Scott Brown’s injury-enforced absence from the team in recent weeks has at least taken heat of his contract situation but that will change in January, when he is back in the team and available to sign a pre-contract agreement. Neil Lennon reports that Celtic have met Scott’s terms but have declined to meet his agent’s demand.
Agent’s often have exclusive representation agreements with players which guarantee the agent a cut of any contract signed when the agreement is active. 5% of a four or five year contract for a top-earning Celtic player could easily reach £300k, or £360k including vat. This is a lot of money for the player to pay out of his after-tax income so what commonly happens is the agent uses his exclusive deal with the player to negotiate a pay-off from the club instead of acting for the player. Unlike the player, a club can reclaim vat and pays before, not after tax, so the same money going to the agent costs the combined player/club less.
It’s often the case, however, that the agent’s fee paid by the club has little resemblance to the percentage the agent would get representing the player. While a player has an exclusive deal with an agent, a buying club has three deals to agree: the selling club’s fee, the player’s wages and the agent’s fee.
Big agent fees don’t necessarily mean bad business for the buyer, as the agent may well have made a deal achievable at a purchase price which would not have been otherwise possible, but clubs are typically more reticent when it comes to paying agents to renew contracts for their existing players. One (then) SPL chairman told me he had a flat £500 tariff for such deals.
Artur Boruc concluded his last contract with Celtic without an agent. At the time he explained that he would need an agent if he was moving club but didn’t need one to negotiate a predetermined level on the Celtic pay structure. This would have saved Celtic money and might have earned Artur an extra bonus.
Scott Brown is not in this situation. If he is offered a contract of around £6m over five years, after 50% tax and 12% (?) national insurance (which Celtic and staff pay…), his take home pay from the contract will be considerably less. 5% of the contract could end up looking like 14% of take home pay after vat is added.
Celtic will also be alert to the dangers of precedent. If a player’s ‘advisor’ can get a significant pay-day out of a contract renewal there is no incentive for the player to conclude a deal with Celtic without an advisor, indeed, there is incentive to get one involved.
I’ve no information whatsoever on what is going on with Scott’s contract but the portents don’t look promising.
A couple of years ago we spoke about the excellent Why England Lose and its predecessor, Moneyball. Two books that sought to explain how to find value in football and baseball respectively. The Brad Pitt movie, Moneyball, based on the events analysed in the book, is now out. Not sure making a drama out of statistics is wise but I’ll need to check it out.
Read CQN Magazine for free online here. Subscriptions to the online copy are discretionary but you can contribute here. Old-school hard copies are available here from Magcloud.
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goldstar10, we are in the total agreement that o** f*** should be a no longer heard, sweary word kinda thing…
Celtic > ♣
pigalle
Paul67 and others
From the reviews I have read and heard of Moneyball, it will be be a good value movie.
Even film buffs who know nothing about the sport were engaged by it.
Hi just a note re travel..Erskine bridge closed at the moment ,M8 closed at Bishopton diversion via Old Greenock road behind Langbank..be careful out there
Celtic manager Neil Lennon believes captain Scott Brown is close to agreeing a new deal with the club.
Brown, who joined Celtic from Hibs in 2007, is out of contract in the summer.
The midfielder has agreed personal terms but talks have stalled over the fee demanded by the player’s advisors.
Celtic paid £4.4m to take Brown from their Scottish Premier League rivals, a fee that remains a record between two Scottish clubs.
The Scotland international has resumed training after a spell on the sidelines with an ankle injury and has an outside chance of facing Atletico Madrid in the Europa League on Wednesday.
“I think we are pretty close to getting the deal done,” said Lennon.
“It’s just a question of talking to his representatives as soon as possible and coming to a resolution.
“I think he wants to stay and I don’t think we are far away. It’s dragged its heels a bit but I’m quite confident we can get it done.
Continue reading the main story
We are not even in December yet and I’m being asked questions about players coming in or going out
Celtic manager Neil Lennon
“There are all sorts of reasons why it’s not been done yet but it’s certainly not been for the lack of trying.
