Resolutions to be voted on at the 30 April meeting are proposals from the Scottish Premier League executive (Neil Doncaster). They have nothing to do with the Gang of 10 nor are they a Duff and Phelps/Rangers conspiracy. The resolutions are not set in tablets of stone and have no authority in their own right. The League has form in voting down executive resolutions, in particular overthrowing plans for a 10 team league last year, so, in theory, the votes could go for or against.
Neil Doncaster, being as thorough as he is, has almost certainly shared his plan with the man along the corridor at Hamden, SFA chief exec, Stewart Regan. He is also likely to have taken guidance from the Uefa executive, specifically CEO David Taylor, formerly of this parish. It would be unnecessarily lax to leave legislative loose ends before embarking on such a radical plan, so forget about any intervention by the SFA (cough) or Uefa.
Putting preconceived notions aside (if I can), the resolutions are flawed.
Asking for 8 clubs to vote for a Newco to be allowed into the league, but requiring 11 to vote for a financial penalty to be imposed for an Insolvency Transfer, is beyond ridiculous. The former provision – the gift of continuity to a defaulter – is easy to achieve. The latter – the punishment for defaulting – is unnecessarily difficult. Duff and Phelps will need the support of only one club – let’s say Dunfermline, who are brogue-to-brogue with them anyway and due to relegation will not be affected by the financial penalty, will vote with them. Why would Doncaster put such a high bar on setting financial penalties?
Arbitrary voting thresholds smack of gerrymandering. Can anyone explain this in any other way?
There will now be a period of debate between clubs; Celtic will oppose any provision for a Newco to enter the league. Duff and Phelps will be in the opposite corner. You can expect to hear wailing and gnashing from Rangers (IA) along the same ridiculous lines they have used ahead of the SFA hearings into the behaviour of the club in advance of, and after, Craig Whyte’s purchase of the club. On that occasion, Duff and Phelps argued that the actions of Rangers’ new owner, or the failure of the old board to conduct their business correctly, should not lead to a penalty on the club.
It doesn’t matter how lax or severe the proposed penalties, Duff and Phelps will oppose them. Anything lessening of the penalty is worth money to the proposed new buyers of Rangers, so let’s view everything Duff and Phelps say in pound notes.
Rangers have unpaid bills potentially running up to £134mm that’s medicine, operations, road repairs and Help for Heroes. Allowing them to ditch their history and start afresh, where owners profit by securing a floating charge over the stadium, where fans can continue to be provided with a team in the league, creates an unprecedented moral hazard. It rewards irresponsibility and would create a queue of clubs ready to do the same.
And on the point of ditching their history… I openly mock anyone who uses phrases like Hybrid Liquidation. You don’t get Hybrid Liquidation, Partial Liquidation or Liquidation Lite. You cannot buy or sell history, as Duff and Phelps tried (and failed, I think) to convince Rangers fans. Liquidation would mean Rangers Football Club, established in 1873 (or 1872 as they now claim), incorporated in 1899, is finished.
Just pay your bills and do us all a favour.
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ok lets see what happens when the platitudes have all run their course
and after a few hundred more renditions of foritzas we can learn to hate those
despicable newco’s for another 140 years as the fat slow masters grow obscene on young blood. Stupid is as stupid does.
auldheid..,
I think you missed the follow up point I made earlier
we could be witnessing a prescedent being set to allow their “big clubs” an emergency exit.
Think about it, uefa’s dispensation of punishment to clubs breaking rules is hardly equitable now is it ????
eastern european clubs are being hammered for things that go unreported here every week.
Art of War on 12 April, 2012 at 01:48 said:
===============
D&D are milking the dying cow, that RFC(IA) is , for all it’s worth.
I listened to Tommy@Glasgow on the internet tonight take the absolute piss out of a D&D employee who seemed desperate, even now, for an interested party to buy RFC(IA). I thought all bids were in.
When are the Rankers people going to wake up ?
canamlar
Taylor was SFA CEO in 03 so Taylor, Ogilvie in cahoots? Yes, we know that. It tells us nothing about UEFA other than they took Taylor’s word for the point that thems were sound financially and that iso facto Taylor and or Ogilvie cheated. What else am I missing about confidentiality in that screen-shot?
Bloke109..,
As I said earlier uefa’s public agreement to confidentiality, knowing the agenda.
