I’m told by a broadcast journalist friend that Jim Traynor, of PR company Level5, started Newco Rangers broadcast media conference yesterday with a warning to journalists that discussion about title stripping was off limits.
The law was that if manager Mark Warburton was asked about the proposed sanction for Oldco Rangers financial doping the conference would be stopped.
Say what you like about journalists, but they regard being told what to ask, or not to ask, as a line in the sand issue. Traynor, a journalist for decades, should have known better than to make such a rookie mistake.
He was told that attempts to subvert discussion about Oldco being stripped of titles is not something that would be accommodated. By the broadcast media, anyway.
Warburton was subsequently asked about title stripping and although he was happy to answer, I’m told, this angered the would-be news-denier, whereupon he “lost his temper”.
Post-conference there was a bit of chat about how they would be able to appropriately report on less-partisan issues, like the Level5 PR-controlled Ladbrokes SPFL, although there was a consensus that “He’ll fall out with everyone soon enough. He always does”.
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CultsBhoy
How many seats will be filled after Christmas?
Not yours anyway
Sorry, one new club in Glasgow is enough. In fact one too many.
French Football and Marseille
In 1993 It was found that Bernard Tapie bribed Valenciennes to lose so that Marseille would win the French League earlier, giving them more time to prepare for the Champions League Final. Valenciennes players Christophe Robert, Jorge Burruchaga and Jacques Glassmann claimed that the Marseille midfielder Jean-Jacques Eydelie offered them ₣250,000 to “take the foot off of the gas” in a May 20 match.
Marseille were stripped of their league title and relegated to Division 2 by the French Football Federation, whilst Tapie was forced to step down as its President. No winner was declared for the 1992–1993 season. The LFP allotted the title to Paris Saint-Germain but owners Canal + refused it. The TV chain feared the reactions of their subscribers in Provence and threatened to withdraw football completely if the title was allotted to PSG. Ultimately the LFP decided that the 1993 title would have no winners.
@CU
AULDHEID on 6TH NOVEMBER 2015 3:52 PM
The article was from E Tims Online Fanzine, it was called.
Thoughts………from a taxpayers Sofa
During the 5 or so years prior to the ebts how did ranglers find the money to pay the top internationals that they signed.
These players would only have gone there for really big money.
Where did that money come from and were all these players contracts-payments above board?
CultsBhoy
From somebody who lives in Mnchester
If you care about the club ethos so much, you should be going to see FC United. Not Salford City.
The Class of 92 are trying to take a community club and turn it into a Football League PLC just like every other. Salford City’s fans already feel the bond between them and the club is different.
Peter Lim owns 50%!
While Salford was a city way before Manchester (and Old Trafford is nearer Salford than Manchester) I think anybody wanting to start a new team-not something I agree with- would be better off starting in the likes of Coatbrig.
If we are going to start a new team, it should be somewhere like Salford and try and get up the English leagues. Once in the promised land of milk and money we can transfer the assets to Celtic and play from Celtic Park. Isn’t that how it works. We could keep our history legitimately too………………………Hmmmmmmmmmmm.
RWE 3.48
The charges were registration ones and if you read the blog I linked to earlier you will see what LNS said about what rules would have been broken were ebts illegal.
“Whilst it is unclear which SPL/SFA rules would have been breached by making irregular payments, it was not the rules the Commission was directed to examine as, according to the Lord Nimmo Smith Decision para 88 “ There may be extreme cases in which there is such a fundamental defect that the registration of a player must be treated as having been invalid from the outset “
This is why the matter of that blog is so important. There was a fundamental defect in the registration so the registration MUST be treated as invalid from the outset.
That was true of the then DOS ebts he was kept in the dark about and is now true of all ebts.
This is a crucial point that is being overlooked.
What should be done now is there in LNS words.
Don’t let anyone deflect from it.
The Commission was a sham but because it got screwed (by Campbell Ogilvie as is being pointed out by John James and who I identified did not correct LNS in his testimony ) those doing the stewing have screwed themselves.
