Fascinating headline in The Sun today, proclaiming England’s five wealthiest clubs are “in talks to leave Champions League”, completely missing the irony that Chelsea, Liverpool and Manchester United have been planning to do without Champions League football all season.
Directors of those clubs, Arsenal and Manchester City, met in London to discuss the possibility of binning the Champions League in favour of a competition where Europe’s wealthiest were invited to participate, without the need to qualify. The meeting was attended by US sports entrepreneur, Stephen Ross.
There are a few points worth making:
The clubs leaked this story to The Sun. The intention is not to plot a breakaway, but to be seen to be plotting.
Breakaways have been threatened in football since the 1970s US ‘soccer’ league wanted to acquire top European players without paying transfer fees. They have never happened. Only change based on approval has ever been possible.
European law would stop such a breakaway in its tracks. The European Union allows football to operate various cartels under terms known as the Specificity of Sport. The game is already testing the boundaries of these provisions (which may be worth testing in court), but any move to like this would have no chance of succeeding.
Change
Change of some sort is inevitable, there is just too much money to be made for it not to happen. The risk is that the wealthy clubs put enough money on the table (or in brown envelopes) to get their own way.
Clubs in Europe will not allow their competitiveness in relation to clubs in England diminish.
Clubs in England will not perpetually allow their premium games against Barcelona et al to generate less revenue than games against Norwich City.
Top clubs in England have already tired of sharing around £1billion a year with smaller clubs who contribute little to the pot.
I know people are alarmed by this but as one of the already disenfranchised, we have little to lose. The status quo is squeezing the life out of our game. We need change. Most of all someone to put the money on the table required to create a meritocratic European weekend league – like Gazprom did with Russia and Ukraine.
208 Comments- Pages:
- «
- 1
- 2
- 3
- 4
- 5
- 6
- »
JFH
Well said bud.
Totally agree.
The worship of money is indeed a foolish thing.
Those prepared to ditch their principles for profit, deserve huge contempt.
Those prepared to ignore the cheating, are just as responsible.
HH
TD67
I think there is a reasonable size swathe of supporters across Scotland who believe the SFA have been instrumental in corrupting the game by knowing about ebt corruption since 2000 and then covering up by attempting to minimise the scale and depth of it therebye adding another layer of corruption.
Proof though is another matter and evidence that might support that belief has still to come out in a more public forum than social media.
However I would not dismiss the reach of social media. You talk to your mates in the pub and if you see evidence of skullduggery you will pass it on.
Celtic are right to keep their powder dry for now but they know the issues. What would be a huge mistake on their part, once the lid is lifted would be to expect that 4 games a season v the successors to RFC would more than compensate for the moral repugnance that doing nothing would create.
It’s a bit too early to judge but by ST renewal I would expect some sort of assurance that if the beliefs that are deterring supporters from renewing appear to be true, then Celtic will act either on their own or with other clubs who recognise the old way of governing football encourages corruption and so must change.
If the thinking balancing act is how many will come back to see us play TRFC v how many will stay away because we cannot be sure those games will be on the level, then supporters are going to pass their own moral judgment on Celtic if they remain silent. I just don’t see that as an option and it’s not the kind of ethics I’d want associated with Celtic.
It’s a test I sincerely hope they pass.
My friends in Celtic,
I know under Fergus and MON we regularly filled our ground fo non glamorous domestic fixtures. However we were underdogs and we were on a mission.
Under what owner, CEO and realistic manager could we fill our ground against teams ( no disrespect intended ) like Hamilton, Ross County or Dundee ? Personally I doubt it would be possible now.
If we come to the conclusion that apart from Sevco games we cannot, then it would be prudent to plan for the future. This debate would obviously be nullified if we were to join the English./ Welsh league. If a legal option is available, then we must take it.
Ultimately this is in the hands of our support. The figures will point to the direction we should take.
HH.and COYBIG.
Next time you grab a cuppa, have a look at the BBC website and a wee video feature – ‘100 days, 10 goals’. There’s a great diving header from Henrik on there, scoring for Sweden; also a decent goal by Thomas Brolin for Sweden against England. DId Brolin have the worst goal celebration ever?
