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Who eat all the Flies,Who eat all the Flies.
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I will be interested to see if the SH replies to the various e-mails sent to them. Somehow, and maybe unjustifiably, I would have expected better from a so called "quality" newspaper.
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Would the SH print a piece that used the 'P' word in relation to a specific section of our Asian community, or the 'N' word in relation to Afro-Caribbeans?
If the answer is no, could they please explain to us why it is then acceptable to refer to 'bead-rattlers'.
The obvious conclusion is that the author in question has failed to contain his own particular prejudice.
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Spot on Paul,
never quite thought of the sectarian slant on this one, but it is quite clear the press are using the not Celtic Minded phrase and twisting it around for their own purposes.
Hence the danger of using it as some on here have pointed out.
BF
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Hail, hail..
I too sent an email. Don't expect a reply today, it's a Sunday newspaper, so they won't be back in the office until tomorrow.
A number of the senior figures at the SH aren't what you would call sympathetic to Catholics.
It is however astonishing that the phrase would be used, as I pointed out in my email.
I'm a Catholic and have never used the term to describe myself, nor can I think of any Catholic who would do so.
The only time I've heard the phrase used is by non-Catholics, specifically bigots.
In my email, I asked if senior editorial executives had deemed the phrase suitable to use and if so why, because frankly, it's not.
It's a disgrace that this phrase was used, and I would like to think that the Catholic Church was seeking an explanation from the Sunday Herald management.
This example of sectarian language goes beyond football, which is why I'm advocating the Church asking questions rather than Celtic.
It is an absolute disgrace that this column was published with that phrase in it.
Anyway
STANDING UP...and then jumping around on Wednesday night. Misplaced confidence? I don't think so, let's have them at home and give them a doing....
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Strachan has definitely earned another chance, qualifying from the Champions League group stages twice is an amazing achievement, TFOD have just had an exceptional season, instead of fighting amongst ourselves we need to regroup and back our team and manager, next season will be even harder, Rangers will have guaranteed European Football to entice players and money from Hutton's sale along with probably the sale of others such as Boyd and McGreggor will give Smith lots of money to play with... We on the otherhand will have to wait to the last minute to see if we qualify for the Group stages... This was always going to be a dreadful season to lose the league... We cannot blame the board, money has been made available and certainly at the strategic points of the season Peter Lawwell has been well supported on this site by most people posting on it. Strachan should not be blamed, JVOH has scored goals, so has McDonald... they've just hit bad form periods... My only critisism of GS was his failure to sign a quality centre back, but then who was available....?
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Gordon,
After all that has been said and written about Celtic this season alone, I thought nothing the LL and the Scottish meedja at large wrote/published could surprise me.
The fact that this has been set down in print, appears to me to set a new low, even for the Murray
80%ers!
This following on from the recent Big Jock caption in the Daily Retard shows that they are allowed to portray Celtic in almost any manner they wish without any punishment being visited upon them.
I honestly think that the situation in this country in terms of anti-Celtic/anti-Catholicism has regressed 30 years.
Unless both Celtic and we as Celtic fans, start mass outcries against this bigoted bile, they will feel free to carry on in this vein, especially as the "establishment" seem unable/incapable/unwilling to make any public pronouncements vilifying this despicable behaviour.
Celtic/JR/The Board must draw the line in the sand now and let it be made known to all and sundry that we/they will no longer stand idly by in the face of such provocation!
HAIL! HAIL!
Token
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Am commenting on the Sunday Herald elsewhere - anyone know the name of the 'journo'?
(I call him that - he may be looking for employment in another field)
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Bloke109
The name of the offender is Kenny Hodgart
STANDING UP
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Nthing short of institutionalised bigotry and every negative story about celtic is deemed as justification of their stance, hence we are fighting a loseing battle, but one which needs to be fought.
to quote peter tosh.
"everybody is crying out for peace but none is crying out for justice".
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Inkybhoy, have you by any chance had work dealings with the offender?
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inky
Thanks for that. And I agree on your point regarding its use - only ever used by bigoted scum.
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A first time comment from me in West Yorkshire. I follow CQN regularly and am always impressed by the intelligent debate. I'm writing because I find it hard to credit that offensive reference in the Sunday Herald. I've tried online to find the hack-piece it came in but without success. I think I can say with confidence that such a term would never be used south of the border. It is hard to credit.
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Unusual name, that, Kenny Hodgart. This is the facebook for someone of that name.
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It beggars belief that this kind of gutter journalism is published, even worse when you consider that it will likely not be retracted.
But its not isolated. Add this instance to the following:
1. Commentary published under Jim Traynor's editorship not so long ago about Jock Stein
2. Ridiculous cautioning of Boruc and the non-existent police response to the Voodoo banner.
3. Donald Finlay, his anti-catholic jokes and his absolution by the Law Society.
I have long since stopped buying the Red Tops because of their blatant bias and will now add the Herald group to this list. The only way to punish them is to deny them your hard earned cash.
It is for the leaders of both Catholic society and Celtic to make a stand on this type of commentary. As it appears the silent approach has been taken as tacit acceptance when in fact they have probably wanted to suffocate the story with no response.
Its time to make a stand.
Where are the politicians who supported "One Scotland, Many Cultures", when they are needed to support the condemnation of this type of commentary?
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This is a FULL disgrace
Paul shun, I know Celtic are active behind the scenes on many items, as Peter Lawell told me at the AGM after I asked what celtic would do about the Rangers Big Jock Campaign
BUT BUT BUT
This is an absolute disgrace
Surely we should be condemning these things as and when they occur.
I honestly think Celtic need to appoint someone to a full time post to sort all this nonsense out and to INSTANTLY respond as and when they occur
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Cadizzy
Never had any dealings with this Hodgart..and don't really want to if that's the kind of language he likes to use.
As I wrote in my email to the SH, perhaps he is unaware of the perjorative nature of the phrase and has merely picked it up from the usage of others.
If so, then it is inconceivable that no one else who saw that page before going to press did not know the usage of the phrase and it's origins.
Bloke109
I've had the phrase used against me, and it wasn't used by other Catholics.
STANDING UP..agin them aw
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Daily Record a few years ago
10 things Du Wei cud do as he isnae a footballer
1) Bruce Lee Impersonator
I kid you not
Unbelieveable
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Inkybhoy,
What is your thoughts on the latest ABC figures for Scotland:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/apr/11/abcs.trinitymirror
Do you think the decline is somewhat offset will the growth on online sales? I see the Sunday Herald sells less than 50k copies. Would not be surprised in they have downsized to reduce costs.
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As I said ont he last thread I have a scanned copy of the article. Can't post just now but will around 6pm tonight if someone else hasn't before then.
Name is Kenny Hodgart and he is also so bold as to have his pretentious I'm-a-serious-high-brow-ground-breaking-journalist posing photo accompany the article.
He looks fairly young. Could pass for late 20s but any age up to round about the 40 mark.
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Think "towelhead" and you have an equivalent term that I doubt Mr Hodgart would use/be allowed to use.
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Just a wee point Paul.
While the Artmedia first leg was indeed a tactical disaster, the overall result, as the records show, was 4-5.
PedanticCFC
Hi Richie. You're not my alter-ego by any chance :)
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See the Sunday Herald article here. Then write to the editor and let him know your thoughts. And perhaps write to your local MP and priest, asking them too to publicly express their thoughts on the piece.
Another article considers the misperceptions of a large section of the Celtic "faithful" as to the failings of the team under Gordon Strachan.
So I ask you to consider a few questions:
Q: In the last 3 SPL seasons, which team has scored the most goals?
A: Celtic (231 to Rangers' 201, and no other team comes close)
Q: In the last 3 SPL seasons, which team has the best defence?
A: Celtic (93 conceded. Same as Rangers but 2 extra games played)
So over Gordon Strachan's tenure we have the best attacking record, the best defensive record, and have won more league titles than all the other teams put together.
Get off the man's back...
Hail Saint Gordon!
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Thommo - Heid Rattler
We're getting it from all sides these days but wur joost paranoid so wi ur.
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McManus69
Most newspaper are seeing declining sales figures. I think the Scottish Daily Mail or Mail on Sunday are doing better than most.
While most newspapers are trying to make money from online, they only make it from advertising, they don't actually charge for reading their website in the same way as you hand over cash at the newsagent.
The Sunday Herald has always had a relatively low circulation, it's a West of Scotland paper, but it probably has good demographics for advertisers.
In journalism terms, it's a poor paper, full of McChattering classes having a rant about something, although I think Iain McWhirter is one of the best political commentators in Scotland. Daily papers don't generally follow up the SH splash.
They had a round of redundancies earlier this year and are due to have another later this year. Newsquest, the company that owns the SH, the Herald and Evening Times is a cost cutting firm, very much based on it's American parent company model of newspaper ownership but I don't see how less staff let's rubbish like this guy Hodgart's phrase through.
It's just very poor and unprofessional journalism, coupled with a sectarian mindset on the part of some individuals.
STANDING UP
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WG,
As an aside, whilst down in Wales last week I tried a nice wee ale to the name of Brains SA (or Skull Attack to give its full moniker).
Seen it down there for years but never actually drank it - until last week.
Not bad at all, nice and smooth and flows down quite the thing.
At 4.7% decent without blowing you away after a few.
You tried this before? I've only ever seen it down there, but can't say that I have actively looked for it elsewhere.
HAIL! HAIL!
Token
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My view on the SH - dont buy it. It really is a terrible state of affairs when a Newspaper can resort to such terms
On the Strachan situation - the stats quoted by "bigchipsuk" is statistically correct
However when we play them on Wednesday they will set up 4/5/1 - no surprise and they will frustrate us
WE will set up 4/4/2 - no surprise and struggle to get behind them
This is the reason why Gordon has to move on he does not have the ability to change us tactically
I agree he has done "reasonable" in his time with us - but Celtic are biggr than just playing 4/4/2
For the record I will be cheering my head of for a Celtic win
I will never boo the players or the manager - but the reality is we have spoon fed them the treble
Hail Hail
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Token -
I've had a couple of Brains beers including SA in the past. The Teser has a Brains keg in the cellar which should be out over the next week or so, canny remember the name of it but will let you know this evening. I'm sure it's named after a man of the cloth - Walfrid's Sligo Slug or something.......
review of Wychwood's Mad Hatter when I get home then more tonight, Last Night of The Hops
WychwoodGoblin
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Token -
for clarification, I've had Brains in Cardiff (always - in fact it's the only city I've seen Brains and NAFOS in the same room !)and ML2 (occasionally as a guest ale in Teser)
WelshdraGon
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Whilst we're at it, I think it's time for the club to end its silence on the BJK bile.
