The actions of the Sevco Requisitioners in undermining Newco Rangers made no sense. They invoked an almighty schism, one which will forevermore deny the emerging club from a potentially rich seam of support. An act of such potential vandalism would surely not be undertaken unless they had a plan to deliver the necessary votes?
Turns out they didn’t have a plan after all. Some Oldco Rangers fans put their money on the table but their face didn’t fit. As a consequence, another group of Oldco Rangers fans overtly and covertly campaigned against them, but refused to put cash on the table.
Say what you like about the Easdales, they paid their money fair and square (and any debts to society, for those who like to go digging in the past). The embryonic club will develop in their image, it will stand or fall on their judgement. After coughing up, they endured incredibly manipulative pressures. They don’t strike me as natural underdogs but on this occasion they were. They resisted and I’m pleased for them. If you want to buy a club, walk in the front door with your cash, don’t try to drive the price down by trashing the club and invoking an insurrection.
Paul Murray deserves a special mention in this whole process. When Charles Green was pulling a deal together to buy the liquidated assets of Rangers, Murray campaigned against him, and all others who were prepared to put money on the table. As a consequence, Green was up against it from day one.
Instead of addressing Rangers fans as the man who ensured football would continue at Ibrox, Charlie was painted as a pantomime villain. Without this act of vandalism, he would have been able to sell 30,000 season tickets at full price. He could also have chased everyone earning over £50k per annum off the premises, ensuring Newco launched profitably, with a strong fan base.
Today, Newco would have money in the bank and be laying the foundations necessary for top flight football. No ‘legend’ would have been able to hold them to ransom in return for £800k p.a. Instead, Green, with £5.5m and untold more from his consortium in the game, was put in a horrible situation. As a consequence, he overpromised and under-delivered.
Having done all this, Murray turned on the Easdales, still without the money to get the job done. It is utterly unfathomable.
Just a few posting days left to order your CQN Annual before Christmas, £5 from every sale goes to the Malawi appeal:
Sean Fallon: Celtic’s Iron Man:
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TinyTim
13:55 on 18 December, 2013
TT, agree with you about Derk. He talks a good game but tends to hide near defenders when he should be making space to take a pass and appears to be a bit of a “sick note” into the bargain. Not a good buy IMO.
Gerry
minx1888 praying for Wee Oscar.
Missed your post earlier,no problems,looking forward to it.
Charlotte published a copy of the 5-Way Agreement, so no doubt our board is fully aware of its contents. The fact that it is a 5-way, and not 4-way, should be enough for any sane person to conclude that thems are a new club. PL et al perhaps felt there was no need to push too hard on the matter. Don’t interfere whilst the rival is destroying itself.
The blatant rule bending and breaking by the SFA was probably not anticipated, and maybe caught PL on the hop.
If the board really does want to generate a new firm rivalry, with the attendant bigotry and bitterness, then they are showing a dangerous disconnection with the majority of the Celtic support. I accept that a non competitive league is not healthy, but neither is competition fuelled by corruption and hatred.
Delaney’s Dunky
Talkin’ aboot..
Tight’ners…
Ma Mammy, wiz French..
So..??
but..
When it came tae Cookin’
she ..
Turned intae a Glesca Keelie.
Mince and Totties.. Wiz… n… Still. IZ..
Kojo’s, Favourite Meal.
But, As Ah said.. Ma Mammie ,wuz a French lassie.. so..
She, added a wee Secret Ingredient .. tae Ma Mince..
The French, canny help daein things like that..
Whit wiz that Secret Ingredient, that Made Kojo.. Mad fur her Mince?
Why.. She added a Spoonful or two o’
BARR’S or wiz it Barrie’s??..
American Cream Soda.. tae Ma Mince.. during, the Cookin’ Process.
No tae mention.. the Usual.. Ingins and Oxo cube..
It gave The Mince that
Je ne sais Quoi.. Taste..if ye know whit Ah Mean?
Ye don’t?
Well.Ah kin vouchsafe ..that Her Mince and Tatties , wuz the Finest
Meal.that Aboady could Take..
How Ah wish She still wiz,, Aroon… Ah sure Miss Her.
Kojo
mickbhoy1888
15:12 on
18 December, 2013
++++++++++++++++++++++++
Did you go to the game on Saturday???