Karma eh?
Does anyone remember the wee guy who throughout the early 1990s used to phone up the daily record hotline every day and praise the old board to the high heavens even when we were out of all competitions by the end of January and planning to build a pig in a poke at Cambuslang?
Gerry McSherry from cathkin, that was the bloke if I remember rightly.
Don’t know if he is still alive but if so I bet he posts on this site in praise of “big Peter” and co come what may.
Sometimes the more things change the more they stay the same.
an arranged Marraige between Cheats and the SFA.from football is fixed
http://footballisfixed.blogspot.co.uk/2015/11/an-arranged-marriage-between-rangers.html
TIMALOY29 on 6TH NOVEMBER 2015 11:47 AM
quonno
alleged alleged alleged
To nip this in the bud, Lawell’s son works at another club. Not Celtic.
Park has been ultimately responsible for scouting of all signings since arrival.
From earlier.
Having previously been accused of lying on here, I was extremely careful to use the words allegedly and facetiously.
At the end of the day, approval of signings ultimately comes down to the controller of the purse strings.
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/celtic-v-molde-live-updates/comment-page-30/#comments
GBS Gerry Mc Sherry maybe :-)
Talk about fiddling while Rome burns,our management and team are a shambles,comprehensively pumped home and away by a 6th place Norwegian team.Let’s sort our own mess out first.
BSR nice one jeez he’s a moaning git. Cults do you hate all heated driveways or just one in particular? Let’s have your idea/ideas for the way forward, you never know you might be onto something. H H Hebcelt
For once in our lives we have control of our destiny
Something we’ve needed so long
For once, unafraid, We can scream like a banshee
And somehow we have got to be strong
For once we can touch what out hearts used to dream of
As we always knew
A level playing field
Would make our dreams come true
For once in our lives we will be at the front of the bus
Not like it’s hurt me before
For once, We have something please don’t desert us
Be warned I’m not alone any more
For once, I can say, this is ours, we gotta take it
As long as I know I have you bhoys, I can make it
For once in our lives, we have control of our destiny
the glorious balance sheet on 6th November 2015 4:27 pm –
Yep. That would be he of ‘The Risible Rebels Fame’.
At the time some thought that he might have been a vague relative of the Kelly family.
See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/ladbrokes-spfl-pr-warning-media-to-stop-title-stripping-talk/comment-page-3/#comment-2713090
I am happy that Peter Lawwell will not panic and will give Ronny time to get his teams European form sorted out.Those who are calling for the managers head have short memories we are top of the SPL we are in the League cup semi-final and we are still in the Scottish cup and wither you believe it or not we can still qualify from our Europa group.We need to get behind the manager and the team and be faithful through and through I like many on CQN want to see Glasgow Rangers stripped of trophies and titles for there cheating but as a Celtic supporter I dont want to spend all day talking about the cheating huns my team is Celtic. H.H.
They’re going to get away with it are’nt they?
For all you ghuys not reading Johnjames blog I urge you to have a look if true on a par with Phil’s H H Hebcelt
I don’t like to see anyone lose their job but RD has to go. Where is the improvement? Where is the plan and defensive organisation? We can beat most SPL dross but any level of organisation seems too much for us.
RD asked to be judged on Europe. He isn’t the new Klopp, he’s a decent man given a Job on the cheap way too soon in his career.
Bournesouprecipe
I’m ahead of the game.. :-)
From the esteemed David Low on twitter
EBTs and the former club
via Julyon Maugham
https://t.co/duKMCrfIUA
Hebcelt
post the link
HH
Disappointing result last night, but if you have supported Celtic for nearly 60 years you get used to it, even when Celtic were at a higher level in Europe.
Awenaw not technically gifted just google johnjames H H Hebcelt
The Clumpany…
If you’re lurking, johnjames has used a draught of your letter to the board in his latest blog.
