Back in October 2011 I was for calling an end to the Neil Lennon experiment. During the previous season he lost the league after a late collapse, while exiting Europe in August after defeats to Braga and Utrecht. That season Sion’s insistence in not playing by the rules allowed us a backdoor ticket to the Europa League but we were 10 points behind Ally McCoist’s Rangers.
Subsequent events proved there was not enough evidence on show to judge the Neil Lennon era early in his second season. Neil pulled things together, finished a credible third in the Europa League group and never looked back.
Ronny Deila has already made mistakes in his Celtic tenure but does anyone seriously believe he has had the opportunity and resources to build a team? Of course not. He needs to sort out the many cousins of George Weah who have arrived recently from the genuine John Guidetti’s. He needs players who can pass the ball with reasonable accuracy but most of all he needs players of courage and attitude.
I would probably be singing a different tune if we still had Rangers to contend with, long-term development objectives are important but the short-term need to win the league remains absolute, but we don’t, which means short-term targets remain well within grasp.
The memory of Rangers’ many mistakes in the years before liquidation offers another lesson. They sacked Paul Le Guen six months into a badly needed overhaul project. Le Guen was appointed months before he took up the reins and had enough time to watch his new team and scout transfer targets, but even that wasn’t enough to ensure a smooth transition, as he found the Weahs living in Austria. Le Guen was decrying his as a heretic by a club incapable of change.
Despite the tiredness after Thursday and a plethora of injuries, Celtic had enough resources to swamp a tiny football club yesterday. That we didn’t, suggests Ronny has a big job on his hands. From the frustration shown by Scott Brown and Stefan Johansen at their team-mates yesterday, I suggest he builds his recovery around these two.
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m6bhoy
09:06 on
7 October, 201
Here here to all of that – BUT – I think he deserves until end of November
If we are not top of the league by the end of November he must go
And if possible a little bit of decent football along the way would be nice
The objective is to win the league not to educate Ronny
67ECW
67 ECW
It may have been take it or leave it for Keane,but he could have renegotiated after Lawwell left.
Which he would have done if Keane was appointed,I reckon.
Hence the nature of the offer.
67 ECW
I don’t really have a problem with educating Ronny,as you put it.
I do have a problem that he doesn’t seem to be learning.
Hopefully the break will give him a few days to mull things over,see where it’s not working,and fix it.
Sunday was brutal,for all the chances we created.
Four wide men getting in each other’s way,and a two-man mid crying out for help.
67 European Cup Winners
I don’t claim to know anything of the inner workings of Celtic but why would the CEO be worried about confrontation or competition from the manager??
Surely Neil is as fiery a man as Roy Keane? Have we become fixated on the idea of PL having an agenda and sticking it constantly to him for everything from the state of the club to the war in Syria because it makes us feel better to have a bogey man?
That Celtic can’t sign a decent striker or a ball passing midfielder( remember those) is down to more than just PL’s inflexibility in my opinion, our scouting system has let us down more than a few times but not just in the last couple of seasons but stretching back to a series of midfielders we signed of whom Naka was the only decent one( have we ever replaced the wee man?)
The bigger picture for me is that it seems unless we are in the CL we don’t have decent exposure to recruit better players and we’ve blown that big time this season and I’ve still to see someone at Celtic hold their hands up for that fiasco.
I said to Mrs Starry on Sunday morning ” I think Hamilton can beat us today”
What a way for a Tim to start his day:((
October will be Ronny’s make or break month I fear but he is only a symptom of a deeper malaise that runs all through our national game…
BOBBY MURDOCH’S CURLED-UP WINKLEPICKERS
09:33 on
7 October, 2014
Ah there you go – perhaps DD had a plan ????
Not sure Keane was/is the answer – but he would have livened things up
I now ask myself if I had a choice today – Keane or Ronny ????
Oh dear stuck between a rock and a hard place
67ECW
If all hem shareholders are happy , as to what they see on match days, then they are only interested in there returns, they just shut up at the AGM , oh i forgot the ask questions like the living wage, the catering,do they ,no didnt think so.and Dermot Desmond has been a disaster for celtic. Fergus picked the wrong guy, is there any celtic fan with plenty of cash out there ,who could buy all his shares,
starry plough
I think anybody could beat us at the moment
Hopefully when everyone is fit R.D will settle the team
or will he play CM on the wing and JF at left back
starry plough
09:39 on
7 October, 2014
BTW I know its only 9.45 in the morning but I would love this conversation in a pub – nothing better than good natter with like minded people
I may not sound it – but I am a self confessed Lawell fan – just look across Glasgow and that shambles and I think lawell (Fergus before him) has a lot to do with our financial stability
But as a business as a company if you want to attract top talent you need to flexible (and I don’t mean chuck a load of money at it)
RK has my head spinning this morning – so DD (The Owner) wants Keane but he does not come because Lawell is not flexible ??
