This was a defensive and tactical failure. Efe Ambrose was slow to follow his man for the first goal (Fraser was the beaten easily, though redeemed himself later). Efe was also brushed off the ball at the second goal. Strength in the six yard box is imperative for a central defender.
Mikael Lustig was caught underneath his man for the cross which led to the second goal, a feature of our defending all night. All he could do was attempt to block the header back across goal, instead of challenge for the ball. He was also in the wrong starting position, and therefore, unable to stop the cross which led to the fourth goal.
With Lustig and Ambrose already culpable at the second goal, Virgil van Dijk was caught napping. He may have expected better from his team-mates, but he should have remained alert with the ball inside the penalty area. The space afforded to Radovic, Virgil’s man, should never have existed.
I’ve no idea why Emilio, our only left back, was omitted from the starting line-up. He offered balance when he came on, until his late horror show when he was turned inside out, then inside out again, at the third goal. It was like watching a clip from the 50s, when full backs didn’t know to get tight and close-off one option for the attacker.
Charlie Mulgrew had a nightmare beyond the level of the others, which is saying something. Two penalty kicks, failing to attack the ball with his man, who headed the third goal, failing to track the run for the fourth, and the debacle which led to possession being lost when Efe was red carded, was a calamitous return.
I’ve heard transfer rumours about everyone who played in defence last night apart from Lustig and Izaguirre. It looked like the defenders had been listening to them too, and had minds on other things.
The squad’s weaknesses were exposed by Legia.
It’s probably too late to lament the absence of Wanyama, but with Brown again out through injury, we’re short of bite in central midfield, exactly what we needed when the defence was comatose. Stefan Johansen and Charlie Mulgrew had the senior combative roles, it just didn’t work. We need to fix this gap as soon as possible.
Ronny got things wrong.
I agree with the manager’s assessment in his post-match BBC interview, the back four didn’t defend as a unit, which is fatal at any level of football, and we didn’t press as a team. I’ll make no excuses for the defenders, but playing this specific 4-3-3 away from home in Europe was asking for trouble.
If we’re short of bite with Johansen and Mulgrew, we’re shorter still if the third man in the middle is the creative Kris Commons. Love him, though we do, he is neither a tackler nor a box-to-box player. The middle three in this formation need to be mobile, covering as much ground as four, sometimes five, opponents. Johansen, Mulgrew and Commons was wrong on all levels. As a result, the Legia midfield probably had their easiest game of the year.
Callum McGregor delivered a goal, as much as anyone could reasonably expect of him, but this was his first game against top-flight full-timers. He needs people to ease him into the role. Jo Inge Berget hasn’t trained with the club, has played only twice since January and there’s a reasonable chance he didn’t know the names of all his team-mates.
If you want to know why we didn’t press as a team as soon as Legia got in amongst us, the clues are everywhere. Of course we didn’t press as a team.
On top of this, we ran the same Pukki experiment as last year, with the same outcome. We’ve seen a lot more of this Celtic team than Ronny, who might now be on the same page as the rest of us.
“Anywhere but Warsaw” was title of the CQN article on the day of the draw as this one was entirely predictable, and that was before Legia won in Dublin. The new manager has yet to get his feet under the table. The squad are in a state of flux. We are short of experienced, reliable, players in several positions, and football in July is often a lottery. There was a chance Legia would capitulate but it was more likely that they would be fitter and better rehearsed.
Seven days is a long time in preseason terms, and as you don’t need me to tell you, we’ve been here before. Don’t think this is over.
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32 days to go in this transfer window and £487.75m already spent by EPL clubs.
Obscene!!
paolosboots FC before PLC
15:13 on
31 July, 2014
Where do you get £80M from two CL from?
The answers you seek are in the accounts. They’re available on the club’s website in the investor relations section.
I think Ronny has a preferred system, I.e a main central striker with wide players left and right, backed up by a solid industrious midfield 3…
It’s a shape adopted by most big clubs across Europe.. You can call it a 4-3-3, but evidently when not in possession of the football, the 2 wide attackers should tuck in as midfielders, creating a more robust 4-5-1 when defending.
