Peat ready to tackle Famine Song

podium

Sneaky

Eat my dust,Mr South Lanarkshire policeman.

very opportunistic if I do say so myself jinkys

Support Rangers........ moi ?

Paul 67

Do you think Peat is really gonna drive this through or is just just talk

Paul67

Great Article

What lengths do you believe the Authorities ( ie SPL SFA POLICE etc) are prepared to go to , to ensure this song will cease to be sung??

Hail Hail

Roccobhoy

Jinkysboy

Are you reading my mind?? :)

Glen

I thought also there may be a one year option - but would Celtic think that it is worthwhile to reject that kind of money. What would the return be if they did reject it as he doesnt last 90 mins, is missing for a week at a time when travelling and returns nakad, and doesnt have the influence of the last 2 years.

Does anyone have an argument against taking this kind of money for him?

.

Does Peat....Come From a BOG....

o1bhoy

Paul - They'll get my support when they do something about it. As the article says, the SPL discussed this LAST month. How long does it take to put agreed penalties in place for a blatant breach of the law ?

And to be honest with you, even if they really do something about it, it's only because of external pressure that they've done so.

I'll welcome any penalties given to that mob for their racist chants, but I won't praise an organisation that has only taken action because of extreme external pressure, and not because of their own moral standards.

With all this appearing today i have a we sneaky that the first minister has told them to do someting,we now have clubfoot of the herald commenting, some one has told them to do so...imho

Roccobhoy

Scary thought eh!

Mort

Congratulations - I hand over the baton to you willingly

Nigel

A podium is a fine start on the road to recovery. With the F1 season finishing next weekend its good to finish on a high.

But whos car are you in if Plod kept yours on saturday?

Jinkysboy

Scary indeed!!

Roccobhoy

I missed my usual position on the podium as I was on line getting that O2 Sim card sorted.

A sacrifice indeed - but as David Ginola said "your worth it"

Paul

Peat states "Obviously, it's got to be stamped out and we'll be having a meeting soon with the SPL and the police to see what we can do about it."

What do you think will be done about it?

..

David Ginola....Anagram....=

o1bhoy

ONly one thing will stop this rubbish - REAL ACTION and by that I mean points deductions so for my money that puts them on very few points because ALMOST EVERY game this nonsense has been dished out. If it only happened against Celtic then they could get away with saying it's an Old Firm problem, one's as bad as the other mantras would be valid in these people's mind but now with the singing it in a game against a wee club in Hamiltion Accies and one player in particular it must be points deductions.

Fines mean nothing and the paltry sums do nothing; this has been proven. POints deductions WILL have the desired effect but as we all know NO ONE is going to do this because it goes against establishment politics.

Jinksybhoy- I am in my F40 of course; a personal gift to me from the late, great Enzo himself.

I Nigel, the people's champ, cannot be constrained by the puny pygmy plod of the primeval p1sspot that is Lanarkshire[S].

They think they know a thing or two about the correct use of horsepower but they are sadly deluded. They need to stick to catching boy racers in chipped VW Golfs rather than trying to mix it with real drivers.

Actions speak louder than words.

The only way that this can be tackled is to deduct points from Glasgow Rangers. The regulations are already there. It just need somebody brave enough to invoke them.

It´s all very well the SFA saying that they are the appeals body so they can´t get directly involved but for the SPL and Lex Gold to state that they cannot punish the club because they are doing everything they can to eradicate it is a LIE.

It´s such a BIG LIE that I am a little surprised PAUL67 that you are using reverse child psychology here in the hope that they actually do something. Actions speak louder than words. Especially when those words are LIES

They have had many many chances to do something about it.The SFA, SPL, SRTRC, The BBC, Strathclyde police, every newspaper in Scotland and almost every sports journalist have sought to brush this sunder the carpet.

Glasgow Rangers have yet to condemn the song so how can Lex Gold concur that they have tried everything in their power. Have Rangers or Strathclydes finest ever identified and arrested anyone singing this illegal song ? Has the BBC or any media outlet publicised this ?

I think the answer is a big fat NO and the embarrassing sight of seeing the Scottish media line up to protect Kris Boyd at the same game is all we need to know.

This is George Peat getting in a jab after the Kris Boyd bout nothing more and nothing less. Peat was quick to intervene when summoned to Charlotte Square and to pooh pooh teh efforts made by the SPL on behalf of Rangers.

I think we should turn a blind eye and ear to this song for one season. Let it grow like a cancer amongst their support and at the first airing on the European stage then upload the material onto youtube and put pressure on UEFA to finally do something.

Jinkysboy

Cheers (Of course I,m worth it) Your a gentleman - Much appreciated indeed.

I wish I could say the same about that Bird in Manchester!! - As You know I,ve been sick since.

Perhaps your position on the podium is a sign of Where the Tic will finish in the Champs League Group.

OpTIMisticRocco CSC

Nigel

Glad to hear the cars fine tuned and the right tyres on this time.

Enjoy the Moet and good luck with the additional sponsorship this podium finish will bring

Jinkysboy

Aye ave got an argument against Naka doin one.
(albeit a selfish as mad as a bag a hammers one...)

I'll lose seeing the Hoops on my Bravia!
Koki aint big enough news to make SKYPerfecTV show the SPL.

So I say... who needs 7MIL (no chance thats the fee btw)
Davie in Japan needs to scare the neighbours weekly via a big telly

tbdJ

Roccobhoy

As you know I would settle for 2nd in the CL but even a podium 3rd place will suffice for me this season.

I hope its the signs of old age thats making you sick and not anything else.

Jinksy- I do not drive for money! I drive for glory and the love of my people!

I can tell you because I know you will not go blabbing to the gutterpress but a football team who shall be nameless[ but not shameless!] have allegedly started a 'racing team' and wanted me, the people's champ, to drive for them.

Nay, I said, never. Not in a million years. I would rather have' Nelson Piquet is God' tattooed on my forehead than betray my people.

tbdJ

I was wondrering what the transfer record in the J league is as didnt think it was anything like £7m - I thought maybe £2m.

The post earlier would indicate they see the marketing rites as a big factor in their desire to get Naka and that would seem to raise the stakes to get him early.

I sympathise with your predicament regards live SPL - get a skype phone and I will put my phone beside the wireless for you.

Nigel

Very unusual to find a man of principal in the high octane moneymaking machine that is F1.

The peoples champ indeed.

Gearge Peat is on a roll, it was just announced on talkSPORT that George Burley said that if Nasty Novo was illegible for Scotland he would pick him but George Peat has announced that he is totally against picking Nasty for Scotland. Has Winningemmell kidnapped Peat too?

jinkysboy

what a lovely offer... but of coarse if the deal did go down i'd be a channel 67 monkey.

being this side of things i am naturally SKYPE complient (i lurked with interest at the pre SKYPE clique conversations yesterday)

I will remember your very kind offer in the future when I wish to tune into Archie Fisher

BTW...

I think a big part of Naka's popularity is the fact that he is successful abroad - playing for a Champions League team.
Participating & scoring in massive worldwide exposed games.
This floats Japans boat.

All the above being lost upon a return to the J-League.

tbdJ

I am sorry I couldn't get to your little football tournament at the weekend. I completely forgot. I am sure Dennis will remind me next year...though he seems to have gone out for a rather long walk. I hope nothing has befallen him.

I always worried about Leon Brittan being in my Cabinet, you know. Very sinister looking, if I recall correctly.Even his own children knew better than to accept sweets from him.

Nigel Mansell = lane smelling

AnagramCSC

.

Is Naybuddi....Talkin 2 Me....

Sheena Easton.com

NBT

George Peat on SSN news saying he would not be in favour of Novo are anyone without a bloodline back to Grandparents being picked for Scotland.

tbdJ

Channel 67 may be a better bet indeed. Whats the cost of that in Japan?

o1 bhoy

I have been trying to come up with a David Ginola anagram but got nought so far

Just thought I'd share this pearl of wisdom with you all. I was browsing this new fangled internetty thing, and found this piece, by an American Academic named Philip Jenkins. It lets the reader know about how certain things are seen to be fair game.

The book itself, is called The New Anti-Catholicism, The Last Acceptable Prejudice. It is centred around the Catholic Church in the States, but could be just as easily be based here.

Here is an abstract of the work. Sorry it is a bit long, but please read. It sheds light on the way some people view the people of this faith.

"The New Anti-Catholicism" is a comprehensive, timely study of modern anti-Catholicism. Drawing on recent events while simultaneously mindful of history, Philip Jenkins makes a solid case that Roman Catholicism is subjected to a disproportionate amount of scrutiny, satire, and scorn in American life. The subject of some ugly anti-Catholic remarks myself, I impulsively bought this book as soon as I learned of its existence. What I found was not the polemical denunciation of anti-Catholic prejudice that I had craved (in order to feel vindicated) but rather a careful, erudite--at times sociological--study of anti-Catholicism which I ultimately found no less fascinating!
Chapters 2 and 3 (there are ten total) concern the history of American anti-Catholic bigotry. Consisting of largely classic nativist paranoia about anti-Catholicism, the history itself I found to be rather dry. But I stuck with it, and I'm glad I did. Understanding the history of the prejudice, Jenkins demonstrates, is necessary to understand anti-Catholicism as a whole. Indeed, many of the vicious ultraliberal attacks on the Church that we encounter today are strikingly similar to the ultraconservative bigotry of a century ago. The book picks up pace after Chapter 3, however, as Jenkins explores topics like gay and feminist anti-Catholicism, Catholicism and the news media, Catholics in art, Catholics in Movies & TV, the recent sex abuse scandal, and what he calls "Black Legends," distortions of Church history. The chapter on clerical sexual abuse is so engrossing that it is almost worth the price of the book by itself!

Throughout the book, Jenkins explores the definitional aspects of anti-Catholicism in addition to the topical aspects that I listed in the previous paragraph. He explains the difference (however slight) between anti-Catholicism and anti-clericalism. He notes that to spitefully disparage "the institution" of the Catholic Church, as opposed to "the members," is to practice de facto anti-Catholicism since, unlike other religions, the institution is so deeply central to the Roman Catholic faith itself. He also explains that "it is not anti-Catholic simply to assert that the Church's position on a given issue is dead wrong, nor that Bishop X or Cadinal Y is a monster or menace to the public good. ... It is quite a different matter [however] to say that some essential features of [Catholicism] give rise to evil or abuse and that the evil cannot be prevented without fundamentally changing the beliefs or practices of the religion." The author is a realist, not a sensationalist or somebody looking for controversy. Readers will be impressed with Jenkins.

It is important to note that Philip Jenkins himself, a distinguished professor of History and Religious Studies at Pennsylvania State University, is an Episcopalian. Indeed, he has no vested interest in defending Catholicism and doesn't hesitate to criticize the Church when the situation merits. But he calls on America to recognize that harmful anti-Catholic intolerance pervades popular culture in such a manner that would be unimaginable concerning Muslims, Jews, homosexuals, or blacks.

Margaret

Could never distinguish between Leaon Brittan And Roy Hattersley

Give my regards to the lovely Carol when you see her next.

A LIVID GONAD ?

WG

.

jinkysboy....

It Begins With Vag and Ends With Inal....

I'll Get Ma Parka.... ;o((((

o1bhoy

Jinkysboy, Carol? Oh dear! The name rings a bell but I can't quite place her. Dennis will know. He has a great memory for names. Roy Hattersley batted for the other side as far as I remember...(which is what a lot of people thought about Leon also!)

You Scottish people do not seem to like me very much. Did I do something to upset you?

o1 Bhoy

As your in OZ it must be - A Dingo valid

o1bhoy is this the anagram you are looking for

David Ginola = vagina dildo

Smutty CSC

Jinkysbhoy- the greatest day, of so many great days, in my life was when Pope John Paul came to visit the Ferrari team at Maranello.

I managed to spend some private time with him when I gave him a run on the test track in the F40- Faster! FASTER! He shouted- and afterwards he said to me- ' Nigel, Nige, you have everything- fame, money, beautiful women and even more beautiful motorcars- but the greatest thing you have is the love of the people, never forget that.

And I never have and never will.

someone once said I was a venomous, vindictive, spiteful, cruel child of Lucifer but I could never see how that was a proper anagram

Margaret

Im sure you are mistaken - the people of Scotland hold you in great esteem with many fond memories. Im sure on your eventual demise the nation will celebrate accordingly

I am sure that you remember the crowd at Hapden Park showing their support for your visit with the raising of the traditional welcoming red cards.

Last I saw young Carol she was in the Aussie Jungle - living with you and Dennis all those years she said it was just like home.

jinkysboy

one price fits all (I think?) for us non UK residents.

i've been told the high spec connection is well worth the extra yen.

However, (Kojo use a spellchecker will you!)
Being a mac enthusiast I will have to check with all concerned that the good ship will sail successfully into my port.

tbdJ

01 bhoy

invalid dago

tbdJ

I notice Mr Kojo posted on the last thread 30 minutes after new post.

Think he went to bed afterwards as he has been at the jigging again.

O.K. Guys... you have had yer fun..

Time tae drap this dangerous and prurient road.. that you are going doon...

I come oan here fur relaxation and interest..no fur tae be bothered wit' salacious stuff..

Right?

Right!

Kojo.

If Willie Haughey had any sense (and I believe he does) he will have had a clause written into his £3M sponsorship of the Scottish Cup that the SFA has to be an organisation that does all it can do to fight racism / sectarianism etc. Otherwise, Haughey (quite rightly) wouldnt want himself or his businesses associated with the SFA. I'm sure he would have mentioned this to Mr Salmond at the launch of the new sponsorship deal.

So once the contract is signed, Mr Haughey tunes into the Hamilton v Rangers game and hears TFS....he picks up the phone to Mr Peat and Mr Smith (and maybe Mr Salmond too) and reminds them that to keep their £3M they need to be an organisation that fights racism at all levels. There might also have been a reminder to Mr Salmond of what it would look like to his Homecoming campaign if a major sponsor pulled out due to a racism scandal.

Of course, this is all just guess work on my part....but the SFA have ignored songs from Rangers for over 100 years, why are they suddenly talking about it now?

Hello there, Leo here. I am sorry I could not make the five and sides at the weekend. Mum made me stay in and tidy my room.Thankfully, she still gave me my pocket money so I'm off out soon to buy some crazy bones and a can of Lilt.

Sorry...forgot to sign off in the traditional Celtic way

Hail hail hail

Kojo

do you look scary in the mirror?

I can only guess the reason for your "front foot stance" was the disappointments on the dance floor!

tbdJ

Narrowbhoat tim

the pub i was at on Friday was the horse and barge, Dalmuir. the band where called the wolfe clones..you can imagine....

Dalmuir emarald 10 year anniversary....

and a goodnight from me.

ZZzzzzz...

tbdJ

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend...Lubo1977

Your idea, as proposed is a fine one.

Howevahhhh..

You fail to realise real reason, why.. Willie Haughey, is sponsoring the Scottish Cup, in the Foist place.

The Reason?

Several, I am sure.. here is a smattering.

Besides, Outrageous Self Agrandisement, on the part of OOR WULLIE..

His Sponsorship is also done in the Hope that it will somehow ingratiate his Company with the General Public... to the effect that Oodles of Refridgeration Services, that ordinarily would not come his way..shall.

And..Finally....

To Secure a place for Mr.Haughey and his Company, in the Old Boys Network.

It would nevah be the intention of OOR WULLIE... to, Rock the Boat..if you pardon the expression, in the manner that you have proposed.

Na... Not OOR WULLIE~

Kojo.
yer pal..who likes ye.

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend...The Bhoy Dave.

Na..

When I say that I have "jist come in frae the jiggin'", is does not necessarily follow, that I have bin.... Dancin'.

Should you assume, that..then your assumption is wrang.

Kojo.
Yer pal.. who likes ye a loat.

Kojo - Dont mean to rain on your parade but your way off the mark regarding Mr Haughey trying to ingratiate his company with the public.

As an employee of said company, I must say that we DO NOT deal with any sort of domestic refrigeration or even commercial refrigeration services. We have a contract with a leading supermarket and that is the only people we do any work for. His company will see no extra income from this.

Hail Hail
Gogo

01bhoy.

Just been reading back over the last three days and noticed that PFAyr had a good lift of the football,reading how he managed to get said lift was very fortuitous indeed,I must remember the next time I meet him to rub his shoulder and see if it coveys some magical dust from his shoulder.

Glad to see that your still in good spirits yourself and hope that you get over for a couple of games,and maybe a day at the races,keep us up to date on your homecoming.

lubo1977,

my take on it is that Rangers football club believes that the SFA let them down badly over extension gate. I honestly believe that Mc Cullogh and Boyd have been encouraged to jack in the Scottish national setup.

George Burley has been under mimed at every possible point by Glasgow Rangers football club since it started seeking an extension to the SPL last season. The role played by the Scottish media especially the Daily Record connection has been scandalous.

Before George Burley had played a competitive match the knifes were out for him by the likes of Traynor. His bum chums Chic Young and Bill Leckie have also joined in the concerted effort. It is the work of hit men. His card was already marked. It has nothing personal to do with George Burley and everything to do with under miming George Peat and ESPECIALLY Gordon Smith....now that´s where its personal for all concerned. When the puppet starts to act out with the control of the puppeteer. Gordon Smith has been elevated to such a level of power within the Scottish game that his former hack friends are beside themselves with jealousy and this being Scotland they want "wee favours". The favour that was lost was extension gate.

Since then there has been lots of tit for tat recriminations going backward and forward. The Nacho Novo for Scotland campaign is just the last salvo from the Daily Rangers :-) to make life difficult for Messrs Peat and Smith and therefore by extension Burley.

When the SFA backed down last May they brought this upon themselves. Peat, Smith and Burley are having to fight against this concerted spiteful campaign. That it is their own kind (Rangers and former pundit buddies of Smith) is the only difficulty for them. They have forgotten their place in the scheme of things as fas as The Establishment is concerned but the dilemma they face is what is actually more important Rangers or Scotland ?

Both Peat and Smith find themselves caught between a rock and a hard place on this.

Peats salvo is a kick in the goolies for Murray and his poodles. He has effectively said no to Nacho Novo and publicised that he wanted to ban sine die Boyd for life. This is him getting them to back off and give the Scotland setup time to breathe and develop. Peat wants the pit bulls called off.

I dont see this one as being finished quite yet. The laptop loyal have already stated that Barry Ferguson will be fit to play against Argentina. Its a formality for Barry his next cap seemingly. He will be saying like Boyd that he has nothing to prove to anybody. WRONG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now that raises questions ?

Will he be fit enough ? Will he be good enough ? Will he be picked on merit? If picked in the squad will he even play ? Will he be given the captaincy ?

There´s a power struggle going on within the Scottish game and the SPL holds ALL the cards. I suspect Lex Gold to fold his cards. Lex a former Rangers player and long term serving civil servant is delighted that when the straws were pulled he never got George Peats straw.

As I say expect nothing but hot air until Rangers are in Europe. Also expect Rangers to sabotage any hopes that Scotland have with regards World Cup qualification.

Hail Hail

Hail HAil

There is one issue about the song that sums them up and why we as right minded individuals will always be better than them.

I love Celtic, everyone who reads the posts or contributes to the discussions here loves Celtic, I would never ever do anything that I though may cast a shadow over our great club. When Fergus launched The Bhoys Against Bigotry Campaign, riducled by Mr Moonbeams himself, there was a huge debate as we all know about the merits of his arguement. The ultimate point Fergus made was irrespective of what we as indiviudlas think of rebel songs they are perceived in some quarters as being a smirch on the Celtic principle of being open to all. They also gave our many enemies in the media a very easy stick to beat us with. This is not a comment on the songs themselves but merely summarises the issues as they were presented. So what did we do? We accepted that our great club is too important to be tarnished in any way.

