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Hampden glory a consequence of century of struggle, denial and sacrifice

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Congratulations to all at Celtic on securing our fourth consecutive trophy. Those of us who lived through the 90s (and those who also lived through the 50s) know how precious these times are.

Collecting that trophy yesterday is not the act of a vastly better resourced club picking up what is their divine right. It is the consequence of over a century of struggle, denial and sacrifice. The current success of Celtic is as remarkable as it looked to be unlikely for much of its existence.

The reflective glory that shines on all of us is the gift of downtrodden ancestors who wanted to escape hardship. When the trophies arrive, celebrate a deliverance.

Throughout the first half yesterday Celtic were well below their normal incisiveness. You and I have seen so many League Cups slip away over the years against weaker opponents. At halftime I thought, “All it will take is a half-chance for Motherwell and it’s the same old story.” Instead, James Forrest found the breakthrough and Craig Gordon (and the post) were up to the job when called upon.

Motherwell manager Steve Robinson has done very well but he set himself up for a fall after beating Newco in the semi-final. Pedro Caixinha was correct predicted Motherwell would not finished the final with 11 men on the field.

The get-into-their-face/leg/body approach was Motherwell’s best strategy for taking on Celtic (and Newco), but there’s no point crying about the consequences afterwards, when you lose.

There has been more heat than light shed on the penalty incident, a consequence of seasonal pantomime analysis. Ask any referee the question he is trained to ask himself in this scenario:

What is Kirpe’s arm doing across Scott Sinclair?

His arm is there to inhibit his opponent. No one will be able to give you an alternative scenario.

The incident would have been a foul and a yellow card anywhere else on the field. That is the statutory punishment for putting an arm round opponent in possession, unless it is a goal-scoring opportunity, in which case the card should be red.

It is unacceptable for a player to fall to the ground when he was not fouled, but not only is it acceptable to fall when you have been fouled, it is expected, unless you want the referee to play advantage.

I do feel sorry for Kipre, who by that stage of the game must have assumed his could foul and hack with impunity, but as well as pumping him up to play this brand of robust football, his manager should educate him on the consequences of putting an arm around and in front of an opponent inside the box.

There is a lesson here for Celtic too. When we lose a cup (or a game), it is likely to be when we concede a penalty and a red card.

Chris Sutton and Neil Lennon: love your work, but your performances on TV yesterday is why good analysts learn the guidelines given to referees. Stick to baiting Newco fans and finishing second in the league respectively.

Moussa, love your work too, but I don’t like penalties that go right down the middle of the goal. Note that every keeper in the land watched yesterday’s game and many will gamble on your repeating the exercise next time you face them from the spot. This is a tactic you must use sparingly.

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340 Comments

  1. Seems Collum told Hayes that if SS had went down when clearly fouled by Ambrose, he would have given a penalty……you shouldn’t have to go to ground to get a penalty, but maybe that’s what you have to do now.

  2. BIG-CUP-WINNERS on

    Need to stop eating yourself over the penalty yesterday ?

     

     

    Might even be appropriate to say magic we got a decision ! It’ll be added to the pantheon of decisions Celtic get:

     

     

    Big Roy stealing the Deadclub’s throw in back in 1980.

     

     

    Samaras scoring from a corner that the Motherwell (them again) players thought was their ball.

     

     

    The next one is due in 2041.

  3. Gerryfaethebrig on

    Philbhoy 8.52pm

     

     

    Scott Sinclair centre half, why not :-)

     

     

    All kidding aside Scott has been immense for us since day one at tynecastle and long may he stay with us

  4. Lennon and Sutton are being criticized because they don’t know or understand the laws of the game.

     

     

    Basic stuff for a professional club manager, but does’t matter a **** for a tosspot commentator who wants to run with the hare and the hounds.

     

     

    Mibbe they should join with the smsm and just make up the rules to suit their AGENDA!!!!

     

     

    C’MON THE CELTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  5. Celtics Kilmarnock’s and Partick Thistles next penalties in the league this season will be each teams first. Dundee lead the way having had 5 penalties in the league this season.

  6. I recall 3 controversial decisions that have went in our favour this season,

     

     

    Partick Thistle away, Bitton tackle, it could have been a penalty admittedly but not a stonewaller.

     

     

    Morelos at Ibrox, never a penalty.

     

     

    Yesterday, it was a penalty.

     

     

    Now,

     

     

    Think of how many decisions have went against us,

     

     

    The Hibs penalty at Hampden.

     

     

    Sinclair v Hibs at CP.