I was witness to a series of e-mails involving a female friend of mine with no interest in football which really hit it home to me.
In the course of forwarding whatever funny joke anecdote was in the body of the e-mail, an intellectual giant from dark-side the dark side had slipped in a reference to 'BJK'.
When asked by one of her friends what this referred to her reply was "I'm not sure. All I know is its to do with a paedophile football manager".
MUD STICKS
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BigChipSuk
Thanks for the link.
Like others I find it hard to believe that such an obviously insulting piece made it to print - would be hard enough to get your head around if it had appeared in 1 of the notorious "Red Tops"- but in a supposedly "quality" paper???
BTW - my local MP is -Ian Paisley ....... but I might fire off a letter and copy of this to my Priest!!
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As much as the Sunday Herald article was inappropriate, the sentiment or the bones of what the journalist in question was trying to make is fairly accurate. Unfortunately The Club has more bigots than it thinks amongst its support as we have witnessed in Gordon Strachan's heavily scrutinised 3 year tenure at Celtic. Even when Strachan won us League titles there was still an element of our support who accepted success grudgingly because of who was at the helm.
Personally i think it's time to find a replacement for Strachan at the end of this season, but that is based solely on what his team is serving up on the park every week.
Had we seen the starting 11 at Fir Park yesterday accompanied by Balde in Defence from January onwards, i'm convinced we would be looking at three in a row.
Get intae them on Wednesday!
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I think the time has come for Celtic Football Club to begin taking these people to task once and for all.
We have one of two things in this sick, twisted little country. We either have the poorest standard of journalism and editing in the whole of the Western World, or we have the most biased.
Neither bodes well.
One of the posters earlier, in his e-mail to The Sunday Herald, offered them an out amongst his condemnation. Whilst I salute the common decency of the effort, I will say offering them an excuse is more than I would have done.
Traynor used that excuse after the Rangers game, to defend the disgraceful sub-editor who printed the Big Jock Crew slur. Before that it was used by the moron on Real Radio who used the phrase live on the air. Are we to accept the same excuse again?
I repeat: we either have the worst standards of journalism in the Western World or a biased media. If it is the former, then truly there is an excuse for why they have continually written such slurs, but no excuse for why they keep their jobs. Are we to believe these three half-wits are amongst what I would surmise is less than one fiftyth of the population in genuinley NOT knowing what these things mean?
This guy has chosen to write on the state of mind of the Celtic support, so he obviously has some conception of what the phrase means. Therefore, he has utterly no excuse at all.
He isn't a great journalist. I've read the piece, and I can say that with my critical eye. But to suggest he is ignorant as well as merely a bad writer is to give him a get-out he does not deserve.
He is a bigot. A sectarian bigot. Remember the face. Remember the name. This man has made his position clear vis-a-vis our fans and our club. He has sought some measure of notoriety, and I daresay there is not a Rangers bar in the land where he will not be welcome and bought drinks by all and sundry.
That's the reward of his fame.
It is up to Celtic to assure there is a price for it too. For far too long our club has allowed slanders like this to continue, without a response from us.
But we DO have power. The club could deny these papers access to our players and staff. They could ban advertising in them, or for them. They could give exclusives to their main rivals and thereby drive them to the wall. Those fans who own companies who do business with these papers could do likewise, because NOT to do it is to support the very people who are waging war on our club.
Too harsh? I don't think so. Do any of you remember a time when it was quite so bald and in your face? Can any of you remember when our rivals were quite so open in their hatred? From the SFA heirarchy to the copy editors in the press ....... our rivals are coming after us.
If the club does not start to act in a way which is visible AND effective, how long until the next outrage? Days? Weeks? Certainly it will not be months, because their boldness is growing.
I am furious right now, as you can tell. Furious. Not simply with the sectarian swine who wrote this and his bigots amongst the editorial staff and upper management of the paper, but at the people who are STILL allowing them to get away with this.
Celtic FC.
Their stance has gotten more militant over the last year; indeed, the last few cases, Caption-Gate and the UEFA complaint, have been dealt with on the official website.
But harsher measures are needed. They are upping the stakes.
So now must we.
Hail Hail ..... Brothers In Arms !
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From Zoom People Info:
Kenny Hodgart lives in Glasgow where he works as Glasgow nightclubs editor for the List Magazine and freelances where he can, having produced work for The Herald, BBC Scotland and The Aberdeen FC matchday programme.
He recently completed an M.Litt in Journalism and hopes to amuse himself over the next few years by writing features, visiting some nice foreign places, and getting into documentary production. Besides much else, he has written about film production, sport, visual art, music and booze, while his reviewing hat has clouded his judgement on many a film, gig, restaurant, cattle show, you name it. The boys at Future Movies agree that Kenny was a leading light in their film studies degree class at Glasgow University, where he also studied Scottish Literature. He claims to be an expert on little, but admits to knowing a bit about Scottish film, has ‘dabbled' in film theory and loves Italian cinema.
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WG,
I knew Brains was a Cardiff-based brewery, just didn't know if it was marketed outside the Principality.
:-) re the NAFOS comment.
Not seen or heard much of him recently since Cheltenham. Is he in hiding after losing his tuppence per race or just keeping a low profile (a Derren Brown-esque feat given Nafos' proportions!) in order to avoid buying a round as is his wont???
Cheers,
Token
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At 14/04/08 16:26, VargasShampoo said…
Had we seen the starting 11 at Fir Park yesterday accompanied by Balde in Defence from January onwards, i'm convinced we would be looking at three in a row.
I would hope so. We would have been playing with 12 men ;-)
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Just sent the following e-mail to my MSP, who also happens to be the depute First Minister:
I wonder if you saw an article by Kenny Hodgart in yesterday’s Sunday Herald regarding Gordon Strachan, the Celtic manager. The article discusses fans’ unhappiness with the manager and concludes by suggesting that: “"Some fans would probably rather have a bead-rattling Hoopy the Huddle Hound in the dug-out [than Gordon Strachan]."
A ‘bead rattler’, as I am sure you are aware, is a derogatory Scottish term for a Roman Catholic which mocks the traditional Rosary prayer.
I was astounded to see such a sectarian comment in a supposedly quality Scottish newspaper, and wondered whether you would raise the matter with the newspaper on my behalf? Surely in a country supposedly of many cultures there is no place for such pejorative language?
Will let y'all know what happens...
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So he works for List does he? As "nightclubs editor"?
Does anyone do business with this magazine, or know someone who does? If he's freelance the Herald will just try and palm it off - we should not let them though - so I think we should concentrate on who his full-time employers are.
We should find out if they know they have a bigot working for them, and make it clear a large and growing number of people likewise are aware of it.
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The Herald printed the article, James, so that makes the paper liable in my book. Whoever it came from, a frelancer or a permanent member of staff, they approvied it for publication.
Of course there's no harm in going after the journalist via another route too.
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Yeah as I said, they will try to use that excuse to slither off the hook, but Celtic must pursue them on the subject to assure this kind of thing never happens again.
They employ copy editors to read for things like slander and libel, and they employ fact-checkers to make sure what they print is accurate. No-one's going to tell me this got all the way through the system without being flagged.
I think it's up to the troops in the main to go after the journalist via another route.
Starting with his employers.
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Token -
hope to see NAFOs tonight although he has been an absentee from recent Monday Clubs, I will pass on your kind regards.
WG
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apart from anything else I wasn't aware that you needed to be a catholic to support Celtic.
Obviously outwith the 'family' nobody else realises this. They clearly think only catholics would support Celtic
How wrong they are
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WinningGemmell :-It's been good reading your beer updates, due to circumstances (tomorrow being monthly pension day) I haven't had the chance to sample as many as I'd like but you have given me a few names to look out for in future and a few to avoid.
TheTokenTim :- I agree about the Brains S.A I drink it whenever I'm in Wales (2 - 3) times a year. I can't say I'm impressed with the rest of the Brains line though it's nowhere as bad as Welsh Bitter, possibly the second worst draught I've tasted.
The worst being Federation Bitter which was the main beer in a few north of England working mens clubs.
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James Forrest,
Newspapers in Scotland don't employ copy editors and fact-checkers. although those terms are used in America.
generally, reporters or columnists file copy, desk editors read the copy, artists draw the pages and the copy is put on the page.
Production editors then get sub-editors to produce the pages in their final form.
Senior people should read the pages before they go to print, particularly to make sure there are no defamatory remarks against individuals. Defamation is the offence in Scots Law, not slander or libel which are English law constructs.
My point was not to give anyone, particularly Hodgart, an excuse, but to show that some people or person in influence on Saturday when they were producing the SH thought this was acceptable, when it's clearly not.
STANDING UP..pedantically, but let me assure you, I know what I'm talking about
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Winningemmell
Enjoy your Wychwood, they make nice Ales, they also brew Brakspear another Oxford beer. Wychwood and Brakspear are both now brewed in Witney, Oxfordshire home of one David Cameron. It is not that far away from where I am in Warwick. Enjoy the beer while you can as Marston PLC has just bought Wychwood Brewery on the 3rd April 2008. A shame for in the 10 years I have been living in the Midlands the I have watched the quality of Marston Pedegree go downhill and I have seen them take over other breweries and turn them into inferior ales from what they were once of.
Another good Oxfordshire Ale is Hook and Norton, near Banbury. Always have a skin full of Old Hooky when I attend the Fairport Convention Festival in Cropredy in August.
Tried a few different Ales on the weekend, there is a local brewery near Warwick in Alcester (pronounce Ulster) called Purity, the make Pure UBU and Pure Gold, they are both Pure P*sh. Too watery and weak avoid at all cost if you are into to flavourful Bitters.
Now I have bored most of the CQN long enough.
Real Ale Clique CSC
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inkybhoy:
You said it mate. Someone in that "loop" knew exactly what the connotations were and let it go.
But I want to say again, I am making no excuses, none at all, for the writer.
This is no ordinary halfwit. This is a bigot, pure and simple.
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Well ghuys and ghals, a sad evening approaches with the end of the fun-filled fiesta that has been the Real Ale Festival. However the reviews will continue till the Festivales have been drained.
