Much of the response from Duff and Phelps to last night’s revelations by Mark Daly on the BBC website centred around their fees. BBC revealed that partner, David Grier, emailed Craig Whyte to say, “We propose to cap our fees in respect of an (sic) CVA or Administration to £500k, however, we request the ability to discuss with you an additional payment in respect of our total time costs, in so far as this does not impact on your position.”
Contracting to cap fees at £500k when you subsequently bill creditors £3.5m for your own time plus £2m legal costs would embarrass many of us, though not everyone. Duff and Phelps added a caveat that they could discuss additional payment as long as it did not impact on Craig Whyte’s position, which they perhaps did.
The more interesting part of the exchange between Whyte and Greir is their preparation for “HMRC being hostile”.
Craig Whyte:
“I’d like to speak to David [Whitehouse] and Paul [Clark] to make sure that they’re comfortable with the fact that we might end up with HMRC being hostile (I suspect this will end up being the case so you should go into it with your eyes open)”
David Grier:
“Agreed.”
It is fascinating to wonder how comfortable Mr Whitehouse and Mr Clark were with Craig Whyte’s plans in the event HMRC were hostile. HMRC are Rangers largest creditors. Administrators run the company in the interests of the creditors, not the shareholders.
Three days after this email exchange Rangers went to court to insist Duff and Phelps were appointed administrators instead of an appointment by HMRC.
Last week Duff and Phelps denied they have a conflict of interest concerning this administration. They are currently negotiating a CVA with HMRC and other creditors.
E-lites are opening a concession on the first floor of Buchanan Galleries tomorrow. They are giving away a free copy of CQN Magazine to customers throughout June, while stocks last.
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Wonkyradar
Did bell not ‘steal’ the idea of telephone?
I remember something about contested patents .
Dunlop invented his tyre in Belfast so you cant have that either…
Irish inventions beat Scots inventions all day long…..
Whiskey, Guinness and …
Sligo man ‘invented’ Celtic
Onlooker
Stirringitup CSC
Sixteen roads to Golgotha on 31 May, 2012 at 12:57 said:
>>>
Aye….I was just talking last night to my missus about how good this site is for far more than football,and if you don’t understand something you can just ask and get an informative,non-judgemmental answer or two,and that people help each other out on all sorts of matters.
Epitomises Celtic.
Macjay
Tinternet bampots are us, see you’re off up another dreel lookin for nubile nubians ;)
It’s just so easy to get lost on here.
HH
It would be some craic if Duff & whatever ya call them ended up not getting any of the money that they are owed by the huns.
As for those Ticketus moomins – surely the idiot whom sanctioned the subbing to £26million to those bankrupts,must have been dismissed from his job?
That fool reminds me of the exploits yer man Nick Leeson.(God rest his soul)
A brief word on James Clerk Maxwell of Glenlair (13 June 1831 – 5 November 1879) A Scottish physicist and mathematician. His most prominent achievement was formulating classical electromagnetic theory. This unites all previously unrelated observations, experiments, and equations of electricity, magnetism, and optics into a consistent theory. Maxwell’s equations demonstrate that electricity, magnetism and light are all manifestations of the same phenomenon, namely the electromagnetic field. Subsequently, all other classic laws or equations of these disciplines became simplified cases of Maxwell’s equations. Maxwell’s achievements concerning electromagnetism have been called the “second great unification in physics”, after the first one realised by Isaac Newton. His work in producing a unified model of electromagnetism is one of the greatest advances in physics. Maxwell also helped develop the Maxwell–Boltzmann distribution, which is a statistical means of describing aspects of the kinetic theory of gases. These two discoveries helped usher in the era of modern physics, laying the foundation for such fields as special relativity and quantum mechanics. Which explains Einstein massive sense of debt he owed Maxwell for all his achievements. For without Maxwell as a precursor Einstein would never have conceived of his own Theory of Relativity. In fact on the centennial of Maxwell’s birthday, Einstein himself described Maxwell’s work as the “most profound and the most fruitful that physics has experienced since the time of Newton.” Einstein kept a photograph of Maxwell on his study wall, alongside pictures of Michael Faraday and Newton. Maxwell is considered by many physicists to be the 19th-century scientist having the greatest influence on 20th-century physics. His contributions to the science are considered by many to be of the same magnitude as those of Isaac Newton and Albert Einstein.