     

     

    O’Dea not getting a second yellow at CP for a blatant block.

     

     

    Bobby Madden’s entire performance at St Johnstone.

     

     

    Stonewall penalty, Calmac at Ross County.

     

     

    Tackle on Moussa yesterday.

     

     

    That’s just off the top of my head. Generally refereeing is poor and our players are kicked with impunity.

  7. THETIMREAPER

     

     

    Motherwell at Fir Park on Wednesday…………..Willie Collum refereeing…………….no tv camera’s……………….

     

     

    I hope you have a big sheet of paper………………..

  8. PHILBHOY on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 8:57 PM

     

    Lennon and Sutton are being criticized because they don’t know or understand the laws of the game.

     

     

    ###

     

     

    What did either of them say that suggested they neither knew nor understood the laws of the game?

     

     

    They were both of the view that the contact wasn’t sufficient to impede Scott Sinclair’s progress.

     

     

    If they are correct (and each of them has vastly more experience on which to base their opinion than anyone posting here) then there was no foul.

     

     

    Scott Sinclair was cute. He got away with it.

  9. Row NN just to right of halfway line north stand (nae benefit of numerous replays)

     

    Penalty Aye, Scott Sinclair could have stayed on his feet Aye sending off Naw

     

    Kieran Tierny on Louis Moult,didn’t see it.

     

    Tackle on Moussa Dembele other side of park. Not too many protests from those sitting in my vicinity and not too many protests from the players there again not many of us had the benefit of wind back or replays

  10. Watched the highlights today. Surprised at Lennon throwing Sinclair under the bus to be honest. As for Sutton, when Craig Gordon made the wonder save he said ‘he gets a strong hand to it’. He should have called I t for what it was, a world class save. It’s clear Sutton holds a personal grudge against Craig Gordon. Possibly it dates back to him coming up for that corner when at Hearts.

  11. Had the referee done his job properly in the first place, the Mwell player wouldn’t have been on the pitch.

     

    Had the same Mwell player not put his arm on Scott Sinclair in the pen box, Scott Sinclair wouldn’t have fallen.

     

    Those are the facts, end of, anything else is pish and wind, suck it up.

  12. ERNIE LYNCH

     

     

    They both said it wasn’t a penalty.

     

     

    They don’t understand the laws of the game .

     

     

    McHugh got booked for a similar challenge when Armstrong (think) didn’t go down, but merely slowed his run when tugged however gently/strongly/ferociously.

     

     

    The referee was supported on shortbread tonight when a former referee confirmed he made the right call.

     

     

    Referees do get it right sometimes.

  13. When Scotty Sinclair said he was a target every time he played, I didn’t realise he meant for the CQN Monday Morning Quarterback clique…

     

     

    ;-))))

  14. Brendan Rodgers comment post-match interview yesterday

     

     

    I look at it & think it’s a penalty…I’m not sure of the rules, not sure it was a red card”

  15. HAMILTONTIM on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 8:33 PM

     

    Oops!

     

    ————————————————————-

     

    No problem,that result still hurts.

  16. Ex Cathedra

     

     

    Thank you. I’ll take yesterday’s ‘controversy’ happily in the full knowledge of how we’ve been wronged over the years.

  17. It wiz a Lafferty penalty….

     

    It takes a wee bit of getting used to the Cellic getting Lafferty penalties….

     

    Or, it wiz an Amoruso Juventus penalty…

     

    Awfy strange tumbleweeds comin doon the tracks….

     

    Awfy awfy strange ¥ Π ∆ ~ ¿ ¡ ¶

     

    Anyway,…….

     

    ……oot.

  18. Goooooood Evening CQN

     

    Now my biggest issue today

     

    12 of us left in LMS9

     

    3 have picked Sevco, I think they Should be thrown oooot :-)))

  19. Ernie Lynch

     

     

    I think we know your point Ernie given CQN seems to have captured your attention span for much longer than normal, today at least, and most Celtic fans have had ‘the penalty’ rammed down our throats here in La La land. There’s no hope for Chris Sutton he’s not the brightest and despite his legendary ‘hun skelping’ status he’s just not a good analyst, and whilst he’s bucked a trend in Scotland, he remains BT small fry in Scotland.

     

     

    You seem to dwell on Scott Sinclair saying ‘he felt the contact and went down’ but has been pointed out already by better posters than us that doesn’t mean he dived.

     

     

    IMHO Neil Lennon let the side down big time when he was given a rare opportunity to broadcast to the nation, unless of course he’s inside Scott Sinclair’s head like you obviously are. I saw Neil Lennon brought down in the box at Ibrokes with ‘maximum contact’ and Celtic didn’t get a penalty.

