Like several wealthy English clubs, Manchester City harvest large numbers of players with talent and potential with the intention of adding the City brand to their CV before turning a profit on them.
They usually get two bites at the revenue cherry, once when they sell them and once when they pick up a portion of the subsequent fee when the player is sold by the club who does much of the development heavy lifting. The latter part of this plan fell through for both City and Celtic when Dedryck Boyata left Glasgow out of contract in 2019. Celtic were aware the player would not sign a new contract and recruited Marvin Compper in January 2018 to allow Boyata to leave for a fee the following summer.
Compper was an unmitigated flop and without options they had any faith in, Celtic rejected a £9m bid from West Ham, which resulted in a temporary withdrawal of services by the player and the horrors of a valuable Belgian international leaving without a fee.
City did better with the £4.5m fee they received from Celtic for Olivier Ntcham four years ago. Olivier had stacks of potential but he failed to maintain a regular starting place at Celtic and was allowed to leave on loan in January. It seems unlikely that a player struggling at Celtic would be successful at Marseille and the early signs are not promising. He is very likely to pitch up at Lennoxtown in June without attracting a move to his native France and prepared to run down the final 12 months of his contract.
Despite these two poor examples, there is merit in scouring the development ranks of Europe’s largest clubs – his is how we found Odsonne Edouard, but even when the player is talented and successful, realising your investment when they inevitably leave is far from straightforward.
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Hhmm.
Must admit to feeling a bit depressed by this article.
I see two main problems with our recruitment strategy
1. We don’t execute it as well as we should
But even if we did
2. It’s a rigged game.
Big clubs have enough money to people traffick 15-18 year olds ….
…. several years before we come along looking for 19-20 year old gems in the “played 20 – 60 first team games” bracket.
Inevitable that we’ll pick some sows ears.
BTW – good calls from posters re hindsight.
Dedryck Boyata knew of interest from Fulham and West Ham weeks before we played AEK Athens.
Can you imagine the uproar If we’d sold him?
“Fans, fans – it’s our business model”?
Am sure that would have been unanimously accepted (NOT).
Anyway …..
Hail hail
Keep The Faith
I see the beeb are drooling over the huns’ 12 month unbeaten run…
ROCK STREET BHOY
I think it was Tuesday night on SS Irish guy phoned in saying he was just a football supporter,question”is it 1 or 55 ” Roger Hannah said “if the team wears blue and plays at ibrox it’s “rangers”so 55 it is but someone should call them out don’t know how far they would get after all it’s Scotland.
I can be cruel at times, so, here’s Slippy slippin’ 😂
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/av/football/56282739
Timhorton…once we overtake them it won’t really matter. And anyhow we will keep reminding them of the truth…
Dinner gong has just sounded…must go.
My tuppence worth and tuppence is being generous
Asset management is mediocre at best, if our model is to find a rough diamond and move them on, stepping stone as you were then it could be better, we sort of shoe horn ‘talent’ into the squad, without the consideration of team building. We pay for an academy and see little fruit in the first team, you could say that about the majority of teams, however, we’ve just seen an exodus of young talent leave for all sorts of teams on the continent, bigger league teams, my question on that would be why ? Is it a particularly good crop of players and why did they move on, are they privy to something we don’t know.
Has Beaton phoned Steven to apologise yet? Of course he has…
SFTB 16:42
Very few will now own up to the fact that McGeady was described as a “one trick pony,
——
Happy to help.
Best thing he ever did was sign the contract to force Spartan Moscow to spend the £9m.
He fair set the heather on fire after leaving, didn’t he?
Spartak, obviously
SD- I remember when McGeady was with us,one of the senior staff told me he was ‘uncoachable’ ,took me a while to realise he was right, BTW I enjoyed watching him in the Hoops.
Have no problem with picking up kids and developing them. We have seen some great talents over the years from that approach. Have also seen some epic fails. That is the nature of player transfers and occurs at all ages.
Our biggest failings as far as this goes is actually keeping hold of players who dont want to be here anymore. If they have interest and want to leave move them on for as much as possible and replace. If they say they are happy to stay get them tied down to a new contract that does not drop below 2 years.
We need to have players available to purchase and/ or promote from our academy when players want to leave. That is the second failing, being under prepared and purchasing players without seemingly looking at the players profile I.e. high, strength, pace, technical ability strengths weaknesses etc, playing style.
Celtic have lost games and millions of pounds because the basics are missed. Sort these basic issues out and we will be better prepared.