Compare the difference, putting aside if possible that their song is rascist and deeply offensive, more so than anything ever sung at Parkhead or anywhere else where we have been on our travels, they are told their chant is disgusting and drags down further (if possible) their well deserved awful reputation, so what do they do? Rather than as we did decide our clubs name and principles mean far too much to be sullied and therefore abandon their rubbish they continue the filth, in fact they now seem to wallow in it, pigs in shit come to mind.

Yours in the moral high ground.

Greggsiebhoy

Good article again Paul-I find myself asking the question. Why now?
What would be your thoughts?
Is it political pressure?
Is it the fact that the venom was directed at a young player at the weekend who has nothing to do with Celtic? By that I mean they cannot use the old firm excuse.
Peat the SPL and SFA are now behind the 8 ball and will have to act.
Surely it can no longer be dismissed as banter by the FOD.
Maybe the police will bat it back to the SPL and ban the FOD fans from away ground to start with if that’s the easiest option- either way there should now be action on the issue.
It was good to meet you at the fives-well done to all it was a great day. Hopefully the next time the sun will be shinning.
Bob.

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend...

I bow to your inly knowledge concerning Mr. Haughey's business concerns.

Being ,as you are... an employee of this gentleman,your opinion in these matters must be respected.

If what you have stated is the case.. then...

What about the other reasons that I gave, regarding Mr. Haughey's intention to Sponsor The Scottish Cup?

Do they apply?

We have established, that he will accrue no financial Benefit from his generosity.

If none of the other reasons that I conjectured was behind his wonderful demonstration of Public Service...

Then...

Failing that none of My other Reasons, that I listed, apply to his benefaction...

Then....

That leaves...

The Unthinkable, in this day and age....

He is a DARNED ALTRUIST~

And, you know how I feel about Altruism?...

Or mebbe, ye dinna.

I firmly believe that the one and ONLY, Altruist... that evah,evah, lived...

Died oan a Cross..somewhere in Ole Palestine... Two Thousand Years Ago.

Kojo.
yer pal... who likes ye.

David Ginola......diving a load.

Sounds about right.

Just done some anagrams of Dado Prso........daren't put them on here.

TGITW continueth.....

R: Greater Manchester Police, Roxanne speaking, how may I help you ?

WG: Roxanne, it's WG, howzitgaun ?

R: I'm grand and I've got some good news for you.

WG: Excellent, any update on The Gay City Strollers ?

R: Yes, I managed to trace the Four Fivers. They were picked up by some uniforms who found them busking in the Trafford Centre.

WG: Whit ?

R: Apparently Arthur Lee lost their kitty money and Michel Pwatini confiscated their mobile phones.

WG: Why ever ?

R: The Badger videoed their Zadok The Priest performance and Pwatini complained that UEFA copyright had been infringed. Alexanderson had his security men confiscate the phones.

WG: That idiot has totally lost the place. Anyway where are the Four Fivers now? Ah'd imagine Hugh would have voluntarily signed himsel intae Strangeways.

R: I pulled a few strings, Winston. I managed to put four travel warrants together. Your pals should be in Wishaw by 7pm.

WG: Brilliant, Roxy - that's one I owe you. Anythin else doing in Mancunia ?

R: The top brass are concerned about the welfare of Lady Cafe Alexanderson. She's not been seen since Tuesday night. It would be a real feather in my cap if I could track her down.......

TBC

Following on from Aston Villa manager MONs statement that he fined John Carew for being in a lap dancing club on the morning of Villas UEFA match on Thursday - despite him having mitigating circumstances the Lap dancing cliub manager has been on SSN

" he wasnt even drinking alcohol - just relaxing with a beautiful girl - to be fined £100,000 for that is over the top"

2 questions -

how much over the top does he charge for the girl accompanying big John to relax

and would Mrs Jinx take those mitigating circumstances into account if it was me

Lub01977,

I forgot to add that Willie Haughey´s grandiose gesture with regards sponsoring the SC makes it harder for Peat and Smith to operate as they normally would.

UriahheepCSC

BIGITUPFORPeterLawlell&WillieHaugheyCSC

My last submission, was meant for ....my friend.. GoGo...

Great and wonderful Nomme de Blog, by the way..

I inadverently omitted the addressee in my submission..

Sorry about that...

"Ready, when you are, C.B.!"

A very Contrite ...

Kojo.

Jinky
I thought that part of the atttraction of these establishments was that nothing was over the top.

Ladybumps CSC

paul67

offences committed on 31/08/8 have been dealt with and punishment meated out (see THG
and his £500 light wallet)

or should i say offence dealt with, maybe your man George will come good in the end.

going by the delay and pass the parcel I have a feeling it will be fudged, and lumped in with republican songs, sang by our side.

whereas as we all know the racist issue will be missed.

National disgrace

Supporters drag Rangers through the mud again
Hamilton Academical 1 Rangers 3 Phil Gordon
What do Kris Boyd, Nacho Novo and James McCarthy have in common? None of them has any intention of pulling on a Scotland shirt. So, why was it only young McCarthy who had to suffer an afternoon of abuse that managed to drown out a howling gale at New Douglas Park on Saturday?

The oddest trio since The Thompson Twins each contributed to an occasion stained by the background noise that had its roots not in the Eighties, but the 1800s. The Rangers supporters yet again defied their own manager, Walter Smith, who has urged those who persist in The Famine Song to stop ignoring their club’s pleas to end the anti-Irish chanting.

Just days earlier, Smith had admitted his embarrassment in a newspaper interview by stating: “The truth is, there is still an aspect of sectarianism among a certain number of supporters.” No sooner had the words left his lips than the other words were being belted out by the mouths of the travelling support.

It has been that way all season – at Ibrox, too, since the issue arose. Almost as a mark of defiance. On Saturday, though, it took on a far more hostile tone, McCarthy having his every touch jeered because he recently refused to reverse his decision to play for Ireland, not Scotland.

Miller shrugs off jeering by Rangers fans
Rangers ask fans to help with protest
The teenage Glaswegian also had to put up with graphic visual demonstrations from the Rangers fans occupying two stands about what they thought of him, while his name was added to The Famine Song. No doubt some players view that sort of “stick” as proof that they are doing a good job if the opposition fans are wound up, but most Rangers fans would not recognise McCarthy in the street and some even mistook him for James McArthur, his midfield colleague, because they booed the Scotland Under21 player when his name was read out.

In an ugly atmosphere, the Hamilton fans – meek as church mice all season – actually stood up in support of McCarthy and chanted his name. The rancour spilled over into the main stand, where police spent most of the afternoon removing Rangers fans who had gone undercover, but who fell into dispute with the local season-ticket holders once Boyd cancelled out the lead provided by Hamilton’s Brian Easton.

Boyd scored either side of the interval to steer Rangers away from a potential upset. The claims that this was the striker’s way of “sticking up two fingers” to George Burley ignores one crucial fact: it was Boyd who severed his connection with Scotland, not the other way about. Is Boyd jeered by the Rangers support for this “unpatriotic” act? Not likely. At least McCarthy, whose touch and energy underlined why Giovanni Trapattoni is likely to give him his full debut for Ireland this month, has stuck with the country that first offered him the chance to play international football and capped him at four age levels.

Boyd’s reworking of the “Scottish till I die” mantra into “Scottish till I’m dropped” has taken on a peculiar oddity because of the supposed desire of Novo to play for Scotland. However, the difference between Novo and his colleague is that the Spaniard has shown a far thicker skin when it comes to being marginalised.

Despite everything he has done for Rangers in recent seasons, Novo is continually left on the bench. He was there again on Saturday, offered only a cameo role, but made the most of it by racing away after a blunder by Martin Canning to score a clinical goal that sealed his side’s comeback.

Burley, though, is unlikely to be pursuing McNacho now that he is free to take up British citizenship after living in Scotland for seven years for one simple reason – the player does not have a UK passport.

Boyd showed his customary ruthlessness in converting a 41st-minute penalty after Trent McLenahan pushed Kenny Miller, but even he was too sheepish to celebrate putting Rangers in front with a header in the 49th minute when television showed the striker clearly offside before he met Steven Davis’s cross.

“I have not liked hogging the headlines in the past few weeks but at least Nacho has taken the pressure off me now,” Boyd said. “I don’t have a point to prove to anyone except myself. As long as I keep going about it the way I did here, I’ll do all right. I knew when I made the Scotland decision I had to start again at club level.”

Poor Hamilton did not deserve a fifth successive defeat, or to slide to the bottom of the table, after the perfomance they put in. Billy Reid’s team adapted to the capricious wind far better than the visiting team, by keeping their passing game short, and a fine header from Easton, the left back, another of their home-grown youngsters, illustrated the club’s ethos.

Fascist Fascist going into meltdown. This one post sums them up really.

#2 25-10-2008, 17:58
Earl of Leven
True Blue Join Date: 07-08-2006
Posts: 19,056

Re: no racist abuse of McCarthy

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I cannot racially abuse another white Scotsman and I'd love to see them try and show how I could in court.

Lamartine

I have no idea whatsoever what goes on in these places.

Fair play to John Greechan in todays Daily Mail for highlighting the abuse of McCarthy and also for praising the Celtic fans at Manchester.

Kojo - Dont worry about the omission i'm just chuffed with my 6 "dear's"!! Get In.

On your other points....

Outrageous Self Agrandisement - I just cant see it, i've been in the Company of Mr Haughey a few times and doesn't come across as the type at all! (of course I may be wrong but just cant see it myself)

Old boys network - Well this is what I see when it comes to his sponsoring of the Scottish Cup. As you will know you get nothing for nothing in this world and its usually (read always) who you know instead of what you know. If someone is FINALLY willing to put up the much needed cash to sponsor the competition can we really expect them not to take advantage of any favours or help his new aquaintances may provide?

As with the football academy he was promising to build for the SFA it was all bundled up with a nice little house building project which (i hear) he wouldn't have been able to get planning permission for on its own. Now with the slump in house prices etc the plans for the academy have been shelved along with the housing project.

Gogo, yer pal who likes that ye gave him 6 dear's!!!

I'llscratchyourbackifyouscratchmineCSC

The sinister machinations of the Establishment in the T-Shirt Case indicate to me that they are going to proclaim the term "Hun" as sectarian, quoting the now set legal precedent as the justification.

If ever a defendant was stitched by the system, including his own counsel,it was that misguided lad.

Freemasonry in Action.

Incidentally, if it is true that the policeman made him remove the t-shirt and thereby revealing the Celtic top underneath, was he not placing the boy in greater danger, given the locale of a "stone's throw" from Ibrox?

What a rotten little country.

Henriks Sombrero

They are indeed a class act

blantyretim

A big Tim pub is "the Barge" saying that there are not too many Orc pubs in the Clydebank/Dalmuir area. The Wolfeclones are not my cousins band but "the Barge" is his sisters local.

hope you had a good night there but I wouldn't moor my narrowbhoat outside the pub.

mb1964

Greechan writes with more than a hint of sarcacsm

Kris Boyd's double, naturally, proved beyond a shadow of a doubt that Scotland manager George Burley had acted heinously in ignoring this prolific world-class striker - and should pay for that crime with instant dismissal.Because a penalty and a goal with just a hint of offside about it, against a team struggling at the wrong end of the SPL, is all the evidence some will ever need of Boyd's brilliance.

Nacho Novo getting the third? Well, that's bound to persuade Burley that this son of Spain should be called up for Scotland immediately. Yes, a day for creating new storms, after all.

Amid all of the on-field struggling and cheap-seat plotting, however, one figure did emerge with composure intact and reputation enhanced - no mean feat when you consider the weather. Kevin Thomson, a player denied to Burley by injury so far, turned in exactly the kind of performance demanded by the conditions.

MATTHEW LINDSAY of the evening times writes without a trace of irony

KRIS Boyd showed with his two goals against Hamilton at the weekend that he is too good a player not to be involved in the Scotland set-up.

For all his deficiencies as a player - and Boyd himself will be the first to admit he has a few - he has always known where the back of the net is.

His double at New Douglas Park took his tally for the season to six from seven starts. He is, without doubt, the deadliest finisher currently at our disposal.
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Yes, Kris is limited in other areas. Sure, he would struggle to lead the line by himself.

But the guy is, pure and simple, an out-and-out match winner.

Boyd's decision not to make himself available for selection for Scotland while George Burley is the manager was made in the heat of the moment.

Now some time has passed, though, the national coach should attempt to heal the rift with his disgruntled player.

It also shouldn´t be missed that the SFA have to beg Nacho Novo to play for them. This is the hacks way off getting a dig into the SFA. Lack of action. Stuck in their ivory towers , out of touch with reality etc. etc.

Just seen that the official attendance for saturdays match was 58,337.

Is someone having a laugh here?

Chico

Th official attendance includes all season tickets sold in addition to public sale - not how many actually turn up.

strange - but true

I think (therefore I am) that they and anyone else should be allowed to sing whatever they want. Eventually the world laughing at them will cause their ever increasingly purple raging cheeks to explode, or time will move on and the darkness of the devil's bosom will welcome them as Wily Coyote did when he eventually caught that flippin Road-runner!

Beep Beep now ya bigots!

Chico

We were discussing this on the way home on saturday - in ye olden Kelly / White days it was the opposite.

Crammed in like sardines and they would announce 36,275.

Ryan's second Daughter

That could be a banner one day

True Tim,

Thanks!

Timmy7 and Timmy7-Noted,

I am sure your keeper was really Inspector Gadget - those legs of his seemed to extend for ever!!!

HAIL! HAIL!
Token

Jinkysboy, if Peat was all talk, he would have said much less than he did. I’ve Peat’s chief critic in the past so think it fair to give credit when due.

WG, you know what I mean.

Roccobhoy, hang the dj, I expect arrests to be made and an already tarnished reputation to suffer.

Henriks Sombrero, Awe Naw, I know many will choose not to offer support, but I think we can see what we want to see in virtually any situation. The much maligned (by me and others) establishment are closing ranks on this one, but not in the way many predicted.

The high moral ground is there for anyone to claim it, but I think social change (and that is what we are talking about here) is more complex than many credit.

KrakowBhoy, I have not called for points to be deducted, not least of all because I sincerely hope that our league is forever decided on the field of play. This sanction is a last step, not something to be used early.

Arrests, refusal of tickets, loss of reputation, fines, closure of stands all come before tampering with the league table.

Celtic Bob, why now is a good question. I can offer several reasons:

Momentum has been building since 2004; this is not the kind of exercise that was ever going to spontaneously erupt from the SFA without the ball already rolling.

Actions following their visit to CP in August have been measured; well defined complaints have been made through the appropriate channels.

The police have expressed a firm view on the subject.

Despite all of this, the trouble persists. A significant number of Rangers fans are prepared for confrontation on this subject, irrespective of the damage it does to their club. A significant number amount ‘the establishment’ are prepared to take them on.

Contrast the atmosphere surrounding this matter now with the article we read from andycol last week, where Show Racism the Red Card were far from engaging on this very subject. Coming out in support of action on this is becoming easier by the week.

This will not end well for Rangers.

Kojo, the aforementioned Scottish Cup benefactor had no intention of sponsoring the tournament. His donation to youth development was already pledged and reported. I understand..... that a chief exec suggested this money be taken as a sponsorship, which the donator declined. After this, he was asked if the sponsorship could be passed to the government for good causes with his donation being tagged on, which he agreed to.

I believe the chap didn’t even know the phrase ‘Homecoming Cup’ until after the event.

Bournesouprecipe, I have been saying, ‘let’s wait and see’ on this one since August, and I am sure the events since have gone further than many predicted.

Curly,

You've got mail!

HAIL! HAIL!
Token

Chico-

We've got Kilmarnock at home in a couple of weeks on a wednesday night. I reckon only 56,000 will be at that game.

Jinkysbhoy, Glen Daly
When the Naka story first surfaced again at the beginning of last week, I read an article on Newsnow saying it was a newspaper in New Zealand that had run the story and that the $10 million was actually New zealand Dollars, which is apparently around £3,600,000. I have noticed numerous high figures being bandied about since but (very unfortunately) I think the New Zealand story sounds more likely, I hope I'm wrong.
Sal.

jinkysboy

The same thing used to happen regularly at GAA matches in the north. A stadium was jammed but the official attendence read out would be something miniscule.

It was either a tax evasion scam or a scam not to give all the money raised to GAA HQ in Dublin. Probably a bit of both.

Jinky,

Exactly. The day we won the league against Dundee and there were fans all over the track the board back then had the official attendance as 60000 i think it was probably closer to 80000 or 90000!

There is no problem with Rangers supporters that a cosmic enema could not resolve.

Remember that, though they do not realise it, they are in purgatory where all stained souls have to be purged of their previous sins.

I feel their pain!

Nigel Mansell,

I take it your lawyers have got their sat nav fixed, were also given a short sharp "beat it!" from the ML2 police station and subsequently denied their fee by you???

After all they did go to a NORTH Lanarkshire polis outfit when you were apprehended by a South Lanarkshire mob!!

HAIL! HAIL!
Token

Paul,

Didn't Smith G come out a few days ago and say words to the effect that there was nothing the SFA could do about this song, and it would be wrong to punish 'clubs who have done everything' ?

Are him and peat at odds over this now or was Smith talking oot his bum again ?

Paul, I know you are taking a line here whose base is perched on the high moral ground but to say that Rangers,at present, deserve our encouragement and support in tackling the issue of Anti Irish racism is taking generosity to levels unknown to the human species.

Rangers football club have historically provided a fortnightly forum for the worst sectarian and racist elements in Scottish society. A meeting place, open and available for generation after generation of bigots to belt out Anti Catholic, Anti Irish songs and chants. They continue to do so. UEFA stopped the Billy Boys and open FTP chanting, not Rangers. Rangers paid lip service for years to the criticism of their recruitment policy from fine and courageous Glasgow Herald journalists such as Cyril Horne,(who they barred from Ibrox)Ian Archer and latterly Mr G.Spiers.

'The Rangers fans are in fine voice today,' the TV and radio commentators gush as The Sash is followed by thousands yelling FTP.

The Famine song and the BJK campaign are symptoms of a problem which is given a ready outlet at the football ground of Rangers. Rangers cannot tackle the problem. They are a willing participant in its expression. In many ways Rangers are the problem.(Orange away strips, flute playing music over the PA system etc,etc).

It is true that things have moved on. The Struth days have gone. Business considerations demand that Rangers,to have Celtic below them, require revenue from European football. This has been the catalyst for change. Only this.

Rangers are a team of eleven players and a football club of many nightmares. Because of their guilty past they are now stuck between a rock (their traditional core support) and a hard place. (the politically aware UEFA). I passed the self styled greatest Rangers pub the other day. The Louden Tavern in Duke Street had a large banner draped outside. The ...... is over, why don't you go home, it said. Their core support had been clever though. Another word, I don't know what, had been inserted to replace Famine. The intention was clear however.

And that's where Rangers stand today. The Mary Shelley of British football. They need to keep the sectarians and the racists happy or one of their biggest nightmares will become reality, ie their raison d'etre will disappear and they will become just another football club. Then who will keep the Croppies down ?

Do they deserve our support to tackle the issue of the Famine
song ? One question. Have they told their support to desist because it is wrong or because its continual airing will lead to punitive measures ? If it is the former then the answer would be in the affirmative so long as all the other symptoms which will surely follow are to be tackled likewise.

Fine Girl Y'Ar.

Mort

Back in the day it was a standing joke at CP - guess the crowd?

You took the number you thought of and multiplied by 0.6 and it was around that number they declared.

We often wondered how Celtic got away with it as there were obvious Inland revenue issues with what they were doing.

