 Thursday, June 16, 2005
Strachan brings control to public opinion
What a difference a wee word from Gordon Strachan makes. On Tuesday Jackie McNamara used the word “respect” six times in a radio interview when complaining about Celtic not making him feel wanted.
“Shambles” was the cry across the land, “Celtic are at it again”.
Move on a day and Gordon Strachan paints an altogether different story. The player was informed publicly and face to face with the manager that the club wanted him. A two year offer had been made with a pay increase.
The club did not match the players demands and the player moved on.
There is no point complaining about the press with this one, they reported facts faithfully as they were presented to them.
Blaming the agent is another favourite diversion. Darren Jackson is not employed to keep Jackie McNamara at Celtic; he is there to make available the best deals possible to his client.
I cannot think what was going through Jackies mind when he decided to speak to the media. I am sure the objective facts – that he left Celtic for more money elsewhere two weeks after a testimonial game – is not how he wants to be remembered, perhaps he wanted to avert a backlash.
I do not have a problem with him leaving; he had every right to, just as Celtic had every right to decline to match his wage demand on Monday evening.
It leaves you and me with some thinking to do though. The anguished portrayal of our club here on Celtic Quick News and elsewhere following McNamaras remarks was based on an incomplete picture.
When our team captain is briefing against Celtic to the media we have our hands full. When I hear an anti-Celtic story I filter it for half-truths, spin, misunderstanding and plain lies. As you will have noticed, I then apply my own Celtic supporting picture of the world upon it.
More than our team captain will brief against the club in the weeks and month to come and while so many Celtic fans take the bait they will find fertile ground.
All this sure makes you wonder what was going on in the dressing room during the last four weeks of the season.
196 Comments:
-
Agree. Bottom line is Jackie thought he was worth more than Strachan was offering. Time will tell if WGS is right.
-
Zurawski's team lost 3-1, but he scored the goal, that's 25 in 26 games this season.
-
I typed most of this as the last comment on the previous thread. Wee Gordon's comments are helpful but I wouldn't accept them as a full explanation for what has gone on between the club and its erstwhile captain over the last few months. The fact Jackie wasn't tied up long ago is puzzling. However, as I stated earlier, perhaps it is not justified to be going above 10 grand a week (the poor lad!) for a player who won't be first choice.
Negotiations with agents involved can be toruous and full of bravado and positional statements. I believe Jackie got a better deal and took it. As captain, he should have said so and not tried to do down the club. Nevertheless, I wish him all the best.
However, with wee Gordon now out and about (allegedly), I'd imagine we won't let another weekend go without giving our fans some good news. Big Jock Stein always knew the role Sunday papers played in setting the agenda for the start of the week and made sure they were fed tasty titbits to keep us on the back pages. Unfortunately, it seems David Murray has learned that lesson better than our board.
The Rangers chairman has cultivated the press strategically. When bad news brews (such as Kyrgiakos going) he always makes sure there is something else to take its place. Wonder why the Daily Record put on its front page that they'd signed a "4million pound player" even though the guy was an out-of-favour freebie who had punched his own coach?
The Jackie Mac saga, like the Brian Quinn phone message and DD's outburst before it, were all self-inflicted own goals. Celtic seem to want to hold the media at arm's length, but then bleat when the gutter press turn on them. As a famous Don (not Joe Harper) once said: "Keep your friends close, but keep your enemies closer."
-
As much as I am sorry to see Jackie go, i`m glad a truer picture has been painted. As usual the tabloids have been scathing, who really cares anymore? Jackie earned millions at Celtic, including a bumper testimonial, if he didn`t want to go elsewhere,as he has stated, then why has he gone? Loyalty should work two ways, it seems Jackie was loyal until he`d cashed in his chips. I wish him all the best at his new club, i`m sure he`ll miss us more than we`ll miss him, especially on the European nights, cos lets face it, he won`t see them again. Thanks again, Jackie, lets move on.
-
Hey, I've just been having a beer with Bobby Russell - the one who scored in the 4-2 game. Bhoy, you got home quick! (I apologise for the chat-room banter)
-
IMO Celtic fans are divided down the middle on the JM situation. I know of some lifelong fans who are loyal through and through to the players. Some of these guys have written to JM asking for the money back for the testimonial so they can decide what charity it goes to. My point here is these people would usually blame the board for losing JM. I think if you read between the lines JM took the money option and ran. Good luck to him, he has given a lot to the club.
Paul, I take it that if the two players who have already signed are a midfielder and a goalkeeper we do not have Diamond or Riordan.
My best guess now is Hartley and possibly Gordon, am I close with this assumption?
Off the topic I read the back page off the Daily Rankers (before people start throwing things at me I was at work bored and it was lying in front of me.) and noticed it mentioned that basically, and this is para-phrasing: "Celtic failed to offer JM the wages that he was on after, this on the same day the £7m Euro money has been announced" I ask you, who announced this today? I knew about it when Rankers got knocked out of Europe. Would the answer be perhaps the newspapers? Perfect example of how they are genuinely ingenious and stirring things when it comes to Celtic. (Of course it was all great news for Rankers and how Bazza will improve with the new signing).
