Well done to the Daily Record for revealing that SFA referee, Eddie Smith, was the policeman who reported Celtic fans to Uefa for singing offensive songs against Rennes last month. Smith was one of the referees who declined to make his services available as referees went on strike last season while Celtic took-on the SFA amid accusations of lies, bullying, sectarian behaviour and cover-ups among referees at the association. He is no longer on the Grade 1 list.
Following the strike the SFA Head of Referee Administration was removed from his post and referee, Dougie MacDonald, who was accused of lying to Celtic manager, Neil Lennon, resigned, prompting then-Celtic chairman, Dr John Reid, to say the club felt vindicated in raising their concerns.
Vindicated, no doubt, but with more than a few feeling bitter towards the club.
While the Daily Record can reflect on some good work today, bizarrely, the Scotsman newspaper accused Celtic fans of sectarian chanting at the Rennes game, something even police-gossip, Eddie Smith, didn’t accuse them of.
Why stop at accusations of sectarian behaviour? If the Scotsman are going to be ridiculous, why not accused Celtic fans of genocide and treason? Better still, just say lots of them have funny names, go to strange schools but will never ascent to the British throne.
Celtic have 123-years of non-sectarian history, it is downright offensive to suggest otherwise.
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2010 Never Again
Bzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Craiginho from earlier….
Head… Nail….. Hit….. On.
Couldn’t have put it better myself. We need to seize the moral high-ground and keep it. As long as the desperado’s from Mordor can shout “aye but they did this” then we’re in the trenches with no victory in site.
hamiltontim says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:37
I bit like myself on Saturday ,shouting up that round.
good job you were there .:O)
God bless all in here that suffer from that affliction known as selective memory.seem that memories in here a recalled to suit the posters own opinions and agendas
Well may jog your memories to circa May 2003 when the same Eddie Smith was cause of some future throughout this land because he had the audacity to go an support the Celts in Seville and by god his father nephew and probably another couple of relatives had the cheek to hold season tickets to Celtic Park
Now I know that a fair few on here have a vivid imagination and love to think they are all informed as to the goings on within the main doors at Celtic Park but how many of you were privy to any conversations between the UEFA representative and Smith before the commencement of the Rennes game. Is there a chance that UEFA may have been in receipt of some form of communication from the west of Scotland complaining of previous so called songs relating to a proscribed organisation and as a result of that the UEFA delegate has asked to kept informed of such songs by the match commander.
Any way if you want to take it as read what is reported in the so called old meeja be my guest if it suits you
gerryguk67,
What you contend, that anyone can make such a complaint, may well be true. (One wonders why, in that case, not 1 of Scotland’s finest has ever felt it necessary to report them but that’s another matter altogether.) It has been done to Celtic already. Some “journalist” took it upon himself to so do and the case was dismissed.
Top corner,just seen Saoirse’s sister in the same race,aww the presure is on now..im confident..
Declan Is Neil Lennon 1888 says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:35
Eh??
Is that seat the last one you broke on a trip to Paradise?
Afternoon bhoys, cool but still hun free.
Well well, they are doing a good job in dividing the support are they not.
For all you out there who think that the cesesation of songs with the words IRA in them will make them go away and leave us alone, are seriously deluded to the point of needing to be medicated.
It’s US they hate.
The suggestions of the infiltrators are getting sillier and sillier but my lunch break is ending soon, so I’ll leave the good fight to others.
But, won’t it be fun if Eddie Smith’s complaint suffers the same fate as all previous complaints to Uefa about our songbook?
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:27
Luckily, we are all entitled to our opinions; sometimes I’m less than in awe regarding one or 2 of your’s.
However, I do not allow that to put me off some of your more reasonable ones. All IMO of course :-)
HH Gerry
JinkyvJohnGreig-saysitall,
Cheers!
Always liked your user name. Doesn’t it demonstrate the difference between the two clubs that our greatest player was a skillful winger whereas theirs was a dirty full back?
Gerryuk67
I heard them singing Ooh Ahh Samaras, could it have been the same song?
gerryguk7 says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:08
it was reported in pretty much ALL the papers/online that Celtic are under investigation having been reported to UEFA by Strathclyde Police – the fact that the police officer in question possibly has an ulterior motive is very key. They have been very clear that it was the Police that reported the Celtic fans.