The worst I can remember was the season we beat Dundee at CP to win the league. The stadium was well overfilled that day yet I think they declared 40 odd thousand or so.

There used to be a Bob Kelly Gate, and a Jock Stein Gate, both on Janefield street. Those entering were never declared on the official attendance.

jinkysboy
You could never leave the blog for long enough to attend a lap dancing bar.
Mrs Jinx need not worry.
Your friend-
Bob.

Ryans

maybe the money from the gate went straight into Wee Bobs hip - doubt any went into the Big Mans. But maybe he knew !!!!

Gallowgate,

If i sat here all night i could not have put that any better.

Well said my friend, needless to say i agree 100% with every word.

Celtic Bob

You may be aware thatI have the ability to multi task and my all singing and dancing PC can run many applications at the same time - far away from the prying eyes of the Mejia and the LS of this world.

Hows the water today - wellies dried out and paddy boy happy?

BTW

The lap dancing club was aptly named the "rocket club"

Perhaps John Carew was only keeping Rankers Rocket Jean Claude D'archvillain company

I refuse to rule out this scenario

Peat and Duffield on the steps of Hampden, files in hand

'The SFA, after rigorous consultations with the SPL, and the Police, most SPL club officials and indeed numerous noted history and sociology experts from various Universities and groups throughout Scotland, can now unequivocally confirm that the Irish potato famine is indeed over. And, as its very existence did manifest the first major influx of Irish nationals to our great country, we have no option really but to ask that you, meaning most to all Irish descendants presently living and working here in Scotland, go home.'

Paul67,

deduct 3 points from Rangers and watch the social change happen overnight. They have contravened their own rules time and time again. They have contravened the laws of the land time and time again. There is nothing to judge here. They only thing that is lacking is action. If you are saying that the bigotry that is rife within the SFA and the SPL is the social issue here then placating them will change nothing. History has taught us that in all walks of life. We are only privy to a family squabble. Watch how they close ranks when the opportunity arises.

The Famine song is a brand new song that they have created. So I dont buy the line about social change. A perfect opportunity to do teh correct thing but they are loathed to do it. Self inflicted injuries are the rarest kind as self preservation is the dominating instinct. Paul67 you make it sound like it is already ingrained with a 1 year old song after they know tehy canot sing the BB´s? How difficult is that ?

I worry that us making excuses for them is a sign of them changing bed partners and I am even more concerned that you´ll be printing an article on CQN by the end of next summer asking us to refrain from using the word hun because they consider it to be sectarian.

Peat&Smith may be courting us now and may seem to be making the right noises but as an example take how Graham Spiers so eloquently described the Celtic support 10,000 pound gift to terminally ill children re emphasises the point that a leopard especially a hun leopard never changes its spots

It´s vital that we dont get into bed with them or be seen to get into bed with them as we will only get burned.

Hail Hail

jinkysboy
Yes- a good day for a change.
LS provided some entertainment.
Will Mail you Later
Bob.

Ryan's

You've screwed my day now. I never new the Roadrunner had been caught.

Roadrunnercsc

Celtic Bob

If your happy - Im happy

Never a dull moment

My brother is on the way up from Manchester so Im gonna head over to the shadows of Greyskull and see him at my mums house.

Look forward to reading your mail later.

BTW - tell Robert, Barry and Jeff I will defo be back next Monday

http://www.randalstowncsc.net/home/modules/news/article.php?storyid=163

The above link contains some reaction to Peats statement on FF.

Be warned, some choice language is contained. It amazes me that they can still amaze me!!!

Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo

agree on the use of 'Hun' , there is a quiet campaign to get this defined as sectarian ,

edgar and his RST crew have often and always quoted it as sectarian ,
this breach prosecution needs to be challenged or it will become accepted and the norm to describe its use as sectarian

wait to the next derby game at ibrox and we will all be charged with offensive singing if we use hun , they can then dock both teams points and it will not affect the league placings and the SPL and SFA will be seen to be the good guys soting out Scotlands Shame

Once A Bhoy

If I didn't know better I would swear that they were all made up but I don't think it would be possible to make up such drivel.

Do they actually believe that if they took all that action anyone would care?

Man On,

It´s just an exercise in "ones as bad as the other". So far Celtic have played that game with their cap in hand, staring at the ground. The all prevailing argument being - What can we do about it ? They will make a massive mistake as an organisation if they continue along that vein. Their Old Firm for ever credentials would be tattooed on their face.

Hail Hail

Man on

I would put money on it that should they get docked points we would also either at the same time or soon after to negate the action.

01bhoy

The FF reaction is hilarious - lets pull out of every competition - that would sort the taigs out !!!!!!!!!!!

gallowgate

An excellent post my friend.

But according to some people I should be happy to have my children being educated in the same school as these bigots and racists.

Never.

Once a bhoy

Sorry the FF link comment was meant for you

o1 bhoy - sorry if I woke you

Pleasantly surprised with Peat but will wait until more than words. Surprised if Strathclyde Police have not leant on him.

One thing that I am still in shock of is the Cardigans statement that they are trying to eradicate the few. He openly stated "Twenty years ago, Rangers did not sign Catholic players, you could not put up an argument" (the Herald, Oct 20). While this is just a statement of fact I am not aware of it being conceded before by either Rangers or the media but I do recall it being actively defended.

Have to agree 100% with Gallowgate's post (4.23pm). Rangers do not, so far as I can see, deserve any credit whatsoever on this. Any attempts, feeble as they have been, on their part to put their house in order have come entirely because of the consequences to them if they did not do so, not because they think its the right thing to do.

If they ever come out & condemn the actions of the "small minority" (even though it seems to the rest of the world its pretty much all of their supporters) who act in an unacceptable manner, & say unequivocally that racism & sectarianism is wrong & cannot, & will not, be tolerated, then although many would say its about 100 years too late, & that they have grown fat on the back of exactly these issues over their ignoble history, then I'll be the first to give them credit.

I won't, though, be holding ny breath...

Mort

I think if they took this action everyone would be delighted. A short term financial hit for most followed by Golden silence from them.

The comments merely confirm that they will not bow to officialdom. Any official action would be like a red rag to a bull. My one concern is that it would lead to an escalation of the violence against staff and supporters of our club on the streets of Glasgow as they lash out.

They will not change. They cannot change. Moonbeams is in for one hell of a battle and he deserves everything that comes his way for years of profit making duplicity.

I know I shouldn't be surprised but I am a little. What I find deafening in its silence is the (lack of) condemnation of the racists by more progressive huns, the likes of Edward and his ilk.

Has there been any condemnation by any section of their support (Ed apart?) of the racists?

How depressing.

Interesting times.

McCarthy-I personally think it was self indulgent to make the particular choice he did. We are a wee country and their is not enough of us to start drifting into pseudo-ethnic fission as if we were some sort of giant melting pot like America. However, I personally couldn’t bring myself to boo a 17 year old. Its just not decent for mature men and women to do that. However, I think the boo-ers only partly overlap with the famine song singers and many of boo-ers are decent enough people just with shorter fuses and hotter heads than I.

The actual famine song (adapted or not) is, however, a new level of nastiness. At first, it just seemed another step up on the ugly black humour charts that Scotland and Ulster tend to top, I was not surprised and it was water of a ducks back. However, I think I had just become desensitised by my years in Northern Ireland where that sort of thing was commonplace and 'sticks and stones' were a much more important issue than 'names'. However, I have wised up to my jaundiced approach. I am a simple man in some ways and am not going to get into the semantics of what singing that song represents. Lets put it this way: its simply not possible for a sane, decent human being to sing a mocking song about large scale human tragedy. Glad to see Peat has been forced to confront this evil development.

Boyd-Deserves his booing. More so than McCarthy given his age and also it is more about petulance than misguided loyalty. Again he is self indulging and not doing his duty. For me he has no way back unless he does a tear filled apology. I have to say, while I agree that the reporting is very skewed, the fact Boyd is getting the booing and lampooning treatment from non-OF fans does demonstrate that for many the issue is disloyalty not Irishness.

I think too many tims think the whole country has the loyalist/orange mentality. Don’t forget this is a country who rarely vote conservative, has a huge socialist tradition/Labour vote and also is being currently run by the nationalist party. Its a nationalist and socialist country not a National Socialist one!! Voting figures clearly show that right wing reactionary loyalists are a small minority. Too much misrepresentation of Scotland on self loathing on this blog IMO.

Nasty Novo- I personally believe the country of predominant upbringing in is as important as birth. Hence someone like Maloney who technically wasn’t born in the country but clearly is a Scot just by listening to him. However, I am against adult naturalisation. That is just another mockery of international football. Birth, pre-adult naturalisation, parents. That should be it. Then we will have very little grief.

In my albeit non-objective eyes the biggest wee Hun in the current team is wee Ignacio, who must be descended from the survivors of the Spanish Armada who were washed up on the Ayrshire coast all those years ago.

Anyways, Pablo, my perfect cousin, I saw this and thought of you

I hope the pressure is building and we see one final push
but I agree that at no time have Rangers condemed the content sung by their supporters, to do so would require them to ban then and they are frightened to.
it needs murray to say lets finally ride rangers of this bile for it to happen and we are still waiting 100 years and waiting

meanwhile their supporters see it as a no surrender issue their last stand for their orange culture, whatever that is , and I fear it is going to get worse and ungly before it is resolved

themanfromghordknows,

Sorry but I dont think you can accuse a young boy under the age of 15 of being self indulgent when a country that you are eligible to play for asks you to play for them. With the greatest respect I find that comment a little ludicrous. How many failed footballers do you know ?

I think the whole world is becoming a big ethnic melting point as was noted in the Polish bhoys concerns about Poles playing for Germany. Not that the Brazilian playing for them cause too much o a problem. In fact if you look at Germany now it has Poles, Turks, Africans, Swiss. The French team , the English team even the Spanish team are all doing it. It´s to do with advanced technology and the ridiculous idea of nationalism.

My Maloney was born not to far away from where the Scotlands assistant national manager was born that didn´t prevent him from having a fabulous international career playing for England regardless of how he voted.

HAil Hail

DBBIA

Definition of a hun

Does anyone on here refer to protestants as huns ? I think not - maybe someone can tell me otherwise

Your point on Novo is the most valid - you can be born a catholic or be any religion and become a hun - my definition is a bitter twisted person who is associated with Rankers and has an inbred hatred of me and anyone associated with Celtic or Irish Catholics.

Read elsewhere that Lee McCulloch is looking to become a central defender. And we think we've problems with Big Mick!

I wouldn't get too excited just yet. Rangers had a ban on Catholics, but ask yourself-

What did the police do about it ?
What did the Scottish football authorities do about it ?
What did the politicians do about it ?
What did the Trade Unions do about it ?

Rangers have always done as they liked in Scotland.

Nice wee article about one of our least favourite sons:

Forget "next year." The rallying cry of Toronto FC's turgid 2008 season was "the year after that."

It came to a merciful close on Saturday, leaving TFC in third-to-last place, only two points better than the expansion San Jose Earthquakes and David Beckham's L.A. Galaxy.

It was a campaign defined by low points – the two-month winless streak, the constant in-and-out on the roster, the painfully-bored performances of Laurent Robert, who slummed it in Toronto until someone fired him. The nadir was bombing out of the new CONCACAF champions league, one-upped by the part-time pros of the paltry USL.

Injuries played their part and we can put our arms around each other and spend all day crying about the unfairness of MLS' Canadian player quota and the stupidity of the league's scheduling. But nothing happened that wasn't in full view from the first day of the season.

The fault lies first and last with the team's director of soccer, Mo Johnston.

Having relieved himself in the pre-season of his on-field duties, the increasingly-surly Scot spent the next six months redefining himself as a general manager. The results weren't just poor. They were baffling.

His first major move was ... er, wait, I've got it here somewhere (paper shuffling). Sorry, no major moves by the opening of training camp, despite a winter ostensibly spent scouring the Americas, North and South, for talent. (Note to the MLSE accounting office – I'd vet those Brazilian cab chits very carefully.)

The winter brought precisely zero results on the player-hunting front, while some talent was siphoned off by the expansion draft. So one year after fielding the side with the least productive offence and most porous defence in MLS, Johnston returned in February with an even worse team.

He deflected attention by hiring former Newcastle manager John Carver to mind the on-field duties. The Englishman had the bonafides and the enthusiasm, but he never knew what hit him.

Carver spent the season looking more and more like a man who has signed on to work on a cruise ship, and is only now learning that the captain never intends to dock again. Most of the time, he seemed forlorn. Now and again, he seemed close to a frothing breakdown. Who could blame him?

He was given sub-standard personnel, even by MLS standards, and not a single reliable goalscorer. Many of Carver's post-game interviews turned into extended pleas for an input of offensive talent. No Kreskin powers required as to who those pleas were directed at.

Carver ended the campaign with threats to quit if Johnston did not sign a designated player and bizarre promises to begin his own talent hunt back home. He can't be any worse at it than his boss.

Again and again, Johnston took an actual, live player and – presto change-o! – turned him into something else.

Ronnie O'Brien turned into – Shazam! – a 2009 draft pick. Maurice Edu took the form of – Wow! – a big pile of money. Money is nice, but it doesn't hold the ball terribly well in midfield. In between, Johnston spent his time flirting with out-of-work English pros unwinding their way toward a weekend hosting gig on Radio Norwich. Outside of Rohan Ricketts, nobody was interested.

Johnston artfully deflected attention from the team's dwindling performance with a pair of scapegoats. Nebulous talk of stadium expansion was trumped up into a full-scale outcry, while Johnston turned suddenly on the FieldTurf surface. Few seemed to notice that the best supported club in Major League Soccer had somehow managed to become inexplicably crappier between years one and two.

Two seasons into his Toronto tenure, Johnston has proven himself a master at managing expectations. The stands are still full, there's plenty of give left on the rope around his (and every other sports GM's) neck. Business-wise, he's golden. Sports-wise? Results suggest that this will be another long winter, full of discontent.

Somebody mentioned Stephen Halliday`s seemingly unbalanced article in The Scotsman (normally a reasonably balanced `paper , I feel)re. booing of Kris Boyd. Here is Mr Halliday`s reply to an email:

Jim,

Thanks for your e-mail.

Far from supporting Boyd's stance, I believe he is wrong to withdraw himself from Scotland duty. The tone of my piece was intended to point out that neither Scotland or Boyd will ultimately benefit from his decision. I mentioned the booing of his name as I believe it will be indicative of every match he plays in the wake of his decision. It would have happened whoever Rangers were playing on Saturday.

The McCarthy issue is quite clearly very different and I fully appreciate your views on it. I agree those fans who jeer McCarthy are a minority and, as much as possible, I try not to provide them with the oxygen of publicity.

Kind regards,

Stephen

Man On - you're right Murray will not condemn his racists customers for obvious reasons..., and this is getting very interesting.

Whilst I have not lived in Scotland for a long long time, I thought by virtue of the fact that we (Celtic supporters/of Irish heritage/Catholics) are the minority in most work places, that we all knew a couple of decent bluenoses, not like the FF bunch you know, good guys who just support the wrong team.

Well what are they doing or saying? If any of you lurk here, your club needs you. Stand up and be counted.

James McCarthy like Aiden has done what right for him and how he feels. It's been going on for years, players choosing the country of their parents' origins. It should not even be point under discussion. It is imply not news.

It is disliked by those who boo James and Aiden because they hate Ireland and the Irish. They are racist.

Iscariot - shame!

McGrain

This is there no surrender moment
they have waited for this moment for nearly 3 centuries
looking at a few of there websites
out goes the rallying cry
they will not take this lying down
know they have there Enoch Powell moment

Henriks Sombrero, I’m even going to cut Gordon Smith some slack on this one. His comments reflected where the SFA were at that point in time (giving the police and SPL their place).

Gallowgate, in fact, I am keen to avoid the high moral ground on this one and take the opposite line, that to criticise the efforts of others for being less than wholesome is done from somewhat higher moral ground.

There is indeed plenty of scope to dismiss Rangers actions as being less than perfect, or motivated out of self interest, but that does not preclude me from encouraging them in confronting their own fans on this one, which I do.

My objective is not to punish Rangers over this matter, or glory over their distress, it is to see it ended.

Awe Naw, as I said above, there is plenty of scope to mock the efforts of Rangers and others, so you are free to mock away, however, as George Peat’s most prodigious critic; I believe I am entitled to offer encouragement when I feel it appropriate.

tooheys_new, yes, that statement from Smith was the first official work I had heard on the matter too.

DBBIA

That's absolutely hilarious!

The Poorman's Shaun Maloney, Celtic Beat Hibs, Some Rumours And A Nice Looking Burd.

well done to all at the fives!!!!

forza

Tontine Tim

Everything comes to he who waits

Have to agree with everyone that thinks this is gonna get messy for Murray and his club.

Gallowgate's earlier post was a great one and summed up exactly the way i feel about this latest
episode.
Ban the bigots and go back to attendances last seen during the John Greig years
or pay lip service again then wait and see who eventually takes some action against his club.

Personally i feel it will take Uefa to act before much happens.

I also think the t shirt court case is a sinister one could have implications for us, they are trying their best to get us on something when this all eventually comes to a head

nbt

sure was a pub and a half ! ;¬)
the pakora from the indian next door was superb, a it far to walk from your mooring to the pub...

Tontine Tim

Welcome back.

I just ran the Dublin Marathon!!!! I am whacked but chuffed to bits. Saw two Celtic tops on the way round (I didn't wear mine!)

I am tto euphoric, wrecked and generally drained to join in the debate. just wanted to let you all know.

roberttressell

Congratulations, a truly fantastic achievement, last marathon I was involved in was from a selection box in 1989 just before it changed to Snickers

back to the original question

How much did United pay for Macari in '73

it will amaze

roberttressell

Congrats. Very well done.

Gordon I could be wrong ?

Where is tinytim?

blantyretim

My narrowbhoat is in the West Midlands so it is a bit far to walk to the Horse and Barge, now you made me hungry for Pakora you don't get that down in England, well at least around here you don't I'm in Balti country.

hang the dj - I am laughing out loud!!!! In all honesty the next marathon I do will be a snickers.

NBT

That's an interewsting point.

The "w" wasn't intended but Winston Bergcamp won't mind.

I much prefer "Scottish" curries to those served up darn sarf.

What do you reckon?

I've been, unsuccessfully, trying a linky thing.

Can one of you cleverer guys do a link to a poem from Celtic Underground called Shug The Dug. Really funny.

who needs a curry? i've just had steak pie and chips, i'm sure martin42 will be proud ;)

NBT i know you are based darn sarf by your beer comments..

Fellow CQN'ers

Residing as I now do in Swansea I e-mailed my MP (through the 'They Work for You' web site yesterday evening to raise the issue of TFS and the racist chanting directed at James McCarthy on Saturday.

I had a reply from her at 09:43 this morning agreeing that it was an important issue and one she would happily take up with the SFA and the Minister responsible for Sport in Scotland on my behalf.

There are many on here resident outside Scotland and I would urge you all to contact your MP to ensure that the matter continues to be raised.

Home alone.

Macaulayculkincsc

Paul67,

Of course you are and I wish you well with your good and admirable intentions.

Personally I dont believe that it´s an achieveable goal unless everyone involved takes an honest view of it and if they did they would come to the conclusion that it couldn´t continue in its present form due to it´s unacceptable history and what it stands for. If I can draw an analogy it´s akin to the reformation (for want of a better word ;-) ) of the Orange Order. Dress it up all you want but it´s fundamental principals do not equate with a modern civilised perspective. That would mean accepting a degree of culpabality for previous actions and therefore doing the decent thing and issuing an apology at some point in time so that we can ALL move on. It´s my belief that that will never happen.

