We have spoken before that preliminary positions are being established ahead of the much-anticipated outcome of HM Revenue and Customs tribunal against Rangers with the possibility that, in the event the decision goes in favour of HMRC, the company could go into liquidation. This weekend brought a fresh attempt to pitch a positive scenario in favour of Rangers.
One newspaper sought solace in the case Parma, stating that the Italian club was allowed to re-emerge in Serie A after going out of business in 2004.
Unfortunately this is a complete misrepresentation of the facts, as far as Parma is concerned, precedent points to an entirely different outcome. Parma went into administration on 28 April 2004 after Parmalat, the dairy company which owned a majority of their shares, also went into administration. Parma remained in administration for three years before emerging after a successful restructuring of their debts. The club was then bought by a new company – but crucially – continuity of football operations was possible because there was no liquidation and debts were restructured in a way consistent with prevailing administration laws, that allowed a company to continue trading.
This, however, is not the end of the precedent Parma can offer Neil Doncaster and his SPL board. In 1968 AC Parma went into liquidation and disappeared from existence. They are an ex-football club, to use a phrase I can see creeping into the local lexicon soon.
Shortly after the failure and permanent disappearance of AC Parma, another club, AC Parmense, who were newly promoted into Sere D, changed their livery to match their better known former-neighbours and changed name to AC Parma. It was this club, AC Parma-formerly-known-as-AC Parmenese, who were promoted through the divisions and went on to win three European trophies.
Precedent from Italy is clear: if a large SPL club is liquidated an opportunity exists for Clyde FC to change their name, ditch the white shirts, rent a large, vacant, stadium and try to work their way through the leagues. Just as Airdrie United-formerly-known-as-Clydebank, are attempting to do.
There are no free tickets to the elite level of Scottish football.
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Declan Is Neil Lennon 1888 Hates being 2nd says:
23 January, 2012 at 12:39
i dont like any of this business stuff. i dont understand it. all i know is the league would be rubbish with no rangers. not many of our fans would stay loyal if we didnt have 2 old firm games to watch every year. we might get a good lau8gh for a while but we would soon think it isnt that funny i reckon. thats why that truth4767 guy is right. we need to look at the bigger photo. a quick laugh now isnt worth it. i mean guys in the paper are saying how it is going to be. surely folk on here dont think they know better than guys who have been writing and been at the sharp side of football for decades?
Declan – still cant make up my mind…. are you a lurker or are you still at school???
Celtic as a club, business, team, supporters, players, etc DO NOT and WILL NOT NEED rANGERs…. no old firm – not in our name!!!!
Declan, son should you not be back in class by now?
See when you go back, can you ask them to help you out to tell the difference between loyal and faithful? :-)
HH
CRC
Deccy Bhoy…good to see you posting again.
I toatlly agree with you regarding the scribes in the papers. They know much more than you and I.
Don’t be put off by the cyber bullies |I know you are a staunch loyal Celtic fan]
Lads do you honestly think the media in this country would take the same stance if this was us that cheated for years, no neither do i.
They must be punished and if they aren’t then the game in this country is totally corrupt.
smassingmilkbottles – thank compadre. i wont let them chase me away. i just tell it like it is. i see myself as the conshunse of the club. somebody needs to ask the hard questions of the likes of the board. remember the willo window? things could be much worse if we dont pay attenshun to the likes of traynor and the laughed at keevins. they havent been at the top of their game for so long for nothing.
Paul67 23 January, 2012 at 12:57
“Honest Mistake, not really put my mind to your question, but for a start, as a creditor, HMRC can apply to have the administrator replaced and appoint their own man, with his own timetable.
Any phoenix needs a quick turnaround. HMRC could be in a position to spoil this.”
Does that mean the HMRC have special powers in prepack? From what I’ve been able to deduce is that the SIP16 is presented to the creditors as an afterthought after the deal has been done. If they object to the deal that the administrator has put together then it’s court action after the newco has been formed.