So DD does not get what DD wants or is he so far removed from Celtic that he has given PL complete power ??
67ECW
The one reason I wanted keane was it would have been the end of PL cash cow If Roy wanted vics money for that much needed striker for CL qualifier and Lawwell said no ( he needed it for AGM balance sheet ) then Roy would have told him to fe@k his job and would have told the fans. Then season tickets would have been boycotted and lawell would have had to go
But to be told who your assistant is was shocking
Another reason to sack lawwel
This man has to go to stop the downward spiral
Keane is a horrible selfish ******,’they didn’t want me enough’ is doublespeak for more money.No time for ex players and managers who kiss and tell for even more money,if you have something to say,say it at the time,not 10 years later, when a publisher is dangling a cheque in front of you.
I loved Roy Keane the player but Roy Keane the manager has no credibility. The alleged comments from the book are absurd. “They wanted me but didn’t want me enough” Eh? Jog on Roy.
I was delighted we did not appoint Roy Keane. I don’t rate him as a manager or an astute tactician.
Ronny would have been an ideal no.2 to an experienced or competent manager.. He is still very much learning how to manage. In my opinion he is a spreadsheet type of guy. All figures, diets, fitness and tactical graphs but little actual experience.
I think Ronny is too raw and inexperienced to manage a club the size of Celtic.
To me he needed a few more years gaining practical experience on man management and the everyday cut and thrust of being “gaffer”.
It seems he was targeted as a no.2 , a man to be nurtured but unfortunately he was thrust into the top spot because the club could not get an experienced manager to work under their moneyball thesis.
I want RD to succeed, but am becoming frustrated. Despite our superior resources we look no better and in some cases inferior to those teams around us.
Some of Ronny’stactics and substitutions seem bizarre.
The players have regressed. None of them are better than they were last season. in most cases worse
.Are they on side with Ronny ?
And the signings of the past 4/5 years have been mainly sub standard or abysmal.
Other clubs can sign players and have them up and running in a matter of games but at Celtic its always “he needs time”. ” He needs to settle “.
Most are punted out before they perform because it dawns on the club that that’s it. They ARE settled . Just rank.
In my 40 odd years following Celtic I have seen some duds but lately it has been a conveyor belt of them
The manager must be allowed to target and sign his own players.
tractorbhoy
08:09 on 7 October, 2014
Absolutely spot on …. HH
La bella Italia.
Rubentus have been fined 30k euros in consequence of a Rube Ultra attacking one of Roma s technical staff during Sundays Rubentus v Roma game .
Asked to comment -Pavel Nedved ,said this –
” Unfortunately some Ultras think that demonstrating hatred for other clubs indicates how much they love the club they support -it doesnt , it demonstrates how stupid they are “
Ronny was always the plan.
Learning from the Roy Keane interview that Ronny Deila was definitely intended to come in as a No. 2, which Neil Lennon has previously stated and Roy Keane confirming that this was a non-negotiable clause, leads me to believe that the board had decided some time ago that a new football philosophy was required and that Neil Lennon could not be relied upon to deliver the desired change.
The board either anticipated that Neil Lennon would remain in place for a one season hand over where RD would concentrate on the youth squad and get to know the SPFL before taking charge of the first team, which wouldn’t have been a bad plan, or they knew that imposing RD as Neil’s No.2 would force Neil to quit, either way the decision was made to move in a different direction with the football squad.
Neil’s decision to resign was most likely a surprise to the board which seems to be confirmed by Dermot Desmond offering Roy Keane the job of succeeding Neil Lennon, the contract offered to Roy Keane was he states full of unappealing clauses, which I believe were inserted to ensure that Ronny Deila would take up the first team management role after a one season bedding in period.
I think the appointment of John Collins was a last minute decision when it became clear that Ronny Deila was on-board and a suitable “name” could not be found to fulfil the one year transition of RD from youth team to full team.
If I am right it also confirms that the board did not believe that Ronny Deila was ready to step straight in to the first team managers role.
Guys,
Slightly off topic. I have 3 tickets for Astra game, South stand section F4W, behind home dugout. One adult, one under 16 and one under 12 although both youth tickets showed green at turnstile for Zagreb game.