Lennon was reported for all sorts of made-up offences last year, racism against Diouf, tunnel incidents, attacking McMoist (pah!). Some of the orc websites had a pre-written complaint form for people to forward on. They then use these spurious complaints for a “no smoke without fire” implication that Lennie is out of control that the rags then pick up on.
I posted on other sites that the proper course of action was for Strathclyde’s loyal (ahem) police force to go and arrest the miscreants and then let justice take its course, rather than report the incident to a supranational sporting association.
I will be interested to see the outcome of the investigation – if anything the fact that it was Plod that reported it reinforces UEFA’s previous ruling that if the local country (and it’s police) don’t enforce these issues, there is little UEFA can do about it.
Interesting to note the absence in the Press of the cya word “allegations” which is always attached when the story concerns our friends from the South side.
tbh I am more interested in Phil’s latest story that we lost out on Steven Fletcher by not upping our bid by 27K; yes 27 thousand pounds…the cost of 1000 spectators fro one game; approx 1 week of Scott Brown’s wages. Considering what we have wasted on projects and crap signings a disgrace.
Also Notts Forest wanted 300k for Wilson last year and Davis was not a wedge to the deal but convenient cannon fodder – as PL would have known.
If these “allegations” – see I don’t call them out as facts as the press are doing today – are really true I am disappointed on a couple of scores
1) WGS and Lenny did not walk away
2) Peter Lawwell has lost the plot and is too interfering.
3) How will we ever attract a manager of any calibre while Lawwell is there.
jockodee
Please tell me you’re not serious!?
You’re advocating changing the words of BOTOB!
Dearie me.
BSR
re snorkels
Lourdes Secondary School, mid-1970’s
my brother (so the story goes) was part of a boisterous body of ruffians, aka neds
bell sounded one day, heavy boots shuffled into their places behind the desk
teacher was not the most assertive
aforementioned neds were going thro a snorkel phase
all 7 of them, big green jaikets, zipped right up to the top during class-time
bang bang bang on the desk, rhyming off some ditty or other
teacher not well pleased !! but the scene was once again beyond control
how these ones survive in such a post, i’ll never know
brother went off to join the priesthood years later
studied a while them changed direction
wife n seven wanes now
savin up for a snorkel for each o them as we speak
ha
gerryguk7 – i think you are the only one calling it as you see it here. dont let them chase you off the site for telling the truth. they do that all the time to new people, immeiadtly assume they are huns.
hail hail and god bless
can someone explain to me how this whole thing works
I understand that some people might find The Boys….Sean South or the various other well known republican anthems offensive, in the way that I find lots of other songs offensive, pretty much everything by the so called artists originating from the x factor being a case in point, however, unless I am sadly mistaken most of the republican ballads are political rather than sectarian in nature, and until the tories outlaw freedom of political expression, I cant see how anyone can be convicted of willfully setting out to cause offence by singing a song. I do however completely understand that any song containg sweary words, especially those directed at the monarch and her family could rightfully be regarded as being beyond the pale, but again on that basis the blokes who play the music in football grounds had better be awfy carefull not to play loads of pop/r&b/ house / dance / club / (c)rap / or nearly anything else produced in the 21st century, since nearly everything released these days would fall foul somewhere along the line
I am not for one minute suggesting that mixing politics and football is a good idea, if you want a wee sesh singing the auld songs there are plenty of bars and clubs happy to oblige, just as there are for the other mob, and I really am quite happy for them to sing away to their hearts content if thats what floats their boats, it does not offend me one iota, even if they do want to stand up to their necks in my blood, which lets face it doesnt sound like a fun pastime anyway
Since I am in exile I must have missed something, if they want to play their flutes and go for a wee walk, so what ? likewise if the James Connolly want to go dancing down argyle street to their own wee tunes, then help your selves, turning freedom of expression into a criminal offence? That way madness lies
None of us are perfect we all have our own wee prejuidices, there has been a them n us since we crawled out of the caves, and guess what? there always will be
Live and let live
Jock Tamsons Bairn aka ExiledBhoy
coorslad
NOO ye tell me
:)
2010 Never Again
The afternoon blessing will commence in 5 mins.
