Surprised? Well, yes. This was a no-contest early-on in Maribor last week. Even though Celtic didn’t come home with the win, the chances, balance of possession and play, were well in their favour. A defeat last night was never out of the question, but it was the nature of the defeat that was most concerning. We were second best in defence, midfield and attack.
Pre-match, Ronny told us he expected Maribor to sit in and counter-attack. They didn’t, forcing Celtic into disarray. We were fortunate to go in level at halftime; I was screaming out for a tactical change from 20 minutes in.
Kris Commons proved his value. From the moment he arrived, we had an out-ball for the first time in the night, but it was not enough.
Celtic tried to qualify for the Champions League without a target man, or a striker able to play the kind of football Ronny Deila requires to play his kind of football. Stokes, Griffiths, Pukki and Balde are not an appropriate Champions League strike force, by some distance.
We have plenty of midfielders who are happy to pass and run but no one with the composure to hold the ball. Brown, Forrest and Tonev were all missing, but none will occupy the holding roles given to Kayal and Mulgrew last night. Or to Wanyama two years ago.
The defensive collapse since last season is unfathomable. Virgil van Dijk was clearly a class above, whether in defence or attack, and Mikal Lustig was also assured – it is perhaps no coincidence that we lost the goal moments after he was replaced, but Efe Ambrose and Emilio Izaguirre have returned from the World Cup in alarmingly poor form.
This is where we are. We knew this at the end of last season, perhaps Neil Lennon did too. Ronny Deila has a significant rebuilding job on his hands.
Will we make a significant moves forward this week? This season? The Europa League isn’t the cash-cow of the premier tournament, and it carries none of the glamour, but it is a competition we need to be ready for. Perhaps more importantly, qualification planning for next season’s Champions League starts now.
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A wee recap on loan signings we have made for the first team since 2003-
Michael Gray – Dud
Henri Camara – Dud
Stephane Henchoz – Dud
Craig Bellamy – Success
Artur Boruc – Success
Du Wei – Dud
Jean Joel Perrier Doumbe – Dud
Giorgios Samaras – Success
Landry N`Guemo – Dud
Diomansy Kamara – Dud
Edson Braafheid – Dud
Robbie Keane – Success
Fraser Forster – Success
Badr El Kaddouri – Dud
Pawel Brozek – Dud
Miku – Dud
Rami Gershon – Dud
——————————————————————————————————————–
Prior to this season – 17 loans, 12 duds, 5 successes, only 3 of which resulted in permanent signings.
Now this season 4 loan signings, 1 of whom looks more like a drunk ballet dancer than a footballer (Berget), another whom is rumoured to be getting sent back to his parent club for being seriously injured (Tonev).
The incoming loan system has not been a success for us over the last 11 years.
Strange then that 4 of the 5 new signings this year are loans. Smacks of desperation rather than adhering to any kind of coherent strategy.
macjay1 for Neil Lennon:
Don’t work too hard fella :)
Weefra
Great to meet you too. :))
Last night was summed up by my granddaughter. When I picked Rhiannon up at school today, I asked her if she enjoyed her night at the game? She replied “Yes granda, the chocolate ice cream sundae after our dinner was brilliant.” :))
Macjay1
Yes I would. I went to the Irish Celtic Supporters Annual Dinner in Dublin in June and spoke to hundreds of supporters. This is a huge issue for them – when Fergus sold his 60K stadium out every game he relied on what 12.5% from across the sea. We are losing the young supporters to English clubs and we lose their children and children’s children as a consequence.
On Green Brigade – I stood in the Jungle in 80s and it felt pretty good being that age and singing songs – the issues were different but it was pretty much along the same lines as Green Brigade and probably from your view point – worse. I also went to meet one of their main guys one evening and had a chat over some beers. Youngsters who love Celtic.
Don’t see why anyone would have an issue with Celtic Trust – look at their contribution to the assistance given re the attacks on our support in Amsterdam.
You can disagree and still be a good Celt you know!
DD
That says it all, we were shoite. But hey ho we carry on. Take care kiddo it was a pleasure. Defo cot now. :-))) hope to meet up again soon. :-)))
Weefra HH praying to Wee Oscar.