I still get goosebumps every time I hear a commentator’s voice say ‘And Henrik Larsson has scored!’
Trad88. I cant say I have read any of your posts before unless of course you have posted under another name ? You say you asked me a question before and obviously I did not answer as I have never noticed you before. CQN as a blog is all about opinions and diverse opinions at that My opinion is that Scottish football is corrupt and I personally wont pay any of my meagre pension in order to support it and you are correct in one sense if there are a lot of other supporters like myself unfortunately Celtic will lose out.You doing a Mr.Angry impression and telling me to push off will not facilitate any change I prefer to listen and discuss with fellow Celtic supporters on CQN any changes that may be possible.If my posts bore you or get you angry there is a simple solution scroll past them.H.H.
===============
Joe
You didnt reply the last time, I’d say around 1-2 weeks ago, when you posted something similiar.
I’d put you in with the Mothers Day CSC, looking for an excuse not to go.
If we were playing Barcelona on Sunday you’d all be there.
See Auldheids post for a more reasoned explanation of where we are at.
You want Celtic to jump in all guns blazing but its not always that simple. There are processes, and just because you are impatient, doesnt alter that fact.
Auldheid
My view is simple.
Principle or bigot money, that is the choice for the Celtic board.
Ok..we may be keeping our powder dry….but that approach could very well be exposed by, lets say unexpected court judgements.
Also…Id like to mention the total sevco penalty and red card stats since their formation, and if that isnt suspicious…i dont know what is.
My point being, that in order to clean the SFA up, the refereeing fraternity would need a complete overhaul as well, as a priority.
This continued cheating and the failure to confront it head on…will, as im sure you know create total apathy.
Im there already…unfortunately.
HH
Traditionalist88
Nonsense you are spouting….who made you the arbiter of all things Celtic?
Supporters are fed up being cheated while the board do feck all.
Its a simple as that.
We can think for ourselves thank you.
Like i said to you earlier….Maybe you are on the wrong blog Winston.
Geez Peace
Mr pastry,
Yesterday you said reduce to 40k.
Why reduce it to less than we have season ticket holders?
You also say there are only 10 stadiums in Europe that can hold 60k +, with the caveat of ‘football only’.
Football is probably the main sport in the other stadia.
Yes we might fill it on only a handful of occasions these days but why lock 20,000+ fans out?
HH
This time tomorrow, today will be yesterday.
Let’s hope we will be talking about another win with a great performance. Not about referees.
Hail, hail to all and especially to those who will make the effort tonight.
Geordie Munro
Well spotted that was my point as well…’but why lock 20,000 fans out’
Thats why i suggested two solutions.
A: Sack the board and get a new one
B: Build a massive mega Dookit for the malcontents:)
But…Mr Pastry stubbornly refused to consider it.
We will get nowhere with that sort of attitude:)
HH
Trad88. Fella you are welcome to your opinion what you should not expect is everyone to agree with it.This is simple to understand Glasgow Rangers cheated Scottish Football and fans of all teams by deciding to pay there staff by salaries topped up by EBTs now I cannot find anywhere that shows they have been punished for that.The Scottish football authorities allowed them to play in Europe when they were plainly in breech of the rules they also allowed The Rangers to join the lower leagues before other clubs.Now as a law abiding U.K.tax payer and a Celtic supporter many like myself have been cheated and can see no reason to financialy support a corrupt system now it is a free choice I have made my decision if things change I will reconsider.What you do is entirely up to you but remember like me you are only one voice. H.H.
BMCUWPs
You’ve more mail :) :) :)
Kevj, Be strong. Your posts are often the highlight of the CQN day.
Duty calls.
The Green Man says SACK THE Board on 2nd March 2016 2:28 pm
Traditionalist88
Nonsense you are spouting….who made you the arbiter of all things Celtic?
Supporters are fed up being cheated while the board do feck all.
Its a simple as that.
We can think for ourselves thank you.
Like i said to you earlier….Maybe you are on the wrong blog Winston.
Geez Peace
==========
Aye mate I’m the arbiter of all things Celtic, I thought we’d established that by now?
Now that we’ve got the empty rhetoric out the way, lets move onto your hot air.
