I have a semi-regular correspondent, Raymie, who, over some considerable time now, has expressed concerns when Celtic play two central midfielders with two attack-minded players in the wide berths.
Intuitively, we should be attack minded against all Scottish opposition, especially at home, but football parks are big open spaces which requires a lot of industry to cover effectively. Scott Brown is the epitome of industry while Stefan Johansen appears to be cut from the same mould, but with James Forrest hugging the right touchline and Georgios Samaras playing his usual role on the left, Aberdeen had men over in central midfield, which ultimately determined the outcome of the game.
Neil Lennon seems to know not to play Forrest and Samaras together, they have only both started in wide positions in one league game since September, which was an uninspiring 0-1 win in Inverness. Forrest replaced an injured Kris Commons 28 minutes into a game at Easter Road in October, but although James scored Celtic’s only goal, this was one of only three league games this season we’ve dropped points.
The manager, of course, was part of a robust midfield in his time at Celtic, with Paul Lambert to one side of him and tough-tackling-always-running Alan Thompson to the other, although neither Lennon nor Lambert had the mobility of Scott Brown. It wasn’t until Martin O’Neill left and Gordon Strachan took over, that we got to see the likes of Nakamura on one wing and Maloney on the other.
If you were lining up against Celtic and realised they had two in central midfield your game plan would immediately crystallise. Teams will mostly face Celtic with only one striker, allowing five in the middle, most or all of whom will play tight. This creates a numerical advantage in the most crucial area of the field, and a basis to build forward moves on the occasions, however rare, they are able to do so.
Compare Saturday’s performances with the two comfortable wins over Aberdeen this season. In august the 0-2 victory was achieved with a midfield of Brown, Kayal, Ledley and Mulgrew. None known for their creativity but Celtic cruised nonetheless.
November’s 3-1 win saw Brown, Ledley, Mulgrew and Samaras in midfield; Aberdeen didn’t get a sniff.
One final word on the players……………
Most of us watched the away defeat to Shahkter Karagandy with some annoyance at the ITV commentators’ regular accusations that the players were not applying themselves appropriately. Neil Lennon gave voice to our objections after he heard the commentary while reviewing the game. The game went against Celtic but it was absurd to suggest the players were not applying themselves fully.
Reading comments on CQN and listening to the manager after Saturday’s game I felt we were in similar territory, with Neil saying, “We gave the players all the preparations needed”, “I can hardly single out any player, maybe James [Forrest] and Stokesy, to come out with any credit”, “There was a lack of composure, particularly in midfield and at full-back”.
I just don’t buy the lack of application or focus accusations which have been flying around here in recent days. Players spend all week gearing up for game time, when it looks different on the park, there is usually a tactical reason.
If you would like to read the new CQN Magazine, GO HERE to read properly, and for FREE, the graphic below is just a taster.
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Modern air of resignation to defeat when the other team score is rubbish.
bournesouprecipe
where can I watch the game live?
THM,
Can you not ask an easier one from the archives like what should the ref do when a dug runs onto the pitch, and launches a cushion/balloon/’projectile’ at the ball, thus intercepting a goalbound shot, with the keeper out of his ground.
DBBIA,
From amortisation to nematodes – the journey continues…
HH
BSR/RoyCroppie- that is reassuring.
We’ll have no excuse not to lay on an ole display of scintillating free flowing total football.
Those ole nematodes will just have to crawl somewhere else.
I think mulgrews distribution from the center midfield this season has been one of the creative highlights so far, pity he’s not managed to stay injury free, he’d be a permanent fixture in that central role for me.
quonno
Do you remember pre minty , they were an irrelevance and we never hoovered up trophies then , its football , it happens , we all have short memories .
One of the most enjoyable seasons I have had following Celtic was the Centenary year Stranraer should have beat us in the cup at CP that year .
HH
qunno
Exactly my sentiment – you can maybe lose 10 league games in a season & still go on towin the league but you lose one cup game. You lose one cup match & the game is up.
Hail hail!
Slabhoy
Not in Duntocher ;-) only twitter live updates which is even less riveting than the ole curling.
28 Fisher drives forward and finds Henderson who picks out Fridjonsson, and the striker fires over.
@CFC Rivet
TBJ
You suggested that our best wins and performances did not feature Forrest and Sammi.
Here are the figures for all games this season where we won by 3 clear goals or more. Your theory works for 3 games in November and December only.
