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Charlatan government opens pubs and shuts stadiums

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I was delighted to read the Scottish Government’s clinical director, Jason Leitch, say there are strong advocates from within the Government that football fans will at one point be encouraged to leave pubs when watching games and instead attend in socially distanced numbers at outdoor stadiums.

It will not apparently happen next month, but there may be a trial when the national flags can fly when Scotland team plays in September.

You and I can only wonder when the Government’s scientists will find evidence that an easily policed outdoor arena will become as safe from Covid-19 as thousands of indoor pubs across Scotland.

Pubs, with their drinking, exchange of money, regular toilet use and the legendary increase in judgement that comes after alcohol is consumed, are clearly the safest places to watch football.  If this was not the case, your government would stop fans gathering in them to cheer on their teams and celebrate goals.

And remember, to make watching football in pubs extra safe, the government decided you do not need to wear masks when inside a pub.  Yes, masks are important, but only in shops, if you go to a pub this weekend to watch football, none of those shouting and celebrating will be wearing a mask.

By contrast, football stadiums, with their designated and easily dispersed seating, blanket CCTV monitored from dedicated police facilities, all that outdoor air and with masks used by everyone in a spectator area, are clearly more dangerous to public health than gatherings in pubs.

They would not be able to sell alcohol at football stadiums, so unlike pubs, would need to rely on the sober judgement of spectators to ensure safety procedures were respected.  And I don’t need to tell you how ineffective sober judgement is compared to how easily drunk people find following rules.

To suggest that it is worse (as I stupidly thought) for public health to gather in pubs to watch games this weekend, instead of socially distances in stadiums, is ridiculous.  If this was not the case, what would it say about your governments regard for you or your health?

This is typical of recent politicians’ involvement in football.  Not content will kettling fans, or trying to make political dissent illegal, they are happy to throw the masses they pretend to care about together in pubs at greater risk to public health, rather than actually listen to reason from outside their logic-defying bubble.  Whenever I see these clowns I think of thought-control charlatans.  This is a a farce, the Government know it, football knows it and we all know it.  Those not prepared to admit it should consider how much thought control they are already under.

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377 Comments

  1. Ernie, What difference does it make where anybody is sitting.

     

    At the moment in Ireland 200 can attend games in the South 400 in the North & these are in tiny grounds where you couldn’t swing a cat,

     

    So far so good, no indications yet of any clusters arising from match attendance,

     

    We expect attendance numbers to be raised gradually & the GAA are hopeful that Croke Park will be allowed to host 20,000 by October.

     

    Everything of course is dependent on keeping the Covid Numbers down, if they start to rise all decisions will be reversed & rightly so.

     

    I think this is a reasonable possibility that Scotland might do something similar.

  2. Rock Tree Bhoy on

    GLASGOW LIVE

     

     

    A Celtic fan also wanted to find out Hoops had a good player at their disposal and the responses from AEK fans were overwhelmingly positive.

     

     

    One said: “Yeah he is really good…he is better than the last goalkeeper you had.”

     

     

    Another replied: “He is the best goalkeeper playing in Greece.”

     

     

    One added: “If he was playing at a more advanced league than Greece, Celtic could never get the transfer with this money. Also even AEK would not agree with the transfer but he wanted to do it. Celtic really got a bargain there. You will see on the pitch.”

     

    _____________________________________

     

     

     

    Sounds Great!

  3. SPFL clubs approve use of up to five subs. Clubs can now name NINE subs.

     

    Great news for us I think as it means 16 players out of 20 can be involved in each game.

  4. CORKCELT on 30TH JULY 2020 5:12 PM

     

    Ernie, What difference does it make where anybody is sitting.

     

     

     

    ###

     

     

    In which case he’d be happy to sit with the rest of the fans, share the same facilities and and be exposed to the same risk of infection, his age and (apparent) obesity notwithstanding?