We need a core group of players that stay beyond 2 years and that is possible if we have a better academy and actually use it alongside signing the best scottish players out there and reward success on the park.
We have had a great 9 years and sadly it all seems to have fallen apart. But unlike some I think the correct changes and the right signings can have us purring next season.
HH
NOTTHEBUS on 4TH MARCH 2021 3:54 PM
AN TEARMANN
I am referring to the universal love in and considering if the sands of time will be so kind to our current CEO
I remember nose to nose arguments on my supporters bus on the job he was doing at the time. He was certainly disliked by a high percentage of the support and came off badly in the public opinion battles concerning Tommy Burns, Wim Jansen etc.
My own opinion is that he is a hero who saved the club from certain extinction.
=====================================
I remember the nose to nose debates too :-)
Fergus would be the first to say he was there to do a job and that job was so big his popularity(or lack of) didnt count.
i fell out with a friend on his flag day due to his traatment.ironically bumped into him on 14thjune2012 and made up.:-)
yeh it was sad with Tommy but he was right
wim made his own way.there was more of course but nothing takes away from the difference in Celtic from then until now.
on every level.
HH&ss
STEPHBHOY67 on 4TH MARCH 2021 6:31 PM
Have no problem with picking up kids and developing them. We have seen some great talents over the years from that approach. Have also seen some epic fails. That is the nature of player transfers and occurs at all ages.
———
Problem we have is that in a 2 horse race for European riches we won’t gamble on youth or give them the chance they deserve
Only way to see what we got is the reserves/youths team playing in lower leagues but lower leagues don’t want it
Then it’s loan abroad for development which we seem to have started to do in last couple of years
FRANKTERRY on 4TH MARCH 2021 1:58 PM
The DUP and their terrorist gangs – proving that dinosaurs do indeed exist at the same time as humans.
Obviously the people who voted for Brexit knew that this would happen because one thing they’re not is complete and utter morons.
——-
The irony being that those of them who believe in the ‘young earth’ theory and a literal translation of the bible, don’t really believe in the dinosaurs.
HH jg
The more I see how the Huns have won this season’s league,The more I get angry with Lennon ,Lawelll.
I’ve no problems with signing players with the intention of turning a profit. But only if that is a means of leveling up the quality of player at the club.
We should be aiming to keep the odd star to form a core of the team, players that want to be part of the club.
That requires us to be competing in Europe and have a manager that can attract and keep players.
We had that pull with Rodgers, the unmitigated disaster that was Lennon did not afford that opportunity.
Buying young players at £5m and selling them at £15m should be the go to aim, allowing us to over time to start buying players closer to £10m and sell them at £20m+ (a massive simplification but basically the Porto method).
Over time you get the odd few who fall in love with the club and stay for a large chunk of your career, like Larsson, mixed with those who develop and turn a massive profit, like Dembele.
All players have ambitions, but how far those ambitions come into play are defined by how well regarded they are, how much they’re enjoying not just their football but their life (and that of their families) and their loyalty to teammates and manager.
Selling players for profit without someone ready in the wings is, however, unforgivable.
TIMHORTON on 4TH MARCH 2021 5:57 PM
The club should be calling them out, it’s an easy win for them, congratulate them on their first ever title, get us all back onside, but unfortunately they haven’t got the nerve, spineless and gutless.
I am an outright Fergus fan.
However, I sri
Watching the spurs game – Jose still coaching the art of diving – Kane should have been booked.
Harry £150m Kane missed a free header from 8 yards – and Deli Ali flick from 2 yds was missing until defender put it in.
Jambos in front of the jungle any good guys in that team ? I think I see one. has the poster got the date wrong in awe , was it not 65 ?
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Conversation
retro10
@_retro10
The Hearts team line up for a picture before their game against Celtic at Parkhead on 18th April 1964. This was the final match of the season and both sides were fighting for 2nd place, however the 1-1 draw allowed Kilmarnock to confirm the runners up spot.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Evn_49_WYAIzMIh?format=jpg&name=large
https://twitter.com/DMcGCfc1888/status/1367209447840485377
If this is the GB,the riot squad would be all over them…
JAMESGANG
Everyone knows the devil put the dinosaur bones in the earth to test our faith :-)
Bada
Thats where our custodians need to dtand up…like Robertson, park. lourdes’ old man etc.