It would seem going by the posts so far that unlike yourself few of us believe that Rangers are indeed doing anything real and that the very idea of Rangers putting any real effort into this or us even helping them remotely as being anything but misguided. Like all people with problems you need to admit that you actually have one before you can move on. Until that time the problem can only remain.

The only efforts that I have witnessed has come from ourselves when in any other civilised country a simple complaint would suffice.

It seems to run deep within our club to be prepared to compromise our perfectly legitimate principals and beliefs resulting in it being tarnished in the hope that some kind of percieved tit for tat exchange will help. It doesn´t it makes us look guilty and historically we compromise and they get worse. I believe that this is the wrong strategy and helps maintain the status quo.

I´m interested to see how this one pans out and if it does seem ground breaking I will doff my cap to you. In the meantime I´ll still stand by my supposition that this is Peat just trying to get Murray to behave himself behind the scenes and to forgive and forget extension gate and stop trying to sabotage George Burley position by starting to co operate.

If we get something from it then good but I dont believe that we should dress it up as anything else but been caught up in a family feud. Long term permanent changes would need to happen. The SFA as an organisation would actually have to be seen to go further than was necessary to show that it isn´t just an extension of Rangers anymore.

Peat and Smith were summoned to Charlotte Square in May it´s now October. Nothing has changed for me in that time. I look forward to seeing how this season pans out. Not just domestically but with Scotland too on and off the park.

Hail Hail

EDB1

re your comment last night about Seville.

i am another who hasn't watched the match as i still find it too bad, i left after the final whistle as i couldn't bare to see that mob lift the trophy,

good article about JF 50 years this year since he signed

It may be seen by some as petty, pedantic and pathetic, but I do not like the term, "Potato Famine".
The failure of the potato crop was only one element in this catastrophe, and one which need not have resulted in the suffering and death which followed.
The Famine, The Great Hunger, these terms an their own convey the horror accurately enough.

ElDiegoBhoy1

I use to think the curries around here were great but lately I have changed my opinion, I think it is a case of familarity breeds contempt of local curries and now prefer curries back home. I,ve gone off curries lately and prefer a chinese " Spicy Crispy shredded beef" my fav now.

eldiegobhoy1

Dug called Shug

Aw Naw

I'm fine with Paul's take on this matter. I'm equally fine with the opposition to it.

I dislike that lot with ferocious intensity and see no prospect of them changing their ways.

They are a source of shame on my country and I damn them to hell for that.

I think it's correct for Paul to take a positive stand and for others to speak out against.

If Paul routinely posted negative views, on whatever topic, then I won't be tuning in. Maybe balanced is the word I'm seeking.

kenleecsc

Paul while ah welcome anything that takes us towards the eradication of the racist song my feeling is that its window dressing by Peat. Witness the language he uses "offensive"song,why not racist song it betrays his weakness.

It will stop,perhaps again it will come from an outside agency like FIFA,whose statues are being flagrantly disregarded by the SPL/SFA.

There seems to be a belief among these bodies that doing all you can is a defence against sanction.

It is not culpability does not matter.

The club and or association are responsible for their fans conduct and again i stress culpability is not a defence.

Just for you El Diego Bhoy

A Dug called Shug

blantyretim and EDB1

That is strange I never watched a replay of Seville either, I haven't even seen the highlights since the game, I went with my cousin who lives in Yorkshire to Seville, he taped the game and said that he will only watch it with me so he hasn't watched the replay either. I am going up to see him in November and I think we might be tempted to watch it then. It is strange I never had the desire to watch it again, I don't know why, I think it was because I thought for sure we would win it, I didn't even contemplate losing.

Paul67

I admire your glass half full manishness, and your much younger than some of your more
cynical CQN'ers. Experience - time will tell.

You know me all "pitch forky" Ban them - Problem of listening to racism in Celtic Park solved in one.

Naturally there would be wide and long lasting ramifications for Celtic if we did, but we would always be able to point to 31/08/08 and TFS

Ban them now, why wait for a kangaroo court to side with general endemic anti-catholicism that already exists in Gt Britain

See the Act of Settlement CSC

Excuse ma bad grammer above,the line should have read

It is not,culpability does not matter.

blantyretim

Seville was indeed bitter sweet.

You seem to have had a heavy weekend?

EDB1

indeed, nearly as heavy as the rain....

Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo 5:25 PM

My short note to your comment. I don’t think many people in Poland blame Klose or Podolski for making Germany their choice. For the big majority they had a right to do that, on their own. We blame people from Polish FA, for not contacting those, who wanted to play for Poland before. I told you what Podolski said; I wanted to play for Poland, I have tried many times to contact Polish FA. When they called me, it was too late, because I got a call from the Germany coach, and I agreed. By the way, I tell you two things. I remember one Polish third row politician, who after our defeat at Germany 2:0 said: Podolski should have been deprieved of the Polish passport. Whole country had a big laugh. There were many jokes about the politician, and about that situation. On the other site, you said about the Brasilian playing for Poland. To be honest, my feelings were ambivalen. Take into your account, he was playing for my Legia team too. Before it happend, I was more against that case. Now I’m for, because he is playing for my country, and needs my support. That's a far history now.
Some people were against Guerreiro in the Polish team. It happened about half an year ago. During the first league game, small group of supporters ( I don’t remember the club’s name) hung the banner “ Roger, you won’t never, ever be the Pole” . Disciplinary commission at Polish FA recognized it the sign of racism. Club paid the fine and apologized for their stupid fans.

WDH - Macari 250k?

EDB,

as always Paul67 stimulates fascinating debate and I am thankful for that I honestly admire his stance and I hope something is cooking. As you rightly point out it´s good to have a varied pitch - the baseball is gettimg to me too ;-)

Honestly, I am so cynical about this particular matter that I know I always come across as the grim reaper but that´s my experience.

Nobody wants their kids to grow up having to put up with elements like that and its always good to inspire hope. That´s how I was brought up but a with few quiet home truths in the ear every so often when reality raised its ugly head.

Now before I bore you any more ;-) I need to go off to see The Match as I haven´t seen it yet. Shame on me. :-(

Hail hail

Zbyszek,

football especially international football where no wages are paid is just a multi billion pound industry. I was just using you as an example as that thread is easy at hand and still in the memory. I have been to a few WC´s and EC´s and many international games and I love the atmosphere and the competition and enjoy the atmosphere but not supporting Scotland although I would if they were there, but its all been diluted in the pursuit of money.

Platini had a point about the clubs and it´s the same for the countries. A global change in principals need to be restored and appreciated.

Awe Naw, we’ll see.

TerryO’Neill, aye, we’ll see.

Bournesouprecipe, due process first. Fifa guidelines must be followed.

David Ginola = Vaginal Dido

Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo

I know, I know.It wasn't my riposte, only the addendum :)

I've bypassed a few of the later posts but I'll certainly return to them. A great thanks to the guys for Shug.

Terry,

I never tune in nowadays to you know where. Do you still annoy them?

TNT Blantyre Tim and ELDB1

I was in Seville and have I never seen a replay, i didn't see it live either for that matter
I didn't know until weeks afterwards, that the game went to extra time.

Its a blur and because we lost i don't need the details.

The day started badly with some junk food followed by white wine,red wine, white wine, red wine, then pints.

Never saw a thing of the game made a tour of the Alcazar was at Mass twice in Seville Cathedral and saw a Shrine to Christopher Columbus - I think, that was before the pints.

Paul67

Phil Gordon ,who did the Rangers match report in The Times, had a real go at the rotten mob about their choice of songs

Sustained personal and racial abuse of a 17 year old boy.,..disgraceful

If i were the Hamilton chaiman i would ban the lot of them ...but then again i`d be the first Celtic supporting chairman of hamilton

I see some folk are commenting that they haven't watched the Seville game again. (I have and thought we played better than I felt at the time.) Well, the game I can't bring myself to watch is the Milan one and that is nearly 40 years ago now. It's still too raw.... Mind you, the Seville experience was utterly different to that of Milan. As me auld Dad says (and he was in Lisbon and Milan), the Italians weren't interested and made no effort whatsoever to welcome either Feijenoord or ourselves.

Paul67,

As ever you provide us with valuable insight into the workings of the likes of the SFA and the SPL. I hope pressure continues to be applied to these organisations so that they take appropriate action against the the riff-raff who chant that unspeakable dirge (and their attacks on Mr Stein).

Someone posted Phil Gordon's match report of Hamilton v EU's lot. Was that from the Times or Independent? He has written (mightly on occasion) for both. He doesn't shirk from telling it as it is.

You say: "The SFA, SPL, the Police and Rangers all deserve our encouragement and support in tackling this matter."

Cannot for the life of me see where there is any credit due to any of the four bodies you mention.

After 6 months of listening to racist singing loud and clear from Rangers' supporters the SFA and SPL are only now awakening to this scandal.

I have not written to any of the footballing authorities but I understand from others that they will either: a/ not respond. or b/ respond to succinct and clear evidence of anti-Irish racist singing by Rangers' fans (supported by press and video evidence) with vague talk of the need to eradicate sectarian chants in Scottish football.

I have complained to the Chief Constables of Strathclyde and Lothian and Borders on 4 separate occasions when the racist song could be heard loud and clear on TV.

The first complaint about the St Mirren v Rangers game resulted in a phone call from the Match Commander who did not hear anything.

The second complaint about the Partick Thistle v Rangers game has yet to be acknowledged far less responded to.

The third complaint about the Hibs game resulted in a letter from L & Borders finest saying we are looking into it.

The fourth complaint on Saturday has yet to be dignified with a response.

I don't think that the police are the answer as they are obviously not interested in this racism. I have made complaint to the Equality and Human Rights Commission in these terms and they say the matter is racist and it is up to me to take it up with the police. I say that self-evidently the police are not interested but they insist it is for me to complain to the police.

And so it goes on I will continue by way of e-mail to politely and formally complain to the police when I hear the racist famine song booming out on TV or Radio and no doubt the police will continue to do nothing. I am now copying my MSP and the EHRC in my e-mails to the police.

What else can one do?

Rangers are hardly worth mentioning as the press release on this matter by Bain simply said don't do it because the police might arrest you if you do as they think this song is racist, but we think it is just tit-for-tat banter.

Your statement that "The SFA, SPL, the Police and Rangers all deserve our encouragement and support in tackling this matter." is sad given the level of your previous posts.

I see PF ayr has already answered my question.

This is a small message from me, a Celtic shareholder and one who pays a fairly large wad of cash for my season ticket - my choice of course - to Peter Lawwell.

If the Re-arrangers hangers on are permitted to purchase tickets for our next home fixture against them then I won't attend the game and I will not renew my season ticket until they have been banned from Celtic Park.

roberttressell - did marathon myself, first one, legs fcuked, could also be the last one, back to the selection boxes methinks for marathons

What are the chances come our next meeting at their place when the song starts up the entire away support marching out in silent protest? Now that would get international recognition.

Note I say when not if, as experience tells me the powers that be will still be "discussing" the matter.

gallowgate

sectarian bigotry is the very bedrock of RFC

they have done nothing by their own initiative to tackle their endemic problem

their actions are totally reactionary and are not based on any form of moral judgement

they only act when they are concerned that they may be taken to task by the authorites and sanctioned

when wee Fergus was engaged in his Bhoys against bigotry campaign ...Murray just scoffed ...they had no such problem ...maybe they wee nor so bad when their support was all Camel coated glory hunters ...but their self imposed superiority allowed the rotten bigots to form the hardcore of their support

the fact of the matter is that they have no concerns about morality , egalitarian principles nor general decency ...they are only concerned that they are financiallly sanctioned or docked points
the SPL /SFA have indulged and tacitly condoned them ...we have a long way to go with this one

PFAyr

Whilst I wholeheartedly agree with your post, I was under the assumption you were in the legal profession. Is that 1st line allowed?
:>)))

Once a bhoy

veritas

once a bhoy

a team who refused to employ catholics for circa 100 years

don`t think i`ll have too much trouble defending my assertion

PFAyr

Given the present climate they are probably busy elsewhere...lol. One can only hope.

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend... ElDiegBhoy

Ye Wull Whit?

If ye dae such a puckish thing... whit is the profit in that fur you,pal?

Who wull know of yer great sacrifice?

Again...

Who wull even Care??

Na

Ye ur jist being Melodramatic...that's it...

Intit?

Hmmmmmmmmmmmm..

Kojo.
yer pal... who likes ye a loat.

EDB

Can you clarify. Are you saying all non catholics are filth?

Forgive me if ive picked u up wrong

Zbyszek

I never responded to your request for views on the Legia : Wisla game last night.

I only saw the second half and felt Legia played a clever counter attack game once they went ahead. Nevertheless, your goalkeeper, Mucha, had to make several good saves to deny Brozek and others. I thought the young no. 25 played well in the section I saw (commentary was in Polish and the screen was small so I did not catch his name). Radovic was also busy but he looks like one of the more senior players.

Who did you think showed up well in the team?

On a football note. I watched MotD 2 earlier and was well impressed with the forward movement of the Portsmouth LB Belhadj, who I believe we were "reportedly" interested in. Didn't see much defensively in the highlights, but he was flying at the opposition defence and showing good control. Another one that got away maybe.

I welcome peats intervention in this matter. Why he has intervened isn't as important as the fact that he has.

I suspect that there is a realisation dawning at the sfa that this could result in a european ban for rangers and a censure for the sfa from fifa if they sit back and ignore racism

The sfa's job is to support all scottish clubs. As a member club any ban applied to rangers tarnishes scottish football as a whole. That could be why we have seen so much activity around this. Murray spoke out 2 weeks ago, although to be fair to him he has condemned the ftp brigade and bile previously. Smith's recent comments admitting a sectarian POLICY at Rangers were grounbreaking

These 2 statements could have been seen by the sfa as a cry for help from rangers. What peat has said so far is entirely, 100%, in step with rangers official position.

Murray has no influence over the rangers fans who sing these racist,sectarian and offensive songs. In fact they despise him. He can't get them to stop by words alone. I rarely have any sympathy for people with an ego like murray's , however I do on this occasion. Rangers cannot solve this problem without effecively taking a decision to play in front of none of their fans. That is not a reasonable thing to ask them to do
Therefore the problem has to be solved for them. The sfa have to act. The difference between this shameful racism and the BJK knew bile is that BJK would have been seen by fifa as an unpleasant local issue. I am sure genuine football people like smith and mccoist would also be appalled by it. But essentially it was a local issue

Racism is number 1 on fifa's hit list.it will not be viewed as a local issue.

At this stage the last thing the sfa or rangers want is to use the word racist. Fifa and uefa would then have carte blanche to impose sanctions against a club with a self admitted racist problem

And some at uefa may see that as appropriate given the carnage caused by rangers at a uefa showpiece final. There certainly won't be much sympathy for a club with their dreadful reputation

What happened to the rumour that Hearts were going to go bust last week ?

If fans approached every steward and police oficer about the offensive singing at the next game against Rangers at CP surely something could be done.

We should have a tannoy announcement during the game if need be telling them to belt up or be thrown out en mass. Clear the whole end and offer refunds.
Celtic need to push this as it will be left hanging in the aur.

EDB

not a very helpful statement

what about Celtic supporting non catholics who don`t go to catholic schools

what about decent fair minded non catholics

allgreen

aye they would lift the Celtic bhoys for annoying them

Not wanting to be pedantic here or anything like that - but you could argue that in essence this is simply a case of us being asked by our chairman to stop singing the more extreme songs about the Irish that we do on occasion - and we we wont, and them being asked by their chairman to stop singing a particular controversial song about the Irish - and they won’t either.

So therefore if we acknowledge that we have our own problems to sort then you could argue that until such times as we have clean bill of health song wise its wishful thinking on our part to hope that action will be taken against them - whilst we get off scot free.

In all probability the SFA will wait until they have a cast iron case against the both of us before they even think about taking any action.

EDB 1
There are a great many children from `Protestant` families who are superb human beings. Over the years, I have taught many, many thousands of them. They are not recognisably different from `Catholic` children. Your post uses the same language as I expect from permamently angry, bitter people. Ring any bells?
Jim Barr

WDH...

Manchester United paid Celtic £200000 for Lou Macari in January 1973.

Hail, hail

Nacho No-Go and SFA meeting over hate song making the back page tonight. Peat isn't going to be very popular with an awful lot of people. Donegal TD McHugh’s comments prominent

And a story about Naka wanting to leave in January.

STANDING UP

EDB,
your right, its the only way our "custodians" will pay attention. At the game on Saturday, Did Celtic supporters get forcibly removed fron Celtic park for singing ?
Where I sit, loads of people got to their feet to watch a commotion then "let the people sing" chant followed ?

anybody that knows ?

pf ayr just read back from last night on your bookies win....ya jammy b'sa..... well done mate.

Paul a simple question which I probably wont be on long enough as the lioness wants me to do some work about the house to see you answer tonight but will look back in.

Why all of a sudden against Hamilton have the press and the sfa all popped their head up on this issue? Can it be they are being manipulated from within the corridors of the bigotdome and are doing their dirty work for them.

Maybe im cynical but its stinks to the highest heavens to me.

I truly cannot see too much being done to rangers, after all It's taken six months for the authorities to even comment.
Less than a week ago an article by journalist Phil Mac Giolla Bhain listed every excuse he was given as reason why they couldn't comment on the racist song so I dont think they "deserve" any encouragement, and they wont be getting any from me.

TobiLegend :- It went to the same place as the rumours of Rangers going bust every season.
My opinion is that a lot of internet rumours (not just on this site or Celtic sites)are based on wishful thinking rather than anything concrete.

Once Upon a Tim on October 27, 2008 8:41 PM

Whilst I agree that some of our songs may cause upset to others, there is a vast difference. This was highlighted by our chairman in his AGM interview. We are not talking about "like for like". They feel some of the songs sung at away games are distasteful. Their songs are not distasteful (well they are), they are illegal. Vast difference.
As JR said, "We have to be whiter than white."
This does not mean we stand any sort of comparison with their bile.

Edward

Whats the fairminded Rangers fans take out this recent issue?

A few rotten apples? victimisation by the authorities?

EDB

Is your season ticket so expensive that you are looking for a reason not to renew it?A stance that allows you not to renew,and not lose face with your buddies.

If Celtic meant that much to you, it wouldn't even enter your head.

What a revelation it must be to discover that there are people amongst the Rangers support,who dislike Catholics.

As for your comments about Filth.

They are bigoted.

Do you have a drink problem?

Your comments are not that of a rational,sober human being,never mind a Celtic fan.

Feel free to take your bigotry elsewhere.

setting free the bears

In the first half we were better. In the second half Wisla have shown some pressure.
25 was Jakub Rzezniczak. He is 22 years old, right back. He also played central back.
I know that Mucha was our MOTM, but for me our defending midfielder Maciej Iwanski was class. I think, our left back Jakub Wawrzyniak also played good game, but as you said: you need defending defender, not attacking defender.

PF ayr 8:21 pm.

Agree 100%. When times were hard for them in the past eg pre Souness and attendances were low they could always depend on the bigoted core support, the loyalists to be there game after game. The Camel coats returned when success returned. Lesson learned. Never alienate the real bluenoses, the Brigton/Larkhall true blues. They were clever with Judas. A Celtic hero snatched from under Celtic's noses. Resistence, but not enough. Murray, Bain et al hate websites because they understand they are a vehicle to watch,organise and mobilise against any sign of a change too far. If they are cornered Rangers have shown they will concede some ground re songs but with reluctance and a covert nudge and wink to their traditionalists who interpret this as a cue for some other dab at creative song writing.

Rangers really do need to face them down. You, I and many others know they will not do this.

NOT UNLESS CELTIC ARE FACING DOWN THEIR FANS AT THE SAME TIME.

