Trips to Inverness and Aberdeen offer the Celtic support travelling from the west of Scotland ample opportunity for the odd libation at early lunch stops along the way. As a result, recent seasons have seen enemies of our club set their recorders to capture every utterance from the famous Celtic away support, keen to grab an opportunity to expose and exploit anything which could possibility cause offence. These people are a bit like the National Viewers’ and Listeners Association, but with tattoos and a more libertarian take on profanity.
The ice cream and jelly show these guardians of public morals had to endure on Saturday would have caused ultimate distress. Ultimate, that was, until Sunday brought a new level of consciousness. And profanity.
It’s almost like everything is coming together for one side of the city while the other side is being Flushed Away. Like a horrible wee jobby.
Yesterday may have been the most enjoyable day I’ve had reading Celtic Quick News. As a result, I used the ‘share’ button at the bottom of each comment extensively. If you are on Facebook or Twitter you can use this button to post your own comment, in context, to your social media facilities.
You can also use it to share, or give prominence to, any comment you think important enough for a wider audience, or simply because it is too funny not to share. There is a lot of great material on here that deserves to be read as widely as possible.
By default, the share facility places the article title in the text box, which is not very helpful. So if you use it (which I hope you do after the trouble Andrew in Belfast went to installing it in the first place), it’s a good idea to copy some of the comment and past that into the dialogue box.
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Prestonpans
Great point and one that should be asked on the phone ins, FPLG is just not very good at management,it has very little to do with Whyte,you only have to look at what used to happen when the huns got into trouble in a game under Walters Myth when his prodigy was trackside,no surname would have to get out his seat n tell them all what to do.
I just read that Neil banned the players from talking to the lapdogs after Saturdays game,he was rightly unhappy about the lying headlines following his comments about the huns on Friday.Not before time.HH.
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo – I hear that in Assassins Creed 3 you have to fistfight Our Lady to reveal the third secret of Fatima.
To counter the multicultural bigots at Ubisoft, I’m working on my own line of pro-Catholic games, starting with:
The Lentinator (thumbsup)
Livibhoy-I wouldn’t be surprised if Whytemare docks the huns wages who got booked yesterday,£600 a yellow card.
The time was 6 months ago, a bit late now. Jelly & Ice cream anyone?
IT’S time for Rangers fans to play the numbers game … and they must look beyond the most obvious statistic they awoke to today: That two out of this season’s three domestic trophies are gone after their meek Scottish Cup capitulation at home to Dundee United.
Look beyond, too, the fact that they have won just one of seven cup ties this term when European action is considered; that they have blown a one-time 15-point lead in the SPL over Celtic, who must now be short odds to romp to a Treble.
Those are the numbers attached to the football fall-out. However, as the embattled manager, Ally McCoist, said before the United humbling which was, significantly, watched by fewer than 18,000 supporters: Does what’s happening on the pitch really matter any more?
Given the way just about every one of those in blue hid yesterday, it’s not inconceivable that is the feeling in the Rangers dressing room. This looked like a bunch of players who had seen one headline too many, and chucked it.
It also looked like a group who, if truth be told, are bereft of real quality as a result of asset-stripping without adequate replacements. And those who do have anything about them, have lost it. But, again, that’s not where the Rangers supporters should be training their sights.
It’s hard not to feel sympathy for a support who are in a fog of financial confusion, attempting to find some kind of clarity as to exactly how desperate and dangerous these times are for a club now into its 140th year of existence.
And, make no mistake, these are the most perilous times Rangers have ever had to face. But it is absolutely imperative that each and every one of them stops, digests what they are being told, and asks the burning questions of the man who purchased the club last May, Craig Whyte.
Let’s track it back to then, the time of the takeover. Whyte proclaimed that Rangers were ‘debt free’ when he finally sealed a deal to replace Sir David Murray as the majority shareholder.
