These pages have seen Gordon Strachan written off many times since those four days in August 2005 when Celtic conceded nine goals to Artmedia and Motherwell. Last night, as Scotland manager, he got the breaks. First, at the most ridiculous dive for a penalty ever perpetrated by a player on a yellow card (and I have seen Steven Naismith), then, when tired defensive limbs contrived to concede a late winner for Scotland.
If he gets a result away to Slovenia on Sunday, he will have earned whatever grudging appreciation goes his way. A generation of adults have never seen Scotland at an international tournament. They don’t know the joys of losing 3-0 to Morocco, watching a defensive wall shirk at a free kick, or celebrating as an Iranian scored an own goal to deliver a point. It’s time they learned.
Little about Scotland’s success is good news for Celtic. Should we win the league, our first qualification round will start two weeks after the tournament kicks off. Although that round is unlikely to provide a particularly stiff challenge, consider what happened to Newco when they arrived unprepared against Luxembourg semi-professionals.
Even if Scotland don’t reach the finals in Russia, a second place finish in the group for Scotland would see the players face two play-off games in the middle of our Champions League group games, and the possibility of a League Cup final.
Brendan Rodgers will wish his players every success, but he would surely not be too distressed to share hard luck stories with them when they return to training next week. The club-v-country debate has kicked around for decades, but I doubt if any club/country combo has seen it as acute as it is for Celtic and Scotland right now.
Catch up with this CQN Podcast from last month when we interviewed Celtic star from the Centenary season, full back Chris Morris. It’s a great listen…
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There’s a rich vein of footballing history that I missed out on…..being the youngish pup that I am…..am jealous of awe yous….not that am bitter….am assured that comes with age ;-)))
H.H.
Had Strachan not stubborny refused to pick Celtic players at the beginning of the campaign we would already have qualified for play off. No Celtic player in starting XI at home to Lithuania, only Tierney (his first competitive international) v Slovakia away.
The Lithuania result is the one that will ultimately cost us qualification to the play off. Had we won that game we would have already guaranteed second. We won’t beat Slovenia away as he will play the same pedestrian midfield as last night when we need pace to break quickly through the middle to support and go beyond Griff.
Gooood afternoon CQN
Celtic first, 2nd or any other order for that matter
Who pays the players wages ?
FtSFA and any team they want to have
CELTIC for me
Can’t agree with those who feel the more games we play the better the players will be. Teams like Chelsea, Barca and their like can buy buy buy. We can’t. Our resources are very limited. The Barcas of this world play in leagues which are of a far better standard than ours. Too often when we play them it is a learning experience for our players.
If we are to be confident enough to have our Internationals play for the club and country, we really need to be in another league.
BATEENBHOY
In my defence,I’m talking from a purist view. That was a stunning game,and Eintracht had scored TWELVE in the semi against some deid club.
In my defence,my arse. I apologise to the blog for that. Pretty sure Celtic had more shots at goal than either club in 67.
Pretty damn certain 7000 RM fans didnae go to Glasgow in 2010 to celebrate 1960 like we went to Lisbon.
Oh,what an event that was!
And WHATISTHESTARS is for organising another one for the first weekend in June 2018 if yer up for it!
Discuss on 11/11?
GARY67
I said exactly that to my pet hun mate this morning.
Four games,four points,zero Celtic outfield players.
Results change,spot the common denominator.
Your call,Gordon. Stick to players who have bummed around the lower leagues making a decent living,be a glorious failure.
Or take the easy decision and be a legend.
Part of me hopes he takes the former then he can finally eff off. Fed up wi him saying that only former professionals know enough to comment.
But not at the expense of Scotland. Open yer eyes and open your mind,Gordon. You might be surprised.
TheLurkinTim on 6th October 2017 12:46 pm
Aye you all are lol
away again bhoys
catch you later
HH
South Of Tunis
You should have been up the Celtic end for the Bayern St Etienne
game singing “allez le vert.”…and shouting at the “Bayern” supporters
in Rangers end with union Jacks !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Seem to remember a lot more French
but I was only 10
: > )
P67. Nah.
There is a flipside to the coin of International success.
The argument that players are ‘tired’ is a lazy one. Assuming participation in the World Cup, any Celtic players involved will have had their ‘close season’ rest between mid April when the SPL is tied up and mid-May, tuning back up for the Cup Final end of May. BR will be fully aware of what he needs to do to keep them physically aright.
They would then head off to the World Cup for the experience of a professional player’s lifetime – and take part in three of the most high-profile games of their career.
Scotland won’t get out the group stage. If they do, they’ll be papped in the first knockout.