Does anyone know if Maciej Zurawski has pace yet? I see he scored again today, that's apparently his 25th goal in 26 games. Would be a good signing but a little expensive when you consider we'd only get £2m for BBJ. Although with the teams apparently after him dropping out his price may drop. Paul, is 'Magic' the contingency plan?
To be honest, IMO if we were to buy Riordan I can't see why he wouldn't grab us 30 goals a season, he managed 20 odd at Hibs and would be getting more supply at Celtic. Nobody can really tell yet if he could do the job in Europe but he is still only young. Beattie is a good player but I'm not confident he will get us loads of goals, the same applies to Maloney.
Finally, I would hope we're not after Klos if he's 32, JM was younger so what is the point?
-
WGS putting things from the other point of view certainly helps to paint a more accurate picture of what went on.But ultimately virtually everyone will decide who they blame,sometimes regardless of facts proving otherwise.
Me? I blame no-one.Jackie left because he wanted to,end of story.
BankieBhoy
-
Malone19!!!
Hasn't Paul made it clear on numerous occassions that he won't speculate on who is coming to Celtic. Paul may have some inside info but he's not an all seeing oracle.
Only get £2million for BBJ.. have you seen him playing??
Sorry but some of your questions seem irrelevant and a vague(as in who knows)
-
Look at what this c*ck had to write on one of the Wolves sites on this situation.
http://www.sportnetwork.net/main/s115/st75148.htm
I agree that the situation has been taken overboard but it's something that never had to happen in the first place if we sorted out his contract long before.
-
Mick
Paul has indicated on previous posts that he knows of players who are in the door. It is my understanding that obviously he cannot come out and give the names away as this would be breaking Celtics trust. I am quite sure however that if he does have inside info on who we have signed he could confirm that players are not at the club. A lot of my questions were rhetorical and weren't looking for a black & white answer.
Yes I have indeed seen BBJ play and although he is not what we need at this time he bags loads of goals (he has done throughout his whole career even in the EPL). He will score goals wherever he goes and considering he just received player of the year award (warranting it or not) I think around £2m if perfectly ok to be looking for - the Rankers are after well over £1m for Kishnasvilli (excuse the spelling) so why not?
-
Sean
Just read the article there, found it quite funny in a disturbing way. It's better to ignore reporting of such poor quality, perhaps once positive from this whole experience is that players will hopefully not think they can rape us for our last pennies when negotiating new contracts or when signing for the club.
-
Don't worry it had me laughing out loud for sure. It just worries me people like that are out there. It's time as a human race we trim the herd I feel hehe
I popped on the message board as well. The usual ignorant comments i hear all the time living down here. All it does is emphasize how much we need decent television coverage. You need to pay the huge prices of Setanta to see Celtic down here so basically only our fans see the club. It's not good for marketing. I wish there was something we could do.
-
First Posting....so be gentle folks:)
Guys, there are several issues at play here, and as such there may be
multiple culprits.
First off, decisions were made NOT to offer deals last summer to:
Jackie (he had one year left, he'd probably have taken another one)
Bobo
Lennon
Joos (fair enough)
Douglas (fair enough again)
Hartson (we'd be in deep shoite if he had not signed in January)
That's a lot of bodies to take a chance on. Especially given we had our
arses kicked by liam miller. We did re-sign Sutton (thank God) and Thompson
(aaarrgghh!!) We also spent dosh - lots of it - on Camara (aarrgghh again).
MON didn't decide how much money he had - but he did decide on who to spend
it on. Assuming he didn't have enough to offer deals to everyone he
wanted - he made his decisions, and we need to live with them. I think that
it is clear that neither GS or Lawell would have been part of these
decisions.
Then January came along, and we seemingly had some money available. Hartson
signed, and we should be glad of that. Even if he were to leave now, at
least we'd get something for him. Bobo clearly had decided he wanted to
test the summer market. Given the fact that we were in January, the deal we
got with him was as good as we could have hoped for.
So we get to the summer and Jackie. we don't know why an offer wasn't made
10 minutes after GS arrived, but it seems that an offer WAS tabled, and that
Jackie was negotiating. Then, wolves offered him 16k a week. All of a
sudden, Jackie had to explain why he was dropping down to a lower league,
giving up european football, and rejecting an offer from the club that he
supported - and only a couple of weeks after his testimonial.
I don't blame him for going. What I do object to is his attempts to deflect
blame to what he knew was an easy target - the Board. He knew all too well
that there is a certain section of the support who will believe ANYTHING
about the board - especially if it is written by the hacks at the record.
Sad but true.
So, rather than say he wanted a few bob more and a less demanding
life.....he grabs the money and claims it is all too late....something
(according to GS) he had never indicated.
I feel sorry for Strachan. He bought the house, only to find that it hadn't
been maintained very well. There has been little indication of squad
management either in team selection, or contract awards. Next season will
be a tough one. I hope that the support will bear in mind, when making
comparisons with MON (comparisons that will surely be impossible to live up
to in the short term) that MON inherited Lambert, Mjallby, Lubo, Petrov and
Larsson....oh yes, and Jackie.
Keep the heads up, lads. And don't believe all the crap that is written
about the board.
-
WeeRon
I think this is the first time I've agreed with everything someone has posted on this site that reads over 4 paragraphs.