But, inside nine months, if we are doing the sums based on what is being put out there by the owner and chairman, they are now a minimum of £42m in the red – £18m to his company, who apparently paid Lloyds for the bank debt, and £24m to Ticketus, after the income expected from 100,000 future season ticket sales was borrowed against.
And that is before the potential HMRC liability, which could be as high as £49m if they are found guilty of mis-using the Employment Benefit Trusts, with a tribunal set to announce its ruling on that lengthy investigation some time next month.
Whyte was asked yesterday if he feared a season ticket boycott, something which would, of course, put enormous strain on the Ticketus arrangement, as it is after all based on season ticket sales.
Well, yesterday his support voted with their feet. What happens if they decide en masse not to renew their season tickets? With the product Rangers have on the park right now, who would shell out up front to fund that?
This is a dangerous strategy being deployed by Whyte, and a warning came yesterday when the attendance flashed up – but it’s too late to back-track with Ticketus.
He talks of a £10m gap in funding. Was that not evident when due diligence was done? Would it not have been easier to sell Nikica Jelavic last August when more money was on the table than enter into this Ticketus arrangement, or work at getting that figure down over the year?
And exactly why is there a funding gap of that size. Rangers’ unaudited accounts to year-end June 30, 2011, showed £9m cash in the bank. Where is the Ticketus money? Are we to assume it will be in the audited accounts that must appear before March 31 in order for Rangers to be given a licence to play in Europe next season?
But, and this is based on Whyte’s figures, if £33m was set aside from his own wealth for this deal, as he claims, if the £24m from Ticketus went into Rangers’ bank, add in the £9m that was lying there from season ticket cash already banked, throw in Madjid Bougherra’s £1.8m and Charlie Adam’s sell-on clause of £900,000, then that’s over £68m in terms of incomings.
Even running at a loss of £800,000 a month, as he claims the figure is, just how can Rangers have no money and have to sell Jelavic on the cheap in what appears to be a bid to get cash in the door just to keep them going?
Whyte can, of course, clear all of this up. Produce accounts. Have an AGM. Explain why the Ticketus deal was not in the shareholders’ circular sent out detailing the financial detail of what his takeover entailed.
Rangers fans must do the sums … they must demand answers.
A pensive Craig Whyte with director of football Gordon Smith during Rangers’ Scottish Cup defeat by Dundee United
By DARRELL KING
Share
6 Feb 2012
IT’S time for Rangers fans to play the numbers game … and they must look beyond the most obvious statistic they awoke to today: That two out of this season’s three domestic trophies are gone after their meek Scottish Cup capitulation at home to Dundee United.
Look beyond, too, the fact that they have won just one of seven cup ties this term when European action is considered; that they have blown a one-time 15-point lead in the SPL over Celtic, who must now be short odds to romp to a Treble.
Those are the numbers attached to the football fall-out. However, as the embattled manager, Ally McCoist, said before the United humbling which was, significantly, watched by fewer than 18,000 supporters: Does what’s happening on the pitch really matter any more?
Given the way just about every one of those in blue hid yesterday, it’s not inconceivable that is the feeling in the Rangers dressing room. This looked like a bunch of players who had seen one headline too many, and chucked it.
It also looked like a group who, if truth be told, are bereft of any quality as a result of asset-stripping without adequate replacements. And those who do have anything about them, have lost it or have not even been paid for yet. But, again, that’s not where the Rangers supporters should be training their sights.
It’s hard not to feel sympathy for a support who have been in a fog of financial confusion for 10 years, attempting to find some kind of clarity as to exactly how desperate and dangerous these times are for a club now into its 140th year of existence. With shabby journalists unable to perform satisfactorily and refusing to ask the pertinent questions, it is nothing short of a scandal. Don´t ask me how it came to this ?