Unfortunately for us, we don’t have the players to play the system. Stokes, pukki, Griffiths are all strikers geared up to play in the now defunct 4-4-2 set-up…. Neither of these 3 are truly effective as playing as the sole central striker (as what is needed in 4-3-3) the other flaw we have, is that Boeriggter and Forrest are the only 2 candidates to play the wide positions, yet one of which isn’t deemed good enough and the other is injured…. Hence shoe horning players like McGregor and Griffiths in to wide positions.
Then look at our midfield 3…. Mulgrew (never a centre mid) Johansen (energetic + tidy enough! but not strong) and Commons (a luxury player, with zero work rate / engine)….. Then, hey presto…. You try and bake a cake with the wrong ingredients, and it falls flat in ur face !
Sid. Big EFEs concentration often lets him down also he likes his mazy runs upfield where he usually loses the ball and is slow to get back into position. He is a liabilty and if there is any truth that there is an 8 million offer in for him we should be saying goodbye to Efe and we wish you luck. H.H.
Disappointed to see Neil Lennon having a pop. He was not a fan of former players putting the boot in when he was manager.
Not surprised at walker.
Watching the hockey. Scotland strip is like an old hun top. Only thing missing g is the black socks with the red band at the top.
ruggygman
15:18 on
31 July, 2014
Griffiths is actually better as the lone striker. That’s what he played at Hibs and bagged 30+ goals in a team that didn’t create that many chances. He’s not a wide player.
good morning lads
Still peeved about the performance, but still happy about the engagement stuff (life is all about swings and round abouts) …. I was running about yesterday, so couldn’t reply to each and every one, but wanted to thank you all for your kind thoughts and words.
Going forward, I still think RD is going to drag Celtic into the 21st century (at least in terms of football) …. sadly, I think that like LeGuen at deadco, there will much wailing and gnashing of teeth from some of your players … but, needs must and the players will have to adjust and work harder, or they wont be here …. but I trust that most of them will see the benefits of what RD wishes to instill.
Realistically, we must assume that we are out of CL (and cant bet on EL) for this season … and since the league is a foregone conclusion, this season MUST be used to get the players learning and playing the RD system …. (and assuming there is no appreciable spend, and we proceed with the squad we have, these are my thoughts:
From what I understand, RD favours a 4-3-3, but right now, our squad is more suited to a 4-4-2 …
Up front, LG (a scorer) and KC (a no. 10) just behind him are a must – with Stokes and Pukki as replacements) …
Frig, Atajic and Balde can all get games as needed for injuries, etc.
We have a hole in the middle of the park which needs filled…. Biton (a real player) and Johansen is not ideal, but probably the best we can do (two guys with decent engines, but also can see a pass) (with Kayal, Henderson and McGregor to sub in as needed).
Out right, SBrown (not my favourite, but he adds some steel) and JF (when fit) can play … again, horses for courses … JF for a bit more offence when required, but SB to add a bit of support for the centre mids.
on the left of mid… I think it will be new guy, backed up Boerrigter (not thrilled, but have to work with what we have)
Right back … Lustig (backed up by AM, who can also sub in at right mid, if required).
Left back … Izzy (too small and too often caught out of position for CL, but more than adequate for SPL) with Mulgrew as back up
Centrebacks … EA and VVD (with focus and discipline RD will bring, there is a good pairing there), with Mulgrew and Fraser as back ups
I think FF is immense, but I suspect he will be off soon, and I think CG has looked promising, so I would give him the nod over Zaluska.
On present form, this is a bit frightening (EA is back to scaring me), but I think this group and this formation has the most potential given (i) resources at hand, and (ii) how I think/hope they will react to RD’s plans.
I am sure I have forgotten someone … but, if so, I am sure someone will let me know.
Thoughts?
Lots on here about the style of play manager wants, the commitment of players, the board and signings….etc
For me, style of play, becomes completely and utterly irrelevant – how can you have any confidence in a manager who put a guy into a £20 m moneyball game who
– was signed 48 hours earlier and didn’t know his team mates
– probably didn’t and still doesn’t know their names
– had played 1or 2 competitive games in 8 months.