I was in a bit of a quandary last night. Having been drinking pre-and-post-match I had to watch my intake at night with work on the horizon. So I settled for three pints (one on the house, one on Arthur Lee and one I had to pay for myself; still two out of three aint bad). The chosen ale was the lowest ABV of those on offer :
WYCHWOOD MAD HATTER 4.2% ABV
Wychwood Brewery, Oxfordshire. Est. 2000
From the programme:-
A blend of Cara and crystal malts provides a delicate red colour with a biscuit-malty fullness, combining with an intense hop-experience - for the slightly madder drinker.
Oh well at least I pass muster for the imbibing qualification!
I thought Wychwood was an older brewery as their products have been in our face constantly since they took off. They exploded on the scene thanks to careful marketing, clever advertising, weird brand names, colourful, attractive labelling and bottling. They never miss a trick, drawing us in with scary monsters, T-shirts, outsize bottles and a succession of seasonal and occasional brews - they go particularly big on Hallowe'en and Christmas editions which is great.
Except......
I think all the beers taste similar, be it Goliath, Hobgoblin, whatever. I also feel they understate the ABV of their beers. All of them taste strong to me, maybe its the hop combinations. Hatter had a combo of Fuggles, Goldings and Northdown.
I enjoyed Mad Hatter but I couldn't do the Wychwood Challenge.
WG
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hey narrowboat
Don't knock the Marstons and my home town.
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Cheers narrowbhoat, what do you think of The Wishy Wychwood Verdict ?
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TheLeftWinger,
Thanks for that. He sounds like a right t0553r. Wants to get into "documentary production" eh?
Hope he ends up working with me. I'll have him fetching my iced-frappe-mochaccinos and driving the talent backwards and forwards to some God-forsaken moor in the middle of nowhere every day.
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also Narrowboat I think Marstons was taken over itself by Mitchells and Butler.
My brewing home was in my opinion destroyed by the Tories and their monopolies and mergers commission that lead to the sale of pubs owned by brewers. This has lead to the rise of great noisy caverns of pubs and the end to landlords who know how to keep beer.
Pedigree being one of the most difficult to keep.
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James Forrest,
Agree. The writer's a bigot, but obviously someone else is also a bigot.
So if you get rid of the writer, there are still other bigots in situ.
It's a bit more systemic or institutionalised bigotry that I'm referring to.
STANDING UP..
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Hence my original post. The club, as an institution, has to be tackling these people head-on.
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WG,
please do pass on my best to NAFOS.
Also can you ask him (assuming he joins you that is) if I can expect to bump into his not inconsiderable frame at Ayr this Friday, as per the last 2 years on Pre-National Friday???
If he is going, tell him if he is lucky I will buy him a pint as I know there is no chance he will buy me one :-)
Cheers
Token
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Usually I just ignore all the media nonsense that is spouted about our great club. Living out of Scotland opens ones eyes to different cultures and beliefs and allows you to keep the often parochial views expressed back home in check.
With reference to the Nakamura banner shown on national and unforunately international TV, I find this an embarrasment to our Nation. How anyone in their right mind could construe this to be amusing beggars belief. What on earth are Rangers FC doing about this? To do nothing condones the message and encourages similar behavioural traits amongst the rest of their following. Their crusade against one of the greatest Celts (and Scots)in living memory is further example of the pond life that frequents Ibrox. As I said, an embarrassment to our Nation.
The article in the Herald is yet another media attack on our club and what THEY believe we represent from a religious perspective. I personally have no religious axe to grind but in this day and age, how can a National newspaper get away with printing this #@$%@.
Look out for more news on Boruc's imminent departure this week along with other exclusive's before the game on Wednesday.
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mncelt
i am waiting for the all out campaign to have the season extended "for the good of scottish football" expect this onslaught after we hammer them on wednesday
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I'm Catholic, a Celtic supporter......yet i understood the context and 'tounge in cheek' manner in which the statement was made. In my opinion there are many on this board who are in danger of falling into the PC mindset which has unfortunatley befallen the blacks and muslims of this country..eg. being offended by christmas, tribunals of employment on account of race, Police scars to tackle blach crime because of the 'racism' stigma etc etc. I do of course recognise the right of others to be offended but is it correct to label someone a bigot in this case. I might call someone a b****** but its who i say it in relation to the offence caused..are we being too precious...i don't know
Cheers
SB
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Apologies for the attrocious spelling in my last post.
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Token (will do re Ayr) & Other Real Ale Cliquers -
that Brains beer hidden in The Teser cellar is called The Rev. James 4.5% ABV
narrowbhoat - Old Hooky's an established favourite, John McPhail ?
WG
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soldierbhoy:
You are a bigger man than the writer. No doubt. But as to your general point, this has offended a huge number of people, as I believe was the intention. It has made the writer a temporary household name, as I am certain was also part of the intention, and I believe the people who are outraged, both on here and elsewhere, are absolutely right to be.
The excuse of "tongue-in-cheek" would simply not wash if those comments had been applied to any other social or especially religious grouping.
Do I think it's correct to label the writer a bigot?
Absolutely. One hundred percent.
Cause that's what he is.
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soldierbhoy,
I agree that there is a lot of PC nonsense about these days, and that representatives of some minorities in this country do need to face some harsh truths, rather than always playing the "persecution" card. I also agree that we as a set of fans can occasionally jump on the offended bus a bit too quickly...
However, in this case I think the term used was really quite offensive to Catholics and should not have been used.
The fact that the term is common amongst the moronic elelment of the Rangers support clearly shows where the "writer" is coming from; the fact that it was published by a supposedly "qulaity newspaper" in this day and age really surprises me.
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Oh my god!
Having read the article from the link kindly posted above, I am totally gobsmacked by the sheer sectarianism of the comments.
I would like to see celtic fc make a press release on this, it's time to tell it like it is in the fashion of Mr Galloway.
If a journalist in the North of Ireland made as blatant a sectarian comment like that then there would be an almighty uproar from politicians and clergy alike.
That is totally unbelievable and more importantly, unacceptable.
That "journalist" should be given his p45 along with the "editor".
Scandalous.
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Wg
Very impressive with the Wishy Wychwood reviews you could write for the Good Beer Guide for Tims. Now there's an ideal career movement.
Pastyface
Agree with you about pubs and landlords that don't know how to keep a pint. When I find a pub where the landlord knows how to keep a cellar I tend to frequent it till they move on.
I know Marston took over Banks in Wolverhamption which I use to like a pint off but it was never the same after the take over. Likewise M&B went strictly into the pub business owning amongst others O'Neills. You don't see M&B ales around here anymore (I don't think they make it anymore), the last I heard the brewing of M&B Ales left the Midlands and was brewed in Wales.
Is Whitney Ox your home town?
Black Country Beers CSC
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soldierbhoy,
Had the writer used a phrase such as "towel head" in a similarly "tongue in cheek" way what would have been the result? PC mock ourtrage or geniune concern at bigotry?
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Oh, and Inkybhoy... from above...
Agree on the McChattering classes crticism of the SH. But Iain MacWhirter? Good political columnist?
Seems to me he just rewrites Alex Salmond's press releases these days!
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I have been getting increasingly disillusioned with the Herald and SH for some time for it's football and other coverage but this latest insult is just too much. I will miss Iain MacWhirter, Tom Sheilds (I hope he doesn't remain silent on this) and Alan Taylor but I will not be buying these publications any more. I was brought up a catholic but am no longer a believer and I am insulted on my own behalf as well as that of those who still believe. The bigots don't differentiate between the two. I will be emailing the Herald when I have calmed down enough to be coherent and I will copy in my old school friend Torcuil Crichton who is a columnist (and a good one) with the SH.
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Narrowboat
crickey no, Burton upon Trent the home of brewing
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mcnelt
can you tell us more on Boruc and the exclusives??
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Italiabhoy are you George Foulkes? He was coming out with this claptrap the other day. Mr McWhirter has only ever been a member of one political party and it isn't the SNP!
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Soldierbhoy (excellent name btw) - I agree bigot is the wrong term. Bigot would indicate they are intelligent enough to have considered things from more than one position and we all know that is highly unlikely.
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My feeling is mixed although i'm not offended by the article i can see why it might offend others. However, the actual thrust of the article i actually agree with!! Increasingly, over the last say 5 years there has been an increase in what i would call ignorants and intolerants at CP. Now they would call themselves hardcore Celtic fans, the heartbeat of the club but their passion for celtic belies a more sinister belief. Those of you who follow celtic know what and who i'm talking about and the recent defeats have only amplified their voice. I guess my point is that i hate a hypocrite. By the way any reference to George Galloway makes me sick the man is a grotesque self promoter who will latch onto anything.
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hello all,
cannot believe this was allowed to go to print, someone posted earlier in the thread a link to a kenny hodgart on facebook.
If you are in the glasgow network, i am, you can view his full profile.It is definitely the same one (check the photos), anyway, one of his interests is Aberdeen Football Club. Going by other messages to him, he appears to be freelance.
Go on, log on to facebook and leave him a wee message.
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dalgety...
I attended an event in Edinburgh a wee while ago at which IMW "interviewed" Salmond. It was one of the most toe-curling performances from a professional journalist I have ever seen. Jim White and Brian Laudrup springs to mind...
His columns since then have been notable only for their complete lack of scrutiny of anything AS does.
I am not partisan myself, and will happily listen to the arguments of all the parties, but I know propaganda when I see it and as far as I can see this journalist is effectively engaged in spin on behalf of the executive (or government whatever they are called these days.)
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The perception of Celtic as a Catholic club is counter productive and the board should be trying to distance the football club from being identified as such.
A positive club-funded media program should be put in place to promote the inclusiveness of the club, this could take the form of advert space on sports channels, Internet, etc.
IMHO religion of any sort has no place in football full stop, the idea for a sporting club may have come from a Catholic but the aim of this club was not to be for Catholics only, but rather to help alleviate poverty.
On the BJK story, I think that this is bordering on a legal knife-edge, it could be argued that this is a libel case, If I was on the board of Celtic I would be investing some of the profits that have been made into a series of legal cases against the idiots who display these banners or peddle this mis-information, in fact the Daily record should have been sued under libel laws for their BJ crew headline, as libel covers not just the actual words written but also the inference of the words. I believe that up to £250,000 can be awarded in libel cases and it would only take a single precedence to open the floodgates.