Maxwell contributed to the field of optics and the study of colour vision, creating the foundation for practical colour photography.In 1871, he established Maxwell’s thermodynamic relations, which are statements of equality among the second derivatives of the thermodynamic potentials with respect to different thermodynamic variables. In 1874, he constructed a plaster thermodynamic visualisation as a way of exploring phase transitions, based on the American scientist Josiah Willard Gibbs’s graphical thermodynamics papers.
You cannot even begin to scratch the surface of what this man’s influence and achievements- he died age only 47. Maxwell is buried at Parton Kirk, near Castle Douglas in Galloway. In my modest opinion he is the greatest scientific genius in history. And yet how many of our children know who he is? This is fairly symptomatic of our not being a “proper independent nation”. James Watt is arguably the most important inventor in history; James Hutton with his geological theories of deep time probably did more to shape our psychological perceptions of the universe than any other man in history ( yet who knows him compared to say, Darwin). Every child in Scotland should know who David Hume and Adam Smith are ( two men who shaped the thought of the modern world more than any other).
What of Literature? Outside the three giants of Scott, Burns & Robert Louis Stevenson: Scotland despite producing Edin Morgan, Hugh MacDiarmid, Edwin Muir, Neil Gunn, Norman MacCaig, Alasdair Gray, George Mackay-Brown, we still haven’t had a Scots Nobel Prize winner for Literature…yet Ireland has multimple winners- why is that? I think we are viewed as a cultural backwater and region within the United Kingdom. Not a proud, dignified, independent nation that we should be.
Sorry for boring anyone who might have had the misfortune to read this- that’s the end of these non-football posts for today from me.
Sorry.
WRobertTressell on 31 May, 2012 at 13:06 said:
why any of us continue to deal in fact while you can simply cut through us with ‘truths’ like ‘Kenya would be better off if it was still part of the UK’ surely ends any silly notion I had that thousands of Kenyans were ethnically cleansed in British Concentration camps which is based on reading books and articles on the subject.
Fact?
Who wrote the books and articles?
Back up your assertions with facts and/or proof.
Put up or shut up.
from FF
they just don’t get what’s happening do they???
Team for next season?
Now that the transfer embargo has been deemed unlawful and Mr Green can invest in the playing squad, I was thinking about our potential starting XI for next season.
Gattuso and Black both seem keen on moves, and I don’t think it’s outwith the realms of possibility to tempt King Carlos back.
I reckon the only other position we would need to strengthen in would be a striker, possibly Kenny Miller?
If so, we could be looking at a lineup of
McGregor
Whittaker
Bocanegra
Cuellar
Wallace
Aluko
Gattuso
Black
Davis
Naismith
Miller
Certainly looks capable of winning the SPL.
Ernie
Of all the things I’ve learned on CQN, the most profound was never to argue with Celtic_First on matters of theology.
To answer your question, Calvinist yes, Wee Free no. The majority of choirs, as I understand it, performing this style of music come from the US, amongst which Dutch and German Prebyterian churches for example have far greater congregations than our own local Wee fellas.
Richie
Do you feel I missed something out?
RobertTressell on 31 May, 2012 at 13:06 said:
I honestly think/thought he was/is on the wind up.
miki67 on 31 May, 2012 at 13:10 said:
Big time mate – the only downside is that CQN can be addictive.
Best be on my way now.
Good luck everybody.
HH.
Mort on 31 May, 2012 at 12:10 said:
Thanks. So HMRC were wary of Whyte & Co.
And nothing since then has been part of a grand plan – it’s all just crisis (mis)management.
