Blogging on the move right now but want to pass comment on one part of the statement by Aberdeen chairman, Stewart Milne. As he confirmed his club would place the fifth and decisive vote against Sevco being allowed access to the SPL next season he said:
“Reorganisation of the game is a priority and is something we have been actively involved in for a long time, but it is not something that should be rushed through just to deal specifically with one club.
“As we have indicated there are a number of other areas that we feel need to be addressed openly in the coming period if Scottish football fans are to feel that their views have been properly taken into account.”
Those well-paid executives who work for us and on Friday met to discuss a way to reorganise the league structure in the next couple of weeks should pay heed. As Mr Milne suggests, we are the game, not you.
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I reckon that one of the lessons of the past 12 months is that Celtic operate in an official environment that is unfriendy if not downright hostile.
Supporters of all clubs have come together in a common cause to save football and that is a good thing but the official environment will continue with its coterie of resentful agents all too ready to snipe and misrepresent us and divide us.
We are also a club trapped in a small market and have to find ways of taking the ethos that makes Celtic different out into the wider world.
I have thought that both these challenges could be addressed via the Membership Scheme which I mention occasionally.
Things have gone quiet on that front for obvious reasons of higher priority, but I’ve kept feeding in ideas and points made by posters and other developments and got an assurance in response to my last input that although not the immediate priority the project was still very much alive and would become a reality.
The football landscape in Scotand has obviously changed since the thought of a much more joined up Celtic entity based on dialogue entered my head when reporting on the first Roadshow and knowing what led to but that landscape will provide an opportunity to realise (become a reality) someting I believe to be essential if Celtic and our ethos is to thrive and prosper.
In the meantime, whilst we wait for the landscape to settle give this idea permission to enter your thoughts. In the Celtic world there is no “them” and “us”, only fragments of a whole that will, through dialogue, become one.
Auld Neil Lennon heid on 26 June, 2012 at 01:28 said:
You and I have had a couple of back and forth discussions about the membership scheme idea. My concern over it still stands.
Tonight on this site i have been attacked (a minor one compared to some) for my non attendance at Celtic Park in recent years. This is part of a mentality which irks me somewhat, and which I worry a paid membership scheme would intensify; this notion that if you can pay you are on the inside … if not you are on the outside.
Can you speak as to that concern?
Ernie Lynch
Are you calling human beings doing the right thing “lucky”?
I credit God’s children with having more a sense of rightness than them being lucky.
Depends on what you see I suppose and that depends on what you look for
In the spirit of fraternity I feel required to try to keep JamesForrest etc., in good spirits so……
…..who was it said about Ingurlan’s ‘performance’ last night,”If John Lennon had watched that game,he wouldn’t’ve had to imagine no possessions.”?
:-)
mlkl67:
Lol wonderful comment. I loved the quotes from the Italian commentator which someone posted earlier too.
James
Ye wurnae talking tae me.
But, as you suggest, lack of membership= lack of season ticket in our enemies eyes.
And that’s the point, no descent man would confront his fellow time over lack of money.
If there is a membership scheme, there will be fans excluded.
But they will still be Celtic men.
James Forrest is Neil Lennon! We are ALL Neil Lennon! on 26 June, 2012 at 01:18 said:
>>>>
Also,but not on today’s posts(!),someone said,”Be careful who you kick in the face as you scramble up the ladder…..you’ll meet them on the way back down.”
There,now I’ve said it!
HH!
James
Why would an idea that is meant to promote inclusiveness carry a price that defeated its aim?
What it would do is remove the very accusation from others you reacted to.
The barriers to ” supporting” Celtic is that not enough ways of doing that according to ones means exist. Celtic need to find ways of doing that and without creating a hostage to fortune for thinking can change I was very surprised at the very low figure suggested
However its not really about the price, its about supporters accepting the reality that there are many different means of supporting Celtic than being a SB holder and Celtic creating those means.
As I.ve said before James you worry too much. ;)
Just received an email from Celtic, I can buy a paving stone for 75 quid.
If I had loads o money, I would do it.
I would like my wee bit of the world.
Rascar
It would depend on the Scheme surely?
Even so no one would or could be stopped following Celtic, members or otherwise.
Auldheid:
People tell me that all the time haha.
Mate, the work you have put into this is astounding and appreciated by even those of us who have concerns.
(Unlike some I don’t frown on “intellectually supporting” Celtic haha. I think you do it very well in addition to going to games!)
I would have to read the small print, but if it led to the kind of model that you suggest, and gave the fans a genuine voice which would be heard, then it would be something I’d be totally behind.
