The status of this Champions League group is officially….alright . In yesterday’s blog I said our draw was all about Pot 3. Turns out, this wasn’t the case. Feyenoord, our Pot 1 opponents, are the weakest we are ever likely to draw from that tier. They earned their spot by being Dutch champions and benefiting largely from the performances of Ajax, who along with PSG are the only top 20 rated European teams outside England, Spain, Italy and Germany.
Feyenoord is almost a verb in Dutch, a bit like to “Hibs” something is in English. Since their infamous Uefa Cup Final against Tottenham in 1974 they have won the league only five times. Their record number of consecutive titles is two (achieved once).
They are a club characterised by greatness that vanishes in the night. Think back to that time they had one of Europe’s top five strikers, but stuck him on the wing on the rare occasions he played (Brendan, note 21-year-old Liel Abada). Feyenoord are a gift of a Pot 1 opponent and the weakest team we will face.
Atletico Madrid finished second in La Liga last season, a point behind neighbours Real. They were an eye-watering 28 points and nine places above Pot 1 Sevilla. Real thumped us home and away on Champions League duty without leaving second gear, albeit we had 60 minutes in the sun before darkness fell. If Celtic lay a glove on Atletico it would take a master gameplan – I would be surprised.
Last season Lazio finished above a Champions League finalist as well as a Champions League semi-finalist. Our wins over them in 2019 are among the highlights of Celtic’s last decade. We defended stoutly in both Europa League group games, before snatching two late winners. Football seldom tastes as sweet.
It is no coincidence that over two periods of manager, Neil Lennon’s results were better in group stage and knockout round European games than either Brendan Rodgers or Ange Postecoglou. Neil defended his box when it was appropriate to do so and gave us wonderful football memories. Brendan and Ange recorded some of our heaviest defeats in European competition. Sure, we need to test ourselves, but Brendan, we also need results. It’s Tony Watt’s goal against Barcelona the Celtic social admins continually play, not Tony Ralston’s gumption against PSG.
There will be more blogs up throughout the day.
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CHAIRBHOY on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 12:32 PM
SAINT STIVS @ 12:24 PM,
Maybe you can help me out here
From our new signings and loanees why does that make us stronger than last year?
——————
I neither know if we are weaker or stronger until say all new recruits are bedded in and given say half a season to contribute.
Judge them after actually seing them in action and over a period of time.
I cant say anyone in better or worse than what has left the buildings.
I do actually trust the process and the professionals in place to do the jobs.
I will make a little prediction though – someone from the recent signings will go on to be sold for x3 x 4 of what we paid for them.
my only slightly raised eyebrow was we never took the £10m for MOR, that might happen yet.
asset management in modern paliance
meanwhile liverpool reject £150m bid for mo salah,
the world has gone mad
Personal
Fullname: John William Madden
aka: Jake Madden, Johnny Madden, The Rooter, John Madden
Born: 11 June 1865
Died: 17 April 1948, Prague
Born: Dumbarton, Scotland
Signed: May 1888 (from Grimsby Town); & Aug 1889 (from Dumbarton)
Left: 1888 (to Dumbarton); 1897 (retired, then returned to play for Dundee)
Position: Centre-forward
Debut: Celtic 5-2 Rangers, Inauguration match, 28 May 1888
Internationals: Scotland / Scottish League
International Caps: 2 caps / 4
International Goals: 5 goals, all v Wales / 2
The great John Madden was the first man to ever lead a Celtic forward line. Prior to Celtic, he used to be a riveter in the Glasgow shipyards, and despite leaving the heavy work there he still brought over the hard work ethic instilled in him from his former employment.
He later took up as coach at Slavia Prague (in what is now the Czech Republic) which revolutionised the game there, and is seen as the father of Czech football.
https://www.thecelticwiki.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/09/1-22.jpg
https://wikifoundryimages.s3.amazonaws.com/P4yIEkFL9OUIhYdEP12V1Q126506
https://wikifoundryimages.s3.amazonaws.com/-fbcSnSg3XaVf-XBtE6Q0w87603
https://wikifoundryimages.s3.amazonaws.com/FBbhzfOn6AVjsbDHf1r9bg323533
https://wikifoundryimages.s3.amazonaws.com/DeF4RXa3Y4CKBcfH9RkNAQ446513
TAKEN FROM CELTIC WIKI
Paulo confirmed by his u21 side.
Excellent business, like a Spanish O riley who can tackle and see a pass.
Yasss
KLV
Greenpinata
The Quality Street Gang were from a time when all Scottish clubs were producing really talented youngster and many of our competitors in Europe were still semi-pro at best. We also were pre-Bosman and could keep players there after they signed an S form.
