Negatives out of the way first: we’re not good enough, this is a low achievement by a Celtic team who have reached a group stage. There’s no disputing that, but amid the predictable ‘Throw them all overboard’ reaction, I know I’m not the only one who is not panicking right now.
When I heard we were playing three wingers (Forrest, Mackay-Steven, McGregor) I anticipated a thrashing. Gordon Strachan would often drop all his craft players for the more industrial types in European football, with good reason.
As it turned out, we had the majority of the chances, and all the better ones, as we spent most of the second half pushing for a winner.
No arguments with Leigh Griffiths assessment immediately after the game, that was his worst performance in a Celtic shirt. Nor is there dispute in Ronny Deila’s retort that he’s scored plenty for us before and will continue to do so. Even the greats have days like that, including the Swede.
The midfield formation was fluid throughout the game. Tom Rogic initially played as a defensive mid, before moving in front of Stuart Armstrong (who moved everywhere) and Callum McGregor. The defensive mid role Rogic played isn’t one carried out by either Nir Bitton or Scott Brown. We’ve not had anyone in this role since the departure of Victor Wanyama (still pining) and it remains a large gap in the offering.
Lesson: we need a defensive mid. The deep lying playmaker + box-to-box player isn’t robust enough in Europe.
Callum McGregor carried possibly the lowest expectations of everyone in a Celtic shirt but he put in an excellent shift. His goal was outstanding, losing possession immediately before Ajax equalised took the shine off things a bit, but it was still a strong performance.
Do you know the last time McGregor started a game? October 2014. Under those circumstances that was a remarkable performance.
General consensus is that the defence played well. Kieran Tierney is as good a left back as we’ve had in years. Had he not gone off with an injury the result might have been different.
Jozo Simunovic is clearly out best central defender. I know I’m not setting the bar too high with that statement, but he’s a move in the right direction. He’s also young, still working on his fitness, and will continue to progress.
A week ago Celtic Underground’s Harry Brady suggested Dedryck Boyata plays better alongside Simunovic than without him. Dedryck still has a long way to go but the evidence suggests partnered with a game-reader like Jozo has helped him. Let’s see where he is at the end of the season.
And Craig Gordon? He could have stopped both Ajax goals. That’s not to say he was to blame for either, he wasn’t, but these were the kind of stops he was making in last season’s Europa League.
Ronny is 18 months into the job and has contributed to the situation we find ourselves in (tactical mistakes in both Molde games), but this is not the time to lurch off plan. We’re not good enough largely because we’ve recruited too few players since 2012 who have improved the team.
We need to continue to develop players like Tierney and we need to recruit better. Get this right in January, and again in the summer, and we will be vastly better. The alternative is likely to be to pick up a best from the SPFL pool, or someone from the English circuit who cannot get a better paid gig. And then it would take until November 2017 before we could assess them properly.
Return of the Bampots
Tonight, for one night onlyt, Phil Mac Giolla Bháin, John Fallon and myself are in the Hibs Club, Carfin, for a Q&A in aid of Mary’s Meals, with Phil Agnew hosting. The event starts at 7:30, £5 entry, can pay at the door.
Looking forward to seeing you there.
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Onlyone And that was our best european performance last night. Ktf
Chris Sutton was passionate and agitated last night. He repeatedly referred to Celtic as “We”. The Huns will be demanding his sacking. Maybe others too.
He constantly challenges that wee inside thigh dribble presenter on BT Sports when he attempts to make mischief (Hunnery) on Celtic.
Good enough for me.
OnlyOnePaulMcStay
Mate. I gave Up my ‘kerd’ after the section got banned after Motherwell ( of course it was all about the Sands/Wallace Tifo). I believe the ST to be a scam. I go near enough every week. I get tickets for away games because now they are rarely sold out.
I agree that we shouldn’t be buying ST’s but Celtic are in ye. Ye can’t get away from that. I’ve tried, it doesny work.
Canamalar
You are being quite generous in your alternative explanation. Here is how Chris’s views have been reported previously- he never sought to ave these press statements corrected as innacurate (all taken from what purports to be “his” column:-
“CHRIS believes that the Celtic boss deserves some support from his board when you compare the amount of money he has had to spend compared to previous managers.”
“We had Henrik Larsson – admittedly one in a million – but there was also John Hartson, Neil Lennon, Paul Lambert and Jackie McNamara.
Internationals such as Johan Mjallby and Joos Valgaeren, big-money buys from England such as Alan Thompson.
Look at the side now. There is one major difference – investment.
Martin was allowed to spend money and build his team. It was the same for Gordon Strachan, Tony Mowbray and Neil Lennon as they all had better financial backing than Ronny Deila has received.”
