It all seems a bit cloak and dagger to suggest that pyrotechnics are smuggled into football grounds inside flags and banners. I’d always assumed the ‘stick it up your jumper’ technique would have been the delivery mechanism, not that I’ve any experience of the subject.
Flares have been an increasing menace at football games across the UK in recent years, including earlier this season at a Europa League qualifying game at McDiarmid Park, which passed off without mention in the media, but police have previously limited their interventions to lectures and the occasional arrest.
Football clubs are dependent on Police Scotland for safety licenses for games, and in their wisdom, the police have determined this action will remove one method of entering a stadium with pyrotechnics and discharging them without detection. The ‘stick it up your jumper’ technique remains, as does ‘light it while pretending to tie your laces’. Jumpers and tie-up shoes are the real enemy here.
This is an arbitrary over-reaction to the criticism Police Scotland came under for failing to properly police the vandalism at Fir Park, it will not prevent anyone intent on letting off flares inside a football ground from doing so. Over-reacting after under-policing is a well-known phenomenon. Going after flags and banners feels provocative. Coincidence?
You’re likely to find out if you’re in a provocative mood on Thursday; Police Scotland will know that provoking a crowd seldom quietens things down. The reaction to Fir Park made me hopeful that we’d seen the last flare from the Celtic support, now who knows? We’re deep in muscle flexing territory here.
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gebhoy.. no worries mate. It would be dull here if everyone agreed with each other :)
Merry Christmas to you mate.
Robcfc11,
HH comrade! And a merry xmas to you and yours!
gebhoy
Brogan Rogan Trevino and Hogan supports Oscar Knox, MacKenzie Furniss and anyone else who fights Neuroblastoma
Does it work? The only criteria for positive change. Excellent.
Robcfc11:
Some go home and away to respect our culture. Who am I to tell them how best to redress the oppressions of our history and of our unchartered future.
Anyone that is employed by that Daily Reprobate rag should be banned from Celtic Park for a start.
16 roads – Wee Oscar the Celtic warrior.
11:21 on
24 December, 2013
It’s killing them that the game goes on without them,it really is.
………………………………………………………………………………….
That really rings true.I think you`re right.
It certainly explains a lot.
Since we have one unified police force in Scotland now,this ban would have covered all sporting events all over the country,what was it they said to stop fans from concealing smoke cannisters in them!,my erchie!”!!.
whit next no fans allowed to games with jackets and troosers that hae pockets!
FFS!!!.
big sean.
digginoot the auld fleg fir boxing day.
Auldheid:
Please… What is the difference between the SPL/SFL 5 way agreement? I hope there is one.
parkheadcumsalford who is supporting the amsterdam 5
11:13 on 24 December, 2013:
I’m with you…I posted my thoughts at 18:27 last night. I have reported some of your words, hope you don’t mind.
It saddens me that the usual suspects who have had it in for the Board for ever and a day are now using the latest nonsense to have a go a them. As has been said by others, too many of our support take the SMSM’s line, especially if it means criticising the Board.
I have no intention of returning my Season Ticket. And I have every intention, God spare me, of buying one next season…
I support Celtic, always have always will. There have been far far worse custodians of Celtic in my time than the present incumbents. There have also been great men like Fergus McCann and Brian Quinn whom so many “supporters” chose to boo, influenced, I’m sure, by the SMSM.
Happy Christmas to you.
Keep the Faith!
Hail Hail!
Who was it that said you can write ten million fancy words to oppose victimisation but without actions you have been the obstacle to change?
No other football club in the world would accommodate an instrument that is so blatantly attempting to discredit it with such relentless vigour.
Seems clear to me that Celtic have lost control of PR.
If you were a PR guy working in Scotland at the moment and you wanted to draw attention away from other events what would you do?
Easy pickings us lot.