James Forrest… Agree on Green Brigade. Many people are dismissive of the advantage they give us. They are the conductors of the Paradise orchestra.
Of course there were great atmosphere’s at Celtic Park before them but without them last night it just never really got going and the anxiety and neggativity seeped in.
Nobody ever says we lost a game because of the atmosphere but if it helps us win why not?
Every advantage should be sought especially in a game like that. Even if it gave us 1% extra chance of going through.
Paul,
We’re fucked.
End of.
Patrick27-
What sticks out for me is that both Maribor (last 32) and Ludogorets (last 16) qualified for the CL on the back of Europa League campaigns last season that stretched into the New Year while 2 of the conquered seeds, Celtic and Steaua, were wooden spoon fodder in the CL last season.
I`m trying desperately to cling to a straw that EL participation might be best for us in the long run.
The Bottom Line is ………….
Haha succinct, I’ll give you that anyway!
macjay1 for neil lennon
00:45 on 28 August, 2014,
I can’t speak for the GB as I’m maybe a bit old to be in with their crowd, I can only comment on what I observe within Celtic Park.
I didn’t say their not being in attendance caused us to lose.
I will say it might have been beneficial to our performance if the crowd was more vocal.
Night from me.
The great Celtic football club loved by us all is infested w/Tory executive parasites. Admit it!
Oh yeah GB … Don’t get political
the glorious balance sheet
Interesting that – we are a better team than Maribor (for the most part) so gives me a bit more confidence of doing okay in EL
Without a question of a doubt EL is better for us IMO
Our aim has to be get out of EL group, draw the big crowds again for knockout stages, and prepare fully for CL qualifying next year
My perfect season is 3rd in CL group so get the financial and glamour, and a nice wee run to QF Europa
Another thing to mention is we get same amount for a win in EL as we do in CL, so say if we win 3, draw 1 we’d be on more points in coefficient terms than we were last year with 1 win and 4 Pts for reaching group stages, and let’s face it, this year we wouldn’t have won one CL game
HH
M McGill
Know Riley fae his prior life.
Apron and brown brogues.
P27
Give us a number 9. 30 a year goalscorer first.
The Glorious Balance Sheet
You are clinging to no straws if RD is as up to the task in his way as NL was in his.
I was thinking last night how say, Arsenal would have murdered us if we met in CL.
In EL we can develop as we did under NL but need to use this season as springboard to the next.
So I’d up VVD ‘ S pay to get a CF and build around a proper spine. Plenty of not going to make it players to offload to cover any cost of giving us a chance of improving.
Football over the piece never lies. You get odd shock results but the better quality team will always win out over opponents.
We have to up our level -again.
DD
Aye, needed badly. In fact get him and a mate who can hold the ball up and score a few himself
And by a few I mean over 20 along with his 30+mate
pay, get a CF
James Forrest is praying for The Unconquerable Oscar Knox
00:38 on
28 August, 2014
macjay1 for Neil Lennon:
Last night was a £20 million night. To have not spent a penny on that team – an off-field decision – when they had clearly toiled against Warsaw was shameful, but it was not the only screw up.
————————————————————————————————
O.K.Logic in what you say.
So,you reckon a panic driven rushed purchase between Legia and Maribor was the way to go.
Did Ronny request that?
Why didn`t it happen? Who`s to blame?
Do you know?
The kneejerk reaction here is to blame the Board.What`s new, pal?
Based on precisely what information?
I suspect it`s guesswork.
P27
It’s what we were brought up on. Twin strikers who score 50-60 goals between them for Celtic.
No More Heroes Anymore!
Margaret McGill
01:08 on
28 August, 2014
The great Celtic football club loved by us all is infested w/Tory executive parasites. Admit it!
Oh yeah GB … Don’t get political.
——————————————————————————————————-
Bang to rights,guv.
Always a joy to hear your contribution, Mag.
macjay1 for Neil Lennon:
The season is what, a few weeks old? Now, I understand that some leagues kick off before ours, and that some kick off later but have sunnier climates to warm the players backs.
But I’m going to hazard a guess and say that Ronny and his team are working off last year’s scouted players, as evidenced by bringing on loan at least two who had been scouted as far back as two or even three years ago.
I am going to further hazard a guess that the striker we’re currently now in a panicked scramble to buy was scouted last season when he scored 20 odd goals in Spain.
