The most important result in international week is that we get all our (33) players back fit and ready for Saturday. That looks to be the case, although I hear Erik Sviatchenko had a close shave at Hampden. The job now is for Ronny Deila to assess the preparedness of his squad for the Hearts game. All may be fit, but it’ll be impossible for the likes of Tom Rogic to be at his best after coping with a 12,000 mile journey home and the necessary body clock adjustments.
Ronny will also have to counsel Kieran Tierney, who has had another big week. Teenagers often progress in waves, after with each crest there’s often a trough. The focus for Kieran right now has to be 100% Hearts.
I read Leigh Griffiths had an uneventful game against Denmark. Don’t bet against him shining on Saturday. He’s a player who flourishes with a point to prove.
I’ve not written much on Resolution 12 recently and I don’t see that changing for a few weeks (despite the trolls), but I have been very active on the subject. Anyone who thinks I’d skip over this is welcome to self-certify as a mindless troll below (I’m counting on at least one being sufficiently mindless…).
What I’d like to do is mark your card on this one. Completely erroneous claims have been made. Outrageous things have been written. There’s a Kangaroo Court underway which would do Salem proud. Let the loons run with their agenda of running Celtic down, but be circumspect. Your card’s been marked.
You are being played, all right, but not by Celtic.
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Twists, I have supported Celtic for a very long time since the day’s of getting lifted over the Turnstiles, and yes in them days we lost trophys,leagues, but we won quite a few as well,on the Res 12 thing my own opinion is that a lot of celtic supporters are making it an excuse for chucking it I say getting rid of the present board is more of a priority they are the ones that have caused this Res 12 thing,but me personally I will renew my season ticket, I’m 73 this year and the only reason I will stop going will be down to health problems, which I have at present, but thank god it hasn’t stopped me from following, Celtic
JJ,
Didn’t I tell you that I had one? :D
HH
Oh, just to counterbalance those who seem to think we are all keen to see Ronny go, I am a fan of Ronny and believe he can go on to become something a bit special. Whether or not an impatient support will sway the Board into cutting short this potentiality remains to be seen.
One other point. I firmly believe that our crowds are nowhere nearly as small as some constantly claim.
Cheerio for now,
JJ
Art of War@11:56pm yesterday
Re the ’69 Cup Final match report.
It’s not so much who was booked, but what he was booked for!
“Surprisingly, only Brogan of Celtic was booked, for a tackle on Craig”.
I know Jim was a hard tackler, but even his own teammates weren’t safe??
GREENPINATA
I’m all for as many posters as possible,bud. Especially lurkers.
There’s one fella contributes regularly to the magazine,highly knowledgeable,yet won’t post.
Get on here,Iain!!!
As for my two lurking sisters,be grateful they don’t post. They are much less tolerant of unadulterated p..h than I am,it would be a bloodbath!!
(Plus,they’d be telling me to get to my bed all the time…)
Geordie
Yes, you did tell me……. but you did not look as though you were being honest.
Definite cheerio now,
JJ
ITALIABHOY on 31ST MARCH 2016 8:48 AM
Hilarious front page in the record this morning. Looks like our unlikely hero, George Osbourne, has tweaked the rules to allow HMRC to pursue players individually for their EBT “loans”.
On a sidebar inside an un-named player openly admits he only signed for RFC because of the EBT. Says he will sue the, erm, “club” if he is forced to pay up.
Wonder if soon they might not actually be so keen to claim they are still “ra same club, Timmy!”
—————-
How can you sue something thats dead? :)
TIMBHOY3
Bliddy happyclapper…
Seriously,bud,debate and dissent are good things. But there’s nothing better than going to watch your team.
I canny stand the board,and have been open about that since I’ve been on here. But it’s Celtic we support,not the board.
That said,I understand why some have had enough. Me,well…
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=TspYx7EaF5A
Johann Murdoch
In the same way you can fine them!
Morning all.
Firstly I would like to offer my sincerest condolonces to those who have suffered a recent bereavement.
Secondly, my thought for today is: if Leigh and Kieran don’t win at least one(each) of the POTY awards, then questions should be asked.
A bit like Res 12!
HH!!
Reading Italia bhoy’ s post about the daily rager article, my interest was aroused by the comment about the side bar to the article.