The conditions getting to and from were horrific. It was borderline whether I went but I did, ’cause I’m stupid basically.
That was the reason for empty seats on Saturday.
Celtic Charlie ready to run at Lingfield 14/1 if anyone fancy’s an each way punt.
LB
SFTB
What if Celtic FC see their only way out of Scottish football becoming a possibility is through an unholy alliance with Sevco?
“Most successful team in Scotland”
Have I missed their European Cup wins?
I’ve got O Levels and Highers, I don’t talk much about them since I got my Degree.
Boscobhoy
Aye, the other Dodgy Dave. Cheers
Hamiltontim is praying for Oscar @ 15:38
That would be a Faustian Pact extraordinaire …
Even the Hunnic Mephistopheles would not believe his luck were Celtic to promote such an outcome.
Maybe the controlling TV companies could see it that way, but (surely to goodness) not our beloved Board …
FF
HT
Nail on the head.
OF games are box office and big bucks for the TV co’s.
HH
Kojo
My wee mammy’s mince n totties is amazing. Her secret ingredient was a liberal dash of Worcester sauce in with the bisto, onion and carrots. Home made soup your spoon can stand up in :)
God rest your mother’s soul.
I got a Best Altar Boy prize once, and yet you won’t find me mentioning it on here.
mickbhoy
I think the Board would be unwise to co-opt all the various reasons for reduced attendance (Christmas shopping, bad weather, anger at the GB treatment, and anger at the Barca result) into the one bucket of “our fans want the huns back”. I do not think they are as stupid as that. It’s an easy thing to assess, however, but I am aware of no fan who has been surveyed by our custodians on whether they are more likely or less likely to attend if and when the huns return. I live in a democracy and would accept the settled view of my fellow fans but I won’t take your word as being representative of a silent majority, if you don’t mind.
TBB
“Celtic’s Peter Lawwell, along with a number of other SPL club leaders, was and remains a Director of the SPL, one of the parties to the 5 Way Agreement. The SPL could not have executed the 5 Way Agreement without board consent.”
I have always asserted the same. However, I am sure I heard at one of the Phil & 2 Paul’s roadshows that our Board were shocked at the outcome of the deliberations and of the evidence given by the SFA to the LNS enquiry. I was told that this reflected the forces we were up against and the powerlessness of Celtic in that situation.
But , let’s take your view and my view as given, that Celtic were consulted and in agreement with the 5 way agreement’s original terms i.e. Rangers remain in the SPL with unbroken history at the cost of a few stripped titles. In effect, we made a tawdry deal with proven liars and men we should not trust. As it turned out, they dumped the bits they did not like (stripped titles) but kept the bits that suited them (unbroken history within the senior football set up).
If that was what my club did, I would now accuse them of monumental naivety and not trust them to run a sweeties shop. We had caught them doing the worst thing a sporting opponent can do to you i.e. not playing by the rules and costing us a fortune by doing so. We gained nothing by our machinations in this agreement (their 4th tier placement was not at our Board’s behest and was against their views).
Why could we not simply have let them die and a new club be formed, even within the Scottish Premier Division, around which their fans could coalesce? Did we, for the good of Scottish football, let their history live so they would not walk away in large numbers? If we did, we made a poor bargain and got nothing in return and I’d be on the Sack the Board side.
Off oot now and will catch replies later.
HT
“What if Celtic FC see their only way out of Scottish football becoming a possibility is through an unholy alliance with Sevco?”
That was one of the scenarios I outlined and my reasons for not believing it were contained in brackets.
I might accept, it if it were true, as a price worth paying. But I think we were sold a pig in a poke or the Springfield Monorail, if we did. Did Charles Green dupe Peter Lawwell?
Off oot again
Jim McColl Clyde Blowers Billionaire.
He owns very few shares. He has stated that he cant get too involved because
of promises to his investors(32 apparrently) which is fair enough.
What I cant understand is that he is not going to invest but get other people to invest.
Who are these people that want to buy a piece of this sure thing when the salesman
with plenty of dosh doesnt want to invest ???
Delaney’s Dunky
Thanks fur the reverential gesture..
Say..Pal..
Awe this Speakin’ aboot Mince n Tatties.. Hiv goat Me Salivatin’…
Ah am away oot.. Fur Ma Breakfast…
It’s Noo.. Eight O’clock, here.. so Ah am Fair Ready..
