Celtic v Fenerbahce, Live updates
1021
Share.
Trending
- “Negligence and unprofessionalism” unwise pre-match words
- Determined by Dundee
- EXCLUSIVE: ‘THERE MAY BE TWISTS OR TURNS TO COME, BUT CELTIC WILL NOT BE KNOCKED OFF COURSE,’ INSISTS LEGEND
- ALEX’S ANGLE: TAXI FOR BIG PHIL
- RODGERS 3 ABERDEEN O: Part Two
- BLANKETY-BLANK AT DENS: CELTIC THREE AHEAD
- ALEX’S ANGLE: QUESTION FOR THE SFA
- RODGERS 3 ABERDEEN 0: Part One
- REVEALED: CELTIC v RANGERS DATE IN POST-SPLIT FIXURES
- CALMAC, CAPTAIN AND CHEERLEADER
- Taylor and Johnston’s importance to Celtic
- ‘WHAT IS GOING ON? IT’S CRAZY,’ IDAH’S CELTIC SURPRISE
- TEN AND OUT: BIG JOCK’S LAST HURRAH
- ALEX’S ANGLE: ALL IS REVEALED AMID THE TANTRUMS
- Stressed out Clement flips title race to Celtic
- ‘IT WILL BE A BIG MISS,’ ADMITS HART AS HE PLANS GRAND FINALE
- ‘A TEAM ON A MISSION WITH A MASSIVE POINT TO PROVE,’ CELTIC LEGEND’S VERDICT
- TWO GAMES IN ONE DAY: HOW CELTIC WON THE TITLE IN 1916
- 57 YEARS AGO TODAY: TOMMY GEMMELL AND THE WEMBLEY WONDERS
- HIGHLAND FLING AS GERS FLOP
- WATCH AGAIN: KYOGO AND THE MAGNIFICENT 70
- JOHNSTON TARGETS ‘A SPECIAL SEASON’
- THE REO DEAL: ‘GREAT TO SEE HIM BACK,’ ENTHUSES RODGERS
- ABADA’S SMILES BETTER
- CELTIC 3 ST MIRREN 0: EASY AS ONE, TWO, THREE AS CHAMPS MOVE FOUR AHEAD
- Celtic v St Mirren, Live updates
1,021 Comments- Pages:
- «
- 1
- ...
- 20
- 21
- 22
- 23
- 24
- 25
- 26
- 27
- »
MoonbeamsWD on 2nd October 2015 8:53 am
I made a comment on this last night but as RD what do you say at HT? We totally controlled the 1st half and an individual mistake cost us. So really there’s not much to change.
On the other hand they’ve got areas where they can hope to improve so it’s easier for them. Could RD have anticipated the changes they might make to their play? Maybe but that’s got to be tricky.
For all their pressure in the first 15-20 minutes of the 2nd half I think they only had 1 shot on target, aside from the goal.
Supersutton
I did read it again, as you suggested, and it’s 4 conceded from a total of 73, not 83, corners.
Zonal Maths?
Good that you produce the figures to back up your point though, mate.
Italiabhoy 8.58
Yeah, I remember the days when the ole CQN would get behind Gary Caldwell!
If you think the blog/support gave Efe a hard time replace his name with Caldwell and stand well back!
Super Sutton
We’re not in the CL because of zonal marking
We’ve drawn both games in the EL because of zonal marking
And
We got beat by Aberdeen because of zonal marking
We don’t just employ zonal marking at corners
Btw our rate for converting corners to goals is poor
SUPERSUTTON
Your stats? Abolish corners in Scottish football. They’re clearly a waste of time.
Stringer Bell
Great post. My exact feelings on oor Efe.
Feel for the big honest fella this morning.
Hail Hail
JFH
Correct
We’ve thrown away leads in three of our most important games this season …Aberdeen , Ajax and last night
Macjay enjoy the game on Sunday, nice work HT. long season to go bhoys and ghirls keep the faith.
We must consider the possibility that if we didn’t use zonal marking our defensive record would be even worse than it is at the moment.
Unlike most folk on here I really don’t know enough about football to have an informed opinion on the matter.
Well as a famous poster says im aff oot for me the gairdens calling.H.H.