Considering MONs situation over the last 18 months I believe a lot of the contract negotiations etc. have been put on the back-burner. If even some of the statements Juninho made are true, which I suspect they are, then I would believe that MON drove down south to his his family at every oppertunity. This is completely understandable and I would have done the exact same if I were in his position. However, if this is the case it would have left the board into a difficult position, having a manager who cannot commit 100% to the job at Celtic is not the most efficent way of doing business. They obviously couldn't ask him to move on as it would be similar to commiting Hari-Kari; I would have thought (and all of this is just my opinion) that they would have made an arrangement for MON to finish the season. The manager not being around IMO would explain the behaviour of a lot of the players in recent months.
-
THE REALITY OF THE RECENT EXODUS OF PLAYERS FROM CELTIC PARK LIES IN THE DESTINATION OF THESE PLAYERS.
THE FACT THAT THEY WILL BE PLAYING IN A LOWER ENGLISH LEAGUE IS PROOF POSITIVE THAT THEY ARE NOT OF THE STANDARD REQUIRED TO PERFORM WITH DISTINCTION IN THE CHAMPIONS LEAGUE.
THE FACT THAT JACKIE WAS CAPTAIN HAD LESS TO DO WITH HIS INFLUENCE ON THE TEAM AND MORE TO DO WITH HIS LONGEVITY IN THE SIDE. JACKIE IS NOT AS FAST AS HE USED TO BE, AND IS NOT GETTING ANY QUICKER. THIS IS WHY HE IS GOING TO PLAY WITH WOLVES AND NOT IN THE PREMIERSHIP.
-
Hey guys Jackie is gone so lets get on another subject after all he
is at or past his sell by date. And if Bobo goes, he goes. At times he looked like a disaster waiting to happen. He may be intimidating to play against but I don't see too much evidence of a keen footballing brain. It's gonna take a strong coach to keep him in line if he stays or goes.
-
I can't be too bothered about Jackie going. He was a decent utility player but not a good captain..too quiet. Look at Stan in the last game when his passion was so high it nearly went over the top.
Good on Wee Gordo for speaking up to set the record straight. I expect we will see more straight talking from him.
-
I am sorry I believe Jackie not the board or our newly appointed manager. You guys believe what you want, Jackie was an excellent player and servant to Celtic who it would seem the majority of supporters on this website and the board took for granted. Our loss not his
-
When the two sides of a story conflict, people end up believing what they want to believe. Those who oppose the board will see the JM saga as more evidence of their bungling.
I don't know who offered what when where or how. I don't really care.
Two things I do know.
JM was captain of the side on the worst day I've experienced as a Celtic supporter. Maybe I missed him standing up to be counted after the game, when MON was big enough to take the blame. But his leadership on the park failed.
The other thing is that I cannot remember any respected senior Celtic figure (and we don't always deal with the exit policy effectively) leaving with such lack of dignity.
Let's move on. OK, me too.
-
Yes Paul, I agree Strachan's commenys have shed more light on the events and have assuaged our fears to an extent.
But was is self-evident is the shambolic news management. Our PR is a disgrace. Constantly firefighting a "hostile" press. It would be nice to see Celtic seeting the agenda.
Who's in charge, Paul?
-
Agree Paul, I think you hit the nail on the head with Jackie being embarrassed leaving so quickly after the testimonial and tried to blame the club rather than himself. He must have known though that the Club would hit back especially when GS had publicly said he would like him to stay. Jackie was a good versitile pro but he is not the player jackie himself thinks he is, otherwise he would be looking to a higher standard than Wolves.
I wish him luck but I don't think it will take a great player to replace him, we have a ready made left back on his way back to fitness.
-
You've touched on something really interesting there Paul, what was going on in the dressing room during the last 4 weeks of the season? A club captain harbouring a grudge against some of his team mates who he knew had tied up better deals than he was ever likely to be offered. Putting to one side the mangers situation, what kind of influence would that have had on team morale? I still don’t think we've got the complete picture of the events that led up to that awful performance at Fir Park on the final day.
-
Paul, I loved the way WGS stayed above the slagging match type quotes that Jackie lowered himself too the other day.
The wee man really knows how to speak to the media and won't be caught out that easily.
Hope you enjoy life in the Championshit Jackie-boy..
-
I wish Jackie had stayed - he'd have continued to do a a good job for Celtic and I see no reason why he wouldn't feature in the first team (in terms of fitness and ability).
Now that he's gone, we're all too quick to say "aye, he wasn't that good. Glad to see the back of him".
I don't recall one single person saying this while he was here.
What wages/fees will be involved in his replacement and will he be noticeably cheaper?
People *will* believe what they want to believe if it helps them justify his decision. There's now talks of a rift in the dressing room? I don't believe it.
"When I hear an anti-Celtic story I filter it for half-truths, spin, misunderstanding and plain lies. As you will have noticed, I then apply my own Celtic supporting picture of the world upon it."
That you do - you've taken any half truths in here and painted it in a completely pro-Celtic fashion. It may or may not be the case that Celtic dropped the ball here but it doesn't seem like an option you're entertaining, Paul.
Also, just to finish of my mini-rant (haha!) here. You or anyone could very easily say, "we've done deals for 4 or more players already".
