There are a bunch of Norwegian journalists walking around Glasgow today asking, “What, they cheated all those years? What are the FA going to do with them?” So many titles, so many trophies. Then they ask about tonight’s crucial Europa League game between Celtic and Molde.
I have concerns for tonight. Jozo Simunovic looks unlikely to feature, a fresh injury on the back of a lengthy injury absence. Dedryck Boyata and Mikael Lustig are definite starters, but you can perm any two from four for the other two places. Uncertainty in defensive selection is seldom regarded as a positive.
What I’m really hoping for is a tight game. One where we protect our penalty box and allow Molde to make the mistakes. They did this when Kris Commons pounced two weeks ago, so there’s every expectation they are far from impregnable, but Molde will have examined the mountain of evidence which suggests you can sucker Celtic in and hit them on the break.
If we keep it tight, we’ll win. If we try to sweep Molde off the park, as Fenerbahce did in Istanbul, any result is possible.
Late yesterday we ran an article on the boundary Lord Nimmo Smith’s SPL Commission put on their ruling. It’s worth a reprise today:
The Commission wrote:
“The Tax Tribunal has held (subject to appeal) that Oldco was acting within the law in setting up and operating the EBT scheme.
“The SPL presented no argument to challenge the decision of the majority of the Tax Tribunal and Mr McKenzie (solicitor acting on behalf of the SPL) stated expressly that for all purposes of this Commission’s Inquiry and Determination the SPL accepted that decision as it stood, without regard to any possible appeal by HMRC.
“Accordingly we proceed on the basis that the EBT arrangements were lawful. What we are concerned with is the fact that the side letters issued to the Specified Players, in the course of the operation of the EBT scheme, were not disclosed to the SPL and the SFA as required by their respective rules”
Lord Nimmo Smith was clear: the possibility that Rangers operated an illegal tax scheme did not enter his consideration as to whether the sum total of their activities amounted to a sporting advantage.
The SFA’s Sandy Bryson, in evidence to the Commission, saw no sporting advantage in an administrative lapse over an otherwise legal tax arrangement, albeit a lapse which the Commission found to be deliberate.
The question of a deliberate falsification of submissions to the SFA and SPL over an illegal scheme designed to prevent the payment of tens of millions of pounds of tax, has not been considered.
Ignore the PR coming out of Hampden today that this matter has been dealt with. Former directors of Rangers brought the game into serious disrepute, and their friends still walk the corridors of Hampden, but it’s the clubs who will have the final say on what and who is investigated, not a PR man, or football body chief executive.
It is critically important that fans of all clubs let their custodians know their feelings on this matter. Celtic pushed themselves to the brink of what was financially responsible during the EBT years. This cost our club the opportunity of building a sustainable strategy (like we’ve been building since Rangers liquidation).
More than this, the division and recrimination amount the support as we pulled back from spending ever-more, while Sir David Murray’s splashed inordinate amounts of cash, never completely resolved.
Had Rangers been submitting legal tax returns, the entire landscape of what was possible for others in Scottish football would have changed. Hearts, not Celtic, were the biggest financial losers of this fiasco (figures next week), but dozens of others lost out on cup runs, trophies and higher prize money.
Right now those in power at Hampden have no idea what the clubs will demand of them, they do not even have plans to discipline those who brought the game into such complete disrepute. If the clubs want to put honesty and integrity at the heart of our game, they can do so. I know one club who will put this case very forcefully.
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An Tearmann
When a Tax Avoidance scheme is deemed to have been illegal, does it not become Tax evasion, and thus, a criminal offence?
I sent this to John Paul Talor this morning, pointless sitting on your arse blaming others, may a s well let the club know where I stand, hopefully I’m not alone.
I sent this off to John Paul Taylor this morning, pointless sitting on yer arse moaning right?
I’m sure you’ve been a busy boy today JP, so as a Celtic supporter I’m not interested in the tainted trophies they won, I don’t want them let’s make that clear, but to have been cheated out of the ones wee and every club in Scotland competed for, and they are still attributed to them is not on, in my opinion they should be stripped of them, and then we all move on, but to think that we all move on now with nothing done is not on, I would like to know the clubs stance, I know it would be silly for us as a club to go it alone, and that other clubs need to be involved to show that it’s not just a Celtic-Rangers thing, that will get us no where, surely the club are in some sort of dialogue with other clubs in the SPFL ?
