Today we have a guest writer, Archie Macpherson, Scotland’s most celebrated broadcaster. Archie started broadcasting for the BBC in the 1960s and was the authoritative voice of football commentaries, and comment, for decades thereafter. He was co-commentator for our first European Cup win and remains a regular newspaper columnist and TV contributor.
I had a brief conversation with Archie last month when he categorically stated that Jock Stein was best manager Scotland has ever produced was. Pleased, though I was, to hear this, in the light of accolades earned by Sir Alex Ferguson, I asked him if he could substantiate his claim.
These questions are enormously subjective but few have the breadth of perspective, not to mention the analytical capacity, to tackle this one properly. This is the article he offered to write for us on the subject:
Jock and Fergie, by Archie Macpherson
If there had been no Jock Stein there would have been no Sir Alex Ferguson. It may sound a contentious statement to make but even though it is tempting to play around with history according to your own beliefs and perceptions I would stand by that as a sound interpretation of the way the respective merits of these men can be set against each other.
It helps in this matter if you can lay aside the achievements of those men from the record books and instead consider their personalities and the context in which they plied their trade.
When Jock came to Celtic as manager in 9th March 1965, he fully understood from his past experience there as a player and coach that he would find a club desperate to achieve a commanding status in Scottish football. The frustration they felt only reflected that which their massive support similarly endured around that period. They were massive underachievers.
He also knew from his own background that his task would not simply be about selecting a team, then motivating them, but about radically overhauling the perception the public in general had about the club and which stemmed mainly from the constructs of the media.
It may be difficult for a current generation to fully comprehend this but Celtic then were simply perceived as bit players in a drama where the lead actor came from Govan and always took the curtain-calls. Stein changed all that. He took on the press-pack like he had been sent in from the city’s sanitation department to fumigate.
If you didn’t turn up on the dot for his press conferences then the door was slammed on your face no matter the size of your ego. His television interviews, unlike the passive posture of that likeable man his predecessor Jimmy McGrory, were often truculent and challenging. All of this concentrated the mind of those who wrote and spoke about Celtic. They would think twice about saying anything that might offend the big man. He was strengthening Celtic’s image and, as a by-product of that, securing the self-esteem within the playing staff which previously had been sadly lacking.
And where was Sir Alec at this time? He was watching, observing. I saw him sitting in the lounge of Malpensa Airport Milan in 1970, in the aftermath of the European Cup Final there, amidst thousands of Celtic supporters, which given his Rangers connections only indicated his deep interest in what Jock was doing.
Fergie to his credit was a learner. When he went to Old Trafford it was not to a club about which there was lack of public respect. It was initial lack of respect for himself which made him take up arms against his detractors. To go to a Fergie press-conference was to see a recreation of Jock at the height of his powers. And from being beside Jock in the dressing-room, and on the bench at Scotland games, he absorbed Jock’s handling of men which could range from wrath to wit. The so-called ‘hairdryer’ treatment Fergie handed out only simulated what Jock could do to make the walls of a dressing-room bulge when it got up his hump.
Where they differed enormously as men was that Jock did not harbour grudges in quite the same way as Fergie. Jock did have his difficulties with the BBC initially but never refused to deal with them. Fergie barred them for over a decade, then got an award from the same people. So I am suggesting that although you cannot compare the achievements made in entirely different footballing environments, Fergie served his apprenticeship in the Stein era by consequently adopting much of the big man’s methodology. Jock was the ice-breaker. Fergie was the follow up.
In that sense, as the one was indispensable to the success of the other, I rate Jock as the master of the two.
My thanks to Archie for his contribution.
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Seville
Well just now we have lots of non-scoring forwards… Why not have lots of scoring ones…
ANSWER Q 4
Hapoel Tel Aviv.
Back in the game!
I thought Seville was further south than Tel Aviv. I don’t get out much.
Doc
22:08 on
I ok smarty pants, just wait till round 2 I feel a roll coming on
Scores so far:
Can I have Raspberries 26
burghbhoy 26
Doc 14
Eddie 20
Kayal 24
Jeg er 20
View fae 10
Fields 22
SFTB 2
Q 5 (2 points each correct answer)
I scored on my Hoops debut, but who did I score against:
George McCluskey
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink
Chris Sutton
Jorge Cadette
Brian McClair
Pierre Van Hooijdonk
Big-Cup Winner
Do I not get more than 2 for spelling Hapoel right?