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ticklingstick.
you can't libel the dead.
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Absolutley, tickling stick...hear hear..
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Pastyface
The Home of Bass (not a fan gives me wind)you must of been weaned on the stuff.
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Italiabhoy,
I said he was the best political commentator in Scotland..there's not that many who have got anything worth saying.
At least he doesn't rattle out any press release handed out by the Labour party as so many journalists do.
Soldierbhoy
I think I can see what you're saying, but the fact remains that the use of that phrase is unacceptable in a mainstream media publication.
If you're happy to be called derogatory names by people who don't share your religion, in a 'tongue-in-cheek-it's-only-a-laugh' kind of way, then go right ahead, but I won't be joining you.
Don't make excuses for for them. Show a bit of self-respect basically
STANDING UP..give them a inch, and where will they stop?
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Excellent post Paul67.
Soldierbhoy, I do not agree that this was meant as tongue in cheek. This was a personal attack on all Celtic Fans who the creton believes do not agree that Gordon Strachan should be in charge of our team because he is not a die in the wool Catholic. I have no idea the religion of Gordon Strachan but it is of no concern to me and thousands more Celtic fans who are both religous or non-religous. What concerns me about our current manager or any past or future manager for that matter is that he is capable of doing a the job, entertains and wins trophies or at least puts out a team who will get to at the very least the semi stages of both competions and is there challenging for the league on the last day of the seasson.
Statements like this cretons that drag the name of our club and it's fans through the same thick disgusting mud that Rangers have been wallowing in since creation.
This disgusting example of a human being knew exactly what he was doing.
IT MOST CERTAINLY WAS NOT MEANT AS A JOKE>
I am a Celtic supporter and was brought in to this world a Catholic by my parents. Since I was able to think for myself I turned away from all things religous as I personally do not feel the need for a further controlling influence in my life. I do not hold anyone else's beliefs, religous or non-religous, against them in any way.
Thankfully 99% of Celtic fans and more importantly the club accept me without questioning my beliefs.
I do hold others choice of football club against them though, and always will.
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ItaliaBhoy,
I believe you can issue libel proceedings if the statements have an effect on the deceased family, friends or colleagues.
Could be wrong I am not a lawyer, I work for a living ;)
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oh yes, prefer Pedigree myself.
Bass as a brewer no longer exists its a tragedy. I haven't lived there for 15 years and the town has been decimated by the demise of beer. Huge Carling canning plant though - very attractive.
Coors own it now and they are closing the Museum - its an outrage I tell you
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Inkybhoy,
If you're happy to be called derogatory names by people who don't share your religion, in a 'tongue-in-cheek-it's-only-a-laugh' kind of way, then go right ahead, but I won't be joining you.
Don't make excuses for for them. Show a bit of self-respect basically
Nonsense... self respect, think again, use better wording...then i will see your point.
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Inkybhoy,
If you're happy to be called derogatory names by people who don't share your religion, in a 'tongue-in-cheek-it's-only-a-laugh' kind of way, then go right ahead, but I won't be joining you.
Don't make excuses for for them. Show a bit of self-respect basically
Nonsense... self respect, think again, use better wording...then i will see your point.
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Fine soldierbhoy, have it your way. Run along like a good little Uncle Tim
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I once had an excellent day in the Midlands when we went to the Cadbury works at Bournville for the tour in the morning and thent he Bass museum for the brewing tour in the afternoon.
I also spent 6 months working in an atmosphere of mutual verbal incomprehension in Redditch, roundabout capital of Europe and of course birthplace of Kerrang!CSC legend John Bonham.
I love to hear regional accents but the Black Country accent in its purest form must be the most difficult in the UK to decipher.
Oh, I think this SH article is a good oportunity for our Chairman to prove that he is fit for purpose.
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if the guy is free lance, then the herald will
sacrifice him and if enough people email
the newspaper thats what will should happen.
don't think i'll be leaving messages on his facebook
that would be turned against us and could be counter productive.
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One Scotland many cultures,Rock against Racism dont make me laugh.
The major prejudice problem in Scotland is anti Catholicism.
Its so deep rooted and long standing that the abuse of a Catholic footballer(Aiden McGeady)at Motherwell yesterday will go by without comment in our media.If you are black and receive similar treatment(Jason Scotland at Fir Park) cue the call for video evidence to weed out,much wringing of hands and false concern.
Its not that long ago Stuart Cosgrove and Tam Cowan used the term bead rattler on an almost weekly basis.Thats stopped they were quite comfortable using the term because the climate in this country made it acceptable.
Celtic do not do enough to represent the largest element of their support,Roman Catholics.
If i were the Celtic PR man i would adopt a zero tolerance approach to any sleight or racist/sectarian slur against us.
Motherwell fc should be told to identify and ban those bigots who abused Aiden.
The Herald should be told that a front page apology should be forth coming otherwise do not send your jounalsts anywhere near Celtic park.
'Bead rattler' is a complacent, unthinking,unfeeling manifistation of modern day anti Catholic bigotry.
mncelt a bigot only considers one view,his own.
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Sir Paul
You know pal... I have a good mind to stop right here... and say no more!
Why?
(I see that I have got you attention?)...
Because,my friend...you know that my answer, when asked for my opinion on how to react to the use of a Pejorative when referring to a Follower of Celtic, by a member of the Fourth Estate... is ALWAYS the same!
Fuggggggggggetttttttabbbbboutit!
I learned a long time ago.. I think the answer came to me on a rainy playground in Aberfeldy...
If ye ur Too Wee...
Take yer lumps...keep a Low,Low,Low,Low Profile.....and
Fuggggggggetttttttaboutit!
And whether ye agree or no...it disna chinge a thing.... fur
The Catholic Church... is aye the wee boy in the rain... getting the stuffin' kicked oot o' him in Aberfeldy....!
Do I need to go oan?
Na...
Listen, pal...
We kin dae NAETHIN' At Awe.... Naethin'.... that's it!
In the Scotland of today???...
We've nae Voice ...that wull staun up fur us....
We ure lonlier than the Lonely Linwood... Car Dealer!
The Catholic Church in Scotland..?
Is Clawless and Toothless... it is of Nae Account.
That again, is the Truth!
Ye still need convincin', I detect a gleam o' dubiety in yer 'ee.
Here is the Proof, Pal...
Example...I wull only give ye wan.. but, I could give ye are least Three Mair...
Imagine... if ye wull... or no wull...it is entirely up to you...this.....
An Article in the National.Scottish Press.....Referring, to a member of the Islamic Religion,
As a... RAG HEAD?
The main thrust of any Newspaper Account... is to get a.....
REACTION...from the reader!
A Nod of Approval....or... A Blaze of Indignation!
It matters not which....
As long as a Reaction is Obtained!
And what is a Guaranteed, Good as Gold.... Double Taker... than...
well?.... ye get the idea!
So.....
Look out lads.... here it comes again...
FUGGETTTTTABOOOTIT!
Kojo.
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Just caught the stuff about the Sunday Herald.
Can't say I am 100% surprised by this. Does Murray still have an interest in SMG?
I added the Herald group to the banned list when Donald Findlay was given a column in the sports section.
At present, the only rags allowed in the house are the Scottish Catholic Observer. Flourish and the Celtic View. If Bishop Conti isn't careful, Flourish might be banned as well.
ggh
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soldierbhoy...
re: inkybhoy's reply to you... you will soon find that failure to agree with the thrust of a main article on this site will sooner or later get you labelled an "Uncle Tim", a "Green Hun" and the like from those perhaps a little too eager to please our host.
Consider it a badge of honour...
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Italiabhoy,
I wasn't trying to please anybody.
Do we need to have a wee run through on the use of irony?
STANDING UP
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Brenlox, if we win this league it will be the greatest GIRUY to them in my lifetime.
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Pastyface that is an outrage what they done, I haven't been to Burton in years, another case of Neo-Liberalism policies ripping the tradition and heritage out of the country. Coors is an odious company that allegedly use to be a big backer of the KKK, I hate it when Celtic puts their brand on their shirt when touring the states.
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StanVargaS - I don't follow your rationale re the bigots among our support.
Were Wim Jansen, Dr. Jo, John Barnes, Davie Hay and Jock Stein "scrutinised" any less than WGS in their tenures? I would disagree. The Celtic manager's position is a highly pressurised post. Incidentally all the aforementioned are not "bead rattlers" which would suggest this particular criteria is not a high priority among Celtic supporters.
Did the press include PLG's propensity to "rattle beads" as a factor in the Ibrox lynch mob calling for his sacking? I don't remember that one coming up.
This particular article also has a thinly disguised dig at favourite target of the bigots Aiden McGeady who "proved himself to be amore astute individual than previously given credit for when he said...".
On what basis does this hack judge young Aiden to be "less than astute"? Choosing to play for the tattie muchers over Scotland?
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A google of the offender's name directs you to an article in today's Herald by the very man ! It always has been a rag masquerading as a broadsheet.
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Tony Bananas,
You're right, the comment on Aiden was terrible too. If this guy is the nightclub editor of The List it's fair to assume he doesn't have a regular contact with our players in the way that, say, Traynor and Chick Young do (and for all their faults, they are both- CY especially- on very good terms with a number of Celic players).
Therefore he is assuming Aiden is thick based on what... deciding not to play for Scotland?
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Narrowboat
it is. I still stand by my view that the Monopolies and Mergers commission telling brewers that they couldn't own pubs was the end for my town.
The place of my youth, pubs on every corner huge illuminated Bass signs guiding you home has been destroyed.
Coors are vile. The Carling brand is all they are interested in.
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Bead Rattling - what an insult to a minority which make up about 13% of Scotlands population.
The Club should BAN the Herald reporters from press releases/ conferences until a full apology is printed.
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He writes for the List ?
Is that @The List on the banned list as well now ?
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Terry O'Neill at 18.21
"The major prejudice problem in Scotland is anti Catholicism" Never were truer words uttered. Witness Artur Boruc and his caution.
The true irony is that this perceived, nay concocted story about Celtic fans not approving of Strachan because (and they generally refuse to be explicit) he's not a "Tim" is this - it exposes the the bigoted leanings not of the Celtic fans but of those who express these views about us.