The uefa rep requires permission to enter any such agreement on behalf of uefa.
The fact that these proposals have been mooted shows a positive reaction from uefa to spectlative enquiry from scotland.
Or do you believe these rule change were not aired at this very very recent meeting ???
Not into bhoycot’s but maybe an alternative type of bhoycot can be found.
Celtic play murderwell away on 22nd April.
St Mirren play Dunfermline on 21st April.
Take the green pound away from that non-friend of Celtic on the Sunday and go en-masse to Paisley on the Saturday for a party – AND i mean party, at the Methadome. Send out a wee message before the 30th and Directors of certain clubs will be poopin pants.
Justathoughtcsc
HH
Championes! Vençeremos! Los Niños!
Dae ye think Catalan would have us? I mean,Barcelona are our soul brothers.
HH!
One of thems on Twitter cannot believe our reaction to this, saying that we’ve effectively been handed the league for the next two years. On top of that, they are seething over it and would rather go to Div3 than be so slowlaned.
canamalar
Some on here would call it cognitive dissonance, some would call it me being thick, but I just don’t get the point about UEFA’s confidentiality. I would imagine they enter into any meeting with a member association demanding confidentiality until it suits them. The Doncaster document is his proposals, and only that, all I am saying is that there’s a mile between a meeting and fruitition, as the member clubs have to yay or nay. I don’t see UEFA confidentiality as agreement, rubber stamp or tacit approval.
Even with a 10point penalty for newco, they are going to be slowlaned as TBK or whoever don’t have the cash to splash on a kitty or wages. All of that is dependent on Whyte’s positive involvement and I think he’s heading for the other big hoose. Naismith and McGregor for example will be off, as will others. I want them deid as I haven’t had any jelly or ice-cream, but the ways of the business world, the legal ways, are not always the moral ways we would want. The failed businessmen of the SPL will decide what they decide but there’s momentum to make it worse than a basic 10point penalty. Love the ‘April 30 meeting, come into place on May 14’, a mere 18 days ahead of my June 1 liquidation prediction. Of course I want to tramp the dirt down, but failing that, slowlane them as much as possible. No gurantees of ‘successful liquidation’ of course.
And you think the Scottish judiciary care about cheating huns….
As the judicial inquiry in Scotland into the scandal of contaminated
blood products which infected thousands of haemophiliacs and transfusion
patients with deadly HIV and Hepatitis C heard final legal submissions,
many surviving victims fear another whitewash.
They want Lord Penrose’s investigation to establish how and why some
haemophilia patients and their families were used as unwitting guinea pigs
to discover whether AIDS was caused by a transmissible agent in blood products for more than a decade, and why there was a delay of several years before telling them they had been infected with HIV.
They want to know why many others were not told by their doctors or health
professionals that they had in fact been infected with Hepatitis C – even though
it was in their records for up to 16 years, leaving them in danger of infecting
partners and spouses.
They also want to know why thousands were unnecessarily infected, long after warnings were sounded in 1977 about tainted blood products. And they want a proper assessment of the impact – including the financial impact – that infection, ill health and in many tragic cases death had on the patients and their families.
Maggie M..
I shared quite a few lunches with said lord, he done the big insurance inquiry, seemed a nice bloke and down to earth.
Could you post a link to that inquiry so I can keep up with it, very interested in to see if my impression of him was right.
http://www.penroseinquiry.org.uk/
thank you
For BABASONICOS71 if baba lurks
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=FgxEJOi6GtA
I amazoned everything by white denim today. Bought the lot.
Thank you
Morning Celts……
Are we Gonnae roll over for Newco or embrace change, should we support our club either way…. Of course we should…. But in a corrupt league and do nothing is not an option for me.
V
To those who said last night why resign from the league now…..
Why resign now?
…………….
Why? Well because to take any further part in this save the newhuns legislation is a tacit approval of the financial cheating which gave the huns all those trophies and I don’t want our club part of this.
To those who say the Huns have been at it for over a hundred years why walk away now……. Maybe we should have done something a long time ago….. It’s now the time and we shouldn’t shirk our responsibilities, rise up this morning and think about a new football life for Celtic away from the cheating Huns, away from their Hun supporting refs and away from those who were tasked with the governance of Scottish football,,,, they need us for our money, but we need a decent honest sporting environment where we are free from sectarian and racial hatred.
