I hear there are rumours in the old media today that David Longmuir prepared a plan with Charles Green and Peter Lawwell before briefing Scottish Football League clubs this week. I suppose the rumours are half right. No one from Celtic was involved in this nonsense.
Special mention to Gavin Masterton, owner of 94% of Dunfermline shares, who last month told the BBC “The football club is debt-free. There is no bank debt. The debt is to myself and the other directors.”
This new kind of “debt-free”, talked about by Dunfermline and one other lower league club is more dangerous than it seems as just three weeks later Dunfermline admit they expect HMRC to apply for a winding up order.
Fans have raised around £250k, enough to pay HMRC in full, but they are asking Masterton to value his shares at a level they would reach if an administrator was appointed, which will happen if the fans don’t pay. Masterton’s recovery plan was to issue £500k of shares for around 25% of the club. Nice, for him.
Nine years ago Masterton and Dunfermline director John Yorkston were embroiled in the financial calamity which afflicted Livingston. This tale of woe is worth reading, as is the story about the downfall of Bank of Scotland by Iain Fraser, who writes, “The rot set at Bank of Scotland in when the likes of Gavin Masterton and Peter Cummings started handing millions of pounds to their pals, without doing much in the way of due diligence.
Fraser also speculates “Foolishly, Cummings and his predecessor Gavin Masterton handed [Sir David] Murray a total of £760m on a “no questions asked, handshake only” basis and, in the current environment … realised he hasn’t much chance of paying this back”, in an interesting article on the Bank and the liquidated football club.
Mr Masterton is clearly the only qualified candidate as the next president of the Scottish Football Association. After Mr Peat (former director of liquidated club Airdrieoneans) and incumbent Mr Ogilvie (former director of liquidated club Rangers) the bar has been set at an astonishing level.
“Utterly astonishing”, as our old friend used to say.
Be wary of people to say they are debt free when what they mean is they have no bank debt. Be very wary of bums who try to convince you that them being denied bank lending is a good thing.
If company credit rating equals zero, credibility rating equals (I’m away to find out if a whole number is required here).
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trust (plural trusts) – Confidence in or reliance on some person or quality.
reassurance (plural reassurances) – the feeling of being reassured, of having confidence restored, of having apprehensions dispelled
Not so different.
Unless you’re just looking for an argument with me.
ernie lynch
13:38 on
14 March, 2013
CORRECT
excathedra44
14:11 on
14 March, 2013
Auldheid
13:06 on
14 March, 2013
Thanks for your reply, encouraged if Board really are aware.
I do appreciate the difficulties re your housing analogy,perhaps we should be keeping the House but ensure the tenants are behaving.
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The longer the SFA act as if nothing serious happened on their watch, that the game is ill served by the way the SFA is constituted, the more difficult it becomes to conclude we need to flit hoose or pull the old one down altogether and rebuild it.
In the absence of the ability to do the former we only have the latter as the tenants will not admit to mis behaviour or give any assuarances they will not do so again.
Off for a wee walk round the park.
As someone said last night if thems get liquified again..they can have the “colts” sitting there with the sfa licence to make a comeback ….precautionary measures like…longmuir gtf and take your 4 other numpties with you
Auldheid ,
is not giving a new football company a lift in to the league [with out 3 year accounts] above
others who have been waiting years for this not an act of unfitness to govern?
Ntassoolla
My point was that I am reassured when I am told something that makes me believe what I am looking for is actively being pursued. That would be information like Celtic are seeking legal advice, have approached UEFA, are talking to fellow SPL or ECA clubs etc and think they may persuade those parties that they have a case.
Trust is not being told any of that but hoping they are doing these things and not being made looked a fool if it was just a lie to keep me happy.
Trust is an act of faith, reassurance provides reasons to believe.
For me, but I accept maybe not for you in this instance, the difference is an important one.
While I am only too aware of the Machiavellian machinations that lie behind the proposed ‘colts’ project, it would be perverse of me to dismiss something that I have been advocating for over 50 years.
Long after the last reincarnation of the Zombies has been finally condemned to the scrap-heap of history, I hope my grandsons ( & theirs) will be following the Celts & the Colts in a healthier & more tolerant Scotland than their predecessors did.
I HAVE A DREAM.
Auldheid I’m in the “justice has to be seen to be done” camp.