One recipient, albeit unnamed, has now admitted that he would not have signed had it not been for the ebt.
That surely nails the LNS ruling about no sporting advantage (unless the player is sebo) and also the myth that the players would have signed for them whether or not an ebt was on offer.
JUNGLE JIM HOT SMOKED on 31ST MARCH 2016 9:45 AM
“An opinion can never be wrong.”
In my opinion, an opinion can be wrong.
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/leigh-kieran-marking-your-card/comment-page-14/#comments
JOHANN MURDOCH on 31ST MARCH 2016 10:00 AM
ITALIABHOY on 31ST MARCH 2016 8:48 AM
On a sidebar inside an un-named player openly admits he only signed for RFC because of the EBT. Says he will sue the, erm, “club” if he is forced to pay up.
—————-
How can you sue something thats dead? :)
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/leigh-kieran-marking-your-card/comment-page-15/#comments
I think we are approaching the resolution of the ‘Liar Paradox’ …. the one that goes…
Is the following statement true or false?
“This statement is false”
Back to my breakfast cider…
Hail Hail
Matt
Beatbhoy – haha I didn’t pick that up!
Anyone heard from TSOAL?
See that the new ‘strict’ guide lines that are going to be applicable to the EBT stuff, will not kick-in until 2019.
Dear, dear….the deid(LOL) huns will be kicking ass up n doon the CL groups by that time.
Yeah, and….Celtic FC will have ripped itself apart as the level’s of deceitful stewardship by the Desmond PLC board will have resulted in a gradual, apathetic slump in crowds attending Celtic games as, Celtic supporters(cash-cows) have been scunnered away from the game.
Oh, and the Res : 12 rebels will still be waiting for the results from ‘crucial’ hun court cases.
The Elephants Grave Yard – CSC
How can ye put money into Celtic’s cash register without, supporting the board ?
How does that work ?
By 2019 neither the Huns nor us will be anywhere near the cl group stages of the reported changes to the format at adopted
And this won’t help much either http://m.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/35919247
ANTIPODEAN RED on 31ST MARCH 2016 9:01 AM
Macjay,
Who appointed the coach?
It would therefore lead to the thinking that whoever it was could also be a bit of a problem. ========================================
Absolutely right.
Perhaps head(s) should roll.
Can`t see Jeanette fixing things , though. Can you?
IMHO the problem was not the appointment of the coach , but the failure to accept that a mistake has been made and to rectify that error.
Now THAT is the first priority. Not the blindingly impossible hope of overthrowing the current Board.
That just diverts good Tim energy from where it should be focussed.
By all means deal with that problem later ,but first give us a winning team .
That`s what we all deserve.
And are entitled to expect.
Celtic40Me
___________
Aye,…..it gets better every day :)
HH
KEVJUNGLE
I’m not agreeing with you, you’re talking a load of rubbish as usual
ELLBOY on 31ST MARCH 2016 9:11 AM
macjay1 for Neil Lennon
“There`s only one significant problem at Celtic Park. The coach”
While we all wish for better out on the pitch, I think for many this is a secondary issue. Trust for many is all important as without it then what’s the point in anything? All you have to do is look around the half empty stands to realise this is more than a coaching issue.
===============================================================
Now there I beg to differ.
If we were able to look back on credible performances in Europe , I seriously don`t think we would be focussed so introspectively and I think our crowd numbers may well be higher.
I want a football team that wins and competes at a reasonable level in Europe.
I feel that I`m entitled to expect that.
Overwhelmingly a coaching responsibility.
That`s where the buck stops.
HH!
Hello CQN – long time since I posted or even lurked….just thought I’d drop in and see what’s being discussed. Unfortunately it’s Res 12 so be an even longer sabatical after today..
Hope you are all well.
Sack Lawwell and appoint a qualitry managers, clear out the fakers and watch the crowds flood back..
Looking forward to humping Newco..
Macjay,
A winning team does the trick most of the time, in fact I think it pretty much done for the original ‘Save our Celts’ back in the early nineties but it only postponed the inevitable.
A winning team, playing entertaining football would indeed help but the issues appear to be much more deep rooted than just the team at the moment.