Even if this is patently untrue and we've barely identified a player, I've no doubt that we need to bring quite a few faces in given the numbers who've left.
When these new guys are identified and signed next month it's all to easy to say "I told you so" without actually having had any insight/foresight.
I'm not literally claiming that the "done deals" claim is an intentional fabrication but apart from taking your word at face value, how can anyone differentiate between your version of events and my hypothesised one?
I honestly don't want to sound too critical, I'm just in no hurry to follow tabloids or this website *blindly*.
-
On another note-at least one journalist is prepared to blow away the nonsense of the Daily Ranker. Step forward Graham Speirs again:-
http://www.theherald.co.uk/sport/41325.html
-
Paul,
It seems that some people haven't been reading your site too long. Otherwise they would have known that the possible goings of the likes of Jackie, Lennon, Bobo (oh, please God, let it happen soon)and Fernandez has been the stuff of comment for months. Most quite happy about most, if not all, heading for the exit door. Jackie, for all his efforts, should never have been captain. As I've said more than once on here:WGS MAKE STAN CAPTAIN!!!
-
Stevie21,
not following anyone blindly is an admirable trait and one that most on here would encourage. The reason this site is so good is because we have Paul posting and the reasoned debate that follows. Some pro some anti. Somewhere in the middle ground between what you call a pro-celtic stance from Paul and the position of the tabloids is the truth. I would be inclined to say it is more likely to be nearer Pauls position than the Tabloids, but then I may be biased as I see the tabloids as being anti-celtic. Keep up the scepticism and the reasoned debate.
-
Excellent article by Mr Spiers. In this day and age, any great player of any great quality will not still be looking for a club when they are able to start looking in January. All the best ones are signed up by the bigger clubs as soon as they are available.
You may find some players at smaller clubs who turn out to be gems, but the big names are gone already.
-
For me all this situation highlights is a lack of leadership at our club.
WGS and Lawell comments in the wake of this just reek of closing the stable door when the horse has already bolted.
Did we really expect WGS to come out say “och aye he (Lawell) made a mess of this”.
We need to look closer at the set up at Celtic, not just who’s to blame. We need to look to make sure this doesn’t happen again.
Oh but did we not say that after Liam Miller?
-
Good to see WGS giving a more balanced view of things. JM was out of contract, offered by both MON & WGS what they felt he was worth. His agent(!) has now secured him a more lucrative contract at a much lesser level. His choice, no problems with it he had already Celtic his best years and was happy with his previous contracts or wouldn't have signed. He's been well enough paid + Bonuses / testimonial and can have no complaints. Like Lennon or anyone else he can be replaced.
If JM wanted £ 15k + a week, I would have no hestitation in moving on for a younger / better player which is what I fully expect to happen. For 2 years MON gave JM one year deals, obviously not regarding him as a "must stay" type player...so lets now move to bring in such a player and pay him with the additional wages saved on dead wood such as Sylla - Lambert - Laursen etc
-
Jackie can be a nasty piece of work when it suits him, and I still think that there were issues with him and Bellamy. Jackie has taken his money and ran there was no need for him to give an anti Celtic board outburst to the press, he of all people understands their agenda. Lets forget about him and concentrate on Celtic now, and look forward to a better and more exciting replacement for JM.
Stevie21 can you not differentiate between "tabloids and this website" ?
-
I have to admin, on the day the JM story broke, I had no reason to disbelieve Jackie's view in events. This was based on the fact I've met Jackie on a number of occasions and found him nothing but a quiet/shy/honest guy.
the statement issued by the board on the official website on the day done nothing to shift me from my view that the board were "fools".
However, when it comes down to a choice between believing JM or WGS, I'd have to go with the ginger one. Don't know why, but I don't think he'd issue this statement on behest of the board, and he's a straight talker.
Upon reflection, the loss of Jackie isn't as big a deal as I first thought, and I'm hoping that by the time the season starts we'll all be saying "Jackie who?"
-
Stevie21, you miss my point.
Short of having any (or full) information we all need to consider if we are prepared to publicly criticise Celtic when we know that we are not in possession of the facts. Experience has taught me that more half truths are offered about Celtic in a light which does the reputation of our club no good.
The McNamara episode is a prime example. The lesson is that without any help from the media some Celtic fans turned on the club before they know all the information.
As Celtic ‘supporters’ we should be the last people to jump on the club not the first. I do not look for the Celtic angle, but I take convincing before I come out and publicly berate my club.
As for the “I told you so” comment. I rarely use this phrase and only ever when very specific information has been given (such as saying we would sign two players in the next 36 hours back in January, or telling you Jackie was expecting to leave the day before the Cup Final).
-
Madmurph calls it right.
The truth will lie in the middle. I know some of Jackie's pals have confirmed the offer in the car story.
We know Paul's view will generally be pro-board (he has a position to defend) - so we will just need to accept that.
Anyway - as long as they (Board and GS) get the finger out its not too late.
And naturally I do not believe I was overreacting.
-
Just read the Graham Speirs article excellent as usual.
Incidentally picture on the home page(online Herald) is that Gerry McNee masquerading as a hostage?
