-
third
-
no, 1st
-
it's cause I'm an hour ahead!!
-
I posted this at the ned of the last thread and then found out a new one was up and running
Miketw10 :- I wouldn't disagree with you though I think if you had drawn any other pot four team the two groups would be much the same. Drawing Shaktar was a bit like drawing Moscow they were teams in false positions and a lot stronger than their seeding would suggest.
-
From the previous article:
Thejd 1andonly, totally agree. A point against Milan would be a good result.
Stebhoy, I regard myself as optimistic, but like you also claim to be objective. I was the one to quantify our away defensive ‘record’, but this does not mean we are making no progress, or the team is not more attractive to watch, or that we will not win the league.
The outcome of each I am sure will be positive.
For good measure, I think we will beat Shakhtar at CP and maybe take a point in Lisbon this time around.
-
Hi paul,
Sorry to bother you but I was wondering if you have a link to the BDO report?
-
Paul, I definitely think a case should be made for 'horses for courses'
We have a big enough squad, and varied talents within it, so should be able to chop and change to whatever situation may present itself.
This might of course fly in the face of Gordon's 'whoever is playing best, keeps the jersey' ethos. It's a fine balancing act!
-
Hi Paul,
Any thoughts on why the team turned up on the pitch looking so frightened ? I think this lack of confidence surprised me more than the ability of the Ukranians. We looked petrified from the off.
Wavy
-
"Sorry to bother you" ?????
What the.......!
I think you've read the schoolteacher part too literally Ed!!!
~~
00
<>
\/
-
Of the 16 CL ties this week, only 2 were away wins. Even Inter couldn't manage it.
It is going to be very difficult to pick up 3 points on the road in this CL, and I am not just talking about Celtic.
Hail Hail
-
Edward...
Yes, that's exactly what I was getting at!
It gets quite frustrating every single season we have to do it the hard way, and very rarely get any breaks.
But no, what happens at the beginning of this season?
Don't give us Spartak Moscow! Don't give us Spartak Moscow!
What happens? We get Spartak flipping Moscow!!
What happens when we manage to scale that particular mountain? We draw the current holders, a team we struggled against last year and as you say, a team who are much better than their Pot 4 status!!
Am I turning into a mineshafter?
Not on your nelly!
We don't care if we win, lose or draw...
-
miketw10, "This might of course fly in the face of Gordon's 'whoever is playing best, keeps the jersey' ethos. It's a fine balancing act!"
Does such an ethos exist? Surely then he wouldn't have dropped McGeady, who was praised by the manager as well as getting Man of the Match on Saturday?
-
The little of ESno I've seennthis season suggests he's barely able to keep up with the SPL,never mind the real football.And playing JJ,with his CL experience and'local knowledge'would have been an idea but it seems I'm more likely to get a game than JJ these days;making that tactical innovation a non-starter.
What mtw10 calls El Gordo's ethos might be construed by some as a lack of tactical awareness/flexibility/mule-like stubbornness.
-
Hmm, true!
But then again, Paul Hartley had a blinder against France.
I think you must agree though, that he does tend to stick with whoever's playing best and turning it on in training. That's what the concensus of opinion is anyway!!!
-
I don't want to stray too much onto Celtic1sts area of expertise but today is the anniversary of the Great Schism of 1378 in the Church,when you had a Pope in Avignon[mineshafter]and another in Rome[happyclapper]
As far as I can see Carlisle did not have it's own Pope,but Scotland,Naples,Savoy,Burgundy,Cyprus,Aragon,Castile,Leon and France signed up for Avignon;but Denmark,Norway,England,Sweden,Flanders,Ireland,northern Italy,Hungary,the Holy Roman Empire,Poland and Sweden signed up for Rome.
-
DBBIA
...And construed by others as sending a message out to those without the jerseys "If you don't try harder, you ain't getting a game!"
Like I said... A fine balancing act!
-
BlantyreKev :- On re-reading it it does sound a bit stilted and formal but I'm sure Paul wont mind :-)
-
Paul67,
I seen your reply on the last thread saying something about the Foreign Office,
was that you dropping a hint about our next chairman???? :-)
-
A gem from Youtube, dont know if it has already been posted?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRRe27_kjvU
-
DBB
Today is also Henrik Larsson's 36th birthday.
-
Prophetofdoom
deepest sympathies on the death of your friend .In mourning I hope you can draw strength from his sense of fun..i`m sure it is what Graham would wish.
Ewdward
Congratulations on the demomstration of how to tiptoe through a minefield.As for last night you are forgiven(provided you have true contrition ,a pupose of amendent and a desire not to reoffend).
-
DruidDude :- Damn, I'm afraid the conditions at the end ruin it as I can't meet three of them, especially the last :-)
-
Paul67
Maybe it was just that Naka was well below his best on Tuesday. Not many of us would have suggested dropping him prior to the game.
In Moscow he was good, kept the ball well and took some pressure of our defence. On Tuesday night though he was worse than a man short. Passes went astay and put pressure back on the defence to readily.
Individual players nee to look at themselves and be honest and admit that they didn't produce. Naka and ScottBrown I feel have the most to feel disappointed about themselves.
In hindsight I would have played Aiden on the right and kept Naka on the bench. JJ would have been too big a gamble, with exactly no first team match appearances so far.
But as I said we are hurting but are not mortally wounded.
The home support is going to have to be at its most effective.
-
Paul Shun
I have to disagree
the team should be built around Naka
If we have hopes of actually winning away from home in the CL
we need Naka in the side
granted he can go missing but 9 times out out 10, he will produce something magic, which makes him the type of player we need and also need to keep on
-
Is it safe tae come oot yit ?
Easter Road is not my preferred venue after such a defeat.
See Arsenal got the OG we were looking for. The Gunners remain unbeaten this season.
Two pennos in two games for Darnel The Magnifico.
WatchinGemmell
-
My home PC is Lee Naylored by the way. I think I'll need to perform some sort of cyber-exorcism this evening.
-
Sellik First -
cat got yir eloquent tongue ?
WishymoGgy
-
Back tae
WorkGemmell
-
WG
an ex workmate SC Stevie Clarke told me your the man to get me a Job up there in Scotland.
-
Many happy returns,Henrik.
True heroism is remarkably sober, very undramatic. It is not the urge to surpass all others at whatever cost, but the urge to serve others, at whatever cost.
Arthur Ashe
-
Spot on Paul67. It's not a slight on Naka, but he just isnt a ball-winning midfielder. In his time in the SPL he has learned to track back and stick a foot in, so he's no luxury player. The problem on Tuesday there was that he couldnt do the things that he usually does so well (his passes were woeful and it looked as if he couldnt trap a pound of steak-mince.) When *Naka's* first tough is off then it's "game's a bogey!"
Hartley might have found his niche as the sitting midfielder in Europe. Having two box-to-box midfielders like Brown and Donati should really solve our dilema (ie players who can spend large parts of the game covering the back four and then making runs/acting as the out-ball on the break.)
I dont know who we'd play as the 4th midfielder. Sno doesnt look like he's developing as we might have hoped (he's all elbows and no pace.) Jarosik just isnt up for life in the SPL but he is quite coy when it comes to the big CL stage (ie he knows how to play the continental way-- winning free-kicks etc.) What about young Teddy Bjarnson (sp?)? He looked like a dynamo against Hibs and in pre-season. It may be asking too much of him.
Anyway, that's how I'd play it if it were Championship Manager! :) Then I'd have players like Riordan (the cockiest guy in Paradise, from what I can see) and McGeady coming on in the last half an hour to run like frig and annoy defences.
The thing about this business of playing away in Europe is that losing isnt even as big a deal as British teams and press make out. Your not expected to win away at this level. Stuttgart, for example, wont be pressing the panic button after last night ("Scheiße, those plucky Glazgows, with their toothless Charlie Adams, are too much for uz! Vee should surrender now and let them into zee last sixteen.") If we win our home games and maybe, maybe, maybe nick a cheeky draw in Portugal or Italy then we're through!
-
I have to admit that we on this blog are in danger of chasing people away by stereotyping to the extent that you are either a “Happy Clapper” or a “Mineshafter”. I am neither I am a Celtic Supporter who wants the best for my club and has ambitions to see us build on success and improve year on year.
All of the talk of teams 1,2,3 etc bores me to death.
What we need to do is upgrade, upgrade, upgrade.
Work out who is the weakest link and replace them with a better player /better unit.
Therefore criticising the board for spending net tuppence hapenny in the last two years is not “mineshafting” it is reality. I am struggling with comments like “don’t spend – it does not guarantee success” as I feel that this insults the ambitions of the Celtic support.
In the SPL a certain southside 11 won the league many years in a row by outspending us. Same in reverse for the MON era.
We talked long about Balance Sheets – well having cash in reserves simply generates interest at a low rate of return , however investing in upgrading you fixed assets tends to drive higher returns in the long term. The companies with the best infrastructure, asset base, working capital, and dynamic management teams tend to be the most successful.
The team needs to be upgraded in a number of key positions.
1. Fullback – we all know the issue.
2. Centre Half – we lack class.
3. Wide player with pace.
4. Quality centre forward.
Now do we expect 5 players to turn up with the wave of a magic wand and everything be just great – of course not.
But we expect our manager (of whom I am a fan) to learn from his experiences.
Learning number 1. Last year we could not get it done through the middle, if you wanted to stop Celtic scoring then mark Aiden and Naka and we would struggle. Since Christmas we scored very few goals and a sizeable portion of them came from set pieces.
Cue – Donati and Brown – Excellent Job Gordon.
Learning number 2. A back four of Wilson/Telfer, McManus, Caldwell and Naylor let in on average 3 goals per game in last year’s Champions League. Not good enough – Upgrade , Upgrade, Upgrade.
Cue – nothing.
In fact we were obsessed on this blog with Frei, Oppiah, Maloney etc , then throw Routledge into the mix and what do we have – the same defence minus the protection of Lenny. 2 goals and a perfectly good one chopped off against SD. (What a surprise) Learn from our experiences - NO.
We all know that getting players into the SPL is tough but that is what some people are paid a lot of money to do.
We tried is not an excuse – we all try the lottery every week but most of us are still poor.
I fear that January is not the time to do business so we need to put behind us the mistakes of not upgrading the defence and work with what we have at our disposal – including Jiri and Bobo as they are employees of the club.
The CL is a long stretch from the SPL – I happen to think that 3rd place will be an achievement as I have little confidence of blank scoresheets in Lisbon and Milan. Then have a UEFA cup run.
We need to set our expectations in line with the investments we have made. Reality is we have invested to retain the SPL, and not progress in the Champions League. Our closest SPL rivals needed to invest more heavily to challenge for the SPL and to be fair to them they did that – opinions on the quality of their investments is up for debate but what is not up for debate is that fact that they showed the ambition to make the investments.
Last night showed that retaining the SPL will not be automatic but it needs to be our priority as we are a long way short of competing in the champions league.
Seville67
-
Hi Guys back from the Hols
the BBC are quoting that Mr Mourinho is looking for a 25 million pound payoff from chelsea
-
paul- old son-
im afraid the naka problem runs deeper.
he couldnt even hit a corner into the box.
he is supposed to be our 'biggest talent' yet he was the only one to miss a penalty against moscow?
ive watched him give possesion away all season.
the kindest thing you could say is that he is cream-crackered.
but i think he peaked in the man u game and its been all downhill since.
sure he hit a great goal in a 5 goal romp but we are needing more on the bigger stage and he hasnt delivered it since the man u game.
thought he was awful in the san siro, awful at home against spartak and absolutely dreadful against shakthar.
we should be cashing in our chips on him.
but as one first team player said ''strachan has his little favourites'' and that is colouring his judgement on this one
-
I'd always use Naka! Poor show on Tuesday but we need to find a way to ensure we create a platform for him.