And then, contradicting himself:-
“Having said that, I have sympathy for the manager and the club. The market they are operating in right now is so tough for Celtic.
What chance do you have when Burnley and Bristol City are spending £9million on strikers?
Celtic are expected to reach the Champions League with a fraction of the investment.”
And then back to the old tune
“It all boils down to the players. Until there is proper investment it’s going to be the same old story every year.”
AGAIN! :-)
The Huddle. Nonsense amigo. HH
Herbo
No doubt it will be a hard habit to break (excuse the song reference) but I’ve had enough. Love the Celtic (culture and history) dis like the board and the way we are being treated.
HH.
BGX, A slight exaggeration re number of games without a win. The figure is 8, likely to be 9 after Fernabache.
I trust to God we will win our first game next year, if we don’t win that tie it will be time to chuck it.
It’s a Celtic Trust scam, and it’s up to you all, hand your shares over to them, or just ignore them, Ginty and her storm troopers are having a go at us at a weak moment and want you to hand over your shares to them, you will get the few saying …hey Hamiltontim I’ll give you my shares….. It’s like the bank scams, Hamiltontim comes over as a nice guy, but he’s a shark for the CT , and the guy who says he’s giving up his shares is from the CT, fair play to them, but, they think you are as thick as the Huns, surely not?
Duped?
SFTB
May i ask your opinion on Celtics Record in Europe under deila
Just asking..
OnlyOnePaulMcStay
I hear ye mate. It’s a shite state of affairs. But don’t turn Yer back on it. You decide what games you’re going to. If we’re no good enough, don’t show. That’s how it should be and that’s the only way whoever is calling the shots will sit up and take notice.
Paul McStay – Proud to be a Tim
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Vry20TZAnE
SETTING FREE THE BEARS FOR RES. 12 & OSCAR KNOX on 28TH NOVEMBER 2015 12:25 AM
– See more at: http://www.celticquicknews.co.uk/some-perspective/comment-page-15/#comment-2727281
Yes but on BT last night Sutton rhymed off loads of duds which have cost us millions. Very few of us have seen players such as Pukki and Scepovic play before we bought them. But we all saw Ciffti.
There’s Ganthony on.
Revel in his incitefulness
Gordon64 @12:07 am
“Sftb why denigrate a Celtic great because he doesn’t agree with your agenda.
Erm… I didn’t. I praised him to the hilt as a Celtic player. I then made a fair appraisal of him as a manager (do you think he was a success who can tell other managers how it should be done?), as a pundit (do you think he is consistent or has wavered between hyper critical and fawning whenever the bandwagon changes?), and as a Celtic fan (why did he bog off down to Villa if he loved us so much?)
I suggest your revisionism over CS is based on his criticism of RD. If CS was full of praise of RD you would be telling us what a wise man he is.
Suggest away. Chris is a wise man. He is wise on how to play football as a player. He is wise on how to play the tabloid game as a pundit (same strategy as Hugh Keevins) but he is not wise in how to manage a football team and get others to do what he wants- he chucked it at Lincoln and never had another job afterwards.
I loved Charlie Nic as a player (first time around) and I thought Frank MacAvennie was magnificent in our centenary year but my love for them as players does not blind me to the pish they talk as pundits.
I repeat for those that overlooked the praise :-
Chris is an interesting guy and has delivered many interesting comments during commentary but he has no consistent answer to the dilemma about what Celtic should do in an impoverished football market
So much for my so-called denigration.
Gordon64 on 28th November 2015 12:28 am
The Huddle. Nonsense amigo. HH
——————–
That was a classic NegAnon retort.
CorkCelt..
It was what i read..so its 8 Probably Be 9..Ronny better hope his next european tie is away to Young Girls of Luxembourg or something Coz we are a Walkover at Cektic park .Either way its Shameful..
TD67 Utter garbage. I’m starting to think you are an agent provocateur but you are probably too ignorant. But you are indeed a complete eedit. No offence intended.
SFTB,
And proper investment is not necessarily the amount of investment but the bang for the buck being invested.
Yes he did refer to his team mates but ha also referred to the high number of failed signings which have cost the club more for a much less return. Instead of having two expensive decent quality players we have 5 or 6 projects taking the same resource out of the club in the hope that one might be sellable in a year or two and that is how I read his rant.
You can interpret any way you want but it doesn’t make your version any more valid.
If a Martian logged on tonight, he’d be forgiven for thinking this poor Club is really the pits, I feel so sorry for those supporters, when did they last win anything.
Wonder what he would say if he was told, well actually its not that bad, they have won the last 4 Championships and are well on the way to 5 in a row.