“We all know he can talk to clubs on Thursday but I had a chat with him today, he wants to stay here and I’m confident we can get it done over the next few days.”
Meanwhile, Lennon has refused to be drawn on speculation linking Celtic with a move for Huddersfield Town striker Jordan Rhodes.
Lennon, who was in the stand to watch Huddersfield’s defeat by Charlton on Monday, said he would not discuss players under contract at other clubs.
“We are not even in December yet and I’m being asked questions about players coming in or going out,” he added.
“I’m preparing a team for a big European game and I’m not prepared to talk about much else really.
“We have our eye on a couple of targets but there are no guarantees of getting deals done.”
Morning from Florida Bhoys.
Not sure if this has been mentioned but I have a feeling Broony could head to the Huns.
Its the kind of move that Whyte would go for, get a bit of support behind him from the fickle Huns going for a Celtic player on a pre-contract.
I’m sure Scott was a bluenose in his younger days.
Silly maybe, but it might turn out to be a Miller-type situation.
I genuinely hope he does sign…He hasn’t been what we expected and probably not worth the money. However, I wouldn’t like to lose him for free and I think in the system we played last year, he was a big part of the little amount of goals conceded. He gives us bite and workrate and is crucial in going to places like Ibrokes.
Saying all that, I won’t be devastated if he does go and I’ll wish him all the best, unless he does go and become a monkey.
Hail Hail
Awe_Naw….,
cheers for the advice, I use globetrotter connect for my 3G interweb moblie connection, when I look in processes, it identifies about 5 errors per second, I know this is an issue, but I had to make alterations to the code a while ago to keep the connection, it was a fix I found and not sure if it is actually the cause of my problems.
So Chrome is the bee’s knee’s then ?
CentenaryBhoy at 16:18
When Scott Brown joined us, he was also courted by the huns but choose us for footballing reasons (and the fact that we had the money to pay him). Now, Scott is a reasonably clever bhoy, he will know that the players we have are superior to those the huns have so the footballing reasons for staying with us are still the same, and he will also know that their financial troubles will mean, they are even less likely to be able to afford to pay him what he wants. If they had to ask Aluko to pay the compensation to Aberdeen, what are the chances they can afford a) his signing on fee and b) his agent’s fee.
Mort
Seven Fishes Four Steaks says:
29 November, 2011 at 16:08
————————————————
cheers
ive watched the first episode. What a start…..so bought the box set, and saving it for the chrimbo period to get tore into
canamalar
Chrome is pretty good but not for an iphone
Are you using an iphone or an android ? or a laptop ? or a standard PC ?
Hail Hail
Mort
Fair point. I think if they a fire sale and were able to bring in one or two they would have no qualms about going for our captain considering the hype it would cause and how it would reflect on Whyte.
You are probably correct in terms of the financial situation though.
HH
Awe_Naw…
laptop with built in sim slot, hence the globetrotter connect stuff.
I see Kirk Broadfoot is getting the laptop loyal protection.
Why would Sally have to have words with him as it states in the Record if it was just a bunch of hoodlums as stated in the sun ?
Hail Hail
CentenaryBhoy at 16:27
I’m sure if he becomes a free agent, they would like to sign him but I’d be astonished if Scott Brown would even consider going there now.
Maybe in a few years when his career is near over and Rangers have got themselves back onto a financial sound footing, he might consider it but for a professional footballer at the peak (or close to) of his career to join Rangers given their perilous situation would be career suicide.
Mort
Awe_Naw..,
I also think its to counter his lies about the murder threat he received from the killi captain, innit.
canamalar,
Chrome is a better choice of browser not sure if it is the solution to your problem. YOu need to see what is eating up your memory.
Should be easy enough ctr-alt-del and then click on the memory column for the processes and see which one is eating up your memory.
Hail Hail
Just finished Breaking Bad at the weekend. Fantastic drama. Still just stops short of the Sopranos in my book, but a VERY close second.
canamalar
Kirky biigfoot has been an unhappy bunny for a long time. He is the worst player at hun FC. He is the poorest paid and he hardly gets a game. I think Kilmarnock skelping his backside didn´t help his mood at all .. especially the scorer.
