Where is this relationship going?

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Signing young players on loan has worked well for Celtic in the recent past: Patrick Roberts and Odsonne Edouard, being good examples.  While others, like Charly Musonda, failed to make the grade.  Musonda had talent (you remember that chip against Zenit), but he never looked up to the physical challenges of the professional game.

When Celtic sign the likes of Timothy Weah on a short-term loan, our initial thought is, “Where is this relationship going?”  Will the loan be extended, as it was for Roberts, or end in a purchase, as it did for Edouard, or will this be a one-off gig?

Weah appears to have abundant talent but his chances of breakthrough at PSG are limited.  Mbappe, Neymar and Cavani head an illustrious list of strikers at a club always looking to add to their squad.  It is more likely that the Paris club will look to build Weah’s value at Celtic in the hope of earning an inflated transfer fee.  This practice is how all tier-one clubs operate and underpins their Financial Fair Play credentials.

It is important for Celtic to build a squad – to manage our assets.  The try before you buy model, used effectively with Edouard, works well in this regard.  Building relationships with PSG or Man City, who know their players can gain necessary experience and appreciate in value, means we remain a valuable option for future deals.

But we also need to win football games, irrespective of more strategic concerns, even if there is no long-term relationship with the player.  Sometimes it is OK for a relationship not to last beyond the summer.

Welcome to Celtic, Timothy.

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  1. traditionalist88 on

    MADMITCH on 8TH JANUARY 2019 11:52 AM

     

     

    The problem with going global for 17/18 year olds is that overachievers in that age bracket have a path laid out to the first team where they are.

     

     

    Added to this if they are at a club in one of the big 5 leagues they will be on huge money.

     

     

    So what you are looking at tier 2/3 players at that age group. You then start to question if they are really that much better than the youth we already have.

     

     

    Oliver Burke was judged to be in the top category at that age group and that was a mistake. If a player makes a similiar fall from tier 2 down you are left with a player who is probably not going to be able to handle the SPL.

     

     

    On the flip side other players in tier 2 at age 17/18 will make the jump up and become better players than predicted.

     

     

    But unless we have a crystal ball there is no way to be absolutely certain who those players will be.

     

     

    At age 21 West Brom are still hedging their bets on Oliver Burke.

     

     

    Going out and signing foreign 17/18 year old tier 2/3 players in bulk with limited analysis on their performances is not a sustainable strategy IMO. Lets not forget at that age you probably have to pay for them, and moving to Scotland to become 4th choice in their position is probably not in their life or career plans,

     

     

    HH

  2. Recycling from before …

     

     

    T88 @ 11.14

     

     

    OK — I will try and add some detail to help you with your analysis.

     

     

    If we go global for 17 / 18 year olds it will be to improve our youth set up not put them straight into our first team squad — sorry for any confusion you may have had regarding my thoughts.

     

     

    We have the example of TW who at 18 is seemingly being brought in to the first team squad. You are correct this is the exception but it has been brought on by our paucity of local equivalents and and a player / forward shortage in our first team squad.

     

     

    To repeat — my point is that currently we are paying big money for 20/21/22 year olds.

     

    Surely a better balance would be to try and get some — repeat some — of them in at 18.

     

    Better mix and better financials but more effort and better youth coaching.

     

     

    I am for a full age group youth set up just a case that your last point does not hold water at the moment — we are losing out locally regarding youth talent. We have the best facilities, the highest profile players and the biggest stage but we are not domination youth football as we should.

     

     

    My thoughts are that we should have multiple streams.

     

     

    Local school based academy.

     

    Regional centres across the country.

     

    Couple of overseas bases.

     

     

    All these feeding into a U19 set up with the addition of projects and punts based on what we come across and specific issues with a particular age groups — example: limited talent at CB for the 2001’s then bring in someone from outside.

     

     

    U19’s / U20’s / U21’s — then three choices:

     

    First team squad / loan for the talented but immature / free transfer out.

