Last month Russell Martin told the media that his mum called him worried about how he is coping in Glasgow (just fine, apparently). That may reassure her, but not even Mrs Martin will believe her son can win the title this season. Dreams of their son taking the league from Celtic this season are the reserve of Mrs McInnes, who like Mrs Thelin a year ago, must be entertaining the great fantasy.
Hearts fans know better than to indulge in such thoughts. Not until the last whistle of the season is blown and perhaps a few minutes later (in case VAR spots something) would they get their hopes up, the shadow of Albert Kidd still casts over Tynecastle. Hearts fans are conditioned by their past, they have no reference for their present opportunity.
If they are not a genuine challenger this season, they will be soon. Last season they finished seventh in the Premiership, having dismissed two permanent managers and seen the campaign out with an interim boss. The appointment of Derek McInnes and a total summer spend of £2.6m is all that’s happened since. That’s how little money and managerial brilliance their transformation has taken.
That £2.6m was guided by Tony Bloom’s Jamestown Analytics, McInnes was not the decision maker. Like Hearts fans’ conditioning, analytics are backward looking. They cannot tell you what fortune lies ahead in a game which involves so much good and bad fortune (thinking Jota’s injury here). They have a go at predicting how a player will cope away from home, but that data is limited on this and many other subjects. Mistakes are be made.
Notwithstanding that, analytics is the future. Clubs who maximise their development will ruthlessly rely on data. Those anchored to the manager’s agent network, experienced scouts and ‘an eye for a player’ will perish. Successful clubs will harvest players before they have a successful profile (thinking Oh Hyeon-gyu here), they will never compete with Ajax for a deadline day signing (sigh).
It is possible for Celtic to implode for various reasons but I seriously doubt anyone can put a glove on us this season. If, though, you ever want to see the fabled 10, there is a lot of work to do. Teams who lose reorientate a lot faster than winners. That will happen and Tynecastle and Ibrox with some urgency each season until they win. We are entitled to enjoy laughing at the folly of others (have a word with yourself if you think otherwise), but the challenge is in the post. Not only from Tynecastle.
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A team that swims together sinks together.
Tontine Tim on 16th September 2025 8:59 pm
Chairbhoy on 16th September 2025 8:47 pm
Fritzsong @ 8:22 pm, Yes, very good points. We are running a good business but the priorities of Celtic Football Club for August were pretty darn clear. From the outside, it looks like the UCL-Q was an after thought by the hierarchy.
*knowing what we know now does anybody think that mibbees the board realised that we are really a Europa Cup side and so planned for this, now I’m no a conspiracy believer but just mibbees, especially after watching Ange achieve it last season with a piss poor spurs side, and also reflecting what MON achieved in the same tourney
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In the economic reality The Board occupy that supporters do not I would not be the least surprised if The Board thought this a chance to play at a level we can be competitive in.
However the EL has some good teams but if we have Rangers luck and avoid them, who is to say how far Celtic can go.
Istanbul is a distance mind you.
“The pity is that no one involved could or should declare their hand during the process and unfortunately by the end of it things have become so toxic and entrenched that few would listen anyway”.
None should have had a hand to declare, they should have been on the same hymn sheet.
I go back to a simple decision tree that should have been thought about 6-12 months ago:
Offer a new contract: yes/no
Will he sign: yes/no
If the answer to either of these questions was no you knew what was coming given his previous.
Unfortunately the bandwagon is rolling, the pitchforks are sharpened and the mob are on a witch hunt.
he Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 8:04 pm
Re the 70k I read that on my phone as 70% so ignore that reference but the rest I stand by and The Membership Service comes with a communication model that will work unless the mistrust the various support or individuals gets in the way.
Point 1 is the purpose of Celtic.
Over a large number I think a predominant consensus on purpose would emerge .
The question after that is will any activity further that purpose or not.
It is because there is no means of establish that purpose that division occurs.
An agreed purpose by all parties after listening to each other in the true spirit of dialogue is how to close the divide.
Why after all these years does CQN not have an edit function?
Is it a stupid thing to ask a player to run 60 yards 10 or more times per game when a blootered pass would get there much quicker?
Look what happened to Ange’s players at Spurs, half the team injured for half the season because of all of the unnecessary running.
Sometimes, the fullbacks can take two steps forward and play long diagonal balls to the edge of the opposition box, look at the amount of balls over the top that Bobby Lennox and Jinky, Dixie, Harry Hood, Lou Macari, King Kenny, Paul Wilson, Joe McBride, Joe Craig, Johnny Doyle, etc put away for us.