Our support is a very broad church, much broader than the contributors on these ‘hallowed’ pages. We need to encourage the young fans, obviously they are our future but many will be lost if the current climate continues. I’ve used my son as an example before: 18, 2nd year at uni, Celtic daft and all round good ghuy. He has never been in trouble with the police in his life yet on two occasions I’ve been with him at Celtic Park this season, he’s been searched and filmed for no other reason than his age and I reckon the clothes he was wearing-similar to their enemy the ultras! He doesn’t go to away games now and I’m glad because you just never know what trumped up charge could come his way.
It’s good some of you haven’t witnessed this or much worse but it is happening. Scores of us from these pages went to George Sq and demonstrated about the criminalization of football fans, we saw this coming.
What do I want? The young fans allowed to be noisy, colourful and attend football without undue harassment. There have always been ‘bangers’ who cannot behave and they were dealt with by the common law; the seat wreckers etc need sorted but do not tarnish all of our young fans with the Fir Park brush. I want our board to give them a standing section that can be raucous and colourful and for Police Scotland to keep their provocative cameras out of the faces of the innocent. And if our fans are being unduly/unlawfully attacked let’s stick up for them, we have enough enemies.
HH
robcfc11,
No concerns about how a court of law can objectively judge that a banner is offensive?
Are you saying damaged seats and flares were unequivocally the work of Celtic supporters? How do you know who or what one guy setting off a smoke bomb is? There are reasons why men are inocent until proven guilty.
You have quickly condemned an anonymous and innocent section of the Celtic support. That is me, and everyone else. Call me pedantic, but if you want everyone to follow rules….
Turkeybhoy
10:46 on
24 December, 2013
Auldheid
10:20 on
24 December, 2013
If it was a UEFA requirement,why did we not have one before?.Never heard of that UEFA requirement before,but I will bow to your knowledge.Funny how we appoint one when the storm is breaking.
Do you honestly think that JP will go against anything that comes out of Celtic Park.He is an employee.He is a flak jacket for the board.If you think otherwise,you are deluded.
I really love people who cherry pick bits of peoples posts to try and score some useless point.
==========================
Purely coincidental. In fact had it not been a UEFA requirement then I doubt the post would have been created.
In terms of who JPT is answerable to he told a meeting of the CST that he was the supporters representative to Celtic, not Celtics representative to the support. That is not verbatim but that was the message.
Clearly more work needs to be done re communications which was the other part of your post but long term CQN readers will know this has been my mantra since I first joined CQN and something I have been in discussion with Celtic on using a membership scheme which I will attempt to re engage them on in the coming year.
I hope you have all read the ‘five way agreement’ if not and you support our board then you have slaved you kids to bigotry.
Here son, happy Christmas.
macjay1 for neil lennon
11:31 on 24 December, 2013
———————————-
I know the zombie like I know the back of my own hand mate.
I have studied and observed their treacherous ways throughout my entire life.
I know how they operate and I know how they think.
Son to father:
do all these guys that quote Clauses know Santa?
Son, I don’t know who they are or what they are trying to do.
So there was this apparent mix up and St Johnstone, instigators of the ban, are now commenting on the farcical nature of this?? I smell a rat.
Celtic didn’t then triangulate with the Police but include that the Police agree in their statement…. The the Police contradict this?? Somebody is running rings round you Mr Lawwel.
robcfc
I wasn’t offended by any banners
were you?
Merry Christmas to all the Celtic fans who are delighted with the PLC, to all the Celtic fans who have had enough.
Merry Christmas to all the Celtic fans who are banned and to all the Celtic fans who are fed up with the whole saga
Merry Christmas to all the Celtic fans who are blissfully unaware or don’t give a monkeys
Seasons Greetings to all the Celtic fans who are not into all that Christmas malarkey
Go easy on the brussel sprouts if your heading to Perth on Boxing Day
Fly the flag.