     

     

    From the outside we seem to have tried this to some extent but recently the U20 / U21 age group seems to have been broken up prematurely to the extent that we do not seem to have a settled side.

  3. Big Georges Fan Club - Hail, Hail, Wee Oscar on

    “…But we also need to win football games, irrespective of more strategic concerns, even if there is no long-term relationship with the player…”

     

     

    Agree with this – as long as it doesn’t become too prevalent (i.e., any more than one or two players), which would be very much to the detriment of squad coherence and long-term stability.

     

     

    HH

     

    BGFC

  4. PAUL67

     

     

    Hoi!

     

     

    These non controversial posts will not do!

     

     

    Get wi’ the plan!

     

     

    Hope you and your family had a great new year!

  5. Good afternoon CQN

     

    I see online there is a rumour of Daniel Sturridge on a 6 month loan deal.

     

     

    anyone know if there is any truth in this?

     

     

    D.:)

  6. Delaneys Dunky on

    SOT

     

    Sun is shining brightest in Clydebank today than it has for months. Listening to your tunes I am in Jamaica today. Magical sounds.

     

    Thank you

     

    YNWA

  7. The reality is we need two strikers. As we already have two at the club on long term deals one was always going to be a loan. It was then a question of how much we would invest in the other and the answer appears to be £2m. Both have the potential to score goals and be successful. Weah really needs to deliver in the short term where as Bayo has more time to make an impact. I have no idea what will happen but I’m relatively comfortable that we have enough between now and the end of the season in an attacking sense.

     

     

    Where we really need to do good business is at right back. I would go as far as to say that our 8 in a row effort could hinge on that position. It is now critical that we eliminate that weakness with an appropriate level of investment. For me Lustig has reached the end and Ralston is not tested of suitably experienced. If we don’t recruit a suitable right back I genuinely fear for the rest of our season.

  8. For me, winning the League this year is the most important objective. So, if Tim is as good as I hope he will be, I will be satisfied with an input that leads to the title being ours again.

     

     

    JJ

  9. T88 @ this recycling lark

     

     

    As noted before — please comments on my thoughts as I wrote them rather than on a partial and slanted analysis as you seem to be doing at the moment.

     

     

    My base point — our youth set up is poor.

     

    The decline seems to have started before BR joined but it continues and we are in a poor place.

     

     

    My second point — if we are trying to to buy for big money MC and PSG projects and ex projects at 20 / 21 / 22 surely it would be better to do our scouting earlier when they were 17 or 18.

     

     

    Not a full team but enough to improve our internal youth team output at that age group.

  10. http://www.espn.com/soccer/soccer-transfers/story/3745455/psgs-timothy-weah-extends-contract-joins-celtic-on-season-loan-source?platform=amp&__twitter_impression=true

     

     

    Should Weah impress at Celtic Park and show signs of development, a source told ESPN FC that he will likely remain there for the entirety of next season.

     

     

    PSG and Celtic are on good terms after Odsonne Edouard joined the Scottish champions permanently in the summer following a successful loan spell

  11. David17

     

     

    ` Where we really need to do good business is at right back. I would go as far as to say that our 8 in a row effort could hinge on that position. `

     

     

    I , too, have worried about Lustig for quite a while now.Unlike yourself, though, I don`t think the rest of the Scottish teams are close enough to us to exploit that weakness. Anyway, Mikel might come back rejuvenated and play like he used to :-))

     

     

    JJ

  12. Delaneys Dunky on

    David 66

     

    Hope it is a load of borrocks.

     

    Sturridge no thanks.

     

    We need to build a team.

     

    Huns sign has beens like him.

     

    PS

     

    Think Davis will be shite, but Defoe will score plenty in our league. Great player 2 year ago and prior to that. Great striker.

     

    YNWA

  13. T88 @ 12.23

     

     

    Tried to answer your points as best I could.

     

     

    Will sign off with a desire to stop the excuse making that hobbles so many.

     

    Plus a desire to see us improve rather than stagnate and decline that is the current situation.