I’ll not link it as someone might take offence. HH
Parkheadcumsalford
Isn’t that exactly what Celtic Nation was?
BURGAS HOOPS. I think you are very likely to be correct. H.H.
Quonno
He must’ve been related in some way to the Kelly family, so strident was he in defence of them. I remember him being on that Sport in Question programme not long before the rebels took over still giving it the Chemical Ali party line and making a right idiot of himself in the process.
google canny find it.
C´Mon bhoys
Awe naw, johnjames latest, think it will be the one hebcelt means…
“Dear Mr Lawwell.
I wanted to express my grave concern about the outcome and implications of the so-called ‘Rangers Big Tax Case’.
Assuming that the judgement in favour of HMRC is not appealed and overturned by the UK Supreme Court, then the implication is that Celtic and the rest of Scottish Football were playing in a rigged game for the best part of a decade. One of the competitors had a colossal unfair advantage by being able to employ players on the back of not paying the tax due on their wages.
This meant that myself and thousands of others were unwittingly paying millions of pounds into a grotesque parody of sport. It meant we were most likely deprived of more happy memories and wonderful trophy-winning days. It also meant that the strategy and investment of Celtic’s Board on behalf of its shareholders was being systematically undermined by ‘questionable’ methods.
I don’t doubt that the outcome of the previous Lord Nimmo-Smith Commission into side-letters will muddy the waters in some way (and may be used by some in a spurious ‘double-jeopardy’-based argument for taking no action). However, let us be clear: confirmation of players being employed without paying due tax is something new. And something that needs to be considered by proper inquiry and disciplinary processes.
Should the SFA and SPFL fail to take action it will be a shameful admission that the concept of sport counts for very little in Scottish football. There will be no moral hazard and no justice for all of us who love the game and who were misled for the best part of a decade.
As the Chief Executive of Celtic, I hope you are making the strongest possible representations to the SFA and SPFL (and if necessary UEFA) over the issue of Rangers’ apparently stolen titles and trophies. I also hope that you are speaking to other clubs to build a groundswell of support in favour of disciplinary action being taken.
As members of the SFA and SPFL Boards, I hope that you and Eric Riley will vote in favour of the instigation of disciplinary proceedings against Rangers. I note that the current incarnation of the Ibrox club maintains that the Big Tax Case outcome has nothing to do with them, while still proclaiming that they are the proud owners of 54 titles and numerous other trophies. This obfuscation cannot be allowed to stand in the way of justice being done, and being seen to be done.
I have no doubt that many fans of all clubs will vote with their feet and wallets if Rangers (IL)’s apparent systematic cheating is not addressed ‘without fear or favour’.
I know I will. Because it would mean that the game is utterly worthless.
Thank you for your time.”
The open letter to Peter Lawwell was written by CFC blogger The Clumpany. He is one of the more informed and intelligent individuals on the other side of the divide. As you would expect from me, something rarely allowed me by my detractors, I will play the message, and not the man.
Other clubs, notably Arsenal, deployed EBT. Ray Parlour paid only 22% tax on a salary of £1.5m. Thierry Henry, Patrick Vieira, and Dennis Bergkamp are also alleged to have benefited from a significant part of their salaries paid as a loan. Prior to settlement in 2005, Arsenal won:
2 League Championships (2002, 2004)
3 FA Cups (2002, 2003, 2005)
There was no clamour from other English clubs for Arsenal to be stripped of these five major titles. I accept that Arsenal were quick to offer settlement when the details of Mr Parlour’s preferential tax arrangement were made public during his acrimonious divorce proceedings in 2004.
Is it a more heinous offence to continue to deploy and conceal payments for a longer period than Arsenal did? I can see the merits in this argument, but what would be the benefit of clubs today if retrospective stripping of titles was effected? I don’t see any causal link to yet another calamitous season in UEFA competition. Could anyone possibly posit a case for the extra revenue that was denied CFC being sufficient to arrest the sales of Hooper, Wanyama, Forster and Van Dijk? CFC have become a selling club and this was brought into sharp focus last night. Would CFC have managed to retain the services of these players if they had been paid £2.5m off the books, as was the case with Barry Ferguson?
