Here’s the problem: this is a can of worms. If contagion was limited to Sir David Murray and other Murray Group executives, there may be more “appetite” to analyse what went wrong and what to do about it.
Rangers were a rogue football team, operating a tax scheme out with the law, failing to disclose appropriate documentation to HMRC, the SPL and SFA. Legal responsibility for the club’s actions lies with all directors, not just the majority owner. They have collective responsibility to ensure business is conducted appropriately. David King, Paul Murray, Alistair Johnston and former SFA president Campbell Ogilvie, were all Rangers directors during the EBT and DOS years.
The SPFL (formerly SPL) are also implicated. They set terms of reference for what became the Lord Nimmo Smith Commission, then amended those terms to only include matters which were, at that time, regarded as legal, explicitly excluding matters already confirmed as illegal.
They then failed to present evidence to Nimmo Smith of the five matters Rangers admitted guilt on during the First Tier Tribunal process, preferring only to present matters that were in dispute, but (temporarily) found in Rangers favour.
Having done this, they instructed their lawyer not to ask for an opportunity to appeal if the pending HMRC appeal was upheld. Instead, closing the book on a procedural appeal.
The SFA executives side just along the corridor from their SPFL counterparts. Yesterday they issued a remarkable statement:
“Specifically, Senior Counsel was asked to anticipate whether a determination in favour of HMRC, as announced today, could imply that there had been a breach of the Scottish FA’s Disciplinary Rules as they applied at the time of the EBT payments.
The clear opinion of Senior Counsel is that there is a very limited chance of the Scottish FA succeeding in relation to any complaint regarding this matter”.
I refer you to SFA Disciplinary Rule 71, Article 94.1:
“No recognised football body, club, official, Team Official or other member of Team Staff, player, match official, or other person under the jurisdiction of the Scottish FA shall bring the game into disrepute.”
They are asking you to believe that Senior Counsel told them no Rangers official brought the game into disrepute as a consequence of this matter. A matter which has left over £100m debt and hundreds of creditors unpaid, saw 55 players incorrectly registered, and one of the largest clubs in the country liquidated – the consequences of which will be permanent, no matter your view on Newco/same club.
All for an issue which Rangers directors gave evidence in court that the EBT scheme was undertaken to allow them to sign players they would otherwise be unable to pay. Ensuring an illegal sporting advantage.
Possible SFA sanctions for this include fines of up to £1m and/or expulsion from the game.
Sorry, but this is not a tenable position. The game was massively brought into disrepute; to issue a statement claiming otherwise just adds the stench of cover up to an already dreadful state. And bringing the game into disrepute is just scratching the surface, without going into consequences of the club’s actions on competitions.
I question the scope and remit given to Counsel, which was clearly limited in order to make it possible to deliver this statement. Who issued that scope and why it blinded Counsel to the clear matter of disrepute is another question to answer.
Executives at Hampden will have scoured news coverage this morning in the hope that this this will blow over. Scottish newspaper, TV and radio coverage is irrelevant. Instead, they should be looking to establish a recovery position for our game. This is not finished.
Those implicated by the contagion – the “heavily conflicted” do not get to decide that no action is to be taken; Scotland is not yet a Banana Republic.
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Yorkbhoy
Withdrawing money from the club will never work, nor would I advocate it in any shape or form, clubs like Killie would happily see us gone, they are wanna be huns.
As for our suits, my feelings toward them are well known, but I would never suggest boycotting Celtic.
One game is all that would be needed,
The threat of withdrawing money works, just ask the Aberdeen and D Utd boards.
HH
Jeezo, I am not talking about a boycott at Celtic park, that is just crazy.
UP LIKE A BIRD.
Great post. I empathise 100%.
HH
What’s crazy about a boycott? This issue is far too Important.
TREBLE winning captains on 6th July 2017 9:17 pm
Celtic a few months back held a meeting attended by various supporters groups. Res12 was on the agenda, placed there by the club.
It was a lively session discussing various matters – away tickets and so on – but when Res12 was raised it was met by silence. PL asked if anyone had anything they wanted to ask about Res12. Silence.
=====================
Only because BRTH and I were absent.
