Thoroughly enjoying yesterday’s coordinated effort by Newco fans who have rushed to the coattails of Dave King. To be fair to the fans, the time for them to act was years ago, before Sir David Murray set Oldco on a path to destruction, there is little positive that can be done now. Still, that’s no reason to dive headlong into destruction.
After the debacle of 2012, when Oldco were liquidated, the assets were scooped up by people who wanted to make a lot of money. The moment Charles Green and his consortium owned the assets, this reality should have been acknowledged. No amount of 13th hour Blue Knight revisionism was going to change things.
Green made off with his money a year ago, but as a consequence of that, there are newer investors, with exactly the same objectives. There are also local investors in the form of the Easdale brothers. Neither of these groups will be bullied into submission.
King’s escrow plan, which hopes to gain security of the stadium and Murray Park, cannot be accommodated by the club. How many fans do you think they will convince to hand their season ticket money over, 1000? As many as 3000? Whatever your guess figure, this does not have the look of a high participation endeavour.
With many more fans likely to renew, and more still likely to be completely turned off by the nonsense, the The Rangers Football Club Ltd have a legal duty to their shareholders (Rangers International PLC) and creditors (coincidentally, also Rangers International PLC) to retain security of company assets. Placing them beyond the reach of creditors would be a remarkably brave and self-defeating act.
It now suits the club for King’s plan to appear to be effective, or at the very least, reduce season ticket renewals to a trickle. They can cite this as the action which tips The Rangers Football Club Ltd into administration. As the overwhelmingly major creditor, Rangers International would control this administration and their agents will set about reducing costs.
I would expect to see Newco to continue trading as a youth team for the foreseeable future, with Rangers International taking security of Ibrox and Murray Park, to satisfy their unresolved debt. This will be sold to the masses as ‘securing the stadium’, but it would be the key separation of club and stadium which King as sought to prevent.
Going forward, The Rangers Football Club Ltd will have no significant assets, no playing assets to speak of, and a substantial rental to pay to Rangers International, whose shareholders will still require their financial return. Don’t lose sight of this, the Piper Always Needs to be Paid. Always.
I haven’t revisited the RIPLC accounts which drew comment last week (might be worth an update later), but the important information to glean from them is the cost of running a football operation at a stadium which can occasionally host >40,000 people. You’re looking at circa £19m annually, before you employ a footballer.
I don’t see a way forward. This is a dead multi-club football franchise, killed by 1,000 reckless acts. Even the youth team scenario is unaffordable.
The hedge funds will know this already. Remember what John Brown claims Charles Green told him he would do to Ibrox if he was messed with? Raze it to the ground, apparently. After Newco Youth Team has spent a year-or-so bouncing around, we’ll hear that Ibrox is unsustainable as a football stadium (which I could believe). It will be razed and re-designated as an industrial area.
Celtic better have their plans in place now, as should the rest of Scottish football. There was a notion that there would be a three year hiatus before it was business as usual. This will not be the case.
We need to stand together, as a club, and with other clubs, wherever possible. We need to support the game, primarily through season ticket purchases, but we must find common ground with other clubs and fans.
Leppings Lane
Everything was wrong about football back then. Stadiums were not so much designed, they were built to fit the space and available materials. The lower Leppings Lane end of Hillsborough will be remembered as the worst terracing in football but, in truth, it was just where the next big disaster happened. It could have been anywhere.
After a decade or so of football hooliganism in England, fans were penned in, 8’ fences blocked entrance to the field, some topped with barbed wire. If you were at the fence, you were staying there until the thousands behind you headed home. Hampden Park had these fences, a legacy of the 1980 Cup Final, but they were absent from other grounds in Scotland. The Jungle had some high fencing but with regular breaks. If you wanted to get onto the field, you could do so.
Leppings Lane had further chronic safety violations. As well as a fence at the front the terrace was divided into four pens with fences running back to front. Once through the turnstile, fans were free to choose which pens to join; most would choose the central two. Of course they would.
The central two pens were accessed via a tunnel running under the upper stand. On That Day, fans entering at the rear of the tunnel had no inclination of the crush ahead. By the time they were part of the crush, others had gathered behind them. Space to retreat was quickly lost.
The outer pens were empty, the central two, death-traps. Fans piling into the tunnel knew nothing of the crisis ahead.
For some minutes it was possible for the police to burst open the pens and allow fans to flood free onto the pitch but they were still in crowd control mode. By the time they realised there was a disaster underway, it was too late.