Celtic supporters have always been hard on players, especially young ones. I remember Jinky getting it large from the jungle for beating a player twice, or worse, when trying to beat a player twice he lost the ball. “Luxury player” to some jungle generals.
BEATBHOY on 2ND OCTOBER 2015 9:35 AM
Supersutton
I did read it again, as you suggested, and it’s 4 conceded from a total of 73, not 83, corners.
Zonal Maths?
Good that you produce the figures to back up your point though, mate.
////////
Hahaha – fortunately the 83 was my mistake and not the spreadsheet.
Ernie
When has lack of knowledge ever precluded folk from commenting on CQN ??
Before you say it …ah ken as well as anyone
Super Sutton
Admirable stats but far from the big picture.
You do not take into account
a) Goals lost or scored from set pieces around the box.
b) Whether or not opposition defend zonally
Without these stats your analysis is far to simplistic to provide a complete picture.
MWD said AYE
Love how the fans who can see efe is a liability and he has been for years are called trolls. While the heid in the sand brigade clapp happily away thinking we are doing the best the best we can
How the hell anyone can equate giving a player a ‘hard time’ on a blog during live updates with doing similar at the actual match, especially in large numbers and repeatedly, is beyond me!
Are they checking their phones when the ball’s not in their zone to check their CQN rating??
Oh, and posting ‘terrible pass’, ‘very poor cross there’ ‘FFS Efe’, is not giving anyone a hard time, it’s describing the game as you’re seeing it, and giving an opinion of a player’s performance based on that.
Zero impact on player performance, though can get on other posters’ thrupennies.
That’s a blog for ye!
ernie lynch on 2nd October 2015 9:44 am
You don’t have to be a tactical genius to work out whether the defensive system we use has (very recently) given us the best defensive record in our history, is a good one.
One sky pundit decided he was cleverer than our coaches by finding something to scapegoat (zonal marking) when we lost a goal from a corner, some of our modern day jungle generals repeat the garbage said sky pundit aired.
Morning all
A quick word before I head into the mad, teeming world of Internet Banking and appointments with opticians.
First off I think this and other forums ( my Latin is not what it was but I have a feeling that is the wrong plural- over to you Macjay!) are here for Celtic fans to express their opinions and as with the fanzines of a generation ago that means the right to criticise players. I would, personally, prefer it if the opinions – of any type- were expressed in language that still contained an obvious affection for Celtic and were perhaps a step up from what you would say in the heat of the moment at a game or even in the pub right afterwards but sometimes the couthy can be appropriate. But I cannot re-iterate enough that criticism should be allowed and that negative criticism is not necessarily making someone into a scapegoat.
Earlier in the week I said, here, that whilst Efe was often not to my taste he has great character. I still think that but I think – as Italiabhoy has said in the last posting I read before starting this-his career with us may soon be all but over. Like Mark McNally 20 or so years ago you cannot fault the commitment of the player it is simply all about the mistakes he makes and last night’s was just unacceptable. There are no excuses of jetlag or any of the other reasons trotted out post-Juventus 30 months ago this was just an unaccountable error. I am old enough to remember Big Billy making howlers in the match with Milan in 1969 and an OG for Aberdeen in 1971 that was inexplicable but Billy was an inspiring leader who was often the man who held the team together and that is before you factor in the momentous goals he scored. Efe has no such entries on the credit side of his ledger- he played well in the last three games it is true but what was being praised was competence against teams that hardly crossed the halfway line. Efe seems to me to possess much of what is called ‘the right stuff’ but he is just not a good actual footballer to justify being in the team as often as he is. He has, admittedly, been a bit player for over a season now – a stand-in. Well I grew up with defensive stand ins being players like Willie O’Neill and Jim Brogan who never let Celtic down in the way that Efe did last night.
I do not like criticising players and last night there were, over the ninety minutes, players who did not play as well as Efe did for most of the game. I would not name the one player in our current squad who has the distinction of being only the second player in my 48 years of going who I do not like whilst he is still playing for us as that is a personal foible based as much as seeing him drive a 4×4 in the city. But forums like this should never be places where people should feel uneasy about offering criticism of players whose play is not up to scratch.