And, make no mistake, these are the most perilous times Rangers have ever had to face. But it is absolutely imperative that each and every one of them stops, digests what they are being told, and asks the burning questions of the man who purchased the club last May, Craig Whyte if they do not understand the answers. Tom English has offered to translate and help any Rangers fans who do not understand Craig Whyte
Let’s track it back to then, the time of the takeover. Whyte proclaimed that Rangers were ‘debt free’ when he finally sealed a deal to replace Sir David Murray as the majority shareholder.
But, inside nine months, if we are doing the sums based on what is being put out there by the owner and chairman, they are now a minimum of £42m in the red – £18m to his company, who apparently paid Lloyds for the bank debt, and £24m to Ticketus, after the income expected from 100,000 future season ticket sales was borrowed against.
And that is before the potential HMRC liability, which could be as high as £49m if they are found guilty of mis-using the Employment Benefit Trusts, with a tribunal set to announce its ruling on that lengthy investigation some time next month.
Whyte was asked yesterday if he feared a season ticket boycott, something which would, of course, put enormous strain on the Ticketus arrangement, as it is after all based on season ticket sales.
Well, yesterday his support voted with their feet. What happens if they decide en masse not to renew their season tickets? With the product Rangers have on the park right now, who would shell out up front to fund that? HMRC ? Hearts ? No Of course not it is time the SFA with UEFA backing stopped this nonsense it has went on far enough and for far too long. It has to be said Rangers looked poor yesterday
This is a dangerous strategy being deployed by Whyte, and a warning came yesterday when the attendance flashed up – but it’s too late to back-track with Ticketus.
He talks of a £10m gap in funding. Was that not evident when due diligence was done? Would it not have been easier to sell Nikica Jelavic last August when more money was on the table than enter into this Ticketus arrangement, or work at getting that figure down over the year?
And exactly why is there a funding gap of that size. Rangers’ unaudited accounts to year-end June 30, 2011, showed £9m cash in the bank. Where is the Ticketus money? Are we to assume it will be in the audited accounts that must appear before March 31 in order for Rangers to be given a licence to play in Europe next season?
But, and this is based on Whyte’s figures, if £33m was set aside from his own wealth for this deal, as he claims, if the £24m from Ticketus went into Rangers’ bank, add in the £9m that was lying there from season ticket cash already banked, throw in Madjid Bougherra’s £1.8m and Charlie Adam’s sell-on clause of £900,000, then that’s over £68m in terms of incomings.
Even running at a loss of £800,000 a month, as he claims the figure is, just how can Rangers have no money and have to sell Jelavic on the cheap in what appears to be a bid to get cash in the door just to keep them going?
Whyte can, of course, clear all of this up. Produce accounts. Have an AGM. Explain why the Ticketus deal was not in the shareholders’ circular sent out detailing the financial detail of what his takeover entailed.
Rangers fans must do the sums … they must demand answers and if they are unable too they should ask a young Catholic kid on the way to school for help. That will involve getting up early in the morning. The alternative hanging outside the chapel on a Sunday is too frightening to contemplate. We deserve better
Is Gordon Smith still at Ibrox? He usually has plenty to say about damned near anything. Very quiet these days though.
LuxCelt says:
6 February, 2012 at 12:53
Fantastic viewing. In Gonzo lives a free spirit that is Celtic.
Thanks for posting, recommended viewing.
HH
Re Scottish Cup draw:
I reckon it will provide the opportunity of a trip to Aberdeen in order to continue our 2012 tour of Scandinavia.
Can’t we go back to talking about jelly and ice-cream. I liked it better when we were talking about jelly and ice cream.
pogmathonyahun – Not a problem my friend.
I was shocked too, couldn’t believe hundreds of people in a major game studio in the 21st century would make a high-profile game demonising one religion and inciting you to murder its spiritual leader.
And apparently not one of them thought “hey, maybe we should tone down the Pope-killing and other anti-Catholic stuff?”. They wouldn’t have dared to make a similar game treating any other major religion in the same way, lest they got a visit from either the police or real assassins.