If that guy was Messi or Ronaldo fair enough, but he isn’t, and it isn’t his fault he was out in that situation.
In most lines of business, someone who gambled £20 m like that would be instantly dismissed
Mike,
Congrats on the engagement!
I think the comparison with PLG is instructive. We all laughed at them when they gave in to the Monster Munch Tendency, I wonder if a similar attempted clear-out is on the cards at CP?
If there is unhappiness and disgruntlement amongst certain players (and I’d be amazed if there isn’t), then we will no doubt hear about it soon.
Big days ahead for Ronny…
NFL lost his 1st title at Inverness by playing two wee guys in midfield and they were trampled by the hammer throwers. We all want to see Lisbon Lion attacking football but sometimes it isn’t on like v Dukla Prague in 67. I just hope Ronny learns fast. I’ll be through for the return leg and look forward to hopefully turning them over. If not then at least start building for the future like starting the pre season build up in the beginning of June with games against summer league opponents.
STV tried there best to put words in Neil Lennon’s mouth but he’s far too smart. It didn’t stop them printing their usual sh*te though.
HH.
JFH
8Million I dont think so, but getting a centre half who just clears his lines is not the answer, I thought we are changing to a more passing/possession style. When you get beat as badly as we did you have to question the system as well as the individuals.
Clashcitybhoy. We all know Rony got it wrong but it happened we all need to get behind him and the team for the second leg there is a slim ( very slim ) chance we can overturn lasts night defeat. Come on you Bhoys in Green. H.H.
ClashCityBhoy
Fair comment. My sense is that starting with Berget was a significant factor in unsettling the team. Not the whole story by any means, but significant nonetheless.
I do agree Clashcitybhoy, I was shocked when I saw him included. I expected FF, Lustig Ambrose, Virgil Izzy. Johansen Kayal Biton Mulgrew Commons & Stokes. It is too early to judge Berget, it wasn’t fair on him either to pitch him in at the deep end. Only consolation there is we are only tied to him until Christmas so if he is no better than what we have can get rid easily enough.
Italiabhoy
Cheers.
On one hand, our players dont seem as fit as some (most) of the teams we play in Europe. On the other hand, we see them at the end of games, and they are shattered… they worked hard (chasing the ball around) …. but they dont always work smart ….
so, part of this is coaching and something I think RD will bring …. but part of it requires a fundamental adjustment in attitude …and not just at Celtic …it is much broader than that …
I think too many British players (not just Celtic players) are simply not as hungry/dont work as hard as these young kids who grow up dirt poor and are hungry and work harder …I am thinking of (what I hear of) Tony Watt … even if he doesn’t knuckle down, he will end up a decent player, and he will still have a great lifestyle .. but if some young kid in Sierra Leone, or the slums of Brazil gets a chance to play football for a career, he puts his soul into it, as he realizes that it is make it, or back to life of poverty for him and his family…….
I dont want to sound like something out of west side story (its not our problem, its a social disease), but I do think that there is a broader social issue at play (which is why most of the British national teams underperform, and why the top EPL teams that are successful in Europe, have so many foreigners as key players) …
just a thought..
The Battered Bunnet
Yesterday I predicted Berget would start. I wouldn;t have done so myself but I could see it coming. End of the road for derk for me. He didn;t even get quoted when we are struggling for a wide man. Griffith’s and Stokes were not quoted either for a starting place. RD appears to like fit grafters Commons is his luxury player. The rest have to graft and work hard at training. That may work in the long term but in the meantime he has to go for tried and tested players. He made mistakes last night. Let’s see if he learns from them.
LB
Ambrose could be sold if we are able to line up a replacement for the same fee. He’s a good player at SPL level but too careless for Europe. There’s a reason why Nigeria play him right back – he has pace, stamina height and drive. Playing RB you can get away with a lot of mistakes. In central defense it is different. Unfortuntately for Efe we have 3 excellent right backs at the club and don’t need him there. Personally I hope he stays at least another season. He has improved considerably since he joined the team, but has looked a bit too much like his old self since returning from the World Cup.
