Today our parliament will go through the motions of debating how to criminalise football fans in innovative new ways, not related to prejudice, with the outcome preordained; the Bill will become law. The lines have been drawn on this debate and the country is set for a long and messy campaign.
The various calls for clarification are unlikely to be satisfied as consistency on this subject will be impossible to find. At Celtic, direct or indirect references to the IRA, already deemed unacceptable by the club, manager and most of the support, are likely to lead to prosecution. I would like to see political references removed from football but not at the cost of random criminalisation. It remains to be seen how successful attempts to prosecute fans for transgressing on this subject before the law has been passed will be.
Singing Flower of Scotland will (correctly) never be criminalised but you can expect charges to be brought for expressing similar sentiment. Legally, this sounds like a reach by the SNP government, but it’s likely to be a few young football fans who carry the responsibility of establishing how the judiciary view this matter.
While Celtic will never condone IRA chanting (or, apparently, try to mitigate it as inconsequential, as others did before them with illegal and prejudicial chanting) they have a responsibility to ensure positive parts of our Irish tradition, including the national anthem, the flag and other symbols of the club’s rich and diverse culture are defended.
Football is going to get messy in the months ahead as positions are so entrenched in ‘the songs debate’ there is simply no possibility of agreement. While it may only be a small minority who want to continue political chanting at Celtic, they remain Celtic fans and as entitled to establish their rights as anyone else, including Neil Lennon or Jock Stein. All we can do, as a club and support, is look for common ground amid the turmoil that lies ahead.
Today is your last chance to buy Paul Larkin’s new book, Wim’s Tims-The best thing to hit Scottish football in 10 years, with a 25% discount. Enter code: COUNTDOWN to qualify.
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Celtic top?
Who knows the reason?
Sad nonetheless.
http://www.thedetail.tv/issues/50/steven-colwell/why-did-it-take-the-police-ombudsman-six-years-to-report-on-a-psni-killing
Slan.
BOBBY MURDOCH’S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS says:
15 December, 2011 at 08:22
Lol. :)
Have a great day chief.
Laters.
ASONOFDAN 0821
Lifted from the previous page,hope the second link helps
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Two good articles on the Bill the best of which is from Iain MacWhirter in the Herald: http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/this-dumb-unjust-law-is-salmonds-first-own-goal.16167952
The other is about Fans Against Criminalisation and the refusal of the parliament to allow Jeannette Findlay to lead this group in to watch the debate on the “bigot bill” as they were wearing T-shirts with political slogans on. The photo-op this gave FAC was no doubt the object of the exercise and all of a sudden the normally sure-footed Alex Salmond is beginning to look a bit stupid. Power corrupts….etc. etc.
http://www.scotsman.com/the-scotsman/politics/new_scottish_anti_sectarian_laws_holyrood_gets_shirty_over_bigot_bill_1_2008736
The excellent Herald article in the Comment section reads:
This dumb, unjust law is Salmond’s first own goal
Iain MacWhirter, Columnist
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TTFN
Morning CQNer’s.
BelfastCityCelt says:
15 December, 2011 at 07:35
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Superb stuff M8!
If I had said that I would already be, slow-cooking on the CQN hunfiltrater spit!!!
Hail! Hail!
UDINESE are set to drop star man Antonio Di Natale tonight – and boss Francesco Guidolin has had a go at the Italian FA for the savage schedule that has forced his hand.
Guidolin’s team, who are chasing the Serie A title, will play three times in just six days with games against Lazio and Juventus to follow on from the Europa League showdown.
With Di Natale struggling to play too often due to dodgy knees, the Udinese manager now faces having to leave him out tonight so that he’s fresh for the crunch title battles.
Guidolin said: “The three games are very important and I ask myself why we have to play them in such a short space of time as six days?
“This is the second time it has happened to us – I don’t think that has happened to any other Italian team this season.”
Di Natale, 34, was rested for the 1-1 draw at Parkhead in September but is keen to face the Hoops this time.
He added: “I want to give my best as qualifying would be satisfying for us. I’m keen to achieve something with this team as I am getting old.”