For this to go unpunished without even a mention from us or other clubs would mean that all the clubs and us are condoning there behaviour, for Celtic and the rest of scottish football to stand up and take our game to where it should be, honest, open, a level playing field would surely only advance our game, if not then there is a word that should never be used when talking about Scottish Football, and that word is integrity, and for a cheat to profit and have no punishment sends out all the wrong messages, let’s hope we never go down that road.
Your’s in Celtic.
Tony Donnelly.
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/nimmo-smith-commission-noted-unlawful-tax-affairs-beyond-their-remit/comment-page-8/#comment-2711497
Celtic Research twitter feed is making for compulsive viewing and listening.
They have posted a sound cloud recording of that wee R. Sole Chick Young spinning on shortbread on behalf of Campbell Ogilvie roughly 3 years ago;
Chick claimed-
“Campbell hasn’t benefited personally from EBTs and didn’t deal with contracts”;
“Poor Campbell is being targeted maliciously because he is head if the SFA and was at Rangers”;
“The tax issue hasnt been settled yet and who knows, rangers may yet be found to have been hugely efficient in their tax affairs” (ha ha!)
Celtic research have then posted a broadcast from the following night’s edition of shortbread where Chick is forced to admit that Ogilvie did in fact receive an ebt but is less than “tommo” (Stephen Thompson ex Hun forward and professional zombie shortbread cheerleader?) spends on a night out!
Throughout both broadcasts Chick sounds outraged, indignant and emotionally wrought that people who dare question his pal Campbell. It is biased toadying ass licking toenails journalism of the lowest and most depraved form.
Our licence fees should not subsidise and pay for a platform for tax dodgers and cheats to lie, deflect and cover-up.
Chick Young should be sacked for this gross misconduct.
http://www.thedailyepl.com/#/sfa/4591012246
Campbell getting it in the neck.
Jobo
Forgot I was going straight from work and no magic coat.
However, 4-0
Good Afternoon.
Consider this.
Yesterday a court of law very clearly declared that all of the arrangements made by Rangers Football Club for the best part of a decade in relation to EBT payments were de facto contractual and related to the employment of certain individuals.
As we now know, HMRC assessed the unpaid tax on the payments made to players, managers and officials in terms of these schemes as something in the region of £49 Million pounds.
If I pause there, this then means, that over the period of that decade the Rangers accounts ( whether profit or loss in any given year ) were underdeclared in terms of financial value by that same £49 Million pounds.
De Facto, at the end of the period Rangers PLC was £49 Million poorer.
However, the position does not end there.
In the course of the evidence, it is clearly found and stated that no provision was made in any set of Rangers PLC accounts at any time, for the funding of the so called trusts. In other words, when filling in the figures for the year on year liabilities, Rangers omitted to include any sums that they were DUE to pay players, managers, Directors or whatever.
They did indeed include a figure in the accounts retrospectively which said that in the course of the financial year they had made a payment to certain trusts – but that was supposedly on a discretionary basis and with no tax or NIC being deducted.
That is very different to stating clearly what your legal obligations are.
Accordingly, year on year, every set of accounts sent to the Scottish Football Association or the Scottish Premier League in terms of their licensing and governance regulations by Rangers Football Club were inaccurate and did not disclose the true financial position.
It also follows that every single licence so granted to that football club was granted on the basis of false information knowingly supplied by the then directors and officials of that football club.
Some of those directors and officials have gone on to hold positions of authority within the SFA.
Further, in relation to the Wee Tax Case — HMRC accused Rangers PLC of deliberately submitting false PAYE returns in respect of their players over a number of years – going back I believe to 2000. Rangers PLC did not challenge that assertion.
Varioud companies and individuals traded with Rangers PLC relying on the basis of the stautorily available information namely their officially lodged accounts and their stated and publicly available Memorandum and Articles of Association which state quite clearly that Rangers PLC is de facto one and the same as Rangers Football Club.
That position was formally and fully adopted by the original subscribers and formers of Rangers Football Club.
The SFA and the SPL accepted accounts and financial information from Rangers PLC as if that company was Rangers Football Club and relied on the accuracy and veracity of the accounts which were signed off by regulated and professionally qualified Auditors.
Both governing bodies made decisions, granted licences, awarded points, titles and cups on the basis that each year they are given and were given accurate financial statements by Rangers Football Club.
Eevery other football team in Scotland entered into competitions on the basis that Rangers Football Club had fully disclosed all contracts and financials in good faith in the same way that they had.
It would now appear, that the financials which were provided were never accurate nor submitted in good faith since at least 1998 and that whoever submitted the financials concerend was not in fact Rangers Football Club at all.
Quid Iuris?