Only today at work, I had a colleague suggest to me that there wouldn't be a problem if his name was Shaughnessy O'Brien. Of course the complete retort is to refer to Jock Stein. However, that opens up a whole new matter which further exposes the small-minded and bigoted character of the supposed "majority" in this country.
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I agree with who-ever said the club should employ some-one to "defend" ourselves from attacks via the media.
Can anyone in the know tell me if the club do take media bigotry to task,and is JR the lion he's made out to be?
If we bit when prodded it might stop,,,or just dont let their journos into Parkhead,deny them exclusives,interviews etc.
Fight fire with fire
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Kojo - couldn't disagree with you more when you say nothing will change...
If no-one takes a stand at each defamation of character, at each racist banner at each poorly disguised attack on Celtic things will change...
they will get WORSE.
If this bile is not challenged it quickly passes into the archives as HISTORICAL FACT...
CONVENTIONAL WISDOM...
MAINSTREAM ACCEPTANCE...
witness the comment from the young girl I referred to earlier, ignorant of football and its sectarian vagaries and minefields,...
"all I know is it's about some paedophile football manager"
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Paul 67, GUYS ,
Great site , been reading for a couple of months , this is my first post.
Before i even comment about the continual bias in the media (dont know about anyone else but comments like we have seen recently only fuel my pride in being a Celtic fan , they are out to get us because they cant be us)
I need a favour.My bro is on honeymoon in Bahamas and wants to see game on Wednesday .Any help with bars , TV or internet.Channel 67 doesnt do one off games does it?
Hail Hail
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Lads, If you feel agreived by the idiotic jounalism over The Herald and Sunday Herald, please do what i did and write to the Managing Editor of the publication.
I know a few folks over that way and i know for a FACT that due to english ownership they take any sloppy jounalism with a sectarian tone VERY seriously as they are not specifically bothered about sticking up for one side or the other.
Email this chap for a decent response.
barclay.mcbain@theherald.co.uk
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smc1888
i agree with what you say
what is JR doin about this?
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The club can't jump in every time something ugly is printed about it, sadly. We need to pick our battles. A wee word with the editor of the SH (which has the circulation and influence of two men and a dog anyway): that should be enough.
If it happens again, then make something bigger of it.
Re: the Jock Stein slur. My understanding is that the club have acted on the wishes of the Stein family not to make something of this. The press, with the exception of the DR a couple of weeks ago, have complied.
I'm sure if that positions changes you will get a fairly robust condemnation from the press on the whole affair.
At least I hope you would...
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DBBIA
If you live in the Carlisle area and you like real Ales and Beers you should try to find a pub that is owned by Oakwell Brewery. I know they have one in Carlisle I don't know the name of the pub but you would know them for they sell only their own Lagers, Acorn and Oakwell premium(brewed the German way I believe) and Barnsley Bitter and Old Tom Dark Mild. The Bitter goes for £1.55 and the Mild £1.45, the lagers are £1.75 and £1.85.
They have 30 what are called Community Pubs in the UK, one in Carlisle, as one beer fan site says "The brewery is owned by a somewhat secretive pub owning company, RBNB." I think they call them secretive because they do not have a website or e-mail address but one or two of their pubs have them though..
We have one in Warwick, excellent Beer and at a fantastic price. It would be well worth while the effort for you to find it.
Cheap Drinkers Clique CSC
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My dear,dear,dear friend... Tony Banannas
In order for things to change... one must have a RESPECTED and INFLUENTIAL, Vehicle, that is capable of VOICING ... For Change...on the behalf of the downtrodden.
As I IMPLIED, in my previous comments...
THE CATHOLIC CHURCH IN SCOTLAND,today... HAS NO VEHICLE THAT COULD USED FOR PROTEST!
If you can get one... then by all means
USE IT ....
But the problem is...
Where will one obtain this Friendly Advocate?
If one has no representitive in a Court battle... I shudder to think of one's chance of avoiding the verdict going against one.
The Catholic Church... IN SCOTLAND...
Does not have One Viable Entity of REPUTE... that will stand in it's CORNER!
Therefore,.........
the best course...the Only Course...
Is to spare one's blood pressure... and moral outrage and agitation .. and...
FUGGGGGGGGGETTTTTTTABOOOTIT!
Kojo.
yer pal...who knows how ye feel...
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Soldierboy
Had the article been a mainly humorous and light-hearted piece from a person with a reputation for fairness, then I would agree with you that some are more easily offended than others.However, the writer`s smug bias seeps out several times in his putrid attempt at journalism.
"it seems to be the emerging consensus" (that Strach will be off) he writes. "Seems to be"? Where is the evidence to support his statament?
Next, he talks of " our`resident comedian` as he (Gordon) is disdainfully referred to.`" by whom is he so referred to and if it is `disdainful` why does Hodgart(is he a character in Harry Potter?) feel the need to mention it?
He then follows this with a translation of `sections` (of the Celtic crowd) as representing the TOTAL Celtic support. A truly ridiculous conclusion anyway but look at the language he uses to support this assertion: "...the fact that Celtic supporters tend to think,INSOFAR AS THEY DO (ie think at all)with one mind" Look at the arguments on this site alon and he is saying we think with one mind!!!
Finally, he claims that some of us are arrogant enough to think that David Moyes might come to Celtic. Actually, he says that some have it "Lined up in their heads" that Moyes might come here.Naturally enough, he does not explain how he accessed the minds of these fans. Indeed, on two occasions,he is happy to make a statement then `prove` it by saying `probably` !!
So , Soldierboy, whilst agreeing that we shoulf be solid enough not to be offended, I feel we should be strong enough to confront bigotry when we see it.
Finally, do those who are unhappy with Strachan not now see what happens when we ,ie Celtic fans, show any disapproval of our team? It is immediately pounced upon by others and used againsts us.So, for the sake of the club, maybe we should purge our anger against the Hodgarts of his world and not on our manager and some of the players.
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"I saw you...Kenny Hodgart...being sectarian in the Sunday Herald... referring to kaffliks as "bead rattlers". Who you going to have a go at next Kenny, Islam or Judaism? Your colleagues on The List and the Sunday Herald must be so proud that you can get such a substantial reaction by using a wee bit of religious bigotry."
You know it makes sense...post that you saw Kenny too at The List
http://www.list.co.uk/i-saw-you/
I would also recommend that someone with big balls also makes a complaint to the police...he'd be sacked before next weekend's Sunday Herald....
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Liam*
Here here.
If you feel the need, let one of his top bosses know.
barclay.mcbain@theherald.co.uk
Enjoy.
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ahh dinky, barclay mcbain
a gentleman with a surname for a first name don't you just love it
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interesting exchange on radio snide
I could almost hear darryl clubfoot's veins coming through my wireless in his defence of a season extension for the good of scottish football.
Its our fault we are not playing the game, how dare us
If the fod beat fiorentina
Precedents will be set you had better believe it
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Emdy missing ML2 Legend, Cardinal Winning ?
He wouldn't have missed them.
Just a thought.
WinninGemmell
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If the season is extended for the sake of scottish football, could
celtic issue a vote of no confidence with the spl and sfa and take their case to eufa to try and gain entry to the english league
just rambling
medication please nurse
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wg
he always had a lot to say, trying to stop him was the problem right enough
BTW do I see another cleek forming with the cqn real beer drinkers
cleek
What about us lager louts
tennent's csc
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The List has to churn out a load of stuff for a little money.
They are forced to hire a load of fools.
They do however have a bright young even minded editorial team who I would think would be interested to hear your concerns.
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One Bobby Murdoch
Not sure if there is a venue on the Bahamas to watch the game. It is being replayed on Thursday on the Fox Soccer Channel at 8pm Eastern time.
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mickybhoy -
wee Gordon put you kestrel bhoys in your place
Ooh Ah Up The Real Ale
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Kojo - I fear you are near the mark re a lack of a spokesperson to defend the name of Celtic FC in the media i.e. THE REPUTATION OF THE CLUB we all hold so dear.
One wonders what role our chairman performs for his not insignificant salary?
The most effective weapon is to hit them in the pocket. Don't buy their rag. Don't phone their staged freakshow phoney pretensions at open debate.
Write to the editor or your MP/MSP. Elected representatives can be made to twitch if there is enough of a stirring among the peasants.
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mickybhoy,
Too many cliques about here these days!
teetotalcsc
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Back after years in the wilderness (ok, a month.)
Still haven't bot a tabloid in about 15 years, and not bot The Herald since Spiers left for The (London) Times. It's a very good read...
Shocking comment really - only in Scotland.
On to the footy - great result on Sunday, on an awful playing surface. Well really should be fined for the conditions (though they are working hard to honour one of our former sons at the end of the season, so perhaps that wouldn't be fitting.) What was WGS saying about the product in Scottish football recently? People will be laughing at picures from that game, as a result of the pitch. The SFA should step in an order them to sort it. Then again, the SFA should do quite a few things, and with Mensa man at the top, I don't see it happening. Still waiting for him to follow up his diving point. Went all quiet after Kevin Thompsons embarrassing display (and Kirk Broadfoot's.)
I'm annoyingly optimistic I know, but 3 points on Wednesday, and you start to test their bottle at least....they have some tough games coming up.
If someone can get an e-mail address of one of the Herald's senior managers, we could inundate them with complaints. A truly shocking statement from a national broadsheet.
I'm known as a bit of an arbitrator among friends and family, and I really tried to see what happened here from the journo's side. But I can't. I think he was trying to be smart, and borderline humourous. He failed. He insulted. He probably doesn't know much about rosary beads or what they represent, but thought he'd get a few titters from the more 'Established' readers.
Cheap shot young man. You have a lot of learning to do, including basic facts, tact and religious tolerance. You have shown no class whatsoever, and the only way to regain this would be to apologise. Can someone tell me if he does? I won't know otherwise...
Cheers
MMC
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I wouldn't be expecting Keith O'Brien to take umbrage, he's not Celtic-minded.
Now what's that supposed to mean ?
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Mickeybhoy
Are you a member of WGS favourite clique "The Devil Dog Kestral Lager Clique"
Winningemmell
"It's a big enough umbrage but it's always me that ends up getting wet"
Real Ale Massive CSC
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wg
my favourite song
Devil dug by marty robbins
remember the wishy school fire
I am positive it happened in the week before Mr Barr's buffet
hit town
It could have been St Aiden's but the time scale you mentioned puts st aidens earlier
was there a st elmos fire in wishy
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Paul -
The guy is so obviously a hun - it seems very strange him sticking up so strongly for a Celtic Manager.
