It feels like rock bottom this morning and, as far as Europe is concerned, it probably is. The ties against Legia were our worst performances in Europe. Neuchâtel has a horrible 90 minutes, Artmedia was a 20 minute collapse, and we beat Utrecht comfortably at home, but this was abject over two games.
There are unfathomables, for example, it’s hard to know why a defence which was so solid last season is suddenly inert, but it will surprise no one we didn’t make Champions League football this season. The day Neil Lennon left I suggested it would be a huge ask and it’s proven to be.
We are less than two years since the high point of recent seasons, finishing ahead of Benfica and Spartak Moscow in the Champions League, but the decline can be traced slightly further back than that.
We had an 18 month purple patch of player recruitment, starting when Fraser Forster, Gary Hooper and Emilio Izaguirre arrived in summer 2010, continuing with the arrival of Wilson and Wanyama, and ending with Mikael Lustig’s signing in January 2012. We were bringing players in for a few million who were Champions League calibre.
Since Lustig, the strategy hasn’t changed, but despite signing a raft of players, for much the same money, only van Dijk has improved the team. Most are, at best, misfits or squad fillers. Things started to go wrong with the bizarre signings of Miku and Lassad in late August 2012 and ramped up last summer with the arrival of Boerrigter, Pukki, Balde and Biton. There are more, of course. Some, like Griffiths and Johansen are hitting the modest levels expected of them, but we’ve been missing the target at an alarming rate.
Ronny Deila has so far brought in a six month loaner. He’s working pretty much with the squad Neil Lennon scraped into the Champions League with last season. He’ll now know what you and I knew about the squad months ago. Most importantly, he needs backing from the club as well as the support.
He has to refresh the squad, try to clear out the deadwood, and perhaps accept that one or two of our reliable performers in recent seasons are beyond their peak. It’s critically important that whatever has been going wrong since Lustig’s arrival is put right. Stop haemorrhaging millions of players who cannot command a starting place and start finding value.
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Paul67
I think the inability to spot and sign a player is what is the most frustrating part of the whole thing.
We all know what a good player looks like ( see first touch) so if fans can see it, why not scouts?
Or are they so rare and competition so fierce we might find them but cannot attract them?
Are we priced out of the skills market?
It’s beginning to look like it.
Kev j,
I find you make some valid points and to be honest, board wise, I agree with a lot of them.
From reading the blog lately and other Celtic sites, a lot of fans are coming to the conclusion, that the downsizing is driving “supporters” away.
So, let’s see what the transfer market beholds?
Personally, I think our new manager needs a chance and financial backing from the board, whether he gets it will depend on offloading all the dumplings that’s on our books….not an easy task.
EWO,
I think we are saying the same thing. Has to be diverse and inclusive of where the talent is rather than a protectionist homegrown market only or just overseas.
I like the look of Henderson and I liked the look of Biton, but he got caught up in the malaise last night, as did Johannson (sp).
Need to take stock come 1st September after the transfer window and see where phase 1 for Ronny D is, if we haven’t called time (which I think is wrong).
Were Samaras and Ledley. ‘Deadwood or beyond their peak?’
Four competitive games working with a new team and folk are calling for the manager to be sacked.
The only people who could show such a sense of entitlement and throw their toys out the pram are Sevconians. Otherwise you’d have to be up to this…… http://youtu.be/7WAwuSK36Gw
Rarely do successful managers hit the ground running. We all in our careers have to be given the opportunity of moving up a level in management for instance to gain the experience for us to fulfill the potential which we believe we have.
At Celtic and other big clubs, often the revolutionary who brings his own style and sticks to it, experiences what many think is a disastrous start.This is when the lunatics start howling for him to be fired. Those managers, who then achieve greatness, stick to their guns, to their style. I want and expect Ronny to do the same. There will be change, as there should be. Embrace it.
Ronny is the Celtic Manager.
We are Celtic Supporters.
Kevin=Blantyrekev
Just wanted to come on and offer one piece of rebuttal.
If I was “trying desperately to hide” my dislike of Peter Lawwell, I failed utterly. I wasn’t trying to hide any such thing. I wear my desire to see him gone out on my sleeve, and I have now for a very long time indeed.
In this, I am 100% consistent and unwavering. I have not set foot inside Celtic Park for a game in six years because he is still at the club, and I don’t care what that makes me in the eyes of some people. I bleed green, pure and simple, but I will not fund the failures of the current “plan”.
How badly has it failed? For those who don’t fancy reading 3000 words (yeah, it’s that long) I can boil last night’s piece down to a few paragraphs.
Graham Speirs and others have continued to defend “the strategy” and they keep on coming back to this argument that we can no longer compete in Europe.
Speirs article suggests we should be grateful for having European football until Xmas in five out of six seasons. In those six seasons we had four calamitous group stage meltdowns, which I’ve detailed. We had one season where we didn’t reach the groups of either competition at all and in the other Neil Lennon saw the club post a net profit of over £2 million in the summer prior to taking his side to fantastic heights in Europe, heights we hadn’t scaled since Gordon Strachan qualified from a group including AC Milan and Benfica.
