Negatives out of the way first: we’re not good enough, this is a low achievement by a Celtic team who have reached a group stage. There’s no disputing that, but amid the predictable ‘Throw them all overboard’ reaction, I know I’m not the only one who is not panicking right now.
When I heard we were playing three wingers (Forrest, Mackay-Steven, McGregor) I anticipated a thrashing. Gordon Strachan would often drop all his craft players for the more industrial types in European football, with good reason.
As it turned out, we had the majority of the chances, and all the better ones, as we spent most of the second half pushing for a winner.
No arguments with Leigh Griffiths assessment immediately after the game, that was his worst performance in a Celtic shirt. Nor is there dispute in Ronny Deila’s retort that he’s scored plenty for us before and will continue to do so. Even the greats have days like that, including the Swede.
The midfield formation was fluid throughout the game. Tom Rogic initially played as a defensive mid, before moving in front of Stuart Armstrong (who moved everywhere) and Callum McGregor. The defensive mid role Rogic played isn’t one carried out by either Nir Bitton or Scott Brown. We’ve not had anyone in this role since the departure of Victor Wanyama (still pining) and it remains a large gap in the offering.
Lesson: we need a defensive mid. The deep lying playmaker + box-to-box player isn’t robust enough in Europe.
Callum McGregor carried possibly the lowest expectations of everyone in a Celtic shirt but he put in an excellent shift. His goal was outstanding, losing possession immediately before Ajax equalised took the shine off things a bit, but it was still a strong performance.
Do you know the last time McGregor started a game? October 2014. Under those circumstances that was a remarkable performance.
General consensus is that the defence played well. Kieran Tierney is as good a left back as we’ve had in years. Had he not gone off with an injury the result might have been different.
Jozo Simunovic is clearly out best central defender. I know I’m not setting the bar too high with that statement, but he’s a move in the right direction. He’s also young, still working on his fitness, and will continue to progress.
A week ago Celtic Underground’s Harry Brady suggested Dedryck Boyata plays better alongside Simunovic than without him. Dedryck still has a long way to go but the evidence suggests partnered with a game-reader like Jozo has helped him. Let’s see where he is at the end of the season.
And Craig Gordon? He could have stopped both Ajax goals. That’s not to say he was to blame for either, he wasn’t, but these were the kind of stops he was making in last season’s Europa League.
Ronny is 18 months into the job and has contributed to the situation we find ourselves in (tactical mistakes in both Molde games), but this is not the time to lurch off plan. We’re not good enough largely because we’ve recruited too few players since 2012 who have improved the team.
We need to continue to develop players like Tierney and we need to recruit better. Get this right in January, and again in the summer, and we will be vastly better. The alternative is likely to be to pick up a best from the SPFL pool, or someone from the English circuit who cannot get a better paid gig. And then it would take until November 2017 before we could assess them properly.
Return of the Bampots
Tonight, for one night onlyt, Phil Mac Giolla Bháin, John Fallon and myself are in the Hibs Club, Carfin, for a Q&A in aid of Mary’s Meals, with Phil Agnew hosting. The event starts at 7:30, £5 entry, can pay at the door.
Looking forward to seeing you there.
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BCW
“You describe many Celtic supporters there…..”
The only one on CQN that I can think of who claims to have deserted Celtic to hang about with Villa is Rudicantfail :-)
SFTB
A fair summation. Personally I like Sutton. I was annoyed with his anti-Deila stance last year. I often wondered if it was something to do with Lennon’s departure which I think there’s more to than we know. If you think about McGlone, Hartson and Lennons other mates who gave Deila a hard time.
Id take Sutton over Hartson any day of the week personally. His attack on us after Dundee and lack of apology is unforgivable in my eyes. I’ll always be grateful for what he did on the pitch but he was paid handsomely for that. Sutton is what he is, says what he feels. I like that in a person. He called out the huns in 2003 and he was spot on.
Aw Aboot opinions
Apologies to all inc P67 for my chaz mulgrew
Feck RD, feck the fans and feck the team rant x3 on the blog last night,
Jude you were right, sorry folks
Bad language but I believe I was correct with the sentiment.
Sftb Chris Sutton is exactly what our players need right now. Can you imagine KC taking a strop at CS. CS knows more about football than RD and co combined.
JamesGang
HH fella
Canamalar
“I thought Chris said he had sympathy with the manager”
He may well have done- that does not change my point. Celtic are not his first love or his last love- they are a club he has affection for but, like Murdo McLeod, he would not hawk his support to us unless we paid him big time. That is not my definition of a fan. He has affection for Celtic- that is all.
He is an advocate of Celtic splashing the cash. You cannot be a big club just by spending big. The bills have to be paid – otherwise you have a “fur coat and nae knickers” policy.