Most of us or a high % of us were present during the EBT years. There are ongoing processes, let Celtic put out a statement when all is said and done and not to appease those with short concentration spans.
No matter what the club do some people won’t be happy.
I’d say those that are prepared to chuck it on a whim that Celtic are not prepared to stand up for themselves are looking for a way out anyway. Our crowds were always going to normalise but thats not to say that those walking away wouldnt find some wonderful and baffling excuses.
Sadly they’ve jumped the gun with this one as Celtic will have no option but to react when all is said and done.
[I know a guy who chucked it when George Douglas left because his space in the main stand car park was gone – at least he didnt make a song and dance about it – I’m sure we’ll have the same discussion this time next week when Joe Fillipi reminds us he’s chucking it].
Mr Pastry
Pastry where are you.
Lobbing in a reduction/reconstruction type grenade onto the blog, then backing away.
Get back on here to we debate this properly.
You say reduced capacity, i say massive mega Dookit.
Whats it to be?
Cmon now, this is serious:)
Explain yourself man.
HH
Joe Filippis Haircut on 2nd March 2016 2:42 pm
Trad88. Fella you are welcome to your opinion what you should not expect is everyone to agree with it.This is simple to understand Glasgow Rangers cheated Scottish Football and fans of all teams by deciding to pay there staff by salaries topped up by EBTs now I cannot find anywhere that shows they have been punished for that.The Scottish football authorities allowed them to play in Europe when they were plainly in breech of the rules they also allowed The Rangers to join the lower leagues before other clubs.Now as a law abiding U.K.tax payer and a Celtic supporter many like myself have been cheated and can see no reason to financialy support a corrupt system now it is a free choice I have made my decision if things change I will reconsider.What you do is entirely up to you but remember like me you are only one voice. H.H.
========
There are many ways to make your point. You have chosen to punish Celtic in the maximum way possible, which is your choice. But I wonder if you even considered other forms of action or just took the easy way out.
Not attending Celtic matches and not buying Celtic (home) tickets, merchandise or anything else hurts Celtic. Cheating or no cheating, corruption or no corruption, the fact is it hurts Celtic and brings us closed to our rivals.
Traditionalist 88
You must be one of the ‘Good’ Celtic supporters.
There is no excuse whatsoever for failing to confront the cheating.
Those on the board who choose to ignore it…are complicit, and will be responsible for the continuation of the cheating.
That’s how simple it is, although you would like to confuse by pretending that its a difficult issue to deal with.
Its not….its as clear as day.
Keeping quiet and looking the other way, wont help.
As for Hot Air….you would know about that:)
HH
TRAD88. I assume I should consult with yourself before I speak on any topic on CQN and you can tell if it bores you or not? I was not aware that you are a moderator on the site I will say again you are entitiled to your opinion and I am entitled to think it is nonsense.You keep paying your money to watch the corruption and I will use the money I save on an honest pursuit.If it changes as I said I will reconsider.Also you wont read it again next week if you scroll past my posts it is as easy as that fella. H.H.
To be honest, there are plenty of clowns at Celtic Park who I’d love to see boycotting the club
You know the type. Go to a game, sit with your arms folded and only get vocal to complain the minute somebody misplaces a pass.
Good riddance.
Greenman – I really do not want to face the fact that we are no longer ‘big noises’ in Europe; like you I remember the halcyon days and wish that they could come back – they won’t.
That’s not being defeatist, it is the acknowledgement that we are being left behind, not downsizing, in this money-driven world of sport – do I wish it were otherwise? – of course I do.
Sacking the two incumbents, PL and RD in their executive and managerial roles might satisfy some in our support as a short-term panacea for all our ills – it would only be a short-term knee-jerk reaction, and in PL’s case a gross error.
We have got to re-set our goals – if we can’t be the ‘best of the best’, then we aim to be the ‘best of the rest’ – there is no shame or loss of pride in that.
Around twenty years ago, when we built our new stadium, the TV revenue contracts in the English Premier League were around £500 million – today that figure stands at £5.5 billion – everything around us has changed way out of recognition.
Everything , including our stadium, must be ‘up for grabs’ as we gear up for an increasingly uncertain future.