Lads
Don`t miss this marvellous account
eddieinkirkmichael on 25 June, 2012 at 21:54 said:
Ozzies.
Wonder who could have been the expat Eddie refers to.
Couldn`t possibly have been…..????
So Auldheid,
have you worked out what will entice the peoples front and the peoples liberation front and the rest of the factions to give up their agenda to join this great movement :oD))
If the polis are goin’ in like the heavy team in such a well publicised manner it would look like there must be some weighty kudos in the offing for some highly ambitious boys in blue ; otherwise it would be much more low-key.
The polis have their own PR people & press officers,and the fact that there is so much ‘news’ in the msm about this operation means that the lawmen are expecting to get results. They don’t like to get egg on their faces,so they’ll already have a fair idea of what they’ll uncover and who is getting nicked.
Many months ago I posted the question on Phil Mac’s blog (it’s still in ‘moderation’ for some unfathomable reason!),”When is C.W. going to jail?”
Well,it’s now looking almost certain that quite a few citizens involved with what I’ve always called a criminal organisation are going to have their collars felt….and much higher up the food chain than the patsy in all of this,CW.
Are you shaking yet,Mr. Campbell Ogilvie? Sir David Murray? Graeme Souness et al?
I would be. But,hey,I’m glad I’m not. Schadenfreude is a dish best eaten….now.
HH!
HH all
Don’t know if I’ve proper picked up on the conversation but I think a “last minute” ticket is a great idea.
I mean if you can’t use your SB and someone can get a cheap ticket , Celtic get a additional fee and you get a token amount back ~what is not to lose ~ the way forward (THE ONLY WAY FORWARD)is to give the game back to the fans.
Celtic is a club open to all
JP
canamalar:
Free beer at the signing ceremony would be enough to entice me!
(I work cheap!)
Auldheid
I don’t know the proposals for the membership scheme.
So if fifty quid a year buys you membership, then I think that covers almost everyone.
But I know the others. And they love Celtic. And they are lost.
Not really part of this discussion.
Just what I was thinkin about.
Right heres wan
I reckon Ki may get a move and Vic could leave for a right few quid too but Joe16Led is in my opinion our best centre mid !
JP
Been readin’ back at the posts I’ve missed….because I also have a life with my wife!……thanks to EVERYONE for the honest,heartfelt words you have the courage to lay down for the whole world and its dog to see!
Love & respect to one and all.
This is a momentous time to be part of The Celtic Community,and it brightens up each and every day for me.
I’m starting to feel the years reelin’ in,but weirdly,in these austere times,my life has never felt more positive,or happier.
Too much to tell,really. It’s all good,though!
HH!
JF,
the CSA & CST already have loads of members andset agenda,ok we know all their agenda are to get a free lunch and a pat on the back, but my main objection in fact probably my only objection is, the board.
to negate my objecton I require a couple of principals,
one level of membership one price (no premier or elite levels)
one supporter one vote
The Celtic board pay to join and have no more influence than any other memeber, (lets see them agree to that eh :o) they sneer at the divisions within the support, do you think they would perform any better if they were just anoter peoples front.
Canalamar
Nope they would still be there but hopefully with better information/understanding to form/inform their agenda.
On your point about SFA reform I posted an email the other day about devlopments in England and proposed reforms made by a Parliamentary working party, made up of volunteer MPs that required greater supporter involvement in running of clubs.
If you did not catch it email me to remind me to forward it to you.
What was very interesting is what these guys did enabled the Government with its experience of how governance should work to get involved in football unofficionally thus getting around the excuse tge SG gave me 3 years ago about not getting involved in football.
A similar approach could be applied in Scotland and I suggested to the CST to make the suggestion to the SG as, like you, I believe some sort of enquiry to further reform of SFA is essential.
I cannot see any likelihood of a SPL/SFL merger before the start of the season.
In the scenario that a newco join SFL3 and then join an SPL2 then it will still be 2014-2015 before they would possibly be in the SPL1 again.
I think however that the creambuns have not seen anything like the bottom of the sea yet. Newco-Sevco will fail to get support from the creambuns and I imagine that the assets will be stripped and sold off.
the creambuns, the midden and their followers are gone.
Auldheid,
Jesus H C..,
your wanting to bring in MP’s the only people in the country more corrupt than the existing set up and you want them ffs :oD)))))
back to the drawing board for you buddy :oD)))
Rascar Capac on 26 June, 2012 at 02:11 said: membership scheme?
Missed this. What is this all about?