It’s totally unnecessary to the game mechanic as well, they could easily have cast someone other than the Pope as the chief Bad Guy. It’s not as if the only way they could credibly set an assassination game in Renaissance Italy is by making you kill the Pope in the middle of Mass.
I hope Ubisoft go the way of other jobbies. (thumbsup)
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:31
LMFAO :-)))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Hail Hail
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:39
To be fair. It’s just building on all the Da Vinci Code stuff and it’s only a game. If you stopped all the games that were anti-something or distasteful all you would have left is Lego Batman.
From this morning’s DR
“Davis is not a rent-a-quote. He’s not that kind of man but he speaks honestly enough and was thinking about an answer to this question: “Do you think the board has backed the manager?” when a tap on his shoulder told him the interview was over.
It seems some folk at Ibrox think a grown man, who is deemed responsible enough to wear the armband, is incapable of thinking for himself, although later it was explained that he would have fully answered the question but he had to go for a wee jobby” por cierto.
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:39
Kill Blatter on XBOX and PS3
there you are when your a billionaire … remember who sent you on your way !!
Silver City
I´m a milk lemonade chocolate man myself
Hail Hail
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:16
Top drawer…
The Moon Bhoys says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:21
Your dead wrong. There’s a jillion Stronzos out there.
South Of Tunis says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:17
Yep beautiful language, I share good times with the Sicilian Bhoys who have become big Celtic supporters over the years..I wore them down!!!
AWE NAW ———–
“shabby journalists ” ?
Reminds me of somebody’s joke ————-[ maybe Arnold Brown ]
” Why does Scottish based journalism have such a bad reputation ?
–” it has such a bad press “
Recognise Gonzo from the Madrid CSC bar before the EL game this season…
There was a bunch of young bhoys from all corners of Espana there to see the bhoys…
All spanish and celtic-daft…
Starry “Squalo” Plough
No sucking in !!! ;-)
Hail Hail
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:17
Philvis I love the Assassins creed games, The Pope you mention happens to be a Borgia ,so possibly someone a with a wee crib
against him.
EzioAuditoreDeFirenzeC.S.C
Celtic-daft, even.
ShamedCSC
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:39
pogmathonyahun
Bhoys not quite sure about the game but if set in the Renaissance there were pleanty of Popes who did their own fair share of assasinations The Borgias for instance. I don’t think the game sets out to undermine the Catholic faith just a particullly dark period in it’s history.
Jist In fae the jiggin’
Frum the Desk o’ the Turtledove.
If Neil Lennon, continues to smack Lady Logic in the Eye..
by.. Not Starting the Yooful Jamesy..in a more constent fashion..
Preferring,instead,to give the Starting role of Dashing Right Winger.. to
his Dubiously chosen, Favourite..
Then..
I aver, that..
Lenny,shall Stifle,the still aborning..Promising Career of
Young Jamesy!
Yes, Virginia..
Jamesy, is our best Entry in “Who will be the Next World Class
Wingman”, Interational Stakes.
Howevahhh…
Lenny, if he does not come to his Senses,and Allow Jamesy to Progress
in his rise to the Top..without such ill advised INTERRUPTIONS, which Lenny, whether he realizes it not..is Doing..and with Great SUCCESS,may I remark.
Then..
Jamesy’s improvement,at such a critical time in the Young Celt’s career,shall be stunted..and may go into.. Reverse Mode.
It can happen.
Lenny, take care.
Remember, Angels, demur.. where Fools wid up the Ante!
Kojo.
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:49
Whit I’m still aff the Christmas card list!!
SchreklicheCSC
Kojo
Wheesht !
weeminger – To be fair. It’s just building on all the Da Vinci Code stuff and it’s only a game. If you stopped all the games that were anti-something or distasteful all you would have left is Lego Batman.
I’m not a thin-skinned person, weeminger.
People have a right to criticise my religion of they want to, and I have a right to criticise them back.
