So much happened yesterday, I’ll be as brief as possible:
Newco Rangers sent their counsel to the Court of Session to protest Charles Green’s contract with the club, stating it should pay legal expenses, now crystallising ahead of his forthcoming criminal trial.
In opposing Green, James Wolffe QC raised various objections, but as is often the case when people speak on behalf of Newco, included an arbitrary insistence that Newco operated the same club as the now liquidated Rangers.
Green’s QC, Jonathan Brown, put his pit boots on before stating his client’s case, but tantalisingly, before lunch informed the court that he would return to the same club/new club debate later. And didn’t he. Brown explained that Sevco Scotland purchased the assets of Rangers, not the club itself, with poetic prose adding:
“The team are paid by Sevco, plat at a ground owned by Secvo, are trained by a manager who is employed by Sevco and fans buy tickets from Sevco. That is the business that is being carried on.”
Adding that Rangers were “a collection of assets”, “What if the players were sold to one person and Ibrox to antoher, where is the ‘club’ then?”
I had to look away from court reporter, James Dolman’s Twitter feed at this point. It was like watching an acquaintance being humiliated. Not something you want to see.
Lord Doherty will determine if Newco should pay Green’s costs in due course, but this will be soon, as Jonathan Brown noted, “the rainy day has arrived”.
This next bit is really important:
Soon after court ended, Dave King was out with a rambling statement on the Newco website. If it was designed to play to the galleries, it hit the spot. If it was designed to influence what happens to his club, or how others will regard his input, it was surely an horrendous mistake.
It was a hard day to be chairman of Rangers International FC PLC. The court hearing only happened because the club objected to its contract with Green, so the unedifying episode could easily have been avoided. Despite this, sometimes you have to shut your mouth.
Sure, some Newco fans love a bit of grandstanding, but you know what yesterday’s statement will achieve. If the objective of the statement was to convince other Scottish clubs not to consider disciplinary action against Sir David Murray, or oldco Rangers, for their actions, it was an almighty miscalculation.
Threats seldom work. This one is unlikely to curry favour: “If the history of our Club comes under attack we will deal with it in the strongest manner possible and will hold to account those persons who have acted against their fiduciary responsibilities to their own clubs and to Scottish football.”
In short:
Don’t threaten clubs you are trying to influence.
Don’t grandstand to your own fans if you are trying to influence other clubs.
Keep a poker face. Keep your mouth shut, even if it means taking grief from your fans for the lack of public reaction.
King’s statement also addressed the sporting advantage issue from what we now know was an unlawfully operated tax scheme. While the EBT scheme saved tens of millions of pounds, and King earlier intimated this did provide a sporting advantage, yesterday he insisted the advantage was financial, that the shareholders were “committed to providing funding to the club” and would have done so, if required.
Here’s the thing, in 2012 another King statement revealed, “I have made a claim of £20m on the basis of non-disclosure by the then chairman, David Murray, of Rangers true financial position as far back as 2000.”
That commitment to further shareholder funding seems predicated on some controversial information. According to King, of course. Controversial enough to launch a £20m claim, but not to inhibit investment.
For the war-chest hunters among you, if you read this article covering King’s 2012 statement, you’ll find a strong clue.
One other quick but important point:
Some media are attempting to portray questions of sporting advantage as Rangers being punished for spending money they could afford, a travesty, as so many other clubs have done likewise.
This must surely be a deliberate attempt to misunderstand the issue and manipulate the debate.
No one suggests Rangers should be punished for spending money they could not afford. The questions are straightforward:
Did Rangers break tax law, break SFA rules and break SPL rules, when contracting football players?
Did they disclose matters openly with authorities (in other words, inadvertently make mistakes), or did they conspire to subvert the rules by hiding incriminating information?
Spending like the Borgias? Time to move on. Conspiracy to subvert the rules? We have a problem.
Don’t be distracted by potential ramifications to these questions, they are irrelevant for now. We should consider no more than did they break all of the above rules, should any the rule breaking be interpreted as an oversight, or does evidence of conspiracy to subvert the rules exist?
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I’d like to add my (now sadly) not inconsiderable weight behind the campaign to save the reputation of one of Glasgow’s fairer parishes.
Chateau L’ait.
There was no king in that Chateau, just a lot of jokers.
So the statement is clear the courts and the SFA are required to deal with this, it also in my mind anyway reminds the SFA they are to uphold the integrity of the game by applying their own rules, no need at this stage for an or else.
The statement is a shot across the SFa’s bows!
Get intae them Celtic!
Could have ended on’we await the concluding court outcome with interest….’ ,but a warning shot across the boughs
Petethebeat –
Life’s more complicated than that. If you worked for a firm that deducted tax then didn’t pay it over, how would you react if years later HMRC asked if you wouldn’t mind paying it? Different if you’re a director though….
