Probability of better defenders on loan market for Celtic

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After a flurry of transfer activity, it was reassuring to hear Brendan Rodgers say “We will look to do more business, January is important for us.”  We have brought in players who will help us with domestic and European challenges this season, but the strategic objective of arriving at the Champions League qualifiers with strong central defensive choices remains.

While the manager is in Dubai, Celtic scouts are busy on this task.  The previous two transfer windows saw Marvin Compper and Jack Hendry arrive on permanent contracts but fail to impress.  Getting players in is not the problem, but signing players capable of competing in Champions League qualification games is another matter.

Our most reliable method of recruiting central defenders in recent seasons has been loans from English Premier League teams’ younger ranks.  We have a reputation there for improving defenders, adding value for Manchester City and Leicester.  It would be better to add value to our own playing assets, but squads can have both strategically consistent players (Vakoun Issouf Bayo) and short-term patches (Filip Benkovic).

Would we get a better player through this method than buying on the open market?  Probably.

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348 Comments

  1. Greenpinta from the previous thread- Iran is in many respects far more liberal in their view towards women than other Muslim countries that get a far easier time in our press. I regularly work with senior Iranian academics and at least half are female.

  2. traditionalist88 on

    While the manager is in Dubai, Celtic scouts are busy on this task.

     

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    What have they been doing for the last 6 months?!

     

     

    HH

  3. traditionalist88 on

    While the manager is in Dubai, Celtic scouts are busy on this task.

     

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    What have they been doing for the last 6 months?

     

     

    HH

  4. Recycling plus a bit of a clean up — gender politics don’t you just love it.

     

     

    **********

     

     

    GP @ 10.41

     

     

     

    We have more to worry about regarding the GB / Clearasil Warriors / Physical force fetishists than we have the state of Iran and its engagement with gender equality.

     

     

    I am not proposing that we endorse their legal system.

     

    More a case we look for a RB / LB / CB and a proper full on DM.

     

    Cast our net wider and look for value.

     

     

    Please be very careful regarding your concerns for women’s rights.

     

    It could cause quite a few issues closer to home if you get too pious.

     

    The 32 counties have never been in the vanguard regarding women’s rights.

     

     

     

    People

     

    Glass houses

     

    Stone throwing.

     

    Don’t.

  5. If this is “the line” from the club it’s outrageous.

     

     

    Why don’t we just borrow an entire youth team from England?

     

     

    Honest to God, the leaders on this site border on the offensive at times. They are an insult to the intelligence of fans. We need to rebuild a central defence, not stick a plaster on it.

     

     

    This club needs a minimum of two first choice centre backs of proven quality. And yes, that costs money. If we end up with two more projects – and those who belong to someone else – then two things will happen; first, we’ll get absolutely scudded by the first halfway decent European team we play next year …. but even before that happens Rodgers will walk and no-one will be able to say he was wrong to do so.

  6. P67

     

     

    You just don’t seem to get it.

     

     

    We need short term patches because we do not do the basics correctly.

     

    Our scouting and permanent recruitment was shocking during the summer.

     

    That is why we needed emergency loans.

     

     

    Not sure if you are flying a kite for a low spend defensive recruitment exercise over the next few weeks. If all we are capable of is loan deals then we have stopped being a proper team — we are just an invitational side living off a few cameos.

  7. So many against the loan deals,but the same people are wanting Celtic to buy top class CBs knowing full well the exorbitant amount of money they would cost.Benkovic could help us get to No 8.For me,job done.Same with Weah.Loan deals of experienced CHs to play,would then let us bting in a couple of projects to bring on over a year or so.Expectations of what can buy,way too high.Anyone mentions Mc Kenna,hands thrown up in horror,but this is a young guy,well thoughtof by many in the game.The big stopper at Leicester ,not much better ,IMO,is valued around £60-80 million,for Gods sake.Our big failing is not being able to bring a CH through from the Academy.Looking atbthe dearth of Scottish CHs,not only us.

  8. Somewhere along the line we need to sign a Timothy Castagne rather than a Martin Kelly. It’s about showing intent to succeed on the pitch rather than intent to sell players for money and patching up the gaps with loans.