Nobody played more long balls than Andreas Pirlo from the D at the edge of his own box over the top of midfield and set Juventus strikers up with simple sensible balls into the danger areas.
Celtic ruled Europe playing with one centre half, and one sweeper, MON nearly won our 2nd European trophy playing with 3 big units at the back, and the King of Kings up front.
Wim Jansen might have surprised a few in the CL but was sacked before he got the chance, or jumped before he was sacked.
“The last thing I want is legitimacy for the Celtic support”.
No, sorry – YOU need legitimacy to represent the Celtic support.
I think that’s impossible, so suggested a way in which you could legitimately speak for season ticket holders.
Good result for Union Saint-Gilloise in the CL tonight despite operating with that “out-of-date” data system.
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM
As you know Auldheid, I immediately expressed alarm when I saw a mooted £70k spend on 2 “analysts” to track views on fan media.
======================
The idea there is to see patterns of discontent rising and why and after consideration by a representative group get a response from Celtic before what is based on misperceptions becomes factual. Like Celtic lied about FSR.
The idea there is the old one that the truth shall set you free.
So much of the discontent arises as a result
I might have gone overboard on the numbers but it is a function that a service representing a large number of supporters needs as opposed to it belonging to Celtic and they setting the agenda.
Everything about the idea is about giving the support a voice totally independent of Celtic that can do things that Celtic cannot.
That is covered in the CU podcast.
No Auldheid, your eyes didn’t deceive you.
Maybe mine did, but from what I saw there eas £70k for 2 “analysts” to trawl Celtic cyberspace.
How many penalties do Real Madrid get in the CL?
Auldheid 10.13.answer
‘In the economic reality The Board occupy that supporters do not I would not be the least surprised if The Board thought this a chance to play at a level we can be competitive in.’
It was kinda suggested last agm our bank balance is such that we drop to EL from CL we could cover it.i know prudent is the word but this now looks like planning to fail.
HH
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 10:30 pm
“The last thing I want is legitimacy for the Celtic support”.
No, sorry – YOU need legitimacy to represent the Celtic support.
I think that’s impossible, so suggested a way in which you could legitimately speak for season ticket holders.
================
Since I dont want to speak on behalf of season ticket holders it is not a legitimacy I seek.
So the question makes no sense to me. Never have given it a thought.
An Tearmann on 16th September 2025 10:43 pm
Auldheid 10.13.answer
‘In the economic reality The Board occupy that supporters do not I would not be the least surprised if The Board thought this a chance to play at a level we can be competitive in.’
It was kinda suggested last agm our bank balance is such that we drop to EL from CL we could cover it.i know prudent is the word but this now looks like planning to fail.
=================
Yup. I thought so too.
Whether it turns out be a failure is in the “we’ll see” territory.
!!Bada Bing!! on 16th September 2025 10:43 pm
How many penalties do Real Madrid get in the CL
As many as it takes to win a game 🤔🙄
PB- most are Sevco like
Croftcelt on 16th September 2025 10:38 pm
Good result for Union Saint-Gilloise in the CL tonight despite operating with that “out-of-date” data system.
£€$
I think their home strip is green and white hoops.
I’m sure they wore that strip against the huns in a preseason friendly, or maybe it was us can`t remember.
Big Jock would have had them at Parkhead for a friendly so that they would have experienced that unique Jungle reception, cheered on every time they touched the ball, then they would have told all their pals about this unbelievable place that they had just visited, then Celtic supporters clubs would be sprouting up in these places, as they enquired about this fairy story place in poor old Glasgow town.
“The idea there is to see patterns of discontent”??
£70k to “see patterns of discontent”??
Where do I sign?
I have time on my hands, am reasonably numerate and literate, and happy to sit on CQN from 12-2pm👍
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 10:42 pm
No Auldheid, your eyes didn’t deceive you.
Maybe mine did, but from what I saw there eas £70k for 2 “analysts” to trawl Celtic cyberspace.
==============
No they didn’t, believe me.
But on realising I had picked you up wrong I went back and finally realised you were referring to the model on the spreadsheet.
I’ve since responded to that.
The last thing I would want is put myself in a position where anything I say is misconstrued but it can happen.
Took me a while to get there but I see now where you were coming from.
I find that when I am puzzled by a comment it eventually is because of mis communication.
