Someone kindly directed me to the audio file from BBC Radio Scotland’s Sportsound programme last night. Under recent scrutiny for his role, while general secretary and director of Rangers, in the alleged improper registrations of Rangers players with the SFA, he gave BBC reporter, Chick Young his thoughts on the matter.
While the BBC gave a robust defence of Mr Ogilvie stating that he was not in any way guilty of wrong-doing in relation to tax matters, which I am happy to accept, the entire debate never touched the question which has the potential to invalidate over a decade’s worth of football results.
Article 12.1 of the SFA’s Articles of Association states, “all payments, whether made by the club or otherwise, which are to be made to a player solely relating to his playing activities must be fully recorded”. The redacted EBT agreement published last month by The Sun suggested Rangers would pay the player £1200 appearance money.
The SFA should have no interest in whether tax is due on this money, which is a matter for HM Revenue and Customs, they should only be concerned as to whether Rangers submitted details to the SFA of any payments made in connection to football, including appearance money.
My Young, perhaps trying to help, explained that Mr Ogilvie, as company secretary until 2002, had administrative responsibilities, but took on a legislative role on becoming general secretary that year. This suggests Mr Ogilvie had primary responsibility to ensure Rangers complied with the necessary legislative requirements, including registering payments to players.
Should have mentioned earlier, Mr Young suggested Rangers EBTs “could actually prove, bizarrely, to be one of the great coups of all time”.
He’s not wrong there.
We will address comments by Sir David Murray, widely reported this morning, later.
242 Comments- Pages:
- «
- 1
- 2
- 3
- 4
- 5
- 6
- 7
- »
Paul and all
PL met with supporter groups yesterday evening . will find out tonight if there is anything that can be shared openly.
ta
kikinthenakas
Aye, Killie will be in yellow and we’ll be in green/grey 3rd kit.
Both home kits clash, as do both away kits so due to the virtue of having a 3rd kit, we have to wear it.
Mort
I reckon Ogilvie could be the key to all of this. He knows where the bodies are buried and others are worried about what he might say, hence the circling of the wagons around him.
Perhaps if/when he goes then he takes others with him.
Keep at him Celts, he’s shaking like a blueknighting dog.
No7,
Reading that again I realise my tone may come across as a bit harsh. It was not intended that way. Just trying to say keep the head up man..the battle’s not over.
HH
Top 50?
Anyway,re. this latest bit of hun gimmickry with the red & black colours:
Stendahl wrote a book called ‘Le Rouge et Le Noir’,the colours representing the army & the church. Is it remotely possible that der hun could be making a subconscious statement with regard to their self-perception and sense of ‘entitlement’,and the belief (apparent in Salmond’s statement) that they are Scotland’s premier ‘establishment’ team?
In a way,I would like to think so. Then I think,nah,they’re a bunch of thugs from Govan; irony is beyond them.
Mort & greenmaestro
Once everything is eventually done and dusted, I am convinced that this whole sorry saga of the club/company formerly known as Rangers FC will become standard reference material in a variety of academic disciplines; for many years to come.
Wishingmylifeaway.CSC
Mort
Thanx, canny see the clash masel, and I am colour blind, off out to the golf.
Paul 67 ..
Hector needs to prove that the relevant EBT’s were implemented wrongly . That might be easier said than done .
Thoughts of Hector being stiffed might be balanced out by the prospect of the likes of Ogilvie and those mendacious charlatans at the SFA getting what is so rightfully theirs..
We will see.
Rangers, Annual Report June 2000
“The Board of Directors meets frequently throughout the year and comprises three Executive and six Non-executive members. The Board is responsible for the overall Group strategy and monitors the executive management. Financial policy and budgets, including major capital expenditure, are approved and monitored by the Board. Key operational decisions including safety, planning and appointment of advisors are subject to board approval. The Chairman and the Board have access to the advice and services of the Company Secretary who is an Executive member of the Board.”
“The Directors are responsible for keeping proper accounting records, for safeguarding the assets of the Group and for taking reasonable steps for the prevention and detection of fraud and other irregularities.”
Step Forward Campbell Ogilivie, Executive Director, Company Secretary and Shareholder in Rangers Football Club plc.
Now Chick, you were saying?
The Battered Bunnet on 14 March, 2012 at 11:14 said:
Chick-mate!
Stumbled across real radio last night whilst driving, don’t normally listen.
A caller phoned to suggest Celtic fans/pundits lacked integrity for wanting league titles stripped.
BFDJ said this would DEFINITELY not happen. Yet when discussing tax cheating he said ‘this was still to be proved’.
It was very much – calm down rankers fans, everything will be fine.
It’s funny that their club is in the wrong, but we are getting a hell of a lot of attention for our ‘gloating’.
Eh, I think we are entitled to seeing as we’ve been cheated for decades!
Don’t think I’ll tune in again soon, I’ll just enjoy the treble instead :)
OG
should I clear my diary for Monday afternoon?
nakas
info from Celtic twitter or whatever it is…
“all payments, whether made by the club or otherwise, which are to be made to a player solely relating to his playing activities must be fully recorded”
Was the appearance money not only a part of the payments defined in the second contract, with another figure also quoted? How does this fit in with having to declare payments that are soley related to playing activities?Perhaps Rangers will claim the players also coached the young ‘uns so it was not solely about their employment as footballers…
QB
According to Chick Young, Campbell Ogilvie as Secretary at Rangers wasno more than a member of the typing pool for years before he got promoted and was allowed to book train tickets for the boss.