As a matter of fact we`ve even had sir Wattie himself backing our manager to the hilt - you would think he would have enough on his plate going for four trophy`s!
Whatever next, chirpy Ally joining in or maybe the crowning glory - the horrible knight.
Maybe they are all really genuinely great guys!!! or maybe just maybe they have another motive..............
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My dear,dear,dear,dear friend.... Tony Banannas.
I am not being the 13th Guest by choice.
There is hard won knowledge behind my attitude and conviction.
The reasons that I have stated,in order to explain.... why, SILENCE and TOTAL DISREGARD are the best courses of action,in these kind of situations...which occur all too frequently...are given by me with the very best of intentions.
Those reasons,which I have given... are basically those that are behind... the deplored...by many Celtic fans...their Board's inaction.
I am referring to the Stoic Silence that has been adopted by the present Celticfc Administration, regarding former and present slurs and denigrations towards us, by our avowed enemies.
In short...I agree totally with the Board's... "Turn the other cheek", strategy.
One... if one is wise.... should never engage in a battle where the odds of being victorious... are so IMMUTABLY, stacked against one.
As in the present case.
Kojo.
yer pal... who repeats...I sympathise with yer frustration, but, nevertheless... Dr.Reid and Co..have chosen to be Wise, rather than Brave.
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Mickybhoy -
it could have been another school fire which passed me by. And there are two As in our AidAn.
Also - it was the steak pie wot dunnit.
Tragic event for all concerned and once again ML2 was on the world stage for all the wrong reasons.
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Teser it is, laters amigos.
Hail Hail
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When in 2003 the SPL brought forward the Ibrox clash to the Sunday following our Thursday uefa semi final against Boavista,Celtic were not even consulted.
I'll say it again Celtic were not consulted.
If the same safety considerations were applied as were put forward in 2003 we should have played Rangers yesterday.A night time game is always less preferable for the police than a Sunday lunch time.
Rangers coming back from Portugal to face Celtic at Parkhead,we couldn't have that,so safety was left on the shelf for someother time.
On yesterdays game that was a Celtic team playing like a Celtic team should.
Was delighted for Bary Robson committed man of the match performance.Donati seems to me to be the patsy for our misfiring midfield,i think Brown is the common weak link.
For me i would not be too perturbed if Donati partnered Robson on Weds instead of Paul Hartely.I feel he has a better range of passing than Paul and i do not believe he would let us down on Weds.
In saying that i thought Paul Hartely had a good game yesterday although at fault in the lead up to their equaliser.
Donatti has more guile and for that reason i'd play him.
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WE RECENTLY PASSED A LAW IN THE SCOTTISH PARLIMENT DEALING WITH THIS ISSUE.
Kojo,
completely disagree, the catholic society in scotland has in the last 100 years made great strides in gaining equality, we have an equality rule as statute. This was gained without as you say an influential vehicle. How ever the parishoners of the catholic church are, as a unit a rather large influential vehicle, for the last 50 years these parishoners have complained about our treatment and this has struck a chord with the more enlightened who have added to our plight which in turn has given us a louder voice.
ALL FROM NOTHING
Things only change when non-conformists are heard.
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Whilst I am astounded at the article and its "bead rattling " refeerences I am a little chastened when I consider that there will have been some offended by the article who would have been in complete agreement with the writer's "cantankerous wee ginger" comments. Remembering some of the bile that has appeared on this site from posters who should know better part of me tends to think if you can't take it back then don't dish it out or perhaps if you want the moral high ground start displaying the characteristics of one who deserves it.
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Whilst I am astounded at the article and its "bead rattling " refeerences I am a little chastened when I consider that there will have been some offended by the article who would have been in complete agreement with the writer's "cantankerous wee ginger" comments. Remembering some of the bile that has appeared on this site from posters who should know better part of me tends to think if you can't take it back then don't dish it out or perhaps if you want the moral high ground start displaying the characteristics of one who deserves it.
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Celtic tribute the media forgot
hail hail
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In the past month we have been subjected to the following :
Voodoo No Worky
Nakamura Ate My Dog
Big Jock Crew
and now Bead Rattlers.
This is also the season when a former Celtic player joked with his onscreen buddy about the victims of the potato famine.
Only in the case of the Big Jock slur have the club shown the balls to address these many attacks on our club, our culture and our very existence.
The Voodoo comment could be just about excused, it was an attempt at humour, banter even, although in poor taste.
The Nakamura banner defies belief, particularly as it's the Koreans who eat dogs not the Japanese, but then "they" all look the same don't they. What is worse ? The scum fans (hand selected and paid for by the club)who displayed the banner or the ITV commentary team who laughed and joked. Are we really back to the Love Thy Neighbour and Mind Your Language comedy days on ITV where racism is not only tolerated but encouraged.
Big Jock - well what do we expect from the Daily Record, any Celtic fan who buys or reads this paper or even uses it to wipe their a**e should be ashamed of themself.
Bead Rattlers - The Herald was a newspaper, it is now a propaganda piece for Murray, while it's only decent journalist leaves to get a proper job.
PSG are the subject of an investigation in France over slogans their fans used on a banner. It is time our club stood up and fought back, come on Dr Reid show us your so called tenacity doesnt just work on asylum seekers and the unfortunates.
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My dear,dear,dear,dear friend... Canamalar...
Nice to read you,pal... don't be a stranger.
Of course, you are indubitably correct... there is a law, and a very wise one.
Of this I have no doubt...also... a well intentioned one,at that..
However.........
A Law is only as EFFECTIVE...as it's ENFORCEMENT!
Is that not a truism?
No matter...
If a tree falls in the forrest and no one hears or sees, that event...
Will the Forrest Keeper, give a tinker's?
It comes back to what I have informed.
The Catholic Church in Scotland is
like a child who should be seen..by all means.. but should never be heard.
Why?
Because it has no PUBLIC, STRONG AND RESPECTED REPRESENTIVE BODY,on it's side... which will fight against any Injustice that is Perpetrated against the interests of the Catholic Church...
IN SCOTLAND!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Kojo.
yer pal... who likes ye more and more
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cardiff bhoy
agree 200%
wheres our leaders
why no-one taking ALL this to task?
confusedCSC
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WG - what's this about a school fire in Wishaw? Was is it in the 70s? My big Rangers supporting pal said their was a fire at a school (but not one he attended) and it just so happened that an overly officious teacher kept him back for some reason, and his poor mother (God rest her) was sick with worry that her wee boy hadn't returned home!
Peter (ML5-er but presently in ML2!)
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Terry, I had to read your comment twice
"For me I would not be too perturbed if Donati partnered Robson on Weds instead of Paul Hartely.......
Donati has more guile and for that reason i'd play him."
then look up the definition of "guile" in case I misunderstood before I replied.
GUILE = "clever but sometimes dishonest behavior that you use to deceive someone"
He has been deceiving me that he is a footballer for some time.:
Are we talking about the same Donati, the man who won't go for a 60/40 yet alone a 50/50. I just remembered recently that he was being pushed as a direct replacement for Neil Lennon when we signed him.............
I have never witnessed a more insipid Celtic midfielder in my life.
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Kojo,
what I'm trying to say is, the catholic church in scotland is its parishoners, and regardless of the establishment of the present scotland, as was 300 years ago when martyers were being made, the church has overcome great hurdles to get to here. This country is changing but it most definately is not changing because of indifferent reaction but, because of the outrages being highlighted to the embarassment of the establishment by simple folk, the churches weapon is the dignity of its parishoners, who in this case do not see any way of maintaining self respect in being silent about injustice.
canamalar who enjoys yer intercourse
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canamalar - "intercourse"? I think we should be told.
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Regrettably, have had to join the “infrequent posters” clique these days.
The SH business feels even more depressing from outwith Scotland. Depressing? Yes, that’s the word I would choose over others that come to mind too – such as infuriating, disgusting, etc., or even stunned. I love coming home whenever I can get the opportunity. If I fly up I even try to get a window seat so that I can indulge myself in the great views as the plane approaches. It’s good to come home, of course it is. But … you read stories like this and you just know that nothing will happen to the perpetrator, or it’ll be laughed off, or we’ll be told we’re being too sensitive … and it comes back to you that our wee country has exactly the same set of attitudes and prejudices as it had when I was a wee boy. That view and the pleasure it gives needs to be tempered by this reality.
I’m skim-reading other bloggers’ comments as they quite correctly wonder if a comparable remark making fun of, say, a Muslim symbol would ever be acceptable. Of course it wouldn’t and that is not, please, just a matter of political correctness. Here in this town we’ve learned something about institutional racism in recent years (although we still have a long way to go).
But, you know, there’s another dimension to this that I’ll bet you hasn’t occurred to this so-called journalist. Would it cross his mind that the bead-rattling reference might be just as offensive to the many Celtic fans who are not Catholic? We all know what’s implied by the phrase. Therefore it becomes not only a slur on Catholics and one RC religious practice among many, but also on those who support the club with passion yet profess no religious or denominational affiliation. And thus it emerges as a deliberate, calculated refusal to believe the club’s own clear policy of inclusivity and acceptance, regardless of racial or religious origin.
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Apparently our under 19s won 2-1 tonight against Aberdeen in the Youth Cup semi-final.
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tic-talk 19:10, agree with most what you say but, and this is a big BUT, why is do you believe there is a need for Celtic Fans not to criticise our team, manager, directors etc. publically.
I do not follow you reasoning that by not criticising our team or manager the press in this country will hold off in it's secterian bigotted attacks on our club and it's fans this season.
There is only 1 reason for this bile being spewed by the goat slaughtering, funny handshake madia in this country and that is the 80%'ers and the orders, or orange orders from above, not the fact that we are unhappy.
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Kojo,
one little twist to that would be that the establishmemnt will try to laugh off any embarassment as an embarassed parent with a naughty child, I will say it becomes more than embarassing when the child shows the bruises to all. The world is getting too small for the establishment to condone/encourage such behaviour, especially in the EU where it becomes the minority. This is a worry for them thus laws, yes they must enforce the laws but there is a higher authority being established and they know they need to get the house in order to be part of that community. Our day is at hand.
was intercourse a bit risque, hope its not misconscrewed as a language violation.