As for Jeanette, she is often mentioned on these pages but I don’t think she has ever had anything to say. I think I last saw her on YouTube recently and she came across as being extremely capable, not sure that she has ever said that she wants to be on the board but we could do with a least one female on there as the present crew are too comfy and need shaken up a bit, in my humble opinion
I may have to nip into the library to get more on this one…
The story/myth/fairytale seems to be very much Celtic centric, and as per usual hints at anti-support culture, but the image is a wee bit difficult to decipher, and the main body disappears in to subsequent pages which lie (now there’s an appropriate descriptor) in subsequent pages…
Perhaps others have more detail…. Do your best with this.
https://goo.gl/B0ukgP
Hail Hail
Matt
Macjay1 for Neil Lennon
__________________________
why would it be ‘impossible’ to over throw the board ?
They are there to collect ‘your’ money.
So, don’t give them it.
If,….they want to be seen the power base of Celtic FC…let them put their own money in to run the club.
No fans money into the club would see the swivel-eyed-sleekit-deceitful-charlatans going back to where they came from….nowhere!
Call their bluff!
Folk seem to be brainwashed into thinking that – “Oh, nobody will have enough to buy DD’s shares!”
Oh yeah ?
So, how much will his shares be worth when….
The stadiums empty!
There’s no season book money for them to play with!
Images of, a Celtic Park ’empty’ being beamed all over the globe!
Turn the tables and, play the feckers at their own game!
Your no longer a supporter….yer a, PLC….
Cash Cow!
Mug!
Easily kidded merchant!
Thing is,…..the PLC board are all billionaires, etc so….see what their like when, they have to run the club with their own money.
Thing is,….you have to introduce a little anarchy, to upset the ‘established’ order at Celtic Park.
Thing is,….the Jungle would have chased the PLC doon London Road, way back when – MO’N sign-posted that, the ‘slow’ lane would now be the norm for Celtic.
Too many folk fell for the spin after MO’N left.Te know, stuff like…
“We canny operate at this level any more but, we’ll still charge ‘you’ top dollar to watch the new, downsized quality of the product on the pitch.”
A mug, is a mug, is a mug,….no matter how they try to dress it up.
You either, fell for it….or, ye didny!
Violins FC – CSC
typos – sorry
celtic40me on 31st March 2016 10:24 am
___________________________________________
Aye,…..guid for you.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/rangers-legends-could-bankrupted-millions-7660173
Some difference in the sister paper story
Kevjungle
Never cross your mind that Mon might have been doing a bit of spinning himself?
Provably not
Looks like the papers have at least 50% of the story right today anyway. No chance KT will be going to Southampton this summer. However, we probably are looking at Hendrie as a replacement for Izzy and backup to Tierney.
Really this summer we only need a couple of players. We need a striker and left midfielder. Catman mentioned Elyounoussi from Molde at the end of the transfer window and he looks like a good replacement for Commons. We need a bit more quality (and goals) from the 2 wide midfielders. We also need a striker to challenge Griffiths. Do you go with Fletcher (who should be a good signing and have 2-3 good years left) or do you take a bit of a risk and try and sign an up and coming striker.
The most important part of the summer will be trying to sell/ get rid of the surplus players. Blackett, Boerrigter, Cole, Izaguirre, Ambrose, Stokes, Ciftci, Scepovic, Forrest, Fisher (maybe), Allan (maybe), Mulgrew (maybe) and Commons (maybe).
Morning All,
Busy day yesterday so didn’t have the chance to come on here, but I think it is important that I personally try and clarify a few things and give my own views on a lot of the Res 12 questions that have been posed over the last 24 hours.
Hopefully what I am about to say will clarify some things about what is undoubtedly a complex issue.
I particularly want to address:
Process
Time Limit
Latest
OK Process:
Ever since Resolution 12 was adjourned at the 2013 AGM — and please note that it was formally ADJOURNED and not WITHDRAWN from the AGM as that is crucially important in understanding the role of Celtic PLC, their board and the requisitioners — there have been ongoing discussions between the PLC board and those representing the shareholders.
I have said before that there have been regular meetings, e-mails, discussions and so on. At times, those discussions have not gone as quickly as they could through no fault of Celtic PLC. For example there have been times when some of us were not available through work or family issues — myself in particular– and at other times some of the other parties involved — The SFA, Lawyers, Accountants etc — have to be consulted before you can progress matters further.
That involvement of other parties is important to remember when I come to the time deadline etc.