Celtic statement strikes the right tone and lays down a marker.
Off topic…my daughters boyfriend is going to the Mc Shane fight in Ayr tonight with a bus running from the Brazen.
Any bhoys on here going?
PETETHEBEAT on 13TH NOVEMBER 2015 4:27 PM
Why does HMRC not start looking for tax from the recipients as well ?
One of the 3 you mention,has been interviewed at least 3 times…….allegedly
If the old club cannot pay, surely it’s not that difficult to get a few hundred grand out of Souness, Ferguson, McCann etc. ?
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/spending-like-the-borgias-time-to-move-on-conspiracy-to-subvert-the-rules-we-have-a-problem/comment-page-5/#comment-2718117
ASimple, loaded statement from the club, issued, Ibelieve, to calm the wobbling jellies amongst us.
I would not like to play poker with DD or PL.
Good of Sky to facilitate empty stands for the LC semi.
Sensible dignified Statement from Celtic. The message is clear, only the Courts can decide on the legality or otherwise of EBT scheme, only the Football Authorities can decide on Title stripping.
It is perfectly obvious to anyone (including the SFA) reading the Statement that Celtic believe R*ngers cheated and should have their Titles stripped.
Making rabble rousing Statements or veiled threats is self defeating. Keep your dignity and try to win support amongst the rest of the Scottish Football Clubs & wait & see if Court decision is appealed.i
Strange, didn’t think there was any need for an official club statement. Anyway, a wee warning shot from Celtic I think.
BBC Scotland covering the second Gallowgate kettling incident at 6:30pm for anyone interested.
I can understand why some would have been happier had Celtic remained quiet…….but they have not. So, if we want to deal in reality, what do we think of the Statement? I like it. It is like a simple but classy little black dress compared to Alice`s wedding dress in The Vicar of Dibley. Said wedding dreass of course, being Glibby`s statement (s). 18:14 :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g63ZwxYt424
JJ
Neganon2 I await your considered response to our clubs statement take your time. H H Hebcelt
Both glad and worried that Celtic have said anything before the possible appeal is made. I can just imagine what the SMSM are going to make of it, never mind the rabble rousing knuckle draggers of the deid team. Still, if it puts the frighteners on the SFA high heid yins, then GOOOOOOOOD. They should be talking to their lawyers, imo.
Well that’s a nice big pickaxe driven into the frozen silence of the 41, let’s see if it cracks. :-)
A long question to John James and an even longer answer.
But I love the title.
I am never sure whether this is heading in a direction that I will like, but if it exposes the lies and deception of King and the complicity of the media – then I am fine with it.
“”The Shirebrook Iceberg
“JJ what’s the next iceberg that’s looming on the horizon, is it the EGM, King in court for contempt or potential cash flow issues with November’s payroll?I’m losing track of what’s happening, there are so many moving pieces here it’s incredible. Ashleys is suing the SFA and now I’ve read that he is refusing to pay a £1,000 fine (not sure if that’s to the SFA or SPFL) and is disputing it in court. This is going to be interesting as the club have refused to pay the £250k LNS fine as well. Will both fines stand or will Ashley argue that as the club won’t pay the £250k fine he shouldn’t pay his?The MSM reporting that’s come out of yesterday’s hearing is seriously skewed as well. The two reports I’ve seen have failed to mention Jonathan Brown’s comments re Sevco. How can they report a court case without making reference to Brown’s argument, it beggars belief!
This has become the most toxic sporting scandal I’ve ever seen in the UK. When it finally reaches boiling point it’s going to scald a lot of people including the SFA / SPFL, MSM and clubs officials past & present. People will surely end up in jail and it don’t think that it will just be the current suspects who’s trial is pending!”
My thanks to Wessex for framing a number of questions which cover the majority of queries I have received in the past week. In regard to my previous articles The Wolffe of Parliament Square/The Elephant In The Room, I faithfully recorded the twitter feed of James Doleman who commendably gave of his time yesterday. As I understand matters, James is a freelance journalist. He does not have to report to an editor nor follow an agenda. A journalist at The Record took one statement by Mr Wolffe QC and created an article from it. It’s a statement that I take issue with as the negotiated settlement in Green’s compromise agreement is persuasive. However the narrative that sells copy is that Green is one of the bete noire in an unfolding drama.
I have been asked why Jonathan Brown chose to dispel the myth of a club existing independently of its owner/operators. A number of the criminal indictments predate the time when Green took office. Mr Wolffe posited an argument that these indictments were outwith the timeline where any indemnity could be claimed. Mr Brown stated unequivocally that nothing predates Sevco.The team are paid by Sevco, play at a ground owned by Sevco, trained by a manager who is employed by Sevco, fans buy tickets from Sevco. Rangers was a basket of assets that could be sold, but these were not indivisible.The players went one way and the ground another.There is no club, just a company. That company was and is Sevco.