I find it difficult to read/ hear the various on/off the record statements without remembering this:
“When I use a word,” Humpty Dumpty said, in rather a scornful tone, “it means just what I choose it to mean—neither more nor less.”
Could someone tell SDM (and associated pressmen) that it is logically impossible for Rangers to have both:
A) Properly registered players with the SFA; and
B) Made proper use of the EBT.
At best it is one or the other, although most likely neither.
To win the EBT case, the payments to players must be shown to be non-contractual, discretionary and made by a third party. If this is the case, these payments by definition must not have been declared by Rangers to the SFA.
If the payments were declared to the SFA then they were clearly contractual, non-discretionary and not from a third party.
QED.
blantyretim,11:18,
No, as Monday afternoon will be busy, as will Tuesday. Though there may be some moments of pleasure to be had between now and then
I wonder if Chico woke up this morning thinking what the feck did I say on the radio…
This one will come back to haunt Chico that’s nailed on…
Starry
I understand Murray’s position is that as the EBT’s were disclosed in the Annual Report that is sufficient disclosure as it is a public document. I dont know if these reports are routinely studied by the SFA/SPL. Also the word “solely” may prove to be a get out for him and Ogilvie.
OG
thank you… o))
HT/CT/Che
whats happening down Gallowgate on Saturday?
Its a job for Inspector Cliche
Hail hail cqn
As the sfa and msm circle the wagons,minty claims it was grant thorton and mike McGill that it was legal to pay plays with a side letter on an ebt.all the while r c ogilvie tells chic dung that it was not his responsibility to submit contract details to the sfa when he was at ra gers.
Then who was it ?
What name is on the signed off contract submitted to the sfa?
Could Neil Doncaster answer a simple question for once?
Who submitted the rANGERs document neil?
Digginaholetaehidein csc
“payments […] to be made to a player solely relating to his playing activities” – this is generally held to include training, playing in matches, attending matches if not selected, appearing in press conferences and so on, i.e. everything that a player does as part of his employment at the club as a football player.
An example that would fall outside this would be if you were a player/manager, then payments made for managerial duties would not need to be included, similarly if you held any other dual role at the club, such as player/kitman, player/physio or player/bus driver. By coincidence such joint roles might be on the increase over Ibrox way in the weeks and months to come.
You cannot argue with the veracity of this from Frankie Boyle on Twitter
Know how a scientist looks at some excited ants in a jar? You are the ants, the scientist is Starbucks. Lap up the paste & go back to work.
My better-half asked me at the weekend if I wanted to go to Greece for a holiday.
I told her I didn’t really want to go to Greece even though I know by doing so we could in a very small way contribute something to their economy. I feel sorry for the Greeks.
I suggested if we can’t find somewhere else to go in Europe then maybe we could think about it. But we’ll weigh up our options and then make a joint decision.
A friend phones me up this morning and says I hear you’re definitely off to Greece for a fortnight…
All of the above is a lie, but then my wife is not as stupid as Alasdair Lamont is.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/17364884
BT
Gay Pride Merch :-)))
An example that would fall outside this would be if you were a player/manager, then payments made for managerial duties would not need to be included, similarly if you held any other dual role at the club, such as player/kitman, player/physio or player/bus driver. By coincidence such joint roles might be on the increase over Ibrox way in the weeks and months to come
Reminds of pictures from the Daily Record in the 60’s and 70’s with players carrying a net filled with balls or sitting behind the wheel of a bus with hampden taped to the windscreen
-)
Hugh Taylor CSC
need to phone oldtim then…… o))
BTW
that was on when we where in krakow with Zbyszek…
we retired to the nearest pub…
Chico’s Book of Ethics: Its only wrong if you get caught. If someone lets you do it then do it. If you get caught deny it. If you do it and you don’t get caught then it is a good thing. If the worst comes to the worst: blame someone else: “It wisnae me- honest!”
Morality for the 21st Century.
Is it any wonder the huns are the most corrupt organization in Scottish history when you have muppet apologists like Chico the Clown (not even a good “funny” one) making inane remarks like he did last night?
ht,
I hear the gay pride march is being fronted by the orange walk this year to show solidarity with them in their dispute the the RC church :oD)))
The George Costanza defense:
It’s not a lie if you believe it.
so where are the tips for the chelt donkeys today
The Battered Bunnet on 14 March, 2012 at 11:20 said:
“According to Chick Young, Campbell Ogilvie as Secretary at Rangers wasno more than a member of the typing pool ….”
Wrong again Chic ….. Mrs McKay does the typing.
“And did we tell you the name of the game, boy
We call it ‘ Riding the gravy train’ ”
Come in Mr Young and have a cigar.
HH
This whole situation reminds me of a bad movie about corruption…something like Cop Land…we Tims are like the Sylvester Stallone character ( that disnae sound right)…maybe that should be Serpico ( Al Pacino sounds better).
Neil Canamalar:
But they will only march behind them!
SFA Rules of Player Registration
Rule 4
Such agreement shall be signed by the player and by the secretary [that’ll be Campbell..] and shall be witnessed by 2 other parties and lodged with the Secretary [of the SFA] together with the Form.
Murray sells rangers to Whyte (with Possible £75m tax liability and an already issued wee tax bill of a few million pounds)
With no merchandising chain etc etc etc for £1.00
And HE says HE was duped?????
Bwaaaaaaaaahahshaaaaaaaaaaaa