Under the current rules, the Dundee United penalty on Saturday was a correct decision, as was the yellow card to Alexandro Bernabei. If your arm is away from your body and the ball hits it, a foul is committed. If this happens inside the box with VAR in attendance, this should lead to a penalty. Outside the box, VAR will seldom intervene, so ridiculous examples of the genre, like Alexandro’s on Saturday, are less likely to be punished. Fifa and VAR have inverted the ‘Outside the box it’s a foul all day’ rule.
The yellow card was also correct, if the arm stops an attempt at goal, a caution should be issued. Taken in total, these rules will lead to game being decided by a high proportion of random events inside the penalty area. Our experience in Madrid last week, where despite a good early showing, we were out of the contest due to penalties that would not have met the required criteria a few years ago, will happen again.
Defenders will also face increased jeopardy when on a yellow card. Previously, they could make sure they did not get involved in an incident that would lead to a second yellow, but there is little can be done to prevent a ball changing direction towards you and hitting an arm when you are jumping, landing or twisting your body.
Corner kicks and long balls into the box will become more dangerous than ever before. We will see the ridiculous scenario, where defenders jump and move around the box with their arms straight down, or behind their back, while attackers have the freedom to leverage their arms. Hopefully the World Cup will be determined by such an event, ushering in a rapid rethink.
Yesterday, according to the referee, already-booked Hearts keeper, Craig Gordon, fouled Motherwell’s Louis Molt, who was clean through with only the keeper to beat. The referee failed to show Craig a second yellow card. I am not convinced it was a penalty kick in the first place, but if it was, not sending Craig off goes against the rules. We need referees and VAR observers who can make better decisions, but as a Celtic fan, you have known that for generations! *(not mentioning our visit to Tynecastle).
It was a great weekend that again proved how football often pivots on fine margins. Seven points is a huge advantage, provides Celtic with breathing space and puts pressure on the also-rans who are now besieged. Two years ago, it was Celtic and Neil Lennon in the spotlight. It’s easier to look in from the outside and see the clear and obvious mistakes that happen when things are not going your way. We’ll explore this tomorrow.
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Happy Monday and 7 points clear from Louisville!
Aipple! You must be lonely!
T
By the letter of the law it is absolutely not a penalty.
The law states that the referee should determine the validity of the player’s hand/arm position in relation to the player’s movement “in that specific situation”.
Bernabei’s arm was in a position natural to that situation.
Given that Michael Nicholson openly admitted at the annual general cringe meeting, Celtic hasn’t even fully confronted ‘the shards of glass’ scandal, seven months ago. Celtic supporters shouldn’t hold out much hope for the so called VAR ‘teething issues’ it seems. plenty more of that to come, before some supporters will finally walk away.
Ange the calmest man in Paradise again showed he’s SFA savvy, and got the players heads back up very quickly in a game that was menaced from a room far away. Crowd dread very quickly transferred to the park, and Celtic snatched at chances, until the 90th minute.
A testament to great man management are this Celtic squad.
If you’re lonely when you’re alone, you’re in bad company.
What BSR said.
P67,
My reading of the rules aligns with yours – it could be given as a pen by the letter of the law and it must also be a yellow card as it blocked a shot on target despite not being deliberate in any way.
I say could be a pen as the natural body point muddies the waters here for me, where as the yellow card I think is clearer in the laws.
The handball laws are a complete mess but our officials and VAR officials are also making a bigger mess of things on occasion. For me the non pen for us at Hearts seemed a stranger call than giving this one but again subjective laws make it hard to be consistent. The second the same ref/VAR teams gives an advantage to Sevco (either by giving them a pen similar to the one we didn’t get vs Hearts OR by not giving one against them similar to the one we conceded against Dundee Utd) then we need to be all over it.
Happy for the world cup to highlight this and bring about correction; as long as it’s not in England’s favour!
QB
I wouldn’t bet on a rethink if a VAR penalty decision distorts the world cup. VAR ruined the 2018 world cup final and then, despite it clearly not working, was rapidly introduced. The VAR bandwagon is driven by something other than merely improving the game as it is, as is evidenced by the endless rule changes to accommodate it.
Champs league Draw
RB Leipzig v Manchester City
Club Bruges v Benfica
Liverpool v Real Madrid
AC Milan v Tottenham
Eintracht Frankfurt v Napoli
Borussia Dortmund v Chelsea
Inter Milan v Porto
PSG v Bayern Munich
HH
BSR @ 12:17
I think some would consider it natural, others might not. It is still subjective and reminds me of “offensive to a reasonable person” as far as legislative text goes!
I used to work with a category 1 ref and in their group chats when they reviewed all the previous game incidents the lack of consistent view on yellow/red etc. between the refs was frightening and suggests either:
– our refs have their own interpretations / disregard the rules (“I’ve seen my kids take harder kicks than that” – as said to Skippy by a ref who saw a foul but decided it was not enough of a foul and so ignored the laws of the game
– some laws are too subjective still and need re-wording to clarify these
I think both are in play here.