Seeya,pal..
Nice Chattin’
N Hope yer Mammie, is Still Rattlin’ those Pots n Pans.. fur You,tae.
Kojo
Still, Laughin/
setting free the bears supports Res. 12 & Oscar Knox @14.09 hrs.
IMO you have covered just about all possible scenarios
Ref point 2) “We agreed to keep quiet as Sky has promised us a route to an English League but only if we go as a pair of clubs with our background rivalry. (Sky could not swing this last time they tried so why would we bet on this option now?)”
I think the introduction of BT sport will prove to be pivotal. Very soon Sky will have all its eggs in the one basket i.e. The EPL. It needs to stimulate interest. There is little doubt the product is a little stale and the presence of Celtic ( Probably with a form of the reincarnated club ) would boost interest, especially with overseas viewing figures.
This is not an impossible dream; Market Forces as in all football matters will eventually prevail.
If UEFA object I envisage another Bosman type court action.
Ref point 3) “We have very pessimistic readings from UEFA about our future status in Euro competition and have bet that, if Euro competition is not going to get us riches , we need to have a competitive Scottish League and believe only a strong Rangers can provide it. (would fan surveys not have suggested this was a bad commercial move?)”
There is little doubt that we will eventually get weaker as a big fish in a pond of minnows. We will not always punch above our weight in European completion ( As this season shows ) Attracting players of the correct calibre will become harder and we do not have the added attraction of the “Best derby in Football”. Fans are fickle, I fully expect a packed Parkhead if we meet them in the cup. ( At >£40.00 per ticket )
We are a much bigger club than Southampton or Norwich but as the late TB warned we could end up playing in a league with the status of the Irish league.( No disrespect intended ).
Tiny Tim @14.15 hrs.
I agree with your sentiment about those that advocate that we spend 3 to 4 million £’s on Ryan Gauld. Yes that is a lot of money for us to spend on potential, however that will not deter any EPL club.
Market Forces / Supply and Demand again will dictate.
I too would like a hint of clarification about the policy we intend to follow. Normally I support the board and PL, however the silence is deafening apart from the odd joke and this odious OB act has the potential to seriously divide our support from the leadership.
HH, Always in Celtic.
Does anyone know if the ASA decision is binding to the UK only? Someone joked earlier that if a German journalist investigated Secvo he would find out the obvious. Could the German journalist be taken to court and asked to change his words if he printed this?
Print the truth in Germany I should have added
Bom dia.
Canny understand all the fuss about them’s ASA verdict. After all the phrase in it’s entirety is that they are the “….most successful team in Scotland at Ibrox..” Canny argue wi that really.
Or maybe it’s a grammatical issue? A bit like the difference between:-
Helping my uncle Jack off a horse.
and
Helping my uncle, Jack off a horse.
Whatever, still no Celtic news here in Brasil.
However, the Fluminense/Portugesa relegation scandal has now gone for appeal (Dec 27th) with Portugesa claiming that the CBF had misinformed the suspension details of the player in question.
So IF that position is proven valid (and there are a lot of clubs affected by this “interpretation”) it will throw the whole league standings into question.
And youse thought the SFA were incompetent?
Kojo
Enjoy brekkie.
Aye, my freezer is full of her cooking. :)
Got an email from this chap @pmcn88 and he has provided a link for a fresh complaint to ASA if anyone is interested.
This is a fight we won’t back down on.
…………
Ref
A13-224406
1)Inaccuracies in the ASA ruling
2)failure to comply with CAP codes
3)failure of ASA to adhere to previous ASA rulings on liquidated companies
Please can you send me a link of who to complain to
””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””””
At bottom of this page is email enquiry:
http://www.asa.org.uk/Contact-us.aspx
Better to register that you are likely to complain than raise a full complaint at this stage.
The more people the better.
If they confirm we can make a complaint then we can prepare a full complaint later.
The General email at bottom of page is probably best & its quite straightforward http://t.co/WVt3hXv0dg
Right c’mon bhoys m girls we’re on here all say so no excuses get emailing.
expat_celt
15:59 on
18 December, 2013
ASA is UK only.
Rioskorrie
Benburb or St Ants may argue who is Ibrox’s most successful club. :)
Sftb
Re Celtic being shocked on LNS drop me an e mail.
“Impeach McCrummoch”.
