Before this Europa League group got underway the trips to Istanbul and Amsterdam looked daunting. Those games produced two credible draws, but things went wildly wrong elsewhere.
Our goal last night was a peach. Dedryck Boyata split the Fenerbahce defence to open up space for Mikael Lustig to cross for Kris Commons, who peeled off his marker to create the space to head home. Unfortunately only one point was collected as we lost another Keystone Cops goal.
Craig Gordon seems to be struck by a lack of conviction this season. His was not the only failing at our repeated corner kick fiascos but letting a ball trickle through his legs as he appeared caught in two minds is indicative of a player who is doubting himself.
You know Kris Commons scores and creates huge goals for Celtic, we’ve discussed it often enough here. Despite his veteran status and apparent ill-fitting to our system he remains by far our most effective player.
For Ronny, it didn’t go wrong in Europe this season against Fenerbahce or Ajax (I’m absolving him of blame for Efe’s error or a last minute breakaway goal at Celtic Park), it went wrong home and away to Molde and Malmo. We appeared to underestimate both. Did the manager have something to prove against fellow Norwegian managers?
Celtic dominated possession stats in all four games against Molde and Malmo but the Scandinavians exploited the acres of space which simply didn’t exist in our games against Ajax, Fenerbahce or Qarabag, for that matter. Ajax, Fenerbahce and Qarabag got the respect they deserved, not so Molde and Malmo.
The failure is, of course, more complicated than that. Jozo missed the bulk of the campaign, while Dedryck is only just beginning to look like a footballer (lovely pass for the goal last night). Scott Allan looks promising, but we’ve not seen enough of him either due to injury.
Curiously, Ronny’s big 2015 No. 1 striker target, Nadir, looks less like a Ronny Deila player than anyone we’ve bought in years. Knowing we were interested in him, I watched his performances against Celtic last season, and made the same observation at the time.
What happens if your keeper’s form falls off a cliff, one of your new defenders doesn’t settle quickly, two other new players miss months through injury, and your new striker doesn’t morph into a different player? You finish bottom of the Europa League group.
Celtic must now consider their strategy for January. Successive transfer windows have left us weaker, not stronger. Identify the reasons, remediate and we can build on the away performances which bookended this Europa League campaign.
Check out the CQNBookstore. There’s 15 great Celtic books and 10 DVDs, you’ll love them.
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Quick Survey
If we could replace only one of Lawwell or Deila
Who would you choose?
A) Lawwell
B) Deila
Greenpinata
Get this straight….im not playing any MSM game.
I’m complaining about RD, because I dont think he is a good coach.
I am not influenced by the MSM…..do you understand?
I am capable of drawing my own conclusions….believe it or not.
HH
Cultsbhoy
If you give me the names of the replacements then I can answer you.
Sorry
HH to you.
The Green Man – do you think Ronny was responsible for the quality in the squad?
Of the Europa Games this year, which do you think we would have won if we had had another manager in situ?
And what do you think the manager would have done to make the difference? Different line up, formation, tactics or motivation?
Genuinely interested.
I think we have performed well in all the Europa games with the obvious exceptions of the Molde games. What happened in the Molde games? I am not sure. I can forgive the away result because all our managers have struggled away from home. I must then look at Molde’s results elsewhere and accept they are a decent team.
GM
Aye, it’s the regurgitating of the msm bollix that really gets me, the same msm that Celtic supports don’t pay any heed to cos they are bias.
When I hear of the alternatives that are spouted, Moyes FFS, dear oh dear, and they think the football is dire under RD.
HH
Cults Bhoy
A) is more a strategic choice as it can change B), whereas B) has no power of A).
HH
CRC
Ps where is C) for Collins
One of the prevailing threads on here is that Celtic are blazing a trail using the moneyball philosophy, sadly Celtic’s application of it, if indeed we are even applying it, is hugely flawed.
Since MON left the club one of the startling things to have happened is how much smaller our players are.
Smaller not only in height, but also in terms of muscle mass, which has an impact on work rate, speed and strength.
If Celtic were properly applying moneyball, they would be focusing on the fundamentals, i.e. scoring goals and stopping goals being scored.
Our attempts to defend corner kicks and free kicks over the past few years fly in the face of moneyball. Even a cursory glance at football stats would tell you that set piece success rate should be a lot less than opponents of ours seem to manage.
Moneyball ought to be applying to the day to day aspects of playing football and not just in transfer values, caused by vastly overinflation due to our proximity to the EPL.
Cultsbhoy
PL should retire.
RD should learn about football.
I wish the two of them would go at the same time.
It is only going to get worse.
HH
Greenpiñata
I’m working on the basis that the status quo isn’t working and that a change is required…
HH
CB
Cults
Neither.
Pedro is doing what he is told, and is doing a grand job for the remit given to him.
Ronny is doing a grand job with his hands tied and being blindfold.
It’s the policy that needs changed.
HH
The Ronny experiment seems to be grinding to a half. The high tempo flee flowing football and pressing game is nowhere to be seen. We are slow and ponderous. Sideways passing and lack of movement is the way we play both in Scotland and in Europe. It is sore on the eyes. On Thursday it took a red card and JF to get our first shot at goal, I think we managed 2/3 and one on target the whole game.