“Since I dont want to speak on behalf of season ticket holders it is not a legitimacy I seek.
So the question makes no sense to me. Never have given it a thought”.
Sorry, I’m confused. With all the stuff you write, who do you actually represent?
To represent anything you need legitimacy and I’ve suggested a way to attain that – your negotiating position is strengthened by representing something rather than nothing?
“ Took me a while to get there but I see now where you were coming from”.
No, it was clear in the notes 👍
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 10:54 pm
“The idea there is to see patterns of discontent”??
£70k to “see patterns of discontent”??
Where do I sign?
I have time on my hands, am reasonably numerate and literate, and happy to sit on CQN from 12-2pm👍
========================
The whole point of a “what if “spreadsheet is to let different scenarios to be explored and challenged and had you read the footnotes to the model you would have seen that explained.
As I said it is a function that lets supporters takes issues to Celtic rather then wait a year for an AGM.
The cost is to cover the function which can be done in other ways as suggested in the communication model.
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1uTbC5m713b3vkmiiH4cM4YMlaRpHUFgsttXYOsLbdOM/edit?usp=sharing
It is based on my experience of managing a web site for a number of years of mainly angry Americans with help from some of the contributors. It worked. It kept the group of contributors together.
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 11:07 pm
“ Took me a while to get there but I see now where you were coming from”.
No, it was clear in the notes 👍
==============
It could not have been that clear or we would not be discussing it ,but now we have can we leave it with this story.
Two men live side by side in semis and share a back garden.
A fence divides the gardens. It is dark green on one side and light green on the other.
Mr Dark Green thinks the fence is all dark green.
Mr Light Green thinks it is all light green.
It is only when they talk and Mr Dark Green invites Mr Light Green in to his garden that they discover the truth that the fence is dark green on one side and light green on the other.
As a result of sharing they are more enlightened than when they ignored each other.
It is time for Mr Celtic to invite Mr Celtic Cyberspace into his garden. It’s time to talk, time to trust.
Eile and predecessors,
I was sure you were the notorious Kev J until I noticed you have never mentioned George Galloway.
Unfortunately that wasn’t the link I saw.
Please post the links you put up following the Beer Hall Putsch🙏 It will save me going looking for it👍
For sure it may have been “what if”, but the concept of revealed preference is close my heart 😉
Sorry folks but I have to respond to The Blogger Formerly Known As GM
To represent anything you need legitimacy and I’ve suggested a way to attain that – your negotiating position is strengthened by representing something rather than nothing?
===============
This is not a negotiating matter. For it to be that I would have to have something or someone to negotiate with.
It is more about persuasion as described in the extract from the Dialogue Decalogue that in turn depends on trust.
The Blogger Formerly Known As GM on 16th September 2025 11:38 pm
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1ueh2IEHoSQk97H99mu2w4-VQpf7B483w/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=107947982974245186134&rtpof=true&sd=true
What do you mean by revealed concept?
Croftcelt 11.33
It is the multimoniker.
HH
Supporters need a leader and purpose.
In 1994 there was a Taylor report deadline for all seated stadium which Celtic didn’t resist because there were no more able and quality Celtic men like, Desmond White, at the club anymore.
NO Celtic board figure has since represented the traditional, ordinary, working class, Celtic-ness of the club, like DW.
DW, was accused of being tightfisted and mean, whilst he and his board allowed 30% of every crowd attending Parkhead, mainly school children, to be lifted over the turnstiles free of charge, and 50% of what remained from gate receipts, was given to visiting teams, so that there would actually be an opposition.
Even when games were all-ticket, a comradely blind eye was drawn over that aspect, as DW was acutely aware of the difficulties for Celtic families to bring up youngsters in the west of Scotland in those, Thatcher driven austerity times.
DW died in 1985 weeks after seeing Celtic lift the 100th Scottish Cup Final, which was big stuff in those days.
DW was also hated by the huns fans and they showed that in the first old firm game after DW was no longer with us, in a 1-1 draw at Parkhead before which, the entire Jungle almost exploded as the Rangers end held up a banner stating a horrible phrase from the Exorcist film, evil that the wee possessed girl said to the young Priest in that film about his Mother in hell.
The huns put up a banner with these horrible words, and the police had to charge into front of the Jungle at the huns end, as thousands of fans tried to knock down the metal mesh fence to get at the huns fans, and when seeing this, the huns tried to charge the Jungle at the same time.