Absolutely no apologies to those who see the following as another bit of quonno Board Bashing.
Paul,
Assuming that you have his ear, you might like to ask DD the following.
Could he name any other branch of his business activities where he would allow himself and his associates — as Celtic shareholders and SB purchasers, many of us are his associates — to be stiffed on a systematic and systemic basis.
In doing so, he would do well to remember that the stiffing was done by a great club with a magnificent history, whose supporters he was recently equating to those of Celtic.
Remove The Tainted Titles
It’s time for fans of all of Scotland’s clubs to work together. We must all pressure on our clubs to seek action from the authorities, It’s worked before …
We need a Scottish solution to a scoddish problem……………….
Paul 67
Please feel free to pass this submission on to Peter Lawell and our board.
I turned 52 last week.
Like many tens of thousands I have followed Celtic home and away,through thick and thin.
Celtic are my drug of choice and have been for about 45 years.
I do not believe that Celtic have a divine right to win at all costs.
As a Celtic supporter I want the club the make maximise it’s revenue streams,balanced with a social/charitable ethos.
I want the club to maximise it’s profits ,and the use of it’s resources,so that it can afford to put the best possible team on the park.
This was not possible during the years that the Oldco Rangers cheated the taxman ,and there competitors.
Celtic lost tens of millions of pounds in revenue from loss of CL prize money ,that the financially doped Oldco Rangers gained.
As a shareholder and supporter it is simply not acceptable that Celtic do not seek compensation for this loss.
It may not be financially viable for Celtic to recover lost revenues from the Oldco,but I believe that it is essential that they seek to have the titles and trophies that we were cheated out off awarded to those clubs that were cheated.
On an emotional level as a Celtic supporter ,I was distraught every time we finished second to Oldco Rangers.
It is the least I expect from our board ,that they should support me and those like me who suffered the pain of being cheated.
We have no real voice other that to stop supporting Celtic,if we feel that we are being let down ,by those who should be our greatest supporter,namely our board of directors.
I have no power to get recompense ,our board does.
We should also fight this same club nonsense .
As a minimum standard I fully expect out board to take every necessary step to have the titles awarded to all those runner ups that were cheated.
TT
In Scotland, doing SFA is no longer tenable…………..
Truth and Reconciliation required if the game is to be rehabilitated.
HH
Since yesterday has Mark Hately made any comment on tainted trophies.
If not why are the media not asking his views on such matters?
Stripping Trophies, not titles, and who’s is to say we are the rightful owners, who knows what would have happened had they not cheated, as has been said, others would have had more to invest had they not been cheated, not just Celtic.
Leave the cheating years blank.
Take the titles off them. Cheating Hun Bassas. Damn their history forever.
An online petition might be the best way to garner publicity and support to pressurize the beaks.
A multi-club petition, preferably started by a supporter of another club rather than one of us. A good six-figure signatory would be impossible for the SMSM to ignore.
Auldheid 12:43
I think i Luuuuuuuuuuv you:))))
luv = wanting the very best for someone (so an old monk told me) :))))))
Being a club ARMED WITH THE FACTS,thanks to yourself ,BRTH, canamalar ,Morrisey23rd and others, imho I feel we have a moral obligation to lead the fight for justice for all clubs,issue every club in scotland the same hard drive info you gave the SMSM journos and ask them and their fans to join us.
cmon you bhoys in green
nearly time to let the people sing.
till later all.
TT
…………..52!!!!!!!!!
You must have had some paper round when you were a boy!
;)
HH
have a great day Celts.of to organise a few things before heading up to see Celtic hope to bump into a few o you at integrity corner :-)
Auldheid.Thanks. infinite patience eh :-)
Celtic graves in Donegal https://twitter.com/clancyc06/status/662249943898394624
To all,raise a glass
Celtic
Celtic go to work
Beatbhoy. you are correct,Doh! evasion-thats what i meant to embolden.HH :-) i will repost
a pint for you :-)
TinyTim on 5th November 2015 1:26 pm
It may not be financially viable for Celtic to recover lost revenues from the Oldco, –
What about the SFA of which Olco was a member.
See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/molde-concerns-lns-commission-action-from-clubs-needed/comment-page-2/#comment-2711517
Paul67 –
” I know one club who will put this case very forcefully.”
Is it Raith Rovers?
Ach I was jokin’! Please don’t ban me…
:-)))
I canny be arsed listening, for evermore about tainted titles.
If they are stripped and reissued from the highest level then fair do’s.
But I also have no problem explaining to my grandkids in years to come what aw them wee asterisks mean.