You can spot the Hun posters a mile off – their lack of grasp of their Queen’s English is deplorable. It took me a good three or four attempts at reading “Declan’s” initial post to understand it.
And even then, I’m still not sure…
HH
Giggs
Afternoon bhoys, due to my geographical abode ive managed to get to most of the away games in the Europa league this season.
So what part of we need the huns does that come under?
Perhaps i could have been watching C/L football this season if bills and taxes had been paid.
I don’t buy my season ticket to watch the two Hun games at Paradise. I hate being in their vile odious company.
I buy tickets to watch Celtic. Now I do enjoy when we take on the Barca, Milan, Juve even the Manures of this world.
I have enjoyed watching many a world class act perform at Paradise, but………
I buy my season tickets and CL packages and SF and Final tickets to Watch and support Celtic.
If I never saw another Hun game I would be grateful. Stuff them and their hate filled support.
We can live without what they provide.
EC67
Bosnian Zlatan Muslimovic interest dropped by Ragers, they thought he said Bosman.
Declan Is Neil Lennon 1888 Hates being 2nd says:
23 January, 2012 at 13:04
I agree again. Traynor knows his was round a typewtiter. Keevins helped right Tommy Burns’s auto. I think he is much malined.
Tis good to see sumone postin sence on hear
Giggsyboy – i have never been good at spellnig. i want good at school and i am just learnin how to use the computer thing. just because i wasnt good at learnig doesnt mean i am a hun
Hullbhoy Hullbhoy
@ @fritzagrandold Haha,Traynor wrote his eulogy to Murray last May and never mentioned the HMRC once http://blogs.dailyrecord.co.uk/jimtraynor/2011/05/murray-rhetoric-gambles-boasts.html
Ole Mo (the Bounce) Bangura has a ‘hair do’ rival, if the Djibril Cisse in advance talks with Celtic rumour is true.
Declan
If you carry on like this you’re going to kill MWD.
That phonetic spelling nonsense they trialled in the mid-70s has got a lot to answer for.
Conshunce?
Getting a headache even trying to decipher his posts,not helped by an uncontrollable urge to teach him how to use a spellcheck facility.
Which would probably go into meltdown when faced with the earlier example….
If he’s a troll,then Jack really is scraping the bottom of the barrel. If he’s a Tim,then what happened to the guid Catholic education we all speak of?
By the way,anyone else notice that the spammers seem to have chucked it since 4767 and Declan arrived on the scene?
Obviously a coincidence…..
Does anyone know what the average attendance has been this season? Looking at the EFS website it took a huge drop during Mowbray’s time, wondering if it’s back up…?
Obviously the recession played/plays a part but I wonder just how much TM cost the club with his brand of football.
Declan has to be Awe Naw
Declan,
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again – you’re not fooling me. You’re a clever guy (or gal) and soon I hope you’ll reveal your ‘usual’ blog name.
tal!
Jobo
Paul 67
“There are no free tickets to the elite level of Scottish football.”
Perhaps this will signal a return of that football plea from my childhood ….
“Mister gonnae gies a lift ower?”
oh deary deary me
stop it…ive sprayed my can of lunchtime limeade all over my widescreen monitor.
Declan Is Neil Lennon 1888 Hates being 2nd
SmashingMilkBottles ….. What is your favourite Celtic memory?
Go on…. bring yourself to say it!
HAIL HAIL
SPELLNIG?
Oh,ffs……
RT @polishturnstile: Rabiu Ibrahim has been granted a work permit to work in the UK and is free to play for #Celtic
Spellers of the world untie !!!
Declan IANL1888HB2nd – keep it coming mate, you are a veritable sage and clearly the most literate, level headed, and clear thinking poster on the site right now.
Great Stuff, keep these nail-on-head posts coming.
Would love to know your thoughts re the tainted trophies and how that issue should be dealt with?
Hopefully in the fullness of time some wag with better IT skills than me can adapt this classic…
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vuW6tQ0218
I think we need to take a step back and look at what Phil has posted.