No-one who’s watched Celtic in the last few years can be in any doubt we needed a target man. No-one who knows anything about last season will be unaware we needed a 20 – 30 goal a season poacher.
Maybe it’s just me who thinks that with lead time we could have had someone in before the Warsaw games. Maybe it’s just me who’s baffled why a target we scouted last year was only deemed good enough this time last week when he was too late to make any difference to the outcome of the game, even if the deal had been done and not just half done as the tie was deemed to be.
A knee jerk signing is phoning round clubs to see who’s available for loan and then sticking one in there before the window shuts to make it LOOK like you’re seriously trying to get business done. Then he turns out to be injured … awww, well I guess our people missed that crucial bit of info, but not to worry we can send him back.
It reeks. I’m sorry you can’t see it. I sorry my point is lost on you.
Maybe I’m alone in thinking we do things the wrong way round, that we sometimes seem risk averse, but are actually quite the opposite in many ways.
Except it’s not REALLY a risk at all, is it? Because we’ll punt Van Dijk, scrap any potential signings the manager was going to get and sling an extra £20 onto the price of the Europa League tickets. That will go some of the way to making up the shortfall in bonuses, especially as we can pay the players lesser ones for only competing in Europe’s second tier. That’ll knock some more off the possible cost.
To everyone but us, and to the man in the managers office.
When this bill comes due, his neck is first on the block. We’ve hung him out to dry, but that doesn’t seem to bother a lot of people.
Auldheid,
I don’t know if a pay rise would keep van Dijk here. I think in his head he is away so I`d say through needs must we`re looking for a centre half now. I`d expect the club would have been planning for this as part of their CL failure contingency planning so I hope a suitable target is identified and brought in swiftly should VVD depart.
At least one target man CF is a must. No point playing 2 wide men and marauding full backs otherwise.
We can only properly use the EL as a springboard if we cut out the idiotic trans-continental friendlies come next preseason. All focus should be on the qualifiers.
Patrick27-
I think a lot in the EL depends on the luck of the draw. Italian teams tend to treat the competition with disdain, get them at home on matchday 6 and you`ve won a watch. They won`t be interested. And it goes without saying that we will need to improve massively regardless of who we`ve drawn with.
And on that note, its time for me to call it a night.
Hail hail!
Off on 3week holiday tomorrow .. Anyone recommend a good book ?
Auto biographies, history etc
Just downloaded iam the secret footballer.. So have that
Have been banging the Chris Martin drum for a while. He is what we need.
Em… maybe childish suggestion here…
But our new Drogba esq singing at centre forward
Could be our own Virgil Van Dijk.
A few Maribor cats were amoungst their pidgeons.
Here, there, and everywhere….
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yBBWUZfgRiw
RC
Haha, said the same to my son.
Virgil could be a striker.
D D
But why couldnt he be?
He is taller, more athletic, more skilfull, and maybe more intelligent than Stokesy and the Griffallo.
We can cover the defence.
But we have no one up front.
Maggie
Nice to get a reply from you.
Unfortunately wine had got the best of me.
How come you get a vote?
RC
I would welcome that experiment.
Virgil number 9 :)
Up the rebels the resistence and the celts ✊
Unbowed and unbroken since
1888
Seems like only yesterday Ronny was saying a club like Celtic should not be in the qualifying stages of the CL
He seems to have taken good care of that.
Proudbhoy
bloomin’ iPad. Ggggrrrr.
Proudbhoy- 1927 by Bill Bryson is very informative and entertaining. The NOwhere Men by MIchael Colvin is a very revealing look about where scouting fits into modern football, both in terms of Big Soccer and also at the diddy team ( and I’m afraid that’s what Celtic are these days) level.
Money can’t buy them players . . .
Hugh Macdonald
Chief Sports Writer
Thursday 28 August 2014
THE cries of “sack the board” outside Celtic Park on Tuesday night might have echoes of 1994 but any further comparison invites the charge of ridicule.
Celtic were on the brink when Fergus McCann took over. The accusation now is that they have too much money salted away in bank accounts and have a severe reluctance to spend it.