QB
The main problem for me with VAR in Scotland is the hun scum who are in charge of it at every game
It was bad enough before having the referee and 2 assistants to contend with but now we have a couple of extra huns scrutinising every Celtic decision
They are getting 2 bites to the cherry on every Celtic decision
Handball in the box will give Tavernier the Ballon D’Or.
Think we are going to need to score 3 or 4 minimum every single game
Handball is not the only inconsistency in VAR. I think the bigger scandal was overlooking the head high kick on Giakoumakis- why was that looked at and allowed?
There were two penalty trips in the EPL this weekend. De Bruyne won one for Man City but a very very similar incident where a Forest player was tripped was not awarded. Both saw the same level of contact- a mistimed tackle which contacted a heel of the attacker. Both players threw themselves to the ground when they could have stayed on their feet. The only difference between them was that De Bruyne started his simulated dive a fraction earlier than the Forest player. One was an unconvincing dive; the other was a very unconvincing dive. But one got a penalty.
I don’t have the figures but I suspect that penalty awards have increased since the introduction of VAR.
There is a lot to sort out- not just handball
Good afternoon all from Shawlands.
If that is the law, the law is an ass. Apart from the penalty being absurd, how can it be justified to book a player when he is struck by a ball when it is hit towards him when his back is to the ball? Utter nonsense. Worst hand ball penalty decision since the 1970 cup final v Aberdeen.
If that is the law, why no penalty at tynecastle and why no action against the var guy and ref for making a bad call despite clear evidence.
Next they will be saying if your leg is out and a forward kicks it then a penalty must be awarded.
Also how can they say a flying kick ending with studs in GGs chest was not dangerous and out of control?
The only thing VAR brings is more opportunities to disadvantage Celtic by cheating. If it takes almost four minutes to make a decision, the penalty on Saturday was hardly a clear and obvious error.
If the tynecastle one wasn’t an error it was blatant cheating.
Teething troubles my erchie.
Sorry for the rant but this VAR thing is just going to get worse.
Not for the first time Paul 67, you are wrong. It was not a penalty according to the rules.
I’m sure our CEO will be on to the SPFL this morning.
Stop laughing at the back.
Could someone provide the actual text of the relevant Law of the Game, with any official guidance notes/aides to interpretation, and a source web address?
Because I must have been reading the wrong stuff on the FIFA website if this is correct ‘If your arm is away from your body and the ball hits it, a foul is committed.’
In theory, VAR should be a good thing. How can it fail to be? A closer look at questionable incidents.
However, all that it has shown thus far, is the inconsistency in refereeing in Scotland.
In this case, inconsistency is a euphemism for anti Celtic
Interesting to see how this develops
There’s something about 7 points that sounds much better than 6.
I think the problem with the handball rule is it’s been changed so many times that nobody knows what it is these days, and fans, naturally fall back on what they imagine it to be. When you’ve got “experts” in the studio who don’t have a clue and managers who’ll use ambiguity fir their own benefit only the geeks and anoraks know the rule from one season to the next
I still don’t get why we it’s so hard to communicate what the rule is, even if it changes. If the referee can show that he was applying the law according to the book it takes a lot of the pressure off them and puts it onto the rule makers. The football associations are doing a terrible job of promoting the game and protecting the refs if we have a weekly controversy like this
Maybe the confusion serves suits some people, opacity is the friend of corruption.
Quadbhoy
The handball rule will be revisited probably after the World Cup, I’m fed up posting and reading about it. The game I was at on Saturday was marred by the stupid rule change , that deems unavoidable handball a penalty.
You cannot play football with your arms continuously by your side, it’s ridiculous and should be changed, so that VAR doesn’t continually compound it.
So the Huns would have got Real Madrid…..
if they weren’t the worse team in Champions League history…..
Let’s be honest, some loyal hack will give it a go :)
Enough goals to be clear in a game and at the top of the league is the only way to counteract the cheats in Hampden.
Our board will do eff all. Over to you Ange and the bhoys in Green.
HWG2IAR csc
HH
Season 22/23 after 13 games:
Celtic 36 points GD 35
“Rangers” 29 points GD 19
1st Glasgow derby @ Celtic Park
Season 21/22 after 13 games
Celtic 26 points GD 18
“Rangers” 30 points GD 18
1st Glasgow derby @ Ibrox
So Gio’s record is not much different to Steven Gerrard and he has not had the benefit of a home derby yet.
Give the man a chance. Gio must stay.
GARYGILLESPIESHAMSTRING on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 12:44 PM
‘If that is the law, the law is an ass.’
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Pretty sure it’s not the law. But the law is nonetheless an ass.