Is there Celtic Supporter out there ,who could buy Dermot Desmonds shares. I feel we need someone closer to home, who can run our club, not like Dermot he is never there, and I feel that’s been a burden on celtic football club,is there a rich supporter out .
Hold…………….
HOLD!!………………….
One part of that ASA statement caught my eye.
The bit about the SPL looking at the matter: if that refers to LNS then as I recall he was not commissioned to say anything on that matter and what he did say was in the context of who carried the can oldco or newco.
Regardless LNS was misled by Rangers witholding evidence of original ebts that had it been presented would have required matters to be twisted to the point of saying crime is ok.
When LNS is discredited as it will be lots will fall.
Timbhoy2
How much would Dermot Desmond’s shares cost?
ger57 @ 15:28,
“Charlotte published a copy of the 5-Way Agreement, so no doubt our board is fully aware of its contents. The fact that it is a 5-way, and not 4-way, should be enough for any sane person to conclude that thems are a new club. PL et al perhaps felt there was no need to push too hard on the matter. Don’t interfere whilst the rival is destroying itself.
The main point of the five way agreement was to dress Sevco Scotland Ltd up as The Rangers Football Club Ltd.
Before this agreement at the beginning of August 2012 – Sevco Scotland had already played Brechin in the Ramsden’s Cup.
Sevco Scotland had Associate membership of the SFL and by default registered Membership of the SFA, now they played that game in late July as Rangers, but I don’t know what Rangers.
The Rangers Football Club Ltd, the one that was incorporated in 1899, was still a member of the SPL and a full member of the SFA.
Now a few days later on the implementation of the 5 way agreement the SFA agreed to a request to transfer the SFA membership of The Rangers Football Club Ltd to Sevco Scotland Ltd (IMO quite illegitimately using paragraph 14.1 of the articles of association – which is headed The Prohibition on The Transfer of Membership there was no grounds for the transfer and the SFA Board exceeded it’s powers in granting it).
The Rangers Football Limited (in administration) had their name changed to RFC 2012 Ltd.
Their Administrators D&P gave permission to Sevco Scotland Ltd to use the name – The Rangers Football Club Ltd, which they duly did.
So Newco go into the 5 way agreement as a Football Club called – Sevco Scotland Ltd, with a shiny new registered memebership in the SFA (the lowest level of membership).
And come out called The Rangers Football Club Ltd with it’s membership dating back to 1873….
Stinks on ice!
Hail Hail
The clumpany via twitter
Former Director of liquidated Rangers endorsing another former Director of liquidated Rangers! The stuff of shareholders’ dreams
Chairbhoy
16:20
The main point of the five way agreement was to dress Sevco Scotland Ltd up as The Rangers Football Club Ltd.
I think the five signatories wanted to have a Rangers of some description, but I would say the main point was to allow Sevco to kick a ball in anger 48 hours after the meeting. Without the agreement, they could not have done that. It was only later that Charles Green began to pretend that Sevco was Rangers.
Here’s a thing about the ASA decision. The Rangers Football Club could run an add that said “Come and see Scotland’s Most Successful Football Club Play at Ibrox” and we could complain and they would uphold the complaint.
The decisions can appear a bit random and are all about context, semantics and whether people are likely to be misled.
They could have even over-ruled the complaint stating that while the claim was factually inaccurate, people were unlikely to be misled as most were aware that they were a new club and the claim applied to the old club, who could be joined in spirit at the stadium. Or words to that effect.
Been trying to think who Denny Johnstone reminds me of?
Anyone old enough to remember St Pat’s Dumbarton pupil and European Cup Winner John “Solly” ‘O Hare ?
Denny looks as though he’s developing similar bulk and can head a ball just like John.
Very promising
“macanbheatha, ads are generated based on your previous browsing history. Hmmm.”
Now I know that isn’t true, if that were the case why aren’t I seeing adverts of naked Latino babes sipping fine Connemara single malts!
hen1rik: You said…
Former Director of liquidated Rangers endorsing another former Director of liquidated Rangers! The stuff of shareholders’ dreams.
Ah…but endorsing Director’s wishes will only be granted….if the other former Director retracts his statement of yesterday and issues grovelling apology to the present Directors…
and then they tell him NAW anyway….
And both endorsing Director and failed Director can then walk away with their heads held…
extemely low.