-
Putting aside the who said what when details, we have to admit that this episode has damaged the clubs reputation. We now have every 'Ranger minded' hack crawling out of thier burrows and penning poison words about the club.
I see the principle blame for this lying at McNamara's door. He did not have to talk to the press in the manner he did. He could have keep a respectfull silence.
The club will go on and eventually this will be forotten about, but will it be forgiven?
The only person really damaged by this is McNamara. How welcome, in TimLand will he be now?
-
Malone 19, found this clip of Zurawski. Not sure if its exactly blistering pace but good composure and finishing. Thats my namesake Delaney he held off and I think he's pretty nifty.
http://www.kibice-uk.net/walespoland04.htm
Welcome Wee Ron, great first post.
On the Jackie front, have come to believe that it was a poor effort by the board. I think after it took so long to offer him a deal he was resigned to leaving no matter what the board offered. I hope this time they learn a lesson.
-
-
Paul, you comment "All this sure makes you wonder what was going on in the dressing room during the last four weeks of the season" really does say a lot.
Nobody is coming out of this with any credit. Hopefully, GS will step up and lead us out of this torpor. I actually believe he can !
-
Stevie21: Agree entirely, I just wish I could type as fast as you. CQN is in danger of becoming CBN - Celtic Board News.
Paul: You are much diminished in my eyes by your continual peddling of the spin put out by the board to cover up for their mistakes. In the past it has been flying kites on behalf of middle ranking board members now it involves peddling half truths and a partial selection of facts to denigrate a former player and captain.
What next? "Back the Board" rallies and T shirts?
Everything put out yesterday by the board had a bad whiff of reverse engineering about it. They were not seekers of truth, enlighteners of the faithful, they were coverers of arses.
Consequently your attempts to justify the board's position up to and including allusions to the state of Jackie Mac's mental state are straight out of the Pravda school journalism. Who thought up that idea: you, a suit or NeilR?
The story put out by the board and parroted here misses out some key points:
Why were talks not started earlier?
Were talks only started at the behest of DJ?
If yes when were the talks supposed to start?
When the deadline was set, were figures included?
How many offers were made on Monday evening?
Was an improved offer made on Tuesday?
Did it match the Wolves figure?
Why was Celtic's position on all of this not put out earlier?
Thin on Tuesday, torrents on Wednesday, why?
No party has put out a complete picture of what went on. It is just that the club has previous, it is trying to catch up and JM got 90% of his story out first.
If it all comes down to the clubs reluctance to pay a signing on fee so soon after a testimonial vs. the players insistence on such a fee based on past experience with other players and the fact that the testimonial carrot was used to make him accept cut price one year deals in the recent past.
You pay your money and you take your choice!
For what it's worth I would suggest that the club's poor behaviour has lasted two years and not just two weeks.
With regards to JM being made the captain, why am I reminded of the following Private Eye cartoon?
Man walks in to a shop to be served by a bloke sporting a "God" badge.
"Oh I see you didn't get a pay rise this year?"
The tentacles of this debacle could spread much wider. Who made JM captain and why?
However I think it is time to move on, it is encouraging that the most sense in all of this has been spoken by WGS.
-
Off topic but....
http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/41320.html
Talking about East End renewal.
-
I hate to post yet another opinion on the JM situation but do you not think that he may have been told that during the 2 year contract on offer he may not be an automatic first team pick? Its (in a funny old way) similar to Business - when a CE or MD has taken the Company as far as he is able to do he will move on before in effect he is pushed out? I thought JM was a great all rounder for us but I think he has had his best days and may have moved to a promise of first team football. Good luck to him - but if it were me I would have shut up and counted the lolly....in the past I have had loads of customers who - having made a 'bad error of judgement'and realised it have taken it out on me - its in some peoples nature to lash out - its not in mine.
-
Initially I said I was sad to see Jackie go, but it wasn't the end of the world provided we had a replacement in our sights.
In light of recent events, I take that back - not sad at all. Is it true Jackie went to the Record to spill the beans? If so, that's just incredible...Don't think WGS had that sort of thing in mind when he said McNamara "knows what the Club is all about".
As for info coming from Jackie's pals (?!?)...in all seriousness, were they in the car? Anyone have any info from WGS' or Lawwell's pals to counter this? ;->
Anyhoo, Lawwell has admitted 'phoning Jackie in the car to "confirm Celtic's position and Jackie's understanding of it" - not to up the offer. WGS/Lawwell both said the offer was upped before before JM's pumpkin hour of 5pm Monday.
-
For those of you who feel uncomfortable using the initials of our new manager, then an alternative could be GDS as his middle name is David. Apologies for the distraction, but I feel we have exhausted the Jackie Mac saga.
-
Do you think Jackie Mac would have said no to a contract BEFORE getting his testimonial? I don't think so,
See ya Jackie,wouldn't wanna be ya
Cabbage McF
-
I posted something similar a few days ago, not sure if many picked up on it.
(Firstly, I work with Economic Appraisals- weighing pros and cons and making funding decisions based on them, so can claim a bit of knowledge ont the subject)
The board look at what JMc's value to the club. Considering he is now over the 30 mark and not necessarily the player he was say 4 years ago, he does not warrant a pay/terms increase [Lennon's situation= paycut, JMc's should be similar]. He is no more valuable to the club now than he was then so it makes no Economic sense to put a bigger value on him.
