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When great managers tumble over the peak

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By on CQN BLOG & Comments

Looking back it’s easy to spot; that moment when an imperious manager peaks before tumbling over the edge, but at the time this moment is almost impossible to see.  The moment Jock Stein peered over the mountain was absolutely impossible to identify at the time.

Celtic qualified for the 1970 European Cup final by beating English champions, Leeds United, home and away, and were hot favourites to lift the trophy for the second time in four seasons.  They were about to win their fifth consecutive league title and would go on to make record a world record nine-in-a-row, meaning there was a mountain of ‘evidence’ obscuring the peak from view.

We were the most feared side in football in April 1970 but that team’s time as a European heavyweight was over.  Stein remained a further eight seasons but he never beat another team from one of the large European leagues.  A 1975 win over a relatively obscure Boavista was his best result* in the period before he was replaced in 1978.

The reverence Jock is rightly held in by all Celtic fans now was tested during the 70s when I remember tactics and even minor decisions, like substitutions, were being questioned by large sections of the support.  It all ended in ignominy in 1978, fifth in the league and sacked in a clumsy and misleading fashion.

Jock was still a good manager and did well with Scotland but he should have moved on from Celtic years earlier.

Fans of other clubs will always see the moment of inflection before those too close to the event, but even Arsenal fans are now politely making the case that their once-supreme manager is no longer suitable for purpose.  Anyone suggesting that Arsene Wenger was finished in 2004 would have been certified.  His team had just won the league undefeated, the first team to do so since the 19th century.  They won the FA Cup on penalties the following season and reached the Champions League final a year after that, but they have not lifted a trophy since 2005.  Wenger was a fine 2004 vintage but has disappointed since.

After a slow start at Manchester United, Alex Ferguson has managed to remain at the top for 20 years.  His most important ability appears to be to know when to change coaches, players and tactics.  It has long been said that the best managers were not great players as they needed to acquire a conscious insight on the game which gifted players inherently knew.  Perhaps enduringly great managers are not even tactical geniuses, it’s more important that they can just spot a few.

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* In European competition, between beating Leeds and when Jock left in 1978, Celtic eliminated Kokkola, Waterford, B1903 Copenhagen, Sliema Wanderers, Ujpest Doza, Rosenborg, Turku, Vejle, Basel, Valur, Boavista and Jeunesse d’Esch.  They lost to Ajax, Inter Milan, Ujpest Doza, Atletico Madrid, Olympiakos, Sachsenring Zwickau and Wisla Krakow.  And Feyenoord, of course.

** CQN demographics suggest for most of you, your teenage years are now a distant memory.

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  1. tarrant on

    TSD

     

     

    maybe they thought the claims were a big pile of shite.

     

     

    http://www.thenation.com/blog/169001/michele-bachmanns-mccarthyite-witch-hunt-against-muslims-sharia-law#

     

     

    http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/ten-miles-square/2012/08/gaffneybachmann_v_norquist038965.php

     

     

    I’m a bit sorry that all I;m doing is posting alternative views to yours, but you had no response at all to my last comments on your gun-“control” post.

     

     

    I’m not very sorry though. You post, you spout shite, you take offence, you leave. Are you an asset to CQN? Do you add, or do you detract?

  2. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    GG

     

     

    I confess I’m an atheist… I’m doin a lot of confessin tonight

     

     

    that is moving and heartfelt… we all despair at this, there is no explanation

  3. The Singing Detective Demands The Resignation Of Campbell Ogilvie on

    The Visionary…If Flawed…Kemal Ataturk.

     

     

    Founder Of Modern Turkey………

     

     

    Abolishes The Muslim Caliphate In 1924..

     

     

    And Sought A Separation Of State And Religion….

     

     

    To Bring A Modern European-Style Democracy…..

     

     

    To His Backward And Decadent Nation…

     

     

    The Muslim Brotherhood Was Founded By Al-Banna ,In Egypt,In 1928….

     

     

    With The Aim Of Re-Founding The Caliphate….

     

     

    And They Continue To Work Towards That Goal…..

     

     

    Most Recently Aided By Obama,And The Wahabbis Of Saudi Arabia And Qatar….

     

     

    AND The UK And France…

     

     

    In Turkey,The Autocrat Erdogan Has Turned His Back On Ataturk’s Previously Cherished Secular Reforms…..

     

     

    And The Country Has Become A Hard-Line Neo-Islamist State…..

     

     

    http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/274893/atat-rk-arab-spring-and-europe-s-fall-clifford-d-may

  5. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    I have this – ok desperate – theory, that TSD is actually a good guy who is sacrificing himself by posting views which are so against the Celtic ethos, that it is a test. He obviously researches assiduously, and is no doubt an agent of P67, employed to root out those who harbour any latent racist or sectarian sentiments.