Had we been there the audience would have been building effigies of Regan and burning them. :)
HUNDERBIRDS ARE GONE on 6TH JULY 2017 9:53 PM
The money i spend on Celtic can be a weeks holiday away in the sun, Celtic Can easily be replaced
NA2
Cos it is, it would never work, first reason being that folks have bought their season books and second reason is that apathy has won the day, the majority are happy to see the huns struggling and they don’t care about justice, most still get their info from the smsm ffs.
The smaller clubs are the ones who need to force the sfa’s hand here, Celtic will do feck all, as YB said a small crowd at one of our games will be ignored.
HH
In my opinion if we are trying to get fans of other teams to support us against the SFA then threatening to boycott their teams is not the way to go.
The problem is , I don’t know what we should do. I would certainly agree with a boycott of Ipox and Hampden but as someone who only gets to a couple of games each season I don’t think I am in a position to tell those who go week in week out what to do.
Auldheid- guys like yourself and similar on here have done amazing work , on the fans behalf, and defacto Celtic Football Club, we are getting close to the End Game.The Club put out a holding statement, laced with a bit of intent maybe? The music will stop soon, the Club MUST step up for us all.I think other Clubs are also waiting for our lead.They dare not fail us HH
NegAnon2 on 6th July 2017 9:54 pm
What’s crazy about a boycott? This issue is far too Important.
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A couple of years ago I met up with an old work colleague, a clever chap, responsible for setting policy in a Govt spending Dept. Cool, clear headed and with an ST in the early numbers he had held it so long.
I briefed him over a beer on all that was behind Res12 and he shook his head in disbelief.
Roll on a season or so when things get a bit rocky and I asked him if he would even postpone buying his ST to put pressure on. He knew the principles at stake , agreed they were important but still could not bring himself to not support the team in his way.
That has to be recognised and we have to find ways around that loyalty that lets everyone buy in.
I am only offering an opinion, I am not asking nor telling people what to do.
The threat of withdrawing money works, it is the only thing that has worked so far re the hun thing, the sfa’s spokesman even said that cash, or the lack of it is the only thing they will pay any heed to.
Nothing else has had any effect, nothing at all.
!!Bada Bing!! on 6th July 2017 10:02 pm
Auldheid- guys like yourself and similar on here have done amazing work , on the fans behalf, and defacto Celtic Football Club, we are getting close to the End Game.The Club put out a holding statement, laced with a bit of intent maybe? The music will stop soon, the Club MUST step up for us all.I think other Clubs are also waiting for our lead.They dare not fail us HH
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I hope you are right because I think it is the ideal rather than the reality of Celtic I (and I think others) buy into and the closer the ideal and reality are, the easier it is to buy in.
“We are sure now that the footballing authorities in Scotland will wish to review this matter. Celtic awaits the outcome of their review.”
What review?
THE EXILED TIM on 6th July 2017 10:05 pm
I am only offering an opinion, I am not asking nor telling people what to do.
The threat of withdrawing money works, it is the only thing that has worked so far re the hun thing, the sfa’s spokesman even said that cash, or the lack of it is the only thing they will pay any heed to.
Nothing else has had any effect, nothing at all.
=================================
You said earlier today talk is cheap and that action is needed and I don’t disagree. Effective action is needed.
However talk is not cheap. It is the way we keep issues and ourselves alive, it is how we share how we feel, how we think and both are prerequisites of action.
Sure it can take time for that action to happen but don’t forget LNS and UEFA licences are issues the SFA and SPFL wanted buried but talk has kept them alive.
Now don’t tell your lovely good lady you said talk is cheap, she makes a living from it. ;)
TET if Celtic don’t act then Celtic are dead. I said this from the very start. I stand by it. If we lose a sense of integrity then it’s game over.
We are very close to that.
The only way the Celtic board will act is if they know that the support will desert them.
That’s why paul67 disgusts me. He spouts about this stuff but will not call the Celtic board on it.
Auldheid. I understand how difficult it is for people to give up so,etching they love. My analogy about a cheating girlfriend whom you love still applies. The fact you know that your girlfriend is cheating on you but you don’t want to face up to the truth only leads to you losing respect for yourself. It might take some time. But it will happen.
I have warned about this schism for years. Paul 67 has sold us squirrels for years whilst propping up the boards so called policy on this. It is disengenious.
