group, from the dreaded tenterhooks precinct.
Bellamy will stay!
Selena.
M.I.T.
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OnlySeenInGreenBhoy
How apt!!! Although yesterdays's ensemble almost ventured off the fashion code you follow religiously!
Thanks for the shout mate but I think as I mentioned yesterday, generally, when you're out with me it's more a case of not being able to walk rather than walking alone ;-)
Went for a curry last night - found a green one (Neel Massala) - very tasty and would fit the strict categories applied by your good self.
Hail Hail
Martybhoy
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to anonymous at 6:42
Wasnt at the game but BBC has an article about the game
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/c/celtic/4591877.stm
Rumoid
Those T-shirts are going down to bargain prices!
Was it just me or did i pay £18 for mine?
OnlySeenInGreenBhoy
If you are who i think you are, and if my memory serves me correct, im sure i saw you at the Lyric
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Was that the Portsmouth branch of the Lyric Dave??
Keep in touch mate, some chat of a few of us going to the Leicester game. Also the hoops have playe in London every year for the last 4 close season's - lets hope wee GS reaches out to us too.
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Martybhoy, that experience of Portsmouth will haunt me forever. Getting the train with all the suits to London, with myself not being able to stand and all hooped up.
Yeah, would be definitely up for the friendlies down this way. Any idea of the leicester date? Would be good to tag along if you didnt mind ( see this Guildford place , it does your head in ).
Seems like you had a good night last night. Keep in touch
Dave
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I think GS has a much better base than O’Neill had when he started, the only thing is I think most of us feel if this season had been dealt with better (and O’Neill is exempt from criticism as no way could or should his mind be any more on the job given the terrible circumstances – he should have been forced to take more help) the base would have been even better.
As a Celtic fan for nearly thirty years I feel that for the first time we were so close to putting real clear distance between us and rangers, but we blew it. That’s what hurts the most, not a stupid couple of minutes last week.
O’Neill’s legacy is that we are now a much much bigger club than when he joined and dare I say it much better prepared for the Premiership, in terms of ability, finance , credibility and recognition.
I see people talking about Robbie Keane for Celtic. I would take him in a second, I would also take Liam Miller but if I could pick one player it would be Alexander Hleb. Whoever we sign, its got to be good. No more squad players.
Would like to see Petrov, McGeady, Sutton and Beattie stay. Not massively fussed about who else stays. Body language at the end of the game yesterday told us all we need to know about CB staying, real shame. I would have wanted Thompson to stay but I know for a fact he was mouthing off two weeks ago about O’Neill definitely leaving. Shame that.
Is anyone else starting to think that Strachan might just turn out to be a really good signing for us. At first I was really disappointed, thought Le Guen might be the ‘next step’ man. Read some link from an interview with William McIlvanny (??). Don’t know, starting to feel a lot more positive about next season. Maybe a wee bit of collective humility might do the club good.
When’s this big news story Mr 67?
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Dave - 20somethingth of July if my memory serves me correct.
Hope you held your head up high on that train mate. Thought so. Good man!
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Celtic Dave
T-shirts are priced the same as always......£16 + P&P..(£2)....
After yesterday's game standing outside hampden looking for a ticket for 2 hours I can vouch that they are not waterproof.. ;-)
Theres an olive one for you onlyseeningreen... www.sixtee7.com
How about this for next year;
Neimi
Balde Kompany Pearson
Agathe Petrov Parker Thompson
Sutton
Bellamy Keane
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Interesting little quote from Keane
http://www.sportinglife.com/football/news/story_get.dor?STORY_NAME=soccer/05/05/29/SOCCER_Celtic_Testimonial_Ke.html&TEAMHD=soccer
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Why is it some people need to finish every post with hail hail and others need to put 'h's in front of 'o's in some forced reference to the Bhoys. Is this a medical condition or is it to show how much more they love Celtic than everyone else posting?
Yours, etc. etc.
Evil Keneivel Murray, Cleland
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Martybhoy - Thanks for the sartorial critique...and this from the bhoy who is more milinery (more than questionable grammar?) than anyone i've ever known!!!
Celtic Dave...It sure is mate..met you last week...though lastt time I heard 'bout you you were checking out the delights of Portsmouth Harbour......Hope to see you for pre-season training!!!
Rumoid...Cheers for the link....needs to be the correct shade though!!!!
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For all who are hoping that Liam Miller will be back next season I think todays reaction to him will convince Liam to stay away, he was booed and jeered every time he touched the ball.