I must mention Auldheid and his ‘words of wisdom’ – what advantage would it give us to ‘mouth off’ about The Rangers at this moment in time – with no foolproof legal platform, any assertions by Celtic could seriously ‘backfire’ and draw us into the fiasco.
I cannot understand why some of our so-called ‘faithful through and through’ would seriously look to inflict financial harm on our club, due to the crazy wrongdoings in Govan.
If we have to play them, let’s get behind the club and encourage the team to beat them at every turn – if we punish Celtic then they win again, just as they did when they were cheating.
We must be realistic – yes hope for the best in all we do – but ‘throwing the toys out’ is tantamount to despair.
THETIMREAPER
So…you are blaming supporters because they refuse to fund a rigged game.
Seriously.
Maybe if the board confronted the corruption, they might gain a bit of genuine respect.
But asking supporters to ignore the cheating and pay anyway….I dont think so.
Why the feck should anyone go along with that?
Are we just all daft or what?
HH
Mr Pastry
Good post.
I dont disagree.
Im prepared to wait and see how these issues are resolved.
However, as Auldheid mentioned, failure to confront it…will be suicide.
We will then see a return to the bad old days….with a vengeance.
In the end…I only want to see fairness in Football, ive no doubt you do as well.
But….the responsibility to confront the cheating cannot be avoided by the Celtic board, whatever happens.
HH
Why propose cutting of the top tier, surely better and cheaper to knock down main stand, build in 3000 seats and executive boxes, bars, media conference areas, museum etc… In a new raised stand that completes the stadium but reduces capacity to 55k, facilities in main stand could be first class, bit then its all a pipe dream cause Celtic will not spend millions of pounds
hh
thetimreaper on 2nd March 2016 2:50 pm…..playing devil’s advocate here. You mention the hurt to Celtic, but what of the hurt to Celtic fans who have been paying out for years to watch games on a sloping playing field?
The Green Man says SACK THE Board on 2nd March 2016 2:54 pm
Traditionalist 88
You must be one of the ‘Good’ Celtic supporters.
There is no excuse whatsoever for failing to confront the cheating.
Those on the board who choose to ignore it…are complicit, and will be responsible for the continuation of the cheating.
That’s how simple it is, although you would like to confuse by pretending that its a difficult issue to deal with.
Its not….its as clear as day.
Keeping quiet and looking the other way, wont help.
As for Hot Air….you would know about that:)
HH
=========
A good Celtic supporter… Sorry its unclear if you were attempting to quote someone there.
Again, your short concentration span clearly didnt even allow you to reach the end of that post.
What chance have Celtic got?
If you get this far, reread my previous post and you’ll know where I was coming from.
If you get this far, read Auldheids.
See if you can manage all that without getting excited and demanding a statement.
Actually Mr Pastry you may be on to something..my kids have flown the nest.house really now is too big for us..will suggest to Mrs M ..take roof off-take bedrooms out on first floor-then put roof back on..job done!! :)
*bungalowcsc
Ill keep the bedroom in the garden just in case they are needed again:)..anyway I am firmly in the TGM Dookit camp or is that a clique?
HH
Stephbhoy
Good idea, definitely worry of discussion at a higher level. Correct sponsorship could help facilitate this.
HH.
Geordie Munro 2:24
——————————
At the moment a fair proportion of those have purchased season books don’t even turn up week in and week out.
As far as “locking 20,000 out” – that would only be true on big CL nights – on some of the big CL nights, e.g. Barca and Man Utd, we could have sold 80,000 tickets, so actually there are always times when people are not able to get a ticket and are ‘locked out’
However these occasions are so few and far between, that we would never consider upgrading our capacity to 80,000. The same argument now applies in these difficult times – if we normally attract around 40,000, why maintain a facility of 60,000, that may only be sold out 3/4 times per season?
As the rich get richer, we must get smarter and smarter to survive – nothing should be ruled out/in.
TRAD88. I assume I should consult with yourself before I speak on any topic on CQN and you can tell if it bores you or not?
=================
If you could mate that would be great.
You seem to spend a whole lot of TIME talking about the fact that you DON’T want to spend money watching Celtic.
Sloping playing field?????
EasterRdcsc.