Fine Girl Y'Ar

In relation to the piece by the Irish journalist, Phil Mac Giolla Bhain, mentioned by The BhoyWithTheWaferThinEyes at 8:50pm, when talking about Gordon Smith's excuses for the SFA's lack of desire to broach the subject of the Famine Song, he writes:

"The ex-Rangers man stated that the SFA could not have a public view on the Famine Song as the SFA was, in effect, the court of appeal of SPL clubs.
If the SPL punished a club, for whatever reason, and the club thought this unjust or unfair then the club could appeal to the SFA.
Subsequently, Smith explained, the SFA could not have a public view on the Famine Song for that reason."

Given the SFA's statement today, where does that leave Gordon Smith?

It certainly makes him look foolish. Some might even say his position has become untenable?

The Planner

Parkheadcumsalford,

Paul was telling me that he spoke to you at the A G M.

How are you doing? I will not go into detail about your conversation, but I am glad to put some flesh onto the bare bones of a nom de plume.

Maybe some Saturday you will manage north for a home game and we could meet for a pint in BBs.

I see Mary Gallacher every week, Fr. Clarernce is keeping well.

martinbrennan42@hotmail.co,uk

Martin

Hi Martin 42, thanks for the mail and for what you said; good stuff! shall be back in touch soon.
D

gallowgate

Celtic faced down their fans during Wee Fergus` reign
and all because of moral judgement not fear of sanction

but hey ..we`re both as bad as each other ...aren`t we

justification by inclusion ..not acceptable ...we must disassociate ourselves totally from them , condemn them at every turn and expose them for what they are

they`re public profile is damaged , they are on the brink of finanacial peril....we will not have a better time to jettison them once and for all

good riddance to bad rubbish

Zbyszek

You are right. We are looking for a defensively capable full back.

Howevaah! Kojo wants one that can run like a deer as well. Not too much to ask is it?

I see you are joint top with Polonia now. Keep it up.

Smelltheglove :- I've already given my own opinions on this so I'll stick with a couple of comments on how others see it.
Firstly you have the denizens of FF and their ilk, to them it's a given that the media, SFA, SPL, UEFA etc are out to get them. They are all papist sympathisers and desperate to enforce their fenian views on the peaceful protestant population. Think BNP and swap fenian for black and protestant for white)
Second, and there is a large number of them are those that would agree the words of the famine song are racist but that when it's only the chorus it becomes a bit of banter. This is especially so in the case on Sat when the feeling seems to be that there was no difference between singing the song but with a players name inserted removes the racial connotations and that it's on par and for the same reason as the booing and singing at Mr Boyd.
Third, there are those like myself who feel that there is no place for racism within the game and who feel that whether you think a song racist or not if it's perceived that way by the intended target then it shouldn't be sung. Whether it's from moral or pragmatic reasoning for stopping singing I couldn't say.
All of the above is vastly simplified and I doubt if many people would fall simply within one of the groups (with the exeption of a large percentage of those on FF) I would say the biggest cross over is between those in the second and third groups with some folk falling into group three for some incidents/songs/actions and group two for others.
Sorry if the above seems a bit vague but despite views that we are a homogenous monolithic support we do have many gradiations within the support.

“Justice should not only be done, but should be seen to be done"

Seems we have the beginings of the Latter.
I will not hold my breath for the Former.
These days appearances are what count.

So Far....
They have promised what?
To cover themselves in the 'minutes' of a meeting.
That Is All.....
So far.

Malone19

My apologies if my post to you last night appeared angry or condescending.
I have Iranian friends who consider the western medias reporting on Iran the way we consider the Daily Records objectivity.

Perhaps the SPL/SFA will give referees the powere to stop games for racist singing by fans.

I think this was introduced in Holland a couple of seasons ago to stem the anti-Jewish abuse.

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend.. Jist Ed

Celtic Fans and Rangers Fans...

Bless 'em, each and Every Wan!

Wha's Like us?

We are the Mercury that improves the Battery,the Oxygen that's needed tae the Watter!

We ur the Life Force of the S.P.L.

We need each ither like Lorne's Sausages needs it's Rowat's!

Na...

Lang may oor Lum's Reek...

Although, Ah did notice that the G.A.'s Lum...

Reeks a loat mair than Celtic's Diz.

Dae sumthing aboot that, Ed.

Kojo.
yer pal who thinks ye're swellegant

setting free the bears

Kojo is a brave man. He suggests:It's a figt, attack them , before they attack you.

watching the rerun of the game from Saturday

does anyone think that SMCD may have been given the benefit of the doubt re his bad tackle because tghe ref had just denied a reasonable penalty shout moments earlier ...a bit of evening up maybe

Zbyszek

When do you play Polonia.

Is that considered the derby match or is the Wisla game still the big one?

Edward

Thank you, I appreciate its generalising

ElDiegoBhoy, will you stop your kids going to work, to the pub, to the shops as well? Don't you think that if Catholic schools are abolished that integration could occur - did you watch that Glasgow Colours documentary that Pablophanque linked to last night which showed a young lad at a Catholic school who supported Rangers? There used to be a lad went to Mass every week at my local church with a Rangers scarf on - are Rangers fans only filth outwith Catholic schools or faith? Conversely, there is plenty of non-"filth" in non-Catholic schools - me, for example (well, not now, but 20+ years ago), and many of my friends, family, acquaintances.

PF ayr, thanks for that info on The Times.

Parheadcumsalford, cheers.

Big Nan, I know, I know, I’m just sad. Oh well.

Gallowgate, as you know, I didn’t suggest that Rangers deserve our “unconditional encouragement or support”. I have been strong critics of Walter Smith and David Murray in the past, but in recent weeks they have both been critical of their own fans.

I chose to acknowledge this; you are free to chose differently. I believe that more of this is the way forward and that Smith, Murray and even Peat will find acknowledgement scarce among their normal constituency.

For what it’s worth, I believe in redemption.

Alas, despite your fine comment, I had to delete for the reference to the police at the end.

Barcabhoy, agree.

Hopefully, ElDiegoBhoy is so full of remorse he has signed off for the night.

Kojo :- How are you my dodecca freen,
I agree with you that followers of both our clubs have a lot more in common than many care to admit.
I would love to remove a lot of the reek from the Ibrox lum but realise that I can only do so much, however I do think that things will change and perhaps the recent furfor will keep the momentum of change rolling.
I look forward to the day when both sets of fans can indulge in bitter intense rivalry but with no racist conotations.
I look forward to one day listening to Rangers and Celtic fans each belting out football songs an/or political songs (both republican and loyalist)celebrating their own side without over the top abuse of the other.

Um, I am not "filth" now 20+ years on, I meant I am not at school now 20+ years on.

setting free the bears

Polonia, other team in Warsaw? I don't know them.

Okay, we played against them in August. Result was 2:2, when we were in a very poor form. SFTB, honesty I think you should keep your eyes on defending midfielder Maciej Iwanski 8.

smelltheglove

I've posted on here for several years now and most assuredly, if it helps you, do not post against anything other than the rabid huns who pollute my country.

Kooshty with that?

mcgraininspain @ 7:43

Is this the Macari transfer fee in 1973? If so I think it was £200K. Actually was in the Stretford End for his debut that day. He played very very well and actually scored that day. The second in a 2 - 2 draw ith West Ham after Manure had been 2 -0 down.

Of course my memory might not be all that it never was!!

Paul67

just noted that Hamilton go to RFC on wed in the cup

surely this will be the perfect oppurtunity to scrutinise their behaviour ...as no doubt some in their number will be gearing up to subject Mccarthy to yet more abuse

Strathclde Police will never have a better chance to act on racist singing ..the ground will be half full and they can`t say they haven`t been warned

Zbyszek

5 foot 7 and 1/2 inches?

He's the right height for our small team. Hope the scouts know him.

Catch you all later.

EdwardUrsus,
It makes me chuckle, that, for about 20 year, scotlands shame your preference, if I'm not mistaken ? could have filled every bigot seat with a human being X 10, but are scared to believe. Be honest, are most "scotlands shame" supporters, church going christians?

Oh And,
Do you consider the orange lodge an religous organisation ?
(can you find Christs teachings in any of their docturine?)

EDB,
I got called a bigot for a similar generalisation :oD

macari,,,,

the judas of the 70's

I think animosity between Legia and Wisla and Lech Poznan are bigger than between Legia and Polonia, from one city. I know it's strange.

setting free the bears

You don't need the man for hanging the curtains in windows. You need the nimble player.

Once A Bhoy @ 8:51 PM

I agree with you mate, JR called it right, unfortunately the people doing the comparing will be either the polis, or the Scottish football authorities, and we both know where their loyalty lies.

Edward Ursus

On match day do you frequent any of the pubs on Paisley Road West?

If so, Are there alot of Neds in those pubs on match days?

If not, Do you frequent any hardcore Rangers pubs??

Purely out of a sense of curiousity am I asking.

Cheers

Roccobhoy

PF ayr at 9:06

As long as we remain in Scotland we will never see the back of them. But you are correct in what you say re timing. If their racism and their bigotry leads to further sanctions from UEFA they may not be invited to join any future European league if such a body were to be formed. Then it really would be good riddance to bad rubbish.

At all costs we must not allow ourselves to be lumped in with them. Keep a safe distance I say. Free from contamination. This joint venture with 5% cost on away tickets is something that should have been sidestepped. It allows the perpetuation of the
'Old Firm' tag.

I am of the view their support can not change. Just give them enough rope.....

Fine Girl Y'Ar.

Surprised and upset at the vitriol directed at me.

Goodnight guys.

Hi bournesouprecipe TNT Blantyre Tim and ELDB1

I too have never watched the Sevlle game , I was gutted leaving the ground , my mate was greetin his eyes out , all the way back into Seville that was some walk , still remind him to this day :)

is this the newest clique -

EDB1,

I know how you feel buddy !! :-)

Sleep Well

PF ayr, I’m not sure a half full Ibrox will result in much chanting at all, the away games are far more likely.

theplanner 8.59pm;
Exactly!

Canamalar :- I have no idea how many Rangers fans attend a religous service on a weekly basis but would imagine it runs at the same low level as most of the population.
On whether I think the Orange order is religous, you are asking the wrong one, as a non believer who has never been a member of the order I honestly couldn't say. I'm somewhat familiar with the bible but have no idea of the constitution of the order so can't comment.
I do know that there are members of the 9order who see it as a religous organisation.

Aw Naw

You don't. You deserve it! LOL:o)

I only suffer at the hands of the CQN school bully but the whole class hates you :-) LOL

schlaf Schoen

‘a racist incident is any incident which is perceived to be racist by the victim or any other person’.

The above is the home office definition of a racist incident and therefore the one used by the police and courts to decide guilt or innocence.

If McArthur had complained to the police on Saturday that he perceived comments directed at him as being racist would action have been taken? Probably not but there would still be a better chance of some sort of investigation should an individual complain than a whole load of Celtic fans walking up to every police officer at the next home game against them and saying 'Arrest those 7000, officer, I perceive their singing to be racist'

Unlike some, I do not believe 7000 Rangers fans sang the song at Celtic Park. Quite a few thousand but not all 7. It's like saying the whole Celtic away support sing IRA songs. They do not.Just making a point,please don't start another song debate!

Unfortunately for rangers, should this song be officially recognised as racist by UEFA then it is the club, not the persons singing it that wil be punished.

However, I believe that the fact that the song is continuing to be highlighted in the media (well some parts of the media!) will eventually result in individuals being arrested and if convicted of a racially motivated crime, specifically in relation to the song, this will hopefully result in more arrests and hopefully the song's demise. I use hopefully as I am not wholly convinced that this would be the case.

However, should somebody be arrested for singing the song and found not guilty at court, where do we go from there?

Roccobhoy :- I don't often go into pubs in Glasgow (I go for a drink in my local first most times) on match days but the few times I do it tends to be the Lord Nelson in Nelson Street. Two reasons for this, it's handy for the subway to the game and I used to live above it some 45 year ago.
I would count this as a hardcore Rangers pub and yes you do get neds in it however my opinion is that most neds get tanked up on a "cerry oot" before the game rather than in a pub.

EDB1

Keep the Faith and that of our fathers....

BT

Ed

Cheers

A comment to oneantonrogan and others earlier in the day who have argued against "Faith schools". It seems schools of a Catholic persuasion are only cited as a "problem" re integration here in the west of Scotland and in the Six Counties.

The world over they exist, as far as I understand, and thrive without out the denigration of those who did not attend them but feel compelled to hold them resposible for all the ills of society.

OneScotlandnotatalltolerantofTARRIERS.

Go on the SFA, SPL, the polis and the REARS. You can do it. Go on. Personally I have no faith in any of you but I will hold my fire further to see what transpires. You are fighting a losing fight unless you start punishing that club seriously for their sewer dwelling rat fan behaviour (excluding the godd one because there are some in existance). These people are the lowest of the low and will not heed plea after plea. Only arrest or a major punishment for the club, ie. close the Copland Road stand, refuse their away fans entry to CP, a fine of a good few hundred thousand pounds (if Paul67 is to be believed, and I don't doubt him, they ill afford this) or alas points deductions which is within the SPL rules, then nothing will change. I do not foresee any of the punishments I have mentioned occurring any time soon but you never know.

You know guys, there is such a lot on here about religion... Catholics, Protestants, bigotry, sectarianism etc. So, permit me to flag up the Humanist Society's latest campaign..." There's Probably No God, So Stop Worrying And Enjoy Your LIfe." godislikesanta csc

huge union flags
england's national team's song book played by the club before games
we are the people
the sash
derry's walls

british protestant supremecy is the core belief

Irish Catholics and their descendants are the enemy.

I Hope Celtic football club win at least the next 7 league titles.

Ulster-Celt

EDB,
kooshty.

EU,
I note you dont take issue with the potential replacement support strategy.

kingoh 9.58, were you at that game I have the misfortune to sit close to them if it was not 7,000 then it was 6,999.
Hail,Hail

Man On

i think i remember seeing you, and your mate after the game‹(•¿•)›

don't mention cliques. the clique debate will start again there

are many cliques on here the worst of which, is the clique that don't respond to the other cliques

and the clique that think CQN is a clique clique

Hail Hail

I'm thinking along the same lines as Greenlion2 @8.49pm...

Why has there all of a sudden been comment from the SFA about this? What has been the trigger? It's been present since last season, through their UEFA Cup run (stagger?). So why the sudden prominance?

I'm suspecting pressure from somewhere, but don't necessarily think it's from Ibrox.

ColumboCSC

Evening St Pats hows the handicap ?

"By ElDiegoBhoy1 on October 27, 2008 8:32 PM
As I said earlier and nobody picked up on it.

Ban Catholic schools? Not in my lifetime will my children, or hopefully grandchildren, share a desk with the offspring of the filth that pollutes my country."

As one who believes in the separation of religion from the state, including in education, I'll pick up on your comment.

Not being a christian, I am unfamiliar with every aspect of the faith. But I thought that it preached, among other things, tolerance and understanding.

Some people may well be filth, but does it follow that their children and grandchildren deserve to be tarred with the same brush? Or conversely that your own descendants will be above reproach?

This kind of supremacist nonsense exactly mimics the "we arra people" thinking that we see from those you purport to despise. The attitude behind your post, imho, is as arrogant, divisive and hateful as anything I have seen on this blog.

Well said Gordon_ J, my sentiments exactly.

Weebobbycollins :- I agree 100% though I don't know if that will help any :-)

UlsterCelt :-
Huge union flags. Why not? the union flag is the flag of our country. Unless you stay in one of the three counties in the ROI then like it or not it's the flag of your country as well.

England national team songbook? I disagree with you on that one, I hate it when Rangers fans sing English songs swing low being an example but as with the flag I see nothing wrong in singing British songs.

We are the people? I think it's daft and meaningless.

The Sash :- Maybe a slightly grey area, the song isn't sectarian but the symbol is a symbol of a sectarian organisation but perfectly legal to sing.

Derry's Walls? There is nothing sectarian in that song, it tells of a battle a long time ago and there is no difference between that and any song sung at Celtic park involving old battles.

Lubo1977

You present a plausible premise but I think there have been a large number of Celtic fans including myself, rolling this ball up to the top of the hill. WH might have given it the final push over the edge but many Celtic fans have been advocating, complaining, explaining, deriding, challenging, e mailing and ultimately keeping the pressue on.

A picture of this emerges from two threads on KDS but I'm sure that is only a reflection of a greater ground swell.

There are many many posts covering all the points of principle already mentioned here, motivations, effective action, why none, how the media, Rangers, The Police and Scottish Football Authorities all come out of the mishandling of this issue.

The first one covering the above at

http://kerrydalestreet.co.uk/topic/8028088/1/

has been closed because a new phase was entered at Hamilton, not so much because of the McCarthy chants because they again highlighted the racist issue but because NOTHING HAPPENED as a result. This was the inaction too far. It had become mob rule and I am sure that some in authority were sick and fed up with what had become evasion of responsibility.

Whatever the ball is on the other side of the hill, it might need less pushing but probably more steering to get the desired result.

The second thread on KDS is more about that but duplicates some of the points made in the orginal thread.

http://kerrydalestreet.co.uk/topic/8030513/1/

Its a long long read wandering off into the history of the famine itself and all the various slights in the media. I tried to keep a track focusing on the illegality of the song and what to do about it. I posted under Auldyin.

As an aside I think it a fascinating study of how folks minds work and how the Internet can play a role in bringing into and keeping focus.

Canamalar :- I honestly didn't see anything to comment on in that one, I wasn't trying to dodge anything.

stpatricksbhoy

I don't sit near them but I get a good view of them unfortunately! Not good enough to spot how many were not singing the song. Perhaps I am being naive but I do not believe every single Rangers fan in the stadium that day is a racist.

EdwardUrsus

what song about old battles have been sung at celtic park
in recent years?

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend.. Wee Bobby

Humanist Society?

They are just a bunch o' Hopers.

They Hope they ur Right... Fur if they ur no.... Then there is Nae Hope fur Them..

Look, it is a Fifty Fifty shot...

Is there a God? or There isnae a God.

No a bad bet...

If ye nevah, evah intend tae Actually Find Oot!

Me...

Ah always try tae Hedge Ma bets...

I say there is a God!

If I am wrang....

Nae Sweat!

Right? Right!

But, oan the ither haun...

If there is a God, right enough?

Bingo! Ah'm Golden!

It's awe a Maitter o' showing a wee bit

Uncoammon Common Sense~

Kojo.
yer pal.. who is ayeways fly free... at awe times

should read what songs ( last post by me)

Auldheid

In your other guise on KDS your avatar frightens me !

Ed

I hope your not going to tell me I am British too.

the symbolisim and songs support the idea of British Protestant Supremecy, and therefore is encouraged by your club and embraced by the supporters of your team.

the natural enemy therefore are Irish Catholics.

I am only stating Facts.

I hope we win the next 17 leagues now.

Ulster-Celt

EdwardUrsus
On what you sing and we sing I posted this on KDS.

The reason all this started is that one authority UEFA, deemed the Billy Boys sectarian. It incited violence against a religion. It was sung by intolerant narrow minded bigots but it was the words "up to our knees in Fenian blood" that made it different because that has a violent intent against an identifiable religion.

Whilst lots of songs on both sides offend the other, there is a defense that offense is not the intent, but a celebration of the tribal history.

There is no way to prove intent and if there is another song blue or green that meets the sectarian criteria on which the Billy Boys was banned, is it being sung to any noticable degree? Does any exist (on either side)?

That Celtic have deemed certain songs offensive is an in house choice but that does not make the songs sectarian and if anyone tried to take action on that basis they would have to prove the song was directly wishing ill will on a relgious group.

The minutiae and clarity required to distinguish all the other traditional songs on both sides from The Billy Boys has been lost in a desperate attempt by the Billy Boy songsters to get even or find something they could get away with singing that was nevertheless symbolic of the hatred such people have for Catholics.