While Di Natale is desperate to savour European glory this season, it seems the fans in Udine are less excited by the visit of Celtic to their city.
Just 7000 of a possible 27,000 tickets have been sold and Guidolin said: “We could do with a smaller, more functional stadium. We have a limited number of fans.
“In the opening stages of tournaments such as the Coppa Italia, Europa League or even the Champions League, there can be small crowds.”
Despite the setbacks, Guidolin is confident his team can see off a Hoops side he rates highly.
He said: “We’ll need to be at our best to beat Celtic because they are an experienced team.
“I would rate Celtic at the standard of a very good side in Serie A.
“We will risk everything if we don’t play our normal game.”
Serge says:
15 December, 2011 at 08:09
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I hate to say this but…..if the huns win 4iar then, any fellow Celt who renews his/her SB deserves all that they get!
We, the Celtic support who finance the charlatans who run ‘our’ club are to blame for accepting the down-sizing of, ‘our’ famous club by a bunch of people who DONT know their history!IMO!
Speaking personally….I chucked it when the down-sizing started with the appointment of WGS!
Now, I know full well that WGS won 3iar and, got us to the CL last 16 twice iar but, in his last season when, he was properly challenged, the club was a shambles from top to bottom and, if it werent for NL’s promising heroics then, I think the Celtic hierarchy/PLC/CEO would have been run out of town by a support who’d had enough of being had!
Morning all
They’ve been burning the midnight oil at the new Lennoxtown cloning facility. Tonight’s team, playing 4-5-1:
Wanyama
Wanyama, Wanyama, Wanyama, Wanyama
Brown (c), Wanyama, Wanyama, Wanyama, Wanyama
Wanyama
Subs: Forster, Cha, Mulgrew, Wanyama, Bangura
I predict 2-1, with Wanyama scoring the winner.
Pantaloon Duck
I’d make one change to that team. Wanyama should be captain.
Buongiorno tutti—–
Udinese Quick News —–
Last night’s press conference –
Guidolin , the Udinese Manager said ——
” A draw will suffice —but we will play to win”
Celtic are mentally strong. Celtic have a big history . They are accustomed to playing in Europe . They have quality players. They are a class team. ”
He also added that —-
” Celtic are used to playing in a big packed stadium in front of enthusiastic and passionate fans —- they might find it strange to be playing an important game in a small stadium in front of less than 10,000 people ”
Guidolin said that it was unlikely that Di Natale would start —– he equivocated about whether he would be on the bench. Guidolin reiterated that the soon come games against Lazio and Juve are Udinese’s priority. Guidolin said that he ” liked “James Forrest—– ” he has pace and good technique ”
The Italian fitba media are predicting a relatively strong Udinese line up with 6 Serie A First picks on the bench.—– We’ll see
KevJungle
I gave up 2 with never being at home but i was looking forward to getting another 2 in January as I did regret giving them up.
I’ve changed my mind in the last few days though and I wont bother again aslong as these people are in charge. They have no plan whatsoever for the Club.
I cant help but spend money in the Club shops & go to every game when I’m home. I don’t think i could ever stop going to the games or giving the Club money.
That is where this Board can sit back and laugh i suppose. HH
79caps says:
15 December, 2011 at 08:50
I agree, but you know how NL feels about Broony…
I’m not sure if any other Ozzy Bhoys have mentioned it but we are live on SBS tomorrow morning. The programme starts at the respectable time of 6.45am. This would be the best away result since Ajax? Or maybe Liverpool or maybe Boavista, Stuggart, Barcelona or ???? I’m starting to think we haven’t that bad a record in Europe but I realise we have had some shockers particularly over the last couple of seasons. Anyway COME ON YOU BHOYS IN GREEN.
Hail Hail
Serge says:
15 December, 2011 at 08:55
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I don’t give the club a thin ‘dime’ anymore!
What really gets on my wick is that, and I’ve been guilty of it more than most on here is that, PL is seen as the target for abuse ?