Killie 4:0 Forrest (77m) Sammi (0m)
Hibs 4:0 Forrest (0m) Sammi (85m)
Well 3:0 Forrest (90m) Sammi (0m)
St. M. 4:0 Forrest (79m) Sammi (0m)
Well 5:0 Forrest (0m) Sammi (0m)
Hearts 7:0 Forrest (0m) Sammi (0m)
Ross County 4:1 Forrest (0m) Sammi (0m)
Killie 5:2 Forrest (0m) Sammi (90m)
Shaktar 3:0 Forrest (90m) Sammi (90m)
Cliftonville 3:0 Forrest (86m) Sammi (76m)
Dbbia
I have it on good authority that the SRU are going to have a green pitch in place in time for Celtic games. Apparently it is a hybrid type of pitch. I read somewhere that Arsenal’s pitch is based on something similar. Always looks pretty good.
For clarity the dug will be micro-chipped and fully FoCUS-compliant
31 GOAL!!! John Herron fires Celtic in front.
Goal for Big Bird
bournesouprecipe
Slabhoy
Not in Duntocher ;-) only twitter live updates which is even less riveting than the ole curling
__________________________
Ha Ha! sometimes Celtic TV show the games but I couldn’t see it…
The Speculative Society of Edinburgh, when I first researched it in 2002 had over two thirds of the Scots Law Lords that I could check as undeclared members.
I got my information mainly from a bicentenary vanity publication for the members dated 1968 which showed that all the undergraduates given as members then went on to achieve remarkable success.
An essay by the Queen’s physician in Scotland in the book gave his views for the success.
No women, good middle/upper class families in Edinburgh and new members must be by invite and accepted by two thirds of the membership.
An all-male self-perpetuating elite which has dominated the Scottish establishment since 1764.
Read what Sir Derrick Dunlop says here:
http://www.saveourglen.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/Sir-Derrick-Dunlop.jpg
I would like to see Neil flanked by a couple of bright sharp eyed ,tactically aware coaches.
It happens in the EPL .Very often you can see a manager having things pointed out by his coaching team and making the required changes. I just dont see Mallby and Parker doing this. They maybe good at some behind the scene stuff but no-one seems to be pointing out glaring tactical failures.
Ive also noticed that many managers seem to miss bad performances on the far side of the pitch.
Maybe we should get Walter to sit up in the stand and oversee the game ?
Football tactics are an interesting area and not a simple as saying we play a certain formation. It’s a coaches job during the week to give the players the information they require to do the job. Once players cross the white line, it is up to them to make the decisions on what needs to be done. If that includes changing the formation at certain points in the game, then so be it. The players are not programmed robots.
Lenny is I am sure one of the new breed enlightened coaches, living, breathing his football and seeking the very best and newest ideas in coaching, tactical awareness, psychology, nutrition, motivation etc. He has access to the very best people in these areas of the game. I think he also has good assistants in Johann and Gary and we have fantastic coaching facilities, which is on a par with the best the EPL can offer. We have everything in place to ensure our players are prepared to perform at their optimum. The one thing missing in all this is the psychological corner as coaches call it and its the most important but hardest to get to grips with as a player and a coach. (The other three corners of a players profile being Technical, Physical and Social).
When Jose Mourinho joined Chelsea the first time, he would have a thorough dossier produced of the next opponents, which was handed to the players to study. By all accounts it was over 100 pages long. It included every single facet of the oppositions players, strengths, weaknesses and preferences, etc and likely opposition team
tactics. Such knowledge would help to give his players a psychological edge and confidence. The reason I know this is that it came out after Chelsea had to play a lower league or non league team in the FA cup. After the game the manager of that team met with Mourinho after the inevitable defeat and was presented with Chelsea’s 100 page plus dossier on his team. He was amazed at the detail and thoroughness. That was the level Mourinho went to, even against team his reserves would canter against.
Now, its moved on. On his return to Chelsea, and even in that short period of time the game has changed dramatically. Formations or rigid formations per se are out the window. Its about the players on the pitch adjusting to whatever is thrown their way and making the right decisions. What Mourinho is now doing is giving his players the dossier and info of the next opponents and they have to work together to come up with solutions to certain likely situations. After all, they are the one’s who have to do it on the pitch. The coach has the overview, and if personnel need to be changed or the players are not working it out, he then replaces them.