Alongside Naka we have Massimo, Aiden, Paul, Evander & Skoosh and I’d defy anyone to say this is not a potentially exciting midfield of quality, flexibility and with options.
Perhaps we've got a bit ahead of ourselves though as it is now evident we do not know the most effective combinations to suit different circumstances.
I can see no reason why this problem won’t be worked out and when it is I think we will be enthralled!. A really strong midfield is the bedrock of everything else - even our defence!
Onwards & upwards…
PS - just read McGrory-for-arsenal (BTW, don't think title-tattle adds much to the debate) and disagree with almost everything except how poor Naka was on Tuesday. Funny how some see 'give away possession' while others see ball control, vision & skill. Hey Ho!
-
"Therefore criticising the board for spending net tuppence hapenny in the last two years is not “mineshafting” it is reality."
Seville67 - But saying reality makes it sound like a simple black and white conundrum. Maybe we did try to buy, maybe we were outbid, maybe our target didn't want to come, maybe the pull of celtic means nothing to Joe Le Frenchman or Luigi L'italian.
The southsiders are driven by a last throw of the dice. They've won next to nothing with a support who needed to see activity from their board regardless. They have no sustainable business plan but a collection of bosmans and the odd over the hiller formed by Walter into a rugged band of fighters with a bit of street savvy yet little depth. They'll put up a challenge, and in fact I welcome it, but I fully expect us to pull away from them and the pack.
My expectations are tempered on the CL. I'm a romantic who'd love to see another Lisbon lions but our pot 4 team spent £40m, Man Yoo spent £40m and Liverpool spent £40m…etc etc……………...for the foreseeable future we can't compete with that. Seeing progress is hard when those factors come into play on the big stage. We've picked a model which plays within our means - WGS believes he can coach performance levels of previously SPL-standard players upwards, bring in the odd jewel like Boruc and Donati and try and mould a team within a sustainable spend. I'd love to see us upgrade at the back and up front - I think what emerged in the public domain in the summer suggested we are trying - Routledge as a winger would have given us a new dimension but didn't want to come, Lucarrelli (sp) said we spoke to him and N'Daw said a bid was made but the club refused it.
Keep the faith
Big Wavy "the realistic happy clapper who reserves the right to be a mineshafter from time to time if the mood finds him"
-
I'm a clappyshafter
-
I think that Tuesday showed just how important Naka is to our team.
Naka was poor - and we created nothing.
The best players produce when the chips are down. Like 82nd minute against Man U , like 93rd minute against Killie. Who was that again ?
I am happy that Scott McD is chipping in with assists because without him it would be all up to Naka. I am trying to think of an Aiden pass that led to a goal.
McGrory - couldn't disagree more.
Seville67
-
Jose - no way
-
Big Wavy,
It is black and white. the board spent net nothing.
We don't expect £40M spending levels - but as you said football is about ambition and emotion , and as I said asset management, investment and a dynamic management team.
I think that a balance would be great - but for the last 3 windows it has not been balanced. but heavily skewed towards Prudent Bank of England Fiscal Policy.
As I said - trying to sign doesn't do it for me.
Seville67
-
I'd rather be a mineshafter than a darnelist
and
I'd rather be a happyclapper than a spud.
-
To me its always the same, when we win then they are all excellent players, a great team, the treble's on etc, but when we get beat they are just a bunch of duds who are never gonna win a thing.
Its kinda always been like that, the only thing that’s changed is now we have an internet blog that we can come on and have a go at our least favourite player or some poor guy going thru a bad patch, like Naylor or Naka. Maybe even the manager who was getting pelters up until we started banging in the goals again.
Personally I cant wait until we take our bad mood out on Hibs, another 5 would be just great, wonder what the odds on that are at the bookies, must be worth a wee flutter though.
-
Does anybody know where Noel90 is these days ?
Seville67
-
Cheers Seville67,
OK maybe it's semantics. You see net spend as an indication of the ambition and I see incomings of £6m last time (well spent imho on upgrading the midfield and the forward line to a degree) with a welcome boost at various stages of income for our cast-offs (Miller, Beattie, Marshall, etc). I just think that disregarding our 'hard luck stories" doesn't paint the total picture in a complex transfer window. We looked to pay out more but couldn't (never heard the wouldn't from anyone) and in judgements I tend to agree somewhat that we are erring on the side of caution in this marketplace but not anywhere near the 'biscuit tin' banner some would paint.
As a matter of pure interest, if N'daw at £4.5m, Routledge at £4m and Frei at £5m (names irrelavant)in January were made available, what would you advocate doing at that time ?
Big Wavy
-
Big Wavy,
if those 3 amigos are on Gordons priority list then by all means snap them up.
My point around January is that the top targets are rarely available at this time. so don't waste the budget on 5th / 6th choices.
I see January as a time to plug injury gaps - like Pressley last year.
However I'm sure that there might be a fullback upgrade available...please....
Seville67
-
So.....with that spend of £13.5 million, we then 'sold' Jirosik, Balde, Riordan, Graveson, Pressley and Zurawski for £11.5m, would a net spend of £2million still be bad business sense ?
Wavy
-
Chelsea were not net spenders this summer, neither were Arsenal.
Net spend is not a measure of ambition, I for one would gladly sell a 'Petrov' every year if it meant we brought in players of the quality of Brown and Donati (I'm skipping a year here but there's method!).
I'll happily complain about our fullbacks but this 'they outspent us' stuff is bizarre. It's weird how we only define ourselves by Rangers when it suits us. Seems it suits alot of people this week for sure!!!!
-
big Wavy,
it's a bit of a hypothetical question.
I think if we sell all of these guys we go back to Owen Archdeacon on the bench so we would need to spend to keep the squad in shape.
I don't want to spend on volume I want specific areas of quality to be added.
That makes it harder to do but as I say - people are paid a lot to do it.
Seville67
-
My opinion of reality... 80)
Extra money is pumped into the EPL via SKY. All EPL teams now have an unholy and undeserved amount of dosh at their disposal.
This results in an over-inflated market,(e.g. Darren Bent £16m, aye right!) and as the capitalists will tell you, this effect trickles down to the less well off. What they don't tell you is that the BAD effects trickle down too.
This means that the lower priced players in the EPL, or 'The Dross' for want of a better phrase, suddenly elevates in price to more than teams like Celtic can afford.
Subsequently, Celtic find that what they have already at the club, is way better than this over-inflated 'dross', so decide to keep their transfer kitty in the bank where it can stay until so much of it is accrued that what they eventually DO buy, will actually enhance the playing staff, and not just sit on the bench. But at least the 'spend at all cost' merchants are happy that their particular version of 'ambition' has been realised.
Personally, I see it as common sense. I don't see myself as a 'mineshafter' or indeed a 'happy-clapper'. I just see what I see and prefer to keep a positive outlook on things.
I can remember having 'mineshafter' tendencies when The Whites, Kelly's et al were in charge. I can even remember it when Fergus was in charge until I realised he was the one lone voice in the middle of all the madness. I can't think of one public disagreement he had with anyone where he hasn't subsequently been proved to be right! (Farry, Di Canio, Pierre, etc...)
But to get back to the main point... Celtic are currently the best run team in Scotland and improving year on year.
And that's reality!
P.S. Just to put it into perspective... Darren Bent wouldn't get into the Celtic team
-
thismancraig,
your comparison with Chelsea is bizzare - over the last 4 windows they have spent more that anyone in Europe.
Arsenal have a very different philosophy – investing heavily in French and African youth schemes.
I am not comparing us to Rangers – I am merely stating that we are investing to win the SPL no more but our closest rivals have on this occasion invested more – like it or not it’s a fact.
The only reason that I posted this week is to raise the question why are we surprised that we get the same results as last year in the CL when we have the same defence and to further ask the question about learning from our experiences.
Seville67
-
Seville67,
Appreciate it's hypothetical.
Actually I thought hard about that outgoing group in terms of their proximity to the first team and would say we'd very easily survive on that turnover - abundance of centre halves, a new first team full back, replacing Zurawski with Frei, having Skippy as our new impact forward from the bench and a wee nippy winger to challenge McGeady. Clear upgrading for squad and first team with only……………………………………...a NET spend of £2 million.
Ok bit disingenious of me and another poster has said it more eloquently, the net spend label is really not a measure we should be judging our ambition upon.
Big wavy
-
Where was Naka during the MON barren away CL years ?
WGS seen us free scoring in the SPL saw the improvement in the away performances at Milan and Moscow and decided to name two up front. I dont think the Scotland win in France helped us either. Far too cocky.
Mircea Lucescu went two at the back (i.e man for man on our front pairing - who were back pocketed immediately which is where we should start looking, CL debut for skippy and JVOH has no mobility at this level. Killen looked more dangerous) leaving us well and truly exposed. I thought WGS took too long to move Hartley into the middle but either way you look at it WGS was out foxed tactically. No shame there, Shakhtar have a fine coach.
I have argued before that having both Aiden and Mc Geady in the team is a luxury. I still stand by that. Even at SPL level. It also means that the men who play directly behind them are asked to do far too much. That coupled with the fact that they are the only two who play in every single game even more than Boruc alludes to where I see the weakness in the current Celtic line up. Maybe this is why their crossing is not acceptable.
We need to sort this out. Why they are jaded ? If it means changing formation (i,e going three at the back then do it we need to do something). We have enough CB´s that´s for sure. It´s only September and the games are now coming in thick and fast. Naylor and Wilson dont play international football so imho should be even fresher. So it´s a conundrum that needs solved. Ignoring it and hoping it will go away is not the answer.
Hail Hail
-
MrsWG has just left for NYC, what to do, what to do.......?
Eeny-meanie-minyshafter-judas
where else could I go that's as good as
The Teser ?
-
WG
is the wife still going to the Newmains Youth Club?
tart
-
above post should read having both Naka and Mc Geady ... poor Aiden
-
arthur lee -
you calling her a 'hammer' ?
-
Seville67
I spoke only of this summer, perhaps the time when they should have outspent everyone!
Arsenal sold their prize asset and replaced him across the board, when we sold Petrov there were complaints that we didn't spend the £8m + an additional £7m.
The general malaise this week (a week in which head to head we improved on Rangers) concerning Rangers spending and their European performance is strange. They haven't even crossed my mind since they lost to Hearts - so irrelevant are their European performances. They will not get out of their group.
As for the Champions League, last I checked we had a result (singular) as opposed to the 'same results'. The only time to make a sober comparison is at the end of our campaign.
I appreciate however that not all people are willing to wait that long! In fact, it's probably a sign of progress that it's taken until after the first game before it reached this level. Some people were reaching for the flashlights when the 'impossible' qualifier was announced.
-
Albertz only more powerfully built ?
-
..... and a non-Catholic.....
-
.....who is nevertheless loved and welcome on this site....
-
.....a Mein Kampfer
-
...... a Chow Mein Chapter of the Coltness Germanic Peoples Front
-
seville 67
Entirely agree with your view that we need always wherever possible to upgrade what we have. That is the point whether we are talking football business or life.
All this prattle about net spend is a red herring. What is critical is effective spend whilst via Lennoxtown and those people who are paid a lot to do it we are recruiting the best young talent we can find for our future so that ultimately our effective spend can be merged with our developing talent to produce a side capable of competing at the highest level.
In the meantime we must guard every penny jealously and accept the fact that FOR NOW our priority must be to win the SPL first and foremost year on year.
That will always be the starting point of a road that one day may lead where we would all like to go. Anyone dreaming curently of us achieving CL glory whatever our spend is living in dreamland.