There were lies and cover-ups. Fans were blamed, and accused of atrocious acts, all untrue. The government were complicit. The Sun were the worst media offenders but by no means the only one.
Two weeks ago a fresh inquiry into the events of that day opened in Warrington. At long last, the truth, which we’ve all known for years, will out. Too late for many campaigners and bereaved, who died fighting the combined weight of the establishment, but welcome nonetheless.
Tomorrow, CQN’er, Iain McGovern, sets off on a 232 mile walk from Celtic Park to Anfield, where he hopes to arrive 11 days later, in aid of the Lola Commons Fund for SiMBA. It’s his way of commemorating Hillsborough. Supporting him could be yours.
I’m delighted (actually excited) to confirm John Hughes will be on the blog on Thursday morning. John is Celtic’s seventh highest goal scorer in our 126 year history. He has remarkable insights into some of the great times and characters of our history. Tune in and ask him questions online.
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Auldheid, so long as there is transparency and it is administered properly.
As you say, when it is given up it is no longer Celtics, so that all makes sense.
So, next steps?
tim horton
Right, gotcha. Sorry bout that. No offence meant or taken. :-))
Weefra HH supporting and praying for Wee Oscar.
acgr…
Very sad.
Hope you change your mind.
Soldiers still needed even though the war was won.
HH
Doc
You just argue through the pros and cons when the opportunity arises.
I mention it regularly on TSFM and the other week Cosgrove who reads TSFM brought up on radio the idea of redistributing CL dosh without the how it might be done debate.
That is what needs to be stimulated. I tweeted Jim Spence with a link to my post tonight following Dundee Utd saying they intend to hold on to their best players. He liked the idea.
Celtic would have to do the sums to see impact on their objectives but we know one of them is to make the game more competitive so it is not an unthinkable idea.
In fact if it does improve domestic competition then some of the surrendered £3m might be recovered from larger crowds.
We have to recognise how interdependent football is as an industry and start thinking less selfishly. A bit like life really.
ACGR, hold yer fire squire.
Bide a bit.
Listen to the counsel of others on the blog, and wait.
I know many emails have been sent tonight to JPT, hopefully we will see a response.
I haven’t renewed yet either.
@Morrissey23rd
@stoksey10 @celticfc @CelticFCSLO Pity the club are out-of touch with the feeling of the support. #OldFirm alive&well
http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/?p=15089&cpage=11#comment-2140629
GCT – correct but we’re basically saying the same thing. Johansen was the last player to touch the ball in taking the pen and could not legitimately play the ball again before another player touched it.
Not “offside” as such as he WAS the last player to touch the ball.
Jude – good one :D
Nice to see a few cages have been rattled by Buster Brady’s proclamation about wanting the Zombies back.
A brainless wonder on the pitch and off it.
Just a fan
If it was not for the other 11 teams there would be nothing to endeavour over.
Why should the others not get something back by providing Celtic the opportunity to access CL money?
I understand that the rewards are set to rise with a new TV deal (BT?) and chances are we will have a bite at that cherry in the next 5 years. I am suggesting how that potential bonanza might best be used to the benefit of all.
Rangers go bust and embarrass themselves, Tick
Sevco are born and owner does a runner with Hun money. Tick
New guy arrives and promises security. Tick
Sevco spend too much and are on verge of going bust. Tick
Sevconian is fighting over old rangers assets and threatening to kill each other off. Tick.
Celtic fans threaten to withdraw support and funding for their club …….. Bingo!!!!
Don’t bother replying”………… Off to bed.
Hail! Hail!
Could any more effort be made to encourage fans not to renew? I don’t see the desire for this sanatised Old Firm at the cost of everything being shared by a huge section of the support.
This is a time we could have cleaned up the game and demonstrated that we do stand alone.
I know many are faithful and through and through. Many even miss the team they need to hate.
Many can’t stomach the corruption. Many are not prepared to just pay and turn up to a poor panto.
The hearts of many good Celtic men is being broken. Future generations of Celtic fans are being lost forever. Disappointed and increasing disillusioned.
If the Celtic v Rangers advert is causing nausea take a Sowhatery tablet.
Very calming.
Auldheid, tablet taken.
Nicely put.
Quite relaxing,
It is what is next for our game that should vex us, not what was.
I don’t miss playing them but I miss beating them.
I find them a disgrace of a club who encouraged and developed a sectarian policy to try and find a culture to match a rival who were founded by a people in need and who were open to all from minute one.