     

     

    Shouting and that’s what it is, deflects as per the agenda even when it comes from ex employees who are supporters not in the Celtic end, and only off camera, you should’ve made your point and moved onto Celtic winning the cup like most posters

     

     

    IMHO CSC

  20. THOMTHETHIM FOR OSCAR OK on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 7:42 PM

     

    GARCIA LORCA on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 7:24 PM

     

     

    Stunning post, especially the Rafferty reference. You and I are Celtic contemporaries and, like you, I remember the 50’s-60’s, the Kelly era.

     

     

    Singing fae the same song book as both of you, however, the disdain for us goes well back further than that, but with no bampots watching over them, they did what, where, when and how they liked.

     

     

    Take the Quinn incident for example which occurred near the end of the 1905 SC semi between us and them at Parkheid (how did that happen).

     

     

    Now this was during a time when deidco were evidently non-sectarian and whose 1st chairman james henderson was a fairly decent man. He was renowned for his work among the poor children of Govan and the club had a notable record of helping charitable causes including Catholic charities. Matches were played for the benefit of the unemployed in 1886 and donations made to help the Unemployed Relief Fund in the Kinning Park area. He also, and the club, had good relations with the fledgling club from the east end and sent a team over there for their inaugural game.

     

     

    Unfortunately that all ended when he passed away in 1912 and was succeeded by the demagogue primrose-ure who while nearing the end of his 11 year reign tragically lost the 21 year team manager, with a 66% winning record including 8 Championships and 1 Scottish Cup, in the murky waters of the Clyde, and the pledging of the club to the craft while along with the coxswain the emergence of a sectarian policy that has scarred the country ever since.

     

     

    Back to that game, Jimmy Quinn was ordered off when according to a newspapers’ report “craig (the deid team full back) was downed. He caught Jimmy who was tearing over him, by the leg, and the latter is alleged to have kicked him in an effort to free himself”

     

     

    When Jimmy was sent off a section of the crowd invaded the park. The game was then stopped and the players ordered to the dressing rooms.

     

     

    Once order was restored the MITB tried to restart the game. Celtic refused, Chairman John H McLaughlin (yes he who helped pioneer the SFL) although sympathetic with his support in recognising that Jimmy was unfairly dismissed also acknowledged that we were the offenders and conceded the game. Sir Bob was to mirror this almost 60 years later for a similar disturbance.

     

     

    The game had hardly ended when one journalist wrote “However, hard it may be on the Celtic club, who have done much to prevent disorderly conduct at their ground, it is hoped that the SFA close it for at least a month”. Yet today sevco escape censure as they are seen to be trying to silence their “up tae their knees” support.

     

     

    At the SFA meeting to deal with the Mighty Quinn it was decreed in the MITB report that he had “kicked and stamped” on craig.

     

     

    Jimmy wasn’t allowed to defend himself in person and could only write a letter detailing his side of the event.

     

     

    Along with Jimmy’s denial of the charges there was also a letter from craig where he said that Jimmy had neither kicked or stamped on him but that he had “held Quinn by the leg to prevent him getting the ball”.

     

     

    The panel on the MITB’s advice that his report still stood then overwhelmingly decided to suspend Jimmy for a month.

     

     

    The club in their wisdom and the player had made enquiries on the evening of the game and based on what they found backed Jimmy in his appeal against the suspension and the player asked to be allowed to produce evidence on his behalf.

     

     

    The appeal was dismissed and the matter was over as far as the authorities were concerned.

     

     

    Celtic and Jimmy were not finished and sued one of the papers over a report they had published. It stated that “a more brutal or uncalled for action, we are glad to say, has not been seen on a football field for many a day”. Another writer for the same paper wrote” craig was savagely kicked in the face by Quinn”.

     

     

    We produced a list of witnesses including craig who told the sheriff that as he fell below Jimmy one of his boots came down on his leg. The other boot was coming down when he grabbed hold of it. Jimmy tried tae free himself but never kicked him in the face or stamped on him.

     

     

    He also went on to say that 2 of the Celtic players had visited him in his home that night as they had heard reports that his leg had been broken, which they could now see was not true and that he had not been hurt in the slightest.

     

     

    Later on that night Wullie Maley visited him and asked him to sign a letter that he had not in fact been kicked by Jimmy (this was the letter that was produced at the SFA hearing) and his mother witnessed his signature.