     

     

    Globally 18 years olds will come — especially if involves higher education.

     

    Just need to get creative — we don’t need to bring all just enough to improve the team.

  14. traditionalist88 on

    MADMITCH on 8TH JANUARY 2019 12:27 PM

     

     

    You mean like you’re doing with my posts?!

     

     

    I’ve highlighted why it is too simplistic to say scout/get them earlier.

     

     

    I gave you examples in Oliver Burke and Ryan Gauld who we’d love to have had at the age group you mention.

     

     

    Additionally at 17/18 PSG and Man City have the luxury and the resources to hold off and see if these guys are going to make the grade for them. They can also be selective of where to send them on loan.

     

     

    HH

  15. Delaneys Dunky on

    David 17

     

    I would trust Anthony in right back position till season ends and we win the treble treble.

     

    YNWA

  16. GlassTwoThirdsFull on

    Any truth in the rumour that Dave King was spotted with a snorkel and flippers after hearing Sevco were going to Tenner Reef?

  17. Delaneys Dunky on

    Hot Smoked

     

    I think Anthony Ralston is about to become a true Celtic player. Like this strong bhoy.

     

    YNWA

  18. HOT [email protected]

     

    I think Ralston should be given the time to try and earn his place.

     

    Lustig could be used sparingly.

     

    Like you said most Scottish teams are not close enough to exploit this weakness but it’s worth noting Kent did in sevco game and in the 4-2 victory over Hibs at Celtic park both goals against were directly due to Lustig errors in a game we should have been more comfortable.

  19. Delaneys Dunky on

    Fan a Tic

     

    Kent raped a weak Mik.

     

    Anthony had Kent in his poakit second half.

     

    Young Team Ya Bass. 😎

  20. Paul67

     

     

    Doing what no other club can do, tapping into the mega rich Chelsea, Man City, PSG and their

     

    young star players.

     

     

    What’s not to like in the quest for excellence and entertainment at Celtic Park?, we are the breeding ground with the support, stadia, facilities and platform all unequalled, in pursuit of trebles, we are the envy of ‘anyone but Celtic’.

     

     

    Our relationship with Paddy Roberts was for 2 ½ seasons, we should be back in for him to come home, massive changes in summer shouldn’t prevent us from signing a player where the defence needs sorted now.

     

     

    Get the chequebook out Celtic CSC

  21. DELANEY’S DUNKY @12-53

     

    Totally agree.

     

    We are to quick to write off our youngsters.

     

    Until a youngster gets a decent run in the team we should hold back on judgement.

     

    The phrase no good enough gets used to frequent.

  22. DELANEYS DUNKY on 8TH JANUARY 2019 12:37 PM

     

    David 17

     

     

    I would trust Anthony in right back position till season ends and we win the treble treble.

     

     

    ——–

     

     

    Tony has the bit between his teeth now and appears to take no prisoners, which i really like. No reason why he cant make the position his own over the next 2/3 season but i think now we need genuine quality given how high the stakes are.

  23. traditionalist88 on

    BSR

     

     

    Agree about Paddy Roberts, remove some of the creative burden from Jamesy and provide something different with style of driving directly for goal.

     

     

    I thought his contract was up at end of season but I believe it is actually summer 2020. Still, Man City prob looking to do a perm deal this summer,

     

     

    HH

  24. Delaneys Dunky on

    David 17

     

    Hope Anthony can be a long term solution for us. Like me, you follow Celtic home and away.

     

    We see Anthony’s shortcomings.

     

    I would go for Clyne.

     

    YNWA

  25. traditionalist88 on

    BIG WAVY on 8TH JANUARY 2019 1:21 PM

     

    Paddy Roberts appears to be very injury prone…

     

    ====

     

     

    So was wee Jamesy…

     

     

    HH

  26. BIG WAVY on 8TH JANUARY 2019 1:19 PM

     

    Southside

     

     

     

    Seamus Coleman ??

     

     

     

    Can’t see it personally.

     

     

    Naw, a bit more obvious

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