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first .........mmmmmmmm
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well done kenny miller
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Get in there my son!!
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Damn.
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morning
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C'mon the hoops! Aberdeen won't be a walk over by any stretch of the imagination. Miller will be wanting three goals in three games after his international performance.
BE SEEN IN GREEN!
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Another few of these European night results would be great, then one of these results on the 23rd would round it off!
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Is the game on Setanta anyone ?
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HUD
Yes its on Setanta 12.30 kick off
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calderwood will be gunning for us. time to kickstart the league campaign and get the away show on the road
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hud
yes 12.30
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It's pretty certain we'll see Gravesen and Lennon in the middle given Strachan's comments in the press this morning.
Where does that leave JJ?
The bench.
If we're winning, we may see a 4-5-1 purely to get comfortable with that set up. Otherwise, the team picks itself. For me that's JVOH and Magic up front.
Goals win games. Simple as.
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GAME ON SETANRA 12.30 SAT
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(As posted towards the end of the last thread.)
From an earlier post: "Are ira songs wrong? ...in the real world, according to the people in charge of the sport - yes they are wrong."
With all this repeated and considerable overdone discussion on "traditional" Celtic and Rangers songs, I think we are missing one key point, regardless of everything else...
They have nothing to do with football, and as such should not be sung in football grounds.
It doesn't matter two hoops (green & white or otherwise) if these songs or the sentiments expressed therein are felt to be justified historically or in the present, nor if those who choose to sing them feel that their human right to "free speech" is being denied. If they have nothing to do with football, and have no beneficial effect on a football club as a whole or the team on the pitch (which clearly they do not) then they are not welcome.
Those who sing them at football matches in contravention of the rules governing the sport, and in defiance of the club's appeals to desist, do so solely with the intention of provoking the supporters of the opposition. In so doing they are guilty of "behaviour likely to cause offence and/or incite civil disorder", and are thus breaking the law of the land.
So if you really feel so strongly about expressing the views and feelings inherent in the lyrics of these songs, and must attend Celtic games, then please comply with the laws of the game and the requests of our club and "keep it clean" at the match... then go sing your songs somewhere else afterwards.
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Huge anticipation for the Aberdeen game. Winning away from home is proving difficult for everyone at the moment. Time for Celtic to move up a gear.
Come on the Hoops.
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will boruc and mcmanus (the injured we know) be fit.
are there any other injury concerns.
roll out the big guns.
boruc
wilson
naylor
caldwell
mcmanus
gravesen
lennon
jirosik
mcgeady
JVofH
Zurawski
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I posted the following at the tail end of the last article
Right, hold on to your hats, here comes a rant. This club of ours may have got its act together in the transfer market but it still remains highly inept at issuing tickets for games. I became awar yesterday that a further allocation for Old Trafford was released yesterday....to Thomas Cook! Now, if you wanted a ticket (and also the option of one for a guest unbelievably) all you had to do was apply via the internet. You pay and you get a return bus trip from Glasgow together with a ticket. Brilliant. Now, what do those of us who don't stay in Glasgow and the surrounds do?!!! Well, in short, if you can't make it to Glasgow you can't go on the bus (fair enough) and you can't get a ticket. Why on earth is this the case?!! A club with a global support !! Give me strength. A club more concerned with lining the pockets of wannabe global companies more like.
Even the girl on the ticket phone desk had an air of "I know, its daft and you're not the first to complain". Is it too much to ask that we install a body with a brain in the ticket office? I've a tciket for the Stretford End so I 'm lucky. However, I'd much rather be wearing my colours in the Celtic section. It seems however that unless you're from Glasgow the club don't much fancy you being there.
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Further to my earlier comments on the change strips, and the comments agreeing that we should stick to the hoops whenever possible, why not have a change kit where we simply reverse the green and white hoops...
Straight from the heart indeed!
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bigchip.
on the last thread it goes
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PFAYR
Is SetanRA a Freudian slip revealing your deep-lying feelings on the songs debate?
And are you ex QMA?
BigchipsUK. Why re-post? Just curious.
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mmm...away -white and green hoops.
like yer style.
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Big decision for GS re team for saturday,if he plays TG and NL will he keep a place for Pearo (our best midfield performer this season)? If Pearo plays who goes Naka or Mcgeady/
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or win at aberdeen with this
marshall
telfer
naylor
caldwell
cuthbert
sno
thompson
nakamura
pearson
miller
riordan
and rest the big guns for man u
decisions, decisions
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I think Pearson in the centre has looked out of place, in the Hibs game he was posted missing, far better suited to the left side of midfield if he starts at all.
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Bigchipsuk
While I kind of agree with your sentiments the whole "not a football song" arguement holds no water.
You'll Never Walk Alone could be seen in the same light, it was a broadway show song, but it's the camaraderie (is that even a word?) that the song enthuses that makes it a good song to sing at football matches.
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Celtic_First, because I felt I had made a valid point which would be missed if left hanging on the tail of the last thread.
It seems that almost every time I post a comment Paul immediately puts out a new article, so I don't get the pleasure of people reading my comment then pummeling my opinion into the ground. Paranoid... me?
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davie hay ... deploy the howitzers and ensure victory, it's not as though we have a large cushion at top of the league
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frab
deploy the howitzers.......like it:o)
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PFAYR
You are kidding aren't you? I mean you're having us all on?
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the right rev. david hay (preaching pure football)
I wouldn't have Jarosik out wide, but three in the middle with McGeady in the hole could work.
Against ManUre though it could be dangerous as if their wingers pulled our midfielders out of position we'd be up whatsitcalled creek with no paddle.
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Bigchips
Paul said the other thread would remain open, and the debate is continuing there.
I made a mention of the songs debate on this thread too, but it was just as a wee joke to PFAYR.
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Paul,
agree totally. Focus must be placed on the Aberdeen game. The Man Utd agme is not one which we are expected to take points from - it will be a perfect opportunity to experiment with tte midfield and benchmark oursleves against a quality team.
The analysis of the Man Utd game will be important as it should help us identify the tactics, players and tempo we should deploy in future CL games.
I will enjoy us being the underdogs for this one, Man Utd have it all to do.
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You know ? i hadnt thought about dropping to 5th if we lose the game ! thats scary cause edwaed would come on and sing us that song!Seriously its a must win ! im sure Gordon will stick with the recaent line up ?? is there one ?
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bhoyfaethebul, don't worry. If we do drop to 5th then perhaps GS will get the "Manager of the month" award for September!
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Gordon is a one game at a time kinda guy isnt he ? Totally focuses on the next side he is up against. But hey we have gotta be too strong for them ! TG will take no prisoners !
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I don't mean to be harsh on Pearson, I just don't get why he seems to be held is high regard (and I mean really high regard) by a small section of the support.
Is it because he seems like the type that's living the dream, like a lad from the crowd who's suddenly managed to play for his heroes?
The thing that worries me about that is that he's just like someone from the stands, he's not good enough to bring Celtic forward. He lacks a lot to his game that is needed to perform at the top level. Touch, composure, technique and most of all football intelligence. He makes up for it slightly with his physical attributes and pace. But does Telfer make up for his inability to pass by being able to run for 90 minutes?
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Bigchipsuk LOL ! Malone 19 i know what you mean about pearson. i dont really see him in the starting line up more like super sub with the pace to hurt later in the game!
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alright lads,
i'm off to spain at the weekend, do any of you know any bars where i can see the games/ I'll be in san sebastian and bilbao.
I've checked celtic bars but just wanted to see if anyone has been there or posts from the region knows a good spot.
hail hail
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were saved.
ive found the new lubo.
just interviewed a guy from slovakia.
25 and lubo's spitting image.
hes heading down to CP for a wee tour right after the interview.
im givin him the job, in a sort of non handshake type of way.
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Tom the Tim said...
eyes glazing over rhetoric of the resident commissar, the Bold One.
You've made a couple of sniping remarks about me over the course of the last week. And on differing subjects. If you're not going to counterpoint my arguments or ignore them, at least try and be respectful. I extend that courtesy to you.
I don't force you to read my points, I don't ask you to like me. I don't care what you think of me, but please, at least be mature enough to refrain from catty personal comments. It lowers the tone.
/p
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Will we be wearing the hoops on Wednesday At Old Trafford?
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P8ddy
I know you are busy bolding all and sundry but wondered whether you might get round to me on the last thread.
; )
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Bigchips.... we'll the lgical extension of that is quite... impressivr isn't the word perhaps immense.... will all national anthems be banned as we'll as national flags??? ... will wearing football kits into grounds be banned... as it is in many public establishments.... perhps the big 2 should just call themselves glasgow 1 and glasgow 2 incase refering to celtic-ness annoys the anglican.... perhaps we should remove the shamrock... the celtic cross... i know why dont we appease the genius that is sep blatter and play it in the buff or better yet get the best lookin girls we can to do so that was his idea for womens football wasnt it....
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malone19...
I don't mean to be harsh on Pearson, I just don't get why he seems to be held is high regard (and I mean really high regard) by a small section of the support.
I guess there are any number of factions - I mean, my Mother has no time for Aiden McGeady (clearly I learned everything I know about football by not listening to her ever) :-) I think others see both him and Pearson as representing a new dawn of young home bred players. Pearson also has a lot of fire about him, which will endear him to a bunch of people. Over and above that, I've no idea. I'm a bit up and down on him, sometimes I think he has great potential, others that his penchant for thumbing his nose at authority will ultimately stop him progressing. I guess we'll see in the fullness of time.
The thing that worries me about that is that he's just like someone from the stands, he's not good enough to bring Celtic forward. He lacks a lot to his game that is needed to perform at the top level. Touch, composure, technique and most of all football intelligence. He makes up for it slightly with his physical attributes and pace. But does Telfer make up for his inability to pass by being able to run for 90 minutes?
