No excuses, Celtic were poor and deserved nothing more than they got at Kilmarnock yesterday. Too often a new central defensive partnership looked for a forward pass and were faced with statuesque targets. Kilmarnock went man-to-man and were mostly able to keep the contest in the middle of the park until very late in the game.
Kyogo, as ever, was the exception, continually moving, dropping deep to offer an outlet despite invariably being fouled. Daizen Maeda has sufficient energy to get up and down the field all day, but we saw little of this. He and Liel Abada were often uninvolved onlookers, waiting for the ball to work through central midfield. We are left pondering if this was the plan.
One promising interchange between Matt O’Riley and Odin Holm, almost set up Kyogo, offered a glimpse of what was meant to be, if it had been replicated a few more times, the result would have been different. As we have discussed before, our midfield is young and nimble, sometimes heft and experience is required.
Yang (64 mins) and Sead Haksabanovic (75 mins) significantly picked up Celtic’s pace when they came on, credit to Kilmarnock, however, they had a lead to defend and were intent on doing so.
The goal was scored when Celtic were temporarily reduced to 10 men, Greg Taylor was off being treated for a cut, sustained when he was elbowed on the head. The referee and VAR apparently missed the incident, a clear swing of the elbow. Officials also missed a late trip on Sead Haksabanovic inside the box. It was a penalty in any other coloured shirt, but it wasn’t something our general play deserved.
Early in his first tenure Brendan Rodgers suffered defeat to Lincoln Red Imps, a setup which cost him nothing. This one will sting a tad longer and asks just as many questions.
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COYBIG
I know how much everyone loves a challenge so here’s a real one for you. Clearly not EVERY player underperformed so you just need to identify 3 please. Thank you.
SENCELPOTY@GMAIL.COM
“it wasn’t something our general play deserved”. Yes ,our general play was crap but that is irrelevant in the context of these incidents . A red card foul is a red card foul , a penalty is a penalty , I could add to that, offside is offside .
Our performance and the performance of the officials (onfield and var) are two separate issues , both of which need addressed .
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F3-q-53WQAAt5mj?format=jpg&name=large
“Angeball” is gone, forget about it, it is in the past. Back Brendan and the Bhoys (financially and spiritually) let no negativity creep in, remember we have no god given right to win every trophy.
Rodgers doesn’t look that up for it to me. Never go back?
A team full of young boys with an eye to future sell on to EPL is also a reversion to pre-Ange.
if plan A is not working ,change to another , oh, but when you only have a plan A your stuffed.
Ange signed very specific players to play a very bespoke system. So unique, that we gave it a name.
It was discussed on here, few seasons back, that when he finally left it would take quite an overhaul to unpick all he had knitted together and start again. Alas, that departure was quicker and more unexpected than would have allowed for much planning.
Brendan is a top drawer manager. However, the team doesn’t feel like his picks yet. Even the season ending signings weren’t obvious Ridgers choices.
The rebuild will happen. Though it may take more time, and more resources, than first thought.
Many of us are not blessed with patience.
Not bothered about going out of the League Cup but the injuries to CCV and Hatate are a concern for the next matches and the CL.
The team is crying out for an experienced defensive midfielder to enable Calmac to play further forward. But our board won’t buy a player unless he is young and has sell-on value. This is our much-vaunted player trading model that will probably lead to another debacle in the CL. Imagine playing a top European team with two rookie central defenders.
I’m already over yesterday. I’m not saying I’m glad we lost, but I’m happy that all talk of trebles are done now. We can focus on the real measure of success – winning the league and getting points in europe.
4 points in a CL group is infinitely more important than the scottish league cup.
No excuses now, let’s get quality in and keep our fingers crossed for a kind draw in europe.
From Previous Thread…
BIG JIMMY on 21ST AUGUST 2023 8:52 AM
“But that’s because you turn up and play. You don’t get any second chances.
“And now the lads realise that in Cup competitions you have to be on the money, regardless of where you go, what stadium it is or what opponent it is.
……………
ABOVE is just PART of what CALMAC had to say after the defeat…
I find it to be a wee bit Patronising…” and NOW the lads realise that in Cup competitions, you have to be on the money etc ”
Did NO ONE TELL the ” Lads” BEFORE the game, that it was a Cup Competition ?
Why did CALMAC use the words” AND NOW the Lads realise”…..WHY does it take a defeat for the Lads BEFORE they realise its a Cup KNOCK OUT Competition
Sorry CALMAC, but you are spouting EMPTY Words there.
Were NONE of the Celtic players FULLY AWARE BEFORE the kick off yesterday, that it was a ” KNOCK OUT CUP TIE” ?
HH
I see Cantwell out trolling us after yesterday’s result. Part of football and his prerogative. However, unless we get that key midfield area sorted out he’ll have the freedom of Ibrox on 2 September. As Johan Cruyff used to say ………win the midfield and you control the game.