Paul
Very fair assessment of last night’s game. With one or two comments..
Fraser made some excellent saves (2 from open play and the 2nd penalty) but he still looks very weak on crosses – the 2nd and 3rd goal crosses were very claimable for a professional, international standard keeper. Saw Fraser scream at the defence after he made a wonder save, but I rarely hear him communicate with his defence otherwise. Perhaps it’s harsh to say anything negative about the man who kept the scoreline down, but it doesn’t mean he is blameless for the rest of it.
The Legia forwards seem to have a low centre of gravity in the last third, until they stepped into the box – at which point they seemed to have no sense of balance at all, falling over at will. A weak referee, a hostile partisan crowd, and defenders who threw tackling caution to the wind inside the box – squared that circle. It was very clear from the outset that Legia were simulating for a penalty, but the referee only chose to wave away dives but did not punish or warn the offenders. That Legia strategy was successful though, because as claims you make without a penalty being awarded results in increased howling from the mob, theatrics from their players and pressure on the “weak” ref.
TBB
We supposedly didn’t take a 1st team to Hamburg because they were preparing for last night, but clearly as the manager wasn’t there, nor the Berget fella that didn’t happen.
You know how football works, and players will be making very quick judgements, about whether they want to play for him, or go through the motions, and I suspect many will already have made that decision particularly those from UK / Ireland
Italiabhoy,
I always thought Leguen was an average manager who had a very good infra-structure surrounding him in France….he took over a well drilled club.
His ability, or lack of, or IMHO averaginess was quickly highlighted at Ibrokes
Ominous?
paolosboots FC before PLC
15:13 on
31 July, 2014
For the record UEFA reports the revenue received from them for the last two CL campaigns as £18M and £14M respectively. Would £2M per game in ticketing and matchday revenue be overly generous? For seven games that’s another £14M.
£46M or thereabouts. I ask again where do you get £80M?
Said to bhoys at 80 mins last night,time to park the bus and get out with a 2-1 defeat with 10 men , would be recoverable …….couldn’t do it.
MONEYBALL is the way to go I tells yeez!
I tells yeez I does.
MWD says AYE
LiviBhoy
The end of the road for Derk should have been when he jumped out a 50-50 challenge in Reykjavik(at 0-0) which led to a great chance for them. Would rather go a man short than have him anywhere near a Celtic shirt. Was surprised Griffiths didn’t start tbh.
Shambles but an early goal next week and who knows.
HH
Just back from holiday to find tickets for Murrayfield next week and tickets for St Johnstone.
All of a sudden I feel just a wee bit better.
A question just out of interest. Has Ronny Delia ever managed a team that has played in European competitions before joining us?
Bada
The 4th was the criminal act imo. An absurd goal to lose in the circumstances.
Zbyszek,
Hope you’re well and congratulations my bhoy, excellent result for your 1st favourite team.
Horror show in naivety from your 2nd favourite team and despite many incredibly bad individual performances by the Celtic players, the manager takes the blame for this one.
Playing 4 x forward type players (regardless of whether some of them started in midfield or not…Pukki/Commons/Berget/McGregor are all forward types) and handing a player his debut after 1 or 2 training sessions, who hadn’t played a competitive senior game since January, takes a bit of beating in a Naivety Competition.
When I analyse disastrous defeats, normally I apply an “…in hindsight” factor but this time I could see we’d be so open and have major problems as soon as I heard the starting 11….it was an “in foresight” moment.
But….not taking anything away from Legia – thought they were a good team who hit very well on the break. Your fans were incredible as well. That big banner was something else, but would’ve driven me mental if I had to sit behind it.
I fear the second leg will come too early for this Celtic management team….
But my tickets have arrived and by 7.45pm next Tuesday I’ll be there in a better frame of mind, roaring the bhoys on.
All the best,
tully
When was the last time Matthews had a good game? Turning into another mythical “good young player”…….. We’ve got loads of them ,remember…..
last night was hard to take….but when the line-up was announced then there was only one possible outcome. a terrible setup for a start before adding in the factor of players out of position, better players suited to the game left on the bench, a loan signing pitched straight in and when it started going pear shaped the glaringly obvious substitutions just didn’t happen.