Hail Hail
Awe_Naw_No_Annoni_Oan_Anaw_Noo says:
29 November, 2011 at 16:05
Thomthetim
I think that the PLC has deliberately and unashamedly and systematically engineered itself into being accepted into the Scottish establishment as part of the Old Firm. I also think that over this summer that will be confirmed leaving Celtic and Rangers on a level footing going into the new season.
In that case, they haven’t made a very good job of being “accepted”.
Celtic’s priority is to keep the club viable in a hostile, poverty stricken environment.
So far, they are doing that.
It involves playing in the SPL, under the auspices of of the SFA.
It also involves having competitors to compete against.
Emotionaly, I want the huns destroyed, bur I don’t want the club run on an emotional basis.
I don’t want the club run on the whims and asperations of emotionally commited supporters.
I want hard heads. We are the soft hearts.
Again, can I ask you what you think of the Hypothesis mentioned in the book I referenced earlier?
Thoughts based on Prejudice and Emotion or Logic.
Evening all. BBC weather forecaster has just assured the country that the heavy rain has departed Scotland. Well, I’d just like to assure him that both the wind and rain are still with us. It is wild out there at the minute.
MoernforecastingisrubbishCSC.
Got a call just a wee while ago from scammers logmein123.com had a bit of fun and went along for the ride playing dumb with the female operator after a while their supervisor came on saying I had a real bad virus problem and it needed one of their expert technicians. I asked is that why the young lady was replaced with the supervisor and he said she was a new recruit and could only handle low level virus infections (howls of muted laughter from myself when I heard that one)
Check this video of a guy playing dumb with them and you will get the drift of this scam
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuCFlR-YNdc&feature=related
Portsmouth chairman Vladimir Antonov has resigned after the club’s parent company Convers Sports Initiatives (CSI) entered administration.
Accountants Hacker Young, who handled Pompey’s administration in 2010, have been named to handle CSI’s insolvency.
“It’s incredibly disappointing for the club to find itself in this position,” said Pompey chief executive David Lampitt in a statement.
The financially troubled club could now suffer a points deduction.
In a statement Pompey insisted that “Portsmouth Football Club (2010) Limited – the company that operates PFC – is not in administration and continues to trade”.
However the Football Association has previously indicated that those clubs whose parent company enter administration will be subject to a points deduction process.
“The FA will have to decide whether CSI and Portsmouth are effectively run as one “economic entity,” insolvency lawyer Guy Thomas of Taylor Walton told BBC Sport.
“The penalty – ranging between 10 and 25 points – will depend on the outcome of an FA review.
“Pompey will have its chance to put their case but on balance I wouldn’t hold out much hope that the club will avoid at least a 10-point deduction,” added Thomas.
And what happened to Portsmouth’s Championship rivals Southampton in 2009 offers a worrying precedent for Pompey fans.
Then, Saints’ parent company Southampton Leisure Holdings went into administration and though the club hoped to avoid deduction, an independent investigation by the Football League found the club & SLH were “inextricably linked as one economic entity”.
Southampton were subsequently deducted 10 points.
The Football League were not immediately available for comment on the likelihood of Pompey suffering a points deduction.
“I want to assure staff and fans that we will continue to do everything possible to safeguard the position of the club and its longer-term future,” added Lampitt.
Pompey were the first Premier League club to enter administration
Antonov, who last week was arrested in an inquiry into asset stripping, secured the sale of Portsmouth from Hong Kong businessman Balram Chainrai, director of Sports Holdings (Asia) Ltd in June. Portpin is another Chainrai company.
Chainrai first took over at Fratton Park in February 2010, placing Portsmouth in administration after initially investing £17m in the club, and “reluctantly” assuming control when previous owner Ali Al Faraj defaulted on loan payments due to him.
Portsmouth were consequently deducted nine points on their way to relegation from the top flight.