Having said all of the above I would advocate organising our supporters groups to speak to the club, if they have no wish to walk away then we pay up and take our medicine….. No more whinging just turn up and pay you’re money and hope some of the refs are honest.
V
I’m feeling pretty annoyed right now and that’s partly due to a horrible night going over this in my head…… I’m in the mood to protest, I cannot sit on my hands nor do the Scottish media option of compliance or ignoring….. We are being shafted… I’m not accepting it….. Sunday will show the mood of the support.
V
I’m off to work in a flouncing mood…. I hope the Huns dont re-appear as I’ll not be missing with their cheating and tainted trophies.
V
My summation: the Board will imply/ offer a scenario to the Gang of 10 – either accept the short-term benefits of the newco or face the wrath of the Green Pound.
————-
Like this….thumbs up.
The Wrath of the Green Pound…………..excellent
Paddy T…hi hoing
Vmhan
Morning mate
I know how you feel, I’m totally deflated. Knew all along this was what was going to happen i just kept my mouth shut and waited for it. Sickened by the blatant cheating. The Club need to speak out asap on the matter & the celtic support along with whatever backing we can get from fans at aberdeen, hibs etc need to start demos, boycotts, whatever it takes to show the footballing world that we will not accept what is going on here. I am outraged that clubs in the spl would rather help a cheating bigoted club so that they can get cash rather than try to win some success without them in the SPL. i am starting to hate scottish football with a passion and i am starting to hate my own country now. angry angry angry
Lads,
Nil desperandum.
Supremely confident our Board have anticipated every conceivable outcome ,including this one,and will have considered all the alternatives.
They`re no mugs.
Good morning friends from a dry and fairly clear skied but cold East Kilbride.
Still trying to come to terms with yesterday’s proposals and, to be totally honest I really don’t know what I’m truly thinking at the moment. One minute I think “that’s it, I’ve had enough, I’m not throwing good money at a WWW circus show” and the next it’s “but I can’t see myself not supporting Celtic and going to The Park every other Saturday”. Really hoping that more news comes out on this over the next few days.
Oh how I’d love to learn that Celtic already have an alternative plan for the future…
Jobo
a rallying call courtesy of ROYTHEBHOY on Phil’s blog…
“I have a sick feeling in my stomach each time I read about a potential loosening of the noose. It’s like a movie where the good guy turns his back on the seemingly dead bad guy only to have the baddie get up behind him and stick one on him. Make no mistake, if this West End zombie gets a second chance, THEY WILL SINK US. Once the deeds are done, sure we can Bhoycott away games and competitions but that will not make a bit of a difference. The time to act is NOW. We have mobilised as a support before so let’s resurrect the spirit of the early nineties.
What Scotland do you want? A free one or a desert?”
http://www.philmacgiollabhain.ie/out-of-the-blue/
no43 homebhoys show of last night with much discussion re current newco situation and a summary of paul’s book launch, and a call from phil too
http://www.spreaker.com/show/hail_hail_media
The 1 thing we can’t do is turn our back on our own Club, We are not the cheats. The Board will have to do what is right, with our support. Boycott the teams that are happy to hate us yet take our cash. let the world know what is happening here, if there is secret discussions going on between cheats, governments & football bodies let’s take the lot down. They show no shame. How their own fans who pay their taxes are not ashamed i will never know.
Good morning CQNers,
I’ve always believed that protestant Scotland will do whatever it takes to ensure ‘their’ team is in the SPL and nothing I’ve seen or heard recently has dissuaded me from my opinion.
As for the rule changes, well they’re too late and they only signal to me that Neil Doncaster has accepted the inevitable.
Am I deflated? No, am I disheartened? No.
You see, I’m a Celtic supporter and I want us to meet all-comers and beat them so we can revel in the victories. The victories are always more succulent when we beat cheating teams, referees, administrators, politicians, whoever…….
Hail Hail
Murdochbhoy
That’s fair enough but we shouldn’t have to play cheats. It’s about fair play. Why should they be given an advantage every time they play.
Serge on 12 April, 2012 at 07:03 said
If we didn’t play cheats we’d be struggling to find referees for our games, we wouldn’t have played Rangers for the last 16 years, we wouldn’t have play Porto in the final, the SFA …..well, you get the point.