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Can I point out that The Herald and Sunday Herald are different papers? The SH is NOT a Sunday edition of The Herald so writing to the managing editor of the daily would be a waste of time - unless he specifically overseas all the titles in the group, which I very much doubt.
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MN Celt, thanks but he will need it live.He may have to settle for my impartial commentary from Jock Stein lower.
Hail Hail
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Very disapointed that the only Scotish paper I buy has joined the campain.
Ive always thought Michael Grant the Chief Football Writer/Editor had a decent and balanced view on things.
This hoggart buffoon actually came in to fill the slot occupied by Bob Sheilds, who did not hide his leanings, but hes managed to keep his job, he still writes within the newspaper.
If this Hoggart buffon is given the chance to go into print again this week I will be Sunday Paperless.
Great that we eventually get to play them at home on Wednesday 16 April 2008. I think the season whould have been so different if we had had a home game against them before we went to ipox the other week. Those games early in the season have a great influence in the season, 6-2 for instance.
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My dear,dear,dear,dear,friend... Canamalar.
I can offer no argument against what you have just written.
Everything that you have claimed regarding the legal rights and privileges that have been earned and hard won by the viable and vibrant Catholic community, in SCOTLAND.... are beyond dispute.
What I am saying.. and it appears... VERY BADLY!...is this....
The Catholic Community in Scotland, at the present time...it may change Tomorrow...who knows?..
Nevertheless, the Catholic Community, who are resident , in SCOTLAND...presently...
HAVE NO VOICE OF NOTE...And, more importantly.... Of POWER!!....
That is in existence at this time,IN SCOTLAND... who/which, has the ability to CHANGE THE WEIGHT OF PUBLIC OPINION, which is weighted ...VERY HEAVILY... Against the very Existence of Catholicism, in this day and age.
Pardon me, for my VERBOSITY..
But, I am doing my very best to make my stance on this sorry state of affairs...
AS CLEARLY , AS I CAN.
By all means...knock yourself out...in voicing your entitled protests against these,almost daily, terrible injustices that are being done against us... and in directing those protests, any shape or form that you personally choose.. it is your choice, and is a noble one.
I, on the other hand ....am of the opinion, that I make it a point of some note... to never partake in the flogging of deceased equines...
I have voiced those exact sentiments, in reference to other things, as well...very recently... but, I digress..
As a Don Quixote, I could never be.
I am more inclined to accept the role of Sancha Panza!
Yeah! The more I think about it... I would accept that role, in a NOO YOIK MINUTE!
Kojo.
yer pal....who likes ye a whole loat!
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Paul67
As you are aware you and I do not always see eye to eye...But...Cedit where credit is due.
Congratulations on an Excellent three dimensional piece. A new thread every 200 posts has clearly got your neuron paths fired up eh?
You have not only placed the achievements of GS in CONTEXT.....
Your thread said much about the culture of 21st century Scotland.
And dare I say....
The 21st century-support.
Three things that are not unrelated.
All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing.
AtTheVeryLeast....DoNotBuyOrVisitTheRagCSC
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My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear friend... Canamalar...
Your use of that word, was perfectly acceptable in expressing your feelings.
I am very well aware of its meaning,which is a very innocent one... when used in the context that you presented.
Have no fear in that respect,pal.
There is no way that I could ever misconstrue your sentiments, in this occasion.
Kojo.
yer pal... who likes ye.
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Sorry not to mention the numpty from The Herald, however I would like to predict that we will win 2-0 on Wednesday with Hinkel playing in a more advanced role. They are pretty predictable and will pack the midfield and Hinkel will push on to add to our four in the middle. Don't be surprised if he unleashes another 30 yarder, this time in the onion bag. I am as annoyed as the next man about the gutter press; we will not change it unless we stop purchasing their drivel.
Hinkel to score last and Hoops 2-0 229 to 1
Go on the Hoops, do your bit and we will do ours.
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One star more
can I point out that the said offender has written an article today on the Herald. Officially or not they are connected.
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Kojo,
I have to agree, there is no sinlgle catholic lobby with any power, over the establishment in scotland, however this new parliment thing is at the moment trying to establish a new heirarchy and will succeed, as it must if scotland is to join the globalisation acceleration. scotland has no choice if it wants to become prosperous in the new order that is the EU, therefore I will repeat our day is at hand and not as far away as some think. There are many more trials and tribulations ahead but we are making progress and showing intolerance to the article under discussion is the only way to go for natives in this one scotland. To do nothing as you advise is not an option except for those who condone the behaviour.
canamalar what is sometimes a wee bit confused by your advocation of inaction. but think yer good anyway.
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Kojo the Catholic church has no need to be our champion in this.
Two pronged attack
1st prong Celtic fc have a word with the Sunday Herald inform them that unless a fulsome apology is forthcoming,reporting privileges will be withdrawn.
2nd prong- us.
We overcome apathy and the comfort of the status quo and do as Dinky Diamond suggested email
barclay.mcbain@theherald.co.uk
You underestimate the power of Roman Catholics.
Although match delegate reports brought about the disciplinary procedures and subsequent fines by Uefa,it was intiated by a concerted campaign of fed up Catholics emailing UEFA and highlighting the billy boy blight that week in week out took place in the scottish game.
Delegates did not stumble by chance on to this.
These things should be challenged at every turn.
If you do not challenge you perpetuate.
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Kojo,
genuinely, cheers for the correct spelling, I've been makeing fool of myself on that for years and never been corrected.
My favorite saying is
every days a school day
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We should have learned from our own history. When the press demonized Fergus, and a lot of our fans fell for their nonsense and abused him, the same press used it as a stick to beat us with when it suited them. I see the same thing happening here. They have attacked our manager at every opportunity and sadly some of our fans have followed their lead. We will now see the mock horror from the press as they pretend they are defending him from our nasty ungrateful fans. Played for suckers AGAIN!....imo
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The best form of attack is to hit them in the pocket.
If the Sunday Herald think it appropriate to refer to a portion of the diverse Celtic support as bead-rattlers (!!!!!), then they can rattle the can for pennies.
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malceye
I didn't see his piece in The Herald today - is it connected?
Don't you think it is helpful to point people to the correct paper, rather than emailing the managing editor of the wrong title?
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making even eh, spelling, grammar and punctuation are only a couple of problems I have with english, counting isnt too good either eh :oD
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Wow Fred
I managed to reach the conclusion that WGS was not the man without any reference to the papers.
2+2 does not maketh 5
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One star,
totally agree. I was simply making the point that he writes freely for both.
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I have actually posted about the Sunday Herald before - the paper has previous form in the matter of sectarian attitudes:
Old Adam
For those who can't follow the link, this is an article from 2006 by James Macmillan, the composer, about a bunch of low-lifes from the Sunday Herald, lying, jeering etc.
As I told the unlamented Sean South a couple of weeks ago, I am, and proud to be, nil per cent catholic. My family turned against priests and St Gerard's school in Govan 80 years ago. But narrow and insulting sectarianism has to be jumped on very, very hard. Really, nothing less than a concerted effort by the club and all its supporters will do: straight away the people who published this ought to be forbidden any access to Celtic's premises and a public complaint made by the club to the Herald management.
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Are you surprised? Honestly, are you really surprised? Did you not think they were capable of this?
For those among you who claim membership of the Tartan Army, perhaps you should reconsider your choice. Do you really, honestly believe you're endorsing a nation where all voices are heard? One Scotland, many .... (insert as appropriate)
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The thing I find disgraceful in this article is that this bigot is inferring that in fact we are the bigots by demanding that we have a Catholic manager when it is this guy who has a problem. I am a practising Catholic and have always found the term offensive. I have always been proud of our Clubs traditions in not having an exclusive practise of employing people from one religion and I'm fed up of these guys who try and re-write history and think of us as a 'Catholic' Club. I don't want to seem too PC but it is just too easy for people in this Country to have a pop at Celtic and Catholics in general, knowing that they will most likely be beyond reproach. One Scotland, Many Cultures? Don't make me laugh.
As for Celtics reaction to this, I feel we should go at them with all guns blazing. All co-operation with both editions of the Hearld should be suspended pending a prominent apology in the paper. This kind of stuff has been going on for too long now.
Winning the League this year after all that has gone on will taste so ssssswwwwweeeeeeeeeeeeettttttttt!
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fred c. dobbs,
this may come as a surprise to you but my frustation with Gordon Strachan has come from our teams performances since beginning of December added to lack of visible guidance from Gordon Strachan. Gordon Strachan has yet to decide on his best midfield and strike partnership after 3 years and his constant tinkering has cost us valuable points.
One thing I do back Gordon Strachan on is his dealings with the press in this country. I like the disregard he has for them as they deserve no better. They should all be banned from CP for theforeseeable future until such time as they provide fair comment on our national sport.
If Celtic were to ban the press there would be the initial laughable mocking of the club, reported childishness of the attitude of the club in the rags and on T.V. But it would not take long for them to be honourable in their reporting in the future as without comment they would eventually have nothing to report and all those readers who still by the rags for gossip would stop buying. During this boycott of the press the club should also refuse access to quotes from the clubs Celtic View being used by these cretons.
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My dear,dear,dear,dear, friend... canamalar..
Many people claim this view, as well... so I am far from being original...when I say...
I am, who I am.
Everyone, is different...God made everything in this woild, to be unique unto itself...
There is nothing that Grows or Crawls or Walks or Swims or Flies...( Hiv ye left anything oot,there...pally?...ed)( I don't think so...but, I have no doot...I will soon find oot!)which is not unique to itself.
If ye can find two snaw-flakes that ur the same... ye could bust my argument, tae perdition ,of course...but somehow I dinna think ye wull be successful in that pursuit.
So, who are we to question why each of us should NOT THINK and Act...in the Exact same way?
We even Look different...We speak differently...oor Hair is different.. shall I go oan?
Now, right away....awe these differences, tell ye something ...right there, pal!
Does my explanation,as stated above... go at least a little way in assuaging yer curiosity, at my being of a different opinion,oan this subject, of which we are partaking in discussion and cyber discourse?
I hope it does... for that is all of the explanation concerning my behaviour in this matter, that I will offer.
Kojo.
yer pal....who likes ye.
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I believe in free speech. The guy at The Sunday Herald should be free to write what he likes.
I would go further and say Rangers fans should be able to sing what they like.
However, as I've stated before, in a fair and just society those indulging in this type of behaviour would be pushed to the margins of society.