I see this new club, sevco, had an AGM today, and the smsm reported it went spiffingly ….. Hahahahahahaha ……Ming tries pathetically to get out from under Michael’s foot by saying they are going to now pay back the £5m loan, and it is spun positively ……wonder if any of the EBT loans will also be paid back …. hahahahahahaha ….
Gordon 64
“Sftb Chris Sutton is exactly what our players need right now. Can you imagine KC taking a strop at CS. CS knows more about football than RD and co combined ”
I can imagine that lots of Lincoln City players reacted to Chris in a very similar fashion because he won very few games and then resigned (14 wins, 13 draws and 23 defeats). He never managed again- he has no track record to show that he can do what RD cannot.
Still a great player and was brilliant for us when he was here playing.
What other club do commentators feel safe to lambast the way Sutton (and others) do to us.
People might agree with what they say, but would they attack other clubs in this manner?
Sftb How can you say CS has no more than ‘affection’ for our club. The guy played the best football of his career with us. He scored great goals and won us trophies. And was immense in european games. I was at Ibrox the day he got himself sent off because he was fed with the cheating and as the huddle posted he chucked it under WGS but what a player he was. HH
SFTB,
I didn’t hear him demand anyone splash the cash, I did see him look upset and passionate about the result and the lack of quality in the team, he said the money ball philosophy is not working and the club need to sort it, the supporters were applauding the team off the park but did not deserve to be treated the way they are being by the club, my only issue is that he confused the board with the club, especially when the board refer to themselves as the company. But it was clear to me he was more passionate about how the board are failing the manager and supporters than quite a few on here, which is why I think we have so many who did not agree. Those who are pretending to themselves everything is rosey at the club.
Fred
To be fair we deserve to be lambasted. We’ve failed miserably in Europe.
Anywie
I was in a good mood a minute ago. I’m away to find another song
Sutton has said repeatedly whn commentating live that
‘this is the time when we will find out the heart we have in this Celtic team’
‘We need leaders to stand up and be counted’
‘player need to show for the pass’
Loads of comments mid game about fighting for the win and showing the balls to win a game, stnd up and be counted.
Regardless of his comments after the game he is right.
We have a gutless team with very small balls and no fight and desire to take a game by the scruff of the neck and drag it to a win.
He had loads of team mates to do this. Henke, Hartson, Thompson, Lennon, Lambert. The whole team he was in had a collective desire to win, regardless of the performance.
It was just there.
The undefineable desire and will to win. Fight, fight, fight. Run thru the pain.
This desire is missing in our present team
Europa League
Every game we play we seem to lose a collection of goals that would get £200 off Harry Hill
FeckinJoke
Herbo,
Fine, but what other club have you seen lambasted in such a manner ?
I’m sure there are are many who deserved it.
canamalar
“I didn’t hear him demand anyone splash the cash,”
” he said the money ball philosophy is not working and the club need to sort it”
What do you think he meant by that? Has my ‘splash the cash” sub-text really not captured what he was getting at? Back to the MON era spending as befits a big club, ignoring the world has changed and what it would cost to buy a Chris Sutton now.
Clunks
You make a fairer point but I don’t think last night’s 14 lacked Chris’s fight. I do think that many fell short of his ability level.
But even Chris, big man that he was, failed to sparkle in a less than stellar Chelsea outfit.
Clunks Well said.
SFTB,
The scouting and signing selection might well have been what he was angry about, which would also tie in with his sympathy for the manager.
Fred
Yer probably right. But everyone I spoke coming home from the game last night lambasted the club.
I get Yer point. Ex huns make excuses and paint a false picture. But is that not kinda the reason they’re donald ducked? I dunno mate. I’m tired of being annoyed. I’m now looking forward to Inverness Mad Dog Sunday
Wit can ye do
When was the last time we Won a Game in Europe, 9 or 10 games ago, I Read that the longest run in European Tournaments Without winning a gane is 12…So..Assuming we get whacked by Fener( Fair assumtion) if what i read is True, we are ONE GAME away from eqauling the WORST EUROPEAN RECORD EVER…. Take it Further…Aberdeen Had Their best ever Start to a Season , Since then they have been Poor, Well Ronny can thank his personal God For That , otherwise He would be under REAL pressure,….And People on CQN are Argueing over Chris Sutton..
Un Frikken Believable
Talk about Head in The Sand..
.
Gordon64 on 27th November 2015 11:44 pm
Sftb Chris Sutton is exactly what our players need right now. Can you imagine KC taking a strop at CS. CS knows more about football than RD and co combined.
———
Sutton has taken the strop plenty of times, and hung WGS out to dry when he was crying out for a senior player to stand by him.
How is that a great example to our players??
Sftb why denigrate a Celtic great because he doesn’t agree with your agenda. I suggest your revisionism over CS is based on his criticism of RD. If CS was full of praise of RD you would be telling us what a wise man he is.