Nor should it be a place where people feel uneasy about defending players – at least CQN has not been as bad as some places I read in respect of James Forrest’s display last night. I would have liked to have seen him switch wings more- as I thought on Saturday also- but he was lively, had a good wee link going with young Tierney and has played well more often than not this season. But on several Facebook pages dedicated to Celtic he has been subjected to almost as much criticism as Efe – people see what they want to see I suppose.
Sorry for rambling on but whilst I think there are scapegoats – again I am old enough to go back to Charlie Gallacher, John Fallon and Tommy Callaghan who were never good enough for some people- pointing out that Efe Ambrose has made too many mistakes that are not in any way balanced out by moments of genuine excellence is not making him a scapegoat it is simply pointing out that he is not good enough and it is my belief that he will continue to make costly errors if and when picked. The new defenders we have acquired in recent months may not be any better but it is time we found about them. These youngsters have clean slates as far as I am concerned. I can only hope that other supporters see them that way.
Jimbo67
SuperSutton on 2nd October 2015 9:15 am
Solid stats there.
Goal conceded by a team playing zonal marking: Ditch zonal marking
Goal conceded by a team not playing zonal marking: Silence. I don’t think I’ve ever heard a comment that relates the defensive set up with the goal conceded where it is not zonal marking, just player error.
Here’s a stat. Until zonal marking came along all goals conceded since the invention of the game were from defensive frailty that was unrelated to zonal marking!
Defences the world over are stronger. Barca are dominating Europe with an attacking team that defends corners with zonal marking. It’s Guardiola’s first choice and he deployed it at Munich.
You put poor defenders on a park they will fail to deploy whatever system you ask them to fulfil.
Graeme Hunter did a piece at length on it. You put your strongest defenders in the most dangerous zones. If the ball arrives in your zone you need to win it, if you do you clear the danger. You have a keeper as back up and man on each post so even if you don’t win it you may still prevent a goal. It’s actually dead simple.
Man marking is much harder to control. Players get dragged around, blocked, moved, it can be chaos. Chelsea with Terry in the team exploited it all the time. Run around like loons, block, fall over, create an unmarked zone!
Fenerbahce played zonal marking, Griffiths scored because they’d no one on the back post and van Persie didn’t get out. Those were mistakes. Efe lost the ball very badly in his danger zone and Griffiths had been rag dolled to allow him a free run at the ball. Great header, a sore one, but the system is as strong as the players. Their striker is a better class of player than our defenders.
The goal before half time was a simple howler and one of far too many by the same player who I can’t ever dislike, but he needs to go. We didn’t lose the game through zonal marking, but we have won 4 in a row with record breaking defensive stats with zonal marking. Our results reflect, over the period, the quality of player we have versus those of the opposition. No defensive system will change that.
Wait a minute! The phone-checking thing might explain some of the howlers!
Mwd. Zonal marking is used by top teams who have every player in the box thinking a second ahead. We can’t play that as efe is still thinking about it. Man to man marking when you have players who can only think one thing at a time
Maybe we need an defence coach
Quick note:
Whether predominantly Zonal or Man4Man, almost every team everywhere uses a blend of both. Almost every team everywhere loses goals from corner kicks.
You need to adapt a given set up to take account of how the opposing team attacks, but in the main, it’s not the system that causes the loss of a goal, it’s the players.
There is no panacea for poor defending.
That said, there seems to be a reluctance in our defence as regards winning defensive headers, something that the coaches need to address quickly.
When you weighed-up; age, experience, cost before kick-off against Fenerbahce – then a draw would probably have been considered a decent result.
The thing is – we played better than them (bar a 20 minute or so period) – held a 2 goal lead but once again contrived to mismanage a winning position.
Unfortunately last night’s glaring mistakes (well documented on the blog) are all to frequent – take your pick from previous games; Malmo, Kilmarnock, Aberdeen – even ICT. Who should take the rap?
For me – the fault lies with the coaching staff and players collective inability to game-manage situations on the park as events unfold.
RD has failed to demonstrate that he can reorganise tactics to close-out games from the dugout and…………
equally the players have shown a lack of individual responsibility to take control of situations as they unfold – they shouldn’t be waiting on instructions from the bench – they need to be more pro-active.
As for last night – the majority of the XI as such played well in parts. Young Tierney was excellent – unfortunately Efe’s mistakes and JoH’s poor contribution took the gloss of what was an overall decent performance.