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‘how can it be justified to book a player when he is struck by a ball’
The reasoning is that by making his body bigger by having his arm in an unnatural position the player is running the risk of being booked if the ball hits his arm. It’s a perverse reasoning. It would be more coherent if the player were to be booked whether the ball hit his arm or not if he had made his body bigger by having his arm somewhere he shouldn’t.
I think the problems with them are clear to everyone, they’ve got themselves in one of those death spirals you see with them and us. Quick and easy yo get yourself into one, very difficult to get out of it.
Their senior players will know the writings on the wall.
BOURNESOUPRECIPE on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 12:52 PM
‘You cannot play football with your arms continuously by your side’
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Nonsense. Of course you can (apart from throw ins obviously). And it would fun to watch. Plus it would be more inclusive as those without the normal compliment of arms (two) would not be disadvantaged.
Cheers Pablo.
I’ll respect fully your right to interpret as you see fit on a couple of levels
1. Your blog. Your world. Your rules
2. Evelyn Beatrice Hall and all that
Wish I could share your sanguinity.
Two points if I may.
1. I couldn’t care less what the rules are as long as they are being applied even handedly. They are not.
2. Missing variable from your thesis? This foolishness about the non-negotiable “ball heading towards goal at point of impact”
So, a guy with nae neck muscles heads the ball toward goal from 15 yards out at 4 metres per second only to hit an arm after 18 inches of travel gets a pen?
Harrumph
Same old same old
When in doubt give it to Sevco or give it against Celtic.
If nothing else, your job is safe.
Armless fun??
PICINISCO on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 12:21 PM
“. The VAR bandwagon is driven by something other than merely improving the game as it is, as is evidenced by the endless rule changes to accommodate it.
What do you think that `something else` is?
Usually it is money but I can`t quite see that in this case.
An interesting Blog today but I have to go to Stracathreo Hospital for a MRI so
Cheerio for now.
Stracathro…..I must have been thinking of Hatate !
Alexandro Bernabi was Yellow Carded for his arm being connected to his shoulder…and his shoulder being connected to his body…which was in turn was covered by a GREEN and WHITE Jersey.
NOT just any old Green and White Jersey…But a CELTIC one.
Simples !
Ive read some Pundits/Folk etc say ” Fletchers Header was Goal Bound ” and Bernabi’s ” Handball” prevented a Dundee Utd Goal ?
HOW DO THEY KNOW THAT ?
Joe Hart MAY have saved it ?
What IF the Ball is NOT ” Handballed” by Bernabi, and Joe Hart saves the original Header by Fletcher, ONLY for Joe to PALM/PUNCH the Ball onto Bernabi’s arm, which is STILL behind his back…Is THAT Scenario STILL a Penalty and a Yellow Card for young Bernabi ?
The Penalty Award and subsequent Yellow Carding for Bernabi was/is a Feckin JOKE…..!
As for those so called ” Expert Pundits” like Kris Boyd etc…….what would THEIR OPINION be if it was a HUN Player being penalized for Bernabi’s so called ” OFFENCE” ,….INCLUDING in the LAST MINUTE of A CELTIC V SEVCO game , and a POTENTIALLY a GAME WINNING Penalty for Celtic ?
This DISGRACEFUL Penalty award will come back and BITE VAR right on the Arse throughout the course of the Season.
ONLY My Opinion.
HH
ERNIE LYNCH on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 1:01 PM
BOURNESOUPRECIPE on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 12:52 PM
‘You cannot play football with your arms continuously by your side’
###
Nonsense. Of course you can (apart from throw ins obviously). And it would fun to watch. Plus it would be more inclusive as those without the normal compliment of arms (two) would not be disadvantaged.
……………….
Aye right Ernie….AND GOALIES NOT allowed to use their arms and hands ?
ERNIE, Have YOU EVER tried to RUN with YOUR ARMS by your side….or in your Pockets ?
HOT SMOKED on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 1:17 PM
An interesting Blog today but I have to go to Stracathreo Hospital for a MRI so
Cheerio for now
…………
All the best Mate.
HH.
At this moment it is effectively an 8-point lead due to the massive goal difference! por cierto
I would HOPE that Celtic FC APPEAL against the Yellow Card for Bernabi…IF they can ?
Hvratski Jim
Gio won the Eurination Cup in Seville
“BOURNESOUPRECIPE on 7TH NOVEMBER 2022 12:52 PM”
“The game I was at on Saturday was marred by the stupid rule change , that deems unavoidable handball a penalty.”
Agree – much as the wee lad enjoyed giving it big BOOS during the delay I found it annoying and it impeded my celebrations at goals knowing that some VARanger would be reviewing the goals with a fine toothcomb to find ANY reason to chalk them off.
“You cannot play football with your arms continuously by your side, it’s ridiculous and should be changed, so that VAR doesn’t continually compound it.”
I used to like playing football with the top half of your body in an inflatable ball – perhaps this is the way to go? :)
Do you agree that the current law is too open for interpretation?
QB