I take your point, but I think he's better than Telfer! :-) This being said, I thought the same of Jackie Macnamra, decent enough player but not top drawer. If pearson was happy to be a cover player then I'd happilly keep him. He'd fall under the label of useful squad player in the circumstance. Something Celtic has lacked over the years - decent cover on the bench.
/p
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ExiledInAberdeenTim...
I know you are busy bolding all and sundry but wondered whether you might get round to me on the last thread.
I'll have a look now! It better be worthwhile! ;-D (only joking!)
/p
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Can anyone remind me on how Fergus managed to root out the ditties from our home games. I remember the letters being sent but did he mention specific songs?
IMHO BQ is posturing for UEFA just in case...he should really be taking a stronger stance on this by suggesting songs that are not wanted but I know he never will because he will get invoved in some of the pettiness that even happens on here
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If anybody is travelling up to Aberdeen this Saturday by car/bus there is major roadworks on Market St. beside the harbour which is the usual route through the town to Pittodrie. I can't find any info as to whether there will be an alternative route in place for fans, if I do I'll post it on CQN. Give yourselves extra time for the journey especially if you want a few beers before KO.
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P8ddy a.k.a James T kirk .... To boldly go where no man....... !
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ExiledInAberdeenTim...
You have a reply! ;-D
/p
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bhoyfaethebul...
Did you see Shatners response to the offer of a free space flight?
I'm interested in man's march into the unknown but to vomit in space is not my idea of a good time. Neither is a fiery crash with the vomit hovering over me.
"A fiery crash"...The guy is a star. A true comedy moment :-)
/p
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regarding us not singing songs about our history
as michael collins said 'our only weapon is our refusal'
hail hail
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JarosikPark...
Can anyone remind me on how Fergus managed to root out the ditties from our home games. I remember the letters being sent but did he mention specific songs?
Fergus had many failings, but making himself known wasn't one of them. After being taken to task by my father about "the songs letter" that went out Fergus was good enough to reply, to clarify and eventually to modify his position on what was and what wasn't acceptable. I might still have some of the correspondence, with Fergus lambasting my father for suggesting he cared more about PR than Celtic, outlining his thoughts and ultimately clarifying his position (which isn't, or wasn't at least) too far from mine (or ultimately my Fathers). Communication, dialog and humilty are great things - and Fergus was reasonable at them all.
/p
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p8ddy... simple qusetion... would you ban the soldiers song?
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anyone willing to swap a ticket for copenhagen away for my ticket for old trafford? no money changing hands, just a straight swap
obviously the tickets for copenghagen are not out yet so only investors know that they are guaranteed tickets so i would need proof that you will have access to these tickets and also a CQN background check before doin the swap! a long shot i suppose but its worth a try
note time is of the essence as i know plenty of people who would take it obviously, so its not up for grabs in any other way than a swap
im going to all the away games, tickets for lisbon shouldnt be a problem but copenhagen im not so sure about hence why im asking
cheers
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RE Pearson debate
I am a fan of the bhoy... his heart, his pace, his goals... i think with a little coaching and a run in the side (which i can't see him getting) he'd be a real asset.
We all know that modern football is about having a quality squad - i'd pit out midfield against any team in Britain
NAKA/JAROSIK/GRAVESON/MCGEADY/PEARSON/SNO/MALONEY/LENNON/RIORDAN
happy days
HAIL HAIL
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3-0 to the Hoops on Saturday (Miller, Jarosik and JVoH). Important to get the confidence up before next Wednesday. I expect the defence to be a bit more steady now with Naylor in situ.
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Belfast Bhoy...
p8ddy... simple qusetion... would you ban the soldiers song?
Certainly not! I'm in the "let the people sing", libertarian camp!
/p
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Belfast Bhoy, I think you are missing the point re: relevance to football. Wearing a team's football kit whilst attending a game involving that team at a football ground is clearly relevant.
However, singing a purely political song during a football match is as out of place as singing "Hail! Hail! the Celts are here..." in the House of Commons during Prime Minister's question time.
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Malone 19
Point taken about Pearo`s overall abilities but he`s playing well at the moment ,should you not play inform players?
Those advocating Jarosik for a start must be having a laugh , you have to earn the right to play for our team, he`s got to look interested for a start . Pearson`s a good SPL player , not a world beater ,at Pittodrie i`d rather have his drive and graft than so called pure football from others.
In one game Pearson turned last season around in the corresponding fixture this season the midfield was abject with Jarosik the worst.
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How do I post a picture on here?
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P8ddy
I would be interested in reading those letters if you can be bothered digging them out and you want to share them..
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is this the way to 'expand the brand'?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9WHu0Ymm30
discuss...?
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bigchips
these songs are part of the teams history without the happenings of which these songs tell our club would not have came into being
so yes i'll sing them in memory of my ancestors and to the history of my team
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How do today, Bhoyos?
Well, Scotland were good last night, were they not? Kenny Miller played a blinder. Not only did he work hard, but he scored a great goal too.
Kris Boyd, on the other hand, did not. I noticed some things about "The New Ally" that I thought I might share.
First, does he EVER run? Miller chased every ball this evening, and he won a number of fifty-fifties out of sheer determination and demon speed. You NEVER see Kris Boyd doing that. I hate to say it, me a student who could not run a hundred yards to catch Last Orders, but the man seems heart lazy to me.
Also, I'm not sure whether he was a guaranteed starter for Kilmarnock or not, but this is three managers now who don't fancy this player in a battle - all of them in some way connected with Rangers, so that rules out a Papist conspiracy.
McLeish knew that Boyd lacked the stuff for Europe and against Celtic. LeGuen is WELL AWARE of what Boyd lacks. Now Walter Smith has made it clear that he, too, has doubts about Boyd's contribution.
Kris Boyd is undoubtedly a decent penalty box player, but I stipulate that if you put a decent man-marker on the man and stop wingers and midfielders from getting the ball to his head that this boy will do no real damage in a match, because he never chases a ball, never drifts wide and never comes back outside the box to challenge for possession.
Not the mark of a player who will work hard for the team, a la Larsson or, dare I say it, Kenny Miller.
Kris Boyd also lacks pace, which is a little harder to spot because he has trouble breaking out of his sedate trot. But when he does, it is clear that a quick footed defence will swallow him whole.
If Celtic play the proper way against this young man, we have nothing to fear at all.
Okay then ............
Paul did his summation on the Rangers accounts the other day, and it's clear that they are in a world of trouble. Now, I don't want to get ahead of myself here, because as the above articles (well done to the guys who posted them) make clear, they have underestimated us many times in the past:
But Rangers are irrevocably boned.
Ha! Yes! Never thought I'd see the day!
Back in 2000, when Murray announced his shares issue moonbeams, when he was still funding the insane revolution of Dick Advocaat and before Martin O'Neill arrived in town to put a stop to the nonsense, we were so far behind them in every department that it was almost embarrassing. Or so we were told.
I said in my lengthy post of some days ago that Rangers blew a legit opportunity to put us out of sight, to go so far ahead of us that they might never be caught, but they made several mistakes which have proved fatal.
1st: They signed a truly wretched media deal, which has come back to haunt them. When we were offered the same deal we refused it, hung onto our media rights and have been making steady, but not spectacular, money since. The golden age when we can make serious money is not yet upon us, but we control our own destiny here.
2nd: They invested huge sums of money in players, not spotting, as Paul has said, that the bottom had fallen out of the market. It always gives me the chills when I think that the money they spent on Tore Andre Flo could have bought Hartson AND Sutton. It makes my blood run cold when I think that they could have thrown in Henrik and Lubo for what they paid him in wages.
It is worth noting, incidentally, that they were, in fact, COMPELLED to buy Flo for twelve million - Murray after all had made it his own personal benchmark "If Celtic spend a fiver I will spend a tenner" and we had, of course, paid six for big Chris. So, Murray's ego is directly responsible for the most ludicrous transfer deal in Scottish football history.
3rd: They failed to use the significant investment cash to pay down their debt, which in turn would have brought down their interest payments. Who knows how much money they squandered on bank interest - money that could have been invested in the team instead? A combination of Murray's ego and Advocaat's failed efforts to conquer Europe was put before the one thing that would have given Rangers a genuine edge = bringing down their debt.
4th: They also gave players massively overblown wages. Leeds Utd would pay a high price for doing the same thing - as the below story will illustrate.
Seth Johnson, a virtual unknown, who was linked with Rangers at one time, was sold to Leeds Utd for a hugely inflated fee - three and some million, if I recall. Not massive money for Leeds, but insane all the same.
His agent asked him, as they went for their meeting with Risdale, what he wanted in terms of wages.
"I'll take £12,000 per week," he said. His agent agreed that this was gettable and said that their opening position would have to be high - twenty thousand plus - but that they ran the risk of losing out on the deal altogether. Johnson agreed but said it was worth the risk, in view of how much Leeds were spending.
They get to Peter Risdale's office and walk in the door. Before they can even BEGIN their own negotiations, Risdale makes them his own OPENING OFFER.
£32,000 per week.
Nice work if you can get it.
Doubtless, in their attempts to bring in the big names, and due in no small part to Murray's reputation as the guy who "always gets his man" Rangers engaged in similarly suicidal practices.
Actually, they still do. Paul has never told us the story of Fan-Fan, not even now that the player is not wanted at Ibrox, but I have no doubt that rumours of Celtic’s interest in the player pushed Rangers to up their wage offer. A similar thing happened with Nacho Novo. (But we swooped in on Del Riordan under the radar!)
These practices destroyed the financial structure of Rangers, and this is why they are in such a bad state today.
Rangers earnings are not as high as ours, and the JJB deal will cut those earnings further. Future developments in the media and the improvements to our Far East marketing, which will come from increased interest in Nakamura due to the Champions League, will improve our position further.
Rangers appear to be targeting the Austrian audience, as well as that of Greater Manchester (but that is a temporary arrangement!), but it is difficult to predict how many strips they will sell in Dublin's JJB.
