Austria Wien have played three league games this season, won one, drew one, lost one. Scored six conceded eight. Stuffed 5-1 by Salzburg two weeks ago. They have only had to play one round of Champions League qualifiers so far, which they won 1-0 on aggregate against the Icelandic champions-cum-day-job-professionals. Send them over, please, Uefa.
Ludogorets Razgrad, from Bulgaria, knocked Dinamo Zagreb out of the Champions League qualifiers last season before going down to Slovan Bratislava in the play-off round. They’ve won two, lost one, of their three league games this season. Beat Partizan Belgrade home and away in last round, beat Slovan Bratislava on aggregate in round before that. They also have to play their home game for the next round at an alternate venue to due to a date clash with a concert. Happy to take this lot.
Legia Warsaw, won all three league games this season, scoring 12, conceding one. Eliminated Molde, after drawing both games, in last round, took care of The New Saints (Wales) home and away in earlier round. Would be a great European tie though not sure if Zbyszek can arrange the result for us.
Maribor, from Slovenia, have won all three league games this season, scored 11, conceded two. Eliminated APOEL Nicosia after two draws in last round. APOEL got to the last eight of the Champions League in 2012, so this team are no pushover. Maribor also have the distinction of being the last team to knock Rangers out of Europe. Ever!
Shakhtyor Karaganda, 12 points off the pace after 22 games in Kazakhstan. Beat Albanians, Korce, in last round and Bate Borisov (who recorded Champions League wins against Bayern Munich and Lille in 2012) in the earlier round. The travel would be an issue; Karaganda is farther east that eastern Afghanistan. If I can paraphrase an Ibrox legend, define Europe. The fact they are midseason and, like Celtic, they’ve won through two rounds already, makes this a less attractive tie, but they are surely not a Champions League team.
Preferences: Shakhtyor Karaganda are the easiest possible opponents but a trip to Austria or Bulgaria would be best.
Would rather avoid: Legia will be the most difficult draw. Maribor will be a similar challenge as Elfsborg.
Lots more to blog about: last night’s performance, Kelvin, Honest Dave King… maybe later.
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Why don’t Celtic let the GB use section 111 but arrange the area into small boxed sections,this would stop lateral movement but allow the fans to be close together.
St.John.Doyle
22:29
—
Perhaps the key phrase in No Apologists’ post is this: “Celtic require to be seen to be controlling the situation to avoid external interference.”
You will know better than most, but is it possible that the council has, informally, made it clear to the club that it will get heavier than the minutes and the records show at the moment unless things “improve” from the authorities’ point of view?
I think that is the suggestion implicit in No Apologists’ post and, as I said, it makes sense.
Oh well – 3 more Champions League qualifiers next year then.
No apologist – thanks for a very detailed post.
Tin hat on. I wouldn’t have James Forrest in the team. Several posters have commented on areas he needs to improve on but have missed out one glaring deficiency.
The boy is a coward and easily intimated.
Hail Hail
.
Courtesy Scotzine..Bit repetitive but he gets to the Point eventually..;-(
The ‘Real Rangers Men’ Riding into Ibrox on their White Chargers.
rangers-By the newspaper coverage of the past few weeks, it seems that Jim McColl and his fellow investors have mounted their trust white chargers and road down Edmiston Drive, like glorious and gallant heroes returning to liberate the Ibrox side from forces that they believe would destroy the club, its culture and its ‘Rangers’ identity.
McColl is the front man for the New Rangers Model Army, his fellow investors are his captains while a growing section of the Ranger support make up the cannon fodder used and abused when the need arises.
Inside Ibrox you have King Charles the Green, who has taken up residence initially as the kingdom’s saviour, but now his subjects have grown tired of his rhetoric and that of his captain of arms Imran Ahmad. Who can blame them.
However, just like the Jacobite Rebellion in 1745-46, families are split. One side supports the New Rangers Model Army, while the other supports King Charles. Then there are those caught up in the middle – those who sit on the fence and have to listen to both sides posturing and inevitably getting caught up in proceedings.The real battle is not at board room level, the real battle is that which is happening in the stands as fans split, factions arise and friends now turn to haters and abusers.
This is not some fantasy fairytale, it is life at Rangers Football Cub currently. A tale that has stretched three years and doesn’t look as though anyone associated with the club will live happily ever after, any time soon.