     

     

    The other witnesses included both linesmen, who incidentally were not employed by the SFA but the clubs themselves, the deid team captain and their right back and 3 Celtic players including alec benett who would go on to play for deidco.

     

     

    The MITB restated his finding and further corroborated the newspapers account of the kicking and stamping

     

     

    The courts amazingly found the statement slanderous and untrue and awarded Jimmy a shilling in damages but no expenses.

     

     

    The sheriff also stated that because they the reporters had been invited by the provision of free seats their criticism was privileged, the opposite was the more likely on the principle that a man who of has paid for his dinner is more free to criticising the cooking than a guest.

     

     

    If you know your history right enough and it seems some at our club don’t as they still allow those who do us harm in print and on the air to eat, drink and watch the games for free.

     

     

    Although happy with the outcome both the club and Jimmy were of course not fully satisfied and resented that accusation that he had deliberately used his boot on a player.

     

     

    One pleasant outcome was that a public subscription was arranged and a gold watch was presented to Jimmy “in recognition of the bad treatment he had received”.

     

     

    Given that some of our support believe what they read or hear you get the feeling that if this happened today they might have believed he did do what he was accused of as “it must have happened it was in the papers”, probably take the watch aff him tae.

  21. Dallas Dallas where the heck is Dallas on

    Going back to the 2015 Scottish cup semi final and Craig Gordon’s snding off.

     

     

    I believe Craig was sent off for denying a goal scoring oppurtunity . I still believe this was the wrong decision as the Caley player, Marley Watkins had already shot at goal when Craig hit him late .

     

     

    If my understanding of the rules(possibly wrong understanding) , it was a penalty and Craig should have been booked as he was not denying a goal scoring oppurtunity plus the shot at goal was going wide also.

     

     

    Watkins should have been sent off in that game for persistent fouling and when he pushed Virgil in the coupon.

     

     

    The incident yesterday where Moult walked up , pushing Broonie to the deck , then Mikael made sure Moult would not be doing that again , he was right in Moult’s face.

     

     

    Motherwell management , players and fans feeling mightily aggreived will still fuel their one’s as bad as the other nonsense with us getting as much preferential treatment as the Ibrox mob.

  22. Hello again all you young rebels.

     

     

    All this penalty talk, well, see if anybody impedes me like that

     

    at our 5 a side match on our Celtic bbq day in the park i’m

     

    going down like a ton of bricks and see if i spill my Guinness

     

    i’ll expect the offending player to be banned sine die.

     

    So there.

     

    H.H Mick

  23. Was this the same Chris Sutton that was receiving due praise a couple of weeks ago when he stated “They won’t be playing Tina Turner on the coach home!”

  24. Big Georges Fan Club - Hail, Hail, Wee Oscar on

    JOBO BALDIE on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 2:00 PM

     

    Afternoon all.

     

     

     

    Thought I should get in before Wee BGFC does – if anyone knows of 2 spares for Wednesday night at Fir Park I’d be delighted to hear from you

     

     

    ———

     

     

    Ha :-)). Just saw this !! Wee BGFC says “Tell Jobo we’ve got ours, but will keep our eyes open for him.”

     

     

    If we hear of any spares – your name is on it !

     

     

    HH

     

    BGFC

  25. I’m amazed at how insecure most Tims are in their rigid but fragile belief system. I was under the impression it was all about faith and keeping it. Well for most of us. Personally I have no faith at all.

     

    Anyway we don’t care what the animals say. Right?

  26. Dallas 9.37pm

     

     

    Hope Dallas junior had a fabulous 18th birthday, I realise you were a bit worried due to previous 26th November games, I think I said on Friday they were all pre-Brendan :-)

  27. We won a trophy yesterday. The 4th in a row, unbeaten in Scotland for 65 games. Going to win 7 in a row this season. Strong chance of doing an unprecedented double treble, & extremely strong chance of getting into knock out stage of Europa Cup.

     

    The whole bloody day dominated by bickering over the penalty when we should be rejoicing

     

     

    In my opinion no team in the World has been robbed by controversial decisions as much as we have.

     

    We were awarded a penalty , so bloody what,

     

    We are where we are on merit, we have nothing to be ashamed of, We were leading & cruising before the penalty, this is a pile of crap we should move on & stop this annoying debate.

  28. THETIMREAPER on 27TH NOVEMBER 2017 9:17 PM

     

     

    ‘It’s clear Sutton holds a personal grudge against Craig Gordon. Possibly it dates back to him coming up for that corner when at Hearts.’

     

     

    ###

     

     

    A point I have made previously on here. I can understand why it would still rankle him.