At this time a special prayer will be offered up for the sterling efforts being undertaken by the dedicated and loyal officers of Her Majesty’s Revenue & Customs
coorslad
you work for paddy power ?
Voguepunter
You did better than me. Later, I struggled to remember a round with only 3 drinks on it :(
mickbhoy1888
“Is there a chance that UEFA may have been in receipt of some form of communication from the west of Scotland complaining of previous so called songs relating to a proscribed organisation and as a result of that the UEFA delegate has asked to kept informed of such songs by the match commander.”
I dunno. Is there?
Nice imagination BTW.
Can the polis do NO wrong in your eyes?
MWD
‘Illicit chanting’ – Breaking social norms, Unlawful.
If it is unlawful, why was no-one arrested?
As far as the polis following it up, CCTV does not have sound, so how are they going to arrest anyone?
UEFA must really despair for this ‘One Nation’
HH
Parkheadcumsalford.
Fine, and if a journalist makes a complaint again and it’s not upheld, again, fine. I know lots of people hate us, I know they will use every opportunity to denigrate the club and the support. That is never going to change.
What I think we should do as a support is use this opportunity to provide some sort of clarity in the “songs” debate. We need to know what is offensive, what is sectarian, what is illicit and what is none of the above according to the Police, the SFA/SFL/SPL and UEFA. As a fan I want to know what I can sing at the staidum, and what songs I should keep for other places. I want that clarity so that I can:
(a) avoid getting the club in bother;
(b) avoid getting myself in bother;
(c) protest against any imbalance, insensitivity or downright prejudice in any precribed list of songs.
I think, personally, we need the debate. We certainly need the debate before that dreadful new legislation goes onto the statute book.
GerryBhoy says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:41
My opinion is that you are an acute and terminal sufferer of Stockholm syndrome.
I cant be doing with that. :-)
Hail Hail
Weeminger
I accept Hun collapse has a bearing on CFC .. Right now I’m more bothered by how we are being run rather than how the Huns are being run.
I’m more concerned with the 12 pt gap and the lack of evidence that it is likely to change. I don’t want to build my entire season around Hun and HMRC discussions.
HMRC and sectarian accusations are manna from heaven for our CEO so he can come out and promise to take actions. The only actions I want him to take are resignation or start creating a team that stands a chance of winning a two horse race against a group of players who are limited ( but better than ours) and should be very beatable…
From the Mail online.
Superintendent David Brand of the Football for Co-operation Unit for Scotland (FoCUS) took part in an online debate The Final Whistle Scottish Football Show and said: ‘There is no definition of what is a sectarian offence’.
Why then has ‘offensive’ been neatly tucked under the banner of sectarian?
Was it David Brand speaking, or David Brent.
jimmci says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:42
Strachan did. At the end of that season.
MWD at 12:20
Absolutely not. I mentioned the only three songs/add-ons in our repertoire that could cause offence. There are limitless amounts of songs that don’t but still celebrate our Scots-Irish culture. We’re being dragged into this because of three songs/add-ons while the other side’s entire songbook is up for discussion. We all know the distinction between the early 1900s IRA and 80s/90s IRA but I’d guess that many who hear those songs from our support will have no idea. Being offended by songs that mention the IRA doesn’t make anyone unreasonable.
There are very minor steps we can take in order to completely control the offensive chanting debate. Hell, even replacing “And join the IRA” in BOTOB with “And join the old brigade” would make that song inoffensive. I just cannot see any positive argument for continuing with those songs/add-ons. This isn’t the removal of the tricolour or the Church of Scotland’s memo about the “Irish menace” this should be a minor issue for us.
Craiginho
TopCorner says:
14 November, 2011 at 12:46
coorslad
you work for paddy power ?
***********************
Ha! naw mate he works for Debbie the High heid yin in Doire no1CSC
V
HH
Gordon_J
Indeed! For that I will always be eternally grateful. My only football regret is that I never got to see Jinky play in the flesh. I was only born in 1976 but I do have a great (non football) story about him and Strathclyde’s finest that isn’t for the blog but if we ever meet up then I’ll gladly tell it…
TopCorner
Retro Chic
Mon The Greens
I think we need to get a few things in focus here. Who reported Celtic is not so much the issue as is which organisation which did.
