So much happened yesterday, I’ll be as brief as possible:
Newco Rangers sent their counsel to the Court of Session to protest Charles Green’s contract with the club, stating it should pay legal expenses, now crystallising ahead of his forthcoming criminal trial.
In opposing Green, James Wolffe QC raised various objections, but as is often the case when people speak on behalf of Newco, included an arbitrary insistence that Newco operated the same club as the now liquidated Rangers.
Green’s QC, Jonathan Brown, put his pit boots on before stating his client’s case, but tantalisingly, before lunch informed the court that he would return to the same club/new club debate later. And didn’t he. Brown explained that Sevco Scotland purchased the assets of Rangers, not the club itself, with poetic prose adding:
“The team are paid by Sevco, plat at a ground owned by Secvo, are trained by a manager who is employed by Sevco and fans buy tickets from Sevco. That is the business that is being carried on.”
Adding that Rangers were “a collection of assets”, “What if the players were sold to one person and Ibrox to antoher, where is the ‘club’ then?”
I had to look away from court reporter, James Dolman’s Twitter feed at this point. It was like watching an acquaintance being humiliated. Not something you want to see.
Lord Doherty will determine if Newco should pay Green’s costs in due course, but this will be soon, as Jonathan Brown noted, “the rainy day has arrived”.
This next bit is really important:
Soon after court ended, Dave King was out with a rambling statement on the Newco website. If it was designed to play to the galleries, it hit the spot. If it was designed to influence what happens to his club, or how others will regard his input, it was surely an horrendous mistake.
It was a hard day to be chairman of Rangers International FC PLC. The court hearing only happened because the club objected to its contract with Green, so the unedifying episode could easily have been avoided. Despite this, sometimes you have to shut your mouth.
Sure, some Newco fans love a bit of grandstanding, but you know what yesterday’s statement will achieve. If the objective of the statement was to convince other Scottish clubs not to consider disciplinary action against Sir David Murray, or oldco Rangers, for their actions, it was an almighty miscalculation.
Threats seldom work. This one is unlikely to curry favour: “If the history of our Club comes under attack we will deal with it in the strongest manner possible and will hold to account those persons who have acted against their fiduciary responsibilities to their own clubs and to Scottish football.”
In short:
Don’t threaten clubs you are trying to influence.
Don’t grandstand to your own fans if you are trying to influence other clubs.
Keep a poker face. Keep your mouth shut, even if it means taking grief from your fans for the lack of public reaction.
King’s statement also addressed the sporting advantage issue from what we now know was an unlawfully operated tax scheme. While the EBT scheme saved tens of millions of pounds, and King earlier intimated this did provide a sporting advantage, yesterday he insisted the advantage was financial, that the shareholders were “committed to providing funding to the club” and would have done so, if required.
Here’s the thing, in 2012 another King statement revealed, “I have made a claim of £20m on the basis of non-disclosure by the then chairman, David Murray, of Rangers true financial position as far back as 2000.”
That commitment to further shareholder funding seems predicated on some controversial information. According to King, of course. Controversial enough to launch a £20m claim, but not to inhibit investment.
For the war-chest hunters among you, if you read this article covering King’s 2012 statement, you’ll find a strong clue.
One other quick but important point:
Some media are attempting to portray questions of sporting advantage as Rangers being punished for spending money they could afford, a travesty, as so many other clubs have done likewise.
This must surely be a deliberate attempt to misunderstand the issue and manipulate the debate.
No one suggests Rangers should be punished for spending money they could not afford. The questions are straightforward:
Did Rangers break tax law, break SFA rules and break SPL rules, when contracting football players?
Did they disclose matters openly with authorities (in other words, inadvertently make mistakes), or did they conspire to subvert the rules by hiding incriminating information?
Spending like the Borgias? Time to move on. Conspiracy to subvert the rules? We have a problem.
Don’t be distracted by potential ramifications to these questions, they are irrelevant for now. We should consider no more than did they break all of the above rules, should any the rule breaking be interpreted as an oversight, or does evidence of conspiracy to subvert the rules exist?
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Dennytim
£100 for overstaying in a hotel in Glasgow! The Menzies Hotel I believe.
He was attending a conference there.
I’m guessing a lot of guests might have been stung too.
You’ve been warned!
‘Seidemann wrote that he approached a girl reported to be 14 years old on the London Tube about modelling for the cover, and eventually met with her parents, but that she proved too old for the effect he wanted. Instead, the model he used was her younger sister Mariora Goschen, who was reported to be 11 years old.