In recent weeks I have seen a growing trend among certain elements of the Rangers blogging community turn on their own as opinion and ideals get in the way of rational thinking. These so-called ‘real’ Rangers men and women have been subjecting – at least one Rangers blogger – to a vile campaign of hate, smears and abuse. Which has led to further hate-filled messages being posted on forums and the blogger’s specific site – with childish insult, racist remarks, wanting said person to kill themselves and even bringing the old sectarian card into play. Not my words, the blogger’s words.
These ‘real Rangers men and women’ have a book to flog, a book that Dr. Gerry Hassan has claimed, that it has ‘not addressed in any depth or convincing manner are any of the thorny and central questions of the whole [Rangers] saga’. A book that in my own opinion is nothing more than a propaganda tool – backed by and promoted by the club – to ‘out’ enemies of Rangers, re-write the history of several people who contributed to the piece and above all ignore the pivotal point – that it was no one else’s fault but Rangers Football Club.
But what do you expect from a group of individuals who have shifted their stance on Rangers regimes every time the wind blows. At the end of the Murray era – these ‘real Rangers folk’ attacked Murray for running up such a mountain of debt that was crippling the club – yet I doubt very much any of them were asking where the money was coming from during the nine-in-a-row years or during the Advocaat and McLeish era. Why is that? Because Rangers were winning titles and they didn’t care how it was financed as long as they beat rivals Celtic – at all cost.
When Whyte came on the scene, these ‘real Rangers folk’ demanded that Murray sell the club asap to Whyte – a man whose wealth was seemingly off the radar, a man who was a self-confessed Rangers supporter and who said he would spend this and spend that on players. These ‘real Rangers folk’ were hoodwinked not because of documentary evidence but by PR and propaganda rhetoric from Whyte’s camp ably assisted by Jack Irvine. And they fell for it hook, line and sinker – despite the mountains of evidence being published online and being ignored by the mainstream media – who were more interested in protecting their seat at the dinner table than actually doing their job and getting to the truth.
Those publishing the truth, the facts were attacked, abused and threatened – not because they were telling lies – but because what they were publishing was not what those ‘real Rangers folk’ wanted to hear and see. They had been brainwashed by the Whyte regime into believing everything that came out of his mouth or his spokesperson’s mouth was fact – even using the club’s media department to peddle his lies, his rhetoric and yet none of these ‘real Rangers folk’ have apologised to the Rangers family’ – merely saying they were hoodwinked also.
Some of these ‘real Rangers folk’ backed Whyte even after he put the club into administration and the real truth came out in the mainstream bout him. Yet they chose not to believe the increasing number of articles being written about him – why? Because those covering the story were not like them, they were not ‘real Rangers folk’. This period of blind faith and support for Whyte has been conveniently left out of this recent Rangers book that Gerry Hassan was discussing. Why? Because mud sticks and the truth of the support for Craig Whyte is a stain that will never come out – they have changed their clothes but that stain has marked their skin for life. They know, others know it – but a vast majority don’t know it , the majority that are easily swayed, manipulated and led like sheep.
These ‘real Rangers folk’ did not want the American businessman Bill Miller to buy the club – not because he was dodgy like Whyte, but that he was there to make a profit. He was there as he saw Rangers as an investment opportunity – the hate, he bile and the threats that this man received was disgusting to say the least with many of it bordering on racist rhetoric that the SDL and the EDL love to spout at their hate-filled rallies. We saw banners unfurled at Ibrox, we saw articles written telling him to keep his hands off of their club and after all this Miller made the decision to wash his hands of the whole episode – in part because he saw how bad the club was actually in as well as the ‘welcome’ he received.
Cue the reception that Fergus McCann received when he rode into Glasgow town to save Celtic? Was he ‘welcomed’ in the same way? Was he treated in a racist manner for being a Canadian? There is no denying that McCann’s tenure at Celtic – five years in all – was filled with highs and lows. He stated from the outset that he was there with a short-term goal and to make a profit. The Celtic support saw him as saviour one minute and then the anti-christ the next. Looking back now the majority of Celtic fans see McCann as a god-send and rightly so.