The article from Fascist Fascist, which is printed above, makes it clear that their fans believed, in 2000, that the gig was up, that they had stolen a march on us which would last forever more, and they predicted it would only take another couple of bad seasons before we would be in meltdown.
Consider the facts:
We had finished, the season before, some twenty plus points behind them in the league. Our one-season wonder attempt at outspending them had been a disaster which was predicted to have set us back years. King Henrik had just recovered from a broken leg, and we were being told not to expect too much. Viduka reputedly had personal problems; his girlfriend, who's previous life in Croatia involved having to queue up for hours to buy bread, apparently could not settle in Glasgow and wanted away. Viduka himself was itching to play in England, and on the field we were not just bad, we were BAD. The last Old Firm game had ended in a four-nil scudding and our media policy was being run from Bar 67.
Rangers had a renowned coach, a multi million pound team on the park, they had just won the league by a mile, there was significant investment coming in and they were about to build a youth academy. This should have given them a significant lead in all three key areas of importance vis-à-vis what Paul calls “football operations”: the first team squad, players emerging through the youth ranks and the ability to spend money where and when required. They also had a thoroughly good relationship with the press, a vital but often overlooked part of building success; your failures are not overblown, your successes are magnified. This helps build momentum and confidence in the fans, the players and, most vitally, in investors and those who wish to do business with the club. Clearly, this had been a key factor in enticing people like Hoe Lewis on board – who’s £40 million investment was a key aspect of Murray’s year 2000 moonbeams announcement.
Paul’s declaration that Rangers football operations budget will be in the region of a paltry £16.4 million, in comparison to our own £48 million, reveals that the gap which Celtic fans feared would emerge between the two clubs, and that Rangers fans fully expected to emerge, has in fact emerged.
But on the other side of the equation. Our lead is huge, and we have the potential to grow it still further as we make deeper inroads into the Asian markets and in the United States. Rangers potential for growth is severely limited because of the sale of their retail sector as well as their media deal, which handcuffs them to a strategy not of their own making.
Hugh Adam, the former Rangers director, and one of Murray’s harshest critics over time, has been speaking on Rangers growth potential for years. During an interview on January 11th 2004, he actually said that it might be profitable for Rangers to consider starting a sporting goods chain of their own, which would sell everything from their own gear to Celtic strips.
“You can get a kick-start through your own fans,” he said. “At its peak Rangers Pools had 650,000 entries each week – tens of thousands from Celtic fans. If you’ve got the right product you’ll sell it to anyone.”
Instead, of course, Rangers took the opposite path and sold this section of the business to a sportswear firm. Adam, who’s own reputation at Ibrox was built on the creation of the Rangers Pools scheme, fell out with Murray over what Adam saw as gross mismanagement, and resigned from the Rangers board.
In previous interviews, Adam has talked about how difficult it will be for Rangers to significantly improve their revenue stream. In an interview with Glen Gibbons in February of 2002, Adam destroyed the “myth” that Rangers have a “global appeal”.
It is worth considering his comments in full, as they are often only quoted in part. To do so would leave a lot out.
“Rangers’ so-called global appeal is a myth," he said. "When I was there, we did an exercise which involved asking 50,000 fans on the database to recommend a friend or a relative abroad. A big response was expected - some were even talking about getting 100,000 names - because everybody in Scotland seems to know somebody abroad. We got back 2,800 names and three-quarters of them didn’t know they had been nominated. It’s no surprise that Celtic are officially the best-supported football club in North America, with more official clubs than anybody else. The difference is the Irish connection. Many Irish people may support Manchester United, Liverpool or whoever, but they all - every one of them - have an affection for Celtic. And, of course, Celtic also have a great Scottish following. The difference is that, while the Irish all have an allegiance to Parkhead, there are millions of Scots who not only don’t support Rangers, but actively dislike them.”
He went on to say:
“Despite the claims of international appeal, Rangers are, essentially, a West of Scotland club. They talk of supporters’ buses leaving from all parts of Scotland, but if you look closely, you’ll see there aren’t many from each area and they are not all full. This doesn’t mean that even Celtic will earn fortunes from emigrant supporters. There may be more of them than Rangers fans, but it doesn’t mount to the kind of income necessary to fund their ambitions.”
The crucial difference is that we have invested significant time and money in trying to build the Celtic brand name abroad, time and money that Rangers were squandering chasing pipe-dreams. Hugh Adam long said we were the better run club.
So, with little prospect of Rangers raising their revenues by changing their marketing strategy, in part because it is no longer their own, can they raise cash in other ways?
Their recent share issue was labelled a victory for Murray. Closer scrutiny reveals that it was, actually, somewhat disastrous. Whilst the red-tops and the Murray lackies have been content to portray it as another example of his turning water into wine, his largesse in putting a further £50 million of his own money into the club hides the true facts of the case, facts which have been criminally under-reported by the hacks.
Rangers raised a total of £51.4 million from the rights issue. £50.2 million of that came from Murray himself, which reveals a startling lack of enthusiasm for investment in Rangers from elsewhere. Ordinary fans did not want to know. Big business did not want to know. The share issue was a failure. Even after this money was thrown down the Ibrox black hole, there is still little outside appetite for investment. The fact that Murray had to sell the jerseys to get the JJB money, instead of having them invest it, reveals how far they have fallen in only six years.
In contrast, the latest Celtic shares issue, like those before it, was oversubscribed and Dermott Desmond did not have to pay the full fifteen million that he had pledged to should the scheme fall short. Numerous significant players have money invested in Celtic and some of these, including Eddie Jordan, bought shares in this rights issue, despite it giving them no further overall stake in the running of the club.
The Scottish press, of course, would rather eat Republican liver with fava beans and a nice Chianti than give close scrutiny to this stuff. (Or succulent lamb and the finest red wine, if you prefer ………. )
There are three other ways for Rangers to raise revenue, two of which are highly unlikely. Firstly, they can succeed with their bid to develop the super-casino. This is unlikely because, aside from the other cities in the bidding and the near certainty that a deal has been done to take the casino project to one of those cities, there are four other sites in Glasgow, of which the Clydeside development is far and away the most likely to succeed. This whole area is in the process of serious redevelopment and it makes sense to base a project of this size in that area.
Secondly, they can sell their stadium and do a deal whereby they rent it back. This is plugging holes in the dam, incurring long term debt for short term gain. Although this is very true to type for Murray, it is improbable that such a thing could, or would, happen. I doubt that the Rangers fans would never accept such a deal, even if Celtic’s lead was significant and it was the only way they could rebuild a team to challenge us. It would be interesting to hear what Edward thinks of this, and what you all think, but I have grave doubts that it could be done.
Far more likely is the scheme that numerous people say has been considered, that of selling the stadium name. Again, this would be a short term cash injection, although it would incur very little overall risk.
This time next year, this will be Murray’s final throw of the dice.
Some have speculated that Murray is about to leave. They are concerned that there is a chance that he will sell to someone with similar grand ambitions to those he used to hold. This worries a number of people, but I think there is little there to concern us. I refer again to Hugh Adam, who spoke on this during his February 2004 interview.
“Somebody like Roman Abramovich is not going to be interested in Rangers or Celtic,” he said. “That kind of person doesn’t care who wins the Premierleague – they want a team which is successful in Europe.”
Successful in Europe, in case the Scottish press don’t get it yet, means WINNING SOMETHING, not “making history” by making the knockout phase.
On this note, I can end happy. There is as much chance of that as there is of Tony Blair and Gordon Brown releasing a joint cover version of “I’ve Got You Babe.”
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Ok ... big chips would you ban the SS?
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on the songs issue, i have sang them like most people, they're are a few that i enjoy, but these should be sung in the privacy of your own home or even supporters clubs not at celtic games
before anyone asks my dad and all his family are from donegal and i go back there every year
we should be rightly proud of our irish roots, i know i am. but they're is no connection to the IRA.
the question i always ask and have never had an answer is why are these songs sung at celtic games but not at landsdowne road for irish internationals?
is the answer that the irish society is more forward thinking, more civilised and more mature than the scottish one?
people who say they will sing these songs regardless mystify me, is it really worth tarnishing our clubs image?
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P8ddy
I was going to reply to you , but what's the point, you only take things out of context and home in on anything you consider to be a personal attack on you. Nice little tactic, comrade. reminds me of the shipyard shop stewards of the 60's.
As to your sensitivity and good manners. Don't make me laugh. Sutcliffe-Quinn = Saddam- Mc.Cann.
When will we ever forgive the Daily Record for that, I wonder.
You, my friend, will take much longer, as you SHOULD know better.
Damn, and I wasn't going to respond. Have a nice day.
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Bigchipsuk :
My personal preference has always been for the away strip to be a retro hommage to the great strips of yesteryear.
How cool the classic lime green ala love street? great tops of the 80s, 70s, 60s and so forth. There are loads of strips the fans would love to see reincarnated.
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PFAYR
I don't think he's playing well at the moment. He's doing ok but McGeady has been far and above our best player never mind midfielder.
Pearson as P8ddy has alluded to COULD be a decent squad player. He can change matched due to his pace and enthusiasm. However I just can't see him being a starting player for the club, not now or ever. Players such as Beattie I would also put in the squad or bench player category, however I can see the potential for him to become a starter. I just feel that what Pearson is good at is more to do with his physique and physical attributes rather than anything to do with mental/tactical skills or technichal ability. That worries me.
I can't ever see him controlling a game of football, at any level, not even in the reserves. We need that from our centre mids if we're to be successful. He can do a job coming on from 70-80th minute when we NEED to attack but apart from that I can't see him being more involved.
I suspect Strachan views him in a similar light. Not as a starting player in a 4-4-2.
P8ddy
I know a few people who don't like McGeady and I know why it is. The same people didn't like Maloney until last year either. McGeady's game will, or should, improve beyond recognistion as he reaches 22-23. His decision making will be better as will all his other talents. Hopefully he will be professional in his life and training as Maloney has.