     

     

    Queue a challenge on what is the Celtic ethos

  9. Twinbhoy on

    sounds kind of Bible stuff

     

     

    Do we have a Bible expert in the audience? and can he play the fiddle?

  10. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    Still no scared

     

     

    and t think I gave up Young Frankenstein for this as well

     

     

    And no, that’s not my wife, whose birthday it is tomorrow…. may Allah bless her

  13. monteblanco on

    The singing defective

     

     

    You ever read Animal Farm?

     

     

    I can see you with a hook for a hand and your good eye missing, a whuppin’ an a hollerin’ with dem good ol’ boys in appalachia, dancin’ round the burning cross.

     

     

    Scary man.

     

     

    If I was the moon I would run away after reading some of the dross on here,

     

     

    love

     

     

    your pal

     

     

    Plastic P

     

    x

  15. The Singing Detective Demands The Resignation Of Campbell Ogilvie on

    Mr Tarrant….So Frank Gaffney’s Meticulously Researched Video Material Is Flawed…..?

     

     

    Very Impressed That You Were Able To View All Twelve Hours Of Material…

     

     

    In The Last Twenty Minutes….

     

     

    And Come To That Snap Decision…..

     

     

     

    The Material He Covers Only Collects And Aggregates Information That Is Already In The Public Domain…..

     

     

    To Form The Bigger Picture…..

     

     

    He Makes No Contentious Claims …

     

     

    And Parses His Erudite Observations With The Elegance Of A Philadelphia Attorney……

     

     

    He Is Clearly One Of The Most Lucid And Cerebral Political Analysts Around Today..

  16. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    This Us and Them, twists my tits

     

     

    When I meet Us, some I like, some I don’t

     

     

    When I meet Them, some I like, some I don’t

     

     

    The only…. THE only… people who benefit from Them and Us, are those who seek power. Given the same opportunities, people are the same the world over. Who would’ve thought, that the same species would be similar. There is no race, it’s a lie, don’t believe their shite.

     

     

    Anybody who says otherwise, is a spiv, or a fool.

     

     

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmnDXRJ7btE

  21. zimmerman on

    Take a deep breath..step back..look at it again…hey It’s just a piece of shit..that’s all it is..just bollocks.

  23. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    TSD,

     

     

    look, I can tell you’re startin to get frustrated with me, and I can understand that…. you should try being in my head

     

     

    I just phoned an Egyptian Coptic Christian, and he says you’re that boring bloke with the microphone who’s messin up his trade with Ahmed the baker cos you blame him for fat wummin, or fatwa, or somethin.

     

     

    Anyway, he asks you not to call again…. you don’t scare him either

     

     

    tch tch

  25. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    With TSD’s point on it not being race.

     

     

    Religion’s just a different knife to slice the human cake with – the slicing is the same, and the person who wields the knife is the same. It’s still shite.

     

     

    I shouldn’t need to add that this applies to Islam as it applies to any other creed.

  29. zimmerman on

    Yip.

     

    while were all busying with race, religion,gender,politics,left,right,centre,east,west,rich,poor….they are ripping us right up the middle.

  31. BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS on

    JIMMY QUINN’S BITS

     

     

    I’ll say one thing for the Singing Detective-he should be given The Nobel Prize for Peace.

     

     

    Last night,we had a classic wee moonhowlin’ experience with occasional spats and fall-outs. Excellent,and riveting stuff,it was……

     

     

    However,some of the morning crew were unappreciative of our best efforts,and roundly scolded us for our forthright exchanges.

     

     

    Tonight,just as it was getting interesting,TSD appeared,bored the tits off us all,and peace and quiet took a firm hold.

     

     

    Well done,that man. I commend you.

  32. JimmyQuinnsBits on

    Zimmerman,

     

     

    indeed

     

     

    Bhoylo83

     

     

    Viva La Republica

     

     

    off t bed, got to make breakfast in bed for Mrs JQB’s birthday

     

     

    Night all

     

     

    HH

  38. BOBBY MURDOCH'S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS on

    From yesterday’s record……..our very own Kevjungle.

     

     

    Kevin McQuade, New Stevenston , said: “I’d like to thank Celtic for the inept performance which will probably see another 10,000 falling off the gate on Saturday – just as Hugh Keevins predicted in the summer. It’s a disgrace that Hugh has been banned from Parkhead, he knows more about the team than those running the club put together.”

     

     

    Gaun yersel,son. Eeeeeeejit.

  40. zimmerman on

    Another hour till a quick cup of tea and a quick glance at sky news..(the best movie channel on the box) always good for a laugh before kip.

  41. Walfrid's Brother on

    BOBBY MURDOCH’S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS

     

     

    I concur :o)

     

     

    Morning Celts,

     

     

    Jobo,

     

    What’s the weather like?

     

     

    WB.

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