Miller could have been the right man for the job at Rangers – but we will never know as these ‘real Rangers folk knew better and they chose Charles Green. Well they didn’t have any other choice now did they? There were no ‘real Rangers folk’ ready to step into the breach to purchase the club assets from Duff & Phelps – the only ones who did step up to the mark were Green’s consortium. Only when the CVA was rejected, the club put into liquidation and with no creditors to pay off – did these honest, dignified and honourable ‘real Rangers folk’ come on the scene. Guys like McColl, King and Walter Smith – where were they in the clubs hour of need?
Watching on as the loyal Rangers fans they are.
Now that Green has raised his true image for all to see, after the honeymoon period and after seeing off the likes of John Brown and other ‘real Rangers folk’, Green was lauded by the support and ‘real Rangers folk’ for the way he ran a successful IPO [which is more or less gone now], the way he criticised and attacked those who attacked Rangers – deja vu or what? – anyone not blind to his rhetoric knew it was all done to worm his way into the Rangers support. A support who were willing to accept anyone in their hour of need – AFTER the threats of violence and death that Green received and later apologised for mentioning it.
Jump to present day and after the fall out of Green’s racist comment about Imran Ahmad, as well as several ‘real Rangers folk’ breaching the data protection act and then publishing an article based on illegally gained information – Ahmad departed the club. Smith replaced Malcolm Murray as the ‘dirty war’ was in full flow at board room level and ‘real Rangers folk’ coming down on the side of Walter – a man who does not walk away – yet he walked away to Everton previously, quit and passed the managerial baton onto McCoist to deal with and at a time when the club’s board is at its most dysfunctional and in need of a captain to steer it off the rocks – Walter jumps ship when someone of his ilk should be there as a focal point as a leader, not as the person who bails out when the going gets tough.
At a time when the Rangers support needs to be strong, united and singing from the same hymn sheet – they are at loggerheads, factions are created, abuse and threats peddled towards their own. The McColl and Green camps are using the media to do their dirty work – utilising partisan journalists to write copy that will see them in a good light and the other camp as the villains. In short, the current Rangers farce is looking more and more like smear campaigns that are the norm in US Presidential elections.
It is no wonder that fans of other clubs are looking on with amusement at the goings-on at Rangers, while the Rangers fans and these ‘real Rangers folk’ fight among themselves. Is this the club and the support that claim to be dignified and honourable?
The truth and the facts seem to dispute that statement currently. So will these ‘real Rangers folk’ be up to the job? Are they now swarming around the board to get the club on the cheap when others have done all the hard work? With Jim Traynor, Walter Smith and others pointing towards McColl and his cabal as the way to go it is all far too convenient after 34,000 season tickets have been sold. Why not launch such a coup d’etat before?
Afraid that such goings on would damage the season ticket sales?
Summa
Back to Basics – Glass Half Full
22:37
The boy is a coward and easily intimated.
No.
Celtic by its very existence is political if you know your history. There are even recent anti Celtic supporter laws in Scotland. Not written as such but you know what I mean. To suggest Celtic supporters do not need to be political and should exist in a vacuum just to celebrate their Irish roots is to promote the bigot buck in my opinion :).
Other news is that Celtic will resurrect plans for safe standing area. We have planning permission lodged with GCC but dormant for some time. Contractors have even measured for barriers. So here’s hoping. This man JPT appears to be the real deal.
turkeybhoy
Assuming there is an all singing all dancing four million pound striker out there, does he want to come to us , does he want to come to a side that’s not in the CL yet ?
Neil said its hard work signing one of these type of players , I believe him.
.
fanadpatriot
22:36 on
8 August, 2013
Why don’t Celtic let the GB use section 111 but arrange the area into small boxed sections,this would stop lateral movement but allow the fans to be close together.
Hillsbourgh Lepping Lane pens was to stop Lateral Movement..
Summa
no apologists
22:41
Excellent. Thanks again.
I have been a supporter for over 50 years. I support through thick and thin, I don’t have a choice it is part of me. I don’t apply conditions to my support, I went pre Jock Stein, when our ambition was limited to perhaps top 4 and a run in the cup. The green brigade are a clique within the club, their support is not unconditional, they believe their political views trump their love of Celtic, I understand this but don’t subscribe to it.
I know that I will be at Celtic Park until I am physically unable, even if the atmosphere is like a morgue, even if we are mid table, I know because that how it was in the early 60’s, will the GB?
no apologists
Thanks for this. Good info.