Pre-match a draw was an acceptable result – regrettably we’ve once again mismanaged a winning position during a game and the result was 2 dropped points!
Fenerbahce – Joint Top in Turkish League.
Turkey ranked 37 in world.
Ajax Top of Dutch League
Holland ranked 14th in world
Molde 7th in Norwegian League
Norway ranked 34 in world
Celtic 2nd in Scottish PL
Scotland ranked 40th in world.
A bit of perspective ghuys even if we could have won both EL matches so far. The truth is we are not as far away as some of us think we are, IN MY HUMBLE OPINION.
In both games we have played some very good football. We were never overrun or even beaten. We need to be more consistent.
We will improve as new players get their fitness levels up and get more game time.
Bring on the Accies!!
C’MON THE CELTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I won’t read back as I can imagine what what’s been posted and I’m in such a good mood today..
Anyway, away to experience Zonal Parking at Asda. I know, exciting, eh?
Back in from walking the dug.
BlantyreKev.9.55.
Top post on the defensive conundrum of defending set pieces.
Grass or space may never have scored from a set piece , however plenty of evidence exists that by marking a particular player u leave a vulnerable area free.
No system is flawless.
It’s down to the quality of players.
Not systems. HH
TAURANGABHOY on 2ND OCTOBER 2015 9:42 AM
Macjay enjoy the game on Sunday, nice work HT. long season to go bhoys and ghirls keep the faith.
=====================================================================
Thanks so much,Tauranga.
Undefeated against Ajax and Fenerbache….hmmm. There were many on here when the draw was made predicted heavy defeats. Eve made two mistakes that are well documented. When our Centre Back is fit Efe will be on the bench and maybe shipped out in Jan. I think he needs a fresh start in another team in midfield. Good to see Forest playing well. Now all the over investment mob on here, why did the Turks not win when they have spent more , blah, blah, blah? I’m sure Peter of Turkey must be getting it tight today.
BAWSMAN on 2ND OCTOBER 2015 9:47 AM
Celtic supporters have always been hard on players, especially young ones. I remember Jinky getting it large from the jungle for beating a player twice, or worse, when trying to beat a player twice he lost the ball. “Luxury player” to some jungle generals.
============================================================================
Or
See you,Dalglish.
You`re rubbish.
Truly.:-)
My few thoughts on last night for what there worth.
I think for these type of games we need a real holding mid-fielder in the mold of a Lennon or Lambert. Biton and Broonie both want to push on.
On Tierney I have to differ with a lot of the comments . I think his selection was a mistake . He has plenty of potential and did a few good things last night but overall I thought he was struggling . He needed cover and Forrest had to become a defender in the second half to help him out there-by depriving us of our most dangerous forward. The defence looked stronger after Blacketts introduction .
In hindsight Boyata would have been a more physical match for their big goal scorer.
Batsman
Zonal marking worked with VVD and Denayer
Unfortunately they’re not here anymore ..I think that’s as much to do with it as anything else
Angel Gabriel
Correct …quality of players ….our quality isn’t very high at present
Still a bit annoyed by the fact that we only drew last night.
However, considering injuries and suspensions I think we are improving and look to have at least put the aberrations of Aberdeen and Malmo out of our system.
I remember Martin O’Neil bemoaning individual errors which no manager could much about.
Onwards and upwards CSC.
Árd Macha
I don’t know what’s more frustrating Celtic lack of ability or trying to log onto CQN
I spoke to DBBIA last night and he has given up trying to get into cqn
As for last night
We can’t hold onto a lead because we can’t hold onto the ball
We are to far apart and can’t play the simple pass to keep possession
The players don’t seem to be able to find a man to play a simple pass to
Football is a simple game made difficult by coaches
TONTINE TIM on 2ND OCTOBER 2015 8:15 AM
The huns get pelters on here but at least they are loyal, we were supposed ta be faithful (through and through).
As Oldtim said, if Celtic make you that unhappy then either find another team or hobby. Oh and please nae response about happy clappers etc. I remember the old board and a punter in the stand with a noose shouting ‘this is for you Mr. Kelly”.
Spoiled weans the lot of you.
>>>>
Classic- the noose thing isn’t real is it?
Now getting pop ups when on cqn
flipping piss poor btw.
Philbhoy 10:05
Hail Hail sir.
till later all