Robbie Keane got a great reception, but nothing to what the good Dr. and Lubo got.
Maloney also looked sharp today,showing a great burst of speed.
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I hear that Petrov wants to stay which is obviously great news. I wouldn't even be discussing the possibility of Bellamy being at CP next season. Surely he's for the offski?
Still don't believe that Keane is good enough for us. He'd be OK in the SPL but I feel he'd struggle badly in Europe.
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good game today,
Robbie Keane's late goal backs up my point the other day, he would be great for celtic. Was immense to see lubo, larsson back on the pitch together, good reception given to them as well, result wasnt too bothering
bb67
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Alan in Thailand, no holiday’s booked as yet, going no-where without the laptop, though.
Marzepans, if they bring back Simon Donnelly he can sit in the seat beside me, which is usually vacant.
Also, to you and Thedominie, if we lived in a more competitive media environment I would have been forced to publish my ‘big’ story as soon as I had it. As it is, I am happy to sit on it knowing that there are few even looking for the story.
As events unfolded last week I thought it inappropriate to publish, and I am off to see the wee man with red hair on Tuesday, so unless there is another major trauma (!) it looks like Thursday will be the first actual day without breaking ‘news’.
OnlySeeInGreenBhoy, many thanks. I passed your comment on to Mrs67 to let her know that my time here is being appreciated.
Selena, Selina, you tease. Let’s hope.
Evil Keneival, stick to the bhike and let the ghuys have some fun!
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Paul67 - get the story published ie on here. Consequences of not doig so could go as far as one of your gnomes being targeted for ransom. Ransom note with gnome pic not a nice thing, been there.
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I find it incredible that anyone could be questioning whether or not they would like Bellamy to stay at CP.
It looks like he is leaving,but I for one would be delighted if he stayed.Pace,ability,will to win,these are all attributes I would be looking for in a player.
For those looking to question his ability to finish chances,this is what training ground practice is for.I don't remember Henrik scoring thirty or forty in his first season with us,he developed as the years went by.
At 25 years old,Bellamy is a snip for an additional £5 million.I'm also with rammiebhoy in that Keane in addition to Bellamy would be fantastic,but I'm also a realist.
One last thing.The idea of Lennon and Balde at the back.....
Valium please Doctor!!!!! I want us to build a team to challenge in Europe,not commit SPL suicide.
BankieBhoy
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Ahh Millinery OSIG, gotcha. Practising for the Band / U2 concert. But walking through SoHo like that got a few admiring glances - of the wrong kind!!!
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What a difference a week makes. As an earlier post said, Paul and fellow Tims on this site, you made it possible for me to get through a traumtic few days.
As someone who has been hoping for Bobo to get his cards for months now, I think the idea of a defence based on him and Neil Lennon doing a John Clark is tantamount to suicide and not just in Europe. Sure Bobo will go through brickwalls but it's brain and not brawn that we need. Varga, though dead slow, has that brain. Bobo, to me, lost the plot at the African Nations Cup. Jackie might do a job for us but definitely not at left back. His passing there is abysmal. Neil Lennon, great Celt that he is, is taken to the cleaners too easily in Europe. Sad but true. Maybe he could be kept to bring on someone. But we definitely need a class centre half, left back and centre forward , all with pace to burn. Maybes people will pay good money for Bobo and BBJ. Here's hoping anyway.
To every player who has worn a Celtic shirt this season, many thanks. I don't think there is one who hasn't given everything. That is Martin's doing. Everyone is proud to wear the jerseys. Long may that continue.
WGS: MAKE STAN PETROV YOUR CAPTAIN.
Parkheadcumsalford.
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Parkheadcumsalford.
Be amazed if there were any dissenting voices on Stan as captain
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Wee Jinky @ 4:05pm - well said my friend.
C'mon the hoops.
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Anyone suggesting Kompany for Celtic has been playing too much Football Manager. What about Mohammad Zidan and Freddy Adu??? It’s always funny when the pre season comes around and everyone starts suggesting great wee players we should sign - purely based on their performance in FM. The last champ had Bobby Petta as a great player - I rest my case. I watched Anderlecht against Celtic and a little in Europe and I never noticed Kompany.
Rumoid are you suggesting we play Pearson at the back as a centre half? Although at first I though this was a little daft I think his pace would be of use in that position. Only problem would be his physique – or distinct lack of one. Valid suggestion though.