I believe that is the route the club have committed to for the present and it makes sense to me.
If I can't see any tall and pacey full backs coming into the youth ranks or via the effective spend basis in the coming years only then will I begin to doubt. In the meantime we all know they are not the positions that will secure SPL titles.
-
anyway.....surf's up in ML2.
May All Your Christmases Be
WhiteandGreen
PS the 7-1 Golden Jubilee draws ever nigh
Oh Hampden in the sun
Celtic 7 and the darnel 1
All my life I will hope and pray
Just for one repeat of that famous day.
-
Cypriot Spuds tonight
WonderGolden
Teser-bound for he is freer than a very free bird indeed.....his love is on the WinG, he has dreams and songs to sing, it's so lonely in the bars of ML2.....
-
thimancraig,
I usually read your posts with interest and follow your logic - however on this occasion I am truly baffled.
Chelsea while not spending to the heights of previous years are still not a good example – particularly today when maybe the reason for that downturn in spending crystallised.
Arsenal have as I said made heavy heavy investments in French African youth. Henry may well have been their prized asset 2 years ago but I would not accept that he was last season.
I am delighted that we overtook rangers in the league this week and do not care to be drawn into a rangers debate but I think that your dismissive approach to rangers this season is based more on hope that reality. I hope you are right and I am wrong.
If you read the first line of my initial post I described the very behaviour that you are demonstrating – I will repeat I am not a mineshafter but will not walk away from my view that it is disappointing that we have not learned from our experience that the current defence is the same as last year – the one that let in 9 goals in 3 games.
Your optimism is admirable if a little blind.
Seville67
-
TMC
I think they could very well get out of their group. Lyon and Stuttgart are not the teams they were. I think they'll finish 3rd in the group and maybe even better that thanks to the luck of the draw.
And us, think I'll put this down to a learning CL campaign for the younger players.
-
Chelsea Football Club are pleased to announce details of their new men’s fragrance (perfect Christmas present)
It’s called.......“Special One” by U GO BOSS
-
Seville67
You follow my logic? Now I can see where we're struggling :-)
I'm not dismissive towards Rangers at all, I've been saying since January that we would face a massive challenge. I think this week has seen some bizarre fear emerge based on the two European performances - an unfair comparison in my view.
I'd be willing to bet that the defence this year will not concede 9 goals in 3 games (in fact, I don't think we'll concede that in all 6) however, that won't be a reflection of an improved defence.
EDB
I think they will do well to win another game in the group and whilst others may not be the teams they were, neither are Rangers. Reports of Lyon's demise have been greatly exaggerated (they've won 5 on the bounce in France) and not many average teams (they are no better than that) go to Germany and win.
The other night they won their easiest game, we lost our 2nd most difficult (given the scheduling it may turn out to be the most difficult).
-
thismancraig,
I have no fear of rangers - in fact I am confident that we can win 2 if not 3 domestic trophies.
I thought you were taking them lightly - which considering the challenge that they put up over the last 2 years could be easily done.
They look more equipped not to throw away the boat load of points that they did last year.
As for the CL. I don't care a jot about rangers. However I do want to see us improving year over year.
One year we will get a home tie to start and take an early win to allow us some space in our first away game. We always seem to have to play catch-up and a bad 8 minutes in Donetsk started me analysis why... and we all know my views on the answer.
Seville67
-
Seville67
I didn't think they would ship points however 1st challenge, 1st failure and some bizarre decisions from the manager.
For all their 1st XI is stronger they have accumulated some really average players amongst their crop.
-
Edward, in German, sorry, http://tinyurl.com/2e3xdu
Big Wavy, no idea why we looked so ill prepared.
Gerry, no.
-
Sir Paul.................
Ah! Kojo an' the Gangs', Don'ask Days:
Paul, me lad...you got the ANSWER,pal...yes, you soitenly did!
Picture this.
The Boss, announced to me, after 3 minutes... (I don't believe,that... for a Minute..ed)( I didn't say ONE Minute, I said 3!)...
"Celtic are in, for a doing!"
Sid nodded his head ...Mabel... lifted a supercilious brow...
Me?
I remained... APORETIC!( Huh?...ed)( Well? Can you blame me?)
Vito, he grunted.
After a the 4th minute, had passed.
I was no longer of an APORETIC Mein..(Now, that is the best news, that I have heard,all day!...ed)(Tell ME,pal!... I don't even know what APORETIC, means!)
Brass Tack Time~~~~~
You now have the idea.
Celtic were,not to coin a phrase..
Like a group of visitors from Cassiopeia,( Is that no a Jellyfish?....ed)(It would be... if I had forgotten the extra "i") who had inadvertently stumbled into a MAHJONG TOURNAMENT!
Celtic were THAT, OUT OF IT!
Sid said,"Are you sure, YOUR Guys, have ever played Soccer... Before?"
"Sure, they have...is that not right,Boss? Mabel said/asked ... (I thought, a wee bit hesitantly...ed)
The Boss, glared!... Vito...
Grunted!
Me?
I was back to being... APORETIC!..again!
From then on... it was all downhill.. like Hope Street, on your BOGEY!(Sic)
Almost forgot.
Your Answer?
When you implied that Celtic's trouble, was looking Suspiciously like a Psychological Complaint... you said a mouthful.(Tough word, that... Psych..Psy.. Tell me... Whit is the "P" Fur?... oan second thoughts... Forget it!) ( I am glad you didn't ask!)
The way Celtic continued to contest that encounter, it was ineluctably apparent, that they were obviously oblivious to the solution, on how to cope with the adeptness and over-all Soccer Technique of their swift/ fast raiding opponents.
It was like watching "The Death of the Dying Swan"!
It was Boring... at the same time so Fascinating.. but so Painfully Predictable!
Yep, sirree, Boab!
Don't look now, but Celtic's complete lack of CONFIDENCE.. was not only showing....it was so bad... that they were in danger of being charged with INDECENT EXPOSURE!
How to solve his distressing turn of events?
In a word.....
I DUNNO!( That's two words!...ed)(yer right...but, ah'm so upset... that I canny coont!)
Like Scarlet murmured...
"I'll think about it...." ( fill in the rest... ah'm soooooooo DEPRESSED!!)
Kojo.
-
I see Tommy Burns is impliedly accepting the general consensus on this site that the defence is nowhere near good enough. He blames the goals in Donetsk on "individual errors" and then points out that these errors costs us in Manchester and in Lisbon last season. You would hope that this would lead to an appreciation of where the problem is. Players who are not good enough will always commit "individual errors." Continual errors on the appalling scale referred to in Paul's last article, ie we are one game away from 52 weeks without an away clean sheet, are not hiccups. They are symptoms of a malaise in the team that is the defence. Naylor and Wilson have talent but need to be pushed. They are error-prone yet retain their places due to no identifiable replacements. In the context of Evan Williams, Mr Stein had this to say,
"It is always natural for any player to ease off slightly, he might not even be aware of it himself, if there is no-one to pressure him...And this was the worry about Williams...So he lost the edge on his play a little, and tended to mix some very good saves with some mistakes during a game."
Now, why can't the present day manager appreciate this logic ?
-
Paul67,
I am surprised that you did not comment on the defence the same ,upgrade, net spending debate.
Would be interested in your view.
Seville67
-
My dear friend, Malceye...
After reading your comments...
Think about this...
Fargo is Dead right!
If the performer fails to turn in a...performance... that is Not deemed to be a satisfactory one... then, that individual is in danger of losing his company tenure.
Another equally dismal performance by that same individual... wella, wella?????
No THIRD CHANCE?
Na.... I don't think, so!
If the wine is no good?
Then... Throw it out!
A Credo to live by!
Kojo.
Yer pal... who likes ye
-
Can you imagine these phone-ins tonight?
Flanders will be hyperventilating.
'click' (that's the radio aff).
-
Kojo, agree. I think.
Seville67, at the risk of starting an ill-informed debate on why we didn’t spend more money, yes, I agree, we need more players, Gordon Strachan admitted as much when discussing the fitness of Lee Naylor a couple of days after the window closed.
However, the defence were not the only problem on Tuesday, another full back or two would not have made the midfield or attack play any better.
We were well off the pace all over the field. As I said yesterday, the McManus mistake will grab the headlines, but he was simply following precedent.
The team can and will play better.
-
Met a guy recently who is preparing paper relative to his PHD in Sociology.
He has been studying this blog with a microscope and finds it totaly fascinating.
He is interested in people in this country's passion for football and in particular how the debates on here can reach such a high and as quick,a low.
Keep up the good work folks.
-
Sir Paul......
I think so, too.
Pinkety,Pinkety!
By the way...
I am not speaking of, the Celtic Don'ask?... don'ask!!, performance!
I am referring to your positive posit......
"the team can and will play better!
Kojo.
-
malceye
Think you're stretching your argument a little to suggest that TG's individual errors was anything to do with the defence. The same defence you're castigating also kept clean sheets in 3 home games plus 2x90mins against Milan. THink I've just re-inforced the individual errors point?
-
My dear friend, Derbyshirebhoy.
I agree with Malceye.
You,my friend, have fallen into the trap of driving your vehicle, by looking through the Rear-View Mirror,only.
One must...especially in judging,the worth of a performance... ANY PERFORMANCE... from one at te London Paladium, to that of the more prosaic, which would include that offered by a Street Singer...or even a Busker...
or a Soccer DEFENSE!
A PERFORMANCE, is always JUDGED, IN REAL TIME!
Yesterday's,performance... is OLD NEWS!
The Celtic Defense as adjudged......not only by their last Performance... which was, not to be too unkind...in a word...Deplorable!.... but,that shaky defense, also CONTAINED that same group of Sinners... who are still extant, and doing their jobs in their usual slip- shod manner.
Time for a change?
"Elementary, my deah, Watson!"
Kojo.
Yer,pal.... forever and ever.
-
Paul67,
The more I think about Tuesday's match, the more I think we simply underestimated SD. Hate to say it, but Wattie got his tactics spot on last night- one powerful guy up front, plenty of midfield and full-back support- but overall a defensive formation. And they were playing at home!
That's how you do it. Don't allow your opponents space, effectively bore them to death, as someone put on here last night. That way, even if they are brilliant and fast, and skillful, you keep them at bay at least for the opening part of the game. You give yourself a chance.
Instead, we smelt victory and were far too gung ho. By the time we had realised what kind of team SD were, it was too late.
-
I agree that we got the tactics wrong the other night but I don't think this was any gung ho approach as surely this would have meant Aiden in the team.
Irrespective of what tactics you deploy when a midfielder loads a gun and a centre half fires a bullet into his feet I think you are on the back foot.
Job number 1 away from home is always to earn the right to take part in the game. We are very good at stopping this at Celtic Park so shouldn't be surprised when it happens to us.
As I said earlier this week, it's the manner of the goals that frustrates me as every goal we score at home seems well earned.
-
Italiabhoy - nail...head....hit.
-
Am I the only one who didn't think we were ill-prepared on Tuesday? I thought we were out-thought tactically. For a manager who has given us so much and has had it spot-on so much, I'm prepared to forgive that and I'm sure Gordon will be chuffed to hear it. Shaktar went gung-ho against us, and due to the quality in their midfield especially, managed to over-run us. Because of who we are we hate to admit that a team were just better than us on the night - I especially hate saying that in the SPL - in Donetsk, in Shaktar, in Don'ask, we were beaten by a better team. Shrug shoulders, exit stage left, beat Milan.