  5. !!Bada Bing!! on

    Celtic chief Peter Lawwell said: “Celtic are delighted with this positive development and are very appreciative that the Government has taken this important step. We would like to thank the Scottish Government, the SFA/SPFL Joint Response Group and everyone at the Club who have collaborated and worked so hard over these past few difficult months.

     

     

    “It is our intention to get as many supporters as we can back into Celtic Park as soon as we can, within the guidance. However, the safety and security of our supporters is always our top priority, and we will communicate more on this as soon as possible.

  6. weebobbycollins on

    “However, the safety and security of our supporters is always our top priority,”

     

    Except when it’s not…

  7. The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on

    Just back from the garage.

     

     

    Is it just me or does everyone feel like bursting out laughing when they see someone wearing a Sevco top?

  8. It’s good to know the scientific fraternity are looking beyond the covid 19 pandemic and are sending a rover vehicle to mars to collect rocks which could well contain viruses. We’re doomed.

     

    If we have nine subs plus all the coaching staff then that’s the main stand full 🤭

  9. The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on

    WBC – don’t attend games if that’s how you feel.

     

     

    Your choice.

  10. I missed a good day and article as I was in work, risking my life in an inadequately protected environment. But I did it because I want to retire in 3 months time and I have a lot of work to tidy up and prepare for the person taking over for me. I could have refused, my attendance was not compulsory and I can still do some things but not all things via virtual connections (phone or video), but I embraced the small risk involved and took as many precautions as I could.

     

     

    Good to see so many new names posting from our lurker collection. Their politics are important to them and the SNP ones, amongs them, had an attack from which they wished to defend themselves. I hope to hear more from them and hope that this was not a last and only post. At least, none of them were Russian bots.

     

     

    Paul’s article was a mixture of genuine questions re the inconsistency of applied Covid rules and strong invective against the politicians with the power to apply them. Yet it opens with a note of approval for the point made by Jason Leitch, himself, that it would be preferable to have small crowds in the wider spacing of a stadium choosing to watch matches than it would to have a moderate crowd attend even a larger area pub (and most pubs, at present, are not large).

     

     

    Taking this as a starting point, I ask again why limit attendance to nothing?

     

     

    Yes, I take the point about managed risk and a gradualist approach to re-opening forbidden activities. We cannot and should not go from very little allowed to everything allowed.

     

     

    If we can open pubs with additionall rules to define the new normal, then we can, and will soon, re-open theatres and cinemas. If we can re-open trains then we can re-open planes, abeit, again, with restrictions on numbers spacing, toilet access and food and drink usage.

     

     

    Nobody has yet mounted an argument on here as to why 500 Celtic fans could not be allowed entrance and egress to a Celtic Park where no food and drink was for sale and where toilets had limits on entry. And if 500, why not 1,000 the following week amd 5,000 the following month. All dependent upon the spike, second wave, or first wave resurgent, resuling in an increase in restrictions all round.

     

     

    I accept TBB’s point about the possibility of increased travel being promoted by fans in small numbers moving across the country but that has to be taken into acoount within the context that the choice for these fans is not between huddling at home and not huddling at CP; they have other choices on a Saturday and Sunday with pubs, shops, coffee houses, parks and soon, theatres and cinemas.

     

     

    So the question isn’t about opening fully or keeping the lid tight on. As with the old joke question – “Would you sleep with me for £500?”- No!, followed by “would you sleep with me for 500 million?”- Yes! – we are not establishing an absolute in morality just the price that we are willing to pay for the risk that exists.

     

     

    Finally, as someone who is avowedly no fan of the SNP, the Scottish Government has been, for the main part, a beacon of clear instruction at a time when we have witnessed the low bar calamitous communications of Bojo, Trump & Bolsinaro. But we have not had a successful management of the Covid Crisis compared to most countries. Scotland continues to be 3rd in the table, behind England and Spain only, in having had the greatest increase in expected deaths over this period. These 3 countries are well clear of the next poorest performing European country in Belgium. We have performed worse than Wales, the ROI and Norn Ireland and this is in percentage terms, not absolute numbers, before i get any queries.