I do find it interesting that HMRC, in whose interest D&P are supposed to be acting, are described as ‘hostile’.
gallagher on 31 May, 2012 at 13:12 said:
Macjay
Tinternet bampots are us, see you’re off up another dreel lookin for nubile nubians ;)
Actually I found one.
And married her.
The Onlooker on 31 May, 2012 at 13:09 said:
Irish inventions beat Scots inventions all day long…..
Whiskey, Guinness and …
Sligo man ‘invented’ Celtic
There is no answer to that- how can ANY nation on Gods great green earth compete with such perfection!
wonkyradar on 31 May, 2012 at 13:14 said:
So Scotland has punched above its weight in terms of science and technology because Scotland and the Scots are great but has been less productive than Ireland in the arts because we are part of the UK?
Is that about the size of it?
I did not realise how much of a bitter wee hun Matt Lindsay of the Evening Times was until I read todays piece regarding the SPL meeting. It is like something from FF.
The Battered Bunnet on 31 May, 2012 at 13:16 said:
Let me have another go.
Is it a style of music that most posters on here would most associate with the wee frees?
The good thing is that D&P are currently being investigated ……..we might see an administrator take this on yet……
Al Lamont says a BBC colleague is preparing to break the news from the dual contracts meeting.
Not the ole CQN Wee Free Song debate…
ASonOfDan on 31 May, 2012 at 13:17 said:
Richie
Do you feel I missed something out?
————————————————-
very droll
no, I just find your comments offensive to Scots and maybe misplaced on a Scottish team’s supporters blog.
By the way, ItaliaBhoy, I meant to say I agreed with your post this morning about Al Lamont’s lamentation regarding the SPL meeting yesterday.
Macjaywhat a wonderful world
Paul67 et al
Looks like the Norwich-Celtic match was Paul Lambert’s last game in charge of the club. Today’s reports, kind of explain Paul’s outburst during a press conference, which I think was just after the Celtic game. Now obviously Aston Villa are a bigger club than Norwich, but am I the only one who thinks this might be a backward step for Paul?
The Duke of Buccleuch has a debenture seat in the main stand at Ibrox next to Prince Albert of Monaco….
bulls***CSC
wonkyradar
Sorry for boring anyone who might have had the misfortune to read this- that’s the end of these non-football posts for today from me.
Don`t please apologise for your interesting contribution.
You have educated me about Mr. Maxwell of whom I had never heard.
Maxwelltown braes are bonny.
gallagher on 31 May, 2012 at 13:25 said:
Macjaywhat a wonderful world
Pure Perfection.
Black’s- Wonderful Life is no too shabby either.
Dundee United chairman Stephen Thompson has hailed as ”a big step forward” the SPL’s ruling on how to judge future newco applications.
When the representatives of the top-flight teams gathered at Hampden on Wednesday the most contentious matter on the agenda was the issue pertaining directly to Rangers, who are trying to come out of administration via a Company Voluntary Arrangement (CVA) but who will use the new company route if that is unsuccessful.
The 12 clubs refrained from imposing fixed sanctions on the Light Blues should they ultimately have to apply to stay in the league as a newco.
The proposed rule change would have seen clubs who undergo an ”insolvency transfer” docked 10 points for two seasons and lose 75% of their income for three years.
Instead, a resolution was passed which means the decision on admitting a newco club, formerly taken by the six-man SPL board, would henceforth be made by all 12 clubs and considered on its own merits.
Tannadice chief Thompson was satisfied that the clubs had done all they could under the most trying of circumstances.
”It was a very positive meeting and the SPL got back to business today,” said Thompson. ”Taking the decision on any possible newco — and ‘possible’ is the important word here — from the board to all the clubs and judging it on a case-by-case basis is a big step forward.
”I think that is the right thing to do because no two companies are the same. What might be the right thing to do in one case might not be right for another.
”And that doesn’t mean one rule for one and one for another — it is about looking at the situation and deciding what is best.
