Long time no post, hope you are well. I posted this a couple of times without much debate. I seek dampen some of the hysteria re the pheniox co.
I felt compelled to point out one major flaw for Whyte in the ‘pre pack’ route.
The administrator who would have to agree to the pre pack sale, although not requiring the consent of the unsecured creditors (HMRC), still requires to realise the most he can for the assets. In simple terms that means the key test is – would the administrator be able to get a better deal elsewhere in the circumstances? If he cannot answer this with a ‘yes’ he will not sanction the pre pack at that price.
Yes it is true pre packs can leave unsecured creditors angry and dismayed but that tends to eminate from the fact they are not consulted before the sale. It is a myth to say that pre packs offer the opportunity to rebuy the assets at a ‘song’ and leave the creditors behind. You can leave the creditors behind all right, but only at value (in the circumstances).
The BIG difference in any potential RFC pre pack case is the potential value and potential marketability of the assets (squad, stadium, property). Pre packaged sale to the same directors are most commonly used where the assets are not substantial and not much use to anyone else (be objective lol); in service companies for instance that hold unmarketable assets (cigarette machines for example – in a famous case before the rules were tightened), where the administrator could not get a better deal elsewhere in the circumstances and is unlikely to be able to realise more.
If RFC is pre packed and the unsecured creditors get £4m (which I assume incoporates the £18m Whtye will receive first – meaning the pheniox pays £22m) the administrator would be utterly negligent in the circumstances, it cannot happen in my view.
Also, it is a ‘pre’ pack, i.e. cash has to be put up first by Whyte to buy the pre packed assets (has he got it?) before he recoups his £18million from the money he has just pumped in. I’m not sure he could use his £18 million to buy the pre packed assets as he will not have it until after the old company receives the cash.
Following any pre pack there must be full disclsoure of the rational why that course of action was undertaken by the administrator, there must be good reasons. No insolvency practitioner would be able to justify such a small return on an entire company who value their assets at over £100m. There would need to be an independent valuation and Wyhte and the new pheniox would have to pay value for the assets (back to square one for him).
The administrator will only agree to the pre pack if he thinks (reasonably) that he could not realise more than what the pheniox was offering.
Alternatives – Ibrox as a venture capitalist project to rent back to them? marketable. (That course would incidently leave Wyhte without the £18m he would recoup on the prepack due to his secured debt, as he could not use that asset as further security he would have to repay it – see ya!!!). Players in January – Jelavic, Naismith, Davies – we are sailing over the pheniox offer.
The scenario for Wyhte of £18m into RFC – pre pack administration and £18 million out – then use that £18 with another £4m to buy all the assets for a newco is just not going to happen.
In any event there is no indication has the xtra £4m, or the extra £18 million he may need upfront.
In my opinion it will be administration with players sold, stadium sold – or even liquidation (less likely).
Good times ahead……..
mncelt on
Hooper hits the outside of the post – should have done better
'GG on
Hooper ans Stokes combine but hooper not able to beat keeper
'GG on
Greekster you’ll not get any response during a game
If I was the Hibs manager Id get a wifie to come out and shout ‘Right boys yer dinners oot’ and they would be left playing against old heids Mulgrew and Wilson.
Hoops unlucky tried to beat the keeper but should have scored.
fan-a-tic on
Mncelt
Agree about that.
Think that Kayal and Ledley is better combo with more give and go.
Ki is overated and has a more negative than positive influence on our play
'GG on
Promising moved breaks down as Stokes dawdles
'GG on
Corner Hibs
Kojo on
Five Minutes to Half
Kojo
Henriks Sombrero on
Delahunt and Co on Clyde delighting in the fact Celtic haven’t scored yet.
mncelt on
Good effort from JF saved
'GG on
Mathews down left feeds Forrest whose shot is parried away
Kojo on
Forrest Shoots from Far out.. Keeper saves..
That is the First serious shot for us so far.
Terrible…Really… Three Minutes to half time
Kojo
'GG on
Ki across goal runs away from Stokes
'GG on
Second Kojo
fan-a-tic on
We are a poor team dependent on individual moments of brilliance rather than any great pattern
'GG on
Third if you count Hooper’s one on one
'GG on
I’m pining for Scott Brown
mncelt on
HT Celtic 0-0 Hibs
Dissappointing first half. Our play is disjointed, we are lacking shape and have little or no idea in the final third.
Lenny’s team selections are bewildering.Starts off with Ledley at left back with Mathews (our best FB) in midfield then pushes Ledley forward with Ki covering LB. Ledley then reverts to LB while Mathews looks like a bhoy lost in midfield.
Defensively we have been solid but under no real threat. Ki has done well in midfield and Stokes has worked hard up front. The rest need a rocket at half time.
Need a big improvement
'GG on
HT and I must dash out hopeful to pick it up again mid 2nd half
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Stokes runs into box shot blocked by keeper
Chance for Stokes there – should have played it across goal to Hooper but hit the keeper
GG
Charlie doing a dixie?
Tumbled his wulkies?
or Blast Ba’ over the bar?
methinks latter ;-)
seriously ..appreciate the updates
Watokes unable to connect with cross from Mathews
Stokes even. iPad keyboard
Snow getting heavy
Stokes shot was going in but hit a defenders foot.
Unlucky.
P155 poor stream from Celtic Tv.
Worst in years.
Again no drive from central midfield area
The Ki-Kaya partnership is toothless
Ki blocked on edge of box
Hibs actually look like they can find their man very well
But,the Finishing Pass.. let’s them down
Celtic are Fortunate that Hibs canny get the final pass right.