The point that I tried to make clear in the leader article Paul published last Friday was that the PLC board have been involved throughout here. They have not been obstructive, they have not been difficult, they have not been anything other than receptive to the notion that there was something to pursue here,
Where there has been an issue of late is not so much on what to pursue but on how to piursue it.
Remember that the exact wording of Res 12 was that the shareholders asked the board to take the issue under consideration to the CFCB/UEFA.
We are all wise in hindsight, and with hindsight my own personal preference would be to change the wording of the resolution in the interests of real technical accuracy to request that the board of Celtic PLC formally asks the Scottish Football Association to take the approproate steps to report matters to CFCB/UEFA — the exact wording is not important but hopefully you will get the drift.
The proper procedural route for this is Shareholder — Club Board — SFA — UEFA. That pathway would apply to the shareholders and the board of any club, not just Celtic.
So, at the current time, the shareholders have gone to the board and the board have raised the issue with the SFA.
However, a complication arose when the crown office became involved and when a whole raft of court cases were commenced by others who had nothing to do with the shareholders or Celtic PLC.
Those court proceedings brought to light further information, documentation and points to consider. However, some of the documentation was either disputed or required to be legally proved and so on. Some of it could not be handled or relied on by some of the parties concerned for genuine legal reasons and while that position remained the aims of the resolution appeared to be stalled.
If you ever get the chance to ask Auldheid about this then do so, because he in particular was very frustrated by this.
However, a potential solution was found but that meant the requisitioners taking some unexpected action which then, by necessity, changed the pathway above and it meant the requisitioners going directly to the SFA.
So now we have a different pathway:
Shareholders— Board — SFA — Board — shareholders —- SFA
However, we now have a stall at the SFA end because the SFA are technically saying they will not answer to shareholders ( I have said before this is interesting in itself and may well be an argument for another day ) and so they insist on answering only to the member club namely Celtic PLC.
Except that, as yet, the answers provided are not as full or as clear as they should be. They don’t say they won’t answer, they just haven’t answered — as I say AS YET!
Now, there MIGHT — and I stress the word might — be a reasonable explanation for that and that explanation surrounds things which are taking place elsewhere — particularly in the High Court of Justice.
Since Res 12 started in any way shape or form, the crown office have commenced criminal proceedings part of which relates very closely to the issues, documentation, timescales, processes and people who are at the heart of the issues central to the resolution.
Further, because of the public interest in the case, the Lord Adocate specifically took the somewhat unusual step of warning the media and the public against discussing the detail of the case, or potential case, in open forum for fear of prejudicing a fair trial.
Equally, witnesses and potential witnesses ( and I will leave you to figure out who they could be or might be ) are also precluded from communicating about the case, the issues and most importantly the evidence.
So back to my pathway which calls for anwers from the SFA and at the moment they are simply saying nothing — possibly for the reasons I allude to above.
Into this mix now let me introduce the time limit.
I have seen others mistakenly refer to the time limit of 31st March as meaningless etc. With respect, it is neither meaningless nor finite.
The CFCB regulations state quite clearly that in the event if there being a breach of their rules then any PROSECUTION — and hang in to that precise word — must COMMENCE within 5 years of the breach concerned.
Anyone with any legal training of substance will tell you that you MUST NOT miss a time limit. If you have rights you can lose them forever by not insisting on those rights within a time limit. If you have a liability, you can escape that liability if no one asks you to meet that liability within a statutory time limit.
In this case, we are talking about a time limit of 5 years regarding events which start with the grant of a licence on 31st March 2011.
Now, there is no suggestion that the licence of 31st March issued by the SFA in terms of the rules is in any way worthy of challenge or was issued incorrectly. So in that regard, 31st March is not a finite time limit.
What does fall to be considered, is whether or not the events which more or less immediately followed the grant of that licence is worthy of investigation and ultimately prosecution. It is these events and those dates which the resolution asked the PLC to bring to the attention of CFCB/UEFA.
The events concerned END with a submission which required to be made in terms of the CFCB rules, and which required to show that the terms and conditions of the licence had been met as at 30th of June — some 91 days AFTER 31st March.
Accordingly, it COULD be argued that the five year time limit expires on 3Oth June.
Equally, there is a remote but real possibility any time limit could end on the date when the submission was made which supports the notion that all was tickety boo as at the 30th June — in which case that would be sometime in early June.
