Former referee, Kenny Clark, spoke to the BBC on the subject of bias in referees last night: “For anyone to suggest that a referee would work for 10 or 15 years to get to the top level of refereeing in Scotland and would then cheat the fans simply in order to give ‘his team’ an advantage is just nonsensical.”
Putting aside for one moment all recent issues in our game, everyone is prone to bias, conscious or otherwise. It is part of the human condition. If referees insist they are immune, they are contributing to the problem. Instead, they should be aware of the potential. Former referees should encourage them to be vigilant.
Clark explains how much work goes into getting to the top in refereeing and that it would ridiculous to jeopardise a career to help your football team, but he is missing the point. No wonder refereeing is in such a mess if they go around telling each other they are not affected by the human condition. They are human, they make mistakes and are as subject to bias as any other group of professionals.
Clark was happy to cite the new SFA procedures as being sourced from English football, but omitted the add that English football addresses this very question of unintended bias by asking referees which team they support.
Celtic Charity Football Talk, Xavier Centre, Carfin
Saturday 19 January, 8pm
I am joining Tom Boyd and George McCluskey for a question and answer in Carfin this Saturday. There will be plenty to talk about, as always, while Tom and George will add the wisdom from their years of experience in and around the game.
Tickets are £7 each, call Mick on 07827 975271 to book. Beneficiary is Vision of a Blind Golfer. See you there.
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JG
:-))))
SOT @ 4.22 ?
In a country with a dirty wee secret impartial and fair refereeing will never happen.
The cheating is aided by authorities,mssm and a country with a definite bias against Timmy having success especially against Protestant superiority.
A performance grading system would only work if administered in a fair and open fashion.
In the best wee country it just won’t happen.
If Scots had to grade Beaton’s performance he probably would have gotten an A+ for it.
James McCarthy in my opinion started to come out of his shell in the recent European Championships in France and began to look like the player we all knew he was capable of being. He continued to impress until serious injury halted his progress. A move to Celtic might re-ignite that progress under Brendan.
Who wrote today’s leader?
Graeme Speirs? Even Tom English?
Time to stop trying to apply reasonableness to inherently unreasonable peepul.
It’s rampant hunnery pokery. Call it out ffs
HH jg
JJ
???
Any truth in the rumour in the Scottish press that Kerry management are making a 50 million Euro offer to lure Ciaran Killkenny to the Kingdom.
!!BADA BING!! on 16TH JANUARY 2019 3:53 PM
Darrell Currie from BT Sport, saying Celtic are in for McCarthy, Elabdellaoui & Maja
————
May i suggest if this is true and Peter Lawwell fails to execute the deal for Elabdellaoui then it may signal the beginning of the end of Brendan Rodgers as Celtic Manager.
Whenever I hear Kenny Clark talking he always sounds as if he’s ready to punch somebody / anybody. Clearly a fully paid up member of the best defence is attack club. A real slippery character, and of course if he’s kicking away at us – well that music to the ears of the SMSM – no way will they interrogate – quite the opposite – give us more Kenny – this what we want to hear. Jock Stein called it right way back then – we just need to score more goals than the opposition – lots more. Which of course is why we play ‘the Celtic way’, because we need to.
:)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
The way Aston Villa are losing goals,they would pay 15m for McKenna…
David 17 – your suggestion – it could have come straight from the back page of the Daily Record.
ROCK TREE BHOY on 16TH JANUARY 2019 5:28 PM
David 17 – your suggestion – it could have come straight from the back page of the Daily Record.
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It came from me. You either agree or you don’t.
After dinna speaker,who’d be one?
You Kenny?
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=kenny+clark+after+dinner+speech&&view=detail&mid=8E1760E0D5B2BADFF5DF8E1760E0D5B2BADFF5DF&rvsmid=
HH
Old enough to remember Jim Callaghan referee who failed to send off Big Yogi in a league(sectional ? ) cup game.I seem to remember a suspension of six or eight weeks against Mr. Callaghan.The opponents that day……yeah you got in one.
ROCK TREE BHOY on 16TH JANUARY 2019 5:22 PM
Whenever I hear Kenny Clark talking he always sounds as if he’s ready to punch somebody / anybody.
*Was sitting in a bistro in Dumbarton when he walked by, a wee skinny drip. I was with Mrs TT and her da, a rabid Tim, although he was about 80 at the time I bit my tongue as he would have been out the door steamin intae him.
1969 at Celtic Park.