Kojo
Hibs have two on Forrest every time he gets a ball
Decent move there by the Lilacs
Timely tackle by Rogne
Was briefly at the demo in George Square today which was well attended.
About 300 folk at a guess.
Rico
I’m not a big Scot Brown fan but I think he is more effective than Kayal
Not making match today.. Gave my tickets to a good friend and son , who could do with a wee lift this week! Hoping the hoops keep their side of deal…
Gave me time to watch arsenal game..
A few things struck me..
We ( Celtic) should shoot more..it often works
Wenger doesn’t half moan..
Saturday s seem LONG when you’re not in Paradise and Mrs AB is giving you tasks .
HH and I LOVE Celtic in my life..blessed are the righteous.
SITTER!!!
Hi Paul
Long time no post, hope you are well. I posted this a couple of times without much debate. I seek dampen some of the hysteria re the pheniox co.
I felt compelled to point out one major flaw for Whyte in the ‘pre pack’ route.
The administrator who would have to agree to the pre pack sale, although not requiring the consent of the unsecured creditors (HMRC), still requires to realise the most he can for the assets. In simple terms that means the key test is – would the administrator be able to get a better deal elsewhere in the circumstances? If he cannot answer this with a ‘yes’ he will not sanction the pre pack at that price.
Yes it is true pre packs can leave unsecured creditors angry and dismayed but that tends to eminate from the fact they are not consulted before the sale. It is a myth to say that pre packs offer the opportunity to rebuy the assets at a ‘song’ and leave the creditors behind. You can leave the creditors behind all right, but only at value (in the circumstances).
The BIG difference in any potential RFC pre pack case is the potential value and potential marketability of the assets (squad, stadium, property). Pre packaged sale to the same directors are most commonly used where the assets are not substantial and not much use to anyone else (be objective lol); in service companies for instance that hold unmarketable assets (cigarette machines for example – in a famous case before the rules were tightened), where the administrator could not get a better deal elsewhere in the circumstances and is unlikely to be able to realise more.
If RFC is pre packed and the unsecured creditors get £4m (which I assume incoporates the £18m Whtye will receive first – meaning the pheniox pays £22m) the administrator would be utterly negligent in the circumstances, it cannot happen in my view.
Also, it is a ‘pre’ pack, i.e. cash has to be put up first by Whyte to buy the pre packed assets (has he got it?) before he recoups his £18million from the money he has just pumped in. I’m not sure he could use his £18 million to buy the pre packed assets as he will not have it until after the old company receives the cash.
Following any pre pack there must be full disclsoure of the rational why that course of action was undertaken by the administrator, there must be good reasons. No insolvency practitioner would be able to justify such a small return on an entire company who value their assets at over £100m. There would need to be an independent valuation and Wyhte and the new pheniox would have to pay value for the assets (back to square one for him).
The administrator will only agree to the pre pack if he thinks (reasonably) that he could not realise more than what the pheniox was offering.
Alternatives – Ibrox as a venture capitalist project to rent back to them? marketable. (That course would incidently leave Wyhte without the £18m he would recoup on the prepack due to his secured debt, as he could not use that asset as further security he would have to repay it – see ya!!!). Players in January – Jelavic, Naismith, Davies – we are sailing over the pheniox offer.
The scenario for Wyhte of £18m into RFC – pre pack administration and £18 million out – then use that £18 with another £4m to buy all the assets for a newco is just not going to happen.
In any event there is no indication has the xtra £4m, or the extra £18 million he may need upfront.
In my opinion it will be administration with players sold, stadium sold – or even liquidation (less likely).
Good times ahead……..
Hooper hits the outside of the post – should have done better
Hooper ans Stokes combine but hooper not able to beat keeper
Greekster you’ll not get any response during a game
Celtic team:
22, 27, 19, 21, 25, 20, 23, 22, 24, 23, 23.
Average age 22.63.
If I was the Hibs manager Id get a wifie to come out and shout ‘Right boys yer dinners oot’ and they would be left playing against old heids Mulgrew and Wilson.
Hoops unlucky tried to beat the keeper but should have scored.
Mncelt
Agree about that.
Think that Kayal and Ledley is better combo with more give and go.
Ki is overated and has a more negative than positive influence on our play
Promising moved breaks down as Stokes dawdles
Corner Hibs
Five Minutes to Half
Kojo
Delahunt and Co on Clyde delighting in the fact Celtic haven’t scored yet.
Good effort from JF saved
Mathews down left feeds Forrest whose shot is parried away
Forrest Shoots from Far out.. Keeper saves..
That is the First serious shot for us so far.
Terrible…Really… Three Minutes to half time
Kojo
Ki across goal runs away from Stokes
Second Kojo
We are a poor team dependent on individual moments of brilliance rather than any great pattern
Third if you count Hooper’s one on one
I’m pining for Scott Brown
HT Celtic 0-0 Hibs
Dissappointing first half. Our play is disjointed, we are lacking shape and have little or no idea in the final third.
Lenny’s team selections are bewildering.Starts off with Ledley at left back with Mathews (our best FB) in midfield then pushes Ledley forward with Ki covering LB. Ledley then reverts to LB while Mathews looks like a bhoy lost in midfield.
Defensively we have been solid but under no real threat. Ki has done well in midfield and Stokes has worked hard up front. The rest need a rocket at half time.
Need a big improvement
HT and I must dash out hopeful to pick it up again mid 2nd half