We need modern solutions for modern problems. Nostalgia won’t cut it- though they were great times and memories.
As I said, even Ben Doak was not yet ready to hold down a first team slot and, while he is doing really well at Liverpool, he has not established yet amongst their first team/ squad of bought-in players. We have seen other Liverpool youngsters tried and failed – only the exceptional Trent Alexander Arnold broke through. Even our recent loanee had his spell in the sun as a Doak-like prospect but didn’t make it.
At Celtic, our young players nowadays have to be better than a collection of 20 full internationalists from across the globe, not just to get past 15/16 players, many of whom were barely capped at all- Craig, Clark, Auld, Chalmers, Hughes.
Our auld chum Brogan Rogan wrote a smashing story about John Madden back in the day, as I recall.
A decent LB would be a nice way to round proceedings off
SEVCO v CELTIC…This Sunday.
Like many, I have been rather concerned about this game for several reasons.
Celtics poor form so far, and our injury list etc.
IF our recent signings like PALMA and PHILIPS are Fit enough, then I hope that Celtic play them from the start.
Some on here are commenting on Celtic getting a result as the Huns will ” TIRE” ?
The ONLY way that the Huns will somehow ” Tire”, is IF Celtic can DOMINATE the game with a High percentage of POSSESSION….and/or IF Celtic somehow managed to score at least TWO QUICK Goals, and the Huns Heids go down ?
Given Celtics recent poor form, its very difficult to imagine that we will be somehow Dominant at any stage of the game ?
I sincerely hope that I am wrong ?
Im away to look at the Bookies odds for LUIS PALMA to score One or TWO Goals ?
LOL
HH
HAIRLIKESPAGHETTI @ 12:38 PM,
The debate I had last night revolved around quality signings that we should have brought in, we didn’t
They have proven I was right, excuse the lack of humility but any reasonable football supporter would agree with me
We still get a plethora of excuses of why they would have come and why we didn’t need them anyway
Now, you can go back on my posts on CQN and my comments are a matter of record
So, unless we want to get into a multi-year circular argument the point is moot
Let me just say, the lo-ball on Kvistgaarden!?
I know little about him and can’t see he is the answer.
So if he turns out to be the next Messi you’ll have peace and quiet from me:)
Hail Hail
Tough draw for the zombies, so much for getting to be a Pot 1 team…..
FRED COLON on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 12:36 PM
Quad at 11.44
We need a muscular centre back pairing not a musical centre back pairing 🤪
——
Wright Saidy Fred ;))
All in one day
Liverpool buy Gravenberch from Bayern Munich for £36m
Bayern Munich buy Palinha from Fulham for £55m
Fulham buy Hojbjerg from Spurs and are in for McTominay
Spurs in for Conor Gallagher.
None of this possible until today.
Always liked the Betis kit
Yes, Feyenoord are the weakest team in Pot 1 but they will fancy playing us. They are on a par with PSV who humped Sevco. Are we so much better than Sevco?
I don’t see any grounds for optimism regarding the CL. We are still trying to put a decent team together only a short time before the first match.
KLV
So if Bernardo is the new Matty, our model holds that we should cash in on the Bologna or Leeds offers – if the price is right!
Re definitions of punts, prospects and provens again – to my mind Nat Phillips just fits the proven category (due to Pool, Bournemouth spells etc)
Personal
Fullname: Patrick Gordon Stanton
aka: Pat Stanton, Patrick Stanton
Born: 13 September 1944
Birthplace: Edinburgh, Scotland
Signed: 1 September 1976
Left: 5 August 1978 (retired through injury)
Position: Defender/Midfielder
First game: 4 September 1976 Rangers home 2-2 League
Last game: 13 August 1977 Dundee United home 0-0 League
Internationals: Scotland
Internationals: Caps: 16 caps
International Goals: 0
https://wikifoundryimages.s3.amazonaws.com/945ddd9efd531742ca3e024e6535f669
Glasstwothirdsfull
“We have won one knockout game in 19 years. Brendan Rodgers was the manager.”
————————————
Do our qualifying games not count then. Lose them and you get knocked out of the tourney.
KEVINLASVEGAS on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 12:46 PM
Paulo confirmed by his u21 side.
Excellent business, like a Spanish O riley who can tackle and see a pass.
Yasss
KLV
—
I’m sorry. Are you the owner of a 1980s Delorean?
Don’t you know there’s some mysterious eye test that runs to January before judgements are made.
Apparently that’s how the CQN experts do it.