The Police of the country we live in didn’t arrest anyone as far as we know when they can if they want to.
Instead one man whether at the behest of others or not took it upon himself to inform a UEFA delegate and did not inform the club.
The police are different from FARE. They have the power to act as they are the police and the 2003 act allows them to do so. Discriminatory chanting against races and religions is illegal in footballing terms and the police who say referees can book players for leaving the field yet it doesn’t say so in the rules have an influence.
Now the police have made a rod for their own back with this.
Firstly they didn’t involve or inform the club – we know this from the club. What are they for? What is their purpose? They must liaise with club security so why was this not made clear to Celtic’s security staff? Dereliction of duty? Incompetence? Or deliberate? You decide. It seems unfathomable that the police of this country would not inform the club about such issues and instead they chose to clipe to UEFA rather than make arrests or co-ordinate with the club on tackling an issue which is a domestic one for them anyway. The police are not FARE. They have real powers which can be utilized at the game yet apparently they chose not to. Why?
Secondly Eddie Smith and the people in charge of him must do this at every match domestically and in European matches for consistency if nothing else. We know that it is impossible or at best highly unlikely that this new standard of zero tolerance will be upheld – especially in the case of the hordes of Mordor. It is doubtful in the extreme that this will be maintained.
And finally, this is not the reaction of the orcs. We are asking real questions. We know who grassed us up to use the parlance of our times – Eddie Smith and the Police. We are uncertain as to what exactly was sung because nothing was specified. We also know that the media are reporting it in terms of “Sectarianism” in some quarters which the Police themselves have not said. If it is people chanting Paddy McCourt’s Fenian Army, then the case is a nonsense. If it is IRA stuff, it might have some credence depending upon which song it was but if you are going to take the inaction you took Mr Plod at least have the decency to tell the people getting you your overtime what the problem was. My own feeling is this is another get the Green Brigade stunt with overtones of get the Bill passed to “even things up”. I’ve never been so disappointed in the country of my birth as I am today – total backwater and yet morons think I live in an uncivilized place because I live in Eastern Europe – says it all really.
Celtic supporters do not sing Sectarian songs. We simply do not have them and if we once did they are long gone. IRA chants while unpleasant to many are not Sectarian no matter how much some people want them to be. As to whether they should be sung or not, many people sit on the fence and many hold one view. I agree with posters who say we should sing the Fields of Athenry and other Irish songs if we as a support want to display that part of our history and roots they are untouchable (for the moment at least). It is a stick with which they are choosing to attack us with and by hook or by crook they’ll get their way on this. They have decided that songs like the Celtic Symphony and TBOTOB are not acceptable and they want their pound of flesh. We will not get out of this completely unscathed. The smear campaign is at hand and they won’t be satisfied until they get theirs.
Be smarter Celtic fans, don’t let tiny minds wear us down.
Hail Hail
Mickybhoy1888
Kenny Scott is an ex Glasgow policeman
coincidence ?
you bet yah !!
Hail Hail
We have another double act on today.
Which on is Mike and which one is Bernie, I wonder…
Old Firm policeman slams Uefa over chanting claim
reddit this
Ewan Murray
The Guardian, Saturday 22 April 2006
Article history
The senior policeman who will oversee tomorrow’s Old Firm match at Celtic Park has disputed Uefa’s claim that sectarian chanting is tolerated in Scottish society, while insisting that the decision the European governing body handed down on the recent Rangers case will have no bearing on the way Strathclyde Police handle the encounter.
Chief superintendent Kenny Scott, who has acted as match commander for more than 20 Old Firm meetings in the past eight years, will be in that role for tomorrow’s game amid a public debate in Scotland over who has the responsibility to eliminate sectarianism at football grounds.
In exonerating Rangers 10 days ago on the charge of sectarian chanting by their supporters in recent Champions League matches against Villarreal, Uefa claimed that bigotry was a Scottish “social and historical problem” and singing of The Billy Boys – a song that glories in the violent death of Catholics – is now “somehow tolerated”.