14 day maximum WC.
Celtic players will be delivered home straight into CL qualification, BUT those Celtic players will be tuned and ready – coming off playing at the highest level, buzzing unless they’re made of ice – no pre-season rustiness; if anything, better prepared and ready to go than in a conventional season.
They get us into the CL, they get rested intermittently for free-roll league matches where our second-string are capable enough.
Injuries would be my only concern; but again, those could occur in training anyway or pre-season frendlies – see Dedryck Boyata.
As for this season’s CL – the two Bayern games come before any World Cup playoff; we will have a definitive answer to our chances of pulling off a qualification miracle long before our players answer the Scotland call.
After that, only a calamitous defeat to Anderlecht at home in December would stop our post-Xmas Euro participation.
Add in the prestige factor for the club and money for player participation from FIFA, the positives outweigh the only real negative – the parasites of the SFA offices riding on Celtic coat-tails; but the more dependent they become on us, the more power Celtic wield over their scurrilous existences.
Modern footballers are a snowflake generation in many cases; should be well-equipped physically and mentally to handle the pressures and privilege of playing at the very top for a few consecutive months.
Maybe time to start planning ahead. If Scotland make the finals we should maybe look at bringing in some non-World Cup players for the CLQs. Holland look like they might miss out, or even some players just off full international level with countries that are there?
BMCUW,
Nae old enough to remember the RM game so it disnae count :-)
and yes, interested, and can discuss on 11/11 – if the beer doesn’t get in the way ;-)
GARY67 @ 12:57 PM,
Too True…
Gordon didn’t play the Celts until desperate times called for disparate measures.*
Read Lubo’s comments about Slovakia’s home game with Scotland… Said the Slovaks could not believe how poor Scotland were.
I Still think Callum wasn’t in the previous Scotland squads as it would be a Celt too far, if he had been around the squad and training with them then, he’d be a huge asset going into these important games now.
Slovenia are not an easy team to beat – especially at Home.
*To be fair to WGS, Brendan Rodgers has had a major impact on the players at a Club and Country Level.
PARKHEADCUMSALFORD @ 1:06 PM,
You make a good point, I over simplified things.
Now one thing that happens when the Big Club’s “Stars” play Internationals.
UEFA and FIFA sponsors want them in the Tournaments so will pay good money to ensure that happens – these “Stars” can pick and choose their games.
Also your right, both Celtic and Scotland don’t have the strength and depth to rotate the players as say PSG and France.
Still, the points still stand, playing at a higher level demanding a higher performance makes you a better player… No doubt in my mind.
Secondly, there is still potential to rotate the players at both Celtic and Scotland. How many Celtic players would Scotland need to play Malta at home? How many Internationals would Celtic need for Dundee at home?
The fact is the reality is top Quality, Successful Football players will be in demand for their Club and Country.
Success breeds Success, wanting players to succeed for Celtic and Fail for Scotland is counter intuitive.
Brendan Rodgers deals with Reality, it’s what he does best…
Managing this situation is the only option, wishing it wasn’t happening or invoking failure to ensure success is just fantasy.
Hail Hail
Frankmarker
Eh are yeh gonnie no dae that.
SANDMAN @ 1:22 PM,
Well Said.
Hail Hail
After reading, I can only conclude I would rather Scotland did not qualify. So because I would want them not to qualify, they probably will. Should have kept quiet :0)
BATEENBHOY
Thumbs up in a Philvis-Style.
I keep saying that,hoping he’ll return. I miss that right-wing non-Tory bassa. One of these days,I’m off to Witney to track him down in his gated enclosure.
Well done Scotland.
James Forrest is surely proving his doubters wrong; as for the Griff; he is surpassing what i thought he was capable of. He is proving that at club and country it will be very difficult to displace him.
What exactly does Matt Phillips bring to the table. ? Not for a nano second do I hold it against him that he represented England at under 19 and under 20 level; its just that we had much better alternatives on the bench who never got a chance.
If ( Still a big IF ) Scotland eventually get to Russia, then WGS must surely take BR oot fur a swally.
Mr Donald : All fine and well, but why are all the mods on holiday at the same time ? Not good enough, bad planning there and i’m sure our moderators have a much better CV than the erm, qualifications you are asking for.
HH.
If anyone has time to kill and wants some light entertainment have a look at this:
http://forum.rangersmedia.co.uk/topic/311102-we-are-becoming-the-most-marginalized-people-in-the-country/
Quite mental and funny at the same time.