This has been a recurrent theme at Celtic and it has been answered robustly in the past. Interested observers should expect Celtic to reiterate, soon and strongly, that all the money brought into the club has been re-invested in players and infrastructure and that the manager, Ronny Deila, will be backed in the transfer market.
The problem for Celtic is that the turmoil following the departure from the Champions League is deep-rooted and has some causes that are beyond the control of the club.
Two years ago Peter Lawwell, the Celtic chief executive, said the business model in Scottish football was unsustainable. Good management on and off the field has tempered that reality with moments of glory in the Champions League. This essential truth can not be denied.
Of course, Maribor of Slovenia and Legia of Warsaw have lower budgets, but Celtic are operating in an environment where anything less that their best will be punished. A transitional side with a new manager was a combination that provoked warnings rather than inspired hope.
The most chilling piece of news for Celtic fans in a dispiriting week was that Cameron Jerome, a strong but workmanlike striker, chose Norwich City in the Championship over a tilt at the Champions League.
At 28, Jerome would seem not to be an example of Celtic’s normal policy of buying to sell on. But such was Deila’s need that Jerome was a viable target. He preferred East Anglia over Scotland and this was not about salary.
The board, then, has a problem. It seeks to improve the team so that it can compete in the Champions League. But players who would make that transition from qualifier to group stage more likely just do not want come to Scotland.
Celtic can source midfielders and defenders who can be improved but the striking positions are a different market entirely.
The argument that Celtic should just lump money on a a £10m striker falls on several levels. First a £10m striker would want an annual wage that would equate to a further £20m over four years. This is a lot of eggs to place in one frail basket. This gamble to gain £15m in group stage money, though, is ruled out by the certainty that a £10m striker would have options in bigger leagues and those include the Championship in England. So what is the precise state of Scottish football and how can Celtic overcome the constraints of playing in a league that is not sponsored and offers television revenue of about 1.5% of the bottom club in the Barclays Premier League?
“My prognosis is a gloomy one for Celtic and Scottish football,” said David Low, who might not have been chanting Sack the Board in 1994 but played an influential role in McCann’s takeover of the club.
The financial analyst added: “After a generation of debt-fuelled distortion, Scottish football is returning to its natural level, which is a low level. Sir David Murray introduced debt to the Scottish game in the 1980s and ended it in 2008 when the economy and banks imploded. We’ve been de-gearing ever since. The net result is we are returning to the way it used to be.
“A more level financial playing field, not distorted by debt but at a much lower level. Celtic are now in a financial league of their own and are being dragged down to the average. Each year they step into Europe will be a bigger step and the spectre of early European knockouts will be the norm. Celtic is financially around 10 times bigger and sounder than all the other larger clubs and can expect to be kings of a small football principality here on in. Scottish football should be part-time.
“It’s a very depressing scenario if you’ve grown up competing with the best in Europe.”
Celtic have tried to fight these financial imperatives by improving the scouting system and developing talent at Lennoxtown. It is a battle where the regular bloody nose can be expected. There are two roads to regular success. The first is a move to another league and there seems a major roadblock on that option.
The second is to persist with a business model that will allow a culture of bringing through players to the first team whether by development or by prudent purchase. This has its inevitable risks.
Celtic are favoured by the Platini principle in that the Scottish champions are seeded in Champions League qualifiers. Even so, it might now be realistic to expect that the lucrative field of the group stages might be reached by the Scottish champions in perhaps two out of four years. Supporters may growl at this suggestion. Some clamour for big-spending while others make sober cases for modest investment.
But the paradox for Celtic is that money is not so much the solution but the problem. They have enough of it to spend but their frontline targets remain out of reach.
Bluntly, players good enough to ensure Champions League football – and such guarantees are impossible to give – do not want to come to Scotland. That Celtic can not spend their way out of a problem may bring howls of derision.
But it does make it less true.
Summa of Sammi….
Didn’t you once call me a traitor on here for actually doing what you suggested earlier?
The failures of the Celtic board to progress our club and their penchant for communicating by somniloquy gives me night terrors.
It’s all Ronnie’s fault… pump him and all our misery will evaporate….
No it will not.
It’ll just go on under another patsy.
Somebody please take the dice away from Peter.
Good morning friends from a damp, drizzly, grey East Kilbride.
Another day.
Collective hysteria.
That is all.