I wrote to Talksport last week to complain about Chuck Green’s interview with Keys and Gray. I made it quite clear that this man should not be allowed to continually spout lies aimed at promoting his club while bringing down the rest of Scottish football. Such irresponsibility had lost them one listener.
The reply..
Hi,
Thanks for your email and apologies for my delay in replying.
As with all studio guests that Keys and Gray interview for the last hour of their show, the purpose was not to debate with or challenge Charles Green but rather to give an insight into his role at Rangers Football Club. It is also worth noting that they have a wide range of guests on in that slot, including players, managers and chief executives – the last few weeks have seen London Welsh chief executive Tony Copsey and West Ham chairman David Gold come into the studio, to name just two.
Please rest assured that we understand our responsibilities when it comes to balance and impartiality, and we are not biased in our selection of guests.
Having said all of that, I do thank you for taking the time to write in and let us know how you feel – we take listener feedback very seriously indeed.
All the best,
Alice Furse
Listener Response Officer
talkSPORT
Marrakesh Express 14:49 on 14 March, 2013
If you really want to make a point to talksport – the best way to do that is switch it off permanently.
HH
My tip for the day is Oscar Whisky in the 3.20 at Cheltenham.
Oscar and Whisky are taxi driver call signs of two of my mates. I have also just picked up a fare from a bloke called Oscar.
Now that is the way to pick horses. 7/2 favourite.
danso_1888
14:42 on
14 March, 2013
Auldheid ,
is not giving a new football company a lift in to the league [with out 3 year accounts] above
others who have been waiting years for this not an act of unfitness to govern?
———————–
Dont get me started :)
Club licensing in Scotland has been a sham for years. It was strengthened by UEFA in 2010 because they recognised the shambles that existed in its absence throughout Europe and even the EPL are considering adopting similar principles for their league. The EPL!! If ever a league needed proper licensing to save itself from itself it is that one.
Back to Scotland. The UEFA licence standard applies only to SPL clubs. They need to meet the criteria set to get a licence to play in Scotland and if they qualify for Europe that licence allows them entry there too.
SFL clubs are licensed under a less strict process although even there the historical accounts requirement had to be ignored to grant The Rangers a licence.
That licensing cycle for next season starts now and my point is that what The Rangers provide the SFA in terms of financial information, if their Interm results are an indicator and taking the one off share issue capital injection into account, should reveal a club who if present costs are not reduced and income increased, will run out of money once the share capital is exhausted. That could be next season but the one after if the money earmarked in the prospectus is not spent on Ibrox.
To protect all clubs supporters including Rangers supporters, hard nosed business men should be looking at financial projections and either be refusing licences or setting conditions on their granting.
This area, more than any other is where the SFA let down our game and if they do not improve it will happen again over Govan way.
Ntassoolla
14:48 on
14 March, 2013
Auldheid I’m in the “justice has to be seen to be done” camp.
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Me too. Its the waiting for it to arrive that is the challenge.
Personaly.I think the colts is the way forward for Celtic but if it is being used as an avenue for the huns….no
Fraser Forster in the Engurland squad, but not Kelvin Wilson.
Quote
Rangers FC will slip into liquidation within the next couple of weeks with a new company emerging but 140 years of history, triumph and tears, will have ended. No matter how Charles Green attempts to dress it up, a newco equals a new club. When the CVA was thrown out Rangers as we know them died.
James Traynor, Communications Director of the rangers, 13th June 2012
googybhoy-Hope it’s a Victor :},I done Reve de Sivola good luck.
danso 1888-The mantra of “we’ve been punished enough” and “we listened to the fans last year,and look where it got us(Sevco obviously)” will win the day.I agree with Ernie,we look party to Longmuir’s hun saving act until we hear otherwise.
see some talk of Fr. Lennon on here – he married my parents in St. Catherine’s.
and talk of Tony Martin – ran about wi Tony, played football with him for a while.will be drifing down near Ryemount to pick up the wee yin in 5 mins. Small world.
Solwhit 17/2 wins 3.20
Leaving aside the deceitful motive of the one proposing this now or the attractiveness, to me, of the idea in principle, I would have reservations about good young Celtic prospects or players of the cusp of first team football playing in the bottom tier of Scottish football in a Colts side.
I have, so far, seen nothing in that tier that would encourage me to believe it is a place where good young players can be brought on. In fact, it looks as if players regress, particularly ones used to a better level in the past. I don’t think the Sevco players have benefited from the experience, though they fair cheered me up last Saturday.