SOUTH OF TUNIS on 6TH OCTOBER 2017 9:25 AM
Gordon Marshall Snr played v B1903 Copenhagen in September 71
*probably the only game he played for us. He was a really really good goalie and the only reason he was never capped was that he was born down south though brought up in Edinburgh, although he did play for England Under 23 along with Joe Baker. It must be said though that they had a surplus of good goalies at the time including Banks, Springet and Bonetti..
He starred in an exceptional jambo side winning a handful of medals and they only sold him after signing up and coming goalie Jim Cruickshank fae the Spiders; they also signed Davie Holt in a double signing at the same time.
He joined a waning magpie side, again!!!, who went intae decline after Ronnie had left them for the Hibbees, and helped them get back intae the first division. After a season at Nottingham he actually joined the Hibbees but Ronnie was well gone by then.
When he joined us I was delighted as he had been a top notch goalie, light years ahead of his son who should never had donned our goalie top, the one he had changed to various shades of purple.
After only a season with us he joined the sheep as a backup tae Bobby Clark, at least he got some games there.
As I said a very very good goalie in his day and I suppose Jock was trying tae recreate the Faither factor even though it was he who gave him the sugar lump at Easter Road, Jock and goalies, dearie me.
Ironically, after leaving the sheep Gordon Snr joined Arbroath and helped keep them in the top division.
April 1960.
I’m coming home from St Kentigerns after 4pm and pop into my Gran’s flower shop in Ross St next to the Barras to wait for my mum. I’m aged 13.
“How would you like to go to Hampden tonight to see Real Madrid? ” says my Gran.
“I’ve two tickets for you and John McMahon (who was a year older and got me interested in football two years previously).
I couldn’t believe my luck.
John and I head over to Hampden for a place in the small enclosure where the tunnel is. 5 yards maybe from the touchline.
Eintracht take the lead from their winger (Kress?) but Real pull ahead and after half time I’m 5 yards from Gento with Puskas another couple of yards further away and Di Stefano strutting his stuff in the middle up front.
I remember Gento lifting the ball over a tackle with the outside of his foot (something I’d never seen before) and scamper at a rate of knots down the wing. He crosses about shoulder high and Puskas nods the ball down into the net at the near post.
Eintracht keep plugging away and score (I think it was a CF called Stein but it’s been a long time since 1960)
Real take the centre, Di Stefano plays the ball back to edge of centre circle but takes a quick return and heads for goal. About 25 yards out or more and in his stride, he smacks the ball into the bottom corner of the net like a matador delivering the final blow.
Unbelievable football, the like of which the 125k or more crowd had never witnessed.
You don’t forget occasions like that in a hurry. :)
But you do forget it was May 1960….
GARY67 on 6TH OCTOBER 2017 12:57 PM
Had Strachan not stubborny refused to pick Celtic players at the beginning of the campaign we would already have qualified for play off. No Celtic player in starting XI at home to Lithuania, only Tierney (his first competitive international) v Slovakia away.
The Lithuania result is the one that will ultimately cost us qualification to the play off. Had we won that game we would have already guaranteed second. We won’t beat Slovenia away as he will play the same pedestrian midfield as last night when we need pace to break quickly through the middle to support and go beyond Griff.
………………………………………………………………………………………………..
100% agree
As for his subs & tactics last night, dearie me.
HH
on a lighter note .remember my late father who had no time for scotland. taking me and my cousin to hampden to see scotland v wales mid sixties. big mike england think he was centre half got tackled on the halfway line and went down for about 5 minutes .then someone in the crowd shouted ffs stick a leek up his arse.
In my teens, twenties and thirties I would play three matches a week. For club, work and ‘ringer’ for a mate’s work. Would have played for Scotland given the chance.
Although I would have liked to see McGregor get a run out last night I can also understand Strachan’s reluctance to do so.
Into the second half Embramike was calling it right in my ear about the timing of substitutions and, given Martin scored late when previously brought on, it was indicative of Strachan’s caution in using tried and tested players.
I could also see why Tierney was pulled. He wasn’t poor by any means, he is just more of an attacking threat on the left. It’s like Scotland get 100% with Tierne at RB but with Tierney and Robertson we get 120% in both defense and attack.
Danny McGrain was the best right back of his time but he played at LB to accommodate Sandy Jardine to up the percentage balance.
Back to McGregor, what if he slipped up at some point (remember him loosing his footing against Aberdeen from which they failed to profit?) That doesn’t make him a bad player but we already have another great player who is a Scottish regular, Stuart Armstrong, who gets the blame for England’s equaliser.
Armstrong has more skin in the international arena to rise above that, but McGregor has to earn it.