During the January window, prior to playing Benfica, we bought Thomas Rogic. That was Lenny’s reward, our reward, for doing more with less.
People here have said this is the reality we have to face, that this is how it works now in European football, but some of the teams who have beaten us over that time – Aalborg, Hapeol, Rapid, Legia – have done so only because we’ve gone backwards.
In the same six year period Rangers won three titles. They blew a 15 point lead over us on their way to four in a row, and then collapsed and died. Neil won two out of three leagues without any competition at all. Over the same six years we won three out of twelve domestic cup competitions.
Some of you can kid yourselves all day and all night that this comes down to us being unable to compete with the big boys in Europe.
The truth is, we’ve achieved only marginal levels of success here in Scotland during the same six year period. The turnover of players in and out has been chaotic at best and we have had four managers in that time.
But Celtic is a well run club. Don;t make me laugh.
Can we take the MONEY oot of the BAW noo and start spending it.
MONEYBALL = A fancy sort of buscuit tin
MWD says AYE
Auldheid
I think we are a) being priced out and b) randomly going after the ‘he only cost a million’ so it’s not a great risk too many times.
Trad.
Not so sure about their credentials but thanks for disagreeing politely.
Fair article Paul, as it does feel like rock bottom, but was expected.
Doe’s anyone know for sure what the monetary benefit is when we take into account renting Celtic Park for Glasgow2014, once we’ve paid the SRU for Murrayfield ?
This season is set to be the biggest/most important we’ve had in a while………
HH
Prior to playing Juventus that last post should read, in relation to the Thomas Rogic window. This is what happens when I’m typing on the move!
£6m transfers used to buy you Hartson, Sutton or Lennon.
Now it is the price paid for Jordan Mutch or Brett Assombalonga. Aye, me too.
Not in the mood today to deal with the back bar revolutionaries who are looking to fix the blame, or get others to lead the campaign for them.
Meanwhile, achievers who live in the real world will get on to trying to fix the problem. And there is a lot to be fixed.
Interesting dilemma for the 16th August game.
Do we boo Fergus, like ungrateful spoiled fans for the 2nd time, or do we make amends and cheer him, then boo the current Board because they are acting just like Fergus did?
“Things started to go wrong with the bizarre signings of Miku and Lassad in late August 2012 and ramped up last summer with the arrival of Boerrigter, Pukki, Balde and Biton”.
Not read back and probably been said but those responsible for the above are still in a well paid job with us, that for me is a problem.
ps I woke up still a Tim and everything else is fixable.
jamesgang
I met a fellow Tim from Livi and some CQNers.
It wasn;t all bad.
LB
Ten in a row will never happen under this guy. And that worries me big time!!!!
Has the Manager’s tactics unnerved the players, or is it they simply don’t want to play for him. What concerned me most is that our bhoys were not going in for 50/50 balls and apart from one or two seemed to be just going through the motions. I accept we have been in decline for past 18 months but last night was a dramatic drop in form from last year. I can accept any player having a bad game or losing form over a period of games. However the very least you expect is 100% effort, we didn’t get that last night.
connaire12
12:59 on 7 August, 2014
I agree with the view you put forward of a disconect between the fans and the board. Like you I stayed to the end. I stood at the back of the lower section and found myself looking not at the game but at the fans, what I saw as I looked around me was the faces of our fans looking empty. Perhaps they felt like me as I had the same vacant gaze as I tried to take in not only what was happening but what will happen in the future, where are we going, whose leading us?
While it seems we are too good for Scotland but too poor for Poland and other large parts of Europe.
The main question is as Marvin Gayest sang ‘What’s going on?’
We signed VD for 3 million? Sensible investment. More please. No excuses.
Ah, the old Celtic aristocracy out in force, defending their right to lord it over the Celtic supporters.
The Ancien Regime right enough.
Determined to uphold their privileges in the face of an insurrection.
But wait…what is that I hear.
Its the sound of a guillotine being rolled out.
And as the blade hurtles downwards, the watching spectators shout, GTF.
HH
James Forrest is praying for The Unconquerable Oscar Knox
13:14 on
7 August, 2014
Celtic supporters put their money where their mouth is.
Can you point us to your comments after we beat Barcelona?
big wavy
13:13 on 7 August, 2014
Agreed – pretty much on the same page.
I think what we need to do differently is show more perseverance with our own though, rather than what I fear will become the usual ‘game here and there’.
Eg
Darnell Fisher should have ended the season as right back when he was back from injury.
I hope McGregor stays in the team.
I would like Henderson to take the place of Biton (I will hold my hands up to a personal dislike of the guy due to a recent tweet – however his passing last night was awful – continual 3 yard passes to a guy with an opponent closer than there was to him).
Father to Son…
‘’Chin up Bhoy, the only way is up now’’
Son to Father…
‘’Is it really Dad… is that a promise?’’
Father to Son…
‘’Never forget you’re blood son’’
Son to Father…
‘’I cling to it for life dad, I cling to it.’’
Father to Son…
‘’Nobody ever said it was going to be easy.’’