BJK, which escaped legal challenge because the one person who could mount the challenge was dead, just was not vile enough. The same cesspit had to spawn TFS, but in this they have cocked it up, they have overlooked that the living, even as a group can mount a challenge using the racist content of TFS as the vehicle.

When this is over they will have to find someone else's dead memory to revile for their next number.

Edward I do not include you with such people who have hatred for Catholics but they exist. BJK and TFS is proof of that.

Kingoh :- You are correct on that, Rangers do have racist fans but not all Racists support Rangers and not all Rangers fans are racist. A bit like the old ven diagram examples we got at school.

Bournesouprecipe :- I'm no expert in the songs sung at Celtic Park so if no songs are sung about old battles or struggles then my point doesn't make sense. How about we have as much right to sing Deerry's Walls as Celtic fans have to sing about historic events in their history.

UlsterCelt :- I wouldn't dream of telling you what nationality to consider yourself but when I said that like it or not the Union Flag is the flag of the country I too was only stating facts.
I also hope you never win another league title nevermind the next 17 :-)

Paul, you deleted my post. Why ? There were no typed out swear words and the reference to the polis was obviously jocular. No harm in it at all. Even the Finest would find no fault.

It took me three hours to compose that post too. Running about the house looking up dictionaries then hunting under the bed for a thesaurus. At the end of it I had to go for a rest. Then I come back to find it has been deleted. And just when I was about to change my mind too and agree with everything you said !

Och well, it's good that I believe in redemption too.

PeatSmithfan csc LOL

Fine Girl Y'Ar.

ElDiegfo
I'm a pussycat with no teeth.

kingoh -neither do I,I gave one the credit of innocence.

Lurgan 53 - I was responding to a question from whitedoghunch (I think). I'm happy to stand corrected, it was along time ago.

Ed - if I might continue with our chat over the last couple of nights. OK, we are in complete agreement that the support of Rangers FC is not an homogenous lump of reactionary bile but I think you used the term, a gradation of views.

Edward, I cannot be any more direct with my question. Just what is it that the liberal wing of your support is doing to condemn the reactionary mass, to offer support to those in the club who seek change, and to act as allies to the millions of ordinary Catholics, Scots-Irish, Irish and Celtic supporters who are at the receiving end of this attack.

And Edward if the answer to my question is that this gradation is doing nothing, is it any surprise many Celtic supporters see all your fellow supporters as 'filth'.

It is time for all good Rangers supporters to speak up.

McGrain

EdwardUrsus

Your rethink is better ‹(•¿•)›

Poor Ed :oD

bournesouprecipe

You forgot about me. I'm in a clique o ma ain :)

apologies if this has already been posted.
from todays daily record.
KENNEDY GETS BACK TO HIS BEST AS LOAN STAR.
on-loan celtic star john kennedy is earning rave reviews with norwich in the english championship.
The 6ft 2in stopper,who has had such bad luck with knee injuries,is at carrow road until january and boss Glenn roeder would love to keep him longer.
The former newcastle and west ham manager said; "I would go so far as to say John is the best centre half i have ever worked with.They don't make men like him now.
"He is a warrior who has been so unlucky in his life with injuries.John would not look out of place in any league in the world.
"I can understand why AC milan were about to bid for him prior to his horrific injury he got with Scotland against Romania.
He certainly wouldn't be here if that hadn't happened."

mcgrain

Suchlike posts will get you hammered.

edbfragilecsc

Auldheid :- I read your post with interest and I agree with you 100% on the BB song.
I'd like to make it clear though that in my post I was refering to one specific song Derry's Walls and comparing it to songs sung by Celtic fans celebrating old struggles. I think both sets of fans have the right to sing these songs as long as they are not threatening others for being somehow different as in the BB's

Kojo,

would you consider the banking collapse as an argument/proof that capitalism does not work ?

isn't it ironic that having had a uefa directive on the banned lyric in hell‹(•¿•)› hell‹(•¿•)›

they switched the lyrics to something else even more offensive on 31/08/08 and get away with it

only they are indeed, the people.

Kingoh, I expect an arrest for singing this song in the near future at Ibrox and certainly at Celtic Park if it occurs again.

Ulster-Celt, I am of a mind to say that as each subsequent league title is won, getting to 10 becomes ever more achievable.

EDB, I’ve just picked up on your baited ‘throw a bomb and run away’ comment when reading Gordon J. Deleted, rascalness.

Gallowgate, the **’s used to complete the F word breaks the rules, sorry, rules and rules.

I for one am glad that action is finally being taken by the authorities on that song. It has taken longer than it should have but let's look on the positive: something is now happening.

The whys and hows or motivations are not particularly important. Action is what counts. Not just to embarrass RFC or to advantage us in some way. But because this kind of chanting and the attitudes behind it have no place in our society.

well said weebobbycollins

Auldheid

Sorry about that (good moniker)

but there's hunners of auld heid's on here

St Mirren v Celtic 24th Feb 2008

Soft free kick awarded to Celtic 28 yards from goal. Celtic score from the resulting free kick. Headlines, uproar, days of phone in debates followed. (A free kick 28 yards from goal.)

Motherwell v Celtic 3rd May 2008

Celtic awarded a corner with 11 minutes remaining which TV slow motions show came off Bobo Balde and not the Motherwell defender. Celtic score from the resulting corner. Headlines, uproar, days of phone in debates (Davie Provan famous quote to Daryl Broadfoot "..you sound like a fan now Daryl..." as Daryl demanded the referee explain his award because the "ref in the St Mirren match" (see above) explained his decision.

Celtic v St Mirren 10th Aug 2008

Celtic awarded a penalty after 61 minutes after JVOH is pulled back when in the act of shooting. Soft award. Celtic score from the resulting penalty. Headlines, uproar, days of phone in debates. Referee Smith accused of being on Celtic charters to European matches, relation to Phil O'Donnell, general press frenzy follows. (Smith forced into statement confirming he was on 2 Celtic charters in his role as Police Commander for away European games. He also confirms he has been on 3 Rangers charters in same capacity and 2 Scotland charters.)

Hamilton v Rangers 25th October 2008

Kris Boyd scores from a clear offside position to put Rangers 2-1 ahead after trailing 1-0. Headlines follow emphasising Boyd's wonderful GIRUY to Scotland manager George Burley. No headlines about clear offside goal, no uproar and no phone-in debates for 5 minutes never mind day after day.

Hamilton v Rangers 25th October 2008

17 year old boy verbally abused throughout match. Racist Famine Song heard thorughout match, adapted specifically for 17 year old boy. Rangers fans ejected from Hamilton end as trouble breaks out. Headlines focus on 25 year old Kris Boyd being taunted by "One George Burley" chants.

THE IMPARTIALITY OF THE SCOTTISH MEDIA IN SPLENDID TECHNICOLOUR

U2_1988, your last point is not entirely fair, as several papers have picked up on the James McCarthy chants (even the Record) and only one that I've read/seen linked to has mentioned the Kris Boyd ones.

The thing I find most incredible about Eddie Smith's impartiality being called into question because he married the sister of someone who used to play for Celtic 10 years ago, is that his nephew was playing for St Mirren in the same game.

For General Interest...

A wee story... a wee Johnny McGrory..

"During the American Civil War.. which pitted Brother against Brother..Kin agin Kin..

The Importance of A Flag, became the All encompasing Raison d'etre, for the Conflict..

After all, here was a symbol..that wrapped up all the loose ends in the Political Argument..and boiled it down to something that was visible and tangible..

The Stars and Stripes...and... The Stars and Bar.

In the final moments of a terrible and awful battle, for some particular piece of woodland.. somewhere in Kentucky... in the driving Snow and Sleet..

A young Captain in the 45thNew York Volunteers, saw that his own Father, whom he knew to be a General in the Kentucky19th of Foot... was lying in the snow.. mortally wounded... as the smoke cleared and the fighting moved on.. the Young son, approached his Dad,who was breathing heavily,and it was obvious he had not much time left on this earth.

His Father looked up at his son. Recognition,flickered in his eyes..
and he said this....

"Albert my boy, we meet under the most difficult of circumtances... a sorrow that is too painful to bear..

Please do me the Honor of Propping me against that trunk.. so, as I die and go to meet my maker... My Last sight will be the sight of that Glorious Standard, that is Driven into the soil over there.

The Glorious Stars and Bars.

The young Son, listened, and regretfully turned away from his dying father.

That Night the Young Man... Deserted.

Kojo.
yer pal.. who likes everyboady..except, during the odd time that we lose a game tae the G.A.

Gordon
I agree. I just want it to stop because it reflects badly on this country in many many ways.

Punishing Rangers was not the end for me but the means to it.

Paul67 October 27, 2008 9:50 PM

Whilst it may be more likely of the away support, do not be so sure. They cannot help themselves.

gallowgate on October 27, 2008 10:36 PM

I missed the deleted post and have enjoyed your posts.Without putting you thru the pain of 3hrs searching thesaurus, what was the jist? (Polis points aside. Some of my best pals are polis from both sides).

mcgraininspain on October 27, 2008 10:40 PM

Like you I enjoy Eds post and like you I have questioned the silence of the rest of the support. It may well be a minority singing the bile but it would require a recount to confirm.

bournesoup

I could claim I was a wan aff but others might say more a ker than an aff.:)

Ok Paul, no probs.

Oneantonrogan,

The issue is one of proportion. There was indeed mention of the chants in several newspapers. Mention, somewhere in the text of the articles.

Those articles were not "about" those chants. The headlines were "about" Kris Boyd and George Burley, the articles were "about" Kris Boyd.

I fully stand by the final item being fair. My point is entirely about the proportion of reaction and the contrast in how the Scottish media react to controversy and "create" controversy in line with their own agenda.

Kojo, you make me laugh( and i do a lot of that, cause i enjoy a good laugh ) but what you say reminds me of a time when my dear mammy and daddy came to stay with me on holiday. The first sunday, my dad asks where the local chapel is, he and my mammy want to go to mass. After nearly choking on my cornflakes I reminded him that I had only ever seen him in chapel at weddings and funerals, to which he replied that he had seen the light- the error of his ways etc. At this, my devout mum winked and said, " He's no taking any chances son. It's his insurance policy." And more than twenty years later, he still goes... and in fact he's now a pass keeper. threestepstoheaven csc.

Paul 67 says with regard to Rangers:

"I didn’t suggest that Rangers deserve our “unconditional encouragement or support”. I have been strong critics of Walter Smith and David Murray in the past, but in recent weeks they have both been critical of their own fans.

I chose to acknowledge this; you are free to chose differently. I believe that more of this is the way forward and that Smith, Murray and even Peat will find acknowledgement scarce among their normal constituency.

For what it’s worth, I too believe in redemption".

The notion of Rangers redeeming themselves is one that any right-minded person would welcome. I for one would love to hate what Rangers do in footballing terms against us as opposed to hate the ridicule and hatred they sing in mockery of my ancestors.

But at a time when it is obvious that Rangers (by very obvious smears against Celtic) are spending a fortune on black PR in a bid to divert attention from their racism my redemptive ambitions are at a low ebb if not spent.

I don't know if this is true or not but I was informed many years ago, by whom I do not remeber, that the REARS socks were traditionally white with a red band at the top and that that red band represented 'Up to our knees in fenian blood'. Sounds a bit far fetched but can anyone confirm?

SettingFreeTheBears & Zybsek,

Majcei Rybus? How did he play?

U2_1888 on October 27, 2008 10:54 PM

DOH! That's why we're paranoid.

What get's me is a "minority" of them still believe the media is pro us.Thank goodness for seperate schools.:>)))

Edward
Cheers. I realise that but there must be a number of songs on both sides that celebrate the history without being sectarian and inciting violence.

Not being that up to date on the fans top ten football songs I'm not sure but had someone declared the criteria on which TBBs was deemed sectarian that might have ended the tit for tat that ensued.

TFS though legally falls foul of racism not sectarianism and is a different kind of odious fish.

Weebobbycollins, Gordon J, et al

I'm with you all on EDB's unfortunate comments. The "rascal"!

Seems to me that sweeping generalisations are often at the core of racist/sectarian comments - all Rangers fans are "filth" or all Celtic Fans are Catholics/Fenians!

humanists@cqn. Edward feel free to sign up too!!

So George Peat thinks about what he may - or may not - do, and we speculate on whether an arrest or two will be made, and what will happen the next time we meet them at CP. What happens next? It is not the cessation of this song. We sadly know what happens next is the next song.

That's as far as the song affects us. But what about James McCarthy in all this? Will the booing of him stop? Three of Hamilton's next four fixtures? Away to Rangers, away to Motherwell and away to Hearts. He will be 'given stick' at each. If it stops, will the booing of Aiden cease? We've thought it racist for four years.

Hamilton's game after those? Home to us. The one game young McCarhty will not be booed. How sad is it to say that.

On a lighter note, if 'Peat is ready to tackle Famine Song' - can he tackle flying wingers - can he play left-back? Ok, too far.

Sign James in January.

Big Nan

Rangers are not covering themselves with glory are they? What they need is a metanoia.

We occupy the higher ground and when they decide to join us instead of pulling us into their swamp I'll be more than happy to give them a lift.

Metanoia (from the Greek μετάνοια, metanoia, changing one's mind, repentance) is a word which has a few different meanings in different contexts.

Metanoia in the context of theological discussion, where it is used often, is usually interpreted to mean repentance. However, some people argue that the word should be interpreted more literally to denote changing one's mind, in the sense of embracing thoughts beyond its present limitations or thought patterns (an interpretation which is compatible with the denotative meaning of repentance but replaces its negative connotation with a positive one, focusing on the superior state being approached rather than the inferior prior state being departed from.)

and you wont hear metanoia on FF! lol

EDB

As long as there are people like you in the world then racism and sectarianism will flourifh.

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend..WeeBobbyCollins.

See,palomine?

Yer Faither is a smart Fellah...

Take his re-consideration o' his options, tae hert...

At least he is a Family Member who is well endowed wi that scarce commodity!

Uncoammon Sense!

As ah say...

If ye pitch yer Tent in the " Nae God Camp"

Think abooot this,pal...

Ye ur gonna find oot the true answer, sooner or later...

And if ye are wrang...

Well...

It will gie ye sma' comfort.. but ye kin aye look yer fellow Humanist in the Eye ..and say...as baith o' ye, contemplate the roaring ovens, and ur sweating like Billyo.

"Well, noo... is this no

anither FIne Mess,that ye hiv goat me intae,Stanley!"

"But, Ollie.. the Nae God Idea, wiz awe the Rage...everybody wiz intae it!"

Yep, yer auld man... is quite a Guy!

Kojo.
yer pal...who likes ye a loat.

ElDiegoBhoy1

If you meant that the way it sounded then I am afraid you are every bit as bad as the worst Protestant bigot. The proportion of good and bad folk is equal among Protestants and Catholics. To say otherwise would be shocking.

This is a superb site but the level of disrespect and utter ignorance of Protestantism 'it not a denomination its just a bunch of people protesting against us' etc shown fairly frequently on this site is every bit as bad as the prod bigot ignorantly saying Catholics worship Mary instead of god etc. Incidentally its also a huge example of what segregated schooling and/or indoctrination does for some - an almost Medieval ignorance, misunderstanding and demonisation of 'the other'.

Just my opinion but if there is a god, I feel sure those who put their denomination/church above the tolerant spirit of the universal Christian message of Jesus are for the high jump.

U2_1888

i agree on your 'create controversy theory'

no controversy was more clearly created that when the celtic fan ran on the pitch and touched dida. this was the perfect modern contoversy created from the moment it happened the coverage of a very very trivial thing was turned into something it wasn't.

it was of course a hun reaction to the fact celtic had just beaten the european champions
and bhoy did it hurt badly, yes in dida.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/scotland/article5026822.ece

Another wee story re Naka possibly going home.

Personally I am a mega fan of the wee man. He has skill and composure to spare. Howevvah, and I quote Kojo deliberately, if the figures being bandied about are approaching accurate(circa £5M) and only PL knows, it may well be an opportune time to cash in. This said on the proviso that the money is used to strengthen the 1st team, not the squad, in the knowledge that the wee man is somewhat off the boil.

Further to the above. Let's see Koki in the wee cup and a wee bit more of Paddy. I see Ben scored a trio agin ICT as well.

All those refusing/unable to watch the Seville game, do yourselves a favour and watch it. We got narrowly defeated by THE in-form team in Europe at that time, so much in-form that they won the European cup the next season. Don't know about anyone else, but I left the stadium feeling extremely proud that night (I was expecting a humping) on the walk from the city centre to the game, I couldn't for the life of me figure out how anyone could play football in that heat, let alone a Scottish team.

Watching the Sportscene highlights tonight, that Bob Malcolm takes a mean free kick, what to do when Naka moves? eh :)

mcgraininspain
I agree but when you are going against the tribal way it takes a lot of courage to stand up and say that the tribal way needs changing.

In that respect decent Celtic supporters can encourage the silent at Rangers to speak out rather than criticise them for failing to. We can also help the silent at Rangers by demonstrating that we are NOT all hun haters ourselves, that we are more discerning than not and in so doing demolish the arguments use by "huns" to maintain a vile divide rather than a civil one.

jeez_I_thought_blinker_was_pants October 27, 2008 11:27 PM

The last line may well be tongue in cheek, but wash yer mouth out man.

wehaveabitecsc.......:>)))

jeez

i don;t watch because they are/where cheats,
i was hugely proud of celtic that night and it will live with me for ever,

McGraininSpain :- That's a hard one to give a full answer to, what I will say is what I've either seen or been personally involved in. This includes things such as asking folk to justify what they say, sometimes if you have someone young this can work, with others it has no chance and you get the reply that they are all fenians and deserve it or others will reply that they sing about us but as I said sometimes it works.
Another course is to try and get folk to stop singing specific songs either because it's morally wrong or from pragmatic reasons such as doing this will harm the club.
There is also example, by not speaking about Celtic fans in a certain way and explaining why I don't I hope that some others will be influenced. You may not think any of the above is enough or even much but it's not something that could have been done with any effect as recently as 15 year ago and it's my own small way of contributing.
As for others I honestly can't answer for them they have to decide what they see as the best way to eradicate hatred.

Moonbeamswetdream :- I can assure you that is not the case, I posted on here once before about it and the red topped socks were worn for roughly 5 years before the formation of the Billy Boys gang and before the song was ever sung. If you like I can get the site that shows when the socks were first worn. It's actually a good site as it has all the strips worn by all the teams in the SPL and EPL.

Tallbhoy :- At last, a CQN clique I can belong to :-)

good night and god bless..

to the non believers good night...:)

hail hail and keep the faith

If anyone is interested this is the site showing strips I was talking about, it has all the historical strips of all the Scottish league clubs and all the English ones.

Auldheid on October 27, 2008 11:30 PM
mcgraininspain
"I agree but when you are going against the tribal way it takes a lot of courage to stand up and say that the tribal way needs changing."

I see where you are coming from, but it is not "the tribal way", sure it's only a minority.lol.

If anyone is interested this is the site showing strips I was talking about, it has all the historical strips of all the Scottish league clubs and all the English ones.

http://www.historicalkits.co.uk/Scottish_Football_League/Scotland_Index.htm

jeez_I_thought_blinker_was_pants

they tell me it was close - but its still too raw.:/)

I haven't watched the Seville game either - when we went to see "The Celts in Seville" (the big screen footage during that was the first time I've seen any of it other than Henrik's goals) I was amazed to see how close Rab Douglas got to the last goal - as a sidebar, special thanks to the Pavilion for recreating the heat that was in the theatre that day :-)

At the time when I got back home I was hurting too much (got back to Glasgow early on the Sunday, went to sleep for a couple of hours, woke up for the afternoon's title-deciding games, which nailed on my decision not to rewatch the final), since then the need to watch it has never materialised. I was so proud of all my fellow fans that day though - the YNWA that went up after the final whistle was one of my proudest moments as a Celtic fan, even in defeat.