PL, imo, has been planted into ‘our’ club to get the balance-sheet presentable to DD and, some shareholders but, to achieve this….the manger has to fill the team with, bosmans/bargains/free’s etc ?
Is this the type of quality that DD and his cohorts, deem good enough for us to watch on the pitch ?
The fickle pendulam that swings through, ‘our’ immediate history is in the balance as they say!
We could win and go through tonight which would be ORGASMIC!(can I say that ?)
Or, we could have another Euro heartbreak to deal with and, waiting round the corner….St Johnstone away from home with, hun penalty hero ref Euan Norris and guess what…NO tv camera’s present ?mmmmmm
Hail! Hail!
KevJungle – “Lennons Lions Get Ready To ROAR!!!” says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:11
Faithfull through and through eh!!
KevJungle – “Lennons Lions Get Ready To ROAR!!!” says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:11
I don’t give the club a thin ‘dime’ anymore!
the manger has to fill the team with, bosmans/bargains/free’s etc
Do you realise what you are saying here?
http://www.heraldscotland.com/comment/columnists/this-dumb-unjust-law-is-salmonds-first-own-goal.16167952
excellent article by him on this ridiculous law; though look at the comments below, didnt take long for someone to blame catholic schools (shakes head)
KevJungle
Celtic FC is no more than a sideshow, a toy, a hobby for DD.
When was the last time he spoke of his visions for the Club? When was the last time he appeared at an AGM.
Wee Fergus had a 5 year plan & said he wanted Celtic back at the very top….i’d take him back tomorrow. HH
knoxy2000 says:
14 December, 2011 at 21:52
Wish I knew your secret. I have BT Vision, SkySports 1&2 with ESPNphone and broadband. Costs me £70 per month. If you can get for £40 would love to know what I am doing wrong….
Bright, promising morning here in North Ayrshire.
Come on the Bhoys!
Good Morning,
Each year, in the month of December, I am invited by one of the businesses I work for to their annual Christmas dinner. This is always held in the Shish Mahal Restaurant in Glasgow’s Park Road and a really good night it is too. Accordingly, last night, I made the annual pilgrimage into Glasgow and as usual had a more than excellent evening.
The Shish is iconic in Glasgow folklore. There are, of course, other Indian Restaurants in Glasgow, many of which are very very good, but the quality of the food in the Shish is constantly of an excellent standard and so without wishing to steal the mantle of the venerable Whitedoghunch, I can unashamedly recommend The Shish Mahal to one and all.
However, it would be unfair to suggest that the event described above is only enjoyable because of the excellent cuisine. My hosts were the principal of this family run business and his son, together with their staff,colleagues from associated businesses, and various lifelong friends and relatives. A lot of these people I have known personally for a number of years and so it makes for a very friendly and personal corporate night out.
Among the assembled company was one guy that I normally only get to see at this same event each year, although I have known him as both client and friend for many many years now. He is a professional driver and always has been. A number of years ago he was the victim of a very serious crime, the effect of which had a detrimental effect on his health which lasted a long time. I was glad to see him there and to see that the health was fully restored and that he was in top form.
These days he drives a taxi, although such is his professionalism, reliability and general kindness, he often gets seconded to certain large businesses to look after their visiting employees basically chauffeuring them from A to B.
Last night, he brought with him one of his own “clients” who has become more friend than than client. This chap– a really very pleasant guy to have a chat with- was a Dutchman who has been working in Glasgow for a few years now. Originally from Rotterdam, he has taken to Glasgow and was more than happy to say how much he liked it here and how he regularly invited friends and family from Holland and Belgium to come and visit. He even explained how whenever he had friends and so forth come to visit, he would always receive an invitation from our driver friend and his wife to bring his guests up to them for dinner etc. Clearly the two men, and their families are very close and have a great deal of mutual respect and so on, because I know that the man from Glasgow has been similarly hosted in Holland.
However, there is one area where these two friends do not see eye to eye– and that is when it comes to football. The Dutchman used to regularly visit the De Kuip to see Feyenoord, and now that he is in Glasgow he can regularly be found at Celtic Park. Alas our mutual driver friend is a blue nose!!