IMHO the only mistake the board made was offering him renewed terms after he/Jackson threw his toys out of the pram.
For a player to put such a deadline on negotiations with a club he has supported as a boy then claim the CLUB were disloyal, is infuriating and has left a sour taste in my mouth, and my opinion of JMc has plumetted.
As I said before best wishes and good luck Jackie...... You'l need it!
-
I was fortunate enough to be at Jackie's testimonial ball in the Kerrydale suite a couple of Sunday's ago, when MON was asked to come to the microphone and pay tribute to Jackie.
His opening statement was "We come here tonight to bid farewell to Jackie MacNamarra", amid roars of laughter in astonishment, he proceeded to backtrack at the speed of sound, with Jackie looking totally bemused.
Was it a freudian slip, or did MON know all along what was going to happen, after all he was the guy who could have prevented all of this by addressing the issue when he was manager.
Re Jackie, I'm sorry it ended the way it did, but I feel he has been going backwards in the last 6 months in particular, with a lot of opposition chances, coming from his side of defence.
Yet again, maybe this was preying on his mind, and eating into him, when he saw the likes of Bobo, a nightmare if every I saw one, getting the deal that he got.
-
Steve21
Not much of your comment I agree with I'm afraid.
You are quite mistaken to suggest that JM's ability has never been questioned on this site. I, and others, most certainly have and long before he left the club.
You write`people will believe what they want to believe if it helps them justify his decision' then oddly embody that very principle to state your case !!
Madmitch
JM was offered a contract based on his worth to the club- what's wrong with that.I'm sure the club's and GS's evaluation was pitched at the correct level for a player of only reasonable ability . JM was offered more from Wolves and decides to move - I have no problem with that either but why the need to have a parting shot at Celtic? JM has moved on..get over it, his best days are past him anyway. Celtic won't miss him but he might just miss Celtic.
-
I'm not worried at all about the departure of McNamara, nor anyone else that has left for that matter.
Although WGS has came out publically and said he indicated to Jackie what he wanted from him for next season, could it be that Jackie was not guaranteed a game next season was the main reason?
I'm sure we will see around 5 or 6 new faces by July - maybe not the names many are clamouring for, but new faces nonetheless. My hunch is that we will have one major signing plus a quality Bosman, supplemented by a three or four players of decent standard such as Riordan et al. There will also be the opportunity for a number of young players to make the step-up too.
The optimistic outlook as that this may all work out well. For sometime now, people on this blog have been eulogising about the quality of player in our present youth system. It seemed to me that MON was unwiling to draft from the system, and when he did it ended-up with the talent being shunted to peripheral positions in the team. Perhaps WGS will see things differently, and place the responsibility on players like McGeady (ie. in a central, playmaker role)?
I'm looking forward to the season that lies ahead. It will be different for sure, but I'm convinced we will see a far more entertaining Celtic side that we have in the last two years with more emphasis on the team as opposed to reliance on individuals (Larsson in 2003/04, and Bellamy last season).
I'm be more than willing to give Strachan's Celtic both my time, money and patience. I think we are going to enjoy next year.
-
Tom64,thanks for the link.
I think it's a pity that at a time when the club seem to be involved in a bit of long term planning that it is all being missed due to a lack of communication with the wider support and this pathetic "who's fault was it" scenario with Jackie.
Forgive my ignorance on this issue,but if this isn't the Barrowfield or Lennoxtown option,is this the third option that PL was refering to?
BankieBhoy
-
JeromeK67
I have no issue with JM leaving, it could be the best thing for both paries. My issue is the way it happened and the fact that this site, which is by common consent slanted towards the board, threw all objectivity out the window to "spin" events to the board's / PL's advantage.
EK Gerry
Very interesting comment, a cat playing with a mouse? A weak captain usually means a forceful coach and vice versa.
However both have gone and it is onwards and upwards as the board work towards their plan of European domination by 2010. If that isn't their plan well it should be.
-
I've just had a look at our current squad on the official site and I have to admit I wasn't delighted but after a bit of examination things could definately be on the up with only a minimum 4 new signings.
I went through it and weeded who I think will be on their way out.
Fernandez
Hedman
Henchoz (if not already away)
Laursen
Valgaren
Hartson(maybe)
Varga (maybe, Bobo looks to be staying)
Out of the remaining there are 7 who would be good enough to be first team players and thats not including Pearson, Beattie, Agathe Thompson and Lennon. who would all be excellent squad players.
By my guess (and I'm not best tactician in the world) we need a Right and Left Back, a quick defensive Mid and a Left mid. and I honestly think we would have a side capable of Europeann sucess.
I know this may be a case of stating the obvious but I would urge anyone starting to panic to print off the squad list and go through it. Its not all doom and gloom, providing the signings come soon.
PS. As i said yesterday keep an eye out for something tomorrow.
-
-
From official site ....
Bobo Balde has claimed that he expects to return for pre-season training at Celtic Park after being convinced of the club’s ambition by its new manager, Gordon Strachan.