It also gives you a reminder why Shaun Maloney should never take corner kicks! (Now that WAS depressing!)

kojo and the manfromgodknowswhere.

I have this theory that there is a "what is" and the rest we all make up. We are doing it now (I'm making this up).

Anyhoo what differentiated Jesus from everyone else is that he worked out how it is, that God is not a person but is "THE IS" and was happy to accept that and go with it.

When we shuffle of our mortal clogs we will either have learned to live with what IS as Jesus did or not go there. The choice will be ours not Gods for "isness" just is.

Where will we go? We will not go anywhere we will just think we have and keep on making things up, including a new version of self.

Beats fire and brimstone and a nutter God eh?

Then again I'm making it all up.

It's been a pleasure again guys and gals, and as a wise man often said "May your God go with you".
For the humanists out there, it's all one being pc but I'm glad I have something to aspire to.:>))

Gordon_J

I am with you. I find it amazing when people cant see their own attitudes are a big part of the problem. That’s not the first post showing attitudes of real ignorance towards protestants but its the most extreme. I hope this is a misunderstanding but I am not a happy camper.

TMFGKW

EdwardUrsus

nice link, i see why you used to be called the light blues before the huns;/)

Cheers Ed. That is a good site too.

Auldheid
I`m afraid your metanoia may well be related to paranoia,if only semantically!

i am determined that my children will be brought up in their father's religion,
if they can find out what it is.

BIG AL.

Kojo, do you not think that if there WIZ a god we would now be lookin at 120 in a row and that the rearrangers fans would have to carry copper finials to the game cause every time they started singing TFS he would hit them with multiple lightning bolts??? Glad am yer pal...I like ye a loat tae.

Once a Bhoy
No the minority are the loudest voice of the tribal way and some aspects of the tribal way no longer serve that tribe. Time to let go.

Look at Celtic. We started leaving behind those aspects a while ago that no longer serve us.

Being the Stars of Seville serves us better than being the Mankies of Manchester for example.

The tide of change is rising:

Come gather round people
Wherever you roam
And admit that the waters
Around you have grown
And accept it that soon
Youll be drenched to the bone.
If your time to you
Is worth savin
Then you better start swimmin
Or youll sink like a stone
For the times they are a-changin.

Bob Dylan

My dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,dear,friend... canamalar..

Foist o' all...

To remark that we are witnessing the demise of the Banking System is being somewhat premature.

Banks will ayeways, be with us...they ur like Freckles..or Fleas...or Shirt/fly buttons that ayeways come aff at the maist inconvenient o' times.

Why dae ye think Ah am Buyin' ma Banking Favorites...?

Na... we wull ayeways need Banks,pal. nae doot aboot that...

Sure, the Shaky and the Insolvent and the Badly Run Banks wull be absorbed and vanish like a Celtic Supporter who foon oot tae his horror.... that he wiz oan the wrang supporters bus..oan account the he had had a wee bit too much tae drink...but that is anither story..

Palomine...

Capitalism, woiks...

It is the fault of Capitalism.. GONE WILD...GONE NATIVE... GONE SPARE...

That his caused this terrible trouble in the Glen..

Howevvvahhhhhhhhh...

Right at this very moment.. The Propah Steady Level Heided kind of Capitalism is once more re-assserting itself..

It has Fettered and Imprisoned Mr.Hyde...

And from noo oan ...

The Only Form of Capitalism that wull be practised from noo oan, wull be the Dr.Jekyll, Kind...

Fur ye see.. it is like this....

Everyboady who is anyboady, knows too much Cholesterol is a No No..

But, as ye know....

There are TWO FORMS O' CHOLESTEROL...

The GOOD KIND, that ye require... And the BAD KIND..that ye kin dae withoot.

Well,laddie...it is the same thing wi' Capitalism....

Ye need Capitalism ...but, Only the Good Kind~

Kojo.
yer pal..who likes ye a loat.

I am greatly impressed by Paul's article.
I think he delicately plays his notes like Yehudi Menuhin on a Stradivarius.
Just the right mixture of encouragement, approval & flattery.
Adagissimo, pianissimo.
Play on, maestro.

macjay
It will be a struggle but eventually self interest will make the idea of change thinkable. After that anything is possible.

Life is designed to be self correcting.

That God knew what he was doing when he installed free will. Its like a computer game, there are many roads, but to get to the next level you have to go down a few.

I heard Gordon Waddell on RS tonight talking about the songs issue and he mentioned that Rankers fans were very hypocritical because a few years ago they objected to being referred to as huns and by and large this has now ceased

Genuine question - I was away from Scotland from 2000 - 2003 . Did that happen and did someone at Celtic agree to this?

Kojo

On Capitalism:

Indeed! Its as I said, life is designed to be self correcting. We are currently being taught that lesson.

So game 5 is about to start in Philadelphia. The Phillies are 3-1 up and can clinch it all over the next three or four hours.

I'm officially excited!

NO BIG BAD CATHOLICS = NO BIG BAD CELTIC = NO BIG BAD CQN

you're not reading this.....

Nite,

WG

Gordon J

As well as wishing to win the WS in Phillie I bet you also could use some earlier bedtimes.

Excited and confident - or excited and nervous

Gordon_J

What you reckon for tonight?

Phillies to finally get their 2nd world series?

A bit nervous to be honest - the Rays have comeback a few times and they will be fighting for their lives. This won't be an easy game.

I'm hoping for an early lead and take it from there!

jinkysboy

Who you been cheering for Rays or Phillies?

hang the dj

Gotta be the Phillies

Im a Brewer and they beat us in the 1st round of the play offs so it would be consolation to be beaten by the champs

Also have taken Gordons side on this one and wish him and his team all the best

Been avidly watching the debate tonight guys, but what do you think of this article and the comments by Accies manager Billy Reid?
.
/
/
/

JAMES McCarthy will run a cauldron of hate at Ibrox tonight but manager Billy Reid reckons that will only fire his young starlet up to try and help Hamilton cause a Co-operative Insurance Cup upset.

The Republic of Ireland under-21 playmaker took it in the neck from the Light Blues legions during their 3-1 weekend defeat at New Douglas Park and Reid knows that will be intensified in front of more than 50,000 fans this evening.

The 17-year-old has been singled out as Public Enemy No. 1 because he has agreed to play for the Republic of Ireland, through the grandparent rule, and has since turned down the opportunity to defect to Scotland.

Reid said: “I think James knew he would get stick and he knows it could be even worse when he goes to Ibrox.

“It was inevitable it was going to happen because it is back to the old west of Scotland thing. It has happened on both sides.

“James knows what to expect going to Ibrox and I don’t think he has got any problem with it.James knows what to expect going to Ibrox

Billy Reid
“If there are a couple of songs about James McCarthy then I don’t see what all the hype is about.

“James didn’t say anything to me about it after the game. Maybe it does affect him deep down, I don’t know.

“I didn’t hear the full extent of the abuse because I was concentrating on the game. It isn’t something that worries me too much.

“He is just concentrating on playing for Hamilton Accies. He is an Irish player and he just has to get on with it.”

I ain't a Phillies fan but with the death of Charlie Manuel's mother then I hope they do it.

Was speaking earlier to a guy from Philadelphia who said the city is jumping.

Gordon J / HTDJ

I can imagine - in fact I cant imagine as I have only experienced half a city jumping.

Must be a phenominal experience - I missed out on the Packers winning the Superbowl a few years ago - would have loved to have been in Green Bay when they brought the trophy back

Only saw photos of 1967 - that would have been the best though

We can dream that maybe one day

hang the dj,

The big issue in Philly today is when the victory parade is going to be.

Maybe I'm a pessimist, but I get nervous when the celebrations are planned too early. Get the job done first and then think about the party!

As I've said before, Philly is a sports mad city all year round. The Phillies, Eagles 76ers and Flyers.

It's 25 years since the city had a championship win and it's way overdue. The fans deserve it.

Gordon_J

The past 2 games it looks like Howard has got his swing back & with Hamels pitching I think you could possibly have a wee sip of champers just now.

Gordon_J

One of things Philadelphia is famous for is the fickleness of their fans(glad Celtic don't have any fans like that eh?)

Jimmy Rollins even commented this season that Phillies fans would turn on you in an instant.

I'm afraid that if there is punishment by the SPL or SFA then they will turn around and punish us at the first chance, regardless of the length of time Rangers have been in violation

Mick

Not sure if Reid is trying to play it down for James benefit or just copping out

I would want my manager to come out with all guns blazing though

jinkysboy

“James didn’t say anything to me about it after the game. Maybe it does affect him deep down, I don’t know."

I couldn't believe that comment,he's a manager of a seventeen year old boy and he's not got the common sense to ask him? or maybe he doesn't want to bring up the problem before the game.

At the very least he could have chosen a better way of responding.
IMOH if I was McCarthy's parents I'd be wondering if the manager is trying to support their son,or playing lip service to the vitriol against him.

Should be interesting!

Anyway I'm of to bed!

Adam

I agree, unfortunately we are still tagged with this "old firm" tag & if something happens to one it will happen to the other(except winning the European Cup of course)

The Dark side in thier rascist racist site seen to have completely forgotten thier shame of Manchester 08....

POST 1
Lets face facts - The SPL will NEVER deduct points from us or any other club for chants and songs.

If they tried it, the following would happen:-

Rangers would take the SPL to court, and the SFA for deducting points for songs that havent been identified as being "wrong".
The supporters of Rangers could raise a class action against the SFA and SPL for defemation of character, depending on the wording of the condemnation.
Rangers would refuse any tickets for away games.
Rangers would refuse to sell tickets to away fans at Ibrox.
Weakened teams would be played in both cups.
Rangers would withdraw all players from the Scotland team, at all levels.
Rangers would withdraw from the Setanta deal, and any other sponsorships that are out there.
And if all that hasn't changed their minds, then withdrawl from Europe, and ultimately the league would be the final steps.

The time has come to stand up to these people that go out of their way to hurt us .

POST 2

Quite simply, we should refuse all away tickets for the rest of the season. Watch the diddy clubs go into full-blown panic and turn on the Terrorist Lovers.

Failing that, I'd quite happily resign from the SPL and apply to join the Blue Square Premier.

In fact if I was Chairman I'd be calling an EGM to vote on that very issue. Why continue to line the pockets of those who seek to destroy us?

POST 3

The Famine Song refers to events that killed an estimated one million people in the 1840s and led to a mass migration from Ireland.

I thought, on Saturday, it was directed with irony at a Scottish player who, despite his Scottish roots, has chosen to play for a foreign nation. And, in general, at a set of fans who, despite their Scottish roots, wave flans and sing songs about the same foreign nation.

The common theme being if they're so commited to this foreign land, then why don't they go and live there?

Only in Scotland could this chant be deemed as offensive and indeed racist.

POST 4

Time for Rangers to flatten these c***s and declare war. Withdraw from all sponsorship, withdraw all players from Scotland team and take no away tickets for any competition.....implosion within months, and they'd be begging us to come round the table for a proper 'clear the air discussion'. Vidmar has this spot on.
Do you honestly see a future for us in this League?

We make history by progressing to the Last 16 of the biggest competition around and our FA respond by sending a dossier of 'evidence' to UEFA in an attempt to get us banned (or have our stadium closed) from said competition.

More success just ramps up their hatred and make no mistake, the Taigs would sh1t a collective brick if it looked like we were upping sticks.

We won't be allowed to succeed in this country. Time to go.

pauloantony

re Post 3

I'm all for waving my flan at the next game.

Tiswas csc

G'night nightshift

WGS 11.10

I felt Rybus played well in the last Legia game I'd seen but I did not notice him shine in the Cracow fixture 2nd half- maybe he was subbed or injured.

2 - 0 Phillies after the first. Great start!

pauloantony

Haven't they already removed all players form the scotland team?

2-0 top of second

Great start Phills

Rays pitcher looks out of sorts

Gordon_J

Confident start from Hamels & then a couple of runs in the bottom, the party has started.

hang the dj,

Looking good! Let's ride the Cole train to victory!

WOnder why I feel like a cheesesteak about now?

Gordon_J

They looked a lot more appetising than the pie & bovril I had on Saturday

There can be no doubt that Peat has spoken out now because the Huns have targetted a young Scottish-born footballer - James McCarthy - playing for another Scottish club, for racist and sectarian abuse through the use of the Famine Song.

If the abuse had been limited to Celtic FC and Celtic fans, the SFA would have continued to drag their heels on this as long as possible. The moment these neanderthals spread their poison beyond the boundaries of Glasgow, they shot themselves in the foot.

As for deducting points from them, I for one am totally against that sanction. What honour would there be in winning the SPL title while our biggest rivals have had points deducted.

I have a better idea. Why don't the SFA simply ban them from European competition for one year if they offend again? Make it 2 years for a second offence and 3 years for a third offence and so on. That would be a severe enough punishment without degrading the SPL Championship into a farcical non-event.

Prince
If TFS does not stop and Rangers qualify for Europe UEFA will ban them. They have not so far because until Rangers qualify its not a UEFA matter and as long as the offence occurs in the Scottish game it is for the SFA/SPL to handle under UEFA delegated authority.

It will stop sooner or later.

Baseball Bhoys

Im heading to bed with the Phillies up 2-0 at the top of the fourth

Good luck and dont celebrate too hard

Rays pull back to 2 - 1 after four.

Gordon_J

Game is now official, you think there is any chance with the rain that the umpires will call the game & the Phillies would then win it?

It looks like Glasgow out there! I can't see them stopping it unless it gets an awful lot worse.

dj
not a chance

Gordon, how you doin?

mdbhoy,

Doing good. Even better if we can add a few runs onto this lead!

You?

Sitting enjoying some fine wine but somewhat nervy. Last time the Phillies were in the WS was my fIrst year in the USA (1993. We lost that one.
Philly is nuts right now,and if we get a parade God only knows :)

worried about this weather, great leveler and Hamels has been standing around a long time

You know, I just want this to be over!

Yes me too I just cannot imagine us losing this game (series) does not bear thinking about

Weather cold play a huge part in this game now.

mdbhoy

I think you're right as in they won't call the game but if this was a normal game it would be a rain delay right now

A real shame about the weather. Dont know who you are listening too on TV there but Joe Buck on Fox is so pro Rays I want to puke

Gordon_J & mdbhoy

If you can get another inning out of Hamels, pass it over to the bullpen for the 8th then Lidge in the 9th you will be celebrating your first win in almost 30 years

Auldheid - Fair comment, but what I am saying is, rather than deducting points from Rangers, the SFA could ban them from representing Scotland in European competition, which they have the power to do.

Game tied

Shows you what I Know

We have different comms on the international feed - they want the series to continue.

dj, save the comments :)

Gordon this is worse than watching a Glasgow Derby, do not want to go back to Florida or I may have to get some flights booked

We got a rain delay.

Conditions are not going to get any better, are they?

Due to the delay I don't think we'll be seeing Hamels again

Gordon
Dont think the weather is going to improve and tomorrow is not looking better with rain all day and the temp in the 30's (F)

Is Jesus a Mets fan and doesn't want is to have this at all costs:)

If the game hadn't tied up, would they have stopped?

They would not have stopped the game if the Rays had not tied and in fairmess we would not have wished the game to be called when we were in front

MdBhoy who believes in a fighting chance for all unlike his Hun pals :)

Oh well switch the NFL Colts v Titans (14 v 17) 4th quarter

Mick @12.19,i am not one for idle rumours,so,when i tell you that i have seen,with these eyes of mine,the tattoo on the body of Mr reid,you will understand that his allegiances are with the dark side.

It's 2 - 2 in the middle of the sixth and the game is officially suspended.

Restart from there tomorrow night - assuming that it isn't too wet.

What an anti-climax!

Game now suspended as opposed to delayed. Start at 8pm tomorrow from where they left off though the weather is not supposed to be much better
Nite Gordon and DJ

Nite guys ... bloody frustrated!

Here in Australia, we have ‘State’ schools and we have several ‘denominational’ schools. After more than ten years of living here, I have yet to hear of a single sectarian issue directly traceable to the existence of autonomous Catholic schools.

My children are in Catholic education; at my choice and at my cost. No financial assistance is offered, nor is tax relief granted to me (or others) by the government for lessening the burden of state to educate the population. Quite a high percentage of enrolled children in the Catholic education system are not of the ‘Catholic’ faith.
They are enrolled in the system often because parents have confidence and faith in the system’s ability to deliver a quantifiable and respected education.

Now I love simplicity, simplicity often reveals the greatest truths. For me, ‘Parenting’, ‘Schooling’ and ‘Peer Pressure’ are the three biggest influences on most individuals and how they mature.

I was not a census taker when Celtic played, and were beaten 3 – 2, by Porto in Spain. (Porto and Spain aside) I would be very surprised… if the majority of those who were there to support Celtic had not each been the beneficiary of a ‘Catholic’ education.

I was not a census taker when Rangers played, and were beaten 2 – 0, by Zenit St Petersburg in England. (Zenit and England aside) I would be very surprised… if the majority of those who were there to support Rangers had each been the beneficiary of a ‘Catholic’ education.

Sometimes ‘class and upbringing’ simply shine through… and sometimes it does not. There really is no accounting for poor schooling.

The Token Tim -

Got your e-mail this morning (was out of the office yesterday pm) and will get back to you later.

A few funnies to cheer everyone up on this Arctic morning (2" of no in the higher parts of Aberdeen overnight, but nothing on Union Street!)

Before attempting to remove stubborn stains from a garment, always circle the stain in permanent pen, so that when you remove the garment from the washing machine you can easily locate the area of the stain and check that it has gone.

Don't waste money buying expensive binoculars. Simply stand next to the object you wish to view.

Always poo at work. Not only will you save money on toilet paper,but you'll also be getting paid for it.

Weight watchers. Avoid that devilish temptation to nibble at a chocolate bar in the cupboard or fridge by not buying the ******* thing in the first place.

Save on booze by drinking cold tea instead of whisky. The morning after, you can create the effects of a hangover by drinking a thimble full of washing up liquid and banging your head repeatedly on the wall.

Recreate the fun of a visit to a public swimming pool in your home by filling the bath with cold water, adding two bottles of bleach, then urinating into it, before jumping in.

Don't buy expensive 'ribbed' condoms, just buy an ordinary one and slip a handful of frozen peas inside it before you put it on.

Thicken up runny low-fat yoghurt by stirring in a spoonful of lard.

Olympic athletes. Disguise the fact that you've taken steroids by running a bit slower.

Smokers. Save on matches and lighters, by simply lighting your next fag from the butt of your last one.

Vegetarians coming to dinner? Simply serve them a nice bit of steak or veal. Since they're always going on about how tofu, Quorn, meat substitute etc 'tastes exactly like the real thing', they won't know the difference.

Invited by vegetarians for dinner? Point out that since you'd no doubt be made aware of their special dietary requirements, tell them about yours, and ask for a nice steak.

High blood pressure sufferers. Simply cut yourself and bleed for a while, thus reducing the pressure in your veins.

Heavy smokers. Don't throw away those filters from the end of your cigarettes. Save them up and within a few years you'll have enough to insulate your roof.

Nissan Micra drivers. Attach a lighted sparkler to the roof of your car before starting a long journey. You drive the things like dodgems anyway, so it may as well look like one.

A mouse trap placed on top on of your alarm clock will prevent you from rolling over and going back to sleep.

Avoid bickering and petty arguments by immediately punching anyone with whom you disagree.