However, Scott said: “I would strongly argue, particularly with reference to the last two years, that Uefa’s statement has no validity. Sectarian behaviour is dealt with firmly in Scotland, and that includes at football matches.” Revealing that 39 people have been charged after the previous two Old Firm meetings at Celtic Park this season for sectarian-motivated crimes, more than half of the total number of arrests, Scott re-affirmed that fans singing The Billy Boys are liable to be prosecuted.
“Uefa’s comments will have no effect at all on my actions as match commander for this match and evidence shows that sectarian offences, including people singing the song in question, have been acted on by the police,” he explained. “It is clear that the police and others, including football clubs, have taken massive steps forward against sectarian behaviour.”
Amendments to Section 74 the Criminal Justice Act (Scotland) in June 2003 allowed police to treat religious hate crimes as an aggravated breach of the peace. In the first year of that legislation, 450 people were charged with sectarian offences. That figure has now increased to more than 500, with the overwhelming majority of arrests coming at football matches or political marches.
And Scott hopes supporters attending the final Old Firm match of the season will be aware of the potential for action if they fall foul of such laws, particularly with Fifa’s new penalties for discriminatory behaviour set to come into force.
“I hope that people have taken notice of what Uefa have been investigating and of the debate that has gone on in recent weeks,” he said. “This should act as a wake-up call, and anyone who truly supports their team should know that behaving in an inappropriate manner could have serious consequences for that team in the future.”
Alex McLeish will be in charge of Rangers for the 25th and final time in an Old Firm match, and is aware that the home support will be in a party mood with the title secured. However, Rangers are still chasing a Champions League place and McLeish admits they must silence the vast majority of the 60,000 crowd.
“Of course this is what we are trying to do,” said McLeish. “Whenever we go to each other’s grounds we try to make our own supporters happy and to make it a happy week at work as opposed to a miserable one. We are there to try and help our fans enjoy the next few weeks. It’s the last one for me but I am looking forward to it as much as the first one. For atmosphere and passion, a game like this is a phenomenal experience.”
Security chief at Rangers leaves Ibrox club to take up role with UEFA
Oct 31 2010 Exclusive by Norman Silvester, Sunday Mail
RANGERS security chief Kenny Scott has quit the club to take up a lucrative troubleshooting role in European football.
Fans have been mystified by his absence from Ibrox since the start of the year.
But the club have made no official announcements about it.
However, we can reveal that Scott is now working in a highly-paid freelance role with UEFA – European football’s governing body – putting security in place for the 2012 European Championships in Poland and Ukraine.
He is also being used by UEFA in other troubleshooting roles across the Continent, particularly for high-risk matches.
Scott is acknowledged as one of Europe’s leading experts on match security, particularly in tackling hooliganism.
The 53-year-old former police chief superintendent had previously been mixing his full-time work with Rangers with consultancy work with UEFA.
But he has decided to concentrate on his role with UEFA, where he is highly regarded by officials, including president Michel Platini.
Speaking from Poland yesterday, Scott said: “I have now officially left Rangers, though I have been back a few times this year for games as a guest.
“Most of my consultancy work is currently with UEFA and I travel across the Continent visiting different venues and devising security policy.
“My main task is security at Euro 2012.
“But as a freelance consultant, I am now available for hire for any football security related work.”
Scott was head-hunted by David Murray in 2007 after a high-flying career with Strathclyde Police.
He was match commander at Ibrox, Hampden and Celtic Park and policed more than 20 Old Firm games.
In 1998, Scott, a married father from Lanarkshire, was the police liaison officer for Scotland during the World Cup in France.
During that spell, he helped foil an attempt by a busload of Scottish and English hooligans to cause trouble at games.
While at Ibrox, Scott helped spearhead a bid to stamp out sectarian and offensive songs following warnings from UEFA.
He also had a pivotal role in the investigations into rioting by fans after the UEFA Cup Final in Manchester in 2008.
The only blot on his police career was in 2007 when he was fined £60 for using a mobile phone while driving just after tough new laws had come in. He was off duty at the time.
His replacement, David Martin, is a former assistant chief constable with Strathclyde Police.
Like Scott, he was also match commander at Parkhead for Celtic games.
Before taking the Rangers job, Mr Martin was a member of the Parole Board for Scotland.
Yesterday, a Rangers spokeswoman said: “Kenny was a great employee for the club and we were very sorry to see him leave.
“We wish him every success in his new role.”