As there was no drink allowed at that time, as a pitched riot would have happened imho.
The immediate anger from Celtic fans turning to rage was off the charts, and expressed how DW’s passing was being quietly digested by Celtic fans.
But DW dying left a weakness about Celtic’s ability to stand their ground off of the pitch, and when the huns brought in Souness, then the crooked David Murray, they quickly sussed the vulnerabilities across the city, and were undoubtedly behind the attempt, to get Thatcher to bring in all-seating and to put Celtic out of the game for not having an all-seated stadium, a weakness that saw Celtic under Fergus McCann continue to rig the gate receipts like the Ibrox Tories, Souness, and Murray had Championed.
Smaller teams, like Motherwell parked the bus and mugged the huns, and us, for going along with the hun gate receipts scam, and they didn’t like it, whilst Celtic were brainwashed into running up and down the pitch, leaving spaces for us to be mugged, from which nobody learned a thing, as manager after manager was sacked.
David Murray’s ego would have been traduced by DW, his alliance with Thatcher and her tricks would have been brutally resisted, and exposed by DW, and concentration would have quickly swung to police brutality against innocent Liverpool fans, disguised by lying news media as a tragic event, caused by dangerous football terraces.
DW would have woken a few non thinkers up as to what really happened at Hillsborough 1989, and WHY it happened.
DW had the ability to conjure up a resistance to Thatcher, in England from Celtic friendly clubs, that could have brought down the government, and Celtic would have been viewed through a different lens, especially in Ireland.
All seated scam would have been exposed as a capitalist scam, to pinch the working mans game by gas lighting through the bent media about, how all of a sudden, terraces were death traps, really?
And there would have been a statue of, DW outside Parkhead, no doubt in other places as well, of the man who saved football from the crooked banking cartels of London.
All it takes is for a leader to speak truth to power, and standing in his truth, fearlessly, like DW would have done.
DW was feared by the Scottish media, because he knew his stuff, and made sure that Celtic and its supporters were not misrepresented in any way, which was some feat in those days.
The night after we lost to Rapid Vienna at Old Trafford in 1984, home of then, Celtic’s great friends, Manchester United.
The BBC Reporting Scotland lady, Jane Franchi I think it was, asked DW about the events at Manchester, and should Celtic be worried about our hooligan element of fans?
DW said: “50,000 Celtic fans left from Glasgow and travelled to Old Trafford, in Manchester. 2 fans, based in England, managed to get onto the pitch, and both were exceptionally worse for the wear from alchohol. The Manchester Police Commissionaire contacted us this morning, and said they were over the moon with the behaviour of the Celtic supporters and, that they would be warmly welcomed back to Manchester, in the future, as particularly with the Manchester people themselves, whom the Police said they didn’t want Celtic supporters to leave the city, and that the Manchester people had never seen football fans like Celtic’s supporters, as we at Celtic know only too well.
The reaction from these people in, and from Manchester, really speaks at something else from which you have just asked me.
Will Uefa ban our club?
Well that would be sad for the game itself, we obviously hope not, but we are mightily relieved that Celtic’s case will be judged by people in Zurich, and not by the Scottish Media.
50,000 Celtic supporters were received as friends, in Manchester, and they left as friends.
And today we hear that the Manchester people cannot wait to have the club, but especially our amazing fans, who won over so many new people to our flag, last night.
I will say this to you.
If the best security in the world cannot stop the, Birmingham bombings[looking straight at the BBC lady as much as bombings my erse] and, if the best security in the world cannot stop bombers from getting onto an Aircraft, and blowing it up, how can we expect to keep two drunken nutcases out of a 50,000 crowd, of impeccably behaved Celtic supporters? Its an impossibility.”
DW was the most misunderstood figure in Celtic’s history.
If only they knew.
That’s why he wasn’t knighted…like the GREAT Jock Stein.
Despite our vast amounts of money, Celtic-ness has been dwarfed by the loss of Desmond White.
DW would have educated the Celtic fans by advising them to avoid the Snp, At ALL COSTS, as they are deeply anti Celtic.
That nobody at the club has PUBLICLY done so is a measure of how small the club actually is.
And the Snp demonstrated this when they summoned Peter Lawwell to the Shame Game government summit, were Celtic got 3 players booked.
Salmond was a Celtic hating, populist, and so was his summit stunt, poor Neil Lennon left holding Rosemary’s baby, as the board kept their powder dry.
I thought this worth repeating before I get some kip.