Replying to
@_retro10
Celtic from the same day
9:31 AM · Mar 4, 2021·Twitter for Android
4
Likes
https://twitter.com/_retro10/status/1367407412110635008/photo/1
Swap Charlie Gallagher for John Divers and you’ve got a Celtic song
Scullybhoy
https://twitter.com/Celticcurio/status/1367105008248971265?s=09l
L to R from Matt Corr and Celtic curio on twitter
1.H.o’Donnell
2.Napier
3.F.o’Donnell
4.buchan
5.Delaney
6 Crum
7McGrory
8 Patterson
9 mcDonald
10 Geatons
11.McGonagle
12 Hogg
13 Kennaway.
Hope that helps Scullybhoy.it is a class pic and they all wore the hoops.
:-)
hope your good mate
HH&ss
SETTING FREE THE BEARS FOR RES. 12 & OSCAR KNOX on 4TH MARCH 2021 5:41 PM
While we can debate potential, level of development, etc, you’re forgetting one major and arguably the most important point – the huge difference in spending power.
£730,000 for Manchester City is a drop in the ocean. £4.5m for Celtic is a hugely significant amount.
There are no metrics or any scenario I can think of where £730,000 for City could be called as big a risk as £4.5m is for Celtic.
67ECW,
I think you are mixing up the Edouard’s of this season with the Hun munching,goal machine we had in the previous couple.
I agree.A very pale imitation.He has time to partly redeem himself ,by once again putting scum to the sword in the possible 3 remains match ups.
BOURNESOUPRECIPE on 4TH MARCH 2021 5:03 PM
Odsonne Edouard or Ollie McBurnie ( £20 Million ) 😂
————————————————————-
Who earns more?
Geebee
“There are no metrics or any scenario I can think of where £730,000 for City could be called as big a risk as £4.5m is for Celtic.”
———————————-
The metrics, as I thought I explained were in the ages of the players when they were ought. Iy=t is a bigger punt to recruit a 16 year old than it is to detect a good 21 year old.
Of course the £730k is nothing to City, Hell the £4.5m is a nothing prchase to them.
Squire D
Aiden may not have had a Stellar career but after 6 full seasons of contribution to Celtic, he earned us our highest ever transfer fee, at that time.
He had 4 seasons with Spartak where he must have felt alienated culturally and linguistically, before being bought by a top half EPL club in Everton, where he stayed for a further 4 years though out on loan for the last two. He was then bought by Sunderland, where he is still a regular pick. Meanwhile he was capped 95 times by the ROI.
Not stellar, maybe, but far from a journeyman career and I think he is entitled to treat he ill -informed “one trick pony” jibes with the contempt they deserve.
I well understand that many of your fellow party members felt it was unforgiveable that he chose to be appreciated by the ROI fanbase rather than face the vitriol of the Scottish National Team fans, though.
SETTING FREE THE BEARS FOR RES. 12 & OSCAR KNOX on 4TH MARCH 2021 8:27 PM
Yes, you’re right in terms of age. If all things were equal, signing a 16-year-old would represent more of the unknown than a 21-year-old but then the price reflects that.
My point is City can afford these “punts”. For us, there’s bigger pressure to get it right.
Problem is, sell a player at the peak of his powers and you risk fan backlash. Fact is, almost every club in the world is a selling club to an extent. I have no problem with buying low and selling at the highest price – as long as the money we get is well-invested.
So AT set me the task of building a starting 11 – in a 4-4-2 – for £30m. He kindly excluded wages. The players in question had to be 25 or under.
The team/squad I’ve gone for are naturally callow and I think Europe would be tough, but (properly coached) I think they could win the league and the potential is high. I tried to keep it realistic – no “Messi on a Bosman” types. So here goes:
GK – Freddie Woodman – Newcastle – Bosman.
Perpetually on loan which saw him spend time at Kilmarnock and Aberdeen. Now at Swansea, who have the best defensive record in the Championship. Could be Forster Mark II.
RB – Felix Passlack – Dortmund – Bosman.
I suggested Svensson which kicked this whole thing off. However, I misread his age and he’s 27 (not 25 as I thought). So to keep within parameters, I’m suggesting Felix Passlack of Dortmund as an alternative. He’s 22, a German u-21 international and out of contract in summer. A product of the Dortmund youth system, His time and Dortmund has largely been spent on loan – he’s had stints at Hoffenheim, Fortuna Sittard, and Norwich. Between the 4 clubs, he’s only played around 90 games, so really needs to make a sensible decision on his next move to kick on. I think he’d do well for us (though he is a bit of a gamble) and the Frimpong example would probably convince him that a move to us could be good for his longer-term career.