You must by now have learned from res12.
The soul of Celtic is dying here. I think it’s worth fighting for. But fight our own board we must.
It’s sad that the worst betrayal is actually from our own board isn’t it?
Margaret McGill on 6th July 2017 10:14 pm
“We are sure now that the footballing authorities in Scotland will wish to review this matter. Celtic awaits the outcome of their review.”
What review?
===============
Presumably the one that will emerge after the SPFL Board have considered the pros and cons as they stated, with Celtic emphasising the pros and the “or else”.
Margaret McGill
The SPFL would be within their rights to strip titles if they had sufficient cause – probably based on the findings of an independent review commissioned with effective Terms of Reference.
Peter Lawwell is a member of the SPFL Board and also instrumental in Celtic’s statement on the subject. Perhaps a review is more likely than most people think.
It’s not up to Doncaster – he was appointed by the board and accountable to them.
Auldheid
You are of course correct :-)
I am of the opinion that it’s too late, money will out at the end of the day, justice etc will be kicked to the side, all the talk, cheap or expensive should have been done a long time ago, we have missed the boat I fear.
You more than most know what you are up against, the end game for them is on the line and I can’t see them giving up their power.
HH
Neganon 2
I agree.
If the PLC cant stand up for Celtic, then its game over.
People can fool themselves if they like, but the truth is, how can we allow ourselves to pay, to be cheated.
That makes no sense.
If there is no sporting integrity, what is the point.
HH
Some people seem to think there are only a few hundred malcontents “bumping their gums” about corruption in the Scottish game on the Internet.
Personally I doubt that, but where I do agree with this group of people is that it would be virtually impossible to mobilise the entire Scottish Football fan base into direct action (whether boycotts, silences, protests) in unison.
But, imo, that doesn’t mean that those that think direct action is the only way to bring about meaningful change should not actively campaign for support.
Those that “just want to watch the game, and support the team” are entitled to their opinion, but if supporters of Scottish Football can not gut out and take action to clean up the current governing bodies at this time, when wrongdoing has had such a light shone on it, then… well maybe before long there will be no game to watch.
If Doncaster and Reagan are still in position in six months time, and no meaningful changes are made to the administration of Scottish Football, so that cheating in the manner we have witnessed and recently have had confirmed in courtrooms, can not happen again, then this 58 year old lifelong Celtic supporter will be chucking it.
The soul of Celtic is dying here. I think it’s worth fighting for. But fight our own board we must.
It’s sad that the worst betrayal is actually from our own board isn’t it?
Agreed !
I have held the same seat in NW upper since Fergus built it. I am a shareholder. I want justice.
As Neganon says this is about the soul of Celtic.
Gooood Evening CQN
What have I missed today ?
Can I ask a stupid question
Are there any outside organisations (outwith UK) who fight for sporting integrity ?
It was the Americans who went after FIFA was it not ?
Are there any European clubs that played the deceased mob, and now being aware they were re playing against a team with players, who were not registered correctly and the club paying their players through an illegal scheme, who may be interested in questioning UEFA on this, and any loss they may have suffered
I think we need to get this story and the biggest tax avoidance scandal in U.K. History out into the wider world media, and have these areas, raise questions on why the organisations responsible for that club, have never taken the issue to task
What international papers would run with this ?
NA2
Then the funeral will be soon, the suits only care about money.
There will be plenty who will fill the coffers if the club are winning and more so if the huns are struggling.
HH
Well done to Cork city and shamrock rovers who both won tonight to qualify for the next round of the Europa league
I think there are thousands of Celtic supporters ready to give up on Scottish football and Celtic green man. This has always been the risk to Celtic. I get the feeling that the board couldn’t care less.
Way to gamble with the future of the club.
I still can’t believe how bad it has got. But money talks and bullshit takes the bus………
Actually both rovers and cork won both legs home and away on a shoestring budget. And both are tax compliant
Well done to Cork city and shamrock rovers who both won tonight to qualify for the next round of the Europa league
Hope Pedro was watching……..
EMBRAMIKE SUPPORTING RES 12 on 6TH JULY 2017 10:20 PM
…
Peter Lawwell is a member of the SPFL Board and also instrumental in Celtic’s statement on the subject. Perhaps a review is more likely than most people think.