I hear they burn all data and insights about a player’s prior performance levels before making multi million pound investments. Can’t be having that stuff get in the way of the eye test…..even thouhg it might come close to answering day one questions about being stronger or not…
HH
SCULLYBHOY on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 12:40 PM
SLAVIA PRAGUE
In 1905, Scottish manager and former Celtic player Johnny Madden brought new tactics and views on football from his home country to the club.
*Jake Madden born and bred in Dumbarton’s High Street to Irish parents, my da was similar in a street just off of the High Street as that’s’ where the Irish boat docked on its way tae the Broomielaw
Current Aston Villa captain’s late granny was descended fae Jake’s family, he was also the first Catholic player to enter his local side’s dressing room much to the consternation of his new team mates who soon grew tae love this energetic and hard working goal scorer.
SAINT STIVS @ 12:40 PM,
The world going mad is something we can agree on
“I do actually trust the process and the professionals in place to do the jobs.
Which is where you and I differ greatly, from the transfer window of summer 2018, we have left a lot to be desired in the recruitment business
A ray of light through the window in summer 2021 and the two subsequent windows were the exception that proves the rule
That was kicked off by Ange Postecoglou and Dominic McKay who are no longer with us, an outlier if you will.
Obviously my sincerest wish is that the new bhoys make it.
Yet we needed; quality, experience, physicality, technical excellence to come in, we would all have recognised that if we had recruited it
Nawrocki isn’t the most experienced but he ticked most of the boxes, so I feel we have a player there.
A mix is always good, look at the recruits from summer 2021, a mixed bag for sure but enough to start a squad rebuild.
All we had to do was build from a position of strength, if we had done that we would know
Hail Hail
Meant tae add he was also the first player tae kick a ball for this new east end club as being the centre he kicked the game off
STRANGE ?
BET365 do NOT have LUIS PALMA in their ” Goal Scorer” lists….BUT they DO have have NAT PHILIPS listed at odds of 12/1 to Score at ANYTIME ?
BETFRED…Have NEITHER Player listed….so far.
Chairbhoy
“They have proven I was right, excuse the lack of humility but any reasonable football supporter would agree with me”
——————————
There’s a perfectly circular unbreakable defence and untestable hypothesis. Agree with and you qualify as reasonable but dispute with me and you are being unreasonable😀
Anyway, onto the substance of the matter.
Are the players we brought in an improvement on the players we let go?
My reasonable answer is – “I don’t know yet”
I might reasonably state that Yang and Tillio and Palma are not as good as Jota because none of them have fetched £25m in a football market place. But then I’d have to consider that Henrik Larsson cost £650k and Rafael Schmidt cost £5m. Even so I’d reasonably admit that the Jota who left us was, palpably, a better player than these guys. That Jota had played 62 games for Celtic and provided some breathtaking moments. These young guys have done nothing like that in the 2, 0 and 0 appearances that they have had for us so far.
Personally, and thinking of myself as reasonable, despite many evidences and pronunciations from those who know me, I would give them just a bit more time before I judge that they can reach Jota levels in a Celtic shirt. I would still face the dilemma of wondering, if 2 years down the line, Yang or Palma or Tillio get sold for only £24 m, would that prove they were poorer players than Jota, who know cannot even get a starting place in an Arab pub team😀 (Ed- do they have pubs in Saudi?)
I think that’s a reasonable question
HLS – 30 million budget from ST sales.
26 million from jota but say we got 16 of that and rwst to enfica and 4 Million for Stargelt total 50 million.
Do you know something I am missing here?
D :)
BIG WAVY on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 12:58 PM
The test is games, and a lot of them.
Mooy started once in our first 11 games and that was the terrible performance against st mirren when he looked totally unsuited to playing in that team. At that point he hadn’t convinced anyone he’d improved the team.
Quadrophenian
“to my mind Nat Phillips just fits the proven category (due to Pool, Bournemouth spells etc)”
—————————–
Aye, but so was Shane Duffy- Just saying, like!
SETTING FREE THE BEARS FOR RES. 12 & OSCAR KNOX on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 1:11 PM
Quadrophenian
“to my mind Nat Phillips just fits the proven category (due to Pool, Bournemouth spells etc)”
—————————–
Aye, but so was Shane Duffy- Just saying, like!
and McCarthy.
Giakoumakis was written off by large numbers of our support after the penalty miss cost us three points against Livingston. His second start.
At what point did him and Mooy stop being crap a
and start being good enough to need good replacements?
Anyways, if we are doing no more business I wish Celtic would tell us early so I can stop checking the sources and stand down from Ross Hall.
QUADROPHENIAN
Mate away and beil yer heed.