They need to be stripped of the illegally won titles in the interests of justice and to prevent a similar thing happening again.
It was EBTs before; in the future it could be some of other form of tax and bill dodging or phoenixing.
They haven’t learnt from their mistakes judging by the way Sevco is being run.
Taking back the trophies and cups that were never rightfully theirs should be a given in order for Scottish football to grow out of its big pair of clown shoes that it’s worn proudly since 1988.
Leftie…………..
with respect I think that if our great club is seen to be leading this – the tipping point will never be reached and the sleekits will continually deflect this national outrage into a convenient faux rebellious and bellicose “Ol’Firrum” issue easily denigrated, easily marginalised and easily ignored………..
That’s what they want – to ignore this and be allowed to move on…………
Scotland needs to stop this.
HH
Tony Donnelly and others – we need to hold our fire on asking Celtic to take action here. The Appeal process has not run its course – either BDO or Sir Minty could decide to take this to the Supreme Court.
BDO probably won’t as they don’t actually stand to lose or gain anything – they are only affected by having to divvy out their creditor pot amongst a bigger list.
Sir Minty may well do however – remember he is an EBT recipient so HMRC may end up coming after him for a large amount of money.
So the fat lady is clearing her throat but she hasn’t yet sung.
Celtic and the other clubs MUST lobby hard for very strong action to be taken here.
I, along with tens of thousands of others, paid my hard earned cash to watch my team losing out on titles and Champions League revenue due to the systematic cheating of those devious BASTARDS who unquestionably gained an unfair sporting advantage thanks to their illegal tax evasion. Titles must be stripped or the game’s a bogey. Ogilvie’s continuing presence on the 6th floor of Hampden quite simply beggars belief.
Peter, you cannot let us down on this.
Good luck to the Celts tonight. It won’t be an easy watch because this is a win to live another day moment for us in the Europa League. Wet eyes again guaranteed, for good or ill.
Celtic forever. The only show in town.
And asking the well-intentioned, good bloke, fellow supporter JPT to lead the charge within Celtic imo is pardon the paraphrasing,…………..like a drunk using a lampost………he will give support but little illumination.
This is much bigger than Celtic and much bigger than Scotland.
HH
BANKIEBHOY1
Thats why we must arm the other clubs with all (well most) of the facts we have on the case and ogilvie and move toether in a united effort to clean up or sport from the stains left by Scotlands shame,
united we stand, divided we fall ,n awwwww that.
have a great day/ night BB, and thank you for making me smile often.
offski this time
let the people sing their stories and their songs.
A young man from Glasgow has been named Citizen of the Year in a county in rural Virginia, USA.
A very short piece from us
Tony’s Huddle is bigger than we thought.
http://wp.me/p6DYht-or
Thanks to all of you on CQN for your unfailing support
No One Walks Alone
BEATBHOY on 5TH NOVEMBER 2015 1:03 PM
Bada Bing!!
“P67- I hope you are hinting at Celtic taking the bull by the horms here……”
Ouch! Sounds painful, big man!
*horns ;]
I think if you read some of the best posters on this site,enough is enough.We need leadership now,a lot of guys future commitment to actually going to support Celtic is at stake now.We cannot accept as a football club,playing in a rigged league,with cheats at the helm,and not do anything about it . I think it will take a Euro team who were beaten by the cheats and cost them CL money,to take it up with UEFA,only then will we see Baldrick come out from under his desk,on Hampden’s 6th floor.HH
The sfa and spl acted after the first tribunal when they found in the huns favour 2-1, they can act now that they have been found to have cheated the game, but they won’t unless pressurised.
As ever it will be down to the fans, I don’t believe their is the will to rock the boat from the clubs, sadly, and I’m not too convinced that the will is there from the fans either.
I can’t understand why uefa haven’t taken an interest in the goings on of this member country . Now I believe that they may have issues of there own , but I still find there non interest very strange . The same with SSN , normally on the ball regards Sevco news . Has Jim White more power than we thought .
RWE
WOWWWWWW
be proud sir what an incredible bhoy and family.
hail hail & N.O.W.A.
Phyllis Dietrichson,
Any idea how long BDO or Murray have to lodge any appeal?
RWE
Wonderful news!
Brought a tear to my eye.
Take care and thanks for posting.
At a cottage door one wintry night
As the snow lay on the ground
A youthful Irish soldier boy
To the mountain he was bound
His mother stood beside him saying
“You’ll win my boy don’t fear”
And with loving arms around his waist
She tied a bandolier