Its the coaches job to come up with a game plan(s) and give the players empowerment to make decisions. As I said at the beginning, Lenny is I am sure an enlightened coach and empowers his players. When things are clearly not working its his job to step in. In this case it appears that he did not react quickly enough, or he was hoping for another couple of goals in the last couple of minutes. Funny how often we get these last minute goals, which more often than not is when tactics and formations go out of the window !!
CF
blantyretim is praying for the knox family
13:10 on 11 February, 2014
79
He is allowed an off day surely.
When he wasn’t playing welk the others should have stood up to be counted.
Are we now a one man team..
Spot on blantyre, we had no fight in the team either , and playing Sammie and stokes , well I don’t think either merits automatic inclusion in the team , one fault I do find with Neil .
Celtfish – re the Special One. Always got the impression that Porto targeted Rab Douglas re spilling shots and Big Bobo re rash challenges and that was the difference in Seville. If anyone saw Rab on Sportscene at the weekend he was still dropping them and this resulted in two St Johnstone goals- watching that made me think of that first Porto goal in Seville. Cold shudder.
bamboo
With respect, you or I have absolutely no idea on what the input is from our asst. coaches before, during, or after a match day. trying to form an opinion based on a visual observation of their match day behaviour is as close to making decisions on a basis of ignorance as you can come.
P.S. Peter Grant pointed a lot of things out. Would we have him back? :-)
It was the managers fault, end of!!!!
Responsible for team selection, tactics, substitutions.
Like it or lump it!!
Ole Peter the pointer outer
NoThanks CSC
ohits
13:48 on 11 February, 2014
ohits the nail on the head…..HH
Bom dia,
Been on the road (again) these past few weeks, so catchin up now.
So we got pumped oot the Cup. Hardly (to paraphrase WGS) a reason to go home and drink yourself into raging alcoholism is it? Knock in the nads, maybe though.
On the other hand NOT qualifying for CL Group stages, or (dare I say it) being papped out without any shot at Europe next season. NOW that would be a cata-stroph.
See Eric Bogle taking a bitta flak too. Any man who penned “Leaving My Nancy”. “(and the band played) Waltzing Matilda”, “Green Fields of France” and “Now I’m Easy” to mention a few, canny be all bad. Can he?
Anyway, off to pen up a wee bit about the Libertadores Group stages (which start tonight) for anybody who fancies a flutter on the games (and those who’ve seen my tips in the past, will know they’re usually an inverse barometer of what the actual results will be).
celtfish
Great post
Hail Hail
SETTING FREE THE BEARS 1443
Absolutely correct.
People coming on here and voicing opinions without full knowledge of the facts-with a signed affidavit to boot-really get on my nipples.
On the other hand,is that not what a blog is all about?
Tootingtim.
That’s what modern day football’s missing. Dogs on the pitch and streakers. Not necessarily at the same time.
Interesting Article that sparks a few thoughts…
Losing a cup game is nothing in the over all scheme of Celtic’s current dominance of Scottish football – disappointed? Certainly. Devasted? Certainly not…
First and foremost, Aberdeen won the game as much as we lost the game – nobody threw anything away. I actually welcome the challenge AFC can bring – how much do I want Celtic to win the next game at Pitodrie on the 25th? A whole lot more than if we’d cuffed them at the weekend. I like football matches, I don’t enjoy foregone conclusions.
James Forest? I’m not sure what he has that so many rave about. There has been sacnt evidence of it for my liking. Ryan Fraser who left AFC was a more effective winger IMO. I’ve watched both enough to make that comparison. Fraser ran directly at opponents and took them on. He did this every time he got the ball. JF does not do this often enough.
I think a bigger part of the problem is that Celtic Park is not the intimidating venue it once was – we should be encouraging noisy young supporters to go their dinger – while ‘managing’ their behaviours to stay (just)within the rules – not alienating them.
Mention of Martin O’Neil and Gordon Strachan as templates both worry me for different reasons. O’Neil nearly killed us financially but was the kind of leader I adored having. I’m 47 and I would say it was my favourite period as a fan. Strachan may have reaped more trophies but imo he cast the die for managerial subservance and the down grading of quality of which today’s team is a direct legacy.
Celtic are between a rock and a hard place – we can’t attract or afford the players required for Champion’s League and we have no real challenge domestically over a season.