As I've said, I can see that Pearson has his uses. I just don't get why he's hero worshiped while other more talented players (McGeady for example) take abuse. I mean the whole "Pear-o" chants? Is that just because we can't do it for Keane anymore?
I felt the same way about McNamara. Thought he was a decent steady player (a better player than Pearson) but not top class, although he did have 2 excellent seasons at his time at Celtic. He did offer the team a lot in a time that they needed it. I know you aren't the biggest fan of Wilson (or don't like him attacking as much as he does) but I'd take Mark Wilson over McNamara any day.
Saying that, why is Wilson not Scotland's number 1 right back?
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hello all
Well back in Scotland after a long time away. Can't wait to get to Celtic Park!!
I have got tickets for a few games already but it's been so long since I have been to the ground, can anyone offer any advice-other than getting there early.
A few comments- Petrov, Wallace and Varga going. How many players at CP now use Tony mcGill, or whatever that agents name is. Is this a move by Celtic to stop dealing with him?
Just been watching the reserves play St. Mirren-can't wait to see a few of their games too after all i've heard about them-thanks to all who update on the Bhoys coming through. Jim O'Brien looks good, as does Teddy Bjarnsson, and Scott Cuthbert..well, a lot of the young lads look good. Do the reserves and U-19's play in Airdrie?
Paul67- just wondering if you had sych a thing as CQN t-shirts?
Also, people have mentioned about the young lad with Morton. Does anybody think it would be a good idea for the Celtic web page to have a section on Bhoys on loan, and I guess also Bhoys on international duty. It helps us keep up-to-date with what is happening without struggling to find info.
Finally, can't believe it's sunny in Glasgow! Still freezing though.
Bangkok Bhoy
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Belfast bhoy, what do you mean by "the SS"?
Brinalackbhoy, you claim that "these songs are part of the teams history without the happenings of which these songs tell our club would not have came into being. so yes i'll sing them in memory of my ancestors and to the history of my team."
And if things don't change from the status quo, not only will bigotry and sectarianism continue to blight our society, but these same songs may well be the reason why our club ultimately ceases to be.
Smell_the_glove_etc, ("people who say they will sing these songs regardless mystify me, is it really worth tarnishing our clubs image?") these people don't give damn about anyone but themselves.
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In case anyone stuck with it and is confused by some things, the notes for my above post were taken last night; the majority of the text was written today.
That's why there are references to articles not on this forum - they are on the previous thread.
Anyone who has not read them should do so, especially the one from Follow Follow, which gives a clear indication as to how the Rangers fans viewed our position in 2000, just prior to O'Neill.
They really believed they were on top and staying there.
Thanks to the people who posted the articles. Very entertaining and very, very useful.
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thebhoydave - Love it.
CQN a bit heavy again...........
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In reply to your post, 3 points at Aberdeen are essential, a good performance at Old Trafford is all I expect.
My Team for Old Trafford would be 4-3-3. Back four hopefully with Balde, Stong midfield of Lennon, Gravesen and Caldwell, upfront Miller, McGeadie and JVOH. The plan would be for the two wide players McGeadie and Miller to be defensive and offensive, that is, try to play it tight and hit on the break, this is possibly Miller's best attribute, normally witnessed in a Scotland Jersey, notably against Italy last year.
Go on the Celts.
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thebhoydave
I hope we're getting our cut for that advert both for them using Nakamura (not sure what us having the media rights actually entails) and for them using the hoops.
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All respect Bigchips,
North men, South men, comrades all,
Soon there'll be no Celtic there at all......
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there's more...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cfYSVhHBGLg
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Tomorrow:
Miller or Zurawski?
Vote now!
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so...
do we think its okay to flog the hoops to sell cars/fruit juice if it means we can buy a player??
Raise money at any cost?
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Miller without a shdow of doubt for me.
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Er...for tomorrow read Saturday.
Wishful thinking.
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Thebhoydave,
i'm definately going to buy a Toyota now. don't know about the Japanese cola ,mind you. Could be bad for the teeth.
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Tom the Tim... (re: cola) and consequently better for your nails towards the end of a tight match!
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malone19
I`m in full agreement regarding the Wilson for Scotland position .
I think my obsevation re Pearo come as much from my admiration for his effort as his abilities as a player .
I think GS should play him TG NL and AMCG on Saturday, that gives you strength speed and skill . I think that we will be in for tough shift on Saturday ,Pearo`s the man for the job .
Also agree wholeheartedly re Boyd comments against a good tight defence he`s hopeless
¬
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malone19
I`m in full agreement regarding the Wilson for Scotland position .
I think my obsevation re Pearo come as much from my admiration for his effort as his abilities as a player .
I think GS should play him TG NL and AMCG on Saturday, that gives you strength speed and skill . I think that we will be in for tough shift on Saturday ,Pearo`s the man for the job .
Also agree wholeheartedly re Boyd comments against a good tight defence he`s hopeless
¬
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Bigchips, as I imagine you know, since I'd asked the same question of p8ddy bout 30 seconds earlier, ss = soldiers song
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James Forres. I think I am correcet in stating that you recently completed a thesis on media studies focusing on the redtops.I seem to recall you stating that it was like bathing in a fetid swamp.|You came to mind last Sunaday morning as I listened to a radio interview with David Edwards who has just had published a book he co-authored with David Cromwell.The book is entitled "Guardians of Power..the myth of the liberal elite and documents how such bodies like the the BBC,the Guardian and Observor newspapers ,etc, all have an agenda of manufacturing and disseminating lies disguised as fact in a manner that would put the redtops to shame. Naom Chomsky and John Pilger both gave it anexcellent review and I thought (hope I am not being presumptuous)it would probably be an item of interest to you.
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Bigchips,
"but these same songs may well be the reason why our club ultimately ceases to be."
Absolute nonsense. What people see as our current problem is absolutely minescule compared to most other football clubs problems. Countries like Spain have a racist problem in their football , england , greece , holland ,turkey have major problems.
The songs will stay until Brian Quinn states what is acceptable and what isnt. Until then its all down to perceptions of offensiveness.
Belfast bhoy,
If the soldiers song where to be banned this would be a racist , sectarian move by however sanctioned it.
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James Forrest,
you writing a book?
Another excellent article, thanks. What it highlighted for me is that all this talk of where Rangers were back in 2000 should serve as a warning to us about complacency. One sentence in particular jumped out of your article:
"Rangers had a renowned coach, a multi million pound team on the park, they had just won the league by a mile, there was significant investment coming in and they were about to build a youth academy."
A remarkably similar situation, in many ways, to our own right now. All this talk of a G.O.D makes me feel uneasy.
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Frogbhoy,
I tend to agree with you. Things can change very quickly in football, as Rangers have so gloriously proved. And G.O.D. seems like a concept more suited to Them than Us.
On the other hand, you could argue that the weaknesses in Rangers were already there in 2000, but were ignored by Murray's lackies, and covered up by his smoke and mirrors.
Our underlying situation is stronger than their's was in 2000, therefore hopefully we will not suffer their ignominious fate.
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thebhoydave
That is the whole point in having a brand. And Celtic are a brand.
As long as we get good money and are used with the right companies that's what we want PL to be doing.
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James F
Who would buy Ibrox and lease it back? Who would buy the naming rights? What big investor would want to touch Rangers?
When these questions crop up, I often call probe my own feelings about Rangers. I really dislike them, to a point that my wife believes is unhealthy and unbecoming.
I really like Edward Ursus and hope he posts on CQN for decades to come, but (apologies Edward) I can't help but feel that any right-thinking person arriving in Glasgow from any corner of the earth would naturally prefer Celtic.
After the UEFA investigation, and the threat of continued scrutiny, could any big company afford to be associated with Rangers?
I'm not claiming to have objectivity on my side in making this argument.
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PFAYR & James Forrest
Definetely - Boyd is simply Hartson minus the targetman abilities... which is not a good thing in my book!
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Tom the Tim said…
I was going to reply to you , but what's the point, you only take things out of context and home in on anything you consider to be a personal attack on you. Nice little tactic, comrade. reminds me of the shipyard shop stewards of the 60's.
Our of context? I bold screeds of text! How much must I bold to get stuff into context? Should I invent extra portions of posts? I'll need to if I want any more context. And I don't "home in" on personal comments. I make polite requests that people refrain from insult me personally. I take it as a given that we're a community, and regardless of opinions, we share a common interest and as such we treat each other with respect. I have a good relarionship with most posters on here - I disagree with a few, but that doesn't stand in the way accepting everyone ha a right to their opinion.
Personal comments are normally made for two reasons. One, as a debating tactic to distract from poor logic an Argumentum ad hominem, and two, simple rudeness. I see little point to either.
As to your sensitivity and good manners. Don't make me laugh. Sutcliffe-Quinn = Saddam- Mc.Cann.
And I take things out of context? The record cmpared the twos personalities and portrayed them as being similar. I did no such thing with Mr Quinn. If you want to crticise me, at least base your argument on logic, rather than some overwheling desire to justify your insults. The Statement went something like this -
Brian Quinn is doing what he thinks is right.
so did Peter Sutcliffe, it didn't make him right either
In no way shape or form is that comparing the two - it's highlighting flawed logic - that is, because someone thinks something is right it doesn't mean it is. The fallacy was Argumentum ad verecundiam (argument or appeal to authority) - ie Brian Quinn was doing what he was doing because of his role as Chairman. Peter Sucliffe thought he was carrying out Gods work - the conclusion? Just because someone thinks they are doing the right thing doesn't make it so, regardless of role or position. I in no way compared actions, personalities or characters. I simply used an example to illustrate a point, not to denigrate Brian Quinn.
I have on more than one occassion, pointed out my support for our Chairman.
When will we ever forgive the Daily Record for that, I wonder.
You, my friend, will take much longer, as you SHOULD know better.