Due to work commitments I cannot go, therefore these tickets are free to good home, will post if anyone wants them. HH
A fiver for thoughts.
you may well have hit the nail on the head !!!
Keane it appears was offered the job on Celtic’s terms – non negotiable at that. So how much did we really want him ? Not much imo – he was a stop gap before Ronny took over.
Deila has been recruited as a long term addition knowing that in the short term there may be problems. We need to stick with him, he’ll come good.
67 ECW 0951
‘
But as a business as a company if you want to attract top talent you need to flexible (and I don’t mean chuck a load of money at it)
RK has my head spinning this morning – so DD (The Owner) wants Keane but he does not come because Lawell is not flexible ??
So DD does not get what DD wants or is he so far removed from Celtic that he has given PL complete power ??’
I think the last sentence is bang on the,erm,money. Sadly.
Jobo dont know if you were driving today but missing from weather this am.
I had to scrape ICE of my windows this morning (approx 7:10am)
and as you know I live just within two good 3 woods from you.
(Note Rory 3 woods certainly not jc2 3 woods)
tractorbhoy @08.09hrs.
I agree with much of what you say.
Where I disagree is the booing at HT and FT. If the supporters think that the team ( including management ) have not given enough or sense a lack of effort then they have every right to let their feelings known.
Fans will accept setbacks, if the team give everything, anything less is unacceptable and they must be made aware of this.
What is the alternative ? Give up ?
You are correct with reference to language and attitude. Does being part of the clique make this acceptable. ?
HH.
I reckon Ronny was part of a longer term strategy ok. Whether it was planned he would take over from Lenny or Keane in one/two or three years is impossible to know. Keane is many things but he is not a liar. I would believe his version of events implicitly. When Lenny resigned & Keane turned the job down, they fast forwarded Ronny to the top job. No one can possibly blame Ronny for grabbing his opportunity but he
is obviously struggling to adapt, it was a high risk strategy, it remains a high risk strategy, the next month or so will tell a lot whether it was wise or foolish.
@Divitbhoy I would love the tickets if you still have them?
I have 12 and 14 year old daughters who’d be over the moon to go to a European match.
Tractorbhoy
I get what you are saying, also agree about the abusive posts that some think are ok. I’m sure you’ll agree It reflects on the perpotrater rather than the blog.
Some of it, a lot of the gripes are just Celtic supporters unhappy at what they are watching just now. Many come on to share their views and take some solace from fellow Tims.
I ain’t happy at the glaring problems being created on the park. The Guidetti substitution was incredible and many expressed their frustration. Nothing wrong with expressing yourself?
Annanvhoy and divitbhoy
Email me and I’ll put you two in touch.
blantyretim@aol.co.uk
In life you are often grateful for what you receive and even more grateful for what you don’t.
As far as Celtic are concerned I’m grateful we didn’t get RK as manager.
As a player Roy was a winner and a whole load of other stuff too.
It’s the other stuff that precludes him from managing in any meaningful way a club like Celtic – mibbe he could make it as a coach……….mibbe.
The multi-millionaire former pro is fortunate to have a job in football coaching / management imo, the game is still sufficiently circus-like here for ‘characters’ to be needed to drum up interest and put bums on seats.If Roy was in any other job he’d now be looking at long-term unemployment, If he wasn’t financially secure – he’d be humped. He was very good at what he did but his skills are not transferable – at least not to executive management.
Someone somewhere knows that Celtic needed to change and we downsized in line with that required change.
As many of us know, supporting Celtic is not just about seeing Celtic win every game, as good as that would undoubtedly be.
Win, Lose or Draw.
HH.
divitbhoy
10:07 on 7 October, 2014.
Great gesture mate, what this hallowed site is really about. HH
divitbhoy
Good mhan :))
I just made a song about a tortilla. Actually,it’s more of a wrap
dallas dallas where the heck is dallas
08:01 on 7 October, 2014
Auldheid, further to your post last night about The Scottis Football Monitor and the press. Video Celts have an article about R C Ogilvie and TSFM on newsnow Celtic.
They have a copy of a letter from Ogilvie asking for renumeration for a loyal employee from the trustees.
=========
That letter and other documentation from HMRC that sets out the irregular nature of the DOS ebts was sent to Harper MacLeod in February.
HMCL were good enough to reply but we’re not able to answer the core point about the nature of those early ebts which was kept from HMcL and that this renders the LNS Decision as unreliable.