  9. More loanees? Bah humbug. Our defence should have four core first team players that are with us on at least 2-3 year contract deals to allow some stability and forward planning. KT is the only one we have at the moment. Ralston might be. Bain too.

     

    Before the next qualifiers (IF we win the league), Boyata and Benkovic will be gone and I don’t see any reason to think Simunovic, Hendry or Ajer are good enough to play at that level. Lustig is done and Gordon too inconsistent.

     

    Why can’t we sign two solid CHs? They don’t have to be world beaters for heaven’s sake, just solid and reliable with the experience and ability of playing at a level a notch above where we are but below that demanded by the top teams.

     

    Are we really saying that the best we can get are young loanees from the EPL reserves for a season (if that)? How do all the other leagues in the world manage to function without tapping into City’s treasure chest?

  10. So far it has been two loans and a project with promise.

     

    We still haven’t spent the value of PL’s long term bonus.

     

     

    Something wrong surely.

  11. MADMITCH.,

     

     

    Always thebsame mantra with you.What CHs were available in the summer?More importantly,could we have afforded them.There is no reasoning with you.Blinkers on ,living in your own wee fantasy world.Commper,and Hendry had nothing to do with the Board.They were bought,and failed.Happens.Nothingto say it wont happen again,this time at greater cost.You rabbit on and on,but seem to have no clue on solutions,except for some ludicrous ones.We are trying to get Castagna,but its obvious the player does not want to come to Scotland.When this is brought up as a reason its hard for us to sign players,it gets shot down.Here is a guy saying it.How many more.

  12. If spending less money on loanees leads to the same success as buying players through enormous transfer fees would you say our system is flawed- both relying on a supportive and productive youth system? Or could it be that many of us are having trouble adapting to a world that is moving on?

  13. McKenna has the physicality and failing all else we should go for him. He’s young and a bit of coaching would do no harm. He will improve. There is not much else out there and given we will lose 2 CHs, I don’t see many more achievable options. Unless of course, our top class scouting department ;) have a rabbit in their hat.

     

     

    HH

  14. I’ll tell you what I read just this week,

     

     

    I read the manager of WEST BROM telling the media that he’s glad Burke has gone to Celtic becasue we can bring their player up to a better level so he’s ready for their team.

     

     

    West Brom, right? Not a football superpower by any means.

     

     

    If people are happy that our once proud reputation has shrunk to where English managers talk about our club as nothing more than a development team for getting players “West Brom ready” then I guess we HAVE moved on. But nowhere good.

     

     

    And if that’s the case then all the phony-baloney that comes from our board about how they see us as a European giant ought to cease because it’s garbage.

  15. greenbhoy.

     

    the physicality that mckenna displays in an aberdeen top would not be tolerated in a celtic top.

  16. Interestingly Jeison Murillo a 26 year old Centre Back has just joined Barcelona and you guessed it, on loan.

     

    He’s got 27 caps for Columbia so I guess he can’t be too shabby.

     

     

    There are a few other examples in transfermarkt

     

     

    Maybe the nature of the transfer market is changing, clubs have long term plans and use loans to supplement this.

     

     

    Hail Hail

  17. GERRYBHOY

     

    He’s raw but potentially teachable (as I think Porteous at Hibs is)

     

    But who do we suppose would do this ‘bit of coaching’ and how?

     

    With JK and the same defensive methodology we’ve watched thru finger gaps for the last five or so years?

     

    Better recall Mjallby from the Swedish 2nd Div, and get him to drill them properly again.

     

     

    With the expectation management of this piece, something tells me Nir will be giving CB a try again…

  18. DB @ 12.30

     

     

    We need to fix the squad and fill in the gaps.

     

     

    I rate KA as our long term CB.

     

    I rate KT as our long term LB.

     

    I rate JH as someone who will get better.

     

    I rate TR as someone with a future at RB but he needs coaching and experience.

     

    I rate JS but doubt his focus and engagement at the present.

     

     

    I would hope DB would extend his contract.

     

    I wish that FB had been taken forward when we first saw him.

     

    I wish ML all the best for the future.

     

    I wish CG all the best for the present.

     

     

    Consequently we have a lot of work to do over the next few weeks.

     

     

    Value proposition for a LHS CB — HH vs SMcK.

     

    Iceland vs Farmfoods if you like.

     

     

    Spend real money on a RB.