-
Jimios - its entirely up to you what you believe - the truth will be somewhere in between
-
Madmitch
No idea why you are having a go at me here. To say that I am not objective simply because I require a greater level of evidence before I will criticise Celtic than you does me less credit than I deserve.
Attempting to portray this as being “slanted” towards the board undermines clear debate with a totally subjective opinion – the type of which you have shared with us on many occasions in the last few days.
For what it is worth I regard myself to be the most objective person I know in my views about Celtic and make every call on its merits.
If you review what was said here by others after McNamara went to the press about the club and contrast it with the views expressed after Strachan spoke you might consider adopting my policy yourself.
-
Alabama Celt
Thanks for the link, I've seen other clips on soccerclips.net but none show his pace. Zurawski does look composed and can finish. He is twice as fast as Hartson in this clip alone and I think you can tell he's not running at full speed. I would welcome him as a replacement for Hartson at the club; saying this Riordon IMO would replace him (same goals better workrate and more assists, all at only 22).
I think the posts saying we need to sort out the defence, a left midfield, central or defencive midfielder and a goalkeeper are spot-on. I hope we will be replacing Hartson and can get Bellamy to stay. I think Sutton falls into the bracket that GS put JM and Lennon under (although not a life long supporter he puts everything in for the club). I would like to see him play up front or in defence this year as playing in midfield IMO screws up our whole shape if adding a little bite to the midfield machine.
Still have no idea what the keeper situation is, paul says we have one in place who will be No.1 but I can't even throw a guess at who it is?
-
I think all areas of the team need seriously strengthened. We need a keeper, full backs, central defender(s), midfield players with energy, and striker(s). IMO we need at least 6 starting XI players.
Interestingly in MoN's first Old Firm game the Celtic side contained only 2 players (Sutton & Valgaeren) brought in by the new manager. There is no way Strachan could get away with only bringing in 2 new first team players.
-
Just read Bobo's comments on the Celtic site. Incredible! He wants to be with a club who can get to the latter stages of the UCL. He,single-handely,(pun intended) was responsible for our departure in Lyon.
We slagged Tebily. Nicknamed him "bombscare". Well watching Bobo take the ball from Varga had me "totally brikkin masel" then watch as he punted the ball up the park to no-one.
Do me a favour Bobo take your silky soccer skills elsewhere.
-
Further to my last post RE: the squad. Just my thoughts.
I had provisionally put Bobo and John Kennedy in the centre of defence(from our current squad) but I think Bobo needs an experienced intelligent defencer to play alongside, somone to do the thinking whilst Bobo does the donkey work, he did well with Johan in defence. So if we can keep Bobo for this season, get JK back fit and healthy and an experienced CB, we can sell Bobo for a tidy profit next summer and have a good defence [JK and new defender] into the bargain.
Any thoughts?
-
Apologies meant to read Defender and not Defencer makes me sound like an American!!
-
What is it with these so called former celtic "legends" you know messers nicholas & mcleod. They wheel themselves out to chip in their tuppence worth, playing to the worse of the press inspired negativity brigade.
These guys are trading on what we made them and yet they have the cheek to stick the boot in at every given opportunity.
Compare these charlatans to the true legends of the club, the lions. These Gents see themselves as custodians of our club and while not being apologists they try to provide a measure that does not heap more torment on us, the fans.
I find it ironic that the more players have earned compared to their predecessors the more vocal they have become against those who provided those earnings.
They talk about loyalty, do me a favour, the modern player sees you and me as no more than a credit in the cash column, a down payment on a porsche. You want to see loyalty Mr footballer look up to the stands, not down at your pay cheque.
-
Couple of points
-I can't agree with the majority here. never mind loyalty blah blah, we should have made an effort to keep Jackie as a matter of simple football economics - i don't think we can replace him with a player of the same or better quality for less than we were paying him. plus whoever we bring in may cost a transfer fee and is not gauranteed to fit in, by that i mean sometimes it doesnt matter a players undoubted quality, sometimes due to tactics, personality, they just dont cut it. Jackie did. Those who are saying he wouldn't have been 1st choice next year, thats sour grapes lads, can you honestly say he wouldn't have played at least 30 games given that he can play left or right back, right mid, centre mid? I think its a terrible move, for him AND us, regardless of who's to blame. Am i the only one?
Baldego - jackie never claimed to be a super fan, in fact i believe he was a Hibee as a boy. you mention lennons pay cut, JM should have done the same, but lennon is 3 years older, half as mobile, and even with the pay cut was still being paid well over double.are you seriously suggesting JM should have took a 33% pay cut on 10k a week?! 6.6k pw?
btw alabama celt, good clip, looks very promising. i think if people aren't convinced about signing this guy, its lubo moravcik syndrome, i.e. 'cos we've not heard of him he must be pish'. the guy is first choice striker for one of the better footballing nations. top scorer now, what, 5 years running now? the only surprise is his club aren't asking a lot more.
bigtex - one sentence sums it all up: 'nobody is ocoming out of this with any credit', you're spot on.JM is chasing the bucks, the board are guilty of procrastination and misplaced priorities. MON not blameless either - apart from anything else, why are contract negotiations left until the last month of players contracts?i thought we learned from miller that contracts should always be sorted >1 year in advance.