I think this is crystal clear, although I’m sure Jim Fraser will be along soon to challenge this as a matter of interpretation. Rangers fans have become inordinately adept at objection-handling. If the truth does not suit their preferred narrative, they first of all attack the messenger and then revert to the most forensic examination of semantics.The Daily Record could have led with ‘you cannot be the CEO of an undertaking’ but that does chime with the ‘Rangers then, Rangers now, Rangers forever’ rhetoric. We await Lord Raymond Doherty’s written verdict with interest.
The £250,000 fine is owed to the SPFL, plus the costs incurred by the commission led by William Austin Nimmo Smith who retired from active duty on the bench, on 30 September 2009. It is the view of many that Mr Smith was presented with a ‘dodgy dossier’ so as to avoid highlighting the negligence and incompetence of Sandy Bryson’s Registrations Department at the SFA.
Which leads to the real problem in regard to title stripping.If the Smith report is not defended, then Bryson and the SFA are further exposed. The Smith report stated that RFC plc deliberately chose not to comply with SFA rules. If on the other hand the club was pushing against an open door and that some at the SFA were aware of the tax scam, then that would be a much more serious matter. Campbell Ogilvie evidently knew about the tax scam but failed to inform his colleagues at the SFA, if we were to believe the preferred narrative. The fact that Mr Ogilvie owned shares in RIFC, that he transferred to his wife’s name, should have excused him from the vote on whether King was fit and proper. Ashley knows this and is pursuing this matter in the Court of Session. In a court of law, Ogilvie’s vested interest will almost certainly lead to a judicial review of the SFA decision.
As I see things,one of the major areas of concern is the roles of Topping and Doncaster, who are members of the SFA’s Professional Gaming Board. So let’s run with this. If the Smith report is set aside due to the legally binding Court of Session judgments and a new review was ordered; and Rangers chose to appeal the decision of the SPFL to effect the tariffs recommended by an independent commission; could Topping and Doncaster change hats to uphold their appeal at the SFA? Could they appear to get tough to assuage the baying masses, then change hats to uphold an appeal which neuters the tariffs?
The AGM could well be an EGM requisitioned by Ashley. We have no way of knowing the truth of the matter as the lack of transparency of this shyster board truly beggars belief. Here is a scenario that no-one has thought of. Ashley could go to court to request that King is struck off as a company director due to his participation in a tax impropriety scheme at RFC plc. Company directors have a duty to come forward if they are aware of tax impropriety. The fact that King chose to do nothing and has now stated that he was aware of this scheme at the time, it follows that King has a case to answer.
Ashley will keep his powder dry until the 28 day appeal window is closed. He has something planned for the EGM/AGM which is reputed to be a game changer. We can guarantee that his focus will be King.””
Very weak statement. Matter for football authorities translate SWEEP SWEEP.
Status quo statement on our part.
i would rather our club had said nothing.
HH
ThomtheTim BBC Scotland not Sky
Lennon’s Passion, I am sorry to say this but you Sir are an Ass.
The second best laugh I have had this week is Celtic fans threatening to boycott the LC semi final.
Kim Jong-il: Aw, Hans Brix!
Hans Blix: Let me look around, so I can ease the UN’s collective mind.
Kim Jong-il: Hans, ya-breakin’ my barrs here, Hans, ya breakin’ my barrs!
Hans Blix: I’m sorry, but the UN must be firm with you. Let me see your whole palace, or else…
Kim Jong-il: Or erse what?
Hans Blix: Or else we will be very, very angry with you… And we will write you a letter, telling you how angry we are.
Kim Jong-il: Ok, I show you around. First, move to your to reft a rittle.
[Blix moves]
Kim Jong-il:Rittle more.
[moves again]
Kim Jong-il:Good.
[opens trap door then walks to shark tank]
Kim Jong-il:There you go Hans Brix! How you rike that you fucking cock-sucker?
[watching a shark tear Hans apart] Do you have any idea how fucking busy I am? Werr, f*** you. You want inspection? Werr inspect that you *utt-fu**ing piece of shit. What, you think I’m just a petty arms dearer? I’m pranning the attack. Congraturations Team America, you have stopped nothing.
HH
NEGANON2 on 13TH NOVEMBER 2015 2:06 PM
Timaloy 29. SIgh.
This saga has been going on for years and, perhaps apart from being “surprised” by the LNS decision celtic have said and done precisely nothing. When res 12 appeared they didnt take responsibility for it – and that is a disgrace. When the huns wanted in the top league in their new incarnation celtic said nothing (I am assured they voted them out but ONLY because they knew what the celtic support would do if they didnt).