We? Are you legion? ;-)
Moreover, the barbs started before my "Brian Quinn moment".
Damn, and I wasn't going to respond. Have a nice day.
I will, but more despite you than because of you.
/p
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Druiddude,
It's a good book that one. Though I doubt there is a more agenda-driven, biased, selective, and thoroughly dishonest journalist than John Pilger. He never lets the facts get in the way of one of his paranoid conspiracy theories.
In my humble opinion of course.
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A generation of dominance is the kind of stupid bullish statement i expect from that lot, not one of our own.
It won't happen, because the rangers fan isn't known for it's loyalty when it all goes pear shaped is it? Empty seats will soon see changes being made in the boradroom if things don't start to turn in their favour in the next couple of years.
Which i sincerely hope they don't see.
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Belfast Bhoy, actually I didn't know what you meant actually. I hadn't made the link unfortunately. And of course there is an alternative connotation of "the SS".
I have little or no knowledge of these songs or Irish political history, nor am I particularly interested in giving up what little time I have on this planet to study either. As far as I am concerned history is history, and we should be channelling our energy into building a better future, and in particular ceasing our wanton destruction of the planet.
The Islamic terrorists cite history as justification for their evil and inhuman acts, regardless of the fact that nobody who is alive today can do anything about what happened up to 1,000 years ago, nor be held in any way accountable! I feel that certain members of our species simply use subjects such as history, politics and religion to give them an excuse to practice their inherent evil, and satisfy their personal lust for power by bestowing harm and misery on others.
But in response to your question, no I would't ban any song about any historical context just for the sake of banning it, as I do believe in the right to free speech. But not free speech as practiced by Abu Hamza.
There is a place and a time for political opinions to be expressed (or songs sung), and a sports contest is neither the place nor the time. As owners of Celtic Park, the club is perfectly within it's rights to ask it's guests to behave in a way that it deems acceptable, and to refuse entry to, or eject from the premises, anyone who fails to comply.
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DruidDude:
I love Pilger and Chomsky. Pilger is definately the number one investigative journalist around, and he always tells unpalatable truths. He reminds me, actually, of David Yallop, who's book on the death of John Paul I, In God's Name, was a damning indictment of the Catholic Church's obsession with making money. He recently wrote an outstanding book on FIFA, the name of which escapes me.
I will check out that book, as it dovetails nicely with some things that are going on in the wider world relating to the War on Terror.
Thanks for that.
FrogBhoy:
The real difference here is in where we go from this position. Rangers squandered their own opportunity, mostly due to Murray's egomania. We have no such personality at Celtic.
Consequently, we should continue to strengthen.
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Just when the great song debate dies down - BANG up pops BQ with ANOTHER statement - how many does it take ??
The headlines on the text something about BQ and sectarian singing !! PLEASE PLEASE Mr Quinn for Gods sake stop playing into the hands of the of the laptop loyal - who must be absolutely wetting themselves with joy!
I like BQ. Now and again though he just seems to come out with statements that are not needed - who is he trying to impress - The bigots who were so quick to crucify his own goalkeeper ??
Where was the statement on this ??
Celtic football club should be making a statement regarding the human rights of one of its employees ..............and not ......once again ! decrying the best support on the planet...........THE GLASGOW CELTIC EUROPEAN AWAY SUPPORT!!!
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Druiddude said...
The book is entitled "Guardians of Power..the myth of the liberal elite and documents how such bodies like the the BBC,the Guardian and Observor newspapers ,etc, all have an agenda of manufacturing and disseminating lies disguised as fact in a manner that would put the redtops to shame. Naom Chomsky and John Pilger both gave it anexcellent review and I thought (hope I am not being presumptuous)it would probably be an item of interest to you.
Funny, Fidel Castro was saying the same thing in the 60's! ;-)
/p
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James Forrest, excellent work again, thanks for that.
Frogbhoy, Rangers went into tens on millions of pounds of debt to get their lead in season eanding 2000 (they lost £35m in 1999 alone).
The fact that people looked at the league table and not their profit and loss account before wondering what would happen next was a huge oversight.
Celtic’s current expenditure is sustainable. I could go further and say that Celtic could spend more and it would still be sustainable.
G.O.D. is not, in fact, an article of faith, but it is my genuine belief based on the structural limitations on Rangers income for the next decade.
I have said for years they are in financial trouble, and this summer has borne this out. I have reported here Rangers own statement for Continuing Operations for their last Uefa Cup season (ending 2004) as £34.4m, which is what they can budget for this season.
We will turnover £70m this season, more if we progress in Europe (Rangers can expect around £1m per round extra income if they progress from the Uefa Cup group stage).
Twelve months from now, when the clubs have issued financial statements as above, it will be a lot easier to see where domination is heading (and at which point I expect we will have won the league for the fifth time in seven years).
If my financial information is correct and Celtic turnover twice as much money as Rangers (and my information has not been challenged since posting, principally as I have taken it straight from the Rangers accounts), will you still be sceptical?
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Big Liam, "Absolute nonsense" you say?! If UEFA ban Celtic from their competitions while sectarianism continues to blight Scottish society (i.e. ad infinitum), then Celtic will eventually become just another Scottish team like Motherwell, St Mirren and Ayr Utd.
Do you honestly think that Celtic would have the same appeal to players like Henke, BBJ, Chris Sutton, JVoH, Tommy G, Naka, etc. if they didn't play in European competitions? And without the likes of these players do you really think that Celtic would win almost every game they play? And without winning almost all of their games do you think that they would win the league almost every other year? And without all that do you think they'd get 60,000 at every home match?
I think not.
And hence the whole Celtic phenomenon would disappear after having to scale down to being just another Scottish club... that's if the business actually managed to survived the downsizing process and didn't just go to the wall when the investors decided to cut their losses and jump ship...
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I would like to have a less negative attitude towards Rangers.
Can anyone help?
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CelticFirst ,
The normal logic in a property sale and leaseback situation is to make a profit and cashflow benefit up front and defer repayments over a long term lease .
Given the exorbitant value Snake Mountain has on the Rangers Balance Sheet :
a) No sane commercial organisation would pay the book price.
b) Any repayments to be made to allow the stadium owner to make an acceptable profit would be exorbitant . That is, the rent would cripple the darnel .
For these reasons I don't see it happening.
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bigchip.
i keep away from all the blurb on this and scroll on by because its all pap.
but what you say...
"The Islamic terrorists cite history as justification for their evil and inhuman acts, regardless of the fact that nobody who is alive today can do anything about what happened up to 1,000 years ago, nor be held in any way accountable! I feel that certain members of our species simply use subjects such as history, politics and religion to give them an excuse to practice their inherent evil, and satisfy their personal lust for power by bestowing harm and misery on others."
absolutely brilliant, sums it up my good man.
vinnie.
behind you 100,000,000% on this one. the board in generals silence was shameful.
so do we take the board do not back boruc?
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celticfirst.
sorry cant help, id make it worse.
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Druiddude:
The liberal elite are essentially spineless anyway, or sleeping with the enemy. It is the liberal elite which continues to push the lie that we have "liberated" Iraq from dictatorship, when we've actually sanctioned a gigantic armed robbery overseen by a US appointed government. (All the candidates for the elections were "screened" by the coalition beforehand.)
It is the liberal elite which continues to push the lie that New Labour won the 1997 election, that without Blair there would have been no end to Tory rule and the liberal elite which maintains that socialism is dead.
The liberal elite are the most dangerous political group in the land. They also oppose free speech - which brings me to p8ddy's argument on sectarian singing.
Everyone agrees that respect for other people and their views is the way forward, but no-one seems willing to practice what they preach.
Brian Quinn is entitled to have his say. But in doing so, and in ramming his message down the throats of the fans, he ignores the hypocrasy of trying to tell us what we can and cannot say and sing. In our so-called free society there is an implicit understanding that we must sometimes hear things we don't want to hear. Certainly, the Celtic support does not take kindly to being told what to sing and what not to sign, but we should not be compelled to stop any more than Brian Quinn should be compelled to shut up.
No-one has the right, either in law or otherwise, to go through life hearing only what they want to hear. There is no law which can be written, nor should there be, which protects our right not to be offended.
The right to state unpopular opinions or to exercise our freedom to protest or celebrate, to condemn or canonise people or groups, is the most basic right we have. The doo-gooders who want to remove that right because we might offend people are asking us to give up the most powerful weapon in our limited arsenal - the weapon of DISSENT.
Watch Michael Collins, and listen to him talk to the crowd. "If they shut me up, who'll take my place? Will they shut YOU up?"
Start putting obstacles in the way of what we can and cannot say and you will see all of our other rights vanish pretty fast, because we won't be able to complain.
Let the people sing, I say.
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ItaliaBhoy
If Pilger is such an incredible liar?
Why has he been proved wordperfect correct on the Iraq War.
Just a thought!
pggtips
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To all those who object to Brian Quinn's affront on your freedom:
Boycott Celtic's matches. Why should you throw your hard earned cash at such an inconsiderate and ungrateful organisation? Take your money somewhere else.
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BangkokBhoy
"Paul67- just wondering if you had sych a thing as CQN t-shirts?"
I can imagine the slogan:
CQN - THE SITE OF GOD*
*Generation of Dominance
£11.99 from all good retailers, and some rubbish ones too. We could even sell the 10 year income stream to JJB Sports.........
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bigchipsuk
Does Brian Quinn cover the full Celtic-following spectrum? We all must ex-chairman of the Bank of England then and millionaires to boot.
I sometimes wonder when people try to speak for the good of fans (and people generally), why their words are rammed down their throats.
It is important to remember we do live in a democracy even if Blair and Bush try their damndest to turn our lives into a parody of 1984.
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Paul67...
Frogbhoy, Rangers went into tens on millions of pounds of debt to get their lead in season eanding 2000 (they lost £35m in 1999 alone).