-
p.s. - i've just been told that contrary to reports, lennons contract is not done and dusted, and he hasn't actually signed yet. anyone know whther this is true?
-
I'm not upset about any of the leavers we have had so far. They were either not good enough, too greedy or both. Don't really care either way.
What is bothering me though is this habit we have of not getting any money for any of our players when they leave. Surely they are worth something to someone! And if so, they should be getting sold on before their contracts expire and can leave for free. For the life of me I cannot comprehend why David Fandango is still on our books! What exactly does he do with his time???????????
I may have missed something, I know that Bobo could leave for free this summer due to the clause in his contract - but does this clause only refer to this summer though (i.e. could we sell him come January?) or is this clause valid for the entirety of his contract?
BB
-
I thought early this week he had signed but for the last 2 or 3 days it has been in the press that he hasn't.
Anyone got updates in what WGS is up to the the moment?
-
http://tinyurl.com/dtsty
"Celtic mix-up over McNamara
Celtic manager Gordon Strachan and chief executive Peter Lawwell were involved in an embarrassing mix-up over Jackie McNamara's move to Wolves."
What exactly is a mixup in the eyes of teamtalk? Another fine example of lazy journ.... reporting.
-
Paul,
Think you hit the nail on the head again. With 20/20 hindsight it is clear now that the uncertainty around the club in the last six months, both player contracts and MON’s situation affected the team on and off the park. Something of the togetherness that was a hallmark of MON’s team particularly in the Seville year was definitely lost and I don’t think it has anything to do with tired or old legs.
Nothing could be done about MON’s situation but the players contracts could have been resolved earlier, this seems though to have been a deliberate policy of the management. Probably as a result of MON’s previous mistakes in giving both Lambert and Petta longer and more lucrative contracts than was realistic or deserved. Petta’s playing for Darlington for goodness sake and it still irks me. Who can blame them?
JM was offered an increased contract from what I read, if he is now on £16K a week as has been suggested then he will be £200k better off in salary over the two years of his contract than had he stayed, who knows about signing on fees. He is going somewhere were there will be far less pressure on him, less football, no European adventure or lengthy cup runs and less responsibility in terms of the duties of a club captain. If I was a player I know where I would be staying, no question. I wonder if fear was the real reason for JM leaving, fear that he couldn’t cut it in the new team, fear that the new manager would not rely on him so much, fear that he could not lead the team to regain the title, maybe he had lost some respect (his new favourite word) in the dressing room, fear that he would spend the last year and a half of his contract doing a “Tom Boyd” playing with the kids and going to supporter’s functions. He might have made the right decision, he was always one of my favourite players but he had already peaked in my opinion, we got the best out of Jackie and I thank him for it.
Bald ego, I don’t agree with your assessment, those principles you mention may work in business but not a football club in relation to players. You cannot measure accurately the residual value of a player or his influence on the team and turn it into a formula that works for all. The comparison with Lennon is false, he was on more than double JM to begin with, and just because his salary goes down does not necessarily mean the same was true of JM. I think that he should have got more, which he did get offered. You need a manager with a fair mind and a good judge of character to sort this out not a formula.
Does anyone else feel strangely comforted by the lack of activity at Celtic, the “decisiveness” of Rangers and the lack of info on new signings? Somehow I think that it will all come together, don’t know why, I just believe! We’ll see. They do say no one likes change!
-
Paul,
I think I owe you an apology from yesterday.
I was not trying to say you personally offered Lennon £20k per week.However following the "Jackiegate" incident I would like to know where you stand on Lennon getting an extension.
Personally , I think his 5 yard passes back (never forward) to Balde & Varga to hoof up the park are one of the reasons why were so excruciatingly painful to watch last season. He should be allowed to leave before we have another Boyd/Lambert scenario unfurls.
However , I believe in offering him the reported amount at his advanced age and also not to mention his suspect lack of speed , we may have shown to much of our hand (to use your poker face analogy).
Do you concur ?
-
Paul
I stick by my original post.
Your hurdle of credibility on pronouncements from the board is set a lot lower IMHO than the average fan. This is not just my viewpoint others have expressed it here in the past.
I think that is reflected in the range of subjects generated by yourself and the "slant" you give them in your introduction. That is in itself no bad thing as it often generates a reasoned counterpoint.
However I think that today's blog went beyond what I think is acceptable, the comments on JM's state of mind were the last straw.
No similar viewpoint was offered on PL's performance on Tuesday where I think the consensus was "stop digging".
The die had been cast by the repeating of partial explanation of events put out by the club. No attempt at a critical comprehensive listing of what actually went on, just a series of statements cherry picked to make the club look good.
Hence all the questions, until they or similar are answered the club viewpoint looks a bit defensive. However that is all in the past and things move on. As mentioned before I hold no candle for JM, I just saw another example of the club acting the bully.
Kick the weak
Pander to the strong.
Have you seen the latest on Bobo ...
One aside, contrary to appearances, WGS into football was a loss for diplomacy. That is the plus from all this, however his job is not to save the board in the PR game.
With regards to the views of others, that is up to them. I call it as I see it and if I'm wrong then it is humble pie for me. Or it would be if I didn't now know what the ingredients were.
Consequently my opinions maybe subjective but hopefully they are reasoned and credible. What would this si |