The SPFL who were copied in have not responded themselves, probably leaving the job to HMCL.
The fact that HMCL have now passed the evidence including Ogilvie’s part in the early ebts to the SFA Compliance Officer tells me that the points being made in the previous correspondence stand up or HMCL would have stood their ground and explained why they did not.
So we have the SFA now in possession of the evidence that the LNS Commission was misled by the failure of Rangers to supply evidence that would materially have changed the outcome of what LNS was asked to investigate.
What they will do with such evidence is going to be a problem for them in terms of ignoring it and chances are they might try, but keeping vital information from the SFA is a discernible pattern of behaviour of Rangers since 2000 at least and how they got away with it right up to date must be answered because either the SFA were complicit or incompetent but are safe from censure.
In short it’s all about accountability as is made clear in latest tsfm blog.
http://www.tsfm.scot/harper-macleod-and-lns/#more-2370
“Impeach Grimmond McCrummoch!”
A fiver for your thoughts
Most top foreign teams have a director of football/general manager who oversees player recruitment. The head coach picks the team and manages the team day to day. I don’t believe it’s humanly possible for one man to do everything a la Big Jock. Sure Jock nearly got killed driving back from a scouting trip to England.
This division of labour can only be a success if both the director and coach share the same football philosophy. Ideally, IMO, both men should be on the board; if not, the the DoF should be.
The idea of Ian “behave yourselves” Bankier being involved in any football matters is plainly ridiculous.
Winning captains idea of someone like David Hay mentoring Ronny is appealing, but does he share Ronny’s game philosophy? I doubt he would sit back if he saw Celtic being overrun in midfield by teams with poorer players.
Celtic is a football Club with a PLC structure. There must be football men on the main decision body of the organisation. We don’t have that at present. Peter and Desmond, between the pair of you, get it sorted.
Honestly – not spending my morning on CQN but, as part of my daily update of the world of Accountancy, I came across this snippet about sports testimonials to be taxed in future.
Testimonials: HMRC believes that some aspects of the guidance at EIM64120 on tax treatment of income arising from sports testimonials may have been misunderstood and “improperly applied”. In addition, the guidance “does not reflect the development of tax legislation over time … nor does it reflect the changing nature of testimonials themselves”.
HMRC’s view is that testimonial proceeds are primarily derived from the sportsperson’s employment and should normally be taxable as general earnings: “This would bring the tax treatment of such sums in line with other voluntary payments by the public to employees, for example tips to a waiter or taxi driver.”
More evidence of the general tightening of tax loopholes. Not that many players stay around long enough now to get a testimonial.
I was reading an interesting article on how Valencia beat Atletico Madrid.
How would it work if everyone just put aside their default positions for 3 months and just supported the team on the park as the Valencia support did?
http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/12087/9506462/nuno-got-valencia-tactics-right-on-and-off-the-pitch-against-atletico-madrid-says-guillem-balague
Dividing the Celtic support must seem like child’s play to our media.
So how about for 3 months we show a bit of resolve and fortitude and just back the manager in phone ins in comments on media Web sites, on Twitter on blogs?
Remember I’m backing Lenny?
Why not RD?
If Ronny delivers the treble there will be a lot of supporters with egg on there face ( me included ) after the reaction to the Hamilton defeat.
After calming down I’m happy to give him the season and see how it goes HH
It seems to me reading the bits of the interview with RK that he felt Celtic didn’t offer enough money.
The other stuff about Ronny being his assistant is secondary.
AULDHEID
I think most of us are behind RD and are desperate for him to succeed.
That doesn’t blind us to his faults.
Pretty much as we were with NL,tbh.
When I was a young lad, my granny and my mother told me stories of their days in the LIP. I grew up knowing about the needs of others. I lived in a close and there we all looked after one another. One day it was a cup of sugar, the next a cup of milk or a collection for a family that suffered the loss of a loved one. Socialism in practice or just living as Christians should.
A long comes Fergus and my socialist principles went out the window. I became a shareholder holder…a very small one. Celtic needed my support to survive and with many others I did my bit to change things. Or so I thought. Now I know that like many on here I help the club to survive, but now we have no say in how the club should be run. At the next AGM, we will be told what the Board want us to hear, but they will not be listening to those who give their all for the club they love.
So how can we really change? Anyone got any ideas. We got rid of those in the past who were holding us back, but this time it will be more difficult.
Or can we find a way of getting through to PL and others.
Incidentally this is not about the manager, it is about a whole range of things that need to be addressed.
,