Auldheid
In 60 years you will realise that defunding was the only option.
================
Sorry but defunding now is does not mean an end to The Board, it means an end to Celtic, certainly as a club in the top flight.
No income = no wages=no players=no club.
or
Lower income =lower wages = lower quality players= lower crowds = lower income =lower wages = lower quality players= lower crowds.
The Hamster in a spinning wheel.
Croftcelt on 16th September 2025 11:33 pm
Eile and predecessors,
I was sure you were the notorious Kev J until I noticed you have never mentioned George Galloway.
£€$
What is wrong with George Galloway?
He tried to warn Celtic fans about Sturgeon signing the Scottish people up to eternal Protestant Supremacy, after the Queen died.
“Protestant Supremacy and Celtic Park”
https://youtu.be/eLQolvBmUgM
If you don’t know this then that is because fearty Celtic didn’t warn fans about the Snp’s hatred of Celtic, and Celtic supporters.
An Tearmann on 17th September 2025 12:28 am
Croftcelt 11.33
It is the multimoniker.
£€$
You never need a new moniker cause you are a grassing snitch.
Grassing snitches never get banned.
Burnley78 9:46 & 9:51 pm,
Two years, three months ago the executive flew out to Spain to meet with Brendan Rodgers, who was on an extended leave from football.
They persuaded him to cut short his break and come back to Celtic.
BR then flew to DD’s house in London and agreement was made, no doubt Brendan Rodgers was given assurances on his role and responsibilities as Celtic manager.
Now, the unknown, unknown, was would those seniors at Celtic who were out of the loop and wanting a different candidate be obliging and supportive of the principal shareholder and Executives’ appointment?
BR has clearly delivered on his side of the deal, if you listen to his press conference you can see quite clearly the manager is not being backed.
Not only that, Celtic insiders are going to the dark side of the SMSM and once again briefing lies against the manager.
This was not the deal that Brendan Rodgers cut short his “extended break” for? Quite the opposite.
After four seasons of incremental improvement, we have retrenchment.
So now we have known, unknowns – we know that those outside the decision to bring Brendan back have not been obliging and are unsupportive, as yet we do not know exactly who they are.
So the toxicity is obviously within Celtic Park and you can’t level this one at the support.
I’ve worked in The City of London’s feral capitalist environment and it is very toxic.
No quarter asked for, no quarter given. That’s fine, that’s what you sign up for.
It is not the way folk representing Celtic hierarchy should be acting, they are supposed to be ambassadors for our club.
When in London I loved working for the Americans; can do attitude, wasn’t a slogan, it was lived, as was being great at your job.
Where is that mindset? Where is that pride in the Celtic hierarchy?
The Americans at Ibrox would have read that statement from the Celtic Board on Saturday 6th Sept and loved it – they would have read Roger Hannah’s piece in The Sun and knew they were up against men of little character.
It would tell them they can own Glasgow.
And unless this Board and Executive are completely restructured, own it they will.
The challenge is indeed in the post.
Hail Hail
Auldheid you seem to be able to look at it from both sides of the fence. I totally agree with you, we need to talk more shout less, threaten even less and try to appreciate all sides of the issue, respectfully. This civil disruption is not healthy for our club. Looking forward to getting to the day we have beat hearts, and we can have furious left back and escaped goat conversations, or get nervous about the January window. Hail Hail.
Chairbhoy
So the toxicity is obviously within Celtic Park and you can’t level this one at the support. Er you can.
BR then flew to DD’s house in London and agreement was made, no doubt Brendan Rodgers was given assurances on his role and responsibilities as Celtic manager.You are making this up, were you there?
BR has clearly delivered on his side of the deal, if you listen to his press conference you can see quite clearly the manager is not being backed. How is £30 million last year and what £15 this year not being backed. Agree we should have better both years but to say not backed is head in the sand. Big money doesn’t equal great players, ask second ragers. Ferals love that US darn attitude. Doesn’t mean we need to follow.
The challenge is to stop grandstanding and get calm heads together. Hail Hail
Top of the morn noise mongerers (damp squib). Doin Sevco’s biddin for them ffs, get a grip. Ave Ave
Children of the Revolution
https://youtu.be/aInONhdauU8?si=x9XUumx7HztjrV_d
https://www.acsom.net/post/financial-report-could-spell-the-end-for-peter-lawwell-at-celtic
Strange that Hannah has been AWOL on SSB ,since the story….