Mr Pastry
I totally get what you are saying.
But i cannot throw my money away on a league i consider to be bent.
Until those referees are tackled, and the SFA is cleaned, i wont pay to watch any Scottish Football.
The power those hun refs have is disgraceful…..Ex Hun season ticket holders, refereeing sevco games, the sheer number of penalty awards and red cards in their favour is nothing short of blatant cheating.
Im not paying to watch that s***
Ive seen it for too long.
There needs to be a revolution in Scottish Football….or there is no purpose to it.
Im not throwing the toys out of the pram…no, im refusing to pay to be cheated.
HH
Parkheadcumsalford on 2nd March 2016 8:53 am
Happy birthday, Billy McNeil.
I think he was first CH when Bobby Evans played RH to accommodate him, with Bertie Peacock at LH. All fine players, as was Dunky Mackay at LB.
*I recall Bobby playing centre half but not to accommodate Billy, I believe that he only moved there due to the injury to Big Jock and the ineptitude of the centre halfs at the club then.
He was quite small for the position but was an excellent reader of the game. He was my first Celtic hero ad I wept on hearing he had left only for my da to console me by saying we had a better young player to replace him.
That young player initially came into the side at right back and right half. When he played at the former Dunky MacKay was moved to right half as Bob Kelly, not Jimmy McGrory, figured that he was a better wing half than full back. Thankfully Pat Crerand arrived on the scene to dispel that notion.
First defense that rolled off my tongue was: Haffey, Mackay and Kennedy, Crerand, McNeil and Peacock. The forward line changed at Bob Kelly’s whim.
*aye mine tae, after Beatie Donnelly Fallon, Fernie Evans Peacock. How we never won any honours with that side of current and future internationalists is mind boggling, a couple of captains’ of their country tae.
Actually, Sir Bob is probably the reason, history and Jock Stein have been kind tae him. And some on here complain about Peter Lawwell.
Mr Pastry,
As much as some won’t like admitting it, there’ll be domestic games where we’ll attract more than 40k.
I kinda see where you are coming from but (taking this seasons figures) I can’t see any club saying to 10,000 ish fans that they cannot have a season ticket.
HH
Traditionalist88
Like i said….you are on the wrong blog Napoleon
Im not impressed by your bs.
Try FF, im sure they will appreciate your rapier like wit.
But then again, even the Huns would probably be bored with you:)
Scroll on by
I have been following the Cellic for a fair number of years and sometimes they are mince and sometimes they are fantastic. I go to watch and support my team and have never booed Celtic once and I have seen some crap in my time . I think it must bean age thing as my son and daughters ageless sanguine than I am. Sevco Rangers Hibs Morton ? Who bloody cares! I am going to watch the hoops and tonight since I am inSpain will see nothing. Now that’s a sore one. Can’t imagine how the permanently overseas supporters cope. My Dad who has been dead for 57 years always said we were being cheated ! Plus ca change . COYBIG! KTF ! big fat fingers ageless is are less!
Greenman – I agree that if we have prima-facie evidence that Scottish football was systematically and methodically cheated, then we must make an unequivical statement, hopefully with the backing of all other affected clubs.
That is not the case at the moment, unfortunately that is not the case.
I hope you agree that for Celtic to be further punished by its own fans is totally bizarre.
Finally on the stadium – we don’t need a 60,000 seater – I am open to any suggestions – Stephbhoy says a revamped main stand and upgraded services and hospitality could could work – OK, but 50,000 max.
thomthethim for Oscar OK on 2nd March 2016 10:28 am
Macjay1, Psrkheadcum..,
Bobby Evans was peerless at CH.
The one player he couldn’t handle was Jimmy Millar, of Them.
However, when he was out with his back injury, 17 year old Billy stepped in.
*Big Billy however couldnae handle jim forrest but due to injury we borough big John Cushley in and he handled him.
Fortunately for us forrest was sacrificed as a result of wee Sammy Reid.
Mr Pastry& Geordie Munro
And of course, there is ticket pricing to consider.
Do we really think that Scottish Football is value?
Id say not….more like a rip off, when you considered the mince that’s served up by the clubs.
From what ive seen…even 20 quid would be stretching it.
HH