Last week Portsmouth’s former owners Portpin Ltd re-emerged as an interested party in the club’s future after filing a charge at Companies House over the parent company making it a secured creditor over CSI.
Awe_Naw….,
this is exactly as its identified on the processes page
“C:\program Files\Internet Explorer\iexplore.exe” SCODEF:3904 CREDAT:203009 is using 652,580K, thats a lot, any advice ?
Mick
I am pretty sure Rangers did not use EBT’s at that time.
I think it started during the Advocat era.
TT
I can’t see how Christine Grahame can survive the allegations from Hirst her long-time adviser.
I have said it before she is toast.
How this new bill can be enacted after she let slip that it was an “evening up” device to catch RC/Celtic supporters is reason enough. Add to that the COPFS shredding the sectarian crime stats from 2004.
Then this with video evidence (which my MSP knew about some time ago).
That is before we even think about the alleged anti-RC remarks Hirst says she makes regularly. She had to sue him or resign. The latter must be her only option now.
This is the article from Saturday’s Mail.
………………………………………………………………………………………………………..
Daily Mail, Saturday 26th November 2011
MSP in probe over her election expenses
By Andrew Picken, Scottish Political Correspondent
A SENIOR Nationalist MSP is under investigation over allegations she used publicly funded workers and equipment on her election campaign.
Christine Grahame, convener of the Justice Committee, is being investigated by the Serious and Organised Crime Division of the Crown Office over the claims.
It has been alleged that she ordered three of her parliamentary staff to work on the SNP campaign ahead of May’s election.
The veteran MSP is also facing allegations she used parliament computers, stationery, stamps and travel expenses worth thousands of pounds in her successful bid to win the Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale seat.
The investigation was sparked by a former researcher who was sacked by Miss Grahame.
Mark Hirst, who worked for the MSP for seven years before being axed in September, complained to the Electoral Commission about the alleged malpractice.
Officials at the elections watch-dog last week passed the complaint to the Crown Office.
It is understood the country’s prosecution service has now asked the police to interview Mr Hirst about the claims.
Secretly recorded video footage and emails, handed to the Crown Office but seen by the Scottish Daily Mail, allegedly show Miss Grahame directing parliament staff to carry out campaign work.
Speaking yesterday, Mr Hirst said: ‘She said at the declaration that winning this seat was like winning gold at the Olympics; well the evidence I have shows this was the political equivalent of doing that with performance enhancing drugs.
‘It was unfair on the other candidates, she cheated – that is the bottom line.
‘We were all instructed to carry out work for the SNP using parliamentary resources. It might be more widespread I don’t know but I know it is wrong. She was taking no chances, she was prepared to do anything to win.
He continued: ‘I worked full-time for her and this was not just going on in the short campaign before the election, we are talking back to January.
‘I was instructed to make the 200-mile trip from my home in Dundee to go to the Borders and help with the canvassing and keying in with the SNP database because they could not get the activists to do that.
‘I know the two other staff were doing the same – it was overt political work. And we are not talking about a couple of stamps here and there, it was hundreds of stamps as well as use of thousands of pounds worth of IT equipment,’
A Grown Office spokesman said: ‘The Serious and Organised Crime Division of the Crown Office has received information from the Electoral Commission in relation to a 67-year-old woman. The information remains under consideration.’
Mr Hirst was suspended on full pay on May 16 when two of Miss Grahame’s constituency workers claimed that he was secretly spying on her. He was dismissed for gross misconduct on September 13 but is taking the matter to an employment tribunal.
A spokesman for Miss Grahame said: ‘This is yet another complaint from a former employee who admits himself that he is disgruntled. The Electoral Commission has said that it does not intend to take any further action in relation to his complaint.
“Miss Grahame has provided all organisations with all the infor¬mation they have required and will continue to do so.’
a.picken@dailymail co.uk
http://www.lulu.com/product/paperback/wims-tims-the-best-thing-to-hit-scottish-football-in-10-years/18460333 Wim’s Tims 30% off today only using code CYBERTUESDAY
Enmac, get tore in now!! There is only 7 episodes in season 1. I watched all 4 seasons in space of a month. It just gets better and better and 4th season is sensational!