Are you JPT’s dad BTW?
HH
CRC
Guys
The petition below needs 100 supporters before it gets sent out all over by the petition hosts so please sign if inclined.
https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/uk-government-and-the-nhs-treat-children-with-high-risk-neuroblastoma-in-the-uk
Thanks
BRTH
German style standing area with strategically positioned buffers / safety barriers to prevent large groups moving laterally. As per the German model the standing area can quickly changed to a seated area for European games and events such as the Commonwealth games. That’s what we need
Lincolnshire poacher
I know that I will be at Celtic Park until I am physically unable, even if the atmosphere is like a morgue, even if we are mid table ……
You won’t be on your own , as I will be there too.
Great post
What a remarkable job Neil Lennon is doing under the most trying of circumstances.
He is on the brink of another Champions League campaign despite his best players all wanting to play in more “exciting” leagues for one reason or another.
Hopefully the club will reward him accordingly. And also find another goalscorer to compliment Stokes, Samaras and Commons.
Celtic_First
22:37 on
8 August, 2013
*****************************
The issues of migration (overcrowding), lateral movement and crowd surfing were discussed last year. One of these issues migration is a management matter for the club, the other 2 were mainly observations that required no action plan.
As I said earlier the Safety Certificate was issued without any concerns in how the stadium was managed.
Lincolnshire Poacher
Good Post — I am with you— will be there through think and thin.
Might argue with everyone else there— but will still be there.
I’m not questioning anybody’s motives or integrity but I find it strange that posters can provide a detailed update of exactly what went on between the Club & The Green Brigade and yet the Club observes a stony silence. At this stage I don’t know who or what to believe but anybody on the internet can claim inside knowledge or impeccable source etc. so I’m sorry if it makes me a cynic but I’ll wait & see what either side of the dispute come out with and make my mind up from there.
BRTH
Done.
Ps
for anyone donating by text ……………….TEXT MACK83 then amount to 70070
The wean needs help
Poacher,
Make no mistake, the GB are Celtic through and through.
There are also guys working for Celtic, in various capacities, who are equally Celtic minded (to coin a phrase).
Thing is, we couldn’t give Celtic up even if we wanted to.
Tommy Burns knew..
“Look at them Jim. Thats what special about them. They’re there and they’re always there. God bless every wan of them” . . Tommy Burns
Hail Hail starry,
Paul McStay knows too..
“Celtic Football Club is the fans, without them there is no club.” – Paul McStay
no apologists
22:41 on
8 August, 2013
*****************************
I agree i think JPT is a good guy and will do his best to improve Celtic and its relationship with our support.
The last info I had on the Safe standing area was that no planning permission application had been submitted but the issue had been discussed with GCC Building Control, they advised that due to the stadium having a steep gradient then extensive engineering and construction work would be required for an application to have any merit.
I would not be holding my breath for Safe Standing any time soon.
BRT&H
Well done re your petition-and all your other efforts!
Halfway there now.
I’ve signed it and forwarded it to a few.
I’ll forward it to a lot more when I get into work shortly.
Pf912912
They may be, Celtic through and through, but their actions suggest that their political views come first.
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan supports Kano 1000
22:45 on
8 August, 2013
Guys
The petition below needs 100 supporters before it gets sent out all over by the petition hosts so please sign if inclined.
https://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/uk-government-and-the-nhs-treat-children-with-high-risk-neuroblastoma-in-the-uk
Thanks
BRTH
————-
signed and posted on facebook as well
HH
CRC
Like Celtic fans very willing to make complaints against former clubs and their present exists there are no doubt Rangers fans on the Glasgow City Council Licensing board only to willing to make complaints about anything and everything that happens inside Celtic Park.
Therefore the club have no choice but to self police section 111 as they refuse to comply with the same stadium rules as the rest of us.