I am more persuaded by the point in regard to the investment required by CFC’s board, than to the lost enjoyment of the fans. There is a reasonable doubt that Rangers could have won these titles without the aid of EBT. David Murray borrowed £10 for every £5 spent by CFC, but I do not envisage Peter Lawwell pursuing the former executives of the Bank of Scotland. Mr Murray’s access to soft credit underpinned much of our success. As Hugh Adam aptly put it, he was a super salesman. He was more adept at raising money than the board of CFC during this time.
Would you not agree that this factor, more than EBT, skewed the balance in favour of Rangers?
Would you not agree that the development of the best sports facilities in Scotland, with a £650,000 grant from Sports Scotland, several million from the lottery commission and the balance from Bank of Scotland, led to Rangers’ players being better prepared than those of CFC, and this advantage could have contributed to their success?
There are a myriad of factors that led to our success during that period. Reducing the argument to just one factor does not serve your case well.
What would best suit Scottish Football as a whole would be a more balanced approach from a new commission. Title stripping won’t make CFC a better team and it won’t lessen the bad taste in your mouth from reverses during this period.
https://johnjamessite.wordpress.com/
SIPSINI on 6TH NOVEMBER 2015 4:49 PM
cheers my mhan
HH
Awe_Naw that’s the one
JFH-A few years ago the head in the sand attitude,had us marching to the front door of CP.We are not progressing as a team,yet Lawwell laughably trots out the ‘one of the biggest club’s in the world’bollox.We have a manager who was to be a No 2,who was thrown together with his No2,who he hadn’t even met.Lawwell is an accountant,and has no football qualifications,yet he appoints our managers? We are being pumped by teams,who have a fraction of our budget,the same mistakes,game after game,it has to stop.PL will want to put ST’s up at least £50 next year,if Sevco are promoted,is Ronny Deila going to make that fly?,no IMO.John Park should be bagged also.As i posted earlier,we are not even a Europa League side.HH
What exactly is Peter Lawwell guilty of?
Is it keeping Celtic mostly profitable, strong and solvent, enabling the management team to have a much bigger budget than almost all the clubs we have played in the recent past?
Is it selling players at a profit? These types of players can only be persuaded to come to Scotland because we have a track record of developing talent and do not stand in their way when the call comes from the EPL.
Is it that he gets paid a salary commensurate with his postion and company turnover; a salary thst most probably would need to be increased to attract someone on equal ability.
Or is it because those who constantly gripe about the board have neither a clue about business and/or football?
We are ensconsed in a football backwater, with a inexperienced management team and a manager who has been found out – any current manager in the Scottish top league would win the title, if manager of Celtic – any one!!!!
Very poor last night. As has been said many times we don’t seem to have a plan B.in these situations. We need a steady back four for a prolonged period to help steady the ship. Disappointed that a man like Collins who has played at the highest level does not have more input on a tactical level.or maybe he’s not quite as clued as he would have many of believe. Unfortunately this give the media a large stick to hit us with which they will do with gay abandon. It takes the spotlight off of the dignified ones. A lot of football to be played still season but for me there needs to be a big improvement and a clearing out of those not up to the task.
Apart from The old club Rangers, has any manager been sacked when top of the league.? We are also still in three cup competitions.
How long would we then give the next managerial team ?. A contract stating that you have a job until the loudest fans demand more.
Yes I know that ultimately the manager is responsible, but once the players cross the line then they must take responsibility for their inept performance. Once more, imo players must be shown the door before we consider management changes.
A well respected poster on here ( apart from a short flonce ) stated that all was not well off the park but due to confidences he could not go into detail.
I have no reason to doubt him and subsequently, yes heads must roll, but not RD’s at this stage.
HH.