ItaliaBhoy, I agree with your comment on us but I think you're way off on Rangers. If they play one-up at home good luck to them but teams who do that kill football. Not only do you bore the other team as you say, you bore the audience and fly in the face of an entertainment industry. We smelt victory, dead right. Smith smelt dullness. And yes I maybe Corinthian in spirit but our football was poor enough at times last year - if we play 1-up at home this season heaven help us. Gonnae no call him Wattie :)
-
I'm sure Walter did get his tactics right and it's generally easier to at home but how good would they have been if Carlos Cuellar had scored an O.G. after 7 minutes?
Tactics out the windae!
-
Kojo
With all due respect it was malceye who introduced the spectre of past performance as some sort of endorsement of his premise that the defence continues to suffer from individual errors. Simply pinting out that some of those had nothing whatsoever to do with the defence.
Agree however its time for a change - but who would you change? Who would you play on Sunday?
-
Bloke109,
Fair enough, but we need results, otherwise what is the point of being in the CL? We shouldn't be ashamed of bolting the door shut if that is the best way to a result. I would have been delighted if we had got a dull 0-0 in Donetsk, absolutely delighted. So would every Celtic fan I know.
Sure, if we play 1 up all the time, that's not so good. But the point is that Smith read his team, his opponents, and the match-up absolutely right. Strachan didn't. We were over-confident and badly prepared for their onslaught.
89 minutes of backs to the wall defending and a last minute sclaffed goal from McManus will do me just fine against Milan!
-
I think that the management team believed our own hype going into the SD game - a bit similar to Artmedia but thankfully nowhere near as disastrous.
That mistake won't happen again - this season anyway.
Personally not convinced that Naka is really the sort of guy that relishes high tempo box-to-box football - either home or away.
The added pace and energy of Donati and Brown seems to emphasise the lack of pace we have elsewhere.
Seems like building a new Celtic team is a bit like painting the Forth Bridge?
Maybe the frustration in that is the reason why we are all so addicted.
-
BTW
In the last week, the Scottish papers have mentioned Mcdonalds 'dink', and the 'good ship' Rangers.
They are reading this site bhoys and ghirls. Maybe all contents should be copyright.!
-
ItaliaBhoy
Absolutely, I was more referring to the fact that Smith's default tactic seems to be 1-up - no thanks on that. As tmc says if the Cuellar oggie flies in, he has to re-think it. Players win or lose it, so long as they know what to do in each scenario. A boss is praised for getting tactics spot-on if the team wins.
I think I'm all just for different thinking - from us as fans, not from GS. Part of me sees the CL as fool's gold but I do remember being like a wee boy in Turin with Stan's goal and thinking it's the only show in town. I still do.
I'm struck by Scotland rugby side apparently going to play a weaker side against New Zealand to save for the Italy game - that's anathema to football and CL - you'd rather play the weak side in the SPL before to rest perhaps and keep the 'big team' for the CL. I dunno, part of me thinks we're in the CL, let's try and win the thing, part of me thinks realistically 3rd place is good enough. As usual the truth lies somewhere in between, but the one thing that doesn't wash is to say the players who could have got us to the last 8 last year are, after one game, or perhaps more accurately, 8 minutes, not good enough this year. Some realism is needed.
In other news, was that really Vidar Riseth playing for Rosenborg in their draw with Chelsea? 'My part in Mourniho's downfall' by ex-Celt has a nice, perverse ring to it.
-
What i cant understand about Gordon Strachans tenure is that we are no closer to having a defence fit to wear the jersey.
I thought that would have been our strongest area by this time.
Its bordering on neglect and farce that we have fullbacks that seem incapable of learning from previous mistakes,have no physical stature or presence,look totally out of their depth.
I want ma defenders to be quick and hard as nails.Wilson will never make a right back,Naylor is playing for Celtic when his form does not merit it.
We should not accept a situation at Celtic were players that clearly are not of the required standard continue to wear those hoops.
Gordon Strachan has improved our midfield he is culpable for the state of our defence.
People have mentioned that we cannot compete financially,i refuse to believe that our budget could not radically improve our present full backs/centre half position.
-
Nelsbhoy, I have been saying the material on here would make for a phd for a while.
Kojo, the team sure will play better.
Italiabhoy, you could be right.
TheLassieBeattie, I should have got a copyright on ‘dink’!
-
Terry
We're better than the defence that started against AMB, I've no doubt on that. 5 CL clean-sheets last year from 8 games (including 90 minutes v Milan away) is pretty good by anyone's standards, as is only 3 league goals this season.
Our defence was poor-ish last season but it chopped and changed so much after Caldwell's injury and a slow centre-mid didn't help. I see us as a learning side and given the positives from this season so far, I really can't see us shipping 'in' Benfica or Milan. Bottom line, could we do with new, better players? Always, as organic process.
-
My dear friend, Derbyshirebhoy...
I am glad that you asked.
We have always practised the arcane art, known as PRO-ACTION..when we are presented with an problem ,that seems to have all of the portents of becoming, an obstinate one.
One must DO something... ANYTHING!
If the problem does not seem to show signs of going away... then
steps must be taken... Stringent?
Depends!
But NOTHING IS RULED OUT!
If a problem is allowed to fester and grow, is will metastasize into something not nice!
Like ......well.....
Don'Ask!
or...horror of horrors.....
Another Black Sunday!!!
In answer to your question...
I would, speedily... dispense with Mr. McMANUS.... as punishment, well earned... for at least Two Games!
Just to get his attention!!!!
Mr. Wilson....
Ditto..... except his departure from the team...will consist of a Longer Sentence, than Big Mick's allotment.
Again, this punishment being well earned, having not been turning in, the kind of displays that is required.
Mr.Naylor?
Ah! Yes!
I am afraid that his departure from the team sheet would be permanent.
Besides his obvious,lack of CONSISTENT defensive ability...
His crossing ability, as well...is so pitiful ... it is beyond proper description!
His crosses into the opposition defensive set-up, are Freebies. which he dispenses Freely, to the opposing Defense...they are gratefully gobbled up......thereby, initiating a new attack to the Celtic Rear-guard...
AND THAT MEANS... RIGHT THRO' THE MIDDLE!
Perilous, just shocking!
Those Three SINNERS are basically the most DEPENDABLE UNDEPENDABLES!
Now for the tough part.
Replacement Time.
Joe Doumbe for Mr.WILSON.
Honestly, Double Drum is performing EXTREMELY WELL ,in the Reserves just now... if you get a chance...amble over to Chan 67... and see for yourself.
He deserves his chance.
Which I think he will grab with both FEET.... and
HEAD!
YES HEAD!
He does WIN.... At LEAST 90 PERCENT OF HIS HEADERS!
Big Bobo for BIG MICK!
Yes, I know.... but remember what I said.... Big Mick will return after a TWO GAME PUNISHMENT!
We are merely trying to attract Big Mick's Attention,to the fact that he has sinned and therefore must do a spot of PENANCE!
That is how ...a CHILD LEARNS...or an animal,if you will...
Good performance is Rewarded!
Bad Stuff?...... equates to BAD STUFF will happen!
Darren O'Dea for Mr. Naylor!
with a view of making it Permanent!
There it is my friend...
Unfortunately, I do not expect that my offerings will be the most eagerly accepted answers to our Defensive problems...
BUT THEY DESERVE A SHOT!
As I said...
Something....must be done!
Kojo.
Yer Pal....who thinks you are swell
-
Bloke 109 fair points,am sitting hear with a sore heid that has lasted two days detest when we lose goals so cheaply,needed a rant.
Thanks for the perspective.
-
Bloke109 - spot on!
But not for the first time have many here overreacted in the face of a defeat. Shakhtar at home are not just good but were and are very very impressive. I thought the first 15 minutes were breathtaking notwithstanding the alleged tactical error, which surely we can forgive.
But not some here...'unforgiveable', 'couldn't watch anymore', 'felt physically sick' were three of the more shameful responses.
Sorry these guys are not the sort of Celtic supporter I am. We might support the same club but in a different way. I take succour that those to which I refer are in the minority on CQN. They still rankle!
Tough game at the weekend, though.
Win lose or draw, faithful through and through.
McGrain
Neither happyclapper nor mineshafter
-
Paul 67
See that bag you lost in Donetsk...
Was Noel 90 inside it?
Just back yesterday from a long weekend in Paris. Thanks to Tom the Tim's tip, I caught the ICT game in the Harp Bar and now have a Paris Celts csc badge to start my collection. Lots of thanks to Nils, the only guy from Gothenburg with an Irish accent. Really enjoyed the experience there and can recommend this bar to anyone.
Thanks to my wife's planning, we were flying back just as the CL match was ending. I'd arranged for my brother to text updates.The first text announced we were 2:0 down. He was composing a text to send to me, announcing the first goal, as the second went in. I decided not to get any more texts from him unless Celtic were scoring. I'm still waiting.
As a punishment for missing the match, I have read through all the comments and have just caught up with all I've missed. I haven't seen the game yet just the short highlights (?) package, so I'll save my views on the game as they're worth nothing just now.
To complete my penance, I'll just say well done to Edward's mob for getting a result. Any CL points are hard won.
Oh!, and a final piece of self flagellation, I feel we have to give house room to the mineshafting views and the just plain hurting & lashing out type of views that we get after a CL defeat. I know many find it energy sapping and or tedious to wade through some predictable outpourings, but there would appear to be a common view that some criticism was merited for the Ukrainian performance.
I'm hoping a couple of good league performances and, at least, the avoidance of defeat against Milan in our next Cl tie, will restore the Dr. Feelgood mentality.
-
two new posts on www.thelordofthewing.blogspot.com
Farewell Jose and The Final Word...
only if yer bored like.....
-
Terry
Yes, spot on as per, we're all hurting. Immature, uptight git that I am, I can't watch the game with Mrs Bloke in the same room. She was banished and when she dared to enter the room (I'm exaggerating here, we love each other dearly) I shrugged my shoulders and said something as simple as 'beat by a better team' and that was it. Usually it takes me a week and a half after a defeat but I've been enjoying our start to this season so much I just reasoned that we're not a bad side, a couple of players way off-form and yes, with hindsight, Naka should have been dropped and we should have parked the plane, let alone the Parks of Hamilton across the goal-line. But we didn't and set out to play and lost. Doesn't take away from the fact we're top of the league and horsed the side which beat Rangers in what was for me our best performance since 4-0 (was it 5?) home to Murderwell a bit back.
Another thing on Naka. Play Naka for me. His performances may be misty but he's a moment of truth player - corners on Tuesday were awful but he gives us so much in his flashes.
Kojo - agree for the most part as it goes, but that would be the same Lee Naylor I think who provided the cross for JVOH in our best chance of the game. 'Rest' Mick maybe but punishment would be the return of Bobo, he said over-the-toppedly.
-
Kojo
Strangely I am in agreement in the main though not entirely for all the same reasons.
Wilson - absolutely - needs to think very very hard and listen more.
Naylor - the guy is having to soldier on when unfit - a properly rested Naylor offers many options not least dangerous balls into the box but that requires a rested body which will help his mind and consequently his delivery.
Mc Manus - short sharp shock. I like it but replaced by an unfit Bobo not for me. I'd bring in Kennedy.
However you and I know it won't happen but who knows a bit just might and for my money it will be in the full back area.
-
Rosenborg lined up 4-5-1 at the Bridge,with the midfield being pivoted round the 35yr old Hoopslegend VRiseth;the Uefa website has some good fotos of him sorting out MEssien.
Just goes to show you dont miss your Vidar til the well runs dry.
Also in the line-up in the topical fullback position was Roar Strand;37 years old and holder of more league titles than anyone else in Europe.
-
Why is Naylor'soldiering on when unfit'?
Is El Gordo reading'SS Punishment Battalion' by wee Sven Hassel?