Rascar
As the contestant says to old Brucie
“lower, lower” :)
Read what the English guys came up with, its about governance not politics.
Last for canalamar.
Hector Avo…,
I never even contemplated it being in place by next season, in fact Id expect any investigation into the sfa to take at least 6 months, so everyone would be where they are for at least a season.
I’d also expect reorganisation and rule change\refinement, moratorium to take about two years, oh and the hundead should never kick a ball again.
Jimphil70
That is similar to something I posted about in the last week and something I hope will be pursued.
Good idea.
You’re granchildren will be Celts
My Grandfather supported Rangers (1872 -2012)
I miss him
My Father supported Scotland (1972-) He tried but he could never support them he took me to Scotland games faithlessly >it was a mission for him and I enjoyed it
I would come in from school and the drama would begin, but in the end he would take me to the Scotland game and the drama would begin….back then Scotland were good!
Then latterly he took me to way games in Europe Dortmund Madrid now I was on my own
I chose my local team the Celtic
JP
I propose that any reorganisation should implement as much of an anti-pish-fitba policy as much as possible and reorganise the league on a ladder basis.
All teams start at zero and randomly drawn first game only. All teams then play their match and afterwards you can only play the team above you. So SPL of 20 = 10 games.
1st v 2nd
3rd v 4th etc
and so on each week. You won’t know who your playing perhaps from one week to the next.
That way those cold wet nights away to St Mirren are unlikely to happen….
Auldheid,
I don’t have a copy of the McLeish report with me here at work but off the top of my head some of the recommendations laid out by him, Part two, pages 72 to 75 (ish) lend a lot of credence to what you are saying.
Also, I read it a few weeks ago in full, I did not see any recommendation anywhere in it that gate receipts should be shared. Maybe I missed that part.
I am all for the membership scheme as you well know but the structure and ambition whould have to be in keeping with our ethos.
Auldheid,
I know what its about ,but politicians always skew governance to suit politicians.
Its simple enough, remove the ambiguities from the rule book, put non football people in charge of dispensing the rules, an leave politics out of it.
Neil canamalar Lennon hunskelper extrordinaire:
What you are calling for is well covered in the McLeish report, it is quite scathing of the SFA and the ‘bowling club’ mangement style.
You should download a copy and go to pages 70 onwards. It is funny that the blazers in office are not rushing to implement the changes that are called for on those pages.
Neil canamalar Lennon hunskelper extrordinaire on 26 June, 2012 at 02:46 said:
Auldheid,
I know what its about ,but politicians always skew governance to suit politicians.
Its simple enough, remove the ambiguities from the rule book, put non football people in charge of dispensing the rules, an leave politics out of it.
Let’s take politics out of the arena# they expect to hear it from us…they are driving us to a vote for independance .WHY
JP
Hector Avo…,
lets see if we can get the baby walking before we enter it into the high jump.
McLeish Report Part 2
From page 71 Part 2 McLeish Report:
RECOMMENDATIONS
Competitive Football Leagues
1. Scotland should have one Football League Structure. The Scottish Premier League and the Scottish Football League should combine to form an integrated approach to the professional game.
2. The current set up of four leagues should be reconstructed. And comprise the SPL, a new Championship league and first and second divisions.
3. From my review and analysis there are really two obvious options for the future of the SPL and SFL (1) A Premier League of 10 teams would make sense of the current financial difficulties, the fragile nature of the existing distribution of funds within the league and current anxieties about income from broadcasting and sponsorship – and would avoid a ‘split’. This would lead to a reconstruction of the SFL creating a Conference league and
divisions 1 and 2 with the possibility of Colt teams from the Premier League being integrated into the lower leagues; or (2) A Premier League of 14 teams which would be more in tune with what the fans and spectators have been asking for but which would run the risk of some serious financial difficulties and a reduction in the current financial distribution going to the clubs. The quality of the SPL would also be a major consideration. This would lead to a similar situation to option 1 as far as the reconstruction of the 3 SFL leagues are concerned and the infusion of Colt teams. It seems clear that there is no perfect or obvious solution to the demand for restructuring as reflected in the work in the report which suggests that hard economics and finance may be the real influences at the present time. Any solution arrived at would not in any way solve all the problems.
4. The distribution of finance to SPL clubs is important and parachute payments for those who exit the Scottish Premier League should be more generous and more in line with other European Leagues.
5. Colt teams from the Scottish Premier League could participate in Divisions 1 and 2
6. There should be more competition within our professional game. This should be partly achieved by more promotion and relegation and play-offs between competing leagues. This will provide more interest and more incentive.