Around about that time, an acquintance of mine was at a meeting with DM on behalf of one of his investors in which Murray was told in no uncertain terms that if he entered into any more debt, then those investors would pull out. He did! They did!
He can't say he wasn't warned!
Another point on the people who keep ranting on about Brian Quinn coming out with that statement. You seem to be inferring that he did all of this off his own back. I'm sorry, but the way I understand it, he would only have been reflecting the views of the board. That's the thing about public companies.
I can't see BQ being an egomanical Chairman the way DM is.
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Paul67, James Forrest,
Don't misunderstand - I read and (mostly) understood all the arguments you put forward, and the financial implications are clear from what you say. Also, James's quotes from Hugh Adam are most illuminating, to say the least.
I sincerely hope you are proved to be 1000% correct. In fact, let me add a couple more zeros there - make that 1000000%.
My uneasiness doesn't stem from anything remotely logical. Simply the good old fashioned fear that when everythings going right, and things are all pointing the exactly the right direction, ten tons of elephant quango can still be hovering precariously over your head.
The net effect of thirty-odd years supporting the hoops. Don't try to blind me with logic. :-)
Thanks again for the excellent posts guys. Much appreciated.
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BangkokBhoy, sorry I missed your earlier question and only picked up TheLeftWinger’s response.
Yes, I do have excellent CQN tee shirts, with ‘Celtic Quick News, not lazy journalism’ in a 'typewriter key' font (green, on a white tee).
I have never got the sales side sorted, though Mrs67 does complain about this. I will speak to those nice chaps at Sixtee7, who might help.
Let me know if you are interested.
Frogbhoy, I know where you are coming from, we all went moonbeam gazing last month.
Miketw10, Zsa Zsa should have seen it coming.
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Bigchip,
As far as your concerned History is History...................You`ll not bother with the Celtic song then ?
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Have to pay a visit to London on Saturday and looking for a pub near Covent Garden that will show the game.
Anyone any suggestions?
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bigchip
'.........if you know THE HISTORY its enough .....'
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vinniethedog, yes, but my song goes: "And if you know your history, it's enough to commit mass murder of innocent bystanders".
I'm bored with all this now. You guys are entitled to your opinion, as I am to mine, so let's agree to differ.
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Thanks Paul..
I'll have a think, but on second thoughts, in scottish weather I might be better with a sweatshirt.
I will get back to you.
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Yes Stadium Credit! We're here to help you!
Buying and leasing back Ibrox is entirly feasible whether the net book or any other value is used. There is always a financial institution prepared to loan the dosh as long as the price is right, the interest is high and the opportunity to pursue you in the court is available.
No sane Board would entertain such an arrangement as it is too high risk. However, Ibrox is not controlled by a Board but by an individual.
If that individual becomes desperate enough he'll go for the deal. Not because he wants to but because it's either the only deal in town or the only way to keep the bailiffs off your back.
I think you can see by the plethora of APR 29.5% dealers out there that the smell of decay will bring them running when the time comes.
The best way to get your hands on someone's assets is still to loan them money they can't afford to pay back.
I think you'll find though that any such deal will not be to the benefit of either Murray or FTPFC no matter how it's spun at the time.
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pggtips,
This citation appeared in the OED (New Words Edition) in 1991:
"to pilger: (verb). 'to present information in a sensationalist manner to reach a foregone conclusion'"
Pilger, exhibiting the sense of self-deprication and humour so evident in those on the hard left, objected, and it was removed.
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miketw
your answers on the other thread where the songs debate should be raging
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Paul,
Your article has pinpointed the not so obvious....... proven by the fact that certain Reactionary Elementals, still have their blood red needles stuck in the groove of social change.
Anybody who mentions the name Noam Chomsky,or his works and thoughts.... in any manner, except an Excoriating one... has lost me, forever.
I guesss that puts me squarely in the camp of the Laissez Faire...which is A.O.K. by me!
The venerable and venerated,Adam S. and me are twin shadows.
And by the way, it has worked for me!
Try it....you'll like it!
Meanwhile, back to the Raison d'etre of this wonderful refuge.....
The coming conflict with Aberdeen... as you have so sagely highlighted..... IS A MATCH OF GREAT PORTENT!
The result shall be of Maximum Importance in the Celtic season.
Far,far more of a Keystone,in the Bridge that will lead Celtic to the Promised Land, than the upcoming Manchester game.
The Aberdeen match is not one,in which to indulge in any experimental defensive or attacking, formations.
The name of Mr. Pearson has been mentioned as a possible starter.....also Mr. Miller , who is riding a wave of popularity as per his recent Road-Runner Performance against Lithu.......MMMMMMMMMM!!
Both of these gentlemen, in MY OPINION....... have only proved ONE THING.......to Us, to Us!!
The Just Ain't Got It!!
As we preach in this House of Celtic Worship...........
"What have ye done fer me Lately?"
Until, both of these gentlemen, show us that they have the Right Stuff........ then, much to the surprise of their supporters, I suppose....... My opinion of their worth to the Celtic cause is a negative one!
Next time, both of those men grace the Celtic Jersey, I am more than willing to give them a fair and just hearing.
My mind is very open to the influence of any exhibition of Soccer skill...
I am very easily impressed by a skillful and successful performance,....
I guess I am a big Pushover, for soccer intelligence and all round ability.....I am funny that way!
My opinion of these stout fellows can and Will ...TURN ON A DIME!
Nevertheless..............
Those guys have to SHOW ME!!!!Simple, really......
Just SHOW ME!
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italiabhoy
if ridicule is what is used by right-wing commentators when the facts cannot be used as an argument then maybe those right-wing commentators should face up to the truth instead.
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thegodfather
There is an O'Neills close to Covent Garden where I have watched Celtic and Gaelic matches before, cant remember address though.
I emailed Setanta and they sent me a list of pubs and addresses who subscibed to Setanta, so they were easy to find and I could choose relevant to where I was.
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Addis Ababa
What will you say to your great grand-children when they ask why they can't get access to clean water?
A generational tyranny, a taxation without representation.
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Paul...
Zsa Zsa? Am I missing something? Don't get it?
Speaking of which, there's something else that I never ever 'got'. Can anyone enlighten me to the seasons when we won the league and our players had t-shirts on pronouncing 'Smell The Glove'. The other one was various different t-shirts with 'Milk', 'Coke' or various drinks I seem to remember.
Have I been living in London too long????
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Addis, Adam was over 230 years ahead of his time (there is a point in there).
‘Wealth’ is still beyond the vision of more than 100 countries today.
Never heard of the other guy, except on here.
TrueTim came up with an excellent assessment of the Manchester game, our least important game of the month (I am willing to reconsider this if the result merits such).
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pggtipps,
That's an easy one.
Nothing!
Why should I?
I wont even by ALIVE!
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Bigchip,
I know it does get boring - Thats why BQ was wrong in bringing it up AGAIN.
In all honesty there is not one song that the greatest support on the planet (Glasgow Celtic European away support) sing that glorifies the murder of innocent people - if you could tell me ........just one .......maybe it would help the debate.
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Mike, Zsa Zsa is my pet name for a particular club chairman who would unabashedly flash his wares in more affluent times.
The passing years have not been kind to Zsa Zsa.
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"Smell the gloves that cost you the league" was allegedly what Andy Goram shouted to the Celtic players as he threw his gloves into their dressing room after an OLd Firm game in 1997/98.
I can't remember what game it was, but Goram had puled off a string of saves again, denying Celtic victory.
The T-shirts were the "he who laughs last laughs longest" response of the Celtic players when they won the league.
Don't know about the others though...
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the godfather
Merseyside derby is on at the same time so you'll be struggling at bit.
Sports Cafe on Haymarket will show it, though I'd phone to check first. They do have a list of games they'll be showing so you will get a definite answer over the phone.
The Cock Tavern a Celtic pub in Euston will definitely be showing it, it's not too far from CG.
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addis
you maybe lucky enough to live that long...so you can witness Adam Smith's prophecy right here in the West of Scotland. I bet you're thrilled at the prospect.
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Miketw10
Have I been living in London too long????
I'm afraid so. It was "Milk, Lemonade, Chocolatw" on the t-shirts.
Reference to a purile joke from Chewing The Fat (at that point unavailable to viewers in Londinium). I'm told it was just an 'in-joke' within the dressing room rather than a direct reference or slight at our underpriveleged brethren on the soo'side
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addis abbaba
I am sure you must have meant Sandler and not Smith, otherwise the denizens of addis abbaba will be a tad unhappy
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vinnie,
I suspect you won't get a reply on that... well put by the way.
Hail hail
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bhoyfromdacountyhell
Don't know about seeing the game, good luck with that, but you're certain to have the time of your life food and drink wise.
I know San Sebastián better than Bilbao. Spend all your time in the old quarter near the harbour. You can't go wrong. Ask for txakoli (cha-ko-LEE) in a bar or two. Strong local white wine they serve in porcelain cups. Amazing, but potent.
Beti Jai is a particular recommendation for a restaurant, but there are loads to choose from. Txanguro (chan-GOO-ro) is a brilliant starter, crab meat baked in the shell.
Basques go for red or rosé wine at table. Anyone drinking white wine with their meal is a tourist.
I mention these things because you can't really get them elsewhere.
In Bilbao last year I had one of the meals of my life at Casa Víctor. There's a small square almost entirely made up of bars and restaurants. Walk round and you'll find Victor's place no problem.
Sorry not to be able to offer more help re football.
One final thing, don't talk about having gone to Spain for the weekend. It's the Basque Country or Euskadi.
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Paul...
Gotcha! I've got another great true story from that meeting I must relate sometime. Just a wee bit reticent though, because I don't want to give away the name of the Celtic-supporting personality who was there.
Italiabhoy...
Gotcha...
The other set of t-shirts was I think 2003-2004 under MoN. All of the players had championship-winning t-shirts on with various drinks on them. Milk, I think was on most of them.