I do expect entertainment media to adhere to a duty of responsibility not to unfairly single out religious groups for vitriol and hate. After all, that’s the basic politeness that you expect from people who proclaim their multiculturalism.
Also, consumer expectations come into play. If I had bought a DVD called “Ian Paisley Does Drumcree” or “Donald Findlay’s Greatest Sash-Ups” I would have been expecting some anti-Catholic invective.
I wasn’t expecting it in a game about an assassin in renaissance Italy.
I can’t think of any big budget other games that are anti-Judaism, anti-Islam, anti-Hindu, anti-Buddhist, or anti-whatever so I don’t see why I should put up with Ubisoft’s Pope-murdering simulator without complaint. (thumbsup)
Afternoon, catching up on the blog over lunch, saw James F comment on what if they don’t loose the tax case and are left with the MBB in charge.
I was talking to a mate about this scenario over the weekend, how would Murray be feeling if after selling his shares for a £1 , presumably with the belief that the tax case would be lost and he wanted out , they win the tax case, not happy I presume. He thinks he has stitched the MBB up and it turns out he should have held on to his shares.
As for the MBB he has bought them thinking he will loose the tax case ,to allow him to cash in his preferred creditor status, presumably after loading on fees and costs to the £18m bank debt , the ticketus deal etc, and he is expecting a tidy profit and lo and behold they win the tax case and he is left with a club with a £10mil trading hole, a rookie manager and a poor team and a large portion of the next 3 seasons revenue sold to ticketus. He has also to convert his £18m loan to equity if there is no insolvency event after tax case result.
So felly Tims even if they win the tax case , think of SDM and the MBB greeting into their jelly and ice cream as they take the call from their lawyer what do you mean we won the tax case !!!!
I think they call this a win win situation
Particularly Dooh
pedrocaravanachio67 says:
6 February, 2012 at 12:44
What else could top that off?
Can i have hundreds and thousands on mine please.
PC67
———————–
these are now called “craig whyte sprinkles”
Montreal_bhoy: cheers – are you canadian or just living there? I lived in Montreal for half a year – was playing rugby for Westmount RFC for a season. fantastic city.
Starry
just seen the pics of your partner on facebook .. your back on the list !!! ;-)
Hail Hail
I’m confusing my Gonzos with my Stronzos now. Nearly wiped the wrong orifice with the wrong type of paper.
Paul67
Are you allowed to post the word “jobby” on CQN?
Here is another post you may wish to share! ;-)
Celtic – Rangers finances compared
By
Paul67
on October 3, 2008 10:18 AM | Permalink | Comments (402)
While income and expenditure both turned slightly against Celtic last season, it was bonanza time at Ibrox where Rangers published record turnover as a result of the double bounty; Champions League group stage income followed by a run to the Uefa Cup final in Manchester.
Celtic turnover (t/o) was £75.237m compared to Rangers £64.452m, but Rangers outsource their merchandising operation, including only a licence payment from JJB Sports in the figures, whereas the Celtic figure includes total income from merchandising sales.
Celtic earned £16.092m from merchandising sales, contributing a margin of £4.8m in a financial year without the release of a new home shirt. When Rangers signed the JJB deal in 2006 they revealed they would earn £3m each year, plus £1.45m amortised in the Profit and Loss account (P&L) but paid at the start of the contract in 2006, criteria was in place to provide for bonus payments should unspecified targets be achieved.
It was, therefore, with some astonishment that no bonus payments were earned, despite the unprecedented proliferation of Rangers merchandise walking the streets ahead of the Manchester riot.
I understand that the bonus is dependent on progress to the latter stages of the Champions League, which ironically would have sold a lot less kit for JJB; it appears Rangers had overlooked a clause for Uefa Cup progress.
The big area of interest from a financial statement is the indication of where a company is heading next. Celtic will earn at least £70m this season but if they finish higher than bottom place in the Champions League group stage they should reach £75m.