A civilised country would make it known that such views are not acceptable and will not be tolerated: the guy at the Herald would never work again for another credible journal and Rangers would be playing in front of a handful of bigots in a pub league.
That journalists can write articles on "bead rattlers", the "Big Jock Crew" and the "Sign Of The Cross" with impunity and Rangers are touted as the country's "second largest institution" gives you an insight in to the kind of country we live in.
And people wonder why some of us couldn't give a toss about the national team!
It's open season on our Club and those who follow it. The best way to get it right up them is to stick together and do the business on the park.
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The straw the broke the.......
Paul67
I don't buy Sundays so had no idea of this gross insult. I firmly believe the Catholic Church is bigger than any institution in his country but it open season on the Cetlic community this year. One event after another.
Time for the club to make a statement I would suggest.
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Apologies if I missed a direct question, I’m on the road this week.
Welcome patmcgrathtakesapenalty.
Brenlox, comment deleted.
Welcome One Bobby Murdoch. Never a truer word has been left here; he was a very special man.
PjBHoynyc, putting the GS achievements in context was something I planned to do later, but this debate had been simmering below the surface and was due to come out eventually.
Gordon has had a dearth of support from those he needed it most, which is very disappointing, but enormous care should have been taken before this was attributed to a sectarian reason.
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Not sure how many "Kenny Hodgarts" there are in this best small country of ours. However, I note that such a named person left Kilwinning Academy in 1997. Now, if it is the same person the at least we know its not his fault, just his background ! Kilwinning indeed !
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Mornin Bhoy...
Apologies to anyone who took umbrage to my use of a AH quote yesterday...
Now i know what it feels like to be a Man Ure goalie...More TIC...
o1bhoy
lettermannlenoCSC
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Kevtic
absolutely.
Whatever we think of WGS, the media will try to win this league for the Rankers by hook or by crook.
Bring it on !
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TrueTim jr. joined us on Sunday afternoon. Young Ryan is fit and healthy and mother is well!
On other news:
During season 1995/96 Celtic were made to play four times on a Saturday following European ties the previous Thursday, and on each occassion they dropped points. Despite many protests at the time no help in moving the Saturday fixtures was offered, yet the following season when Hearts were faced with the same scenario, games following Thursday European ties were moved to a Sunday to allow their players more rest.
Then in season 1999/00, Hearts agreed to postpone a match to allow Rangers more preparation time for a European tie, and the SPL sanctioned the postponement. Yet when Rangers refused to return the favour to Hearts the following season the SPL insisted the game must go ahead as any postponement required the opposition club to agree.
Roll on to season 2002/03 and Celtic ask for a postponement of a match against Rangers following a UEFA Cup semi final. The SPL refuse citing the reason that there was a vote of 11-1 against Celtic's request. Days later the reason was offered that the Police did not want the game switched but that did not alter the fact that the SPL had voted against it in any case.
Then onto the current season and Rangers request postponement of a league game against Gretna. The SPL granted the postponement citing the reason that Gretna had agreed. Only days later Aberdeen were refused a postponement of a game against Motherwell. This time the SPL cited the reason that Motherwell had not agreed.
Parniod? Moi?
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My dear,dear,dear,dear friend.. TerryO
I was belabouring my point, that it is not the Catholic Church who should be our Champion... it was a Champion for the Catholic Church..which I was pointing out... which is, LACKING, in coming to its defense...
The Catholic Church and its practices is being disparaged... ALONG, with the Celtic Fan...
As those two things are NOT MUTUALLY EXCLUSIVE...although, some would
dispute this.
Nevertheless...as you have suggested, one can... as you say... promote a letter writing campaign to express our indignation... plus the other avenues to pursue and state our objections as you have suggested.
I would never counsel,otherwise..
What I am saying on these pages,is that no matter how much one voices his/her's objections in this sordid matter...which to be brutally frank, is easily identified as bordering on Anti Catholicism.
Go ahead with your plans, as stated,
I will back you to the hilt...
However....
We are still back to what I have claimed...
In Preventing further attacks...and they are, indeed, attacks....on the good name of Celticfc... and also, on the Catholic Church,as well...
as it is generally believed that being a Celticfc Supporter and a member of the Catholic Church are synonymous
All protests of the type that you have suggested will fall by the wayside...
For we need a...as you have sensibly described, the term...
A POWERFUL, INFLUENTIAL AND PUBLIC, CHAMPION... to carry our protests into the PUBLIC DOMAIN.
and at last reading... we do not possess one.
Kojo.
yer pal.. who always liked ye...and still does.
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Congratulations TrueTim...
Best of Health to Mother and young Ryan...
I like the name...My Grandmothers maiden name...
o1bhoy
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Moonbeams wet dreams,
I do see what you are saying, but as hoops fans we have all seen some poor teams led by managers who have won nothing for us (maybe not always entirely their fault) but have you ever heard our fans chant GTF to them? I Haven’t! SOME of our fans are influenced by the media in my opinion.
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I have caught a couple of beer posts as I started reading the comments today. A lot of mentions of Wychwood.
Is this recommended and can it be purchased in yer local Morrisons?
Anyone recommend some good Weissbiers too? Picked up a couple at the weekend, Franziskaner Hefe-Weissbier was one, I forget the other. In any case, they went down quite well, so looking to see what else is available.
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Стахановец
look for Dunkel Weisse Biers as well.
It is the same dark white beer and my favourite too.
The pub over at Templeton Business Centre has a few good ones but all else is a waste of time.
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7 giraffes, good Alloa beer. A microbrewery is better than no breweries at all !
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whitedog:
I will keep an eye out for it, I am sure Morrisons had more of the Franziskaner range so they should have the Dunkel version too.
Unfortunately I am never out near the business centre.
I think the other one I have unopened is Kapuziner or something. I'll save that for Wednesday. =)
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Paul, As one of the posters on here put it so well the other week,it might have been yourself, the established media is looking to shore up its readership by playing a Rangers ticket, even now actually writing as if they were true blues. It also shows that the Herald is following the Celtic debates on CQN, which may not be the only source in order to gauge the feelings of the GFITW.
What does the ordinary fan think of Strachan? I doubt they give him too much thought, we are happy go lucky bhoys after all, but great European nights will be in our collective consciousnesses. This season Celtic beat the existing European Champions. One of the greatest achievements by Scottish football yet it is being erased from the memories of the neutrals in football,but we will never forget it. Do we hear about it much, nah..nah... nah... but Alex McLeish at Birmingham makes all the news.
That is why CQN is so essential. We won't let them write our history.
SOsadScotlandCSC
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People should not be surprised at the attacks we coming under just now.
The huns have been suffering for seven years more or less.
Even the couple of titles they have won , were won at the last minute.
No time for that special group to lord it over all and sundry !
Their bile has been building up and is about to overflow - bog tome !
Should they get to Manchester - just watch how many "long time "
huns come crawling out of the woodwork ?
Manchester Police will be rattling their beads that they do not have to host 80-100,000 drunk huns in a city that they detest.
No to mention the little matter of the hooligan Red Army having given the hun a real doing in the CL.
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I want a new manager because the present one will never win another league while Smith is at Ibrox.
Its got hee-haw to do with religion. That doesnt enter the equation at Celtic.
Out of the scottish cup, at home, to a team thats usually been knocked out by Queens Park or Queen of the South.
Crap football, Crap signings, Crap substitutions, Crap post match statements.....
sorry I cant give this manager any more support.
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jbj
I think I know where you're coming from, but in the context of all, your sentence starting 'Manchester Police...' - could it maybe have been put slightly differently?
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I've never bought the Sunday Herald as I've always found it insular and parochial ( my father in law buys it -- thats where I've read it), but any pretence to serious journalism cannot stand up to such a shocking reference to "bead rattlers"
For the record as a lapsed Catholic I do not regard it as an insult to "my" religion as I dont have one.
As patmcgrathtakesapenalty said "Think "towelhead" and you have an equivalent term ..."
If the powers that be at the Sunday Herald were in any doubt as to the context in which the term "bead rattlers" is usually used all they had to do was google it.That would have told them all they need to know and would surely have been enough for it to be edited out.
The sheer arrogance and laziness in the assumption that being a Catholic is in any way a criterion for being the manager of Celtic is staggering or at least it would be if it werent so depressingly predictable.
TLWIO
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Why not just ban all press from CP and give the fans their news through 'the view'?
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Paul67,
Well done for highlighting this astonishing slur, i hope but don't expect Celtic FC will take some serious action on this one.
I think we have to realise there is a difference between down right bigoted slurs (of which there are many) and what could be described as banter.
Example, the article highlighted is bigoted without any shadow of doubt and deserves to be tackled, however, many are calling for uefa action against a rangers banner saying nakamura ate my dog. Where do you draw the line? Do you honestly think naka would lose any sleep over this? Do they the report us to uefa for singing about Charlie Adams sister. Do you think she'd be happy (if he even has one). The point is we all see that song as banter, i doubt she would.
There is plenty out there for us to deal with but we must not mump our gums about every single banner when there are more important issues as it only harms our points.
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Cuellar has won the Player of the Year award. Aiden voted young POTY.
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It was suggested earier that the Herald and Sunday Herald were separate entities and that they had different managing editors. I have no knowledge of their management sstructure but from what I know of newspapers I would not be surprised if this was a post overseeing both titles. They are however beyond dispute part of the same organisation. The parewnt company is Newsquest. The Managing Director is Paul Davidson and the Regional Director is Tim Blott. Newsquest is part of the American Gannet company. Interestingly Gannet have a body dedicated to good works called the Gannet Foundation which describes itself as follows:- "About the Gannett Foundation
The Gannett Foundation is a corporate foundation sponsored by Gannett Co., Inc. We give grants to organizations in the communities in which Gannett owns a daily newspaper or television station.
The Gannett Foundation’s mission: to invest in the future of the communities in which Gannett does business, and in the future of our industry.
We value projects that take a creative approach to fundamental issues such as education and neighborhood improvement, economic development, youth development, community problem-solving, assistance to disadvantaged people, environmental conservation and cultural enrichment.
Grants to journalism education and training projects are part of our media grants program." The bolding is my own addition.
If you wish to ask this worthy body what contribution their title in Scotland is making to these worthy aims email them here. foundation@gannet.com
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To add to Dick's post...
Smith Manager of the Year shocker, and to calm fears in a non-story, he is staying, gushes The Herald