     

    Spend money on a LB to help out KT in the here and now.

     

    This might the place to seek out a loan if a permanent deal is hard to close.

     

     

    Loads of Deadwood and squad fillers not in the picture.

     

    Needs to be sorted so that we are not just a wage for the un-focused.

     

     

    Then there would be the youth angle.

     

     

    What do we have and does it need improved with a number of new 18 year olds coming in to freshen it up?

     

     

    All of this will cost real money — might be as much as 4 PL bonuses.

  19. McKenna ain’t the worst. £3 or £4 million though is very expensive . Although in time, it may prove to be a good signing if it happens.

     

     

    Half decent centre half’s , who are comfortable with the ball at their feet ( Brendan would insist ) cost serious cash . Either that or you work on the flaws . Tough game, and the price doesn’t garauntee he haw . HH

  20. TB @ 12.39

     

     

    Excuses, excuses, excuses.

     

    The Scottish cringe has made it to the Eastern Med / Black Sea.

     

     

    We either front up or we give up.

     

    The challenge is to find the way forward.

  21. It almost certainly is flawed mate, but that’s not the point.

     

     

    We now market ourselves as a development club, and an over-reliance on loan players gets in the way of stability and building something. Our backline needs an overhaul, a real one, and Rodgers has left it late to focus on it, but even he has come around to it at last.

     

     

    Project players are not going to get us through next year’s Champions League qualifiers. It is embarrassing that a high profile Celtic site would even suggest that a few youth players from EPL sides on loan would be a satisfactory way to rebuild the central defence. How many lessons from top clubs does it take?

     

     

    This nonsense – for that is what it is – about there just not being players out there … it’s laughable.

     

     

    I’ll give you three right now who would markedly improve our defence, and all three are available for what would be relatively light sums because their contracts are up in six months;

     

     

    Michael Van Der Hoorn, Swansea.

     

    Daniel Schwaab, PSV.

     

    Cedric Yambere, Dijon.

     

     

    I could go on. And on. And on. The players are out there. If we’re willing to pay for them.

  22. Maybe the West Brom manager is over-inflating the standing of his team because he’s the West Brom manager. We cannot compete financially with the mega-rich clubs who hoover up young talent in batches hoping a small percentage will fulfil their potential and we play in a league that is unattractive. We need to cut our cloth accordingly.

  23. How many wage-earners in total in our extensive scouting division?

     

    And between them they can’t source 2 defenders who could help us safely negotiate Euro quallies?

     

     

    FFS CFC

  24. AG @ 12.53

     

     

    SMcK will leave the Sheep in the next 6 months — prediction is a mugs game but …

     

     

    Interesting to see where he goes, at what cost and with what wages?

     

    VvD is a great contrast to what happens next.

     

     

    The EPL pay below the market rate for SPL players because of the duds the SPL / TFOD2.1 have passed of in the past and the general conception that the SPL isn’t that good so average players shine in a less than competitive environment.

     

     

    SMcK is no VvD so it will be interesting to see what happens next.

  25. GlassTwoThirdsFull on

    If we don’t improve the defence there won’t be Champions League qualifiers. Tierney needing an op? Not what we need at all.

  26. MM,

     

     

    I am well aware of the equality issues closer to home. That struggle is still going on, although massive strides have already occurred.

     

     

    Stairheedrammy

     

     

    Maybe so, but the female academics still have to live their life as second class citizens to men. They still have to wear mandatory headwear, even if they don’t want to. They must obey their husbands wishes and their testimony is still worth less than a male.

     

     

    Canamalar

     

     

    Even you cannot argue that women’s rights in Iran have not been severely erroded since 1979.

     

    Just because you have worked in the Middle East dosent make you the political commissar for CQN.

  27. Maybe i’m just a weirdo but I’ wouldn’t care if we won the league and cup using the flute section of the Larkhall Defenders Orange band.

  28. I said it before, spend 25M now and we will dominate Scottish football forever. Sale of Dembelle, Armstrong and 8M for Van Dyk sell,on = 35M without even considering CL and Europa money.

     

    I don’t understand why it is so hard, just do it.

  29. Stairheedrammy on

    Greenpinta- so you are writing off every Muslim country for adhering to their holy book just because it doesnt fit with your view of the world?