Robcfc-
Deadco
Offensive banners
Offensive singing
Smoke bombs
Wrecked seats
Wrecked toilets
= NO BAN, NO MEDIA COVERAGE, NO PS SPECIAL ACTION
Motherwell fc
Smoke bombs
wrecked seats
attacks on Celtic supporters at Motherwell train station
= NO BAN, NO MEDIA COVERAGE, NO PS SPECIAL ACTION
So while you are trying to cleanse our support you might want to ask yourself why we are seen as such a special group in Scotland
So what is the difference between the SPL/SFL 5 way agreement.
All I want for Christmas is the difference.
Robcfc11
I take it you never saw the u-tube with two polis standing by doing nothing just watching as rabid huns ripped toilets apart during the last game we played them? In fact it turned out that one of the mob doing the damage was actually an off-duty polis. After that game there was the usual amount of broken seats which the police and MSM ignored . The polis control box is right above them with a perfect veiw.
Around Celtic Park police hit squads issue on the spot fines for very minor offences of the kind that in past days would have resulted in a verbal warning.
ffm.. did you go along with old rangers’ fans view that they didn’t wreck manchester and it was a big chelsea boy what did it and ran away too then ?
Uefa were the court that said the ‘f@@k uefa’ banner was offensive and they are the law in european football. We have incurred several fines from uefa now and i believe are paying for the damage at motherwell.
Someone else’s supporter sneaked into a european game at CP and got the game halted too ?
Sorry mate, we have a problem within our support.
brogan rogan trevino and hogan supports oscar knox, mackenzie furniss and anyone else who fights neuroblastoma
11:07 on 24 December, 2013
Just now I get the impression the Police are run by a very ambitious “politician” he could be our next first minister.
HH
St J weren’t behind the ban.
On the contrary, they had the decency to forewarn supporters.. Perhaps that’s why there was a bit of unexpected confusion yesterday.
robcfc11,
Do you think we deserved to be attacked in Amsterdam and then be accused of rioting?
Open your eyes, for crying out loud.
Take a walk up the gallowgate any match day, with eyes open, and see who the real hooligans are.
Who cares about them over at govan and their hordes ? This is a Celtic blog about Celtic. If we give the authorities no reason to attack us then we can point at other teams fans behaviour but until then we need to fix our own problems.
We didnt stop paying tax and ni just cos they stopped.
We lead and they have always trailed behind so forget them.
Don’t sack McCoist!!
“If I have a budget of £3million and Celtic have a budget of £20m then it would be extremely difficult to compete with them, an enormous task,” the £850,000-a-year Ibrox boss explained. “Rangers and Celtic have always had the highest budgets.”
kitalba,
I find your last post rather strange. slaved your kids to bigotry? What kind of bigotry? I agree that when rangers return we will be back to the same old panto. We are in limbo at the moment. Fans are turning away in their droves. I don’t think this team are any worse to watch than some of the Strachan versions with Telfer and Caldwell etc. In fact I think this team would give any of the last versions a game. (striker would make a difference)
That said. Bigotry? 60,000 paying customers subscribed to that panto bigotry before. 60,000 will do it again and it will be cranked up all the more by the events now and in the last two years.
Bigotry though? We all seem to love that. Keep turning and churning through the seasons with rangers back in and the same placemen at the SFA holding their necks above the waterline.
I wouldn’t call that Bigotry I’d call that stupidity.
If you want to make a difference then turn up now not when rangers return.
You are being played by the press and the PR spin merchants aided by the idiots on here who think that a flag or a flare is a big issue.
When folk couldn’t feed their families that was an issue. When folk were told they couldn’t applied for jobs because of their religion that was an issue. That was sectarian. That was bigotry.
The most important thing to me is the continuation of Celtic in it’s strongest form. Please do not confuse the mini drama being played out on Provos and Pyros with the end point we should all be looking at.
ffm.. i walk up the gallowgate to CP every home game and have never had so much as a second glance from the police.
We are developing a victim mentality here and its unhealthy.