So I reckon it was a mix of Strachan caution and consideration for McGregor (and McGinn) that kept both on the bench.
Kevin Keegan WGS is not and he can be accused of over caution, but I can understand his reluctance to put McGregor on with score still at 0 -0 late into the game.
I thought all 4 Celts acquitted themselves well last night.
TET
Whose making yer dinner or did the good lady remember not just the dogs n cats need fed?
Auldheid
She filled the freezer afore she went, I have curries, kebabs, quiches, lasagnes and more to choose from, might just light the barbie tonight :-)
Lonely and bored already, just two more weeks to go :-(
HH
The fact that Slovenia can mathematically qualify, will make it even harder for Scotland to win. I don’t think they will but they have a chance.
One thing about Scotland games I really hate, is it gives the opportunity for ‘other’ fans to have a go at our players.
At one time I did go to their games but gave up after hearing them booing Kenny Dalglish.
AULDHEID on 6TH OCTOBER 2017 3:01 PM
i was thinking about your pal JOHN today.i don’t know why, just came into my head.
I have just bought a T shirt from CQN a Gottcha Green in cough cough
lets just say Big Boned size
It came back and told me it would appear on my BILL as
“PAYPAL PAUL”
PAUL67
In VIZ style handy hints
MAybe thats why you have a lack of zombies buying your wares ?
Sorry for the sweary words in last post.They are very sweary people and I missed out a few.
JC2 on 6TH OCTOBER 2017 1:21 PM
Never went to the Bayern-St Etienne final but I remember the occasion well.
It was a beautiful sunny evening in Glasgow, I was 16, and I had just talked the most beautiful girl in the world into going out with me over a couple of Guinnesses in the Avalon Bar.
We were walking up Sauchiehall Street hand in hand – me walking on air – when we found a crowd of St Etienne fans with drums chanting ALLEZ LES VERTS outside the ABC.
Captivating, and very exotic!
The most beautiful girl in the world said how much she loved the St Etienne tops they were wearing – skin tight & they looked like they were made out of silk – so had a brainwave and pulled my old-tech Celtic top out of my bag and traded it with one of the French lads for his exotic St Etienne one, and presented it to her.
Felt like Jimmy Stewart in It’s A Wonderful Life.
As the old Lakeland daffodil-botherer said:
Bliss was it in that dawn to be alive
But to be young was very heaven!
Gordon Marshall senior played in goal for Celtic against Sliema Wanderers in Malta.
I think Steve Hancock made his only appearance that night too,
http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/international-soccer/the-death-of-street-football-and-what-it-means-for-ireland-36203321.html
I can’t believe that no one has realised that by winning the Europa League we’ll avoid all 4 CL qualifiers. Mind you, we’ll have to lie down to PSG in Paris to secure 3rd place in our group.
Seemples!
TIMMY7_NOTED @ 2:55 PM,
That really is a very sad indictment on some in Scottish Society.
Not been funny, ironic or sarcastic – People with these views really need educating. Seriously! They have been brain washed to believe in some mad erroneous myth.
They talk about this stuff as if it’s for real. In fact, I’m sure for them it is. They need to be put right but no one in Scotland wants to tackle it.
Why doesn’t someone ask them to look at Western Europe, every Country from Scandinavia to the Mediterranean.
Is there a “people” in any of those lands that have their delusions?
Sure there are sects, but those sects don’t think they have a God given right to rule every aspect of Society (Though they may want too:).
Sure every Country has an elite, who wield great influence on the State. But these are hugely wealthy, privileged, powerful people.
What makes some Scottish working class and lower middle class folk of average intelligence and ability think the should be running the Country from a position of superiority and privilege???? A special status in society as a birthright just for them!!
Can’t someone explain how things work in the 21st century. Oh, and while they’re at it, they could explain this Special Status never existed at ANY time. It was just the “Great & The Good” blowing smoke… to make them more biddable.
Hail Hail
GREENINBINGLEYINOSLO
Forgot about those tops
I had St Etienne one green le coq sportif. !!!!!!!!!!!red white blue collar : > (
Remember my gran was round watching us and Ironed similar
NOtts Forest top .
Material didnt like irons and my wee gran Bless her was like
“nobody will notice”
Loved my gran to bits so me trying to keep in tears
thinking
AYE Nobody will notice a Iron mark that was literally whole length of
a 12 year olds shirt.
: > )
GREENINBINGLEYINOSLO
The Avalon Bar.-Kent Rd.
A blast from the past.One of my teenage seeing a man about a Dog places.The Man was always late.