They were liquidated, their ghost club every time it takes the field is a reminder of their death. They are gone and their triumphalism is no more.
Why would any Celtic fan walk away from our club now? we won! Stokesy and an u’17 game…so what? Stokesy is probably sick of his windows getting put in, perhaps he misses beating them but lots of people need to get used to the new reality including him. This is what loads of us have dreamed about, enjoy it but don’t walk away.
HH
justafan, no disrespect to you buddy but the club and the players are telling me they want to bring back the very thing I despise about my early life in Glasgow.
The hatred and violence generated by the tie our club are so desperate to bring back must be well worth the massive sky / BT bags of silver they are taking. And people on here still harp on about Maurice Johnston being a judas? Our club are becoming more of a judas than judas and it makes me want to throw up.
I’m thoroughly disgusted by our club today for putting a naïve idiot like stokes in front of a microphone and then later announcing a young Celtic team were to play “Rangers”.
Great timing all round and a solid message to the support. No, a total Celtic cop out.
They could have rallied the whole Celtic support, sent a message to the SFA and the SPFL but instead, they chose the cowardly path.
Prize money for all levels of achievement are agreed before a ball is kicked
I am not in favour of Celtic sharing out any money obtained by the teams achievements on the pitch through Celtic living within our means
However if the other clubs want to revolutionize the SFA then i will reconsider my viewpoint, no revolution no shared prize money, if we did with no change at the SFA it would be the end of my season ticket
Did Cosgrove ever raise the issue of the ole Ragers sharing prize money ?
squire d
Was that not 1966?
Auldheid…
Don’t disagree I just look at it from a slightly different perspective. I think Celtic earn something in the order of £1.8m from domestic football via SPFL sponsor and media ‘rewards’. It is this money I’m suggesting Celtic or any other club qualifying for euro football group stages should waive.
Those funds can be distributed to non euro qualifying clubs equitably or (my preference) as performance based reward.
Probably semantics!
ACGR, we don’t have to accept it, whether the “club” do or not.
The “club” have differed from the support in the past.
It time for our tablets.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zE7PKRjrid4
But I won’t follow you into the rabbit hole
I hope the Celtic Under 17s win the Glasgow Cup On April 28.
Sowthatery CSC
estorilbhoy, nice to put the ticks in the boxes and all your points are great and we’ve had much hilarity at their expense. But it wont end with hilarity with our club and current players getting all starry eyed about the return of hun competition.
This a black day in Celtic’s history. We’re officially legitimising the years of shite they lorded it over us.
I don’t think I’ll join in with that party.
After everything that has happened that has exposed the huns for the cheats they are and all the strange decisions and media coverage from their administration up until the lies and pig headed childishness the huns,the sfa and the media have perpetrated to the detriment of Celtic and the supporters,the club has the chance and the power to make a statement and what does it go and do?
Celtic should NOT be referring to a dubious collection of assets as our former rivals,it makes a mockery of the hard earned financial support the fans sustain the club with.
On a day we get a reminder of the importance of buying a season book to maintain the club and keep it in a safe distance of negative financial events the club refers to a shambles of a new club as a club that is no longer in existence.
I would hope Celtic take heed of the supports feeling especially if the first team of the new club reach the spfl and refer to them as their proper name.
The one chance they get to do something right and they go n kow tow to those who wouldve gladly seen us killed off.
I might not be a season book holder but I spend plenty on merchandise,that will dramatically reduce if Celtic continue to help propagate the myth by the most simple of gestures to the fans as referring to them by their real name on match day literature and advertising.
And Stokes needs a good talking to anaw.
RWE, I hope they do too.
Night all Night wee Oscar my hero. God bless x
fritzsong 00:36
No.
http://www.thecelticwiki.com/page/1967-08-30%3A+Celtic+3-1+Rangers%2C+League+Cup
“To have to fight for the good name of the ones you lost was appalling but the authorities took on the wrong city.” Roberto Martinez #JFT96
Jungle Jim, if you read this in the morning you’ll know you’re back on the Arbroath supporters bus next season. Sorry pal, I’ll still take you out on the man’s course…………when I’ve had sufficient practice:_)
That was a fun season we had with a few great up and down journey’s fun but acgr has reached his line in the sand with the lies and bullshit from those I put my money and my faith in.