Fool next door into thinking you have more stairs than them by banging your feet twice on each stair.

At supermarket checkouts a Toblerone box makes a handy 'Next customer Please' sign for dyslexic shoppers.

Putting just the right amount of gin in your goldfish bowl makes the fishes' eyes bulge and cause them to swim in an amusing manner.

A next door neighbour's car aerial, carefully folded, makes an ideal coat hanger in an emergency.

AVOID parking tickets by leaving your windscreen wipers turned to 'fast wipe' whenever you leave your car parked illegally. Brilliant!

HOUSEWIVES. I find the best way to get two bottles of washing-up liquid for the price of one is by putting one in your shopping trolley and the other in your coat pocket.

OLD telephone directories make ideal personal address books. Simply cross out the names and address of people you don't know


Here's a selection of favourite letters sent into Viz.

The person who coined the phrase 'as different as chalk and cheese' obviously hadn't tasted Kwik Save's cheddar.

John Sampson, Southampton.

If Eastenders is so true to life, how come none of the loveable Cockney characters are Man Utd supporters?

P. Sullivan, Birkenhead .

They say football is a game of two halves. Not for me it isn't. I regularly down eight or nine pints whilst watching a live game on Sky TV in my local.

D Evans, London .

If smoking is bad for you, how come it cures Salmon?

Stalker, Bournemouth .

Why does Frank Bruno get a gong just because he's good at hitting people? I'm brilliant at it but the most I've ever got is 200 hours community service.

A Woodward, Sheffield .

They say good manners cost you nothing. B*llocks. I sent my daughter to finishing school and it cost me twenty bloody grand.

J Morgan, Wigan .

If, as Freddie Mercury claimed, fat bottomed girls make the rocking world go round, isn't it about time that the city of Derby received some recognition for its contribution to astrophysics?

Neil Sedgwick, Nottingham .

In the 20th Century, Britain only made war with countries whose capital cities began with the letter 'B' - Germany ( Berlin ), Argentina (Buenos Aires), Iraq ( Baghdad ), and Serbia (Belgrade ). China changed the name of Peking to Beijing and we bombed their embassy. One hopes we will show a little more imagination in this century.

Martin Harwood, Bradford.

These so-called speed bumps are a joke. If anything, they slow you down.

Tim Wakefield, Surrey .

Now I've been going out with my girlfriend for some time, it seems OK when I break wind in bed. It's when I follow through that the petty arguments begin. I will never understand women.

Chris Mapply, Carshalton.

We should remember the tremendous contribution of the Queen Mother to the war effort: as the BBC pointed out, she 'bravely remained in London beside her husband' during the war. This contrasts sharply with the actions of my grandfather who, on the declaration of war immediately left his wife and children and p*ssed off, first to France, then North Africa, Italy , France (again) and finally Germany .

The shame will always be with us.

George Nisbet.

Like the Queen Mum, my grandfather was a frequent visitor to the East End during the dark days of the blitz, but he was never hailed as a hero by the people of London . That's because he flew Heinkel bombers for the Luftwaffe.

Werner Hoffman, Munich .

I would just like to say a big thank you to all those wonderful young people who stand on motorway slip roads (and in any weather) holding up boards telling us motorists where they lead to.

B Bollockbrain, Braintree .

Ulrika Johnnson says that dangling off a helicopter over the Grand Canyon on a 700 foot bungee rope was the most terrifying and dangerous thing she has ever done. She must be forgetting that she went out with Stan Collymore.

M Duckworth, Poole .

So Sting is able to shag his wife for five hours without going off. I know how he feels. My wife is no oil painting either.

J Leonard, Hull .

I heard recently that, on average, Alex Ferguson receives two turds in the post each week. What I want to know is, who's sending the other one?

K Libretto, Welling

Dave Allen on Religion

Curly

A few good funnies in there - hope we get another to put a smile on our faces tonight.

Mr Angry - excellent clip - my old man used to let me watch Dave allen when I was a wee boy - the first funny man I can remember.

Times article on Naka quotes a fee of around £2.5m

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/scotland/article5026822.ece

morning bhoys. firstly congrats to all who took part in the fives on saturday, in stinking conditions. . re the peat affair and tfs. this my friends is not going to go away. and i will be surprised if at the final hurdle mr peat doesnt fall by the wayside. like everything else in this country a mention of action against anything rangers and the defenders of the faith appear like magic. they have got off scot free since their club was founded,and nothing will change. you only need to look at the boyd affair, to see what i mean .here we have a guy who doesnt command a starting place for his club .yet wants a straight inclusion into the international team and every member of the ltl back him to the hilt. if i had anything to do with it ,he would get a game all the time along with the remaining members of the rangers team .play the whole lot of them, novo as well. after all our international team as far as i,m concerned is a joke anyway. the whole set up is geared towards them .scotland must be managed by a former ranger OR a ranger sympathiser . the team must be captained by a rangers player ..and no celt however great a player he was, can break any performance records held by a ranger. i watched scotland for years until they abused jinky then i stopped never watched them since ,and havent missed them one bit. with reference to young james mccarthy sign this young man and bring him home among his ain folk, and do it soon. that my friends is my tuppence worth .

hail hail

Today's birthday bhoy is Hoopslegend Wim Jansen.

Our favourite Oranje get's to blow out his candles with specky twangy Geordie Hank Marvin, motorsport's number one munchkin Bernie Ecclestone and the tortured Brazilian genius Garrincha.

Kojo :- With your post the other night on politicians I thought you might like this quote that shows just sometimes (though not very often) they get it right.
'I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered.'
Thomas Jefferson 1802

Interesting situation developing in England regarding offensive chants being dished out to Cardiff manager Dave Jones.

I wonder what other clubs fans would indulge in similar chants.

FA to investigate abusive chants

One sentence in Peats statement has alarm bells ringing for me. 'We know the clubs have tried hard....'

Why, when he's talking about one specific song sung by one specific clubs supporters does he mention ClubS ?

And another thing, quite a few people on here have said they don't care what Peats reasons for this statement are, as they are just happy for action to be taken. I disagree completely. The reasons for this statement (and any action taken) are of the utmost importance. If the reasons are wrong, the problem will never be tackled properly and finally.

EdU- on the subject of old strips, there was a picture in HMDT yesterday of your former skipper the late Ian Mccoll. wearing[ it was a b and w pic] a pale top with 2 dark hoops[!], and very shiny, almost satin effect shorts, taken at a Glasgow Cup final just after the War.

I expect most posters on here will remember him as the captain of the runners-up in the 1957 League Cup.

I see Big Ben got a hattrick in the reserve match with ICT yesterday.
Full match report from the P&J - http://www.pressandjournal.co.uk/Article.aspx/908661?UserKey=

And wee McGowan was on the score sheet as well.
It looks like we have three very accomplished young strikers vying for the free slot up front.
Mr Strachan must be rubbing his hands with glee.

Bring on the Hertz!

/Bishop B

DBBIA :- Thankyou for that bit of football trivia. I've always found that one of the great things about this site is that as age advances and the events of 57 fade from my mind someone on here will always help remind me. I don't think I've ever met a more altruistic bunch of people :-)

Ed- no problem; always happy to help out a genuine football man like yourself.

What struck me about the pic was that the Busby Berkeleyesque shorts didn't fit with what I'd always taken to be the austere,even dour approach of the Struth era.

Morning all, been off line for a while, good to be back. Haven’t read the comments yet, but
I took my son and nephew to the Cliftonville v Linfield game last night. I don’t normally go, but I got tortured to take them.
I wasn’t surprised to hear the linfield fans give a few renditions of TFS. I checked when I got home and it was clearly audible on Sky’s coverage.

Good to see Big Ben continuing to impress in the reserves. Wonder if we will see him in the first team squad soon? I have high hopes for the lad.

Captured

News of Linfield fans singing TFS to fellow Irishmen who still live in Ireland is ridiculous on so many levels.

As John Reid said, Famine is not sectarian and many non-Catholics would have died also as a result of the blight. A point that is most definitely lost on these folk.

Go home?! They only live round the corner, for God's sake!

Captured :- I find that one of the most absurd things I've heard. Not your post but the events described. It does raise a question though, if the song about the Irish famine is sung by one N. Irish team to another is it racist?

Mr A

Great video on the happiest days of our lives.I did not know that Dave Allen went to school in Rathfarnham.The school described can only be the magnificent Loreto convent referred to locally as Beaufort.He would have been very close there to the home of Flann o`Brien

I have always felt that the sort of two dimentional Guards barracks as described in the the Third policeman was based on the pub the Yellow House.

As Flann drove to work each day up Nutgrove (!) Avenue and Loretto Convent where Dave was stuggling with the concept of Divinity Flann would have seen the Yellow House as though looking at the apex of a triangle.

Each in his own way driven to spiritus sancti.

A quare conumdrum indeed ...a real pancake.

Brick in the wall CSC

refrain (SONG)
noun [C]

1 a short part of a song or poem that is repeated, especially between the verses (= the separate parts)

2 a phrase that is often repeated:
'Every vote counts' is a familiar refrain in politics.

Ed Linfield would class themselves as British, so yes it is racist as it is an anti-Irish song. If it were two Irish teams, I would call it insulting rather than racist. Also, I'm sure it was not only directed at the Home support, but for those watching on TV.

Craggy, ridiculous and depressing.

Edward ,

To answer your question , yes , its racist.

I don't know what you find absurd , 90% of Linfield fans would support rangers (You'd have thought Cliftonville were playing rangers judging by the amount of rangers strips worn in the away support) first and foremost and most are regulars at Ibrox every other week so if they sing the racist song on boats , buses and at Ibrox , why do you find it absurd them singing it to Irish Nationlists at Solitude in Belfast on a monday night?

it's snowin' here in north lanarkshire!

just wispy light flakes, but still snow.

time to get out the bing crosby.

I love the 'way forward' for Rangers:

- sing as offensive a song as you can imagine with 'implied racism that isn't actually racism' and we'll all be ok!

- boo Aiden McGeady / James McCarthy for entirely non sectarian reasons then cheer Nacho Novo (presumably because he is rejecting the team of a predominantly Catholic Country for another one)!

Yet every time you mention them you have to say 'but they are trying' whilst highlighting our own efforts; depressing!

craggy island gaa,

Maybe the Linfield fans are singing the song in an ironic manner to those of Scots decent living in Ireland??

The Scotsman drops the famine story or am I blind ?

Hilfe

James Mc Arthur whom Rangers fans booed mistakenly is in actual fact a Rangers fan !!

Famine song highlighted in Times this morning - more interesting comments e mailed in with a classic from Gerry from Paris

" I don't think you could call the Billy Boys a "dirge". Racist possibly, sectarian definitely, a dirge never"

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/scotland/article5026958.ece

Modern snow is rubbish.

Edward, Auldheid, Gordon J, EDB1 from last night, thanks for responding...

I agree that it is very difficult to challenge stuff like this and I would never suggest any one individual challenge it head on. I have tried it in less risky situations than this one and it can be scary.

But I think since 31.08 there is an extra edge to relations within the Rangers ranks and between Celtic supporters and liberal Rangers supporters, and to put it quite simply, they have to decide which side they are on.

If a Rangers supporter says to me, as Edwards does, I am a Rangers man, but I can’t support the racism, he has my respect and my support in looking at what can be done to challenge it safely and constructively.

But by doing nothing, liberal Rangers supporters are tacitly supporting the racist views and actions of their less enlightened pals, and as a recipient of that racism, I am tired of their inaction.

It is time for all good Rangers supporters to stand up.

What could be done? Loads. How about an online petition to the club? David Murray needs to hear loud and clear if only for commercial reasons that the racists are in the minority.

It’s not for me to devise a campaign strategy for the guys, but it’s time they did something.

McGrain

Gordon_J

Perhaps but then they should have sung "The Plantation's over, why don't you go home".

Wonder what would happen if Cliftonville or any other "catholic" team were to sing that to Linfield or Glentoran supporters?

Gordon J

I think you may be onto something there. Aren't the protestant (small p) majority in the North descendants from Scottish people planted by the government at the time, hence the large number of Scottish surnames.

Mort
Great minds and all that, eh?

is it just me or is E-tims the most pessemistic Celtic site in the world?

hadn't been on it in ages and just left myself depressed after a half hour reading a few articles!!

mcgrain,

I cant recall any campaign orchestrated by liberal Rangers supporters ever - for anything ? In fact I would suggest that surely such a campaign would actually be labeled as radical as opposed top liberal and therein lies the problem

Mc Bain asked the Rangers support only to sing the refrain from TFS and they have done so what´s the problem ? :-)

Captured & BigLiam :- Thanks for the replies, I'd like to point out in relation to my post asking if it was racist that I'm speaking from a position of ignorance. Apart from Linfield I have no idea which teams in N. Ireland consider themselves to be British or Irish, I have no idea what teams have a support consisting of loyalist or nationalist folk. That's why I found it absurd, one group of N. Irish fans singing it to another.
On a related matter, are there any teams in N. Ireland that have a mixed support?

Gordon J, Velvet Underpants...

Exactly.
We have native Irishmen being taunted about "going home" when they never left the Island in the first place, by an Immigrant population planted there who now believe themselves to be the "Native" race!!!

Craggy
In a cahrt of average annual rates of excess mortality 1846/51
The Great Irish Potato Famine by James S Donnelly Jr

Fermanagh 9th greatest (of the 32 counties)
Armagh 19th Ditto
Tyrone 20th "
Antrim 21st "
Down 28th "
Derry 29th "

To complete the picture
Cavan 6th
Monaghan 10th
Donegal 24th

velevt

indeed

As sure as night follows day if action is taken against the fod for singing dodgy songs action will be taken against us as well, bet your house on it. Any case the SFA or whoever may have against them will be put on hold until they have an equally strong case against us. As Henrik Sombrero pointed out earlier Peat is talking about clubs plural, that'll be them and us.

DBBIA, thank you for your submission to me yesterday, but I had already posted that vidjo some months ago !!!

Modern wind-ups is rubbish :o(

pablophanque

http://sport.scotsman.com/sport/SFA-chief-Peat-vows-to.4634962.jp

blindtimCSC

Is booing a national anthem racist ?

IF UEFA ever caught such antics what would they do about it ?

and there´s your answer CSC

Hopefully, the hoards will disgrace themselves at the pox again tonight. I was disgusted to read the Hamilton managers comments about the abuse given to young McCarthy. It doesn't matter if the player brought it to his attention or not, its not even about the football. its pure racism end of story

Ps long time lurker and 1st time poster....

In support of El Diego Bhoy.

EDB has been contributing here for donkeys possibly as long as my good self, getting on for 41/2 years. His contributions are funny, clever and interesting and he is far better Celtic and CQN supporter than I.

Last night he wrote something I disagreed with but I felt the reaction to him from some was unfair, comparing him to the racists that are abusing our people.

Does EDB think all Rangers suporters are filth? I doubt it.
Does EDB think the offspring of all Rangers supporters are filth? I doubt it.
Does EDB feel tired of putting up with the racism and abuse directed at our people? I bet you he does.
Does EDB feel the culture, traditions and history of our people are under attack? I bet you he does.

When I feel under attack I sometimes lash out and that's what EDB did last night. But to compare him to a racist is not fair.

Hail Hail

McGrain

Welcome One thin dime

Strange statement from The Hamilton manager indeed

lamartime

Thanks for posting those stats, it does show that Famine is not particular about its victims, but it is worth noting that mortality rate was lower in the 6 Counties in NE Ulster than the rest of the Province.

That said, there were still a considerable number of fatalities due to the Famine in ALL the counties in Ireland.

mcgrain,

While defending EDB is admirable he has to stay in the naughty corner a while longer. :-)

Hail Hail

In terms of punishment or the Darkside, if they are deducted points and are forced to sell off, just to balance the books, what happens long term. If this continues, and the recession continues, where does this leave them? Out of business?

I for one would rather see 'them' severely weakened, a la Dukla Praha, and be seen as the once mighty...

I do not want to see them go to the wall. A good mate of mine told me about his lecturer at uni, telling him about his views on the Troubles.

This academic firmly believes that the troubles and the armed struggle came about as a result of state sponsored sectarianism and the closure of Belfast Celtic. He claimed that the closure of BC, took away the only significant outlet and form of control of the Nationalist, Catholic people.
What else could occupy time?
There was, and never has been a proper replacement, and therefore the disaffected youth had no outlets, other than to join up with or align themselves with the Nationalist extremists.

I would hate for this type of situation to happen here. Imagine the sectarian violence levelled against places such as Croy, Chapelhall, (these are only NL examples, I'm sure you all know of similar places) it is unthinkable, but possible.

Celtic boss Gordon Strachan is being linked with managerless Portsmouth.

Strachan, once of Southampton, is among bookmakers' favourites for the Fratton Park post following Harry Redknapp's departure for Tottenham.

The new boss could be in place for the November 27 UEFA Cup meeting with AC Milan with former Bolton and Newcastle boss Sam Allardyce, ex-Chelsea manager and former Pompey technical director Avram Grant and Celtic's Strachan all figuring high in the bookmakers lists.

Former Liverpool and Southampton boss Graeme Souness was also at Fratton Park yesterday but many Pompey fans are in favour of Tony Adams although he would almost certainly leave if passed over.

Gordon Strachan still has a house in the Southampton area !!!!

It is described by Graham Spiers as follows;
"the song, which derides those of Irish extraction in Scotland and is deemed by many to be racist and offensive"

I'm sorry "Deemed by many"?? "DEEMED BY MANY"?? For goodness sake!!

TFS is racist. It should be stamped out and the offending supporters brought to task for behaviour which is unacceptable in todays society. Their club should outrightly condemn this song and the supporters that indulge in singing it. The media should firstly highlight this behaviour and then support any and every action required to eradicate this racist contempable behaviour and encourage the authorities to act against these racists!!
I know of no other country which would accept this behaviour and condone this activity by its media and governing bodies sweeping it under the carpet!!

Manic street preachers chanted about the Spanish Civil war and had the line "If you tolerate this then your children will be next" - - I hate to quote those Happy-Go-Lucky, smiley, welsh funsters but Is Scotlands future to always have to deal with Racism against Catholics?? Should any society in 2008 have to deal with such overt racism?? Racism which nearly cost a football coach his life? Where does it end Mr Brown, Mr Salmond, Mr Peat? Mr Murray? Mr Bain? Where does it end...............

awe-naw

Tony Adams appointed manager of Portsmouth

Mort

I was just about to take up the lease on WGS mansion there , phew ... Thanks !!

mcgraininspain,

I understand your point. But EDB posted something that I very much disagreed with - and he specifically asked for a reaction.

I attacked the attitudes behind his post, not the man himself. I've never met EDB and have no idea of what kind of a person he really is. But if he makes posts like that I will reply.

Just as he can reply to me! That's what makes htis blog so interesting.

Ed, as far as I know only Cliftonville and Newry would be the only nationalist teams in the premier league, although Donegal Celtic are in the league below.

Think I'll join the Italian Polis !!!!

Nice work if you can get it !!??

pablophanque

Ed

I don't know any teams in NI that would have a "mixed" fan base although i'm sure there are some. This is purely down to the location of the teams, i.e. most places in NI are not mixed therefore a local team will generally have the support of the local town and would be perceived to be either "catholic" or "protestant".

Another point is that football in NI, especially the club sides are very poorly supported with probably more people travelling to see Celtic, Rangers, Man U, Liverpool etc each weekend than would attend all the local games.

In terms of popularity, "local" football would probably only be the third most popular sport in NI behind GAA and Rugby.

Pablo

Reckon they would give Nigel a run for his buckie

may i pose you all a question . a few weeks ago .scotland played northern ireland at hampden ..there was a very large n/ireland sup