Yet with 10 mins to go we were still favourites to go through over 2 legs IF we just played with a bit of calm and defended as a 10 man team……why we did not is a mystery
An era is over i fear, we are no longer a CL team and i cant see us becoming one again without big investment and that will not happen. …..TBH, If we now make the EL then that will do for me……….to reach the CL Groups and then be pot4 cannon fodder will be an embarrassment. We have managed to punch above our weight with some decent players, those players are now gone Hooper, Wanyama, Ki, Sammi, Ledley with no equal or better quality replacements and I don’t want to see the team I love being there just to make up the numbers. Perhaps EL will give us some kind of challenge that may not be impossible to compete in
Today, I hope PL is pleased with himself……there was only ever one final outcome to this. When he looks out and sees a half empty Paradise on matchdays I hope he realises every empty seat had a Bhoy or Ghirl there who loves their club far far more than he ever will
Keyboard malfunction above – posted by renegade keyboard.
last bit should read.
“That Legia strategy was successful though, because as these claims mounted, the howling from the mob and Legia player theatrics increased, increasing the pressure on the weak ref into awarding at least the 2nd penalty, on the basis of balance of probabilities.
I didn’t see the game last night but instead settled for CQN updates. It was all going so well up to the first goal then it made for brutal reading.
I’m not going to make the home tie as I’m heading to Alaska on Tuesday. Do we have any Alaskan Tims who can recommend a bar in Anchorage I might be able to pick up the game?
Mike in Toronto, congratulations you sly old fox. I’ll raise a glass to you later.
HH
TBB- killed the tie IMO, Stokes and Griffiths have to start next week,with McGregor on the wing ,if we are to have any chance.HH
macjay1 for Neil Lennon
10:09 on
31 July, 2014
Tontine Tim
10:02 on
31 July, 2014
I was at that Ne`erday game too.
Wee Henderson cracker of a goal just after half time.
Painful it was.
The “story” was that Pat was poured into Ibrox just before the game.
He left Celtic very soon after.
*Aye heard that story at the time…betty davis scored for them tae FFS….yet the following week we went up tae pittodrie with a revamped team, 6 changes in all, and won 5-1 with 2 goals from the much maligned Bobby Craig and a hat trick from the Bear.
Mike in Toronto supports Oscar Knox….
Of course, all about opinions.
I believe 433 can work… Home or away… When away from home the onus is on the 2 wide forwards, to become more defensive minded, and support / suppliment the midfield 3..
As it goes my favoured midfield 3 would be Broony, Biton, Johansen….
My forward 3, right to left Forrest, Griffiths, Commons….
Of the above, I would say Commons prefers to play central, and most probably wouldn’t give the defensive work rate or support to midfield…. Therefore possibly the new Norwegian guy, in the wide left forward position.
Sir Paul
Ye said awe the right things.. in yer review of Oor troubled defeat.
n.. Ah agree wi everything that ye said..
Howevahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
Like Ah keep oan Reminding Folk..
Ah NOTICE things..
n…ye Didnae Mention.. whit Ah Noticed..
An Ah noticed something….BIG TIME.. Last Night..
In Fact.. Ah Mentioned it.. As soon As the Game Started..
Before, a Goal Wiz Loast..or A Ball wiz Kicked..
They FANS.. THEY FANS.. THOSE Legia Fans!
Ah said that Ah hid Never Heard Such NOISY Fans…. Waves of Sound…Emanating like Thunder..
These Fans ,in MA opinion wur Like No Ither.. that we hiv Met.. so far..in the C.L.
N… Sure Enuff.. like Ah Secretly Dreaded..( Because ..of Whit Ah Dreaded..n because of Ma Backgrun in Psychology..)
It wiz the Legia Fans.. Who Done Us ..
Sure, We Helped a Loat In Ensuring oor Demise..
but oor Poor Play . in Ma Opinion.. wiz HEAVILY INFLUENCED..
by the Sheer.. Weight ..of the Palpable Pressure.. which the Legia Fans..