Mariora initially requested a horse as a fee but was instead paid £40’
-lifted from Wiki /EWLM /EWTB
DBBIA
Good to know you are making good use of your spare time!
:-)
Philbhoy- it’s a grand wee place, but like most it’s sufferin’ from a bit of the ole High St blues.
Richie Havens blew the arse off Blind Faith @ Hyde Park..( IMO )
Turkeybhoy.
I hope the Dundee Unt,Aberdeen,Hibs ,Alloa,even Hearts fans are watching this and paying attention.Anyone with access to any sites should be posting these rants and calling for a united front gearing up to December 2nd. We must all take on this alliance of SMSM Hun apologists,SPFL/SFA gutless wonders and win the day for our game.
@@@@@@@@@@@@
I’m quite sure that point is in all our thoughts . I posted as much a few days ago . But why do we need to ask if any other clubs fans are as irate at what’s going on as we are . Has any celtic fans any idea if other clubs fans have been asked for there views . Make no mistake we need every club onside in this fight . Blantyrekev made a point earlier on regards not letting the laptop loyal run the agenda . I only wish lhads like him , auldheid the bb , and brth would Marshall this fight , and mobilise the celtic support , because make no mistake every angle for a slithering way out will be getting looked for as we speak . I also bet Lord docherty,s private number was busy last night .
Philbhoy- if only I could put my feet up in front of a fancy big TV.
dbbia/tenthcommandmentCSC
I hope blind faith is a song !
BT
Richie Haven’s performance at Hyde Park has fair slowed down the ole comments rate.
what is it with ex celtic players Jackie mac games were won on the park are some ex players brain dead or is there an agenda?
Hi bhoys
Got a parking ticket from the private eye mob..for parking at a hotel in Glasgow Airport..contacted the hotel with details was cancelled n two weeks later got letter from private eye it had been cancelled.
Kikinthenakas
That is one seriously long blog on the JJ site.
In summary.
We have a hugely over-inflated sense of self entitlement which allows us to be taken in by a conman (Murray).
We have a hugely over-inflated sense of self entitlement which allows us to be taken in by a conman (Whyte).
We have a hugely over-inflated sense of self entitlement which allows us to be taken in by a conman (Green).
We have a hugely over-inflated sense of self entitlement which allows us to be taken in by a conman (GLS).
Our only crime was loyalty
danso_1888
I think it’s a matter of personal pride.
They don’t want medals from games they lost. They feel embarrassed about it.
BSR
A few utube searches maybe
Danso
These ex players were paid handsomely from our pockets irrespective of what happened.
They may have lost bonus money but we still paid them well.
Our loss is the greater emotional one which only a true supporter can feel.
Sutton Lambert and others won’t get that.
Look for the bears necessities
The simple cheatin recipes
Forget about your taxes and your strife
I mean the bears necessities
Old Mother Minty’s recipes
That brings the bears necessities of life
Good evening friends from a very wet, pretty windy and already dark (I’ve just come in) East Kilbride.
Someone complimented me on my parking at the Forge. They put a note on the windscreen saying ‘parking fine’.
Oldjokesworthrepeating.
margaret mcgill
Class
Kickinthenakas Hi Paul same thing happened to my daughter overstayed at the Ramada by a few minutes would you advise contacting them or brassing it out? H H Hebcelt
Bumping on this post from the last thread. Lest we forget.
Just trying to keep the pot boiling!
ERNIE LYNCH on 13TH NOVEMBER 2015 10:12 AM
blantyretim is praying for the Knox family on 13th November 2015 9:02 am
‘[20] Mr. [Dave King] is a tall, slim man in his 50s. He appeared to be very confident and not in the slightest uncomfortable about giving evidence and being cross-examined. He is intelligent and articulate and appears to be well-versed in the intricacies of the financial world and the purchasing and selling of shares on the JSE. Notwithstanding these advantages he made a very poor impression as a witness. He is extremely arrogant and obviously thinks that whatever he says is so. It was demonstrated that he deliberately misrepresented the facts of the case to his legal representatives, to SARS in correspondence and at the section 74C enquiry and to the representatives and solicitors of the Y Trust. As his evidence progressed it became clear that he has no respect for the truth and does not hesitate to lie or at least misrepresent the facts if he thinks it will be to his advantage. There can be little doubt that on most occasions Mr. [Dave King] lied as he knew the correct facts and obviously decided to misrepresent these facts. In cross-examination Mr. [Dave King] often avoided giving a proper answer to the questions. Sometimes he simply ignored the point of the question and gave a long rambling answer. On other occasions he resorted to bluster or to attacking the integrity of the cross-examiner, accusing him of misrepresenting the facts to the court. He also attacked the integrity of the Commissioner’s attorney, accusing him of presenting facts to the court knowing them to be untrue. It is significant that the appellant’s counsel have not attempted to make anything of these allegations. They clearly consider that there is no merit in these allegations. We saw Mr. [Dave King] testify in chief and in cross-examination for four days and are unanimous in finding that he is a mendacious witness whose evidence should not be accepted on any issue unless it is supported by documents or other objective evidence. It was remarkable that Mr. [Dave King] showed no sign of embarrassment or any emotion when he conceded that he had lied to the Commissioner in a number of his income tax returns. In our assessment he is a glib and shameless liar.’