You have your view on it and i have mine and we are both correct obviously… I am just more correct (haha.. joke)
Have a good christmas mate
Neganon
I agree. Third Christmas in a row where no Celtic merchandise will be opened in the Awe Naw household. I will watch on Thursday. My second domestic game this season. Hope its better officiated than the Hibs 1.1 game.
I just heard on SKY that Celtic security contacted ICT security and not the Saints. Is this true ? If so nobody can complain. You get what you pay for ? Or are the security staff on more than the minimum ?
As we play ICT next it begs the question why is it acceptable in Inverness and not Perth ? Is it just a case of good PR for the polis ?
Stop press: banners now allowed according to SKY news not sky news sports.
HH
kitalba
11:32 on
24 December, 2013
Auldheid:
Please… What is the difference between the SPL/SFL 5 way agreement? I hope there is one.
======================
There is only one agreement as far as I’m aware between Scottish Premier League, Scottish Football Association, Scottish Football League, RFC 2012 PLC (in liquidation) and Rangers Football Club Ltd. ( I had to get the parties from P McConville’s site)
What we do not know is whether there was an earlier attempt at an agreement that kept them in the SPL that the SFA tried to arrange but SPL clubs rejected (I suspect there might have been but know that Celtic thought this undermined sporting integrity and of course they voted against )
The agreement that did emerge was after SPL and SFL clubs rejected any parachuting and I doubt Celtic would have got involved in that discussion or even had any right to as the decision was all within SFA powers, the SPL having said No Entry..
robcfc11,
We don’t have a problem within our support. By law of averages, we havdm the odd old or young ned like any crowd of 1000+ .
There is no justification for the harassment of our support.
But get used to it. We’re just a trial run- seen as a troublesome left wing group by this establishment. A small hurdle in the way of their goosestepping march to authoritarian police state. And it happened under your watch as you agreed that cheeky banner was offensive.
FFM – I’m the only conspiracy theorist in the village), Police state? Have you read the white paper then? All because you and a few others can’t sing about the provos and some pyromaniacs cannie have their way?
robcfc11 – i’ve never been stopped (well not for a while !) either but i have seen many of the celtic support stopped/anotagonised/victimised –
At a meeting last week and in consideration of the safety requirements of the match and based on the risk assessment provided by Police Scotland on their current intelligence of potential disorder at the game, St Johnstone FC and Celtic FC endorsed a Police Scotland suggestion that a ban be placed on flags and banners for the match between the clubs at McDiarmid Park on Boxing Day.
This was on the basis that, regrettably, flags and banners have been used as cover for the letting off of flares, smoke bombs and other pyrotechnics at games throughout Scotland this season.
With Celtic FC representatives keen to avoid a repeat of the recent scenes at Fir Park and with St Johnstone FC mindful of the fact that smoke bombs have been let off by our own supporters this season, both clubs endorsed the Police Scotland recommendation for this specific game.
Both clubs have since received representations for their supporters on this matter and Celtic FC in particular has had extensive discussions with their main supporters’ representatives and has been assured that their supporters will back their Club in the right manner.
Further discussion has today taken place between all parties and a request from the clubs made to Police Scotland that the ban be lifted has been accepted. Safety remains of paramount importance to both clubs and the match will be managed with this in mind and with Police Scotland having reviewed this policy, the two clubs are now putting their faith in all supporters that they shall support their respective teams in a manner which befits what should be a great game of football on a special date in the football calendar.
However, it should be noted that as is the case at every game and in line with Ground Regulations, no flags on canes or sticks will be permitted and any offensive banner or inappropriate behaviour anywhere in the ground will not be tolerated.
With the rigorous search policy which will be in place and a busy road network expected, supporters are encouraged to come early – turnstiles will open at 1.45pm
We reiterate Celtic’s sentiments regarding the excellent relationship that exists between the two clubs and we look forward to working together along with other agencies in ensuring an enjoyable spectacle on Boxing Day.