Imposed oan oor Defenders .. Eardrums n Psyches..
Our Guys Wur Subjected tae a Wall of Noise.. This Is An old Psychological Trick..
N..if imposed Correctly.. kin break down Any Kind of Resistance in the Hearers.
Yes.. Undootedleeeee//
It wiz the Treemendous Backing fae the Legia Twelfth Man.. Which
Did the Dirty..oan Us..
Think Aboot it…
We started. Brightly..Confidently… n..sure enuff..
our Sparklin Play.. Wiz Rewarded..
We Scored that early Goal .. which so Often Had Eluded us,in C.L. Competition..
n..it wiz from OOTFIELD PLAY.. tae..
Great Goal… fae the Kid..
Everything, wiz coming up Roses…’
After that Early Goal.. All of us.. Were..Like Big Bill Campbell. Feelin’ Mighty Fine!
Then.. Whiz Bang.. thankye Man..
Legia..
EQUALIZED!
As the Fitba wiz Centred..right after oor Goal….the Legia.. Fans.. went tae Work.
n..did THEY EVER!
They Roared ,they Stamped .. Their Noise Grew Even Louder…n Louder.
N..thur Idols. responded.. Jist Like Pavlov’s Dug?…But..Of Course they did..
fur this Legia Team..Know Awe aboot thur fans Abilitee. tae ..
Ramp up .. thur flaggin Spririts..
n.. This Time.. The Fans.. Never Say Die Enthusiasm.. Woiked…
Jist like THAT.. SNAP!
Bingo .Bango Bongo…
Our Hopes n Dreams came crashing doon..
Efter Legia.. EQUALIZED.. Ah Turned tae.. Ma Pals.. Lou. Boots.. Starry,,n the Rest..
N
Groaned..
“Ah knew it. Ah knew it..!
They fans.. hiv done us In….”
Yes..That is whit Ah said..
Of Course. when the Efe Challenge wiz Punished..
Ah knew that the Writing wiz oan the Wa’
“That’s it… Fertig Mit.. Ye know whit Nutsy Says??
“Lose a Man.. Lose the Game” in the C. L.
Right..??
Damn Right ..it’s Right!!!
This Tale should not be an Unfamiliar wan..
We know How It wiz OOR FANS..
who
Done In.. The Gandy Dancers..
Sure.. We came back fae the Tall n Uncut.. Licking oor wounds.. N
Lo n Behold..
Good Home Cooking..n. The Treeemendous Response of
OOR ain Fans..
Quickly Gee.d U Oan. tae a Resounding Comeback .. Victory..
noo.. Is it Possible that Oor Fans..
Kin Oodae.. Those Wonderful Legia wans???
Why No? Ah Say..
Why Not, indeed..
Sure..it kin be done.. n..it hiz bin Done afore..
We jist Need tae Score.
Three Goals ..n tae Lose. None..
Yes..it Kin be Done…
N..
We are Jist the Team tae Dae
with..of Course..
THE HELP OF OOR.. TREEEEMendous.. Fans
Kojo
Still,Laugnin’
Tully
by 7.45 next Tuesday you’ll be parking up at Ingliston and waiting on the tram to Murrayfield… Go with a supporters bus!
Bada – notable point. IMO, Matthews was the most talented of the youngsters in the group 3 years ago that included Forrest, Wanyama and Forster, but he’s developed little in the intervening period. Forrest likewise.
Dunno what the issue is, although he’s been injured quite a few times (by foul play) which perhaps has had an impact. Disappointing. An important season for him.
Just a selection of the possible opponents we could draw in the EL play-off
Brondy, Brugge, Karagandy, Hadjuk Split, Real Sociedad, Gothenberg, Cluj, Lech Poznan, Torino, Hull, PSV Eindhoven, Lyon, Rosenberg
Afternoon awe
is good to see the blog
Has its balls back in the last 24 hrs
Been posting stuff like this since
Ronnie was appointed
And have been largely ignored
I also like the language clear and concise
and not pages bull
Long live the opinions of the hundreds
to be critical is not being a hun