A third view, would be that the time period would only start when UEFA acted upon the information and issued their confirmation that the 30th June provisions had in fact be met — in which case that finite date might be September.
Lastly, there is a provision which says that in certain circumstances UEFA/CFCB can waive or extend any time limit and another where the language suggests that in the event of wrongdoing any time limit can be ignored.
However, taking these last points first, the only way you can extend a time limit is by persuading CFCB there is good cause to extend any such limit or to prove that there was such wrongdoing in the first place that the time limit can be ignored. If you don’t prove the necesary wrongdoing or if CFCB say that there is no good cause or reason to extend the limit, then you are goosed, the time limit applies and you are thrown out the door.
It is against that background you have to look at the time limit.
You also have to look at the exact wording of the rules for they say that within that time limit a PROSECUTION has to have been COMMENCED.
For a prosecution to have been commenced first an investigation has to have taken place and reached a conclusion which then justifies a prosecution. For an investigation to even start, someone somewhere has to take an issue to the CFCB for them to investigate. If there is no formal reference to CFCB they won’t investigate at all — and so there will be no prosecution.
Accordingly, if there is an issue which by regulation should be the subject of a prosecution which should have been commenced by 30th June 2016, then long before that date an investigation has to have been started and concluded OR any time limit has to have been waived by UEFA/CFCB for good reason.
The process by which any CFCB issue is ultimately prosecuted is that an investigationg officer is assigned to an issue, he or she then invetsigates and prepares a report to be considered by a disciplinary panel and then that panel instructs that there should be a prosecution and then finally an officer commences that prosecution.
As at today’s date, all of that just might have to be done within the next 92 days and as yet no one has referred the matter to UEFA/CFCB at all.
Allowing for due process, proper procedures, fair investigation and so on — working back from 30th June to say 31st March provides for a very tight timescale.
So, the time limit is one which is very real and very much worth considering because if I were defending any prosecution which comes down the pipe in say late 2016 or 2017 I would immediately be arguing that the proceedings were without merit because they were time barred as all the facts were known and proceedings could have been commenced within the time limit. The time limit is there for a reason and everyone knows that if you don’t enforce the rights within the time limit then they are lost … unless etc.
That “unless” puts everyone on the back foot. Instead of marching forward knowing you have an absolute right to proceed, you have to justify why you didn’t act sooner and the onus is on you to prove why the time limit should be extended or ignored.
That step is completely unnececessary if you make sure you act within the time limits.
A prosecution in terms of the CFCB rules can be commenced and immedately adjourned just to preserve a time limit and, in my opinion, that is what should happen here as that would allow any criminal proceedings to take place and preserve the CFCB time limit.
As of a couple of weeks ago, no one was considering this issue being time barred and so it was thought best to raise it and make sure everyone with an interest in this is well aware of it.
So that deals with process and the time limit.
Where we are now, and I want to stress this, is that both Celtic PLC and the shareholders think that the matter should be referred to UEFA/CFCB without delay but what has not been established is how that is to be done.
Rather than leave this to chance, the resolutioners are looking at making the reference direct. Celtic know this and have encouraged it.
In the opinion of some, however, it would be better if Cetic PLC make the reference for legal and technical reasons, not least of which is that this is precisely what the resolution asked them to do.
However, both the resolutioners and Celtic PLC believe that the very best person to remit the whole issue to UEFA/CFCB for the purposes of investigation at least, would be the SFA as that is the proper logical and legal path to follow.
The pecking order for referring this is:
1 SFA
2 Celtic PLC or any other football club
3 Shareholders of Celtic PLC orany other football club.
What I can say is that the requisitioners have now received mandates from shareholders which allow them to show that this is not an issue which is of concern to one or two people and that hundreds of Celtic shareholders at least want this to be pursued. This is why I would encourage anyone with shares to send on a mandate so that we can demonstrate through the solicitors just how strong the feeling is on this.
All Celtic shareholders, everyone with an interest in football and fair play, should be asking for the issues to be looked at.
The board of Celtic PLC are well aware of the strength of feeling and that has been discussed with board representatives this week and no later than yesterday.