An extract of a statement made by Celtic Supporters
It was made clear that the Green Brigade were not responsible for any pyrotechnics which were used during the match against Cliftonville at Celtic Park and had no knowledge of any fan’s intention to use them. We accept that it took place in our section however and as a group we will strive to deal with the matter and have warned fans on our website against such behaviour in 111
A couple of points jump out at me regarding the above.Its obvious that there are some within the group who are well aware of who was actually responsible for the illegal use of pyrotechnics at said game and they will protect their identity no matter the cost to Celtic and I doubt very much that any sort of punishment will be meted out by the authors of the statement and secondly what gives any group any right to self police themselves at Celtic Park
I imagine if I turned up to hire a function suite within the stadium stating I would supply my own security my offer would quite rightly be declined
If supporters groups are serious about protecting the good name of Celtic they could start by offering up the names of those who may be responsible for costing the club 40,000 euro fines
But I am long enough in the tooth and have attended Celtic Park for too many years to know that self interest is the order of the day for some supporters groups when it comes to compromises
Gourockemeraldbhoy
Catching up but heading to Dublin tomorrow.
Slow boat from Cairnryan
I think when tkts came out I said in same section as you..
Look out for a big guy in green
: > )
Oglach,
If Celtic provide the evidence to the GB and they are satisfied, I suppose that will be our answer.
It seems Celtic don’t consider there is a real prospect of GCC effectively closing Celtic Park but they do wish to avoid putting it to the test or having their approach to safety questioned.
Celtic will also be intricately aware of the relatively recent corporate manslaughter legislation where Directors of a company can be imprisoned if a death arises from what is found to be a negligent act or omission of the company. Any company needs to evidence, record and demonstrate that they have undertaken all measures to reduce the risk of injury etc to employees and “visitors” to the premises. If Celtic ignore what others perceive to be action likely to endanger visitors etc, the Directors can be held personally responsible.
In my business, some of the duties required of Directors seem way over the top and the prospect of injury extremely remote but that’s where we are I’m afraid.
Back to Basics 22.37.
If James Forrest was a coward he would never have
made it through the ranks to the Celtic 1st team.
My next two posts go out to two of my favourite night-shift CQNers. I have deliberately waited until I thought, and hoped, these bhoys would be back on the blog, time differences being what they are.
Relating to posts they both made last night.
First,
‘GG
04:30 on
8 August, 2013
I’ve found in life and in Celtic it’s best to celebrate the positives and try to learn from the negatives.
—
This is my view too, completely and utterly. This is Psalm 125, my favourite, in a nutshell. There is a time to sow (and weep while we do it), and a time to reap (and rejoice while we do it). The old Protestant hymn ‘Bringing in the Sheaves’ comes from this.
My humble opinion is that we have become very bad at both. We have to sow, the daily grind. There is no option for those of us not independently wealthy. Sometimes the daily grind causes us to weep. This, too, is part of the human condition.
What we have become particularly bad at, in my view, is recognising the time to reap what we have sown, the fruits of the daily grind, and rejoicing. We are bad at rejoicing. The irony is that the ‘leisure industry’ has been trying for ages to get us just to celebrate one thing after another, whether appropriate to us or not. You have to earn, with the sweat of your brow, that moment of reaping and rejoicing for it to taste sweet.
In the context of Celtic, we have to remember what life was like before Rangers destroyed themselves. The remnants are still there. My parents and grandparents would never have believed we would see what we have seen in the last two years. Perhaps you would say the same of yours. But we have seen it. It is real and we have come through it. Praise be to God. And we should pause to thank our forebears for all the years of sowing and weeping they went through so that we might see these days.
The psalm says:
“They go out full of tears, carrying seed for the sowing.
They come back full of song, carrying the sheaves.”
—
Thank you for a great post.
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan supports Kano 1000
22:45 on 8 August, 2013
I get:
“Uh oh.
The server is misbehaving.
You can try refreshing the page, and if you’re still having problems, just try again later. We’re doing our best to get things working smoothly!”
Sorry that should be is a coward.
Bemused at the accusation.
Was Sammi a coward until he scored a double
at bigotville ?
Its fashionable on the blog to taunt anyone who supports The Green Brigade with the mantra “I was there before the Green Brigade and I will be there after they are gone”. Well I support the Green Brigade and have supported Celtic for close on 60 years. If the Green Brigade is killed off, I will still be a Celtic Supporter. My support is not conditional on anything, I just think The Green Brigade brings a lot to the Club and the Club will be poorer for their demise. And yes before anyone says it, The Green Brigade have made mistakes and do need to conform to agreed procedures.
BRTH,
Petition signed