Henriks Sombrero, isn’t season 4 just sensational tv? I was glued to it!! Watched last few episodes a few times now!!!
WalterWhiteCSC
http://viewer.celticfc.net/movieoftheday
Just had a scam call from what sounded like an Indian call centre but claiming to be from windows.
Asked for the guys email (surprisingly he gave me it) mstechonline. Check it out. If they phone you,
shout GTF loudly down the phone and hang up
thomthethim says:
29 November, 2011 at 12:23
THE EXILED TIM says:
29 November, 2011 at 12:09
The analytical being the likes of Auldheid and SFTB, amongst a few notable others.
The prejudiced and emotional, being virtually the rest of us!
—————————
You might have read this on the previous CQN mag but it is about who owns football and who (because of emotions) gives them the power.
Evolution Soccer – Revolution Soccer.
“The socialism I believe in is everybody working for the same goal and everybody having a share in the rewards. That’s how I see football, that’s how I see life.” Bill Shankley. Liverpool FC.
Football has experienced a curious phenomenon over the last ten years. Neither the fans nor the clubs can be considered the owners of the game. If we define ownership as the ability to dictate terms then it becomes self evident. The world’s best players and those who hang on to their coat tails now run the show and it filters down to the lower levels. These people are football’s new owners.
How has this happened for it would be impossible in normal business? It happened because the player’s paymasters, the support, set no price on their desire for glory and success. The paymasters have become the slaves of glory and football is paying the ultimate cost.
Along with the desire for glory at any price is the working man’s thinking that a player, like any working man, has the right to negotiate as high a reward for his labour as he can. As a left leaning Glaswegian who has had to strike for improved conditions in normal business, I subscribe to that notion and paid my dues to defend that right. However football is not like normal business. In normal business if a worker negotiates a wage that makes the company uncompetitive because the rise exceeds the income it will generate, that company will eventually go out of business. Thus a reality wage ceiling is in place. This is a good thing because it means the company can continue to offer employment to all its workers and continue to serve its customers.
However in recent football history the influx of TV and sugar daddy money has enabled a wage to be offered that goes way beyond the business’s ability to sustain, but unlike normal business, clubs do not, by and large, go out of business. They find ways of reforming and carry on, but at a cost to those players not in the top earning bracket, or to the workers in companies who served them. It has meant smaller squads, fewer players able to earn.
It is a curious socialist philosophy that supports a player’s right to get as much as he can from the game, but ignores the consequences for his fellow players/workers without whom there would be no game.
A good analogy is in order here. Modern football is like a description of a scene from hell where a visitor looks into one room and sees an emaciated group around a table on which is set a large pot full of stew. They cannot eat because their arms have been set straight at the elbow and elongated so that they cannot get a spoon in their mouths. It is a miserable place. Then the visitor goes upstairs and enters a similar room with occupants similarly handicapped, but where everyone is well fed and contented. “How can this be?” he asks his guide. “Well downstairs all their energies are spent in the nigh impossible task of feeding their insatiable hunger, whilst up here they simply feed each other.”
The thankless job of managing the downstairs room falls to the custodians of clubs, but their hands are tied by the players’ real paymasters, the support, demanding the custodians throw more food into the room, rather than teach the occupants the benefit of feeding each other for the good of all.
Not all players and agents are greedy men, John Kennedy’s magnificent gesture to give his testimonial money to famine relief is a demonstration of this, and there are other players who also carry out charitable acts. However, overall, it is players who exploit the support using the support’s desire for success to demand from custodians wages that starve lower reaches of the game. There is more than enough finance to satisfy both players and supporters needs, it just needs to be distributed more equitably.
Hopefully this phenomenon will end when the unconscious paymasters – the support, who should be the owners, waken up and realise that they are being exploited, not by the custodians of clubs, but by their fellow workers the players. When this realisation finally dawns about who currently owns football a consensual wage ceiling might emerge to allow football to again become the people’s game. There is no natural ceiling to ensure wealth generation is preserved or that the wealth created is more fairly distributed. One must be created.