-
dontbratt
With big Darth for every bizzare og at McDiarmid Park there was a home winner against Motherwell (The Herald the following morning had a cracking picture of him vaulting the ad hoardings to celebrate it). Good honest pro, evidenced by Tuesday. And 'I lost it and got sent-off against the huns' will surely merit a chapter in the biog.
-
SFTB, the bag turned up w/o Noel, who is in The Betty Ford for CQN-addiction.
-
My dear friend,Bloke109
Bobo? Unfit?
According to what I have observed in his recent reserve outings...
I fail to agree with your opinion concerning your doubt of his fitness.
He is fit, fairly fast, but unfortunately, he still has the same mental lapses, which cannot be over-looked.... therefore, I don't see him as a Permanent Replacement for Mick,
Mr. Kennedy?
I just cannot imagine that he would be a better temporary interim choice, than Bobo.
I believe, John has a long, long way to go, before we can make a proper judgment on his return to top form.
Give it another 6 months, then I will give my opinion on the young man's ability to do a RELIABLE Job, for us.
Kojo.
yer pal..... for good
-
I haven't read the board intentionally since the match as I can already guess what the general tone is and it would depress me. I'm sure a number of players have been slated with a number of claims that they are not good enough for the club and Strachan's tactics have been slaughtered I'm sure.
I'll just say I think the team that went out were good enough to win the game and the tactics while could have been a bit better with some slight changes were also good enough to win the match.
We lost because we just simply didn't start at a high enough tempo and didn't seem to have the right self belief from the beginning. It's not the first time it's happened and it needs to be sorted out which I'm sure it will. It was an awful night but this happen especially if you have an inexperience side. If we signed one more good player before the window it wouldn't have changed anything especially when the main problem area in that match was in midfield which is the area we have invested in the most.
I have full confidence that these players will go out against Milan and put on a brilliant performance because their pride has been dented and they'll want to prove how good they are. And they are good players. They also have an idea of the challenge they are up against now. Whether they beat Milan or not is another matter, much better teams will fail so there is every chance we will to.
-
Kojo
Wooft, I don't know if I said Bobo was unfit, apologies. I was just suggesting I don't think he's the answer. And yup, JFK, perhaps not. How about Darren, who also looks good on CTV?
-
Heerenveen are leading Helsingborg 5-3;the birthday bhoy's got a couple.
-
Continental drift
Anyone interested in long-term trends and links between real life and football should have a wee look at tonight's UEFA results. Not since the high noon of Moscow Dynamo have Russian teams been so prominent and powerful. Smart money might well be placed on a Russian team in the UEFA Cup. Spartak Moscow won 5-0, I see ...
Also just 2-1 home loss for Artmedia, and Bayern Munich looking a bit sick.
-
Kojo or whatever your collar says in Mosspark these days.... WTF .......... O'Dea is not or ever will be a left back......Have you watched the games? Aye the bhoy can play but no there ........jeez, for all your prose you talk some keech......
TBM
-
The scale of Tuesday's disappointment comes from the high expectations before-hand. The team has started really well in the league and put out Spartak by showing a lot of skill, energy, passing ability and barrowloads o' bottle...
we had a poor night on Tuesday against a good team, but against pre-match hope we fell from a height...
When you don't see it coming it hurts much more. Artmedia Bratislava, Black Sunday, Inverness in 2000 at Parkhead, 5-1 at Ibrox in '88 going in as champions and taking the lead...you just think "how tf did that happen?"
-
My dear friend, Derbyshirebhoy....
As far as our disagreement in the desirability of Bobo as a Temporary replacement for Big Mick...see my subscription to our mutual friend, 109Bhoy.
In point of fact(Huh?...ed)it is perfectly natural for a Smidgen of Disagreement to creep into contending opinions...of anything...
Blame dat ole Debbil.... SATAN!
Doncha know that he is lurking somewhere within Everybody's Psyche? ( Why da "P"?....ed)( Zip it! Let's no go into THAT...
again!
Yep! That ole guy...is always there.... enjoying the trouble that he loves to create... and you know something... he always comes up smelling like roses!( Roses? not a wise choice o'f adjectives,pal...ed)(I could have used, BRIMSTONE.. but that one is soooooo, UNORIGINAL!)
Take that Serpent... in the GARDEN OF EDEN?...that's the one.
He was solely responsible for the starting of ALL our TROUBLES...and STRIFE!
So what was the outcome of his wee tete a tetem with that EVIE GAL?
He sold her a Bag of Apples...She ate one... and.... well, ye know the rest.
However, God subsequently, Unceremoniously kicked EVE AND THE DOPE (ADAM)... Out of the Garden... And gave them a SINE DIE sentence, into the Bargain!
Now howdya like dem Apples?
I am curious to ask... what do ye suppose happened to the Serpent?( I KNOW! Oh! I KNOW! Please, sir!....ed)( Zip it!... yer gonna spile the Punch Line!)
Why he STAYED IN THE GARDEN!...and as far as I knoo is STILL Hanging around there...
and he has LIVED HAPPILY, EVER AFTER! THE END.
Ain't that a kick in the PANTS?
So that my friend ,is WHY....
PEOPLE WILL NEVER AGREE COMPLETELY ON ANYTHING.
As far as Soccer is Concerned?
Fuggggggggggettttttttabouttttit!
Do not examine the Logic... too closely....
Jist havin' a wee laugh....
After, Don'ask ...
Can ye blame us!
Kojo.
Yer pal.... forever...
-
Should have written Bloke109...
Sorry about that!
"Ready, when YOU are.... C.B.!"
Kojo.
-
Paul67
"The team can and will play better".
Can you elaborate?
It's hard to take issue with the way they are playing in the SPL at the moment, so you must be referring to the CL?
I also think your comment: "no idea why we looked so ill prepared" was quite intersting; as was Hamptontim saying "the management believed their own hype - a bit similar to Artmedia.
Seville67 also made some very valid points earlier today regarding our inability to learn from past mistakes.
While watching the Brian Quinn on celtic TV this evening I actually wondered if Paul67 was in fact Lauries Anne Brown!! He pre
tty much repeated word for word what he said to you.
I'm not sure if it was an interview that would have taken place regardless of the manner in which we lost the goals on Tuesday (i.e a defensive shambles); but I thought it interesting that he felt it necessary to come on and defend the Club's transfer policy during the last window.
I can't help but feel that after watching a decent start to the season by Rangers and a defense that is completely out of its depth at CL level, the Board are starting to feel a tad uncomfortable.
As mentioned on Tuesday evening, I am not expecting European football of any description after Christmas, which will allow us to focus on winning the league.
With atomatic entry next season I can only hope we have learned a lesson.
-
TheBarcaMole.
I am shocked that you are in Profound Disagreement with myself... apropos, my suggestion of using Darren in the right full back position,in lieu of the Faltering Englishman.
Ignoring the somewhat crass tone of your protestations,.. I shall hold my nose and progress with my explantion of why I selected Darren to fill that berth.
Unlike yourself...I believe that Darren would fulfill all of the obligations of that important position,in a much more successful and RELIABLE WAY, than the present Incumbent.
I have ACTUALLY SEEN DARREN... play in that Position... and he gave an extremely good account of himself...if I am allowed to say so.
Should you retain any doubts in reference to the Above statement... I suggest that you take the opportunity to ankle over to Chan67 .....
Where you will see Darren perform...like a Champion...at Left Back...in RESERVE LEAGUE GAMES....
After you have viewed my recommendation.........
Then YOU will be more able to discuss this matter, more intelligently, instead of so RUDELY.
-
BDO
did it come from their glasgow blythswood office ?
The numbers people with offices up that way blog it.
Mervyn King - South Bank show critic.
Was their a stronger board at BOE when abby had two worse cashflows without a column inch.
Could be out on this one.
But I doubt it
BDO I trusted you once with my life's work.
-
Should have written....
"Left Full back Position"...
The Faux Pas proceed to multiply!... time for a spot of tea(?),I am afraid!( should that no be Faux Passes...ed)( Search me! )
-
I misplaced a comment.
Mr Quinn I believe was deputy govener at BOE at the Abbey time.
Never that simple just holding my scarf up which I don't own.
Too expensive.
Poorly made.
-
I'm Bryan.....
Noel90 is well and articulated that london clubs manager and his team very succinctly by text earlier today.
-
Kojo, c'mon ..........."like a Champion...at Left Back...in RESERVE LEAGUE GAMES"..... You soid it!!!!!!!!!!!!Is that affected Bronx accent ok wid you?
Forthright maybe but rude, hey...............my sainted mother would not permit it......
Opinions.....
TBM
-
I turned on Sky sports and theres a tribute show entitled mourinho , turned it to skysportsnews and witness Steve Bruce solemnly speak about how much he'll be missed , then Sven blathering on about how much england shall miss a great character etc.
Did Jose Mourinho pass away today? Going by what I just watched in amusement , you'd have thought so.
What is going on in the world. The Sky platform is sickening , its heading towards " Americanism ".
If people were not aware he got sacked then they'd be leaving wreaths outside stamford bridge.
-
Time for new tactics , if the full backs fail us , do without them.
Go three at the back , three center halves MON style.
-
I think we have exhausted the analysis of where it went wrong on Tuesday. Fact is, what happened against Donetsk could easily have occurred against Spartak 1st leg. They were not without opportunities. We lived and won by thw sword in that game. We just plain lost the last one. Everyone knows the reason lies in defence - Lordy, its been said often enough here since, oh, about March. We must get on with it and focus on the next game which is not without its hazards. Hibees will want to show that whatever their city bedfellows can do, they can do also. We must be up for the cup. Let's look forward to Sunday now. Milan will take care of itself. So we are disappointed that Rankers took all 3 points. Well, the Stuttgart web site is still in a state of shock that they didn't collect. They, Barca and Lyon will put Hutton's exuberance to bed. October is usually a pivotal month in determining who gets their nose out in front in the league. We've edged out in front and I believe that the opportunity is there to expand the lead. So, from one whose glass is half full, COME ON THE HOOPS !!
-
Did I really say "half full"?!!! Feloow mineshafters relax, of course I meant empty !
-
Big Liam
we have been there done that before. I think that system was blown out of the water in Porto and subsequently by any other team who cared to play with wingers.
-
with the king of kings banging in a couple tonight is that not him well up in the all time uefa comp scoring charts?
also another one of those good bars in foreign climes requests any good bars in amsterdam to watch the ac match? all suggestions gratefully accepted :)
-
TheBarcaMole
The tone of your submission has somewhat improved.
So, you have earned a second riposte.
Yes, I unashamedly admit that the only times, that that I have seen Darren perform..that is RECENTLY.... at the Left full back position, has been in RESERVE GAME FIXTURES..
On reflection..There was another occasion ,to be truthful ...where I did see Darren perform in the Left Full Back Berth.
It was in a FRIENDLY GAME , AGAINST NEWCASTLE.
At least One Year in the Past.
At that time of course, Darren was a Green as a GRANNY SMITH.
Plus the fact, I believe it was his FIRST, FIRST TEAM OUTING!
Darren did not fare too well in that game.
Taking the above facts into proper consideration... We will find that Darren is a much more rounded performer, at the present time.
The BOY DARREN HAS NOW HAD QUITE A FEW EXCELLENT OUTINGS IN THE FIRST TEAM.. EUROPEAN EXPERIENCE AS WELL...
Now surely,You...na.... you could not be so dilatory..
Perhaps, though?
Surely, you are not basing your LOW opinion, of Darren on that old , first impression he gave,way back then... at Left full back?
However, I would like you at this time... in the spirit of fairness... forget all of your whimsy.....please!
Present YOUR FACTS TO BACK UP WHY YOU HOLD DARREN'S POSSIBLE PERFORMANCE AT LEFT FULL BACK...