LB: Juan Miranda – Barcelona – Bosman.
More appropriately Barcelona B team as he’s only made 4 appearances for the first team (3 in the Copa Dep Rey and 1 in the Champions League). He would be a consummate gamble as his first team experience is limited – he featured in 12 games on loan at Shalke and (so far) 16 on loan this year at Real Betis. He’s playing regularly now for Betis, featuring in 12 of thier last 14 games.
Like Passlack, someone who needs to make a sensible decision for his next move and we could fit the bill. He’s 6ft1 for those who like/want tall full backs.
CB: Cameron Carter-Vickers – Spurs – Bosman.
An American international, he’s clocked up over 100 appearances in the English Championship. He’s bounces around on loan for a few years now – Stoke, Swansea, Sheffield United, Luton, Ipswich, and currently Bournemouth- and I can’t see Spurs offering a new deal.
CB: Benkovic – Leicester City – £5-8m.
We know all about him and his career post-Celtic hasn’t been great. I think if Leicester could get their money back (£10m) or some of it with a stinking sell on, they’d let him go. At £5-10m there’s room to make a profit long-term, and we know there’s a player in there.
RM – Youssef Ait Bennasser – Monaco – Bosman.
24 year old Moroccan international, with 90 games in League 1, and has been around the loan block in France. As I’m not a professional scout I’m restricted to Google searches, but he looks to have a bit of skill and good close control. He’s a CM by trade but can play RM and DM, so I’ve put him in there with a view to him tucking in to create a middle 3 if we need more numbers in the centre or to allow Passlack to bomb on without us being left light at the back.
CM – Junior Bacuna – Huddersfield – Bosman.
A 23 year old Dutchman who was capped at u-21 level before choosing to play for Curacao at senior level.
He’s been at Huddersfield since 2018,
playing 21 games in the Premier League and 69 in the Championship. He was picked up from Groningen where he had played 83 games.
DM – Dejan Ljubicic – Rapid Vienna – Bosman.
23 year old Captain of Rapid Vienna, he’s played almost 120 games for Rapid in the Austrian Bundesliga. Almost moved to Chicago Fire a year or so ago but controversially failed a medical. Chicago said he had an ACL injury but Rapid checked and couldn’t see it – echoes of Hartson to Rangers there.
LW – Marco Grull – SV Reid – Bosman.
A gamble (again) in that he’s in his first season in the Austrian top flight having been promoted last season. This season he’s got 9 goal contributions (6 goals and 3 assists) in 18 games for a team who are struggling (3rd bottom in the league). Overall he’s got 57 goal contributions (26 goals and 31 assists) in 67 games, so think he’d be a decent addition given he’s only 22.
CF – Mohamed Bayo – Clermont Foot – £5m
In his first season with Clermont Foot in France’s Ligue 2, he’s had 23 goal contributions (18 goals, 5 assists) in 38 games. In season 2019-20, he had similar numbers in the French third division- 22 goal contributions (16 goals, 6 assists) in 36 games, so he’s showing the ability to step up and at 22 has some good goal numbers in France.
CF – Luke Jephcott – Plymouth Argyle – £5m.
21 year old youth product, he scored 7 goals in 14 games in Plymouth’s prompt season helping them escape League 2. This season he has 25 goals in 37 games, showing the potential to step up.
I’d use the spare cash to bring in McKenna (£4m – Nottingham Forrest), Ferguson (£5m – Aberdeen) and Nisbett (£3m – Hibs) as well as bringing in Ostigard (Brighton – Bosman – 30 games for Coventry in Championship and around the same in Bundesliga 2 for St Pauli. Norwegian U-21 centre back) and Campbell (Motherwell). Rounding the squad out with some existing players, it would look like:
GK – Woodman / Bain
RB – Passlack / Welsh
CB – Vickers / Benkovic / McKenna / Ostigard
LB – Miranda / Taylor
RM – Forrest / Bennasser
LM – Grull / Johnson (last chance for him)
CM – Soro / Turnbull / Ferguson / Campbell / Ljubicic / Bacuna
CF – Bayo / Jephcott / Nisbett / Klimala (I think there’s a player in there).
please please never bring that var offside rule up here
Chris Shevlane is the guy on the extreme left of the back row.
Signed for us from Hearts but had bad ankle so didn’t break into the team.
Moved to Hibs where he was more of a regular.