     

     

    Despite the credit I have quite justifiably given for Nicola’s clearer articulation of the message, we have not managed the implementation of the message well by any standards. Despite the low bar, set by Boris and chums, we have not implemented a radically different model from them – merely waiting a week or two to do what they have already done has much less to do with Scientific advice and a lot more to do with political positioning.

     

     

    And, above all, our Care Home Scandal is just as big an issue as England’s was, and with respect to Melbourne Mick this morning, far larger than that he was citing in Australia. The reckoning on that issue has still to be addressed and opposition spokespeople have been moderate and careful not to have that reckoning during the time of grief. But the brakes are off now, since the BBC Scotland Disclosure programme of 3 days ago and there is no longer an escape from addressing that failed and very hurtful policy.

     

     

    It certianly knocks the football issue well into second place.

  11. So if a few thousand fans are allowed into Celtic Park…how will Celtic decide which season ticket holders can be present ?

     

     

    Will Celtic be forced to only consider supporters who live near or in Glasgow, in order to reduce any health risk if supporters are travelling from all over Scotland and beyond ?

     

    Also, what IF your mate or next door neighbour is invited by Celtic for maybe 2 home games or more…but you dont get any invite ?

     

     

    HH

  12. The blogger

     

    Absolutely – pubs are open but I choose not to go because I don’t think it’s safe enough. So I’ve carried out my own risk assessment which we all do many times everyday. But I’m just about to leave for Mass where I’m happy with the procedures put in place.

  13. leftclicktic on

    THE BLOGGER FORMERLY KNOWN AS GM on 30TH JULY 2020 5:26 PM

     

    Just back from the garage.

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

     

    Is it just me or does everyone feel like bursting out laughing when they see someone wearing a Sevco top?

     

     

    ——————-

     

    Snigger at me f2f top.😂😂😂

  14. CaddingtonCommon on

    I see nobody is having technical problems logging in this afternoon

     

     

    Hail Hail

     

    Stay Safe

  15. eddieinkirkmichael on

    Amazing how political Paul67 can be when it Suits his own Unionist agenda.

  16. weebobbycollins on

    THE BLOGGER FORMERLY KNOWN AS GM on 30TH JULY 2020 5:27 PM

     

    WBC – don’t attend games if that’s how you feel.

     

     

     

    Your choice.

     

    What are you on about?

  17. !!Bada Bing!! on

    The politicos are never slow,but sporadic, whenever an SNP post gets fired on here,very strange.

  18. Paul 67,

     

     

    I cannot see any fault in your rationale.

     

     

    I would argue that it is far safer to attend a match in controlled environment at Parkhead rather than be a Celtic fan watching in Merchant City. Toilets are far more problematic in busy pubs and I can say this through experience even without a Celtic game being on.

     

    Social distancing and alcohol do not mix. As for test and trace, the amount of false names and contact details given to pubs is rife.

     

     

    That aside, Nicola Sturgeon’s presentation has been first class ( Compared with Boris Johnson’s anyway) although it is flawed.

     

    Our population density is 70 persons per Sq k. England’s is > 430. With that stastic our record compared to similar countries in Europe is appalling.

     

     

    I fear we will have to live with Covid 19. A vaccine may or may not be found. When found it may or may not be universially sucessfull. I would wager that many people have had Covid and have not realised it.

     

    Herd immunity may ultimately be the answer, but one thing for sure is that we cannot live the ” new normal ” indefinitely.

     

    I wish all our government’s well in this dilemma.

     

     

    HH.

  19. Jackson Carlaw quits as Tory leader to take up role as scriptwriter of CQN lead articles……

     

     

    🤷🏼‍♂️😉

  20. The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on

    WBC – I inferred from your comment that you felt Celtic did not have the best interests of their fans at heart and want to get supporters back in to Celtic Park for some nefarious reason..