Diary updated, brilliant.
http://williammcboyne.wix.com/tarrierhunter#!diary-blog/c1flm
picinisco
15:29
It would be a fallback to the days when jinky and other players were farmed out to junior teams.
Which done us no harm.
As has been said earlier it’s a door opener for the huns to jump.
Excellent Article Paul,
Like most Celts I’ve had a long term loathing of the Dunfermline board for many years – a cabal of … ahem …. “presbyterian establishment types”.
However we should spare a thought for the club as a whole. Good fans and some really decent blokes as manager throughout the years.
Hail Hail
Pope Francis has spent his first day at the helm of the Catholic Church meeting people in Rome ahead of a Sistine Chapel Mass with cardinals.
‘After private prayers at the basilica of Santa Maria Maggiore, he crossed the road to a local school to meet children and commuters heading to work.
The Pope later went to the priests’ residence in Piazza Navona to pick up his belongings and pay his bill.’
Paid his bill, one up on the zombies right away then…
Hard to forgive and forget Dunfermline lying down Copyright C Sutton in 2003.Calderwood ,Nicholl ,Yorkston would have been out celebrating that night,ably assisted by Stuart Dougal who gave the huns the worst penalty you have ever seen.Masterton bankolling Murray,?Lot of time for Leishman though
The Cheltenham festival?
A bloody lottery!
Put a blindfold on and stick a pin in!
HH!!
Jim Leishman – thoroughly decent chap.
While we have been celebrating 125 years, Villarreal are celebrating 90 years.
All the best to the Villarreal Submari CSC.
Tallybhoy despairs @16:07 “The Cheltenham festival?
A bloody lottery!
Put a blindfold on and stick a pin in!”
I do that on a regular basis with effigies of all my favourite huns.
Remember the Dunfermline fans bringing a banner in 1988 congratulating us on winning the title in the centenary year.
All went wrong between the clubs when Yorkston appeared…
I’ve know 2 Dunfermline men well. Both gentlemen and bevvy merchants of the highest order who put the paralytic in the PARS.
The mind boggles (can it?) at the sheer effrontery of the Mastertons of this wee world that is Scotland. Imagine an independent Scotland where the likes of them might be able to act with impunity and quickly destroy the very fabric of the nation (unwittingly, of course) in aiding and abetting the likes of Murray. Frightening and worrying in equal measure.
bankiebhoy1
16:10 on 14 March, 2013
Jim Leishman tells a very funny story about his first game for Dunfermilne. It involves John Greig and lots of sweary words, couldn’t possibly tell it on here!
I have a mate at work who is a Pars man. Leishman doctors his stories to his audience. He has met him many times and I have seen him at a Celtic smoker night. He claims to have a soft spot for whatever clubs fans are in attendance.
He is a smart man when it comes to generating cash. No problems for me with that. Fair play to him.
His dad was a Rangers man. He is a Pars man his brother supports Celtic and that pretty much covers most bases for him to get plenty work. He is decent at what he does tho. Not universally liked by the Pars support tho.
LB
Remember reading(?)/hearing(?) Jim Leishman tell the story of when Dunfermline were going through a rough patch while he was manager, and some of the fans were up in arms.
During a match he happened to spot a guy in the crowd – who he recognised – holding up a banner which read – ‘Leishman must go!’
He knew the guy was a Celtic fan.
It was his brother!
HH!!
Parkheadcumsalford
They are doing it now, under the guise of the UK. Only one banker, Peter Cummings, has been punished, and then only a fine, whilst David Murray is still being referred to as Sir, though not by me. Murray was referred to, in the FSA report on the collapse of the Bank of Scotland, as a single name, (in yet another anonymised publication), but in Scotland there is another word for it. That Gavin Masterton is in a position to influence the future of Dunfermline FC, without so much as putting one penny of his own money (stressing the word “own” here” is a complete disgrace, and part of the toxic legacy left by Murray and his pals in the City, (of Edinburgh). The “loans” to Masterton, are in my opinion a breach of fiduciary duty by the lender, but do not expect jail sentences any time soon. As for an Independent Scotland, do not worry, both the BOS and RBS, will have been cleaned up and sold debt free to the Tories’ friends in the City, albeit London this time, long before that happens.