IN SUCH LOW ESTEEM!
Pal... you have the floor!
-
I do think the weight of the monkey is too much for this young inexperienced side. From the off we were very nervious.
Gordon's preferred XI is simply not conditioned to defend. Naka, Brown and Donati are all offensive rather than defensive players.
Barca maybe equiped to play 4 defenders and 6 exceptional attackers sadly we are not.
Sno and possibly even Jari better options away from home in Europe.
Doumbe is not the answer. We will need to wait until atleast Christmas for the gift of a full back or two.
Although have we not been here before?
How many full backs did MON go through and not get it right?
-
the plain fact about the left back berth is that for whatever reason be it flash in the pan first year or injury it has become a problem that has to be sorted not of course the only one i might add but given that it has been stated by wgs that we have little cover there something else has to be tried dont have any recall of darren at left back but know kojo likes the what have you done for me lately mantra would give ear to the fact that he is giving kudos to performances in said postion again something different has to be done and quickly and darren has done ok from what i have seen of him when he has played
-
@22.51 Big Liam ;
Martin O´Neill, (MacDuff), has played no small part in the downfall of Mourinho (MacBeth). The emphatic 2 - 0 defeat at Villa Park recently and a well earned draw at Stamford Bridge last season were body blows that hastened the end. Those results did not come easy, MON and his teams had to stand up to Chelsea and their power. Power that ultimately Jose could not wield.
Jose is now being lauded by sports commentators who prefer to sidetrack their viewers from real sports stories, like Yuvraj Singh scoring six sixes against....who was it again?
-
KOJO O`Dea for left back? Too slow?asked the boy,respectfully.Wilson left back,doumbe right back. Macjay.
-
Two games from Darren at left-back...
1. v Hibernian away when they played Sproule.
2. v Kilmarnock away when they played Naismith.
He was given pretty much a torrid time by each. Never say never as he's a good, honest player, but ... The real answer would be Mark to LB, JJPD to RB. Wilson, though, is IMO the weakest player in the side.
As mere speculation, jumping a game ahead, team versus Dundee anyone?
-
GM, let me put it the other way, I don’t think they can play much worse than they did on Tuesday.
No, I am not Ms Brown.
Malceye, irrespective of the score, we played much better in Moscow than Donetsk.
-
My dear friend, BelfastKev
I have no inkling whether or no you have the ability to check into Chan67's ...CELTIC RESERVE FIXTURES...But at this very moment...Chan67 is featuring a Recent Video...of the CELTIC v.HEARTS RESERVE CONFLICT.( Aug30(?)2007.
All the major cast members that are contained in my list of possible replacements for the First Team DITHERERS are to be found there...in situ.
In the particular reserve game, that I have alluded to....you will see a fairly recent performance of EACH OF MY SUGGESTIONS.....
Bobo, Darren... even JOE DOUMBE are all partaking, in that game.
Riordan ....also...what a lovely pair of GOALS he scored!
DEEEELITEFULLY SCRUMPTIOUS..
Darren was confident... classy... and HE WON EVERY HEADER...and MOST IMPORTANTLY... his Distribution was impeccable..
Joe DOUMBE also... won 99per cent of his Heading Duels...
and... believe it or not...
Bobo WON.. I believe ALL OF HIS HEADING ATTEMPTS...
Does that TELL YOU SOMETHING?
I know it tells me a lot!
Anyway....
If you can...or any other of my Readers, as well...
TAKE A TRIP TO CHAN67.....
And judge for Yourselves...
Nothing beats a Try..... as the Bishop said to the .... oh! I better not finish that one!
Kojo.
Yer pal..... for good
-
Tommy Gemmell did alright at left back even though he wasn't naturally left footed. His height was the main factor, he was imposing like William Gallas. Can Double D not play at left back? Why does Oor Mark have to be played out of position? And I also think we can play 3 at the back depending on who we play and who we are playing against.
-
My dear friend, BarcaBhoy,
Now you are fit company... see?
Politeness never hurt, anyone.
I accept your observations...I confess I did not see those encounters where,as you say... Darren in your opinion performed so poorly.
But, one can only form one'e opinion on what one has actually seen....that is if one is being perfectly honest.
On what I have seen...
I believe that Darren could, would... and will....
MAKE ONE HECKAVA LEFT BACK!
Kojo.
Yer pal....for good.
-
what do we want?
what are we happy with?
rankers wanted 9 in a row.
they would have been happy with 10
european success doesnt matter to them the way it does to us.
why?
not sure , probably the stein years.
lisbon taught us we werent an underclass.
back to my original question... we want credibility in europe and we'd be happy with.....
making the last 4 .
we can win the league with the current full backs but would that be enough?
dont think so.
we've got a pair of £500k full backs and no matter how you hide it or how you try to spread blame amongst the team/squad that is our problem.
in my opinion it is nothing short of a disgrace that a club of celtic's size has entered the champions league with the 3 full backs we have.
-
Paul
the point I was making (or rather trying to) was that if Spartak had taken any of those opportunities before Dink's cross and the Hare's header (Pipkins - geddit?), then we may well have gone down the route of Tuesday night. That Spartak didn't take the lead was due to (a) Artur and (b) a wee bit of luck. It certainly wasn't because of a water-tight back 4.
-
kojo
can get them on celtic tv but my failing among any i might add is i havent the patience to sit through recorded matches live or bust for me :)
agree with you on the fact that deek the ned :) and doumbe should have a good run in the team post haste cant agree on big bobo love the big guy cause of the fear he can instill into some opposition players he is sadly just as likely to make a howler as what we already have and could even say in european games slightly more likely even with all his experience although on a side note do think he should be eased in for the rangers game we will need his ahem no nonsense approch big time mark my words :( we need to slap them down form the mind game point of view if they are allowed to build moumentum we might find it very difficult to claw back as regardless of the hearts score i dont think they will drop to many silly points hope i am wrong of course but get that feeling with walt at the helm so obviously the games formely known as the old firm will be crucial and remember the will of course be aided and abbetted abely by the media lackeys in keeping any moumentum they can grasp going and no matter what we all think it does ahve an effect
-
Belfastkev
I may just be being sentimental but I cannot recall Bobo ever having a mare against Rankers. I agree with you that he should be brought back into the fold. He is imperious in the air at the back. McCulloch, Boyd, Darcheville would not get a look in, and remember they are very much a route one team.
-
My dear friend, Macjay...
You have a point... which I am just about to blunt..
The Present incumbent in that disputed berth... does not impress me,that much, in has alacrity of movement.
In fact, I have seen him OUT -RUN ... on inumerable occasions.....
Also...and this is important... it was pointed out to me, by an unnamed doyen...of the very positions of which we are now discussing...
This was said to me, during a very recent performance, by Mr. Naylor...
" SEE!...He is on the WRONG SIDE, of his opponent,He is gonna get beaten to the Ball...See!... I told you!
That is a trait that Naylor suffers from. His distribution,also is a serious failing.... because in making a faulty pass or cross, which he is inclined to do... and,too many times.... to his utter horror and consternation, he is caught out of position".
Heading? Naylor is very suspect.
Does not win MANY HEADING DUELS.
There is more.. I am giving you an insight into why I say that Naylor, deserves to be permanently... "86ed"!
Anyway... I can not see much difference between Naylor's Fleetness of foot... and
Darren's.
That is my opinion... which differs from many of my readers..
So what else is new... Besides...
York,Hampshire,and Jersey?
Kojo.
Yer pal.... fur Ever and Ever.
-
I don't believe that WGS will make wholesale changes in the defence as he favours continuity and bedding in a unit. Hibs away is not the softest SPL fixture in which to gamble 3 points, so I'm guessing 1 change only.
If Wilson is dropped:-
Doumbe, GC, Mick, Nayluck
If Naylor is dropped:-
Doumbe GC, Mick, Wilson
If a CB is dropped, Darren will replace him.
Darren could play LB against a mid to lower table SPL side without it being too much of a risk. However, I would not expose him to a winger with pace. I believe young O'Brien has replaced Sproule as Hibs' flying machine so I don't think this is the match to attempt this.
For the same reason, bringing back Bobo could be a problem against Benjaloun and Zemmama. Fletcher is their main threat for headers. I don't think we should pick a back 4 to address issues we may not face this time. Hibs will attack largely on the ground.
-
At 20/09/07 23:44, rimtimtim said…
Tommy Gemmell did alright at left back even though he wasn't naturally left footed. His height was the main factor, he was imposing like William Gallas. Can Double D not play at left back?
*Big Tam was originally signed as a centre half from Coltness United, there was a line up of fine prospective centre halfs in front of him including Frank McCarron, John Cushley, John McNamee and Big Billy. Tam adapted and the rest is history.
-
malceye
agree what i was trying to say is bobo makes mistakes yes he gets more chance to rectify those mistakes in spl whereas the can be ruthlessly punished right away in europe
just think as with walts usual form of approching games against us with the first lets kick the s**t out of them we have a few players who shall we say might not fancy that type of game haveing bobo steamrollering over someone would tend to give you heart i think :) and players like crueladeville might not think themsleves so strong and hard when confronted with the bufg(big unfriendly giant) :) boyd we know would be reaching for his hamstring for a start please sally can i come off now :)
-
Belfastkev
the sad truth that we know however, is that both you and I have as much chance of taking up the left and right back berths in the team as BB has of filling a centre half spot.
-
does the chosen one have to sign on in the morning :)
could be a bit of the hearts scenario developing at combat 18ski
god hope so couldnt happen to a nicer club :)
-
Burp......
Pardon Me!
A touch of Indigestion due to recent dishes my palate has had to endure....Some of it was a Little Hard to Swallow...
But I am sure...
Sorry...
I Know...
My appetite will return....
C'MON THE HOOPS
Oh and thanks Dick Byrne..... :o)
PJBhoy...
Who was talking about posts rather than players...
Who has to watch kids learn and fail and learn every day.....
And whose only real concern is......
Would Brother Walfrid employ ..... Dr. J
Roll On The Furore..............
-
true
but i would be crafty enough to wait until the 90th minute or if we are winning the 110min before kicking wee bazza in the nads :)
-
Genuine question:
When Motherwell/ICT/Dundee Utd etc get beaten at Celtic park is there this amount of despair/anger/behaviour unbecoming of a Celtic fan/ on their relevant websites or do they just accept that if you are so financially out of your league then these things are going to happen?
-
well we know for a fact that follow follow gets a bit down hearted after we beat them :)
-
My dear friend,Setting Free the Bears...
Good solid logical thinking... you backed up ... all of your proposals...very well.
There is school of thought, which I somehow don't think that Gordon,attended...
Sure... you know the one?
It's called... "Horses for Courses"
I am a definite subscriber to that Place of Higher Learning.!
Isn't that what the "Technical Approach to Soccer ...as she is played".... is all about?
It would be... If I were King!
But I am not... and it is not!
Yermamma?
He's a Bona Fide Target of Pierre's... you heard it here, first!
Pierre, loves the guy!
Kojo.
Yer pal.... forever.
-
nice eupemism there bk, reminds me of the comment "he's a bit tipsy" as you're helped into the police car
-
kojo
true problem is though we dont have enough varied horses for the many different courses that have to be run :(
-
BelfastKev
Imagine putting your first name and home town in your Blog name. It's a dangerous world out there mate, I don't think that was a good idea.
malceye
I have enjoyed your posts over the last few days. The battle cry for the Hibs game I think signalled a closure on the whole process: denial, anger, transferwindowism, depression and acceptance. Pure passion, tremendous!
I just pity the poor bugger who is getting charged for your time since Tuesday. Hopefully not the same guy as me!!!
-
Ahhh...I am off to the pub...The Ship is now in safe hands....