By contrast, Rangers are looking at financial Armageddon. In 2004-05 they earned £34.48m (from continuing operations), a whopping £30m less than last season, but 2004-05 included four home European games, each with TV rights, compared to only one this season.
£34m will be the upper limit of their income potential this season; it will be less still, unless a good run in the domestic cups includes high-earning home games, a whole £40m less than what I expect from Celtic and still £28m less than the Celtic figure adjusted for comparable merchandise income.
Celtic salary costs were £38.981m, a £2.5m increase on the previous season, compared to £34.339m at Rangers, up a massive £10.1m on 2007. The latter figure will in part reflect incentive payments for European progress, although the clutch of new signings who arrived at the club in 2007 will make up the bulk of the increase.
In a masterstroke of business acumen, Rangers chief executive, Martin Bain, appears to have included the Uefa Cup in bonuses to be paid, but not on bonuses earned.
I was delighted to learn that Rangers pay more for the remarkably unpopular Bain (£668k) than Celtic pay for ‘Self Appointed Football-Integrity Judge and Jury’ (W.Smith), Peter Lawwell (£514k). Although perhaps Bain’s remuneration also reflected Uefa Cup progress. You would think that with such big numbers flowing into his own bank account the whole ‘What will be get if we do well in the Uefa Cup?’ question would be at the front of his mind when he negotiated with JJB.
Football club’s P&L income figures do not include player sales, with are recorded on the balance sheet, so Rangers sale of Cuellar will bring in £7.8m more than the income figure, which itself will be offset in cash terms by the £1.45m banked back in 2006 from JJB.
Before they start to spend on extravagances like footballers, clubs have considerable costs to pay. Rates, electricity, property maintenance, policing, to name only a few, cost Celtic £15.395m. Rangers figure was higher than this, perhaps as a result of exceptional items resulting from the run to the Uefa Cup final, so the previous year’s cost of £16.262m will be a better indicator of costs this year, which is just £18m less than their anticipated income available for football and other operations.
By comparison, Celtic will have in the region of £45m available for football and other operations when adjusted for the merchandise sales difference.
Net bank debt at Celtic was £3.52m compared to Rangers’ £21.559m but while Celtic are set to come out of debt in May (barring an exceptional expense in January), Rangers net year-end debt is likely to rise beyond £30m unless significant steps are taken to sell players in January.
Celtic are in an exceptionally strong financial position. They can survive the vagaries of football fortune, or economic downturn, without the threat of cutback should income dip.
Conversely, Rangers are in dire trouble. This year will not be financially the worst Sir David Murray has bestowed on his club, but it will make for horrendous reading to any prospective buyer of the club and provide further evidence that they are hopelessly adrift of financial security.
Winning the league this season and qualifying for next season’s Champions League will not provide succour from their structural problems, it would only result in a temporary slowdown in decline.
Rangers debt has risen inextricably, and is set to continue to rise, at a time when bank facilities have become more difficult and expensive to acquire.
Should new HBOS owners, Lloyds TBS, take fright at the property-to-football conglomerate, Murray International Holdings, which includes Rangers, frankly, the consequences are so dramatic, I don’t think we should discuss them, as I have trouble sleeping when I get too excited.
We live in a time when things which simply cannot happen, happen. When some of last year’s most credit-worthy companies in the world have gone into receivership; when one of the centuries-old pillars of the Scottish business community crumbled in days.
No company dependent on a significant increase in its debt is safe.
Rangers Football Club, 1873 – 20??
philvisreturns_2: 6 February, 2012 at 13:54
Are people accusing you of being a troublesome number two?
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo says:
Well, if I can’t raise the level of the conversation, here is United FC’s version of the song.
United FC
philvisreturns_2 says:
6 February, 2012 at 13:54
Always admired your defence of the church on these pages!!
Your politics still suck mind you :-)