Lose the corporate driven politeness towards referees and officialdom.
McInnes started working the ref THREE DAYS before the game.
We were mute before, during and after.
Until that happens – we (including me) can moan all we want about Muir and his ilk.
Has the same impact as a fart during a gale.
Yang wears the wrang boots 🥾
PeterLatchfordbelly
Is AJ a downgrade on JJ ?
In less than 45 mins (part on plastic) you have decided Yang is less than Jota ?
Is Holm (Norway poty) less than the partially used and injury prone Mooy ?
Is the much maligned starfelt now Maldini in his prime compared to 2 young international CH’s we have just recruited ?
You can tell all that after seeing these guys play for 90 mins and most of that on plastic.
Never mind the Aussie winger and the others we have not seen yet, or bought.
You clearly should be in the football management profession
Oh wait you can’t actually name any players we could sign who would do better !!!!
Ah that’s the problem. My old man always said he never employed folk who could only tell him all the problems……only the ones who could follow up with an attempt at a solution.
Glendalystonsils
Couldn’t agree more even if this was the worst performance of any Celtic team in our history clear and obvious decisions, particularly with the assistance of VAR, a team does not need to play well or ‘deserve’ anything to expect officials on and off the pitch to do their job, they didn’t, incompetence or cheating?
Before Sunday the dross, was only the deadwood.
If we are continuing with 2 wingers then we need players with ability, not runners.
We play against teams who sit in.
Abada and Maeda rely on space as they technically poor.
Haksa and Yang looked better because they are skillful.
I was gutted when Maeda signed the new contract as he would continue to play as a winger for us, whereas his former club and his national side used him through the middle where he had space.
All the talk of Abada moving was probably nonsense as top clubs will see he’s not a natural winger or centre forward. Again I was disappointed as he didn’t move on.
Midfield is one paced without Hatate.
We replaced Mooy with a B league player from Korea who looked like he won a competition to play in a match against Bilbao.
Taylor was really good as an inverted full back but his deficiencies are clear to see in his left back role under Rodgers.
No wonder Rodgers is saying that we need players with ability.
Some lads will still maintain those end of season league games ladt April and May were dead rubbers but the squad players who were playing for their places had plenty of skin in those games. Just ask Kobayshi, his Celtic career looks to be over. Likewise, Ralston and Bernabie should be moved on. If Berny can’t shift an appalling bad Taylor from the team then he’s of absolutely no value.
We turned up to Ibrox last May without CCV and got blown away. If he’s out for Ibrox then please God we get AJ back and a new LB in before then. Going to Ibrox with Ralston and Taylor, missing CCV is enough to break out in a cold sweat.
Uncle Jimmy / An Dun
Spot on with those posts.
Onward and upward.
Just the wee challenge of getting over Angeball and how much joy it gave us. I have never enjoyed going to the football as much as I did in that 2 year period. Fast, high risk and high reward.
Hopefully once we get a structure and style and personnel all aligned we will be more effective in terms of big game results with Brendan.
We have 2 wins from 2 and hopefully can get 3 on Saturday. We have time to work on things. The other lot don’t.
Good afternoon all from Ryan’s Bar. And a fine day tis.
In an attempt at equality
The Scottish Referees and VAR assistants can Learn a lot from the Women’s World Cup
Var used effectively and communicated clearly
Mind the guys and girls at the Women’s World Cup were being honest and fair
It will never catch on in Scotland
Oh and BTW we were very poor
VAR apart Kilmarnock were up for it we were not
67ECW
I think I can recall Brendan saying his objective was to take the best of what he was inheriting, make some improvements and add some strength. There was no talk of a squad overhaul or having to dismantle and rebuild a team that had just won a treble.
When CCV, AJ, Hatate and Oh are fit we are in a pretty similar position to last season player wise. Only Jota should be badly missed. CS was fine but the two new guys should be capable of being at least his equal.
On occasions when Ange made 4-5 unforced changes to our starting XI there was plenty of criticism on here, we looked poor and the talk was of a weak squad. As well as losing Jota, Brendan has been forced to play without 3 definite starters and his only alternative to Kyogo in Oh. A back 4 yesterday that have hardly had time to say hello did ok.
My major worry is how poor the midfield is functioning and that is not because Mooy has left. We played plenty games without him in previous two seasons. Clubs now man mark Calmac and it is effective in neutralising the engine room.
Brendan deserves time and will get it. I hope.
McPhail Bhoy .
We’ve all seen the video clips and still pictures of the incidents . The same pictures the officials see , which emphatically rules out incompetence .
Ron Bacardi
Burnley 78
Was as much about their fans as ours re the trouble.
Our bus had 80 folk on it going down. It was a 54 seater. Absolute bonkers.