I should add that he is one of those people for whom I personally would walk on Glass in the middle of the night if I had to even though he is a blue nose– and so I was delighted to hear that this Dutch fellow took every opportunity to wind him up in the very friendliest of ways at every opportunity about his poor choice of team. Apparently he has been known to sing some rather uncomplimentary ditties from the back of the car when being driven about, only to be told ” aye you just keep singing, ya eedgit!”
I have sworn in the past that one day I will convert our blue nose driver into a Celtic fan, to which he always reacts the same way–” No F…ing Chance!”
However, it would appear that the Dutchman is getting close to succeeding as he takes him to Celtic park often,although in truth it is the other way about because your man the driver always drives. As a result, my blue nose friend waxed lyrically about how friendly he found the people at Celtic on his regular visits to the ground to sample the “hospitality”. He was at pains to explain how nothing was too much trouble for the staff, that they could not be kinder or more helpful and that ” There was just something”– something that he could not put his finger on that was different about Celtic Park– though he was still a blue nose.
We went on to talk about different stadia– Old Trafford, Highbury, The Emirates, San Siro, Amsterdam Arena, St James and on and on– comparing atmospheres and so on. We talked about which was our respective favourites, and it was the Dutchman who said ” Honestly– my favourite ground in the whole world is Celtic Park. Especially on European nights– it is just the best!”. Our mutual Rangers supporting pal even muttered– ” Yea I suppose it is!”
We then got round to talking about the league etc and whilst The bluenose among us barbed about being top of the league and I countered that I thought we would ultimately prevail, the Dutch chappie was in no doubt that Celtic would be champions and made his point with utter conviction much to the mock disgust of the Ibrox man.
It was a really good and fun football chat with a load of great banter and a lot of laughs with loads of good old fashioned winding up going on.
Any good lawyer will tell you that you should never ask a question without knowing the answer first and so it was with more than a little devilment in my eye that I did ask my new Dutch acquaintance what he did for a living?
He was a little bashful with his reply to be honest and with a degree of embarrassment he said rather quietly:
” Oh— I— Play Football professionally!”
My response was to look a bit aghast and puzzled– as by this time we had been chatting for a bit and eventually I replied:
” Glen– I have seen you play football often— and surely nobody pays you for doing that? Can you not get a proper job which you are hopefully quite good at……..?”
The bluenose driver spat his beer out!!!! And to be fair so did the tall dutchman!!!
May I just say that Mr Glen Loovens is a really nice guy who is so clearly a Celtic “fan”– and of course his wee Rangers supporting driver is just a gem in so many ways– though one day I will have him tattooed with a big Celtic crest when he isn’t looking!!!
With that I am away to the airport as the City of London and another culinary experience awaits– though this time it is work.
Big Glen advised that tonight will be tough as Udinese have the best defensive record at home throughout the whole of Europe, but he is hopeful that we will give a good account of ourselves.
I will tune in with expectation before heading of to a small musical venue in the smoke where Mr Ferry awaits my company for the evening……….. life is sometimes tough is it not?
PS Quinn– if you are reading this then stop lurking and get back to your work…..
Brogan
Celtic_First
If you’re still around, you’re welcome mate, I wish there was more like you.
JHilday
I was thinking about your ordeal. Hope you’re all right.
We/Celtic fans have not been ONE inch more in control of ‘our’ club since, the Kellys & Whites were deservedly sacked despite, numerous share issues, WE are on the outside looking in! IMO!
Thats why we are in freefall! IMO!
The establishment know full well that the Celtic support/WE are sitting ducks for the cops!
PL signed-up for the new ‘rules’ when instead, he should have said that, after the so-called shame game that, WE/Celtic FC and supporters had NO case to answer and, walked out of the room! IMO!
Tactics for tonight:
Dinner a bit earlier than usual. Heating up a notch. Bit of Santa chat and threats about not going to bed early. Back downstairs, quick visit to fridge for beer, arse on couch 8.04. Kick off 8.05.
Will take a bit of discipline but focus and determination and it can be done.