It’s not up to Doncaster – he was appointed by the board and accountable to them…
————————–
Embramike – exactly what I was saying to Wee BGFC earlier.
The statement from Celtic I presume would not have went out without Peter’s approval.
Doncaster is only an employee – the CEO answers to the Board. Peter is saying he awaits the result of the review, and he is one of the people on the Board who can instruct that review to happen, ergo (I think) it will happen.
HH
BGFC
Another question
What role does Dickson have in Scottish football, outwith working as that new teams administrator – a role he had with the deceased team
Should he not now be removed from any role or position of influence in the Scottish game ??
In any other sporting contest or event, cheating is considered an automatic disqualification.
Basically, we have a mob of bigots saying, ‘Let us cheat’,.
And i must say, they have been very successful, only as a result of the inability of supporters to construct an effective opposition strategy.
You cant overthrow corruption by sitting on your arse.
HH
TET it will be a slow death. It’s taken me two years to stop going to games. I now don’t miss it.
I still love Celtic but Celtic are us, the support. But we are seeing is the subjugation of the support by a board who are saving ,only (probably for their future bonuses).
BOYCOTT???
I’ve been following the outcry (rage) following the SC ruling these past few days on CQN and various platforms. Anger = boycott = not always practical – technically you get once chance to make it work – get it wrong and it becomes fruitless sabre rattling!
Long post by me almost 7 years ago – if you’re interested reading?
Whilst there have been many reasoned posts lately advocating the ‘boycott’ strategy to highlight the injustices faced by the Club (and the inadequacies of dealing with them) – there have been equal measures of ‘gum-bumping’ rhetoric calling for an all out war of attrition.
Boycott by definition: refuse (v.), stay away from, impose sanctions, embargo, shun, proscribe, prohibit, reject.
The process of getting from A to B (Arranging to Boycotting) often proves to be the most difficult part of the action. The Celtic Support (for their own reasons) will have different agendas – when and if an away boycott actually comes about;
• Those that believe it’s mandatory to back the Team whatever the circumstances.
• The unthinkable – no support away .v. them.
• Those financially signed-up to the ‘away’ ticket scheme.
• Those already committed to pre-booked travel arrangements (buses, flights, overseas fans with infrequent opportunity to see the Team, etc).
• Those who do not attend way games.
• No doubt – a few more that I have failed to list.
Magherareagh’s post (5th September @ 10:00a.m.) makes many good points – the gist of it being that sometimes the mere ‘threat’ of a boycott; the media coverage, the potential for financial loss to the targeted away Club etc can often have greater effect than the actual boycott.
From experience (and not exactly as portrayed by those who rushed to cash-in with various books on how ‘they alone saved’ the Celtic) – 2 examples of previous successful C-for-C boycotts (my views on what they entailed in terms of arranging and what they ultimately accomplished).
Circa 1994: As meetings, rallies and demonstrations became more frequent – there was a rising groundswell for boycotts. Many had differing ideas on; how, where and when.
The first attempt proved tenuous. Those with season tickets (a small percentage compared to today) suggested boycotting home games – justification being that they had shown commitment to the Club by paying up-front and it was a small sacrifice to get the message across to the Board.
It made no impact whatsoever – it was particularly difficult time for some of the ghuys who turned up to demonstrate at the barriers, only to be left standing in extremely small numbers ten minutes after the home game had kicked-off.
The 1st successful home boycott: Celtic .v. Hibs* (I think or was Hibs the T-shirt demo – anyhow that’s what I get for not keeping a diary or writing a book).
It probably came about after 2-4 months of debate and argument with various parties; the Rebel Shareholders, the Bhoys travelling from Ireland, the Affiliation and the CSA (who proved the most difficult to get on-side because of their outdated Constitution that was written in tablets of stone – pro Board despite the fact we were heading for the precipice in a runaway hand-cart)!
By this time the media (who were now being spoon-fed from various sources) were desperate for the date (a bit like trying to forecast an upcoming General Election date) – the 1st boycott needed to make an immediate impact otherwise any future attempts would render its threat of use entirely futile. The plan was conceived with the intention of addressing (and in some cases placating) all perceived misgivings raised by all the factions seeking change (whatever their agenda).