     

     

    If you, or anyone else feels that way, simply do not attend games.

     

     

    If you feel it’s too ‘dangerous’ to go to the pub. Don’t go. Ditto shops, restaurants and everything else.

     

     

    It’s your choice what to do.

  21. Re. Five subs allowed ruling:

     

     

    While the general consensus seems to be that the new ruling favours the bigger clubs, Celtic tend to win a lot of their matches in the last 20 mins once teams begin to tire and our superior fitness begins to tell

     

     

    I know we have a lot of quality on the bench that we can call upon to break down stubborn defences but with the new rule, teams can stick eleven men behind the ball and attempt to hold out until the hour mark before bringing on five fresh players to do the exact same thing

     

     

    It will be interesting to see how teams decide to use it

     

     

    🍀

     

    B-)

  22. The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on

    Quite amazing how the cybernuts label anyone who disagrees with the Scottish government as TTTTTory.

  23. ADI_DASSLER NOT FOR 2ND BEST on 30TH JULY 2020 6:05 PM

     

    ‘Just say you hate SNP’

     

     

     

     

    ——

     

     

    If you insist.

     

     

    I hate the SNP.

  24. The Battered Bunnet on

    SFTB

     

     

    Fair points. Mine in short form is…

     

     

    It’s about managing the sum of the risks – the inevitable negative impact of relaxing each of the measures (plus mitigations) versus the sum of the benefits. You do that with each aspect of ‘normal life’ and keep the sum of it all below the threshold for reigniting community transmission.

     

     

    This inevitably leads you to trade one measure off against another. Schools are the big priority, along with big economic sectors. You can’t do everything at once or you trip the threshold. That’s why hospitality is reopening while allowing football fans in stadiums is in the relegation zone of priorities. There’s little doubt pubs are higher risk than football stadiums for the individual, but (simplistically) you can’t have both and open the schools too. Hospitality has greatly more jobs attached to it, so which do you choose?

     

     

    Night clubs and gig halls I fear will be novelties when they are finally permitted to reopen. See the recent patterns of infection transmission in Spain and France and elsewhere for a hint.

     

     

    I think also you underestimate the importance of – or unjustly attribute motivation for – the differences in relaxing measures either side of the border. Up here, there’s an express policy of ‘Zero Covid’, and approaches have been diverging with England for more than 3 months. Down south the priority has been opening up as fast as possible without swamping the NHS.

     

     

    They are entirely different approaches and time will tell which (if any) is more effective, but the Scottish approach necessitates the caution you refer to as ‘political positioning’, and thus far it is apparently less expensive in deaths and long term morbidity. Whether it means fewer restrictions/lockdowns etc in due course remains to be seen.

     

     

    Whispers suggest England will adopt the zero Covid approach in early course, although they need to drive infections down considerably do be able to do it, and that might prove to be more difficult given they’ve opened up so much already.

     

     

    Anyway, pleased you’re well and working, and looking ahead three months there’ll be a wee scoop to be had.

  25. lets all do the huddle on

    i think P67 deliberately throws a political article into the mix just to get a reaction

     

     

    its the adrian durham style of getting more folk posting

     

     

    i would have thought he would be above that

     

     

    but if the adverts on here are paying him then he can be bought like most other folk can

  26. GREENPINATA on 30TH JULY 2020 6:00 PM

     

     

     

    The supposed justification for opening pubs and restaurants is to boost the economy. That benefit, it is claimed, outweighs the increased risk of transmission.

     

     

    How does opening CP to fans help to boost the economy?

     

     

    The tickets are already paid for. Money’s in the bank.

  27. lets all do the huddle on

    more importantly

     

     

    if 10000 folk are allowed into a celtic game shortly, do you think it will b a fair decision on who those lucky folk are?

     

     

    no, me neither…

  28. whitedoghunch on

    I have a disabled badge

     

    can I get one of those wee three wheelers

     

    and sit behind the goal

     

    bidet in the seat – too much ?

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