http://www.politicsweb.co.za/documents/dave-king-a-mendacious-witness–tax-court
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/scottish-football-cannot-be-haven-for-lawbreaking/comment-page-15/#comments
………………………………………………………
It is even more worser than we thought.
HH
http://www.celticfc.net/news/9522
BSR
Blind Faith Hyde Park Concert is on YouTube (c/w some after the watershed pictorials) – we might be in the footage 1/2 way through (deckchairs near the lake).
We worked just off the Bayswater Road back then in ’69 and got to see some good and bad concerts in the park.
Post Cream – pre all out Hippie love-ins! :-)
IN response to considerable interest from supporters, shareholders and media representatives in recent days, Celtic today made the following statement:
“We are aware of last week’s Court of Session ruling, which we note is subject to potential appeal.
“Celtic’s position on this issue is consistent – that this remains a matter for the courts of law and also the Scottish football authorities whose rules are intended to uphold sporting integrity.
“In 2013, we expressed surprise – shared by many observers and supporters of the game – over the findings of the SPL Commission that no competitive or sporting advantage had resulted. That remains our view.”
And this one, because it is very funny. Good Job Ernie
ERNIE LYNCH on 13TH NOVEMBER 2015 10:26 AM
The SFA’s interpretation of the SARS court judgment that allowed them to conclude that he was a fit and proper person:
‘South African judge describes Dave King as a tall slim man, confident, intelligent and articulate, well versed in the intricacies of the financial world.’
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/scottish-football-cannot-be-haven-for-lawbreaking/comment-page-15/#comments
………………………………….
Personally, I still think that Stuart Regan and DC King are fraternal twins separated at birth and destined to reconnect in a tragic denouement – without realizing their genetic connection.
It’s in the eyes, ah tell ye.
NOWA
http://www.celticfc.net/news/9522
Club Statement
Personally if I was Celtic I wouldn’t have issued any statement. Let this play out then make a statement….
Would have rather that Celtic remained silent but I’m happy with their brief factual to the point comment.
Praecepta – Hyde Park in 69 – lucky man
Ole King Crimson blasted it out that day
21st Century Schizoid Tim!
Sky Sports Scotland @ScotlandSky
… @RCFCStaggies v @celtic at Hampden Park, 31/1/16 3pm.
Glad Celtic have said something.
Keeps the pressure up, and very much puts the ball in the SPFL/SFA court: ie, it’s up to you to do something, and (*adopting AlPacino in Carlito’s Way voice “We are watching…”*)
Also love the casual dismissal of Sevco’s remaining life-raft, the LNS Commission.
Compare the clarity and dignity of that statement to the one we saw yesterday. Night and day.
I wouldn’t have said anything. All it says it wait to see if they appeal.
Very good statement.
Has a touch of; grenade in hand – pin pulled – trigger not released yet!
What we have to remember about your average Scottish football numpty is this.
Although they hate the facts that;
1) The huns cheated
2) That the SFA/SPL helped them
3) That not one iota of remorse has ever been shown by them
4) They they are overtly sectarian and are race supremacists
THEY HATE US FAR MORE FOR BEING WHO AND WHAT WE ARE.
NEVER FORGET IT
HH
Sorry Blind Faith fans I thought they were pretty dire just my opinion. H H Hebcelt
ItaliaBhoy…
With you on the statement, the fenian hand is hanging over thems, yep, that’ll do for the moment Celtic.
Campbell Ogilvie laid bare
https://scotfans4change.wordpress.com/2014/03/04/what-did-ogilvie-know/
HH
Why does HMRC not start looking for tax from the recipients as well ?
If the old club cannot pay, surely it’s not that difficult to get a few hundred grand out of Souness, Ferguson, McCann etc. ?