They hankered for rangers publicly time and again. They have attacked their own support at every opportunity – including helping to criminalise them.
They have said the OB act is wrong but done precisely nothing about it.
They were involved in the 5 way agreement.
They pretend rangers are the same club.
So what makes you or anyone else think that things are different here. Celtic remain silent. true to form.
Now we are told this is a clever move (havent we always been told that) that we should wait to ensure no appeal. But tell me, when that day comes and goes and silence remains. What will you say then?
We hear lots of things about celtic working behind the scenes etc but every single indication that we get is that they desire the return of the racist £.
The huns certainly are delusional – but I suspect that many of us are too.
======
When the fog of war finally clears around Res12 and LNS and if CQN have a Fanny of The Year Award it will either be you or me.
Given that I’m now in my 70th year I’m making you favourite to win by some lengths.
Think Jackie Mac may have an agenda against us….go to guy for an anti Tic slant.
HH
I like the Statement from the Club
…Short and Sweet….
Im Happy Hope Youre Happy Too…
he second best laugh I have had this week is Celtic fans threatening to boycott the LC semi final.
Kim Jong-il: Aw, Hans Brix!
Hans Blix: Let me look around, so I can ease the UN’s collective mind.
Kim Jong-il: Hans, ya-breakin’ my barrs here, Hans, ya breakin’ my barrs!
Hans Blix: I’m sorry, but the UN must be firm with you. Let me see your whole palace, or else…
Kim Jong-il: Or erse what?
Hans Blix: Or else we will be very, very angry with you… And we will write you a letter, telling you how angry we are.
Kim Jong-il: Ok, I show you around. First, move to your to reft a rittle.
[Blix moves]
Kim Jong-il:Rittle more.
[moves again]
Kim Jong-il:Good.
[opens trap door then walks to shark tank]
Kim Jong-il:There you go Hans Brix! How you rike that you fucking cock-sucker?
[watching a shark tear Hans apart] Do you have any idea how fu**ing busy I am? Werr, f*** you. You want inspection? Werr inspect that you *utt-fu**ing piece of shit. What, you think I’m just a petty arms dearer? I’m pranning the attack. Congraturations Team America, you have stopped nothing.
HH
Auldheid,
Glad I am not being considered ;-)
HH
RWE…
After reading TD’s post from earlier, I asked one of my mates about King coming from castlemilk.
He reckons he did and went to Grange high school, he’ll do a bit of digging and get back to me…no joking :)
Statement was of the bland nature that would suffice when DD is asked about THEM.
I see the club have issued a statement on the cheating. Ol’ Pete must have found it quite tricky typing that out while sitting on his hands. Mibbe he used his nose -:))
I don’t know what people were expecting from Celtic here … I personally expected stony silence.
Yesterday, King made that impossible. His statement was a disgrace, and made a response inevitable.
And the response itself? Perfect. As a former politico I read that as a clear statement; we’ve put our guns on the table, and the guns are loaded.
Anyone who thinks that says “We’re doing nothing and we’re willing to leave it at that ain’t reading between the lines.”
It quite clearly reminds people of their own responsibilities.
It says nothing about how we’re in a position to actually force them to. And I think the line about this still being subject to appeal is a dark hint about us being willing to bide our time … for a couple of weeks at least.
I think this nails it.
Excuse the numerous typos in that :)
Writing on the move.
I get the impresson that some posters wont be happy unless Peter Lawell is offering King and Ogilvie a skwerr go.
“HEBCELT on 13TH NOVEMBER 2015 4:37 PM
Neganon2 I await your considered response to our clubs statement take your time. H H Hebcelt”
My guess would be that Neganon won`t like it. Not sure why I think that. Just an inspired guess.
LENNON`S PASSION
I am left to assume that you think Glibby`s statement was a cracker. Yes?
JJ
JJ “Inspired guesses R Us” H H Hebcelt
Jobo Baldie on 13th November 2015 4:29 pm
Life is more complicated.
The problem for the tax dodging players is that their P60s show they did not pay enough tax on their earnings.
My understanding is that the “loans” had a 10 year term. When the 10 years were up they would be automatically rolled over for another 10 years. Now when the loan expires they will be required to pay tax and NIC on it. The tax dodgers should then become creditors to the original rangers, who promised to cover them from HMRC.
HMRC will get their tax and NIC as and when it becomes due. Their call on BDO will reduce as the tax dodgers call increases.
LENNON`S PASSION
Just for a bit of fun,` release` the Statement you would like to have seen.
JJ
I would imagine that Celtic are reacting to a barrage of E- mails.
I think we are all aware by now that it is impossible to satisfy everyone. I am happy. ( I am not a dwarf before someone posts it )
HH.
Tim Malone Will Tell on 13th November 2015 4:55 pm
…or a skwerr sausage