Q 5 (2 points each correct answer)
I scored on my Hoops debut, but who did I score against:
George McCluskey Hibs
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink Aberdeen
Chris Sutton Dundee UTD
Jorge Cadette Aberdeen
Brian McClair Dundee
Pierre Van Hooijdonk Hearts
Valur Reykavic
Hibs
Dundee United
Aberdeen
Partick Thistle
Hearts
George McCluskey-Rangers
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink- Falkirk
Chris Sutton – Dundee Utd
Jorge Cadette- Aberdeen
Brian McClair- Dundee
Pierre Van Hooijdonk- hearts
Tony Watt blessing himself after each goal tonight,
That’s him not coming back to Celtic, the media campaign will have Celtic banning him :-)
Hail Hail
Just heard the tragic news about Ian Redford. Very sad.
sorry in a q5 for a bit of fun..plz ignore
??
Hibs
Dundee United
Dons
??
Hearts
George McCluskey – Hearts
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink – Hibs
Chris Sutton – Dundee Utd.
Jorge Cadette – Aberdeen
Brian McClair – Partick
Pierre Van Hooijdonk – Hearts
Keep the Faith!
Hail Hail!
Rangers
Mitherwell
Dundee Utd
Aberdeen
Motherwell
Hearsts
rangers Aberdeen Hearts valure hibs dun Utd
Right here goes, think I was at most of.them.
McCluskey Valur, Big Jan Hibs, Sutton Dundee Utd, Cadete Aberdeen (as loud as I’ve ever heard Celtic Park), McClair Partick Thistle, Pierre Hearts
Rangers
Hibs
Dundee U
.
Dundee
Motherwell
Burnley78 @ 21.43 hrs,
By your own admission you have not listened to or heard HK, you are only going by hearsay.
To make such a statement as “no one would think any different except sun and daily record readers” without having first hand knowledge is well—–rash.
I have no wish to stick up or agree with some of Mr Keevans ridiculous comments, but I recognise that he has a job to do and as we still live in a democracy, I will always defend freedom of speech and therefore his right to say them.
Incidentally the combined readership ( not circulation ) of the Sun ( Scottish ) and the DR in Scotland is circa 1.73 million adults. Quite a lot of dafties pressing buttons.
HH, and apologies if the quiz is still on.
fieldofdrams
22:22 on
I think we broke the world record for noise at a football game that night according to % Live
5
How the f. Did I forget Cadete.
eddieinkirkmichael
Is that in order ?
George McCluskey Rangers
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink Aberdeen
Chris Sutton Dundee UTD
Jorge Cadette Aberdeen
Brian McClair Dundee
Pierre Van Hooijdonk Hearts
Absolutely gutted for a fine human being who died today.
Ian Redford you were a gentleman and a fine one at that.
Your demons can’t hurt you no more,brother.No more dancing with that black dog of depression.
May perpetual light shine upon your soul.
God Bless your family left behind.
Rest in Peace.
Eddieink
read a few years ago the hampden crowd broke the sound barrier when joe jordon scored in that world cup gain apparently caused a sonic boom either that or I have a very vivid imagination
McCluskey – Huns (pure guess)
JVOH – Hibs
Sutty – Dundee Utd
Jorge Cadette – Aberdeen
McClair – Partick Thistle
Pierre – Hearts
I remember two things about the night of Cadete’s debut. One was The Noise. Second was learning on my return home that Mrs Fieldofdrams had ‘forgotten’ to video the game. We’re still married but things haven’t been the same.
BIG-CUP-WINNERS
22:26 on
No sorry just the way I remembered them
I blame Charles.
ANSWER Q 5
George McCluskey – FC Valur
Jan Venegoor of Hesselink – Hibernian
Chris Sutton – Dundee United
Jorge Cadette – Aberdeen
Brian McClair – Partick Thistle
Pierre Van Hooijdonk – Hearts
Q6
Who am I ?
I was born in Giussano 1/7/1966. (5 points)
BIG-CUP-WINNERS
22:26 on
you want me to put in order?
Rico Annoni?
Q6
I played for the Hoops. Who am I ?
I was born in Giussano 1/7/1966. (5 points)