I think Ronny will get to the qualifiers in the summer and then if he fails to get us through he’ll be gone.
Kikinthenakas
Cultsbhoy
My info was that RDs peg was indeed very shaky. Unrest in the dressing room is not helping him and he seems unable to control this
C) Cultsbhoy
:)
Catman,
Was the player going out Logan Bailey? :))
HH
Leftclicktick
Happy anniversary bhud
I’m 26 year in 8 days
So a longer sentence
But we are off and on
Currently off
Hope there’s many happy years to come
Marrakech 10 53
Genuine beer oot o ma mooth moment
Still laughing
Hail Hail
With regard to Celtic’s desire to see a team playing at Ibrox as competitors again.
You cannot play football without opposition. That makes Celtic dependent on other clubs as much as it makes them dependent on us. That is what makes football an industry like no other where the last thing clubs want is a competitor going out of business.
The problem Celtic and I now believe all of Scottish football faces is the idea that it is dependent on one club for its survival.
In trying to save that club and oh how they have tried, the SFA, the media and the club’s themselves have created a Frankenstein monster. An entity that no decent club or supporter would want to face.
The best Celtic can do imo is to campaign for change in the way our game is governed which means a whole new way of thinking and being.
Sadly no one seems capable of providing the kind of leadership necessary to do that although the criminal element that the SFA allowed to retain a foothold in our game are facing criminal charges.
What emerges from that and a final appeal on the BTC case will shape events thereafter.
It’s frustrating to have to wait and we can only keep the pot boiling until the legalities are cleared.
However in the meantime every letter sent to PL about the lack of transparency and accountability in the game is grist to the Celtic mill for change.
After all what is the point of a rise in STs because some folk like to see us play a club from Ibrox if it is met by a decrease from those who refuse to pay to watch a one sided competition governed by events off the field and not on it?
TET
I don’t think we need to worry about Moyes.
They wont pay him what he wants….and he is crap anyway:)
The Scottish Media are beyond redemption.
Just fools who have managed to Bs themselves into hun papers.
They are nothing but brain-dead morons.
HH
Thankfully the plc didn’t sack lenny 18 months into his management at Celtic.
HH
Catman,
If there is unrest in the dressing room, whoever is causing it and for whatever reason has to be shown the door. I’m in the keep Ronny camp myself.
Cultsbhoy
Hypothetically if Change could guarantee instant success on the park and results off the park, then yes I would change both.
As much as I would hate sacking a manager who is top of the league.
Maybe the only thing missing presently is our own magic hat or wand.
Cheers and Hail, Hail.
It’s quite typical of this blog that Celtic supporters who have a different opinion cannot think for themselves, their views are always simply echoing the meeja.
Very easy way to try and discredit or kill off discussion except its doesn’t work.
Many on here have had grave reservations about Ronny’s suitability from day one, but they are just repeating the meeja, how does that work.
My own stance was to give him 18 months, after that 18 months I have come to the conclusion that I don’t see any improvement and that’s enough for me to join the dissenters and call time.
My only reservation is I don’t like the LeGuen factor but I honestly don’t see any improvement so no longer believe there is enough evidence to persist with this experiment.
There is also the problem that whoever replaces him will also have his best players sold out from under him, there is no team building on bank balancing, bonus and dividend earning on the horizon for as long as the current “guardians” are in place. A successful company at the expense of a struggling team, quite a few times the Canadian ice hockey team has been mentioned, won nothing but bring in the money, that I suggest is our model.
Right. Maffit.
Winter wonderland hingy beckons.
Be good to each other :)
HH
guernica on 12th December 2015 11:07 am
Leftclick – why the obsession with 2 up front?
——————————–
Wisnae me sir :)))))))))))))
Bob O Baldy
Good point. The problem is big guys, like Wanyama, Forster, Van Dyke De Nayer see us as stepping stones which creates churn one season to the next.
Reducing churn and starting the season as settled and as match fit as the opposition would vastly improve the chances of any manager in qualifying.
So to reduce churn you go for Scots who are more likely to stay. The problem there is for all the porridge we eat, as a nation we are on the wee side.
A bit of balance needed to beef up but generally I think our chances of success are better served by tackling the factors that work against us than finding a manager who might be more able somehow to overcome churn and fitness when it matters.
Pcs
I was going to the Polish supermarket which is just across from the Charlie. .. heading towards Tollcross.
Told my other half that I had the urge to put my foot down and mow every one of them down .
She is from a really strict polish catholic background and still doesn’t realise their hatred…..
She did laugh when I said a hail Mary for torrential icy rain ;)
Looks like the PL/RD hate club have had a meeting recently, I wouldent be surprised if they rented an orange hall down the old Larkhall way.
The public character assassination on these two men is beyond a joke, and it’s Hun/SMSM driven, every day it’s the same posts same people constantly banging the big Hun drum, the hook was dangled and they bought into it, that’s fine ok we all can’t agree on everything that I get, I truly do,
But ffs can you not take a day aff?