Enjoy the transfer deadline day and stop acting like the club are spending your millions and you know better than the professionals.
Matty going nowhere.
Nugget.csc
KLV
Starfelt was roundly criticized for much of his first season. A mistake in him in every game. His reputation at Celtic was built on some very strong performances against the Huns. (Not the 3:0 game when he gifted them their third)
DAVID66 on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 1:10 PM
at no point ever will Celtic PLC spend everything they have on football players.
Hun blog,
Yes,Sparta Prague.Hope we smash the racist bassas !!!.
All you can do is shake your head.
Their forums are like a different planet. Such a weird people. Hair triggers and faux intelligence.
Mask always slips,
KLV
SETTING FREE THE BEARS FOR RES. 12 & OSCAR KNOX on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 1:09 PM
Not quite my friend….
The value at the point of sale has too many variables. We can control some of them (contract length for example or playing time). Jota went for more than we anticipated due to a Portugueser and Saudi combo. Dembele went for less cos he fell out with Rodgers.
However, at the point of purchase we can make assumptions that are better than the 3 month eye test or sale price. We have metrics on players that can tell us about their strengths and weaknesses. We can use machine learning to assess against selection criteria with others (we know that Maeda is an elite presser when compared against peers in his group. He has eff all else). They can tell us about a lot of things that allow us to answer that ‘better’ question now and help us make good decisions based on how we want to play. Back to Maeda, is he a good fit in a system where he’s expected to play in front of the full back, 30 yards out and taken them on? Nope. One for Rodgers to solve.
Looking at the metrics between Palma and Jota and they will weigh in favour of the latter. Better dribbler off the top of my head but there are others. Doesn’t make Luis a bad player.
We go back to my point. You can choose to pick a better profile as a starting point against Jota’s but they’ll cost more. We max out at the Luis level.
What we have after that selection is how much he’ll grow under Rodgers (a big bet in our proposition and I get & like that) but he’s further back than a Jota today. We have the evidence.
Are we replicating? – Don’t be silly BW.
Are we getting closer to Jota’s strengths and spending more money? – Nope. We aren’t.
And on a wider note, are we using this kind of coherent thinking to build a team and not a 32+ squad of hit and miss ? – Nope. Look at the number of mediocre midfielders, the lack of challenge to Callum, the amount of wingers, etc etc. We seem to build projects in isolation of team building that can compete on a European level. Ok when you’re up against Billy the journeyman from Ross County or a young pup with bad acne from Motherwell.
Joined up thinking Celtic. The technology and proof of concept is out there.
HH
STtBs @ 1:09 PM,
Of course, when we said Toney was the one, we were correct – any whatifery doesn’t change that
Yet you get to the cruix of the matter for me
Celtic sign players for the B team, Lawal and Dawson for example
Celtic sign players for the first team Kyogo and Ajeti for example
Celtic sign prospects as future first team Abada and O’Riley for example
All good, nothing wrong with that, an excellent strategy
Yet you need clever football fholk to get this right and they must be backed
You will need to get the proportions correct
How many B team “starlets”?
How many wunderkind “prospects”?
How many first team “experienced quality players”?
We spent 20 mn on first team ready players in 2019 with disastrous consequences
Not because of the “model” but because our recruitment guys weren’t up to it
It’s a complex process that needs to be handled professionally and skillfully, a dozen prospects, lastminute.com and fingers crossed doesn’t cut it for me.
We did that ten years ago…
VVD – a revelation
Pukki – a good player that was mishandled
Amido Balde – A nice big fellah
We should have learned by now and there have been multiple examples of the how to get it right in the last ten years.
We should do that….
Hail Hail
CELTIC40ME on 1ST SEPTEMBER 2023 1:19 PM
Starfelt was roundly criticized for much of his first season. A mistake in him in every game. His reputation at Celtic was built on some very strong performances against the Huns. (Not the 3:0 game when he gifted them their third)
—
Starfelt had strengths and weaknesses, which we knew. Brilliantly balanced out by the superior CCV, like bambi on ice when he wasn’t around. He was aggressive in the tackle and had great recovery pace. Not so good on distribution but if he was, he’d be more expensive than his arrival and sale price point, which remained static.
HH
Saint Stivis – And no one os asking them to.
Where wlse is the money getting spent?
Board members bonus’s??
In fact the money should be spent on the team to progress year on year.
D :)
Celtic in shock move to sign God.
A mixed response on CQN , some say he’s not as powerful as he used to be and not sure if they have belief in his abilities. Others say he’s not as tall as he looks in his paintings .
The general consensus is positive as he can play anywhere on the pitch , except left back, sometimes all at the same time.