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pggtips,
I take no pleasure in useless and pointless badinage.
If you are willing to waste your time,jousting with Windmills.... then, bully for you.
The cares of the world, shall always be....well....the cares of the world.
I just live my life as peaceful and happily as I can.
It works for me!
Politics?
Don't make me laugh!
Here is my lightning synopsis of that silly pastime.....
If I promise to Take the Money from A...... Give the money to B...... B will vote for me!....as there is ever an extreme plethora of B.....then my election is assured!
Goody, Goody, for me!!
Too,Too, Baddy for You!
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Italiabhoy
Did John Pilger lie about the Killing Fields of Cambodia? This man's reporting opened up my eyes and mind the world as a young teenager. His book Heroes is work of articulatejournalism and passion. Indeed at times he is polemical but dishonest...NEVER.
He is one of my heroes and if you are going to slander (or is it libel on a blog) people I think you should be willing to back it up with facts.
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addis
If a lot of B's think they will be A's in the near future ?
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Sorry to go off topic, but last week I posted the text of an email I sent to the Crown Office asking for their clarification on possible prosecution for expressions of religious observance, specifically making the sign of the cross, as follows:
Dear Sir Madam,
Following on from your very carefully worded statement on the caution issued to the footballer, Artur Boruc, I am still a little confused. Could you please clarify for me your position on the following hypothetical situation:
I am on board a plane sitting on the runway at Glasgow Airport, awaiting take-off. Also on board are a large group of Rangers supporters travelling to the away leg of a European tie.
A nervous flyer, I carry out my normal pre-flight prayer for the safety of myself and my fellow passengers.
The large group of Rangers fans observe me bless myself before and after my prayer and become very irate, threatening to attack me for blatantly provoking them with my religious gesture. Take-off has to be delayed in order for the airport security staff to come on-board and restore normality to the Rangers fans.
I was fully aware of the possible reaction of the Rangers fans, but my fear of flying overcame my fear of their reaction and I decided to bless myself anyway.
Under these hypothetical circumstances, would I be held culpable for inciting these fans to violence?
I await your reply.
That was sent to the Crown Office on 29th August.
I finally received a reply today (7th September), you will notice not signed with anyone's name at the Crown Office:
Dear Mr Hoop
Please be assured that we do not prosecute people for lawful religious observance as we have repeatedly tried to make clear.
Unfortunately, we cannot offer legal advice about speculative behaviour.
PS/COPFS
They freely acknowledge that they have not answered my question and their reply is a total cop-out. The key phrase is I feel, "lawful religious observance."
It would appear to paranoid old me that making the Sign of the Cross at Ibrox is possibly not "lawful religious observance."
If anyone feels that Boruc's caution is a dead subject, please let me know.
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Vote update:
Miller or Zurawski v. Aberdeen -
Miller 100% Zuawski 0%
excellent response so far!!!!!!!
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Theleftwinger...
Thanks for that. Cleared up now!
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frab,
You have the correct attitude.....
Ever let a smile be your Umbrella!....
Who said that?...
NAW! IT WIZNEY, CHAMBERLAIN!
Mr. Sandler is my kind of guy.... a Funny man...which is a totally different animal from a Man who is funny!
I approve of your selection.
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Addis
If you live in such a wonderful world of splendid isolation, why do you feel the need to follow a social phenomenon such as Celtic where the collective good is so wonderfully cherished?
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Addis
If you live in such a wonderful world of splendid isolation why do you feel the need to follow and support a social phenomenon as Celtic where the collective joy of many is so wonderfully cherished?
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Newarthillbhoy,
Pilger is a polemicist yes, but an objective, rational observer... no, not for some time now I am afraid.
http://www.honestreporting.com/articles/critiques/Pilger_Pilfers_the_Truth.asp
http://oliverkamm.typepad.com/blog/2003/09/pilger_truth_an.html
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Paul,
Get yer point and to a certain extent agree -
Aderdeen - Three points we require
Man United - Any points we desire
Yet me thinks in the grand scheme of things MU@OT will be a defining moment for WGS's reign - IF I'm correct I'll remind you in December!
Addis,
You surprise me thought you were 'the state is supported by the labour of the ploretariat' type.....
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Frankiebhoy,
I see that there are no flies on you,my friend.
You got it, babe...You got it!
Many,many years ago, when I was a callow(?????) youth....
I had a discussion with a RED CLYDER,
went something like this:
Me:"Supposin' then you won big in Littlewoods....would your politics change?
He:"Politics, wid no change a bit... but the wey Ah looked at things, Sure Wid!"
Deep,deep stuff....eh? What?
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The Godfather...
You could always try the Hoops Bar in the Oval. It's just across the river on the south side and within spitting distance of the cricket ground. It's also the official CSC for London I'm told.
They'll definitely have it on there. Directions are included in that link.
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Addis
Was it Monsieur Le (pen)Guen.?.umbrella ,top hat and tails,monocle
..sounds like your kind of guy
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Newarthillbhoy,
MMMMMMMMMM!!!!!
Could you please, apprise me of which path, in the tangled web of your logic....that I should follow... in order to understand your question?...
Your enquiry is a masterful example of.....
"Whit the Hades has wan thing goat anythin' tae dae with the other???"
No, my friend...
It is up to YOU, to furnish the answer to my question!
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Celtic first,
thanks for the reply. i've been told it's great and there won't be a mention of espania while i'm there.
Your post has now been printed, i waas also told to try the cider over there. I hate fish so i won't be trying your crab thing!
i've got a feeling i won't be getting to see the aberdeen game so i may be visiting the internet cafe for some cqn updates
hail hail and thanks again for the tips
mike tw, reply's on the other thread matey
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miketw10
Someone posted on here last month ,that The Hoops bar at the Oval had closed down.
Can anyone confirm this?
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Druiddude,
Fair conjecture....but a wrongo one.
But I must aver that your description, conjures up the image of one o' my wee grand-daughter's favourite make believe companions....
Mr.PEANUT!
And a very worthy choice, if I may or not say so!
You have stumbled, unintentionally, I am sure, on a very apt cognomen for the Gaul.
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ItaliaBhoy
erm Iraq.
Cast your mind back to 1991. Were the Ameri/British alliance so desparate to cut down civilian casualties. 250,000 Iraqi soldiers and countless civilians killed in what is now called a "turkey shoot". Aircraft Bombers were reported flying in as low as 100 feet simply to kill people.
The deaths of more than 500,000 children is a price worth paying according to the US/UK.
There is only one reason why the Americans & the British wish to cut down on civilian casualties.
The Internet.
Ever since the first "Net War" in 1994, the Americans have known, news that would never have seen the light of day for 10 years appears within days on some hitherto unknown website which through word of mouth begins to appear in the mainstream media.
Have you ever thought of the reason why the American administration wants a Two-Tier Internet?
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Addis
Is there some story about paying Peanuts and getting monkeys?
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Not so long ago the policywonks in 10 Downing St would have been looking forward to a'Generation of Domination',just as the Tories would have done when Labour was being led by Michael Foot.
And yet,look how things have a tendency to turn out...
meanwhile back at boring old Association Football-the shiny green change strip of the mid80s[think of the shade of those chocolate lime sweets]was worn at 2 of my favourite games;the Miracle at Love St,and the victory over Sporting,who wore the hoops with black shorts that night.
With regard to events in Manchester next week-has El Gordo ever beaten the Govanator as a manager?Not a small consideration,when comparing the strengths of the teams.
As for Saturday's game,I think we'll start with JVH and Majic.
However,against Dunfermline I see no reason why we can't play all 3.
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Addis
"The cares of the world, shall always be....well....the cares of the world.
I just live my life as peaceful and happily as I can."
Can one live a peaceful and happy life by blindly ignoring what is happening around them? Such would be splendid isolation indeed! Lonely as well!
No individual is an island....
Does your support for Celtic show a need for a more collective approach to happiness? Thereby your happiness is connected to the happiness of others.
I extrapolate this onto the wider human condition.
My true happiness is connected to the happiness of others and thereby their removal from slavery, poverty, fear of violence etc. "the cares of the world" you seem so unaffected by!
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Chairbhoy,
I suppose because of my well known soft- heartedness and willing to give everybody another chance,time after time, after time,after time..........
Yes, I can see why you mistook me for a member of the Bleeding Hearts Brigade.
So, I can forgive your error in judging my blase outlook , regarding the sleazy world of Political MANIPULATION....and its well known MANIPULATIVE MANIPULATIONS!
The Politics of Greed......The Politics of ENVY..... that last one is a beauty!
Oh! I suppose, I am different...as I can clear as day...spot every little nuance of manipulation.....in every speech that a Politician makes.....
Strangely, most of the listeners to the nonsense that we are subjected to, whenever a politician or a POLITICAL OBSERVATIONAL WRITER makes, are completely convinced that they have just heard something profound and revealing......
Listen, my friends...
"There just ain't no FREE LUNCH!"
Someone ALWAYS PAYS THE TAB!
And.... Guess who??
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Addis Abbaba,
there you go again.
Decrying the talk of political on the site,while putting the boot into Chomsky.
As I remember an "Apparatchick" and one who has "never had a good thing to say about Americans or America"
You (and your cohorts) have already made your political leanings more than clear to the rest of us.
Even in riddles and funny writing,it is plain to see that you operate somewhere to the right of your revered Mrs Thatcher.
I would suggest you read what posters have to say,rather than dismissing them for using a quote from someone you obviously regard as some sort of "dissident"
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Newarthillbhoy,
You can keep putting them up... and I can keep knockin' em down.
This is getting both of us nowhere....
My statement.....
I am a fan of the Glasgow Celtic....
No more, no less......the same as you and all of the others, who are dedicated to the success of our team.
Simple.... really?
Really.
My advice to you...is ... look out for nosebleeds,my friend....
You are so high and mighty in your outlook.
Good luck to you.
I do not aspire to such heights of moral standards......