”Judging things on a case-by-case basis will take into account circumstances and that is the way it should be. As far as I am concerned, this is a positive move.”
SPL chief executive Neil Doncaster described the fixed penalty proposal as ”obsolete”.
He added: ”With the change in rules meaning that any application for a share transfer would now be considered by the clubs in a general meeting rather than the board, a fixed penalty is not appropriate.”
”The clubs have decided that, should they be in a situation in future where they were considering an application for the transfer of share to a newco, it would be on the basis that the members could impose a sanction proportionate to the individual circumstances. So the fixed penalties were deemed obsolete and therefore withdrawn.
”But I think it is important to stress that there is no newco application for us (to consider). There is a CVA proposal which have gone to creditors and on that basis we are not anticipating a newco proposal to come forward.”
Doncaster confirmed Rangers’ preferred bidder Charles Green was present at the meeting.
The Ibrox club’s creditors will vote on the a CVA proposal on June 14. If passed, the Light Blues could come out of administration on July 12 and there would be no decision for the SPL to make.
The proposal states that, if the CVA is rejected or other conditions of the deal are not satisfied by July 23, Green’s Sevco consortium is contractually obliged to buy the ”business and assets” of the company for £5.5 million by July 30.
Doncaster also claimed the most significant points to come out of the get-together were the ”very heavy sanctions for clubs going into administration in the future.”
Clubs who enter admin will lose at least 10 points — cut from the original proposal of 15 — or one third of their previous season’s tally, whichever is greater.
The SPL clubs also approved an extension of sporting sanctions to the parent company of an SPL club that goes into administration and updated the definition of ”insolvency events” in the SPL rules to reflect developments in insolvency law.
Clubs will also be obliged pay their players and Her Majesty’s Revenue and Customs on time and be subject to sanctions if they fail to meet their tax obligations.
A vote to decide the financial fair play matters had been put off twice before and one other hugely significant matter was postponed again on Wednesday.
The resolution to amend SPL voting rules to an 9-3 in all cases was adjourned to the SPL’s annual meeting on July 16.
Currently there is an 11-1 majority needed for major reform, in reality meaning a two-vote veto for the Old Firm.
……Ally just couldn’t stomach it, probably……
or is he another St Mirren/ Airdrie/ Clyde supporter….?
Aye!
Breakfast conversation at Balmoral —
Charles – ” Mutti , I’m going to the Hunt Ball at Buccleuch-I don’t know what to wear ”
The Queen —— ” Wear the fox hat “
Celtic_First on 31 May, 2012 at 13:24 said:
Al Lamont says a BBC colleague is preparing to break the news from the dual contracts meeting.
========
In another era this story would have been swept under the carpet by the authorities and newspapers to protect the huns. Thank God for the bampots on the internet.
Can I just say that the Wee Free’s don’t use music in their Church Presbytery services…music is after all the work of the Devil.
Alasdair Lamont@BBCAlLamont
This from @BBCRaymondB: Lawyers acting for the SPL have received contract documents from Rangers 3 months after first requesting them.
Ernie
We’re going nowhere with this.
reilly192 said:
In another era this story would have been swept under the carpet by the authorities and newspapers to protect the huns. Thank God for the bampots on the internet.
Makes you wonder: WHAT DID GO ON during those days before the internet?
Bawsman – They were SUSPECTED Mau-Mau. S’pose they all look the same eh Phil?
Play that funky race card, white bhoy… (thumbsup)
RobertTressell – And of course with your genius comment that all drugs are bad
Eh?
I said all drugs should be legal.
Although I don’t disagree that drugs are bad, mmmkay? I do think adults should be free to imbibe, inhale, or inject any substances they please into their own bodies, even when that happens to be a very silly thing to do.
You seem to be one of those people who is keen to point out the bad things the British Empire did, of which there were many, but give it no credit at all for the good things, of which there were many.
I doff my cap to your superior education sir.