We have a great young inexperienced manager who is learning all aspects of a very demanding post – only the hardest of critics would not concede Lenny has matured tremendously in his managerial approach. Yes he could do better with tactics – I think he will. He is however hampered by the ‘projects’ approach we need to take as there is a constant churn of our better players out of the team. This leads to stability issues. I’m not sure what our first 11 is….? Is anybody?
He probably also needs to be more ruthless in his succession planning – for me Sami has been a hero but I’d personally pay up his contract and move him on now. Scott Brown has not imo developed in to the role as Captain so he would go too.
However changing tactics, managers, recruitment strategies, captains.. will only achieve so much.. we need to change Leagues. I’m more convinced than ever we have simply outgrown Scottish football and the Board should be more focussed on this than anything else, certainly than cosying up to SFA.
dontbrattbakkinanger
13:53 on 11 February, 2014
On subject of qualifiers, is Murrayfield pitch going to be fixed in time for visit of Famous Glasgow Celtic?
I don’t enjoy the prospects of our Euro -hopes restin’ in the armless hands of a bunch of ole nematodes.
~~~~~~~~~~**~~~~~~~~~~
Judging by the s**t served up on Saturday,the pitch should be first class.
Good to have you back,btw. Much missed.
WC
Mourinho’s plan was dead easy: With 3 at the back, our first centre half always covered for the wing back, the other two moving across one. This left a huge hole on the other side of our defence. Mourinho’s tactic was to attack beyond the wing back on one side, then switch the play to the space on the other.
Worked a treat for the first 2 goals.
Faulting Rab Douglas for the first is rather harsh to say the least – he’s saved well and pushed the ball away from the goal. It ought to have been safe, but our defenders were slow to cover.
The third goal though, was pretty much Rab’s fault, and he says as much himself.
Crikey, we’re still analysing that game to death……has noone got any news on the sevco demise…..get your priorities right FGS….. :)
We have no absolute right to win games and some we’ll lose. Aberdeen played well and strong against a solid game plan. They pressed very high up the pitch and were in our faces throughout the game. In some senses two other cup winners is part of a healthy non-armageddon scenario.
However, relying on two regular midfielders against five is a losing hand we have played many times under Neil. It was obvious after 20 minutes that, although a goal to the good, we had lost the middle of the park. Neil has in the past responded to this and stiffened to our advantage. For some reason on Saturday he chose not to.
I agree that our lone forward received very little service, simply because we had lost the middle of the park. James was posted missing in the first half, Sammi did little and Chris was not on his best form. With three players contributing little to a lost mid it is still baffling why a change to strengthen wasn’t taken. By getting more control of the mid we would have created more for the forward(s). We only needed one goal to be back in it but failed to carve the opportunities necessary.
Failure to adapt killed us off. Seeking to kill off any players or the manager on the back of that looks on the hysterical end of the spectrum.
HH
THE HONEST MISTAKE
Tried to mail my attempt at an answer,seems to be not accepting anything. Probably because I am wrong!
Strictly speaking,a booking for ungentlemanly behaviour. But since the keeper prevented the offence,a warning should suffice.
Btw,pity you had to introduce a newbie on Saturday. Tell him it does get better!
‘Democratic Capitalism is a myth’
*bait to lure Philvisreturns*
Jobo
Snow in lower East Kilbride.
Our two best domestic performances this season were the back to back away wins at Tynecastle in the cup (7-0) & Fir Park (5-0). In both games we had Forster in goals, our strongest back four of Lustig, Ambrose, Van Dijk & Izaguirre, and a midfield diamond with Mulgrew at the base and Ledley on the left in both games and Stokes up front in both games. At Tynecastle Biton was to the right of the diamond and Brown at the point with Commons as 2nd striker, whilst at Fir Park Brown moved to the right of the diamond, Commons dropped deeper and Pukki partnered Stokes up front.
No wingers, no Forrest, no Samaras, no Boerrigter.
A formation that seemed to get the best out of the players available, rather than a formation to get the manager’s favourite individuals into the team.
It allowed our full backs to bomb forward, gave our central defence protection, gave us numbers in midfield to dominate and still allowed us two men up front.
Tactics only work if the players follow them and play to close to their potential, and tactics may change for specific games or during a game if things are not going to plan but surely the formation/tactics for these 2 games should be our start point for most games, tinker with personnel by all means but keep that shape and we will dominate most SPFL games.
Kayal33
I loved that diamond formation.
When will we see the likes again……..?
Shame, damn shame.
Right, sammi and Forrest injured to start next weekend.