SFTB
Last night was an improvement but the point I was making is you cant buy team spirit and mentality.
We dont have the mentality to win games just thru the collective will of the team on the park.
I remember watching past teams, in particular the one Sutton played in, who just fecking pulled up their shorts, gritted their teeth and got fucked in about it and won ALL their personal battles. If they didnt win their battles they made it so hard for the other team to play.
You remember that.
Its a mental state. Not just in Europe. Going to shite grounds in the middle of winter and just thru a collective mental state they won the game, even when they played terrible. They just refused to be beat!!
Its a quality we lack…………..in spades mate. Thats my point. All year we have lacked the collective mental strength to dig in, fight and drag our arses past the post.
aye but.
does anyone know a handsome hun
No oh
No oh
Oh and that would be why he rhymed off so many failed and failing signings, no ?
BGX
That’s a horrible stat.. Not good enough at all.
Clunks…Agreed 100% this Team is Tottaly Heartless..What we are seeing is a Celtic Team in Name only, Wear the Strips, play at Celtic park, thats where it Ends…They Dont Have The Desire That The Support Has…End Of…
Herbo,
I hear what you are saying…It’s just that their brutal honesty deserts them when other clubs are involved.
Agreed, clean slate in Inverness :O).
The Huddle As I said earlier have a look at the rerun of the game at Ibrox in 2004 when CS literally put his body on the line for Celtic and come back and give your opinion. HH
Had my season ticket (kerd) for a few years now. Was nearly not renewing this season but as usual the auld heart strings pull and that off season optimism and board promises of seeing better talent brought in had me invest again.
This will 100% be my last season, this is not the same club I was brought up on. We are merely a customer, I don’t think we are so much as taken for granted but it’s a case of “it’s celtic, they will always be there”. We have absolutely no ambition and an absent owner with no desire to push us on and get bums on seats. Too many gambles are taken (yeah yeah every transfer is a gamble). No sorry but when you have wasted circa 8m on strikers in the last few years then strategy needs to be revisited. Our signing policy is a total punt but we have now run out of assets to sell when we get pumped out next seasons champs league. Big Nir is the only plausible option at probably 4-5m. Then what?? No more desirable assets, not been in champs league for 4 seasons so unable to attract a better calibre of player. The game in our little bigoted patch of land is gubbed. Sorry to be negative but it’s the way of things. I took my auld da to the game last night and he couldn’t believe how poor we were and how limited our play was. I tend to agree with his opinion that “I’m being ripped aff son”.
Someone far brighter than me needs to come into our club with some pretty amazing ideas to get the fans excited and back on board. Sadly that ain’t going to happen and this makes me very sad indeed. Will always be proud to be a tim but my commitment to the “cause” died last night.
I know that I am not the only one thinking this way, season Kerds will be at an all time low next season. We are not a champions league club and on this seasons exertions we struggle to compete at Europa League level. The thing is Ronny in my opinion is in way over his head but there is no point replacing him because he is just a puppet on a string. The real people running the club need to be replaced before we have any chance of moving forward and that is a fact.
Hail Hail.
Fred
ADELANTE mate
It’s all ye can do. The struggle goes on and as a kinda newbie on here but a lurker for hunners a years, I see the winds of change getting its maddie up.
Gordon64 on 28th November 2015 12:16 am
The Huddle As I said earlier have a look at the rerun of the game at Ibrox in 2004 when CS literally put his body on the line for Celtic and come back and give your opinion. HH
————-
Why would I look at one game rather than a whole career to judge a player? Doesn’t make sense.
Sutton was a great player for Celtic, was also a great player for Norwich and Blackburn, but was an awful player for Chelsea.
I’m judging his attitude and commitment when playing for Celtic under WGS
Passion
Passion
Passion
We all have it. Our team has an average wage of what 10-15k a week. the average wage is what £300 – £500 a week.
And it cant muster the collective fight to get stuck in about it. Someone paid me £15k a week I would run throu brick walls, I would be Mike Tyson ripping ears of feckers that stood in my way.
Thats the disappointing factor here,
Get a CQN 11 against the current RD team and I believe if we were equally fit and skilled we would just fight and grind the result. We would just do it to prove a point?
Whoever decided to play the short corner whilst bringing the centre backs up for the corner have a lot to answer
Simple
Was it
C Sutton
J Hartson
S Petrov
Talking about Inverness
Argueing over an Ex player is Deflection Taken to the Max…Lets argue about our Record in Europe, Lets Argue About ” Are We Improving” ..Naw..
What Happened To our once in a Lifetime Opportunity When the Huns Died…Jeezo..No wonder we Going Backwards
Oh and big Sutton’s comments are spot on!! Anyone that thinks differently is a moron and lapdog!!