Personally I think Robbie Keane is a wonderful player and is proven premiership quality. Not been tested in Europe but neither had the vast majority of the Seville side. It is all about the man at the helm. Rammiebhoy made a good point about how Keane may still have his best years ahead of him – like Henrik did.
I also hope to see Neimi at CP next season. He is a very capable ‘keeper and the fact he is an ex hun makes no difference. In fact it would make me very happy showing them what they let go.
Chris, Cleland
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And added to that last post, Stan is my overwhelming choice for captain. He is a fantastic asset and love the burst he provides the side with.
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BankieBhoy, you have taken my comments out of context.i did not suggest that lenny and bobo be tried together in europe, just suggested that friendlies are for experimenting and i can think of loads of examples where def mids have moved back with varying degrees of success (alan stubbs being one celtic minded example, rio ferdinand, roy keane,helguera, even our very own jackie mac came to us as a right winger and played very well as the left of a back 3). i would say that he has the main attributes necessary to play with the proviso that he has big goliath bobo for the rough stuff beside him:he reads the game well, is comfortable sitting behind play, and a great, GREAT tackler. my main reservation is his heading. but as i say, if money is no option go out and sign a centre half and a midfielder. if money is a factor, which i think we all know it is, then perhaps moving certain players eg jackie mac into lennys role, may be one option.
anonymous 8:49 will grant you that varga 'reads' the game very well. hes great at intercepting passes from opposition intended for strikers to run onto, and hes a decent passer. but although these are great attributes, he steps out in front of bobo a lot to do this, leaving bobo as our last man, which im sure no-one feels safe about. also i think his (misplaced?) confidence in his passing in my view is one of the reasons we degenerate so easily to route 1. i prefer defenders who don't go for the 'world cup' pass bypassing the midfield, particularly as our most potent threat (petrov) is not getting enough of the ball from the back. basically we've got 2 guys who seemingly cant play together and the solution is to replace one of them with a more suitable partner for the other. my argument is that bobo is a lot better at what he does (ball winner, intimidating guy) than varga is at what he does (reads the game and passes). therefore i feel vrga, while not without his virtues, would be easier to replace.
by the way, referring to rio ferdinand earlier reminded me: has anyone seen his wee bro antoin play? heard hes even better than rio was at his age, he was interviewed the other day saying how peter grant was the biggest influence on him. thats my boy peter, get him up to the hoops ASAP!
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by the way should have put my name at the bottom of that last post (9:20). and one more thing - bankiebhoy, totally agree with you, you will not find a celtic supporting soul alive who would not like to see bellamy in the hoops next year, the point is would 6 million be more productively spent on him or on 2-3 players in the 2-3 million price range, particularly, and this seems likely to me, that is our entire budget for transfers. for 6 million in todays market i would expect the complete finished article and im not sure he is. and henrik did get 30 in 37 games in his first season, but lets not compare anybody to him, that wouldnt be fair!
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Can't believe the number of people defending Bobo. His quality was summed up for me yesterday when he conceded a completely unnecessary corner when he was under no pressure whatsoever simply because he obviously did not have the confidence to touch the ball with his left foot. If my arguement needs any back up Seville and Lyon provide it.
Paul - your already excellent site has improved even more over the last week or so. I have said before that it is let down by the very basic engine, and while I would never want it to go the way of every other football forum, I can't help but think it could be so much better. The content from yourself and many of the other posters is absolutely top draw. You have replied in the past that money is the problem. I know absolutely nothing about how much an improved forum design would cost, but would certainly be willing to consider a moderate sized financial contribution, and there may be others who feel similarly. After all, we have at least one poster who boasts of a lavish, well-connected lifestyle. Please let me know if you are interested, and may I suggest that other posters who would also consider this let Paul know. Bear in mind that buying the Daily Record/Sunday Mail for a year costs the best part of £100.
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i remember when Hearts were beating us 2-0 and Bobo let the ball run out for a goal kick and just left it leaving Marshall to run and get it.I couldnt believe his attitude.
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two points to add
1) anyone defending bobo on here would still admit he has a lot of improving to do. So no-one is saying he is the finished article by any means. But I think any sensible Celtic would agree that Varga and Bobo are never a partnership, in fact I think many including myself have suggested it for a year and a half. Now there could be an argument for Varga and another rather than Bobo but I would go for Bobo. However what is clear is that the two cannot play together.
2) Talking about Bellamy and the lack of support he gets from Hartson etc reminds me of the abuse Agathe used to get when he played at wing back for bad crossing despite the fact as he was so fast he had nobody to cross to.
Tonybhoy
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