My one regret this season was laughing at Peter Lawell when he cracked his Rory Bremner joke. I thought he meant it and I was obviously very very wrong. At the very time we needed men of strength to guide us through this fiasco, we get a man with nothing more than a cheap throwaway joke.
acgr…
I can feel your passion from here mate!
Consider the footballer looking for red hot, meaningful, derby type fixtures. Famous games, games to test them, real rivalry…
I might not agree with them from a ‘political’ point of view but I can absolutely understand them wanting to play in that type of environment. Somebody posted earlier an excellent quote from TB about what it felt like to score against THEM….he thought about it for ten minutes and eventually said “nope there are no words to describe it”.
You talk to almost any Celtic player who played in these games and they’ll tell you what they meant to them. From memory I can only recall one player saying he didn’t much enjoy them and that was Bobby Murdoch. AS is by a mile not my favourite player but I can understand why a professional would want to play in or miss such matches. If that is what he thinks then it is good he gives his opinion rather than some fudged response which seems the norm nowadays.
You talk of Sky/BT but the rivalry preceded them by about 100 years! I refuse to get upset by any of them. In fact I think they’re trying to get me upset…I won’t let them lol
I understand what you’re saying and sympathise but I just don’t feel as aggrieved as you do.
As I said earlier if my dad or grandad was around now and was told Celtic supporters were not going to see Celtic following the liquidation of RFC they would be incredulous.
Anyway you’ve made your decision, good luck and I hope you’ll be back with us one day.
HH
Goodnight Celtic men and wummin.
ACGR wishes you nothing but the best.
Hail Hail We used to be Celtic
Goodnight all.
Fish and chip mhan next week?
Night oot delayed, but not abandoned!
You talk to almost any Celtic fan who paid to get into these games and they’ll tell you what they meant to them.
…and knowing what we know now. Why would any Tim want a return to THAT?
Timmy’s Swansong (No Fun):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iix18rtJmU0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=BiUIhgN7FH8
No mention of David Murray, John Greig or Billy Bunter’s love child here…or even an u’17 game!
sowhateryCSC
Right guys, no more lambs tonight. You would think these ewes were having us on. The twins born last night are doing brilliantly. So it’s a very tired Night Night Timland from me. Shattered is not the word. Worse if I could find one. Hey ho. :-)))
Weefra HH supporting and praying for Wee Oscar.
“The showpiece City of Glasgow Cup final will see Celtic’s Under-17s take on Rangers for the famous old trophy.”
http://www.celticfc.net/newsstory?item=5708
CELTIC will almost certainly be seeded in all three Champions League qualifying rounds next season as the dust starts to settle in European title races.
The Scottish champions will have to negotiate the second and third qualifying rounds as well as the play-off round if they are to reach the group stages again.
Celtic currently have six teams with a higher co-efficient than them that could be seeded in the qualifiers, but it would take a bizarre set of circumstances for Neil Lennon’s team not to be seeded.
Out of the six teams, the likely Swiss champions Basle are almost certain to go directly into the group stage and the five other teams would have to win their title for Celtic not to be seeded.
Although Salzburg have already won the league in Austria, and Steaua Bucharest are well clear in the Romanian League, three other teams are struggling to win their titles.
FC Copenhagen are third in the Danish league, Viktoria Plzen are second in the Czech league and ten points behind Sparta Prague with six games to play.
And APOEL are second in the Cypriot league, three points behind AEL Limassol with six games left.
It means Celtic will almost certainly have a less daunting path to reach the group stages again.
The sanest days are mad
Why don’t you find out for yourself?
Then you’ll see the price
Very closely
Some men here
They have a special interest
In the Old Firm
They want to help you to grow
And then siphon all your dough
Why don’t you find out for yourself?
Then you’ll see the glass
Hidden in the grass
You’ll never believe me, so
Why don’t you find out for yourself?
Sick down to my heart
That’s just the way it goes
Some men here
They know the full extent of
Your distress
They kneel and pray
And they say:
“Long may it last”
Why don’t you find out for yourself?
Then you’ll see the glass
Hidden in the grass
Bad scenes come and go
For which you must allow
Sick down to my heart
That’s just the way it goes
Don’t rake up my mistakes
I know exactly what they are
And what do you do?
Well you just sit there
I’ve been stabbed in the back
So many many times
I don’t have any skin
But that’s just the way it goes
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sWNGF1SkAAM
lionroars67
some good news for us.
HH
roy croppie
01:14 on
16 April, 2014
Yes with having to play at Murrayfield and having a team which at present is below C/L group stage standard, we need that seeding