SFTB,
I never read any of the reports, I watched him on the telly making his argument.
St Stivs
Magnificent
What an absolute hero
Corkcelt aye ok then. We are fantastic. The football we are watching is fantastic. Our manager is fantastic. Somehow the supporters don’t seem to agree and are disappearing like snow off a dyke.
For a Celtic manager not to win an EBT challenged league, would be catastrophic. Which is why so many are now using Europe as a yardstick whereas previously domestic success was our metric.
corkcelt on 28th November 2015 12:40 am
If a Martian logged on tonight, he’d be forgiven for thinking this poor Club is really the pits, I feel so sorry for those supporters, when did they last win anything.
Wonder what he would say if he was told, well actually its not that bad, they have won the last 4 Championships and are well on the way to 5 in a row.
————–
I’m sure he’ll ask do you have the living wage badge (all kids love a badge) and do you employ any woman in the boardroom. Then he’ll ask if you serve only veggie/vegan approved refreshments at your place of work. :O)
Gordon64 on 28th November 2015 12:46 am
Corkcelt aye ok then. We are fantastic. The football we are watching is fantastic. Our manager is fantastic. Somehow the supporters don’t seem to agree and are disappearing like snow off a dyke.
—————–
Somewhere in the middle, do you know what that means?
What an a–e peice
Don’t campaign for the living wage folks. It’s just not cricket.
Corkcelt.What would they say if you told Them a Team that gained, correct me if im wrong was it 10 pts in a C/ l Group that contained Bsrcslona in it a Few seasons ago was sitting on 2 pts after 5 games in the E/L..
Hard To Believe..
BGX
I’ve been giving it in every post I made- do you want yours e-mailed somewhere?
Emus
“Yes but on BT last night Sutton rhymed off loads of duds which have cost us millions. Very few of us have seen players such as Pukki and Scepovic play before we bought them. But we all saw Ciffti. ”
We did and the reception to each signing was mixed. Very few, apart from Sydney Tim, expressed any view about Pukki. Scepovic was generally welcomed as a free scoring forward in a competitive league- he is still a La Liga player. Ciftci too was heavily touted on here and our players were enthusiastic about his abilities.
Paul67 states our transfer record has had too high a proportion of duds but, to be honest, I have absolutely no idea how our dud-signing propensities compare with other clubs. I suspect every club has dud buys.
All I know is that even Big Jock signed John Dowie, Ian McWilliams, Willie Garner and frank Munro. Big Billy bought Martin Hayes (and paid over the odds), Lou bought Whittle & Holt, MON bought Fernandez, Sylla, Laursen, Juninho, Hedman and the little used Guppy.
The duds, like the poor, have always been with us.
So, when nobody could live with their financial doping why was Europe not their yardstick?
The Huddle with all due respect I’m sure Corkcelt can post for himself.
Gordon, Never said anything like that, we performed horribly in Europe for past 2 years. I know it, you know it, we all know it. However the pessimism is being overdone, I said immediately after the game and I repeat it now, we didn’t play too badly last night. Ajax lead the Dutch League, Eindhoven drew away to Man Utd. Ajax are not a sh*te team, we should and could have beaten them last night.
I’m not happy, no Celtic Supporter with the exception of Tony Donnelly is happy, but we are not that bad that this can be turned around fairly quickly.
Fred C…,
For most of us, Europe was their yard stick it showed us how shite they really were and why it was so depressing they were winning so many domestic trophies.
SFTB
The problem in my opinion is that although Stein, McNeill, O’Neill signed a few diddies. Ronny Deila has no say in who’s coming in. That canny be right.
Gordon
CorkCelt
Last night wasn’t the problem though troops. It’s been previous games. Malmo and Molde Espescially. Don’t even want to bring up last season
Canamalar,
Most of US yes. The media, press, TV pundits ? NEVER.
Im Off to Enjoy myself in The Glory of Ms Diamond Jackson.
Im Happy Hope Youre Happy Too
BGX on 28th November 2015 12:49 am
Corkcelt.What would they say if you told Them a Team that gained, correct me if im wrong was it 10 pts in a C/ l Group that contained Bsrcslona in it a Few seasons ago was sitting on 2 pts after 5 games in the E/L..
Hard To Believe..
———————-
Our last 10 years of CL efforts
2014-15 – No CL
2013-14 – 4th in the group
2012-13 – Round 16
2011-12 – No CL
2010-11 – No CL
2009-10 – No CL
2008-09 – 4th in the group
2007-08 – Round 16
2006-07 – Round 16
2005-06 – No CL
hope that is right think it is , quite drunk