It’s almost as if they can’t wait for a Celtic defeat, one crack pot the other day posted……I was hoping Celtic got hammered on Thursday ? And was even backed up by (so called) Celtic supporters in here, the hate campaign on both these men has no boundaries and its cringe worthy.
One thing I’ll never be, and that’s embarrassed to be a Celtic supporter, the Benadict Arnold’s in here well that’s another story,. HH.
Geordie Munro
Thankfully the plc didn’t sack lenny 18 months into his management at Celtic.
Why on earth would they have? He’d transformed Celtic from a wretched state under Mowbray to a formidable footballing force.
From 81 points (24/24 of which were won at season’s end by NL’s Celtic) to 92 points.
From an average of 1.74 points per game to 2.25.
Despite the gut-wrenching loss of the league, it was clear Celtic were on the up.
Deila took a CL team, ripped up the playbook to do it his way, and promptly got us bombed out of CL Europe. Twice. Then a third time this year.
Yours is yet another apples and oranges comparison designed to mitigate Ronny’s failures.
And by the way, the poor quality of players he has at his disposal? When you pass up £10-15m income from CL qualification, poorer quality is what you get. That one’s on Ronny, not Lawwell (despite the screeching from serial anti-board bores).
I don’t agree with everything the board does, but you can’t attract CL players if you don’t have CL football.
Finally, I fully expect Ronny to stay. Damningly, that one will be on the board.
We have players like KC and LG….yet we play one up front.
Seriously!
If that is the Celtic way….then I’m a Dutchman.
When have Celtic ever played regularly with one up front?
Let me say that again…We have Kris Commons AND Leigh Griff…..but play one upfront.
That is fecking stupid imo.
If that is modern coaching….you can keep it.
HH
My friends in Celtic,
Many thanks for the Celtic chat. I think All opinion should be respected and encouraged.
I also think Each post should be treated on its own merit and evaluated on its content, not by the name of the poster.
Offski to the pub.
HH. To all.
“£10-15m.”
Should have been £20-30m? Happy to be corrected.
Am amazed at the number of fholk on here wishing for PL to hit the road. He is going nowhere until either he decides to do so or the board get rid of him and that is fantasy land. He is managing in their name. On the other hand, RD is not yet in a secure job. That will be based on what happens on the park over the next few months. Fitness as seen last season has completely evaporated, so maybe he doesn’t have control of the dressing room any more and if so, that is likely to get him his P45.
HH
The Green Man
Leigh Griffiths is a striker playing in a team that dominates domestically. He’ll get an average of 6-7 chances in a Scottish game. Contrast that with Europe, where you have to make and take your chances (something Samaras excelled at) and you will see his charts plummet.
Commons, on the other hand, is truly something special.
Cultsbhoy –
Neither a or b.
We need to stop believing we have a sense of entitlement. There have been many reasons for poor results in Europe, including some shocking individual errors. Tactics can’t always deal with that.
Football is a matter of opinion, on Thursday we got a reasonable (good) result despite not playing well. Fine lives separate success and failure.
The Green Man 11.08
In forming opinions we cannot discount factors we don’t like. They help form the policy that produces what we see on the park. Factors that the likes of Keevins dismiss as excuses.
There have been signs of good play v Malmo and Ajax and Fenerbahce but unforced errors in all the games affected the final result. We qualified for last 16 Europa last season too but lost the spine which Celtic have paid money to replace.
I would just like to see a settled team play for up to 10 games in order to decide if RD is making progress.
Some days we go backwards other days we play better.
That’s football.
I do feel sorry for Ronny.
He has been thrown in at the deep end by Peter Lawell….Sink or Swim.
No doubt he is a great guy….but it is not working.
I don’t blame Ronny for the crap signings….that’s down to Peter.
And BTW….Rod Stewart was planting a seed the other day.
Ive no time for him myself….however, he knows what is going on at CP.
And I reckon that was a strong hint that changes are afoot.
HH
Guernica et al,
Scottish Football doesn’t count — it’s a pub league. Europe where teams with 1/5 of our footballing budget dismantle us.
Molde, Malmo, Maribor etc
Our Director of Football PL has mismanaged the budget over the last 3 years with failed striker projects , the Dundee Utd trio, loan signings. Despite taking in considerable transfer fees we have blown a lot of it on duds. The net outcome is that we have a much weaker team.
As long as PL is at Celtic he controls all in and outs and the timings. He can decide to close a deal or walk away. Any manager is a bystander and may end up with Option 1 or Option 5.
RD has a narrow remit ( which is probably just as well ) club football philosophy , pick the team and tactics. However he accepted that even being told to take John Collins and John Kennedy.
While RD is out of his depth , it is very difficult for anyone to succeed with Lawwell at the helm. MON would never had made Seville with PL steering the ship. He would have sold Henrik to balance the books and secure the bonus.
Auldheid
Some days we go backwards other days we play better.
Yes. It’s just a pity for his proponents that Ronny’s bad days coincide with playing better quality opposition.
Cultsbhoy
Quick Survey
If we could replace only one of Lawwell or Deila
Who would you choose?
A) Lawwell
B) Deila
Can anybody take the survey or is it just for Celtic supporters?