At least you have manners Robert. :)
Anyway, I’m sure you agree with me that Ireland would be better off today if it were still part of the UK. Ireland would get the Euro and ECB off its back and we could see a reunified Ireland within a federal UK – the best of both world for the island of Ireland as a whole and a renewed Hiberno-British alliance for the 21st century. What’s not to like about that?
(thumbsup)
gallagher and wonky
We all have our agendas,but we are united in our love for Celtic and for our fellow Celtic supporers.
Are we lucky? Or what?
Aff tae my kip.
SPL statement at 1:26…..
The SPL confirmed that Rangers FC had today provided documentation to the SPL in relation to the SPL’s investigation into EBT payments. The SPL’s legal team will now review and provide an update to the SPL Board at the next SPL Board meeting on 18 June.
There were at least two players who participated in the 2011/12 season with contracts that contained side letters. Mark Daly confirmed that in his documentary, and it is also on the BBC web site
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-18148818
Sasa Papac played in 21 League games, Steven Davis Played in 33 League games
Side letters breach SFA and FIFA rules. The accepted norm is for a 0-3 defeat
That would place Rangers comfortably last in the SPL. They should have been relegated. CQN posted an excellent article recently showing how much money clubs lost due to Rangers playing allegedly improperly registered players between 2000 and 2010. The numbers were enormous.
The financial consequences for each club in 2011/12 is significant. The SPL pay prize money based on where you finish in the League. In addition there is normally a lost opportunity for at least one club to play in the CL and one to play in the Europa League. This year that loss does not occur because of Rangers Euro ban. However SPL prize money is affected.
The SPL’s failure to expedite their enquiry has had a significant detrimental financial impact on 10 member clubs to the benefit of Rangers. Celtic are unaffected as they finished above Rangers.
Doncasters position should be completely untenable if has has given any form of instruction that the enquiry should not report in the fastest possible time, or has hindered that process by not insisting that Duff and Phelps provided information in a very short oder rather than only getting forceful after the outcome of the League, and the prize money was decided.
The League Table finished this way officially
1 Celtic (C)
2 Rangers
3 Motherwell
4 Dundee United
5 Heart of Midlothian
6 St Johnstone
7 Kilmarnock
8 St Mirren
9 Aberdeen
10 Inverness Caledonian Thistle
11 Hibernian
12 Dunfermline Athletic (R)
Without working back the effects of each individual match and merely dropping Rangers to last and moving everyone else up one this is how it should have looked
1 Celtic (C)
2 Motherwell
3 Dundee United
4 Heart of Midlothian
5 St Johnstone
6 Kilmarnock
7 St Mirren
8 Aberdeen
9 Inverness Caledonian Thistle
10 Hibernian
11 Dunfermline Athletic
12 Rangers (R)
The financial loss is based on prize money as stated.Using the CQN numbers which are accurate, as I have seen the entire spreadsheet, it works out this way.
There is approximately £85,000 for every place you jump up from 12th until you get to the 3rd place club.
Whoever finishes 3rd gets £170,000 more than whoever finishes 2nd .
Whoever finishes 2nd Gets Approx £935,000 more than whoever finishes 3rd.
There is also lost revenue for whoever finishes last of they relegated unfairly as the minimum they would earn in SPL 2012/13 is £765,000
This works out this way, and apologies if it doesn’t format well
1 Celtic (C) nil
2 Motherwell £935,000
3 Dundee United £170,000
4 Heart of Midlothian £85,000
5 St Johnstone £85,000
6 Kilmarnock £85,000
7 St Mirren £85,000
8 Aberdeen £85,000
9 Inverness Caledonian Thistle £85,000
10 Hibernian £85,000
11 Dunfermline Athletic £850,000
In addition Rangers earned £1,700,000 more than they should have.
All because The SPL couldn’t put together a prima facie case in 2 months which took RTC half an hour to prove. Maybe Mr Doncaster could explain that to the shareholders of his business.