My boss is Peter Principle says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:20
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The manager has to bring in cheap players while, PL secures himself a cool £mill of the Celtic fans money every season for presiding over a, hun 3/4 iar ?
Not with my money he(PL) won’t!
I’ll no longer be viewed by the Celtic PLC/hierarchy as a, mug with a £-sign on my forehead!
“How could films like Michael Collins, about the IRA leader, be shown in Glasgow cinemas? ”
from Herald article.
No problem on non match days.
No problem on July 12th or the numerous other strutting days.
“If this is justice I am a banana.”
Or some other fruit.
dallasnomore says:
15 December, 2011 at 06:48
Auld Heid 22.22
Your suggestion that all the interested Celtic parties should get together to hammer out a solution is as ludicrous as it is dishonest.
You are skilfully moving our argument away from my original point; the nature of the UEFA charge as opposed to the far wider issues around yesterday’s Bill.
My point remains the same. The Board colluded with the authorities to have us ‘done’ in Europe. And people like you encouraged this.
=====================
Tripe!
Kev jungle
This is about personal perception and not how we see ourselves but how others perceive us.
I spend a fortune going to watch Celtic home and away every season. I don’t do it for Lawell, I don’t do it for Desmond.
I do it because I love Celtic. They are my focus, maybe you could try it mate?
BRTH
Thanks. Now I have to try to explain to my work colleagues why I’m laughing…
Kev Jungle,
Some of the happiest days/nights of my life have been given to me Celtic. Yes it’s a rollercoaster but I never want off it, take me round again.
Kev Jungle,
Some of the happiest days/nights of my life have been given to me by Celtic. Yes it’s a rollercoaster but I never want off it, take me round again.
KevJungle – “Lennons Lions Get Ready To ROAR!!!” says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:47
Right when you’re on the verge of making a reasonable point you go and spoil it. Show me when PL has made “a cool £M” in even one season let alone every season?
I could just as easily argue (for the sake of arguing) that PL is paid his high salary for his perceived ability to attract commercial income and if more fans spent the money watching us that wouldn’t be necessary and we’d be able to ditch him for a cheaper but less successful alternative.
Celtic_First says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:42
JHilday
Thanks for that kind thought.
My lip’s healing up fine, though I’ve still got a large lump on the outside of a very sore elbow. Maybe have to get it looked at. I’ll give it another few days.
The police have been in touch and seem optimistic about getting the man responsible.
It’s just a rotten thing to associate with an activity I enjoy so much.
Anyway, I appreciate your kindness.
Hail Hail!
BlantyreKev,
You’ll be missed in the ole Marquis tonight!
hamiltontim says:
15 December, 2011 at 09:51
I spend a fortune going to watch Celtic home and away every season. I don’t do it for Lawell, I don’t do it for Desmond.
I do it because I love Celtic. They are my focus, maybe you could try it mate?
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I have followed Celtic, home and away and sometimes away from home in europe for, over forty years M8!
But, why should I encourage the demise of Celtic FC by, financially endorsing the regime/hierarchy/PLC amongst whom, you would be lucky to find a ‘genuine’ Celtic supporter but, what you will find are a, collection of financial sharks who have to beremoved or, the huns will pass us on the way down! It’s that serious! IMO!
I struggle to take Kev Jungle seriously. He comes on with tweaks to his blog name suggesting he’s the uber Celt, in a style of writing almost Kojo -esque. Not riddles, but so overloaded with punctuation it looks deliberate. And always goes into blog saturation mode. There is a name for that type of blog contribution.
Sorry if that’s off the mark Kev, maybe we’ll meet and I’ll be embarrassed, but I reckon I’ve got you sussed.
KevJungle – “Lennons Lions Get Ready To ROAR!!!” says:
15 December, 2011 at 10:02
I would assume you will be off to form a version of “FC Celtic of Glasgow” then Kev?
Rubicon
I hit the bar, if you pardon the expression. Was down last Friday for a function, would have been good to have got the timing aligned. Still, Man City in the next round, I’ll make sure the visit works out!