The following is an edited version from the book, Hail Hail by Tradamus Lampada FP Martin Hannan whose mother taught one of my weans before we left the country:
“As the season neared its completion, trouble erupted when Celtic met deidco at Parkhead in the Scottish Cup semi-final. A pitch invasion when Jimmy Quinn was sent off while the huns were leading 2-0 caused the match’s abandonment and the SFA duly convened an inquiry.
Celtic manager Willie Maley conceded the abandoned match and, despite huns injury victim alex craig testifying that Quinn was innocent, the SFA suspended the Celtic legend until the end of the season.
“deidco’s quest for the Double ended with Third Lanark soundly defeating them in the Scottish Cup Final and, when Celtic beat Motherwell 6-2 away from home, they and the huns had ended up jointly topping the table with 41 points from 26 matches.
The rules back then still did not encompass goal average or goal difference – deidco would have won the title on both counts – so a play-off was arranged to decide the championship. ”
A sign of the league’s concern about the match was the appointment of a referee from England, Mr Frederick Kirkham of Preston. The League and the SFA were both concerned about the obvious bad blood caused by the events of the Cup semi-final, and wanted none of Scotland’s umpires to be put into the position of seeming to be less than impartial. No such accusations could surely be levelled at the Englishman, as long as he got the decisions right.
Given the events of season 2009-10, it makes you wonder whether the idea is not worth trying again. “Kirkham did not have much to do, because the game was largely a bore. It was Celtic who briefly rose above the mediocrity, (beating the huns 2-1). The response outside Celtic’s fan base was underwhelming, but that victory proved the catalyst for one of the great periods of the club’s history. With Young, Loney and Hay usually at half-back and McMenemy, Quinn and Hamilton providing the threat up front, a great side had emerged.”
TONTINE TIM
Great story.
Of course nowadays they would have had the four cheats from the Ibrox game knowing the mssm and Scottish society wanted a sevco win.
Clark’s view doesn’t even make sense.
If no referee would ever deliberately favour “his team” then what would be the harm in saying who “his team” are?
No matter how nonsensical Clark sounds, it will make no difference. The Establishment will offer up any and no excuse to condone the bias.
I don’t know how we can effectively challenge it, as it has always been the case, since I started watching Celtic in the 50s and my Dad says it has been the same since he started in the 30s.
If it would help if we refused tickets for Hampden, I would be all for that.
Have Clark, Dougal and Co,ever been wheeled out to defend ex colleagues, other than when we get cheated?
Kenny Clark has been trotted out as he always is when Celtic have something to say about refs or anything else in fitbaw.
His main purpose is not missing the point, he is a fully paid up member of the Stop The Ten Project.
FTSFA
Ray Parlour shared how some Celtic fans leave him stunned as he can’t believe that any of them should want rid of manager Brendan Rodgers.
from NEWSNOW CELTIC.
can anyone explain what the point of this website is.??????????a full month of posting anything that contains the word CELTIC.total dross.every day non stop.
ps where is KEV.
BHOYJOEBELFAST on 16TH JANUARY 2019 5:39 PM
Old enough to remember Jim Callaghan referee who failed to send off Big Yogi in a league(sectional ? ) cup game.I seem to remember a suspension of six or eight weeks against Mr. Callaghan.The opponents that day……yeah you got in one.
*I was over here at the time BJB but was preparing to return hame, which I did less than a month later so can only give you 2nd hand information as related tae me by Tim family and friends.
They had won the first LC game a week earlier and although we had a superior goal average we still had tae win or we were almost surely out. Both the wee mhan and Bobby Murdoch were struggling with injuries but in a game of this importance Jock had them in the side tae the exclusion of Jim Brogan (on the bench) and the Fife Beckenbauer.
It was seemingly a no punches pulled game and early in the 2nd half shortly after being booked for a foul on the over rated jardine the Bear allegedly kneed the wee Fife ned who went down as if a sniper had shot him.
Seemingly neither the ref nor linesman saw it but the latter seeing the wee scheitd lying on the deck flagged Mr. Callaghan, him with the Irish sounding name © naesurname.
He never spoke tae the wee ned, who it was rumoured later had spat on big John, but had words with the latter. The huns were ecstatic because Yogi had been cautioned in the first half and so the automatic assumption had to be that he would be sent off, after lecturing Yogi for what seemed an eternity the referee, who had also reffed the 4-0 Cup Final 4 months earlier, allowed him to remain on the field and restarted play.
Consternation at the hun end and mid-way through the second half following a corner where the deidco hun goalie gerhard neef (nae pun intended) lost control of the ball and big Tam reacted first and headed what turned out to be the winner into their net.
The fall out was horrendous, and the smsm went berserk. Deidco were always bad losers and so a witch-hunt was carried out.