Son to Father…
‘’Listen to yourself dad, even you are excusing the inexcusable and you don’t even know you’re doing it. Listen to yourself and think about what, and whose, lies you are hiding your fears behind. The lies and the fears dad, the lies and the fears. I dream dad, I dare to dream, but liars are turning my dreams to long nightmares that scare me.’’
Captain Beefheart
13:15 on
7 August, 2014
Trad.
Not so sure about their credentials but thanks for disagreeing politely.
===================
According to Hamilton Tim I think it was they have around 90 members, supplemented by others who wish to join them for matches. They don’t know how every member is going to act but I know they will react to any garbage like that.
Same goes for CSC’s up and down the land, they are open to all but racist bile is not tolerated.
The GB are certainly the most visible group inside the ground but that does not mean they are more tolerant of bigoted views or the entire group is responsible for the actions of one idiot.
I will have a look on their forum later and see if this has been picked up on,
HH
Snake Plissken @ 12:42
I am going to the St Johnstone game tonight in Slovakia.
If Stevie May plays and does well I will let you all know if he is up to this level of football.
Unfortunately, he’d be cup tied if we bought him.
————-
I fear that may not be an issue for us for much longer this season.
HH jamesgang
macjay1 for Neil Lennon
13:20 on
7 August, 2014
James Forrest is praying for The Unconquerable Oscar Knox
13:14 on
7 August, 2014
Celtic supporters put their money where their mouth is.
====================
You mean, whilst lying on a beach in Australia telling us its fine that we are treated like criminals whilst travelling to support our team?
CQN seems to be attracting a more & more Hunnish type of contributor nowadays.
Undignified & gloating when they are handing out ‘doings’ to clubs with far less resources than ourselves.
‘Greeting’ & whinging when we are fairly & squarely put in our place by a decent Polish side that they naively expected to steamroller.
Complaining about Legia supporters being in the midst of the Celtic support & having the audacity to cheer when their team scored.
These Polish fans were not there to antagonise us. They were paying us a compliment by feeling safe to sit amongst us because of our reputation for good behaviour & sportsmanship. What a rude awakening they must have got !
It was not only our players who let themselves down.
We learn more about ourselves when we are losing than we ever will from victories.
Many of us have become like spoiled children.
Enough already !
Well done to Legia & their supporters, especially our own Zybszek.
Good luck in your final qualifying tie & hopefully beyond.
James Forrest
The turnover of players and managers has a lot to do with the volatility and lighthouse thinking of many of our fans.
As a very good writer and Celtic blogger, do you not recognise that you have demonstrated such volatility with your opinions? Did you not want Neil Lennon out after Killie, for example?
I agree that your position on PL and “speculate to accumulate” has been consistent but, because of your passion, you are led to other mood swings and over-reactions.
Now this might indeed be one occasion where it is correct to cut the manager and run but that would just make it 5 managers in that time. The next questions would be “Who comes next?” and “How long do you give him?” as our fans will remain volatile and demanding change after every big and important defeat, as well as after several small and unimportant defeats.
I will catch your reply whenever I get back on the blog. Out now
Kevjungle
That may be so ie reduced income from reduced sales.
It’s a bit like the SB strike over Ibrox way to unseat their Bored.
How’s that going?
Like it or lump it not supporting only makes matters worse not better.
The answer is to stop thinking there are two adversarial sides in the Celtic story and find ways of working better together.
Oh the irony of that.
I think that things will get better when the suits realise we are a Football club.
1 Ryan Mc Gowan 2 Jonny Russell 3 Snodgrass 4 Ciftci 5 Mc Ginn St M 6 Adam Rooney 6 players I think should be at Celtic
Maybe it’s because the players can’t get to Nando’s of an afternoon and instead are being asked to train to improve their fitness that is causing all these problems?! Maybe!
MWD says AYE
I’d love to know Peter Lawwells retirement plan. I increasingly feel he is working to that timescale. The short to medium expediency approach rather than the long term best interest of the Club…
By October … 20,000 attendance. At best.
the green man
12:50 on 7 August, 2014
Are you KevJ …?
Yes we also got grubbed last season by Barcelona and Milan but this was Legia Warsaw FFS!
Samaras and Ledley aside this is the same group of players who romped the league with a miserly defence and impressive points total. No question we are light on real quality but again this was Legia. The scoreline is just unacceptable and could easily have been much much worse.
Alarm bells should be ringing loudly about the manager, but let’s see how he handles the final qualifying round of the Europa.
Hopefully we draw some real diddies!
cultsbhoy
13:28 on 7 August, 2014
As long as you are one of those 20,000 won’t matter to you will it
setting free the bears for Res. 12 & Oscar Knox but saying no to CQN racists
13:16 on 7 August, 2014
Cutting through the condecending tone, are you saying that Celtic supporters who are complaining about the stewardship and direction of a club we all love, are bar room revolutionaries? Are you one of the ‘achievers’ who will help fix things?
Sometimes I think people forget they are on the internet and what is said on here will have minimal influence on what happens at any level within our club.
Fergus gave us vision and direction and a plan and was (wrongly, IMO) booed. This is not what we’re getting at the moment.