At some point the age old class struggle of exploited worker versus owner will be repeated, except the battle will be between a more aware and responsible support and the new owners of soccer, the players.
These are not to be confused with the players of the past, fellow workers of their time exploited by then club owners. Players like Bobby Evans, Willie Fernie, Jimmy Johnstone, Bobby Murdoch etc. These guys and their fellow professionals were working men all their playing lives.
Those days, however, have gone.
TinyTim says: 29 November, 2011 at 16:45
In hindsight I think your right about the EBTs… ach well what a shame! never less Hatley going on about cheating in the game!
thomthethim says:
29 November, 2011 at 16:34
Celtic PLC´s priority at this moment is to keep the Old Firm afloat that is why your perception with regards being accepted as part of the establishment is currently clouded. It is a needs must situation at present.
I hope and pray that our performance financially has been a case of keeping the club well run financially. If they kow tow to Rangers FC or NewCo then it has been only to their benefit. Of that there can be NO DEBATE. We have to wait and see.
The words competitors and compete mean nothing without level playing field …. we are paying that even this season only lip service
I dont want the club ran by those whose god is money.
———-
I think that most peoples opinions of the club are not based on prejudice and emotion and logic but on personal experience.
I think you discount that entirely. All of our experiences are different. Also Celtic means different things to all of us. How that is measured is very difficult to quantify and with the greatest of respect I find your analysis of it as being overly simplified.
Celtic represent us or at least they used too. Do they still strive to do that ? If they are then this quiet, submissive, subservient , money grabbing organisation that we see before us is creaking under their own neglect.
They have to understand that they cant have their cake and eat it.
The excuses that you seem keen to trot out do not wash any more.
The defiant fighting well balanced Irish man with a chip on both shoulder possesses a working brain also.
They are playing it coy , sly, devious .. a whole list of adjectives that can be listed none of them complimentary but ultimately they must realise that they are extracting the urine from their own people for the sake of profits for a corrupt competition that they meekly and quietly accept to participate in.
The clock is ticking. The whole eyes of the Celtic diaspora is on them.
If they show themselves to be Old Firm for the sake of keeping the club viable …. they will have made a mistake IMHO.
Hail Hail
Tommy McInally goes to see Maley about a pay rise
TM Boss Im no being paid enough and I’m the best player in the team
WM You signed for £10 pw and 6 in the close season and thats what your going to get
TM But Patsy Gallagher’s on 14 pw and 10 in the close season
WM Gallagher’s a better player than you though
TM No in the f^^^^^^^ close season he isnae
Seven Fishes Four Steaks says: 29 November, 2011 at 16:51
————–
I am realy tempted, but I know once I pop, I won’t stop.
Hail hail
canamalar
http://blogs.msdn.com/b/askie/archive/2009/03/20/how-to-i-determine-which-ie-tabs-go-to-which-iexplore-exe-process-when-using-internet-explorer-8.aspx
find out what tab it is and kill it. If it is CQN and you only have CQN then I suggest that you use chrome instead of IE 8.0 or at the very least make sure you are up to date with all microsoft images
Hail Hail
Here in ole DG the rain has stopped, but not before ole man Nith has gone into complete Memphis Minnie.
..anyways, ole postie has struggled through the ragin’ torrents to deliver’ The Old Magic’ by Nick Lowe.
The opening track ‘Stop Light Roses’ is a classic, and the whole CD is full of quality choons.
Awe_Naw…,
thank you
hail hail
Paul67 et al
A fit Scott Brown gives Neill Lennon options in midfield, though not as part of a middle pairing with two wide men. That role can be better filled by others. He knows how to play wide right and can be effective on the inside right position of a five man midfield. He is also only one of two players in Neil Lennon’s squad who has actually won an SPL title. I would offer him a one year extension to his contract with no fee to his agent. This would allow Neil Lennon the possibility of strengthening the team in other areas, crucial if we are still involved in four competitions heading into 2012.
Enmac, seriously go for it!!
SffS