RichieDonovan & Belfastkev Rowing Us to More Familiar Waters
Keep Smiling Bhoys....
-
a walk on the wild side yes :)
-
which reminds me
is it a good idea to wear the hoops to an ajax game or not?
-
belfastkev
If they're playing a friendly against the gers, it's a great idea.
-
My dear friend, BelfastKev
I have enjoyed my little flight of fancy....
But, not so deep down..I know that Gordon will not pay the slightest attention, to my/our proposals.
And that is as it should be...
For, fundamentally speaking( is there any other way?....ed)(There is no other...and Jerry Lewis does it every Sept.)
The Manager... does what he does best....... Manages.....
The Spectator, such as I... does what he does best.... SPECTATES.
And God is in His Heaven... and Hibs are blissfully unaware.... that we are going to take them apart at the week-end!
Good evening, friends.
Kojo.
Yer pal...who likes ye.
-
the use of friendly and gers in the same sentence causes abit of confusion :)
-
and if it did happen to be that i would be front row centre without asking :) sadly this time it would be dinamo zagreb
-
kojo
yup
but lets also hope the the manager eventually manges us into a postion where even given the good football hibs can play they would be blissfully aware that we are going to take them apart then god would be in his heaven and the mineshaft would be closed until further notice :)
-
PJB
Not been posting much but I thought I would at last rise to the bait about the good Doctor.
Doctor Who? No.
I agree with you that he is not fit to replace the Chairman, but not for political or moral reasons.
The Doctor's expertise is in politics and arguably survival.
Mr Quinn's is in high finance.
Could the Doctor have steered the ship through this troubled decade as astutely as Mr Quinn?
Could he have put a recovery plan in place and executed it as well as Mr Quinn?
Would he be able to provide the same vision and steadfastness through the clamour and ridicule from media and fans?
I think not.
Therefore he should not be a candidate. We should be seeking a person of the same skills and repute as the present incumbent.
'GG healthy again.
-
September 21
St Matthew
Happy Feast Day Craigneukian and Wishyhillian FPs.
WG
-
Tuesday night-we can have no complaints.We got what we paid for-we put a UEFA Cup team into the ECL,and got found out.
We need to regroup for a difficult trip to Easter Road-a dour,hardfought 1-0 may put more iron in the soul than the iron pyrites of some of our recent 5-0 victories.
Anyways-pros:le Tissier
cons -Goss
-
Some mitigation - good results for Ukrainian sides at nEverton and Ebirdeen.
Pro- Bianco
-
Quite an impressive crowd at the Dungheap - 15,431 - well done to them.
Pro - & Son
-
pro - Damon
CON - Kelly...
-
After seeing all the recent maulings of our fullbacks by the posters, I have a point on Lee Naylor that may have already been made, but I feel it’s worth repeating if it has. For the first part of last season he was close to player of the year material. Solid performances, rarely caught out of position, playing with confidence. After Christmas his performances seemed to tail off and that has continued into this season.
Two points here,
A good player doesn’t become bad overnight and the best football teams usually contain partnerships. Players who compliment each other. Sutton and Larsson, Hateley and McCoist, Viera and Petit etc. This also applies to fullbacks and wingers.
Aiden has become almost an ever present since Christmas and I am a very big fan. This coincided with when Lee Naylors form started to dip. Shaun Maloney is a player who rarely loses possession. If the full back overlaps he would either play a good ball to him, or play the ball inside to one of our players giving the fullback time to reposition himself. This gives the fullback confidence that he won’t get exposed through no fault of his own too often.
While Aidens unpredictability makes him a great player to watch, it makes it very difficult for a fullback playing with him. He is prone to lose the ball unexpectedly leaving everyone exposed. If the fullback does overlap without getting the ball and Aiden loses it the fullback has to be out of position. If Aiden does get robbed, his player is usually free to come forward with the ball while McGeady pleads his case to the ref.
I think playing with Aiden has upset Naylors game and confidence. He isn't sure whether to commit or not as Aiden may lose the ball. I also think a replacement left back would end up in the same situation. I believe the way forward would be to treat these two as a partnership and coach them the way you would a forward for defensive pairing.
With a player who can keep possession playing left midfield, Naylor is a decent full back.
Lets stop making him a scapegoat.
Bertie.
-
pro - McVittie
dunno- McGlone
-
Where is Noel?
-
Just a wee thought and not seen what has gone before in terms of team suggestions but in these away games could we not maybe look at the 4-5-1 to start the match and then work our way into the game.
Was thinking of Boruc in goal (As if there was any other choice :o)
From what we have would still go with Mark Wilson, And McManus. Toss up for the other berths as not convinced with Gary Caldwell in their but thought a decent second half performance by him in Donnie made for some better viewing. Still think O'Dea if given more games slotting along side our captain would have merit based on the Milan experience. Naylor (and I agree in some part with Bertie but still think he looks way off form as McGeady hasn't always been on the park for some of his horror showings) or Doubme at left back (Unknown quantity).
For the midfield I would keep Hartley in the holding roll and let him patrol that area in support of the obvious pairing of Donati and Brown and then you can opt for the more defensive Sno. This leaves a choice of either Aiden or Naka as the wing option although both are adept at coming inside when required. Could obviously play both against the weaker ECL teams :oP
Only issue as you well know is only one up front but I would go with our lil Aussie buzz bomb who seems far better at gathering the ball, closing down and generally making a nuisance of himself than the dutch fella JVoH who is clearly out of sorts.
That was we could at least see our midfield pair of Brown and Donati get forward to support him which is their preferred method of play and indeed we have seen Sno and or Hartley do similar.
As I say just some musings and open to discussion by all.
Fire away! :o)
Hail Hail
-
"where is Noel" ? Its been so long the pertinent question is "who is Noel?"
-
BigSwee,
Artur - Absolutely
Mark Wilson needs moved to left back or dropped. JJPD needs to get a run in that position. O'Dea needs to replace our clumsy non-footballing captain Mick and Lee has been rank rotten for almost 10 months now.
Hartley has made the holding position his own, Donati and Brown are shoe-ins and Naka and Aiden would be the additional midfielders breaking to support Skippy up front. I'm in the camp that Sno, after a burst onto the scene, is offering little in terms of progress. Slow as a week in Bar-L and all elbows and stuck out arse.
By way of January cavalry I pray we need those full backs replaced and Maloney to mix things up more effectively for our away legs.
Here's hoping.
Wavy
-
Good point Bertie and offering a sensible solution to boot!
I love Aiden but Id have Maloney back in the side at the drop of a hat as a replacement. To me Maloney was a much better technical player and closer to the finished article than Aiden albeit different type of player.
However that is gone and we are lucky to have Aiden. He does a good enough job to get a place in the side at the momnet and is progressing into a very good player.
Not at his peak yet but is at the right club to get there.
I watched the last two Ireland games and he looked a little lost in both.
But as you alude Bertie a lot of the detail is in the pairing up and understanding between players not to mention coaches tactics or in the case of Stan, lack of tactics.
As for Lee I have been on here before voicing my support for him.
He will come good again but the club need to do him and themselves a favour and bring in quality competion for that position....which Im confident they will.
DBBIA Agreed we have a good Uefa cup team which I guess is the boards responsibility to assure...We were fortunate to get through to this stage but once here as last season proved anything can happen.
Remember when we had our first sniff of the CL after their NIAR.
We beat Dynamo Zagreb 1-0 at CP and got humped 3-0 away (Now why is that familiar?) I rember thinking then that we would never be able to get into the league stages and why could teams like Rosenborg and PSV etc always manage it and we couldnt.
Then came Ajax and the rest is to me at any rate an exciting rollercoaster that I would have bitten your hand off for if it was offered to me in the not so nice nineties.
Gweedorebhoy...Condolances to you and your family.
-
that is a ridiculous comment to make that nakamura should be left out the team for european games, for the simple fact that he is our main goal threat, although it is from set pieces, he must play in the hope that we get a chance within 30 yards of goal.i agree that right midfield may not be the best place for him in europe possible behind one of the strikers and allow him to play a free role playing in mc donald or venegoor of hesselink, but to say he shouldnt play is wrong.
-
Only one problem with suggesting Maloney helped Naylor's form, it was Aiden who started the season as first choice as Maloney was injured. Maloney played no more than a handful of games last season. Aiden gives Naylor plenty protection, far more than Maloney does as Aiden is more impressive physically (despite what Neil Lennon says :-))
I think we've a better squad and team this season than we did last. Last season we reached the last 16 of the Champions League and ran AC Milan closer than any other opponent (Carlo Ancelotti's opinion). When we play AC Milan they will have NO new signings on show.
What's happened in the intervening 6 months for our squad to be downgraded to UEFA Cup only (whatever that means - Bayern Munich are in the UEFA Cup with Ribery, Toni and Schweinsteiger).
We've played one game and people are looking for 5, 6 and 7 changes to be made, even suggesting JJPD (who struggled against Dunfermline and hasn't even seen a European game before) might be the answer to our prayers.
The answer to our left back dilemma cost Lyon £3m! I've still to come across a right back of that quality available at similar price, as an example Milan spent £8m on Oddo who will give an absolute masterclass at Celtic Park.
-
thismancraig,
I don't think anyone is saying that JJPD is the "answer". I think there is just a consensus that our defence needs an overhaul and these unfortunately are our only viable options.
On the other hand, how much time do we spend on waiting for Naylor or Wilson to find their form, and how much rest do these guys need, especially being non-internationals ?
Wavy
-
A good Uefa Cup Team but not a bad Champions League side either is what I was implying.
Got to go to dentist now. Later.
-
Perhaps more worringly, when was the last time that we had a left/right back who climbed through the youth/reserve ranks at CP and looked on the verge of competing for a first team place ? I cannot honestly remember. Was Mulgrew a left back ?
-
Big Wavy
I'd be tempted to wait a bit longer as I thought JJPD looked poorer than both Naylor and Wilson - especially defensively where he offers zero protection to the back four.
Neither Naylor nor Wilson have what I'm looking for in a full back however they are all we have at the moment (a seperate debate!). The only thing I can say in Wilson's defence is that he's missed effectively a season so he is attempting to build back to form. When this happens there are always setbacks and drops in form. He was frightening the other night, it's down to him how he reacts.
I still think the back 4 who started the other night are our best bet.
-
malceye
Think he was, Stephen Crainey before him probably had more of a shout.
Danny McGrain before that?
Problem is that playing fullback for Celtic must be the easiest job in the world in the SPL, under almost no pressure. It's also a problem which afflicts British football in general, the difference in importance placed on fullbacks between here and Europe is staggering.
-
Mulgrew was a left back.Young Irvine was a right-back;his injury meant we had to sign the Telfmeister.Irvine has since been released[I think].
Young Caddis was given a run-out at fullback against the Mags but this was not a success[in fairness to him I think his best position is midfield].
TCM-the only way we could make 5,6 or 7 changes is to play the likes of BB and JJ;I can't see that happening.I'm also not sure of the wisdom of continuing to play LN if he's injured,which some posters have suggested.
-
I think we will wait till the League Cup game to give Doumbe a start.
Sunday is a massive game not just for us.
If we can win it will be a major psychological boost for us and a big blow to Rangers.
This game like their visit to Tynecastle last week is one where they would be hopeful we will drop points.
Hopefully players like O'Dea,Kennedy,Sno,Killen etc will get a start at Dundee.
-
Greatings one and all from a very sunny and lovely Polland. I'm over here visiting my good friend Zbyszek and his wonderful family. Today we are going to look around Warsaw and tonight we are going to the pub to watch Legia against Korona Kielce, whoever they are. I've asked Zbyszek for a couple of full-backs, but he's a bit reluctant to give me any !!!