There used to be an unwritten rule which said that the referee is right even when he is wrong. In other words the referee’s decision had to be accepted otherwise we would have anarchy. Every team in the world can relate an incident when they were hard done by and/or felt cheated by a match official’s decision but at the end of the game the result was known and that was that.
Everyone had to accept the situation, but not the club of the establishment. There seemed to be a general view that Jim Callaghan was a Catholic and so favoured us, the craft went intae full battle mode.
At the time Jim Callaghan was Scotland’s best referee but his treatment by the huns and totally unjustified two month suspension by the SFA were humiliating.
To his great credit he returned and continued to officiate at the top level for several years.
Incidentally as I said earlier I was planning on returning hame, at that time with nae shortwave our only means of finding out the scores was tae phone one of the Toronto sports departments a couple of hours after the final whistle for the scores.
I couldnae wait and had a copy of that weekend’s Sunday mail lying on the table. I looked up the phone number and called. “Hello record house here” said a wee lassie, “aye I’m calling fae Canada can you put me through tae the sports department”, which she did telling them about a “Canadian” wanting tae talk tae them. A “Canadian” with a bonnie banks accent lol.
“Hello sports here”, “aye could you give me the score of the nights big game”, he then covers the phone and I can hear a muffled voice shout out, “your no gonnae believe this but there’s some eejit phoning fae Canada and wanting tae know the score of the night’s game.
Back he comes and disconcertingly says, “Celtic won 1-0”, “Oh and who scored the goal”, “big Gemmell”, “oh ya effin beauty”, click.
At that I then phoned my family and friends with the result, naebody believed me lol. Oh BTW the huns tied their next game 3-3 at home tae Raith Rovers while we won our next two at Broomfield 3-0 and Starks Park 5-2 and I was hame in time for the Harry Harry game at hades, a game where big Tiny sent off Cairney after an altercation with, the wee Fife ned out on the touchline again.
FAVOURITE UNCLE on 16TH JANUARY 2019 6:43 PM
There is an awful lot of sh**e on Newsnow with an occasional worthwhile article. The pish is easily dealt with by clicking on the publication and selecting ‘hide publication’.
TT,
brilliant recollection.
the problem with referees , sept 67, celtic view.
whits changed he haw.
https://kerrydalestreet.co.uk/imageproxy.php?url=http://i1368.photobucket.com/albums/ag192/Timmy7_16/Refs_zpspnkjkxy4.jpg
Tontine@6.48
Thanks for that little piece from way,way back.Some night games were not broadcast on the Scottish home service,so me and my pal big Hughie Mac,would go to the phone box on falls road and give Benny’s bar a tingle,oh it’s you Joe,came the reply!!!!!!!!
Memories CSC
Just Asking
Did FtSFA ever explain why Steven Caven ? Was Sine died from the refereeing fraternity when he told the truth about Dougie Dougie ?
Never ever mentioned us that
Kenny could you explain that one
Remember when one of you colleagues was caught out through the truth being exposed
Answering myself ?
Wonder if Steven was just Black Balled ??
For our young brigade:
Benny’s bar was at gorbals X.
Doyle’s,garryowen,mckellechers( spelling) .
Kenny’s on message and resolutely on The Journey.
Deny, Deflect, Obfuscate.
I take it FtSFA did or do not have any
Whistle Blowing policies/ procedures for employee protection ?
Flute Blowing policies/ procedures for employee cover ups
GLENDALYSTONSILS on 16TH JANUARY 2019 6:56 PM
THANKS for that .
NOW can you tell me how to get TONTO TIM to write peoples names instead of riddles.
TURKEYBHOY on 16TH JANUARY 2019 2:11 PM
Dont know why so many are getting riled up about the cheating scum who referee our game.I am sure,any of the older persuasion,like me,who first started going to the games with their Da,would have heard him and his mates,relatives,say exactly the same thing then.Its always been there,and as long as the Masonic SFA are in charge of our game,it always will be.
Ask yourself,Celtic v Huns,you are the Ref.Would you be fair and impartial?Not a hope in hell.The talk of declaring who you support,dont make me laugh.We would have 12 Chick Youngs in there.The difference in England is,its club rivalry,here its religion.Pure inbred bigotry.Hatred for all things Catholic.Never change.Incredible how well we have done considering,and no end to our success on the horizon.Savour every trophy,and think about how they feel like a dagger through their black hearts
POST OF THE YEAR. POST OF THE DECADE. POST OF THE CENTURY
NEVER HAD BEEN A TRUER WORD SPOKEN ON HERE
THANK YOU TB
News Now Celtic:
Roma right back Biggus Dickus seen checking into the Sandyford Clinic.
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feederclub’r’uscsc