We had beaten rangers 3-1 the previous Saturday hence the numbers travelling but for me it was the all time low point in my Celtic watching career. The whole of 78 we were dreadful and getting worse. It culminated in losing to an English tier 2 team because we had missed Europe due to finishing the previous season on 36 points from 36 game.
At Xmas 78 we were 7th in the 10 team league with a couple of games in hand. The only saving grace was John Greig was manager at rangers at the time.
Somehow we galvanised and went on a run leading to the 10 men winning the league on May 21 1979. It shows how quick fortunes can turn. Within 16 months of Burnley we were a George McLuskey sitter away from beating Real Madrid in the European Cup and reaching the semi finals.
“Kilmarnock went man-to-man ”
————-
Yeah – that can be awkward to play against but it shouldn’t have been a surprise for a McInnes team.
Get into positions where your marker doesn’t want to go. Needs better rotations though.
More worrying was the ball-watching at the goal. How often are we guilty of this? Needs fixing or the CL will be a shambles.
Previously in most games we were met with a standard 10 behind the ball. This has now moved on to 10 behind the ball with agricultural tackling which will be ignored by the people who are paid to keep order and follow the rules of the game. Whichever way you want to look at it, we have to recruit accordingly and I would suggest that there is no way that players like Abada, Maeda or O’Riley would be in a Martin O’Neill team.
You can add a sprinkling of young players but imho we have gone too far and those who despise our existance are making capital because of it. If we are only to be a transit camp of buy cheap sell big I may find something else to amuse myself.
https://twitter.com/tirnaog_09/status/1693504857829683295?t=LH6yGuBzuA0AVHtSk0MNyg&s=19
Celtic scored 12 goals and conceded 1 goal in 3 games on plastic last season
Anyone else screaming for CalMac to get up the park where he can do some damage, especially with Reo not available? That deep lying role does not suit him and he’s certainly no Broonie.
I’ve had a bad feelings since Brendan has come back and I am not sure why. He should be a trade up on Ange in terms of tactics and player improvement, but why do I have a sinking feeling when I see him on the TV? He looks like a stepford version of himself he’s in the job 6 weeks and already looks fed up.
I don’t buy the Peter stuff, Brendan has said he has DDs 100% backing if there was an issue like before he would walk. Doesn’t need tbe money and was taking a year out.
So what’s wrong? He looks like ge regrets coming back to me. There I said it.
I hope he proves me wrong, yesterday was only one game but nothing has improved, injuries have hobbled us no doubt, the sfa will do everything in their power to hobble us further, but surely Brendan knew this. So what’s changed in 6 weeks?
I have been patient and was over the moon when he came back, but why the gut feeling?
HH not trying to be a downer, just puzzled.csc
KLV
Whether we deserved to win or not is irrelevant. The Huns and their refereeing brethren might think it’s funny but L bet Viaplay don’t! I wonder much revenue this jolly wheeze has cost them.
The SFA don¡t give a f+ck. The Huns will happlly fill Hampden for them, but any future sponsor will need to have a serious word with those clowns in black.
Paul67 – “As we have discussed before, our midfield is young and nimble”
20, 22…yes.
30….nope. Regressing at that age and need to find a solution to ensure he continues to be effective. Man marking him out of the game feels very easy now.
Nimble – you’re having a laugh.
Whatever happened to pace and power?
HH
AN DÚN on 21ST AUGUST 2023 12:18 PM
I’m already over yesterday. I’m not saying I’m glad we lost, but I’m happy that all talk of trebles are done now. We can focus on the real measure of success – winning the league and getting points in europe.
4 points in a CL group is infinitely more important than the scottish league cup.
No excuses now, let’s get quality in and keep our fingers crossed for a kind draw in europe.
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Well said and completely agree. I mentioned last week that our most important game out of the next 2 was St J at home. It’s imperative we head to Ibrox maintaining our 3 point advantage and looking to have a hefty goals for column to boot.
KLV.
Kinda like a bloke that went back to his old squeeze after a spell away, cos it used to be a buzz way back when.
Then after the first couple of brendan rogers, he remember her harsh laugh, the stale, smoky breath, the leg stubble, attitude to money and the after-effects of a curry on her digestive tract kinda thing.
Or am I oversharing ;)
It’s hard not to look for something being amiss.
Mibby we’re just an entitled bunch, not that used to losing.
The Thin Blue Line
The picture of Alan Muir ‘shaking’ McInnes’s hand and laughing heartily tells you all you need to know about Muir. Even his linesman looks more than eager to congratulate him. Strangely there was no greeting from McInnes yesterday about the referee’s performance as his wont when we normally cuff them.
QUADROPHENIAN
I don’t know. I’m 45 and I have seen us win a lot and lose a lot so I am pretty balanced. I get the changes on the park style etc.
My post is purely a gut feeling. We were winning and I didn’t want to post it and be Jonny downer.csc. It materialised yesterday unfortunately, park sfa were all in play as we knew they would be, but why the lack of fight and for a better word care?.
KLV