Tomorrow we are going to Krakow, can't wait, 25 degrees !!!! Woohoo. I hope I can find somewhere to watch the Bhoys on Sunday, as a win is essential.
Hope you got back alright Paul and I'll catch up with you when I come back.
Odezwę się później
pablophanque
-
I find it deeply depressing that we feel the need to have this debate on almost a daily basis regards the lack of quality in our defence and primarily the fullback positions.
We didn't strengthen when we could/should have and I believe we will pay a severe price for that - and I don't just mean no European football after November.
This weekend's game is vitally important and no mistake. There's more than just 3 points at stake here, there's a real need to win back the feelgood factor and show that we will not be moved on our way to 3 in a row.
Any slip up and the darnel will go back top as they will undoubtedly collect all 3 points from their game.
-
Thismancraig - you make a sensible point about the difficulty of getting quality defenders in at an affordable price. In an ideal world it would be great to get a full back like Oddo or Srna, but i think the majority of Celtic fans would settle for dependable players in the full back positions. It would alleviate the air of anxiety that filters round the rest of the team & support whenever the opposition have us on the back foot. Think of the confidence that Boruc brings to the team & compare it to the edginess you felt when it was Douglas or Hedman between the sticks. Thats my point.
Telfer although not a fans favourite was an experienced guy who understood how to hold his position & use the ball well when he had it. A player like this would serve us well in the short term. Our current full backs are OK at SPL level but in Europe they are constantly out of position & giving the ball away cheaply. This is at odds with Strachans total football philosophy & makes me question why we're bothering to acquire world class players like Donati & Namamura in the first place if we're going to do them the disservice of having a Defence behind them that are like an episode of Tiswas.
I was over in Copenhagen last year when we were gubbed 3-1 & although Gravesen received the bulk of the flak for his kamikaze performance, it was the performance of Wilson at right back that really shocked me. I couldn't believe how easily Copenhagen negotiated attacks down the left flank that night.
Big Wavy makes a good point - its all very well saying these boys are learning the game & they're just back from injury etc, but at some stage you have to hold your hands up & say right bring back Daniel Fergus
-
TMC-yet again we find common ground;~0!
One of the multitude of bees I have in my bonnet is that fullback is a specialist position,too often it is sen as a means of giving a centre back or midfielder a game.
Hoopslegend DAgathe is one of the few to make the change successfully at that stage in his career.
-
VargasShampoo / DBBIA
Absolutely, this always confuses me. Right back is the easiest position on the park to play, left back is a touch harder because the player will generally be left footed and therefore a bit daft / mercurial / cultured / (insert stereotype of choice).
In Europe the fullback will generally be strong, athletic, pacy, good on the ball and always, with few exceptions, be capable of adequately covering the centre half. Without wishing to continually hark back to the Italians, Oddo cost AC Milan £8m and was only given a token 15 minutes at the World Cup.
In Britain, traditionally the full back is pretty much the wee guy who can't get a game anywhere else!!!! Paul Telfer made himself a marvellous career out of this, proving that an interest in football isn't even required to play right back!
Considering we have the least threatening forward line for a decade it's interesting we're all talking about fullbacks!!!!!!
-
TMC-to hark back to the Italians.ACM will put every game in context,and will not let other considerations to confuse the issue.They will go to Donetsk looking for the draw;if the chance of a win comes they will take it but they know that there's more to winning everything than trying to win every game.
We alowed all the chatter about our poor away record to distract us from the fact that a draw in the Ukraine would have been an.excellent result.I don't mind us banging in the goals between now and the trip to Lisbon but I don't want this to be seen as justification for thinking we are going there to win as soon as the game kicks off.
-
DBB
AC Milan probably know on how many points they will qualify, such is their approach to qualification.
Given their recent experience against us they will approach Celtic Park in exactly the same manner as they do Donestk. The ideal scenario for us is that they have already won the group by the time we roll into Milan as when this happens you can get something (Lille last year).
I think Lisbon will suit us better as long as we approach it correctly, hopefully the gunslingers will be left at home and we'll at least make the opposition score a decent goal for once.
4 points from 6 please!!!
-
Eldiegobhoy,
If the feelgood factor went away with one bad 90 minutes away in Ukraine against a better than half-decent team, then, with respect, did we have it in the first place?
If a 6-match run of 0-0, 4-1, 3-1, 5-0, 5-1, 5-0 is wiped clean by Tuesdays 'mare, the players are on a hiding to nothing. They just can't win. Has there been a more positive and productive start to a league championship in recent times? Possibly, but 2007/08's is still very good.
We need to cheer up...it's like the day Walter Smith went to Debenhams to be told the cardigans lorry hadn't arrived. The man was inconsolable.
-
Here’s my take on the defence/full backs issue for what it’s worth.
I have been thinking back to the last couple of seasons and if you think about it, how many times did you see Neil Lennon down in both full back area’s of the field sweeping up and intercepting?
I think Naylor, Wilson and indeed the centre backs all benefited from this cover and now we are seeing them slightly more exposed this season and the result is the whole defence looks rather more shaky.
Now, I like the way the midfield is playing but there is a case, particularly in away European games for Hartley to sit in there and protect the defence.
We could be doing with better quality in these positions in my opinion but we have what we have and I think they will all get better, though Naylor at 27 may be all the player he is ever going to be. If he can recover the form of last year then that’ll do for me, but I do suspect now that NL is away this area is feeling it more than any other.
-
I remember the gist of the posts when Mark Wilson first signed was how well he was doing at left back and wait until he gets onto his favoured side to see him really take off. Pretty much cries in unison to have him replace the Telf.
I like Wilson, I think he is technically a sound player but it appears to me he has no natural aggression or confidence, this will have to be coached into him. At Dundee United I think they realised this because they partnered him with Barry Robson and very often Mark actually played in front of Robson on the right hand side, to good effect.
To date his best performances have probably been at left back. Tom Boyd was another who although right footed played his best games for Celtic at left back behind John Collins. Now that was a partnership that delivered. Wdowzcyk and Slater on the other side however just never gelled for some reason.
Anyway, if Naylor is not fit as has been mentioned numerous times I'd have Wilson cover at left back and play Doumbe at right back, who despite his faults has a real presence in the air, which might be important at the likes of Ibrox.
Wilson then becomes the competition for both left and right side berths which would surely be better than two shoe-ins week in, week out?
Hail Hail
p.s. I think the last time we had the shut out debate was the week before we went to Ibrox and Magic slotted home for a one-niller. A clean sheet this weekend would be a terrific achievement and I've no doubt we will score, hopefully often!
-
Settingfreethebears - glad to hear you had a great time in Paris with the French bhoys. I'm going up there next weekend for the French CSC AGM and looking forward to the atmosphere in the Harp Bar for the Dundee Utd game.
Nils the Swede is a great guy and its thanks to him that the Paris Celts have a great venue. If only we could have this elsewhere in La Belle France :(
By the way - is your badge not a French CSC badge with a wee frog on the front of it ?
If you make it to Lisbon, look for our French CSC banner in the main square, by the fountain. We should be 10 or more making the trip. Happy to buy you a beer and flog you a t-shirt at the same time :-)))
Hail Hail !
-
Antibes,
Does the big french guy Jean-Luc (?) in Marseilles still have his boozer and club down there ?
Spent a weekend in that guy's company a few years back and had a smashing time. Would love us to get Marseilles in the big cup some time.
Wavy
-
enjoying your debate lads. Hope you dont mind if I chirp in with my tuppence worth.
If you were an attacking fullback would you rather have a Thompson playing in front of you or a Naka or a Mc Geady? especially during an away CL game ?
This was our first CL game in 5 years where we started without a holding midfielder. The king is dead long live the Paul king Hartley. Maybe as a club we have been too keen to shake off the turgid tag. I´ll bet you now that we play Hartley or Sno in a holding role in every away european game we play this season ?
Shakthar played two at the back in the first half and that was our undoing. The dodgy ball played from a midfielder to our captain added to the problems. As has been said if that was Mc Manus in a Scotland jersey the ball would now be in orbit.
Our midfield then having to deal with two extra attacking defenders sat back too deep because they had too. Naylor couldn´t do anything about the second goal except give away a penalty it was a good goal. 10 minutes of Artmedia Bratasalvian panic until Hartley was moved centre.
I think what I am trying to say is that the full backs look jaded but we need to find out how to play away from home. We done it against Moscow and we done it against the CL champions and we done it against Barcelona at the Nou camp with a different set of players.
Our new attacking midfield needs to learn to be dogged, uncompromising and defensive minded we lack that player. Hartley and possibly Sno excepted. new Midfield partnerships need time to gel and going forward Brown and Donati have gelled. They might need more work going back the way.
Rangers haven´t lost in 7 consecutive CL outings. I think it´s unfair to still be crucifying Wilson and Naylor. It´s a maliase with the whole club. We think we´re better than we are at this level and playing two up when one of them was making his CL debut was an indictation of that.
We need to learn to play counter attacking football home and away. WGS didn´t misjudge Shakthar he misjudged his own team. I know I am going to get flamed for this but WGS could learn a lot from how Rangers and Scotland have won points away from home in the CL against good quality opposition.
Hail Hail
-
Antibes,
do you know monsieur M Gill who was based in Paris until earlier this year and a member of the CSC ?
-
EDB, TFOD lost 4-2 to an average Hearts team. I dont believe a victory against Aberdeen is the foregone conclusion you think. Ok they may be a major force in Europe now, but that wont help them in the SPL. :-))
-
Awenaw-you might get flamed for that opinion but not by me.
DBBIA/JohnnyStormCSC
-
dbbia
Your 451 suggestion sounded interesting before the game. From here it looks like an opportunity missed.
A toughened defence and a gyroscopic midfield. What's the problem?
-
I'd play Hartley & Sno away from home in the CL, along with Brown & Donati. And if we'd another robust midfield player I'd have no qualms of playing him instead of a second striker.
If we want/need to go more attacking then we can do that if the last 15-20 mins.
-
Zbyszek
You've got Pablo there I understand......lock up your daughters mate:-)))
-
Sno is a must in my opinion - a player who does not panic and is comfortable with the ball at his feet. His sheer size is also a bonus.
-
My Tuppence is that Gordon went for it - or more to the point, intended to go for it away from home. And on the back of our last three results I was the good side of hopeful as well. 8 mins later the show is over, and we never get to find out how good Shaktar truly are because their job was done for them - due to one error that could have befallen anyone and our defence letting the ball get crossed without a proper challenge.
Now if we had stolen those two goals then Gordon had made the move with Hartley we would have been crying his genius.
So, I guess I'm not defending his set up and I do also agree with Awe Naw in regards to learning from other results. But I also hoped that we would go and win there.
Before the game I e-mailed a mate down south saying I was nervous about the game and although my head was saying a 0-0 would be a great result for us I also added that I was praying for a Skoosh winner for us.
We are top of the league and have lost one game away from home in the CL, and I can't see it anywhere on paper or in my head that Hibs are a better team than Spartak or Shaktar so I'm looking forward to Sunday.
-
hello there peeps
Totally disagree RE leaving out Naka in Europe. He's our best player and we need to provide space for him to play. If that means playing with one upfront away (not exactly unheard of)then sounds good to me.
-
uncle P
Maybe play Naka as a second striker ie in the middle. Out wide he's not much use, neither would be McGeady be much use in that wide role. I doubt anyone would be.
-
C'mon The Hoops
Pro - s Southern Comfort
WoodstockGemmell
-
Bertie @ 0917
Well said... Say it as you see it...
...And he does lose possession quite a lot too!
-
new article posted.
-
Pro - Street, Cork City