Celtic Supporters were asked to boycott the East terracing (the away end). Sounds simple – just call for it and everyone to a man obeys the request. Not so – this was pre-blog times (mobiles only)!
Arrangements involved hundreds of Supporters spreading the word and getting commitment by; phone-ins to radio stations (Eire and U.K), writing letters to papers, articles in fanzines, fly-posting routes to C.P. etc.
On the day of the boycott – volunteers (with flyers) met coaches arriving at their parking spots – toured pre-match haunts such as the Gallowgate and manned every cash-turnstile at the East terracing in order to make it a success. The unsung heroes who rarely feature in the history books.
The boycott worked – an empty East terracing apart from a few scattered souls and the ‘brains’ of the CSA who chose to give up their comfy seats in the main stand as an act of defiance. They hadn’t called a motion (under their Constitution) despite repeated attempts by most Delegates (from the floor) to back the boycott – cynics would suggest had they, it would have jeopardised their generous ticket allocations from the Old Board.
That success meant the Supporters were now in possession of powerful tool that could be used again and again – perhaps to greater effect.
And it was!
* A certain young lady was a key participant in that demo – good luck with the wedding day H. xxx
IF anyone is interested in reading the 2nd post – the Beginning of the End! I will c&p. H!H!
NA2
I have always said that the biggest losers will be Celtic in this sorry affair, it won’t be this year, maybe it won’t be for another few years, but I still think in the long run Celtic will suffer the most.
In many ways we can never win, we can try and get a semblense of parity, but we will never get a level playing field, why would they give up what they live for, without their supremacist lording it over us they are nothing, they are in total control.
HH
NegAnon2 on 6th July 2017 10:15 pm
Good analogy (and I speak from experience)
That experience means I’ll have no problem walking away . Sure it will be sad but I know from experience there is life beyond Celtic. I’ll watch on TV to meet the new friends I’ve made on this particular journey in the friendliest of bars. If you ever visit the Costa look me up.
On Res12 what I now believe is that the SFA and UEFA in September 2011 decided to cover up a gaping hole in their much trumpeted UEFAS FFP system with its added enhancements on tracking tax over due payables .
They did so because even although a license should not have been granted, Rangers were out of Europe by then and heading for the rocks. That UEFA accepted a false statement in June 2011 means either the SFA told a porkie to UEFA or were truthful but said if UEFA took action the SFA and the UEFA new process would be exposed, because to get the license under self certification arrangements a club just had to lie and RFC specialise in that by non disclosure. So instead of requesting future financial forecasts as was the rule UEFA did not ask for them (just 5 months before RFC entered administration) This decision was passed on to RFC by the SFA as “Good news.”
What always puzzled me about Res12 was Celtics reluctance to ask UEFA to investigate as per the Res. There was enough to suggest it was necessary. But if UEFA already knew what had gone on after talking to SFA, why would they want to investigate themselves?
So Celtic become piggy in the middle and who knows what the best response by Celtic should have been in those circumstances?
As someone inside (not PL) said to me about UEFA “you don’t bite the hand that feeds you”.
So its not just Celtic, its the corrupt industry they have to work in.
Auldheid
The huns got a licence for europe this season when a blind man could see that they didn’t remotely qualify for one.
And we are hoping for justice, sometimes I think we are the deluded ones and no the huns.
HH
Exiled
The biggest losers are Rangers and their support. They cheated, they spent other people’s money they went bust and died, their fans dressed up the corpse and continue to worship it. This joke club will limp on being soundly thrashed by Celtic on a regular basis..
Sleep well Timland
HH
A couple of rare posters joining the blood lust urging us to walk away.
The Board should indeed do all they can to have a fresh tribunal set up, but unless other Clubs back them they are on a loser.
If other Clubs fail to back us, then why should we take it out on our Club.
I would be sorry to see a single Celtic Supporter walking away over this but all I say to anyone who does walk please don’t slag or denigrate those of us who are going nowhere.
I will help the campaign to force a new Tribunal any way I can. If we need crowd funding to lodge a legal challenge I will contribute but one thing I can say without doubt, whatever or whichever way this turns out, I will continue to support Celtic as long as God allows me.