The first thing which strikes me is that there is no authority quoted for his view that the “Newco” would not suffer a 10 point penalty if it were allowed back into the league. I assume, although he does not develop this point, that this would also apply in the event that “Newco” entered the 3rd Division of the SFL. Phil does not say where he gets this argument from. I would be very interested to know if it comes from his own reading of the rules and articles or from somewhere else. The reason for this is becoming more and more important.
I have posted on this matter several times reccently. In my opinion there is a developing confusion which surrounds the concepts used in the rules and articles of the SPL. I believe that this is due to the quite understandable interest in the corporate structure of, for want of a better expression, Rangers Football Club. I feel it is also contributed to by the use of the word “Newco”, and it is for that reason I use it within parenthesis.
The articles define a club as an “undertaking of an association football club”. Note that the word “company” does not appear in this definition. This is no doubt due to the fact that some clubs (more than others) have a complex structure of ownership. They cannot simply exist as one company but as a number of different companies held together by various legal obligations. This is a helpful definition to use as it is gets round the issue of the corporate persona trumping all problems arising from administration or liquidation.
The rules on points deduction following an administration event are contained at paras. 6.8 to 6.20 of the Rules. They indicate that a 10 point deduction will be made against a club which suffers an insolvency event. This will be incurred either during the present season or at the beginning of the next season. What is important to remember is that these rules refer to the club and not to a company. The word “undertaking” has such a wide ambit that the mere change of a company which owns the club does not have any effect on the rules to which that club is to be subjected. Further support for this view can be seen at para. 6.10 where there is provision for a 10 point penalty to be imposed for each insolvency event during one season. A casual reader might enquire why a club which has a new company owning it but which then suffers a further insovency event could possibly suffer a futher penalty when the “Oldco” had disappeared. The answer is the the SPL Rules were designed to prevent just that eventuality from taking place. Clubs will be punished – not their corporate owners – if they experience an insolvency event at some point.
We have already seen disinformation coming from the SPL on these issues. You may recall a few weeks ago that Paul67 had been told the vote on “Newco” joining the SPL was to be taken by the Board. As I posted at the time, this is a legal impossibilty as Article 14 makes clear. I feel there are considerable difficulties for “Newco” getting into the SPL. I accept that this is my view and that I am more than capable of being wrong. However, if we read about possible scenarios involving the entry of “Newco” to the SPL, we should ask ourselves if this is correct. Any view which does not refer explicitly to the rules and articles of the SPL has to be scrutinised intensely. Paul67 has done just that with the Parma case – a lot of ham if you ask me.
So the next time someone says what will be happening to “Newco”, just ask them to point to the provision in the rules and articles which backs up their argument.
And then see what they do.
Rabiu Ibrahim has been granted a work permit.
Welcome to the biggest club in the world Rabiu
King Vic
Wining the ’68 Cup winers cup….also noan as the Big Ears
There are many who say that Ragers cannot be allowed to rejoin SPL without real punishment because it would just lead to other clubs doing likewise.
I suspect that an instant re-entry will be accompanied by a change in rules to prevent it happening again. This will be presented as lessons having been learned.
The phrase “Willo Window” gives it away…….come on Dec, who are you?
Hello All
Just heard that Rabiu Ibrahim has been granted a permit to work in the UK, and is now free to play for the famous
Glasgow Celtic,
So lets see him lenny
mm
Shirley Declan is one of us at the wind up,no. I know some thick huns but this is too obvious.
Sorry Bourne
missed your post, you beat me to it
mm
Celtinental – what i think about that is what is done is done. i dont think there is any point in whipping a dead sheep. no point in that at all
Thanks for the birthday wishes and to BJmac for letting it slip :-))
Starry
I’m the same age as Joe :-)
Awe Naw
Compared to most of the CQN posters I’m positively embrionic :-)
hoopeddreams,
But the NewCo is exactly that – a new entity, a new club. It’s not the old club with new owners. And the NewCo won’t suffer an insolvency event, so how can it be punished?