Ah just mosey along, doin' the best that ah can.
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Dontbrattback 6:20, 1979 – 1997 sure felt like a generation in Lanarkshire.
I am also pretty sure the young boy Cameron will not get near power next time.
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Pggtips
The remark regarding the 500,000 children was made by Madeleine Albright(surely some mistake) former Us Secretary of State.To be fair to our American friends they seem to have learned the lesson of the Vietnam war where reporting like that of Seymour Hersh on Mai Lai led to collapse of support for the war at home.To ensure that such a tragedy never happens again they now have embedded journalists so that even even if it does happen we will not know about it...if a child is shot in Palestine and nobody hears it cry can we say it ever happened sort of thing
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Druiddude,
I must congratulate you on your display of mental alacrity....
you goat it, pal..... you darnwell, goat it!
If you agree with the phrase ......
"If the Shoe fits?"
Why not a wee bit....Razledazzle .....to that old saw.... then.....to upgrade ......
"If the Top Hat and Monacle and Tails, fit?"
And the capper.......
Speakin' O' Peanuts?""
Whadya expect?......
The Appellative....Mr. Peanuts...
Is perfect, for the Jauntin' Desert Rat.
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Italiabhoy
I will access and read the links provided at an earliest opportunity.
I would suggest though that John Pilger has many enemies who would want to discredit him. I shall review these objectively but with the knowledge that just because some says it is so doesn't make it so.
Addis
My morals are not that lofty. I jsut do not belive that humans can be so indifferent to the suffering and plight of other human beings. At least to be moved by them.
Anyway we are individuals motivated by different things. I shall leave it at that!
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Paul67-DCameron might win by default ie the Tory vote holds up,and the Labour vote melts away through people abstaining.
Did you see the Facchetti obit in yesterday's Telegraph?Excellent stuff.He played for the nerazzurri,his only club,for 18 years.634 games,75 goals which is a record for an Italian defender.
He was converted to fullback from centre forward-just like Hoopslegend Didier Agathe!
In today's DT Mihir Bose expands on the WHU acquisition of the 2 Argentinians.The deal was brokered by superagent Pini Zivari,who got £5m for his efforts-the Corinthians club in Brazil got nowt.
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My first post, hopefully a helpful one.
There was a guy on here the other day looking for a venue to watch Celtic Games in Las Vegas. Try this place:
The Crown & Anchor Pub
1350 East Tropicana Avenue
Las Vegas
Nevada
(702) 739 8676
Short Taxi ride off the strip & worth the $10 door fee they charge. Hope that helps.
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Kano,
I am glad that you are wise to where we are coming from.
We are on the side of the Angels...
The Posters that you are supporting in their umbrage to my opposing views....and I can almost bet the farm on this...
Don't Even Believe in ANGELS!...
Ask 'em, if you doubt my word!
Now I ask you, my friend...
Would you not rather not be on the side of the Angels?
We would........and We ARE!
And it has worked out...
VERY,VERY WELL, for Us!
So.....
All in favor o' the Angels...
Let's hear ye!
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Newarthill,
It was George Orwell who said "Just because it appears in the Daily Telegraph doesn't make it wrong".
That is my problem with Pilger- he can never allow that one of his enemies (capitalism, USA, Israel, UK etc), might actually be capable of getting things right or doing good.
Fine in a polemicist, not so fine in a journalist.
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Addis
Are Hells Angels included?
Sonnybargercsc
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Newarthillbhoy,
I have enjoyed our little bout of
Persiflage.....( I have been dying for a chance to use that little woid!.....(Fargo.... june12..2005...At the Gold Coast.)
Now please do not take, the advice which I am about to hand you, like a brother.....(Sounds familiar?MMMMM?)
Like most of my offerings.... this was said by another....
"If a Young Man is not a LIBERAL in his Youth, then he has NO HEART!
If a Man in his Maturity, is not a CAPITALIST, then he has NO BRAINS!"
I repeat... the above is not aimed at you .or indeed..... anyone else in particular....
I just submit it ...
For Food for thought!
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Italiabhoy
Well I've accessed the honest reporting link and I have had my Road to Damascus conversion...NOT!
Your evidence is absed on a website campaign that is so pro-Israel, pro-Zionist it would be hard to claim these to be objective champions to truth! I think my first thoughts were accurate.
When Pilger critises the site he mentions an e-mail campaign to discredit his film. They retort that most of these e-mails came from America where the film was not screened. I think the phrase "exactly the point" comes to mind.
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Italiabhoy
That is complete rubbish!!!
Read "The Boys of Beallsville" from Heroes to find his views of America.
p.s. Read Heroes cover to cover. You may even read that Pilger has the decency to write he himself was an "embedded" journalist of the US Navy during the Vietnam War where a horrible thing happens and Pilger knows he can do nothing except be a passive observer...
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Addis
I prefer Hells Angels...the devil has all the best tunes!
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addis
its a nice quote, but as has been said on numerous occasions, "not everyone in the world can sell biscuits to each other."
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Addis
I have heard the below many times before. (Although in Scotland we change the liberal bit to socialist) and have used it myself. Neither of us are originals in that respect.
Like most of my offerings.... this was said by another....
"If a Young Man is not a LIBERAL in his Youth, then he has NO HEART!
If a Man in his Maturity, is not a CAPITALIST, then he has NO BRAINS!"
I also think the word is brain...or are you the man with TWO BRAINS"? Are you Dr Huffnnnhurrr?
Also "Scatch a liberal and a facist bleeds" copyright Joe Orton!
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Newarthillbhoy
You must be the other person from the village who passed their English
Are you ex Taylor High
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PFAYR
Dragged up in Paisley! Alas!
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Anyone know a place in Alcudia to watch the Celtic games?
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pggtips,
From your riposte, to my plagiarized quotation.......
Tells me... that you do not have the slightest idea, of what the definition of a capitalist is.
Self Interest, my lad....
Self Interest..... it is what makes the world go round.
Liberalism always clashes with it.
But that does not prevent the Liberal Faction of the Political spectrum, to studiously, BUT PRIVATELY! practise that obscenity ( to them! to them!)
But on further investigation....all of the Prominent Liberals that I know.... Practice the art of Self- Interest to a marked degree.....
Mr. Clinton....... $100,000 a pop...for the privilege of hearing his pontifications on the latest political happenings.........
Pilger........... One of the highest paid Journalists....no question....his politicizing of the on going military conflicts, have been a fertile field for his cud chewing rhetoric.
Remember my friends.....
Who drove the big limos and lived in the Country Houses and enjoyed the good life......during the inter-regnum....in the Soviet Union?
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Nerarthillbhoy
I have heard the saying attributed to Churchill in the format "If a man is not a Liberal in his youth he has no heart and not A Conservative in his old age he has no brain".Of course Winston was a member of the Liberal Party in his political youth and a member of the Conservative Party in his old age.What a coincidence!
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Dontbrattback, I expect the labour vote will recover from last time, when they won, despite the cloud of an unpopular war.
I did not read the Telegraph obit on Facchetti, a great man for club and country for sure.
Welcome David Mitchell.
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While reading the John Pilger stuff - a little thought crossed my mind.......who would you believe first............John Pilger or George Bush ?? ......you could extend it.........a Zionist politician or somebody representing Hamas ?...... from a few years ago....a USA backed contra or a sandinista ? An ANC spokesman or somebody from the then ruling Afrikans
Does capitilism work ? certainly the wealthy would say undoubtedly -the poor and disadvantaged maybe not so sure - ask the people of New Orleans or any in the massive ghettoes in the good old USA - whats it like to live in the greatest country in the world - where you are basically brainwashed at a very early age about the magnificance of the country.
If you happen to question the ideals - then you must be some sort of leftie - commie - red deviant !!
Mr Pilger would - I think agree not every single thing that Britain USA and Israel has been involved in is wrong - but history shows us they get it wrong an awful lot of the time (sadly).
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Thank goodness there's a game coming up. This has been a strange few days on CQN.
Anyone know if Artur has played for Poland this week?
EDB
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Looking for two seats on a Supporters bus travelling to Old Trafford.
Preferably from the south side.
mail me at noel90@hotmail.co.uk
Have a wee skwatch at this while you think about it.......
Rangers fan on the X factor
by SeanM Walsh .
noel.
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Noel
Speachless!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
EDB
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El Diego-
I don't think he made it to London....
noel.
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EDB
Artur didn't play.He was back to Glasgow on Tuersday. Any more questions?
I'll be back in one hour.
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Ive just heard about the old Trafford tickets disgrace. So much for the supporters being the most important thing to Celtic FC PLC. Aye, if your one of the priveleged few to have the posh season tickets. Also, why were Thomas Cook given the remaining tickets? Why didnt EVERY season ticket holder get invited to register for the tickets and then do a fair ballot? So what we have instead is the corporate's taking their corporate guests in order to keep them signing their corporate contracts.
Absolutely disgusting.
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addis
I know. :-) That is why I asked ItaliaBhoy to check Pilger as embedded journo of the US Navy during Vietnam.
He is as complicit as GWB or you or I. Besides my view is none of us have self-control or free will, only some of us are only good for predicting what we are going to do next. I am no leftie, I just observe what we are doing from a distant gaze and chortle at how we can get it all so wrong.
Self interest or not, it can't be in GWB's or TB's interest for their kids to be exposed to coke or heroin in their teens. Sure they'll get the best counselling but it says little for their parents' affection.
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There's a programme on Radio 4 at the moment about people of Pakistani origin living in England supporting Pakistan against England at cricket.
They interviewed this guy who said: "No one bats an eyelid at Cockneys like Andy Townsend and Pat Bonner playing for Ireland."
You couldn't make it up.
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Addis,
Thank God Brother Walfrid did`t have too much SELF INTEREST !!
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celtic_first
To be fair, I think that was just bad luck, pretty much every player from the 80s side was English.
But yes, a little research would have helped.