Regards
Art of War on 12 April, 2012 at 02:25 said:
Indeed.
We can debate, hypothesize and vent till our hearts content..
But you raise an irrefutable fact.
For a brief moment in time, very brief, the Celtic support, or more accurately, the Green pound, will be watched, measured, weighed and judged.
That is a moral certainty.
To be or not to be—- That is the question!
A question Currantly facing us…. but one that should be facing them, the stacked deck of cards.
Murdochbhoy
….No ;-)
What’s the general feeling amongst other SPL fans
If CELTIC FOOTBALL CLUB cannot find a way of removing us from this disgraceful sham of a league then IMO they really need to plan their strategy on the basis that we are the only team in the league ,everything they do has to be based on keeping every single penny that our fans is kept in house ,pay only what we have to pay and even then look at every payment and find out if there is any way we can avoid paying it .
If we can tell the SPL we have no demand for away tickets ,then don’t just think about it CELTIC get it done ,if we can lay on beam backs for said,away games and all they revenue stays with CELTIC ,get it done .
If an away ticket costing say £25 (always more for us than anyone else ) can be denied to the cheats then why not go to the beam back ,pay ,say,£5 and spend the rest on the half time draw .
If these plans go ahead does that mean Ross County won’t be promoted ?
Ross County are coming up, but to what?
They are lucky Rangers aren’t twelfth, otherwise Neil Doncaster would have to draw up some proposals to keep Rangers up and Ross County down. They are also lucky that Dunfermline will make saving Rangers a higher priority than saving their own skin (they potentially have a get out of jail card here but seem to prefer not to use it).
Neil Doncaster has two issues that he wants to resolve.
Getting a change to 75% voting rule.Which the gang of ten want.
Getting Newco into the SPL.Which everyone (with the possible exception of Celtic wants).
His proposals are clever.
Rangers will not vote with the gang of 10 for the 75% voting ruler change.The major obstacle for Rangers is that the gang of 10 ,could then in the future vote to change how income is shared.That is why Neil Doncaster has suggested that it would still require an 11 to 1 vote to change the financial penalties.However everything else would only need an 8 to 4 vote.
Celtic would be stiffed twice here.
My understanding is that if Neil Doncasters proposals are to be accepted then it would take an 11 to 1 vote to make the changes?
Rangers would have to vote with the gang of 10 for Neil Doncasters proposal to be accepted.His proposal increases the likelihood of that happening.
TT
He needs Rangers to split from Celtic.
Neil Doncaster has two issues that he wants to resolve.
Getting a change to 75% voting rule.Which the gang of ten want.
Getting Newco into the SPL.Which everyone (with the possible exception of Celtic wants).
His proposals are clever.
Rangers will not vote with the gang of 10 for the 75% voting ruler change.The major obstacle for Rangers is that the gang of 10 ,could then in the future vote to change how income is shared.That is why Neil Doncaster has suggested that it would still require an 11 to 1 vote to change the financial penalties.However everything else would only need an 8 to 4 vote.
Celtic would be stiffed twice here.
My understanding is that if Neil Doncasters proposals are to be accepted then it would take an 11 to 1 vote to make the changes?
Rangers would have to vote with the gang of 10 for Neil Doncasters proposal to be accepted.His proposal increases the likelihood of that happening.
He needs Rangers to split from Celtic.
TT
Fergus Slayed the Blues.
The other clubs are not going to allow Celtic to show a beamback.
The team would suffer results wise without our support.
Many vans will not abandon going to away matches.
I do agree that our board MUST be capable of engineering our way out of Scottish football.
TT
Vans = Fans
TT
Scupper the Sky/ESPN TV deal. Its our biggest trump acard in the short term. We can afford to play hard ball and lose £1-2m per year (we’ll more than make up for it in CL money). Tell Sky/ESPN we will not sign up to any new deal if these proposals are accepted. If the so called ‘financial fair play’ proposals are accepted on April 30th, Celtic should tell Sky/ESPN that they will withdraw their co-operation with them immediately. This will affect the Championship presentation and hopefully the Cup FInal, both live on Sky. Do this and they will withdraw the unsigned deal from the table. Result = financial carnage for the rest of the SPL quislings.