For good legal reason a whole lot of detail cannot be explained at the moment but on where this is going and where we are just now, my own view can be summed up in the title of that old song “It’s ain’t what you do, it’s the way that you do it!” — as right now that is the key issue.
One way or another this is going to the CFCB.
Finally, can I throw something into the mix about Paul’s article of yesterday.
I know fine well he has an opinion on this and I also know fine well he has taken a keen interest in the whole affair. How else would I have been able to write the leader on here last Friday? However, he has deliberately said very little and until some things are sorted out I would encourage him to say very little. That may well be a cause of frustration — like having an itch and being unable to sctratch it. Go figure.
With regard to Phil’s article, I have to say that I do not share all of his views or his conclusions. I pointed out before that Phil had previously reported that a letter had already gone to UEFA. I don’t believe this to be correct although I could be wrong. What I would say on behalf of those who have been very much involved in this for a long time, I would be deeply disappointed in the Celtic board if they answered questions posed by Phil on his blog or in a letter before consulting the requisitioners and dealing with the more substantive and procedural issues that they have raised.
All recent communication from the board suggest that there is work being done to further the aims of the resolution in line with longstanding discussions and that the requisitioners concerns and points of view have been noted and are being considered.
Meanwhile, the shareholders will continue to just get on with their business in the most professional way possible with a view to ensuring that they fulfil the mandate given to them as best they can.
Hopefully that makes some things clearer.
CELTIC40ME on 31ST MARCH 2016 10:44 AM
Kevjungle
Provably not
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/leigh-kieran-marking-your-card/comment-page-15/#comment-2803498
CELTIC40ME
If that is not a typo then it is brilliant. In fact even if it is a typo it is brilliant…and I will use it!
Hail Hail
Matt
MATT STEWART on 31ST MARCH 2016 10:47 AM
CELTIC40ME on 31ST MARCH 2016 10:44 AM
Kevjungle
Provably not
______________
Lol….don’t think that even MO’N could have spun that yin :)
HH
Have to leave but….I’ll spin this afore I go….
Cliques & Cronyism have reduced Celtic FC to a hollow shell with a, dwindelling attendance base.
Cliques & Cronyism have reduced CQN to the Peoples Friend with a, dwindelling poster base.
So, so sad.
You’ll Never Walk Alone….in the Jungle.
…..bye……
BRTH
Thank you, sir, for your comprehensive state of play and detailed explanation of time and process requirements for submission of points contained in Resolution12.
This puts my mind at ease regarding a case going forward but, in order to avoid SF A continued filibustering, would it not be possible to lodge papers, simplicity, to UEFA and if current legal proceedings in Scotland cause an adjournment of UEFA investigation, so be it.
I commend you and the other requisition for your indefatigable in this matter.
Hopefully this puts an end to the fevered animosity on this blog. Power to your elbow. HH
BRTH
Could you run that past me again? por cierto :)
BRTH
Blinkin’ flip,no wonder you elbowed law a few years back,my head was exploding just reading that!
Circuitous doesn’t come near,you’ve been led a merry dance and put through some hoops. That you are all still in there batting and battling,well,I raise my hat to your dogged perseverance.
My grateful thanks to you all,and here’s to a deserved success.
MATT STEWART
purely unintentional, i promise!
ANTIPODEAN RED on 31ST MARCH 2016 10:36 AM
Macjay,
A winning team does the trick most of the time, in fact I think it pretty much done for the original ‘Save our Celts’ back in the early nineties but it only postponed the inevitable.
A winning team, playing entertaining football would indeed help but the issues appear to be much more deep rooted than just the team at the moment.
As for Jeanette, she is often mentioned on these pages but I don’t think she has ever had anything to say. I think I last saw her on YouTube recently and she came across as being extremely capable, not sure that she has ever said that she wants to be on the board but we could do with a least one female on there as the present crew are too comfy and need shaken up a bit, in my humble opinion
===========================================================
“Appear to be deep rooted “? Only if you believe those here who have an ulterior motive. The Celtic Trusters and their acolytes.
Jeanette was mentioned by Kev.J. as someone to “take over.” That`s why I mentioned her.
Seriously ,pal.
Cloud cuckoo land . Surely.
And in the meantime we have fruitless division amongst Celtic supporters.
What`s that quote.?….Sound and fury signifying nothing ……….or words to that effect.
Will`s words.
A tad better than mine. :-)